Dan17S: my journey with Prozac

[Dan17S]

Hello everyone,

 

This is just a short post to introduce myself. My name is Dan and I'm 36. I live in South London.

 

I don't think I ever really noticed anything really wrong with my mental health until 2014. Before that, looking back, I can see I had spells of quite strong anxiety but I didn't know what it was at the time. In 2014 I was working so hard, overthinking, feeling very sensitive to things like criticism and then my one "rest" during the week was to meet friends at the pub, which would mean then feeling rubbish the next day/s, as I got bad anxiety from drinking. In the end I suddenly stopped sleeping and felt incredibly anxious. I took time off and tried to let it pass but it didn't. In retrospect I think a key reason it didn't was because I was so bewildered by what was happening and constantly thinking what it was and would it ever go etc. So I was tiring out an already very tired mind. My doctor and I tried a few things to try to help but nothing worked in the end. So I started on the lowest dose of fluoxetine, 20mg. It worked very quickly for me, I think I’m very sensitive and responsive to it. 

 

All went fine and I was stable on it until 2018. I hadn’t tried to reduce the dose over the time until then because I went through so many life changes and it felt a bad time. But in 2018 I felt better in most ways and a doctor at my GP surgery suggesting halving my dose. For three months it was fine and then after an evening where I’d had some alcohol the following evening my sleep started becoming very disrupted again and the anxiety symptoms returned very powerfully. I’m not sure what happened exactly but maybe drinking alcohol affected my serotonin levels while I was still too fragile recovering. Anyway it was too uncomfortable and I went back up to 20mg.

 

I stuck with 20mg until 2019 when my ex wife and I separated. Like I said above I’m a very sensitive person and even though the separation was incredibly amicable I needed some extra support and my doctor suggested going up to 40mg, which I did and had positive effects from very quickly.

 

In 2021 I decided I’d had the extra support of 40mg for long enough and started trying to reduce. For 3 months I skipped a tablet. The next 3 months another tablet. In the UK to get to 40mg per day we take two 20mg pills. So by the end of last year I was taking one less pill on two days per week. I think this averaged out as about 34mg per day.

 

This summer I decided to skip another tablet, meaning I was overall having one less tablet three days a week. I think it means I’m on roughly 31mg per day now.

 

I should say that I’m a practising Buddhist since 2019 and I’m training to be ordained in my Buddhist movement. I think this gave me the extra impetus to try reducing the dose as I felt more prepared to work with withdrawal symptoms and what I may face on a lower dose.

 

The two small reductions last year went pretty well, no major turbulence. This year the next reduction has been a bit more difficult. I had physical symptoms of anxiety for about a week around 2 weeks into reducing. After about a month I had one really bad night’s sleep and I was worried that was a return of what happened in 2018 with the unsuccessful tapering. But I was very patient and let the symptoms come and go. This week is 7 weeks on the 31mg dose and I’m doing okay I think! I still have some symptoms of physical anxiety but so far nothing unmanageable. I’ve been taking a magnesium supplement for a couple of weeks and that has helped I think, although the strength (300mg) has given me some nausea so I've stopped taking it this week.

 

I signed up to this forum for a few reasons, mainly though that there is so little information on antidepressant withdrawal. What little information there is isn't always informative or helpful. So I'm looking to connect with others who have been or are on a journey of reducing their dose and learning from their experience. I'd love support and connections as I navigate reducing my dose, tips and advice on how to manage it and ways in my own way I can help share my experiences to help others.

 

Look forward to getting to know some of you! 

 

Dan

 

Edited August 18, 2022 by ChessieCat
Missing final sentences! CC removed photo

[Onmyway]

Hi Dan, 

welcome to SA. Can you please create a drug signature so that we can advise you more easily and quickly (when threads get larger we can't always read all of them). 

 

How to List Drug History in Signature - Introductions and updates - Surviving Antidepressants

 

What you are doing right now by skipping doses is not good. It creates inconsistent dosing in your brain which can eventually sensitize your brain and make withdrawal much harder. More info with links to literature here: 

https://www.survivingantidepressants.org/topic/22958-never-skip-doses-to-taper/

 

This has a link to important topics in the tapering. Please read these carefully. 

SA recommends tapering by no more than 10% of your previous dose every month. These threads explain why that is the case: 

https://www.survivingantidepressants.org/topic/300-important-topics-in-the-tapering-forum-and-faq/

 

 

Here are tips for tapering fluoxetine. 

https://www.survivingantidepressants.org/topic/759-tips-for-tapering-off-prozac-fluoxetine/

 

We advise that you are take your dose consistently - so you would get 31mg of fluoxetine a day consistently. The above thread has info on how to obtain such doses. Fluoxetine has a long half life and is a bit more forgiving with skipping doses but it is still a very bad idea.

 

Withdrawal can be a tough time for many people and it helps to be less reactive and learn techniques to manage some of the symptoms without drugs. Your training in Buddhism and its focus on meditation and mindfulness can be useful. Many of us here like Dr Claire Weekes' methods as well. Pls look her up. 

 

Non-drug techniques to cope with emotional symptoms - Symptoms and self-care - Surviving Antidepressants

Important topics about symptoms, including sleep problems - Symptoms and self-care - Surviving Antidepressants

 

Hope you start feeling better soon and we are happy to answer any questions that you may have. 

This is your introduction topic where you will update the community on your progress, feel free to check other people's threads as well and say hello and make friends. 

 

OMW

Edited August 25, 2022 by Onmyway

[Dan17S]

Thanks @Onmyway! Really useful. I know Claire Weekes' work well. I listened to her audiobooks while dealing with the unsuccessful taper I tried in 2018 (going from 20mg to 10mg). I've tried to set up my signature. Hope it worked. I'll look at those other links you sent me. Regarding my taper I should have said in my post that it was a plan I agreed with my doctor, rather than on my own. In the UK I believe the recommendation is to go from 40mg to 30mg and then to 20mg. The 30mg step they say is by alternate day doses. I didn't want to go this quickly after going from 20mg to 10mg in 2018 unsuccessfully so for this latest taper plan I agreed with my doctor to go slower and I began last year by missing one tablet out of the two per day once a week and then after 3 months on a second day. I felt well enough this summer to try a third day. Thanks for all the tips on how best to taper I hadn't known these options. What I am planning to do actually, because I found the 34 to 31mg reduction slightly more difficult than the previous steps is to do a smaller one next time. To do this what I planned to do is when I am ready see if my doctor can help me access 10mg capsules as well as 20mg capsules and reduce to 30mg per day with both of these. Further reductions from that I'll work out a good plan and might ask advice on here. I'll explore the liquid option, which I think I may have a better chance of getting once I'm on smaller doses I think. I'll check in with you on that perhaps.

 

As per our message exchange @brassmonkey I wanted to ask you a little about about your post "Are we there yet". What I've found with my respective tapers is the following: 2018 halving dose from 20mg to 10mg- three months fine and then after drinking alcohol (not much) I totally derailed and had to go back on the 20mg dose. When I felt I wanted to reduce my 40mg dose last spring I reduced by roughly 3mg for 3 months, without much turbulence, then another 3mg, again without much turbulence. This year I've done another 3mg and while it has basically been fine the symptoms have been more present. I had physical symptoms of anxiety about 2 weeks into reducing the dose. 4 weeks in a pretty disturbed night. And then over the last few weeks bits of turbulence with unsettled tummy, feeling quite anxious on occasion and taking a bit of time to get to sleep. As I say none of this has been particularly disturbing yet, but i'm 8 12 weeks into the new dose. What I wondered, after this long preamble (sorry!), is if you have seen any particularly helpful advice or trends on how long it is worth stabilising on a new dose for (i.e. how long it is worth feeling the "WDnormal" before trying the next reduction. 

[ChessieCat]

Hi Dan and welcome from me too,

 

PATIENCE and non drug coping skills are key to getting off successfully.

 

And the learning of patience as well as non drug techniques to cope helps once you are off the drug too and trying the cope with life in general.

 

It is important to listen to your body/symptoms and not reduce again until you are stable.

 

Non-drug techniques to cope

 

Dr Joseph Glenmullen's WD Symptoms Checklist

 

Stability

 

WDnormal

 

And Brassmonkey talks more about it here:

 

tao-of-the-brassmonkey

[Dan17S]

Thanks so much @ChessieCat xx

[brassmonkey]

Tapering is all about listening to one's body, it will tell you when it is time to taper. Our recommendation of at least 4 weeks between reductions is a good starting point, but it is fine to take longer. Shorter time periods are not a good idea because unresolved "background symptoms" tend to build up and can cause a crash that is quite hard to recover from. Some members report having to wait many months between reductions, but 4-6 weeks seems to work well for most people.

 

It appears that you are doing a linear taper of 3mgai each time. After the third reduction you dose will be about 31mgai. Any reductions after that will start to be too large if you continue with this plan. I strongly recommend that you start doing a 10% reduction or a Brassmonkey Slide. It will save you a lot of grief down the road.

[Dan17S]

Thanks so much @brassmonkey. I think my next reduction I will try to get hold of the 10mg capsules of Fluoxetine from my doctor, as well as the 20mg ones and then go from 31.5mg down to 30mg that way (on a daily dose). That's a 5% reduction I think. And then from there I might check in but I think reducing by a 10mg tablet a time rather than a 20mg tablet means I should be able to stay within a 5%-10% reduction level.

[Onmyway]

2 hours ago, Dan17S said:

Thanks so much @brassmonkeyI think reducing by a 10mg tablet a time rather than a 20mg tablet means I should be able to stay within a 5%-10% reduction level.

I don't think you should be reducing by 10mg. Not sure if that's what you meant. Consider getting a liquid formulation for part of your dosage. Or a scale or make your own liquid.

[Dan17S]

Hi @Onmyway. I'm hoping once I am stabilised on my current dose of 31.5mg and ready to go down a next dose I can go down to 30mg by getting a 20mg and 10mg tablet. It seems hard to get 10mg in the UK but I will ask. I'll also ask about the liquid. I'm almost 9 weeks into 31.5mg by taking 40mg four days a week and 20mg for three days. I hadn't known about any potential issue with alternate dosing with fluoxetine until your post so I'll bear in mind when I next speak to the GP. Hopefully 9 weeks into that pattern I'm getting a handle on the side effects and approaching stability. My plan had been if i do get a 10mg tablet was to then do 20+10mg tablets per day to get to 30, stabilise and then on one day per week drop a 10mg tablet as a next step, which seems like it would be 5% reduction. But I will ask about liquid and look into a scale too.

[Onmyway]

Dan our advice is to take a consistent dose every day so no alternating doses. The latter is a surefire way to make yourself sicker - it's like "playing pingpong with your brain" as Alto says. That makes your nervous system more reactive and every time you lower you will have worse symptoms.

 

The extra effort to get the same dose every day is in your interest.

[Dan17S]

Thanks @Onmyway! When I next talk to my GP about doses I’ll find a way to get access to regular amounts.

[methuselah]

3 hours ago, Dan17S said:

Thanks @Onmyway! When I next talk to my GP about doses I’ll find a way to get access to regular amounts.

Get the liquid if you can, it’s so easy that way.  Else, mix 1mg Prozac per 1ml distilled water and dose that way.  Don’t alternate, if the doc tells you that ignore him/her or get a new one.  The docs that like to alternate doses are also the ones that liken the drug to insulin, idiots.  Sorry, little salty   Good luck

[Crepe]

Hi @Dan17S, I hope today finds you well. Thanks so much for your response in my thread. I am with you on the lack of info/knowledge out there on withdrawals and tapering. Availability of low doses seems to be a big issue. I too was told to skip days. 

 

Just last year I read "Dr Claire Weekes: The Woman Who Cracked The Anxiety Code". Fabulous book.

 

Practicing Buddhist? You're awesome.

 

Sending you love & peace,

 

C.

[Dan17S]

Thanks @Crepe! When I next need a prescription I’m going to see what options there are in the UK to get a 10mg tablet, which would help me with the next reduction I was planning to make (from 31.5mg to 30mg) and to access a liquid solution. I saw that biography of Claire Weekes but haven’t read it, I’ll download it tonight! I love her work she was a wonderful woman! Yeah I’m training to be ordained in my Buddhist movement. It’s taught me a lot of useful tips for working with anxiety although still days that aren’t easy! I’ll message you to connect. Dan x

[Dan17S]

Thanks @methuselahwhen I next talk to my GP I’m going to find out about what options I have to get a 10mg tablet, which would help me with my next planned reduction as I’m planning to go from 31.5mg to 30mg and if I can get a 10mg tablet alongside the 20mg I can do that on a daily dose. I’ll also ask about liquid formula. I’ve never had either offered before on the NHS but have never asked either as I hadn’t known about them. I’ll keep you posted!

[Dan17S]

Hello everyone. I’m at week 9 today on my dose of 31.5mg of fluoxetine. I was journaling last night on how it’s been so far and thought I’d type it up.

 

Context

 

Last year (March 2021) I decided to start reducing my medication level from 40mg. I’d been on that level since November 2019. I felt at the time that the support I’d needed to get through a separation with my ex wife had had its effect and my Buddhist practice would be able to sustain me moving back gradually to my lower dose of 20mg. I started last year by missing one of two 20mg tablets on one day per week. I think that took me to an average weekly dose of 37mg. And then after three months I skipped one of the two 20mg tablets on another day. I think that took me to a weekly average of about 34mg. I did that second step for three months and then from September decided to stay on that dose over winter. Both those steps I found okay. Each time I had anxiety symptoms a couple of weeks in but I let them come and go and I stabilised pretty quickly. 

 

This year

 

At the end of June this year I had a strong subconscious message in one of my meditations to go down a further tablet per week. Taking me I think to roughly 31.5mg per week. As I said above I’m 9 weeks into that dose today.

 

Symptoms over the 9 weeks so far

 

Initially the symptoms were quite similar to the two reductions last year. A couple of weeks into the taper I had some mild anxiety symptoms, churning tummy, for about a week. Then it subsided. 

 

About a month in I had a disturbed night’s sleep (wakeful from 3-5am). I was worried this would be a return to some of the symptoms I had when my taper in 2018 went wrong (my doctor advised going from 20mg to 10mg in one step and although I was fine for three months after a night of having alcohol I was blown off course and had to go back up to 20mg). But thankfully it was one bad night and my sleep returned quickly. I started taking a magnesium supplement after this initial disturbed night. 

 

Six weeks in when my mum visited me (we’ve had a somewhat strained relationship at times) I noticed I was working with a little bit more physical anxiety (unsettled tummy and slightly busier mind). With her visiting I would kind of expected this anyway but thought I would include.

 

After my mum left (week 7) I had a night where it took me a little longer to finally fall  asleep (around 1am). That again passed quickly in terms of disrupted sleep. I felt a little more melancholy that week but that may also be linked to my mum’s visit. I’d noticed my tummy had been a little more unsettled and decided to stop taking the magnesium supplement (300mg). I think this has helped reduce how unsettled my tummy has been since. 

 

Week 8, last week, I had a sinus infection. I get these a couple of times a year and often feel quite laid low by them. I think that affected my mood a little and prompted me to have I would say too high a focus on my symptoms and searching a little too actively on here and elsewhere for definitive answers to what was happening and when they would end. Straying a little too much from focus on my Buddhist practice as an anchor and acceptance and patience as my tools.

 

Stabilisation? WDnormal?

 

I would say my general pattern for the last month or so is something like this:

 

Sleep: aside from two nights I’ve had minimum seven hours per night. Sometimes it takes me a little time to drop off, with a final toilet trip or two to wee before dropping off.

 

Mornings: on waking I have a somewhat unsettling tummy. I have one main meal a day and this is an evening meal, so my bowel movements are in the morning. This unsettled tummy sensation can come with some anxiety and adrenaline.

 

Mornings I have slightly more physical sensations of restlessness and a busy mind. This has come often, but not always, with a sense of a foggy mind.

 

Afternoons: generally the busy mind starts to pass over the afternoon. I generally eat some nuts or have a smoothie so that may help settle my tummy. The anxiety symptoms of adrenaline and unsettled tummy generally pass. My foggy head lifts.

 

Evenings: have been generally my best period of the day. I feel settled and calm in the evenings and generally sleep well.

 

Of the 63 days so far I’ve had 2 with noticeably disturbed sleep. I would say the above pattern of symptoms have been a rough norm for about a month now. Within that month I’ve had windows of feeling absolutely clear minded and symptom free, a couple of these have been in the last week.

Unlike last year then this has been a less linear and speedy journey to stability. I really found @brassmonkey @Onmywaykindly reminded me of), other tools that @ChessieCatkindly shared) and work with acceptance, courage and faith. 

 

I’ve learned a lot more over the last few weeks about anti-depressants and withdrawal than i’d known before. Most of this has helped and has given me much better clarity on how to approach next steps on my tapering. As @Onmyway and others have said, it seems important that next steps on my tapering try to work within the 10% range and that I try to get a regular daily dose. I’ll see if I can get a 10mg tablet to try to next take a 10mg and 20mg tablet per day to go from 31.5mg to 30mg. Im not looking to do this next taper soon, I’d like to stabilise on this dose for a while first. Any future steps from that I’d try to then use a liquid solution to come down from 30mg to 20mg a little slower.

 

I feel a lot of clarity on my plan at the moment. The one thing I’m reflecting on is the concern people have raised about alternate dosing and what that means for my current level of taper (31.5mg by taking 40mg on four days and 20mg on three). I feel a little uncertain at the moment between knowing I’m 9 weeks into this taper method and sticking with it until I stabilise and feeling I need to try to find a way to get 31.5mg per day to stabilise. And I think a little bit of underlying fear now I know about issues with alternate doses, which I hadn’t before, that I won’t stabilise on my current approach (which I’m sure is my anxiety talking). 

 

I feel really committed to my journey of moving down to 20mg again over the next year or so and am really grateful to those of you that have engaged with me so far. This forum feels a really important space to ensure I don’t feel alone in what I’m doing.

 

Dan x

 

p.s. Big thanks to my wonderful dog for his constant support and companionship. And to @Crepefor becoming the first person (non-moderator) to chat with me.

 

Edited August 31, 2022 by ChessieCat
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[Crepe]

Ah @Dan17S give your dog a big cuddle from me! Where would we be without them? Keep listening to your body, follow what it tells you. Your meditation is the ideal tool to stay in touch with how you're feeling underneath the anxieties.

I wish you more days of clarity, and more nights of good rest. The days of crap are bound to come but when they do you won't be alone.

 

I want to thank you also for reaching out to me.

 

Sending love & peace,

 

C.

[ChessieCat]

You sent this via PM:

 

15 minutes ago, Dan17S said:

I wondered if I might ask you a couple of questions on your experience of withdrawal?

 

During my tapering I only experienced mild withdrawal symptoms.  When I first arrived at SA I was experiencing major withdrawal symptoms but after updosing and stabilising my taper was fairly uneventful.  I listened to my body/symptoms and only reduced when I was stable and if I was experiencing additional stress or was sick I would hold for longer.

[Dan17S]

3 minutes ago, ChessieCat said:

You sent this via PM:

 

 

During my tapering I only experienced mild withdrawal symptoms.  When I first arrived at SA I was experiencing major withdrawal symptoms but after updosing and stabilising my taper was fairly uneventful.  I listened to my body/symptoms and only reduced when I was stable and if I was experiencing additional stress or was sick I would hold for longer.

Thank you! That's really good to know. Thanks for sharing!

[Dan17S]

Hello everyone! I wanted to post a week 10 update. 

 

I've had a very positive last week. For most of the days since last Monday it has felt like pretty much all the symptoms of adjusting to the new dose of the medication lifted. My tummy settled, I had a clear head and rather than feeling consistently neutral felt very positive most days.

 

Tomorrow I have a catch up with my doctor now she is back from her summer holiday. I'll explore with her how I can move to a regular daily dose soon. I think I will do this when i reduce my current dose from 31.5mg to 30mg and see if I can get a 20mg and 10mg tablet to be able to do this. I'm not sure I want to tinker with my current dose yet as I think I am stabilising but I'll see. 

 

On Thursday I've managed to organise a chat with Baylissa Frederick. I found her book SO helpful and her website is such a great resource. I'm hoping that session can arm me with the tools I need to be as prepared as I can for future reductions. 

 

There's always the temptation after a positive few days to cling to them, so I am being careful to acknowledge there are still many bumps to come in the road as I reduce my dose but I've felt extremely happy to know these positive feelings are there. I would say some of the days of the last week felt more positive even than before I dropped down the dose in June. Thanks everyone for being in touch. I really appreciate this community. 

 

Dan x

[Dan17S]

Week 11 update

 

I thought I would keep going with writing periodic updates on my page. It feels quite cathartic to write about how I am doing.

 

The last week has been another good one. I've felt really well over the last seven days. I would say about two weeks ago all the (moderate) symptoms I had while adjusting dose have lifted. Over the past week I felt calm, happy and positive. I've been sleeping well and my tummy has felt very settled. The three main updates I have are from a call with my doctor, a chat with Baylissa Frederick and with my dietician.

 

My doctor

 

I had a really good chat with my doctor last Tuesday. Where we left things is that we think I have stabilising on my current dose. We touched on the issue of alternate dosing and she said her colleagues at the Maudsley use this approach as routine. She's aware some people can react badly to it but she thinks the speed I have gone so far has meant I've been okay. We agreed though that when I next drop a dose (which I am now not planning to do for some months) I will go from 31.5mg per day to 30mg per day via a 20mg tablet and 10mg tablet. From there future drops I can use the 20mg tablet and an oral solution. So I feel confident now I'm on the right plan to keep coming down in future stages in a careful way, while also giving myself time to heal properly in the coming months.

 

Baylissa Frederick

 

I had a really good chat with Baylissa last week. I really found her book and website so helpful and it was great to speak with her. In the end nothing particularly new came out, she was very supportive of my approach, but it was lovely to connect with her. I really recommend accessing her resources online if you haven't!

 

Dietician

 

Through a friend I made on the "Withdrawal Project" I have had access recently to a dietician/kinesiologist. She did a a consultation with me and has recommended to supplements to help with my tummy and gut health. They took a while to arrive because of the postal strike but I have started them this morning- which feels good timing as I think I have stabilised now and they hopefully won't be interfering with my healing. 

 

That's it from my end. Hope you are all well!

 

Love,

Dan x

 

[ChessieCat]

5 minutes ago, Dan17S said:

We touched on the issue of alternate dosing

 

From:  NEVER SKIP DOSES TO TAPER

 

On 6/5/2020 at 9:36 AM, Altostrata said:

Skipping doses causes the level of the drug in your bloodstream to go up and down, even with long-acting drugs such as fluoxetine. This puts stress on your nervous system, potentially causing withdrawal symptoms. It's like playing ping-pong with your brain.

 

 

There is no need to alternate doses.  Fluoxetine can easily be made into a liquid.  See Post #1 of this topic which explains how to get non standard doses:

 

Tips for tapering off fluoxetine (Prozac)

 

[ChessieCat]

You could take part of your dose in tablet and the rest in liquid or you could change to all liquid.

 

cross-over-changing-form-eg-tablet-to-liquid-of-drug-or-changing-brand-of-same-drug

 

[Dan17S]

Thanks @ChessieCat. When I do my next reduction I'll be going to a regular daily amount (30mg per day with a 10mg and 20mg tablet). Given how many weeks I am into my current reduction and that I have been okay we didn't think we should tinker with things for this step but change for the next one. Sounded sensible to me. Further steps down from 30mg I'll do with a tablet and liquid, which she said she could help me access. 

[Crepe]

Hey Dan, so glad to hear things are going well. I'm curious as to what supplements the dietician recommended? I take probiotics and sometimes prebiotics, can't say I feel them working but I'm sure they do me good. I read a research paper (now I can't find it) showing fluoxetine changes the microbiota in the gut. I'm still learning so much.

 

I hope your days continue to be calm.

 

Peace and love to you,

 

C.

[Dan17S]

Hey @Crepe. I'm taking AlfaAlfa, activated charcoal, something called bowel build (https://lilyandloafinternational.com/products/bowel-build), something called MSM (https://lilyandloafinternational.com/products/msm), and also something called NutriCalm which helps replenish nutrients etc lost during periods of stress (i.e. withdrawal)- https://lilyandloafinternational.com/products/nutri-calm. Oh and Pea Protein, to add to milk as a shake. 

 

I'll let you know how i get on with them. When I was having symptoms the main one was with my tummy so I'll see what effects these have (although bearing in mind my tummy settled a few weeks ago now). 

 

Lots of love! Dan x

[Crepe]

Thank you! I'll be looking into them. My tummy needs all the help it can get.

[Dan17S]

Thanks @Crepe I'll let you know how I get on. To be honest I am really glad to be starting them now, after having not had any symptoms for a few weeks, so I can just see if they make an added difference rather than worry if they affect my recovery negatively. When I spoke to Baylissa she said anything for the tummy sounded helpful and not to be too worried because some supplements can impact some people negatively but it's rarely anything significant or that doesn't pass.

[Onmyway]

1 hour ago, Dan17S said:

Hey @Crepe. I'm taking AlfaAlfa, activated charcoal, something called bowel build (https://lilyandloafinternational.com/products/bowel-build), something called MSM (https://lilyandloafinternational.com/products/msm), and also something called NutriCalm which helps replenish nutrients etc lost during periods of stress (i.e. withdrawal)- https://lilyandloafinternational.com/products/nutri-calm. Oh and Pea Protein, to add to milk as a shake. 

 

I'll let you know how i get on with them. When I was having symptoms the main one was with my tummy so I'll see what effects these have (although bearing in mind my tummy settled a few weeks ago now). 

 

Lots of love! Dan x

I will strongly advise against the Nutricalm as people in withdrawal are sensitized esp to some of the B vitamins and that supplement has them in 4000%+ of daily requirements. Over long time periods this can also damage your liver.

 

I am really glad that you are feeling better but withdrawal is a long process and has the windows and waves. As much as we advise to not despair during waves, we also advise to not make risky choices during windows. Enjoy the respite but even people who have recovered have had setbacks months/years after from an odd glass of alcohol as their nervous system is sensitized. Supplements can also set people back. Be very careful. There will always be people willing to sell you stuff and most of the time you just lose your money but here you're risking hard won stability.

 

OMW 

 

Edited September 12, 2022 by Onmyway

[Dan17S]

Thanks @Onmyway! These supplements are just for a short course (a couple of weeks). I'll see how I get on with them but be prepared to stop if they seem to be having any negative effects. When I tried to come off in 2018 and halved my dose it was after three months I crashed and that was because of a small amount of alcohol (I don't drink anymore as a Buddhist) so I know to be careful.

[Onmyway]

I personally would not touch these supplements in these quantities. You might not be able to put the genie back in the bottle even after a single dose. But up to you. Just remember that once things get broken there is nothing to do but wait - sometimes for months and years. Stopping might not be enough. 

 

OMW 

[ChessieCat]

I agree with Onmyway.

[Dan17S]

Thanks @ChessieCat& @Onmywayfor now I’ll stick to just the supplements which are for my tummy, they all seem fine, and as you suggest I won’t take the Nutri Calm. Thanks for both your advice. X

[Dan17S]

 

I decided to also not take the charcoal supplement after reading it can interfere with your normal medication. So I am just going to take the ones below now, all for my tummy.

 

Bowel Build: https://lilyandloafinternational.com/products/bowel-build

 

MSM: https://lilyandloafinternational.com/products/msm

 

Alfalfa: https://lilyandloafinternational.com/products/alfalfa

Pea protein: https://lilyandloafinternational.com/products/red-berry-pea-protein-powder-540g

[Dan17S]

Hi ! I've spent a week now on the supplements mentioned in my last post. I'll copy them below for ease:

 

• Bowel Build: https://lilyandloafinternational.com/products/bowel-build
• MSM: https://lilyandloafinternational.com/products/msm
• Alfalfa: https://lilyandloafinternational.com/products/alfalfa
• Pea protein: https://lilyandloafinternational.com/products/red-berry-pea-protein-powder-540g

 

As part of this supplement routine I stopped taking my normal multivitamin (https://vegan-vitality.co.uk/collections/frontpage/products/vegan-multivitamin). I'd been taking the multivitamin, and a vegan probiotic, for about a year or so.

 

I was looking at the multivitamin box this morning and realised it has quite a high amount of B12 and D3 (as I'm a vegan)- something like 2000% RVA of B12 and 400% of D3.

 

On my new supplement regime I'm getting more like 100% of B12 through the pea protein and no D3 I don't think. I just wondered if there is a possibility of any issues by the B12 now being reduced? If there might be I could go back and take the multivitamin again (even half a tablet). I'll speak with the nutritionist but thought I'd check in if anyone had an experiences.

 

So far I've felt pretty fine on the new supplements. One of the main symptoms I had over the summer while reducing dose was an unsettled tummy in the morning. This seems to have calmed down over the last week and instead I have 2/3 bowel movements in the morning and my tummy then feels very empty. My appetite has also increased. I haven't noticed any spike in anxiety although I've woken up a bit more during the night to wee.

 

Dan xx

 

[ChessieCat]

10 hours ago, Dan17S said:

I just wondered if there is a possibility of any issues by the B12 now being reduced?

 

You will need to work with your medical professional.  The SA staff are unpaid peers who have tapered, tapering or stopped their psychiatric drug/s too quickly.  They are not medical professionals and do not provide general medical advice.

 

SA does have some suggestions regarding starting anything new, especially only making one change at a time (one supplement, not a complex) and also starting with a small dose; see:

 

the-rule-of-3kis-keep-it-simple-keep-it-slow-keep-it-stable

 

There are many existing topics on SA, including supplements, where members sometimes post their own experience.  Go to the  Symptoms and self-care and use the site search bar at the top right.