vaibhav: anhedonia, tapering duloxetine and bupropion

[vaibhav]

HI  Gridley, 

I have had this anhedonia like condition , when i was  on SSRI, then my doc changed it to SNRI and Bupropion , it reduced some of the anhedonia like condition....However not recoverred completely.I read on research paper that dopamine agonist receptor are required for it to treat...So my doctor started Promipex 0.25 .....It helped ....I am on tapering currently for Dulexetine and bupropion..How to do it? WHat more needed for this anhedonia to lapse as this is taking heavy toll on my learning , happiness, social sphere.

Edited March 3, 2020 by manymoretodays

[manymoretodays]

Hi vaibhav, @vaibhav

Welcome aboard.

I got you moved here, so that you can have your own introduction.  Here is where you can tell us a little more about yourself, and ask questions around your specific case.

What are you presently taking?

And I will alert Gridley now, as well, so that we can further get you started, as well as answer some of your questions.

 

Love, peace, healing, and growth,

moderator manymoretodays(mmt)

Edited March 3, 2020 by manymoretodays
additional....

[vaibhav]

I had started  this heavy headed ness in December 2018..The feeling was like someone tying strong knot around my head and its getting tighter...with NO relief in site....I ddint knw at that time , it was related to depression. So i kept hoping that it will ultimately subside after diet change, sleep patterns etc.. but nothing worked ....After 6 months of this unbearable pain.I visited psychiatrist.In our society and family , visiting psychitrist is taboo. 

He has Started off with  amixide-h, flunil 20...it helped me ...I got recovered to some extent .But not completeely. then my doctor advised me to visit another doc at metropolitan area. so i did...

he started with having galop 10 and betacap 20 ....and increased dsage gradually... I recovered but new monster arised infront of me 'ANHEDONIA/emotional blunting/numbness' ...It was making me disassociated from everyone i am closer and affecting every relations i have.

 

Then i talked this to doctor, he changed tab to Dulexetin , buproprien and betacap for this emotional apathy .....This has really helped me in relieving some symptoms of depression ..Anhedonia but remained ...

After 4-5 month of treatment , Now i am recovered to the extent but last problem for me remains.

In between i tried supplements like MUCUNA pruriens  for dopamine, its very effective for me  with libido increase, sexual pleasure, but not helped much with anhedonia.

 

Now i started on with AGOMELATINE for this anhedonia thing...so will update about its effectiveness after 1 -2 months.

If anyone has gone through plaese reply and suggest any new thing for anhedonia...LETS beat this bastard...

[vaibhav]

I had started  this heavy headed ness in December 2018..The feeling was like someone tying strong knot around my head and its getting tighter...with NO relief in site....I ddint knw at that time , it was related to depression. So i kept hoping that it will ultimately subside after diet change, sleep patterns etc.. but nothing worked ....After 6 months of this unbearable pain.I visited psychiatrist.In our society and family , visiting psychitrist is taboo, so visit was late...I feel if I started this early, i would have better by now.

He has Started off with  amixide-h, SSRI...it helped me ...I got recovered to some extent .But not completely. then my doctor advised me to visit another doc at metropolitan area. so i did...

he started with having SSRI and betacap 20 ....and increased dosage gradually... I recovered but new monster arose infront of me 'ANHEDONIA/emotional blunting/numbness' ...It was making me disassociated from everyone i am closer and affecting every relations i have.There was no feeling, no interest in activities which i enjoy, ....There was like no feeling of emotions except anger, rage, hate , frustration etc negative one..

 

Then i talked this to doctor, he changed tab to Dulexetin , buproprien and betacap for this emotional apathy .....This has really helped me in relieving some symptoms of depression ..Anhedonia but remained ...

After 4-5 month of treatment , Now i am recovered to the extent but last problem for me remains.

In between i tried supplements like MUCUNA pruriens  for dopamine, its very effective for me  with libido increase, sexual pleasure, but not helped much with anhedonia.

 

Now i started on with AGOMELATINE for this anhedonia thing...so will update about its effectiveness after 1 -2 months.

If anyone has gone through plaese reply and suggest any new thing for anhedonia...LETS beat this....

 

 

 

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Pills

amixide h , flunil 20- from june 19 to july 19

galop 10 , betacap 20 - from aug 19 to nov 19 with variations

dulexetine 20, bupropriion 150  - dec 19 to march 20.

 

 

[vaibhav]

Why no one replying.....has anyone faced emotional blunting /apathy./ numbness/ anhedonia? 

[Altostrata]

vaibhav, I've merged your recent posts into your Introductions topic.

 

There is only one Introductions topic to a member. Please add all your comments, questions, and updates to this topic.

 

Anhedonia is a common adverse effect of psychiatric drugs. You might say it is the way the drugs "work". Some people like the effect.

 

Anhedonia can also be a withdrawal symptom, or a lingering effect of psychiatric drugs when you're off the drugs.

 

As you are taking several psychiatric drugs, any of them can be causing the anhedonia.

 

This is a site for going off drugs, not for correcting the effects of your drug cocktail. How may we help you?

 

 

[vaibhav]

hello,

I actually stopped all the drugs since 20th march ....I read that SSRI causes anhedonia. SO any of the member dealt with it successfully..How much time is required for it to recover? Any pills /supplements helped ? 

 

[Altostrata]

Without knowing what drugs you were taking, how you went off the drugs, and what you're experiencing now, I cannot answer your questions. To help us out, follow these instructions Please put your drug and withdrawal history in your signature You may need to use a computer to do this.

 

Please read

 

What is withdrawal syndrome?

 

The Windows and Waves Pattern of Stabilization

 

Are We There Yet? How Long is Withdrawal Going to Take?

 

"Is it always going to be like this?"

 

Important topics about tests, supplements, treatments, diet

 

Overwhelmed, demotivated, apathetic? Cannot get going on interest or action

 

Apathy, anhedonia, emotional numbness, emotional anesthesia

 

Derealization or Depersonalization

 

[vaibhav]

@Altostrata

symptom history:

1. Before starting psychiatric drugs in june 2019, I had extreme heavy headedness, pain and cant feel  anything...Sometimes after workout , i feel flow of happy emotions but for little time

2.After the drugs started, amixide -h, all feelings gone , even after exercise. in 1 month.

3.SSRI- helped in reducing heavy headedness but anger increased.

4.SNRI and Buproprion - reduced this heavy headedness and anger to large extent..in 3 months.

5.Now only little bit of heavy headedness and major anhedonia remained.

 

[vaibhav]

@Altostrata

I have started this supplement -L-DOPA (MUCUNA PRURIENS ) for anhedonia - 1500mg, 

Will AGOMELATINE helps with anhedonia....?

I have started agomelatine with this l-dopa suppplement , is it good? or should i stop  supplement?

 

This guy  here, claiming anhednoia is getting treated by L-tyrosine supplement he has taken.Don't know how it help...

Can you  tell effectiveness of omega - fattty acid with anhedonia.?

 

[Altostrata]

As this is a site for going off drugs, we don't advocate trying new drugs.

 

If I were you, I'd stop trying to find pills for anhedonia. You may have noticed by now that they seem to make you worse.

 

We don't treat pre-existing anhedonia here. Your original anhedonia may be due to many things, some of them best pursued with the help of a psychotherapist. Could also be poor diet, lack of exercise, or other health issue.

 

Taking psychotropic drugs can cause emotional anesthesia, and it can be a withdrawal symptom. If the latter, it will slowly go away. One way or the other, you may need to make lifestyle changes. See

 

Non-drug techniques to cope with emotional symptoms

 

Easing your way into meditation for a stressed-out nervous system

 

Music for self-care: calms hyperalertness, anxiety, aids relaxation and sleep

 

Overwhelmed, demotivated, apathetic? Cannot get going on interest or action

 

Apathy, anhedonia, emotional numbness, emotional anesthesia

 

Derealization or Depersonalization

 

To help us out, follow these instructions Please put your drug and withdrawal history in your signature You may need to use a computer to do this. This is at least the third request.

[vaibhav]

@Altostrata

IS THIS NOT THE DRUG AND WITHDRAWAL HISTORY.?

WHAT MORE TO PUT ?

I HAVE PUT IT IN SIGNATURE....WHAT MORE TO DO?

june 2019 to july 2019= Amixide-h  and flunil 20(SSRI) 

august to november 2019 with increase in dosage = galop 10 and betacap 20.

                                                                I had told doc , anhedonia and anger increasing , so he changed drugs

december 19 to Jan 2020. = Duzono 20(snri) , zupion sr 150(buproprion ), betacap 20 

Feb 2020  =Duzono 30(snri) , zupion sr 150(buproprion ), betacap 20

 

then Tapered drugs over 1 month period with  little withdrawal symptom.

Now stopped completely SNRI and Buproprion since march 22 this year..

ANHEDONIA NOW , is only problem , with little heavyness in frontal head.

Trying AGOMELATINE 25mg to reduce it since 21st april.

 

[Altostrata]

Thanks for your signature. 

 

If anhedonia and "little heavyness in frontal head" are your only symptoms, ordinarily we would advise not adding any more drugs, be patient, take care of yourself and let it gradually go away.

 

As this is a site for going off drugs, how can we help you?

[vaibhav]

so can this site helps in giving information related to experience of supplements like MUCUNA PRURIENS, L-tyrosine, 5-HTP etc...HOw was experience...? 

Can you comment about the video i have posted ?

 

 

[Erell]

20 hours ago, Altostrata said:

As this is a site for going off drugs, we don't advocate trying new drugs.

 

If I were you, I'd stop trying to find pills for anhedonia. You may have noticed by now that they seem to make you worse.

 

We don't treat pre-existing anhedonia here. Your original anhedonia may be due to many things, some of them best pursued with the help of a psychotherapist. Could also be poor diet, lack of exercise, or other health issue.

 

Taking psychotropic drugs can cause emotional anesthesia, and it can be a withdrawal symptom. If the latter, it will slowly go away. One way or the other, you may need to make lifestyle changes.

 

 

Hello, 

 

Altostrata has already answered your questions.

 

I don't know what we can tell you more : if you are looking for advices on taking more drugs, you won't get these advices here.

 

Take care ❤️

[vaibhav]

Ok.k. understood....

I was just trying to know experiences of members related to supplements...

[vaibhav]

are there success stories , related to anhedonia/ emotional numbness? 

[Altostrata]

You might want to look in the Symptoms and Self-Care forum for discussions of supplements. We're not supplements enthusiasts. They may help a little to diminish some withdrawal symptoms, but there is no miracle formula. They do not work reliably for everyone, it's strictly trial-and-error.

 

The only 2 supplements that seem to help many people are fish oil and magnesium, see
https://survivingantidepressants.org/index.php?/topic/36-king-of-supplements-omega-3-fatty-acids-fish-oil/
https://survivingantidepressants.org/topic/15483-magnesium-natures-calcium-channel-blocker/

 

You might try a little bit of one at a time to see how it affects you.

 

(We also favor melatonin for sleep problems, but you have not yet complained about that.)

 

Neither fish oil nor magnesium address anhedonia. If you're trying to cure anhedonia, we have nothing to recommend. Frankly, if your only withdrawal symptom is anhedonia, you're lucky. You need to take care of yourself and cope with it until it goes away. If it arises from pre-existing attitudes, situation, or habits, you need to change them or accept it.

 

Many people here have suffered post-discontinuation anhedonia and recovered from it. You might read other Introductions topics to see how they managed it.

 

We will not assist you in finding drugs to fix your anhedonia. As you have decided to take another drug, which may contribute to anhedonia, you probably would find a different site, such as patientslikeme.com or depressionforums.org, to provide more support. We're not going to counsel you about how to deal with adverse effects of agomelatine or any other drug you might decide to add, that's your doctor's job.

 

[vaibhav]

 

Sleep is not major concern currently..I did not sleep early. But it is totally without any disturbance, whenever i sleep..

I Tried for melatonin for sleep , but stopped it...as it was making me more aggressive and angry and also sleep was with much disturbance and dreams....

Thanx for your frank advise.I appreciate it...

[vaibhav]

You mentioned about sleep problem and i want to share this experience happened with me 4-5 days ago..

 

 

 

4-5 days before,  I have this 2.5 hrs of happiness' I felt , after almost 1 year......I felt like some of the positive feelings are returning...It was the best feeling I had in last year..No regret, frustrat'ion, self pity, but flow of happiness. 

 

BUt it made me exhaust and I sleep after that 2.5 hours ...Then when i woke up , it was all anhedonia again...But i am feeling little better ..

There might be 2 reasons behind it  , i started making 'gratitude list ' since  20 days .

One sure thing , I started taking Agomelatine since last 5-6 days , ..It helped me getting VERY good sleep and helped me in calmness ...Do u think , it might be helping in this?

Since , i started taking it, i noticed  lot of improvement in my mood, attitude....

 

Will that phase of happiness again come...because i didnt had it since 2-3 days?

[vaibhav]

@Altostrata

Hi, I am planning to withdrawing of agomelatine after my 30 days of dosage ...how should I do that? There is no smaller dosage than 25mg for that...

It is really helping me getting REALLY sound sleep .... Will withdrawal affect that? 

[Altostrata]

Tips for tapering off Valdoxan (agomelatine)

 

If the drug is causing you to sleep, removing the drug is likely to disrupt your sleep.

[vaibhav]

@Altostrata

HI , I am typing this after 2 back to back crying spells . please assist .

I have stopped my all medication since last 3 days. Last one was pramipex 0.25 mg only a single time at night , for anhedonia .

I  have problem of emotional numbness since long time. I can not remember, interconnect, things in my life or anything I read , so need your help.

 

1. I am feeling anxious and worthless especially at night and thats when my crying spells comes  and feels like No member of family support me except my mother, because they don't understand it.  Being around them make me feel  little intimidated and got agitated.

Frequent crying spells happening since last 2 days  only at night where I feel too lonely and always get intimidated by thought that anhedonia may not go away at all and I have to live like this. concerned about my future , job, marriage. ...

 

2. I also feel some unequal in my brain as my right brain feels little empty and not under control ..It was under chronic pain since long time before i started treatment .Now there is no pain ,only little heaviness .

3. Little burning sensation also feels sometimes .

 

Please assist, I dont want to see psychiatrist or take pills that may interfere with my natural brain. I fear them now.

What should I do ? 

 

 

 

 

 

[Altostrata]

What drug changes have you made since May 3?

 

What is pramipex? You must list all your drugs by their pharmaceutical names. You cannot expect us to know the names of the drugs in every country.

 

Emotional numbness is a common consequence of taking psychiatric drugs. It will very slowly go away when you are off the drugs.

[vaibhav]

@Altostrata I had taken agomelatine for almost 2 month and after that i stopped it .there is no withdrawal symptom of it , I quickly adjusted i guess..

Pramipex constitute pramipexole salt . i dont know any other name for it..Its been taken for anhedonia as many helped with it.

It helped somewhat . but After stopping all drugs since july 15 ..I started having some feelings like some happiness, excitement and curiosity , which are positive emotions.

Now currently , I am off drugs for 2 months almost and there is visible recovery for me.

I am still feeling some heaviness and foggy head and there is like issue with my 'AMYGDALA' as i can not feel FLIGHT / FEAR emotions.. also there is LONG term memory issue and Interlinking of things , that I face currently.

I hope with time , everything will be back to normal.

Thanx for your support..You are doing wonderful work here.

[Altostrata]

7 hours ago, vaibhav said:

Now currently , I am off drugs for 2 months almost and there is visible recovery for me.

 

This is good, isn't it?

 

7 hours ago, vaibhav said:

I am still feeling some heaviness and foggy head and there is like issue with my 'AMYGDALA' as i can not feel FLIGHT / FEAR emotions.. also there is LONG term memory issue and Interlinking of things , that I face currently.

 

People often experience emotional anesthesia and dullness when they're off psychiatric drugs they've taken for a long time. This is left over from the drug effect. It will gradually fade if you take care of yourself and your vulnerable nervous system.

 

How much recovered would you say you were? 50%? Please let us know how you're doing.

[vaibhav]

@Altostrata hi.

Yes it s wonderful to be off the drugs .just can't explain it ..

Recovery, i would say, is , different at different times of day... When I focus only on this MOMENT , it feels like i am recovered almost 70-80% . but it changes during various times of the day.  Worst I feel is immediately after waking up ...that is almost 50% and feeling of 'good' increases through day till evening and then   it remains same or  decreases slightly..

I would also like to say , I am taking homeopathy drugs ALPHA-TS - but it is not in any way changes brain chemistry , its just for tension reduction and I am also reducing its use day by day..This helped me in my recovery to some extent  , i must admit. 

Still there is emotional numbness and memory issues , however , due to my cultivated habit of  seeing good even in worst situation is helping me to feel some positive emotions. 

THis videos helped me to change my habit of thinking , though it took A LOT of EFFORTS for that .

Thanx...i will update , when i would be feel like I reached next checkpoint.

 

 

[vaibhav]

@Altostrata

Hi. One more thing , i want to highlight is , whenever there is too much stress, i feel like there is pin like sensation especially on inner part of brain.. Is it due to pills or part of recovery?

[Altostrata]

Are sensations these like little sparks? How can you avoid too much stress?

[vaibhav]

@Altostrata 

No .Whenever its stress , its like pain there constantly  inside brain  ..Its because i don't i much emotions i guess..

That little sparks were there , when i used to consume SNRI , in march , but went away after i stopped it.

 

To avoid stress, I  do exercise.Also anything which requires too much intellect like planning my study , or doing it..It causes stress as my emotions are not tthere , so thought process is derailed...and can not manage it properly.

 

Also when i have that stress and I think of positive thing , though not rational ...It somewhat reduces my pain ...what is this?

 

[Altostrata]

Your nervous system probably is still sensitive from the effects of the drug and going off the drug.

 

Many people find fish oil and magnesium supplements helpful, see
https://survivingantidepressants.org/index.php?/topic/36-king-of-supplements-omega-3-fatty-acids-fish-oil/
https://survivingantidepressants.org/topic/15483-magnesium-natures-calcium-channel-blocker/

 

You might try a little bit of one at a time to see how it affects you.

 

I would also avoid stress as your system gradually heals.

[vaibhav]

@Altostrata Hi..One more thing  I experienced yesterday.  I had quarrel with my family member , I felt really angry and uncontrolled. my blood pressure surely increased.

However , that gave me some respite i don't know why..IS it because my adrenaline increased and my whole body felt like rush of blood.? 

it is not good ...right?

[vaibhav]

@Altostrata 

since last 3 days, I felt , really weird thing. I got angry on saturday , uncontrolably,  ..losing control of the moment. I  was also taking total 1000EPA 800 DHA per day fish oil( 1-1) since last 1 month .It was the best month for me since all this started .

 I stopped it since  4th of this month . And since then  , i feeling little bit down in mood . Today I took fish supplement again, but high dosage that is 2 pills at a time in the morning  , and felt like ,new energy rushing though my brain. it felt SO GOOD , but also , it was like uncontrollable. My mood is also too good  but without any breaks. its like Fish oil is  giving me kick . But still emotional variations lack and other problems of memory and restraint , is there.

.It dramatically uplifted my mood .Some feelings are still not there and they are there , only for a short while. keeping them ON , is kind of a problem.They dont stick for a long time. 

Is this ok?

Should I add magnessium supplement to this? 
What dosage adjustment should i do? continue with this 1 -1 morning- evening or 2 in the morning ?
Is it ok , if i made this platform , to kind of tracking my emotions and phases?  

[Altostrata]

It is unlikely that fish oil caused you to be angry with your family member.

 

If it makes you feel better, I'd continue to take it. If you feel it's overstimulating, you might want to take only a little bit.

 

We recommend magnesium and fish oil because people often say they help.

 

Your symptoms that are related to withdrawal are of interest here, we cannot provide psychotherapeutic services.

[vaibhav]

@Altostrata

Ok.thanx. No I am not saying fish oil caused me to be angry , I am just saying that , fish oil gave me something like runner's high like condition. So , i will reduce dosage or spread it out over the day like twice a day rather than taking all at the same time..Will update it...

[Altostrata]

You should take either fish oil or magnesium throughout the day, in divided doses. Please read the links we give you.