neilstevenlubin Neil's Introduction.

[neilstevenlubin]

Hi everyone. My name is Neil and I'm 53 years old, have been fighting treatment resistant depression since I was a child up until today by taking all of the U.S. antidepressants and having many Ect treatments and hospitalizations for the past 30 years now. It has disabled so much that I finally stopped working in 2000 and started Social Security Disability and Medicare. At first I hated not working, but it turned out for the best. 

 

Since nothing has really worked, I've recently researched Vagus Nerve Stimulation, Deep Brain Stimulation and CES devices in hopes I'd find another route that would help me, even a little. the first two choices, while they may have worked, are out of my reach financially since insurance companies and Medicare won't pay for them. This saddened me greatly for several days until I researched the CES devices and came across an FDA approved unit called Alpha-Stim AID. There is one other such FDA approved device, the others are not so I wouldn't even waste my money even though they are relatively inexpensive.

 

It's taken me several weeks to find a licensed healthcare professional to prescribe it to me. My LCSW therapist was happy to after reading the literature that I gave her and talking to some psychiatrist and other therapists that she knows. I'm very grateful to her for this chance, whether it works or not.

 

This unit has 30 years of studies behind it as well as some amazing and not so amazing results that I've read and watched videos of it's usage. I placed an order for the device this past wednesday and will receive it tomorrow.

 

So, wish me luck and it's nice to introduce myself to this group. You all seem so caring and nice.

 

Bye for now.

[OffEFFexor]

Hi Neil, I hope you get some positive effect from the Alpha-Stim device. Best of luck.

[neilstevenlubin]

Thank you so much. Take care.

[Altostrata]

Welcome, neil.

 

Please see and add to our topic Alpha-Stim, Fisher Wallace Sota Biotuner, PoNS, and similar...

[neilstevenlubin]

Thank you so much Altostrata. I'll check it out.

 

EDIT: I was looking over the link and found it very interesting and learned a lot. I've also noticed that I've posted there a couple of times and hope to continue to do so.

[nz11]

Welcome Neil.

Question: Are you taking any drugs at the moment?..or are you off all drugs?

[neilstevenlubin]

Thanks for the welcome nz11, very cute kitty icon. I'm taking a lot of meds. At the moment, for psych, I'm taking Abilify 5mg, which I intent to taper off of, Cymbalta 120mg, Valium 5mg BID and Trazodone 150mg.

[nz11]

Neil i am so sorry the medical profession have done this to you. Well done on finding this site.

I have no doubt imo that your drug has been your problem, and your doctor has behaved negligently.

.

Can i invite you to go to your local library and get a couple of books out.

'Your drug may be your problem' by Peter Breggin

'Psychiatric drug withdrawal'  by Peter Breggin

'Anatomy of an epidemic' by Robert Whittaker

 

You might like to put the drugs you are on in your signature. 

When/if  you do decide to taper please follow the recommended taper instructions on this site...i'd even go slower(5% say) given your long history of drugs. I could guarantee that in the past you were not given a chance by doctors tapering you  too fast and hence because of withdrawal its been one long medicated merry go round.

 

Thanks for the thumbs up for my avatar ...i like it too, pretty well sums up what i am seeing or dont wont to see every day...regarding horror stories i read about, all scripted by doctors.

 

Here are some threads that may be useful in time.

 

Why taper by 10% of my dosage?
The general philosophy of gradual tapering

The slowness of slow tapers
Some people can tolerate tapering only by very small amounts over a long time.

Why taper? Paper demonstrates importance of gradual change in plasma concentration
Discussion of a scientific journal article here http://survivinganti...mography-study/
If your doctor is a scientific type, print the journal article out and give it to him or her.

 

Tips for tapering off Abilify (aripiprazole)

 

Tips for tapering off Cymbalta (duloxetine)

 

Tips for tapering off trazodone (Desyrel)

 

oh heres onemore

Dr. Joseph Glenmullen's withdrawal symptom checklist

[neilstevenlubin]

Thanks for your kind words nz11, I really appreciate them. I just now found a new PDoc who I'll see next month and get all of this straightened out I hope. By the way with abilify having been the problem, and I've only been taking it for a month, is the recommendation on the site still the same slower process or does the short amount of time make any difference in your opinion?

 

I'll definately look into the books that you suggested. Can never have too much knowledge, right?

 

I'd love to put all the meds that I've taken in the past 30 years in my signature, but I've literally taken over 40 different antidepressants. I don't remember the dates, but have kept a list of them and don't think they'll all fit. But I'm willing to do it if you think it would be helpful.

 

You're welcome about the avatar comment. I really like it.

[nz11]

abilify (aripiprazole) is an antipsychotic. Don't know much about it but id say like all of these chemicals dependence is quickly established so after a months use yes you will need to taper. But yeah i agree that would be the one to get off first.

Perhaps a mod can advise on how to attack this. One would think that with short term use you may be able to taper off a little faster but that may not be a given.

 

I think the best thing to start with is to establish what drug and what dosages you have been/are taking. If you can tell us how you previously tapered that would be good eg the doctor cold turkeyed me and switched me to drug 'xyz' say .

You dont need to go back till when Noah got off the ark, perhaps the last 5 yrs would do in the sig. You could  do a post with prior usage if you wanted. imo

 

Please before taking any advice or drug, going forward, from a pdoc check in here for a second opinion....its always a wise move.

"found a new PDoc who I'll see next month and get all of this straightened out I hope." I wouldnt be holding my breath on that one ... new pdoc new diagnosis....they are dangerous legalised drug dealers in my opinion and as they say,  when all you have is a hammer everything and everyone soon looks like a nail!  

 

It may be worthwhile putting your current drugs in the interactions checker and posting results in your intro

Drug Interactions Checker at http://www.drugs.com...teractions.html.

 

Here is another useful link, on tapering mutiple drugs. Sorry if i'm doing 'link dumping' on you, it may be a bit overwhelming im sure.

http://survivingantidepressants.org/index.php?/topic/2207-taking-multiple-psych-drugs-which-drug-to-taper-first/

[oskcajga]

Hi everyone. My name is Neil and I'm 53 years old, have been fighting treatment resistant depression since I was a child up until today by taking all of the U.S. antidepressants and having many Ect treatments and hospitalizations for the past 30 years now. It has disabled so much that I finally stopped working in 2000 and started Social Security Disability and Medicare. At first I hated not working, but it turned out for the best. 

 

Since nothing has really worked, I've recently researched Vagus Nerve Stimulation, Deep Brain Stimulation and CES devices in hopes I'd find another route that would help me, even a little. the first two choices, while they may have worked, are out of my reach financially since insurance companies and Medicare won't pay for them. This saddened me greatly for several days until I researched the CES devices and came across an FDA approved unit called Alpha-Stim AID. There is one other such FDA approved device, the others are not so I wouldn't even waste my money even though they are relatively inexpensive.

 

It's taken me several weeks to find a licensed healthcare professional to prescribe it to me. My LCSW therapist was happy to after reading the literature that I gave her and talking to some psychiatrist and other therapists that she knows. I'm very grateful to her for this chance, whether it works or not.

 

This unit has 30 years of studies behind it as well as some amazing and not so amazing results that I've read and watched videos of it's usage. I placed an order for the device this past wednesday and will receive it tomorrow.

 

So, wish me luck and it's nice to introduce myself to this group. You all seem so caring and nice.

 

Bye for now.

 

I'm pretty sure that the CEP device is a total scam.  Just because there's 30 years of "literature" on the subject doesn't mean it's not a scam. Take SSRI's for instance, there's literally thousands of articles on them in the literature, and yet they are not really more effective than a placebo pill and, for all intents and purposes, a scam.  

 

In my opinion, diet, exercise, and low stress and relaxation are probably a more effective way to accelerate brain healing and health than spending your hard earned cash than on a CEP machine.

 

I'm really sorry to hear about all your psychiatric experiences.  It saddens me to hear about all the medication that you have taken and all the ECT treatments that you have endured. 

[cymbaltawithdrawal5600]

That is a kind of harsh statement about the device being a scam, I'd call it more of a "money printing" device.

 

Been doing a bit of research on these devices and their FDA status. They are not approved, not any of them. They are only 'cleared'. I'll refer you to the fda.gov site for the fine point description of what that means. FWIW, the drugs you are on, Neil, are all FDA approved but we here know that that approval appears to have been 'bought' by fraud and deception. A quite meaningless term, actually.

 

I decided to research the Alpha Stim first and the odd thing I noted on their site is that all of their 'research' (the 'studies' they have used to back up their claims of its efficacy for helping 'insomnia, depression and anxiety' (the AID), are all self reported.

 

Right there on their homepage is this statement:

 

 

*Patient self-reports after using Alpha-Stim technology for at least 3 weeks.

 

 

Directly below that is a link to the main study, conducted by a "Professor of Psychometrics and Statistics", not a lab rat or an MD or anything.

 

Patient self reports are NOT SCIENCE.

 

I got to thinking about the device itself and did a little searching on Alibaba (you ought to go there sometime and see where all of the cheap asian electronic crap we buy is offered for import and sale). It is right on their (Alpha Stim) site that the device is made in china. Look for a device called "happy sleep" and you will see that it is half the cost of the stim device and looks suspiciously like the same thing (the ear clips, the pads, the inscrutable icons on the face of it).

 

Also check out a site called 'ces4me'. Probably the very same device but closer to the asian import price. (I'll bet they got a better deal with an asian manufacturer and will be printing money at a faster rate, maybe).

 

I am not wanting to rain on anyone's parade but we can be so gullible when it comes to 'need' and 'want'. I am a little bleary eyed from so much reading but I hope to add something to the topic in symptoms about a 2014 study just completed that had a few words in it on how these devices 'might' work. It is a real stretch at best. The Alpha Stim site has a fancy graphic containing a lot of fancy words such as 'raphe nuclei', 5HT, serotonin: all the buzzwords the pharma rats bamboozled our docs (and us) with to get us to take their crappy drugs.

 

The terrible thing is, the drugs DO work, after a fashion. But what they do (and how they do it) is dangerous and criminal. And destroys a lot of perfectly good people in the process.

 

Neil, put your drugs into the drugs interaction checker at drugs.com and see what your docs have been doing to you. Your drug combination is dangerous. You will need to very carefully taper off ALL those drugs and it will take years and you might then find yourself to be an entirely different person. A person who probably did not need all those drugs to begin with. Most of them actually can cause depression.

 

For the record, just list the ones you are on now in your signature and mention how long you've been on the drug carousel and include the ECT too. Just a short blurb will do. You are among friends here, and don't be surprised at the comments you'll get on your thread. I (and some others) are in the 'anger' phase at how badly we were misled by all the pharma hype and we've been through the hard horrible wringer of withdrawal and are still recovering. To see you wanting to embrace an expensive (and probably ineffective) device so eagerly makes me want to cry.

 

Don't you dare stop taking any of those drugs suddenly, read the links you were given about how to reduce them safely. You'll be glad you did. You won't want to cold turkey off 120 mg cymbalta like I did, I am lucky I did not die. That was in the beginning, the real withdrawal did not hit until a year later. That is a hell I'd like to reserve for the people who invented and marketed this crap and keep pushing it on an unsuspecting public.

 

You found SA because you saw a link to the CES device. Please stay and get educated on the REST of the story.

 

(PS. I am not mean, I always talk this way. And I purposely left out links to stuff. Learning how to use google is a good thing.)

[Skyler]

That is a kind of harsh statement about the device being a scam, I'd call it more of a "money printing" device.

 

Been doing a bit of research on these devices and their FDA status. They are not approved, not any of them. They are only 'cleared'. I'll refer you to the fda.gov site for the fine point description of what that means. FWIW, the drugs you are on, Neil, are all FDA approved but we here know that that approval appears to have been 'bought' by fraud and deception. A quite meaningless term, actually.

 

Don't you dare stop taking any of those drugs suddenly, read the links you were given about how to reduce them safely. You'll be glad you did. You won't want to cold turkey off 120 mg cymbalta like I did, I am lucky I did not die. That was in the beginning, the real withdrawal did not hit until a year later. That is a hell I'd like to reserve for the people who invented and marketed this crap and keep pushing it on an unsuspecting public.

 

You found SA because you saw a link to the CES device. Please stay and get educated on the REST of the story.

 

(PS. I am not mean, I always talk this way. And I purposely left out links to stuff. Learning how to use google is a good thing.)

 

CW.. terrific job.  I tried what was either an Alpha Stim, or an Alpha Stim 'look and act alike' for chronic pain over 10 years ago.  Mercifully I was able to recoup the money as it came with a 2 or 3 month money back guarantee.  It had ear clips, pads and inscrutable icons.  The electrical stimulation made me feel light headed, which was actually pleasant.. sort of a giddy escape feeling that wafted me away because I could not concentrate on anything else... but other than that short lived sensation, which only lasted as long as the machine was on, there was no effect.  I don't see this as any different in efficacy from the magnet fad we had 20 years ago... vague electrical pulses were supposed to cure. 

 

Folks.. please save your money, at best you will chase down blind alleys which will only frustrate you more.  At worst, you may jump off medication and needlessly put yourself into withdrawal.  In these two regards, the machines are not harmless.

[oskcajga]

That is a kind of harsh statement about the device being a scam, I'd call it more of a "money printing" device.

 

Been doing a bit of research on these devices and their FDA status. They are not approved, not any of them. They are only 'cleared'. I'll refer you to the fda.gov site for the fine point description of what that means. FWIW, the drugs you are on, Neil, are all FDA approved but we here know that that approval appears to have been 'bought' by fraud and deception. A quite meaningless term, actually.

 

I decided to research the Alpha Stim first and the odd thing I noted on their site is that all of their 'research' (the 'studies' they have used to back up their claims of its efficacy for helping 'insomnia, depression and anxiety' (the AID), are all self reported.

 

Right there on their homepage is this statement:

 

 

*Patient self-reports after using Alpha-Stim technology for at least 3 weeks.

 

 

Directly below that is a link to the main study, conducted by a "Professor of Psychometrics and Statistics", not a lab rat or an MD or anything.

 

Patient self reports are NOT SCIENCE.

 

I got to thinking about the device itself and did a little searching on Alibaba (you ought to go there sometime and see where all of the cheap asian electronic crap we buy is offered for import and sale). It is right on their (Alpha Stim) site that the device is made in china. Look for a device called "happy sleep" and you will see that it is half the cost of the stim device and looks suspiciously like the same thing (the ear clips, the pads, the inscrutable icons on the face of it).

 

Also check out a site called 'ces4me'. Probably the very same device but closer to the asian import price. (I'll bet they got a better deal with an asian manufacturer and will be printing money at a faster rate, maybe).

 

I am not wanting to rain on anyone's parade but we can be so gullible when it comes to 'need' and 'want'. I am a little bleary eyed from so much reading but I hope to add something to the topic in symptoms about a 2014 study just completed that had a few words in it on how these devices 'might' work. It is a real stretch at best. The Alpha Stim site has a fancy graphic containing a lot of fancy words such as 'raphe nuclei', 5HT, serotonin: all the buzzwords the pharma rats bamboozled our docs (and us) with to get us to take their crappy drugs.

 

The terrible thing is, the drugs DO work, after a fashion. But what they do (and how they do it) is dangerous and criminal. And destroys a lot of perfectly good people in the process.

 

Neil, put your drugs into the drugs interaction checker at drugs.com and see what your docs have been doing to you. Your drug combination is dangerous. You will need to very carefully taper off ALL those drugs and it will take years and you might then find yourself to be an entirely different person. A person who probably did not need all those drugs to begin with. Most of them actually can cause depression.

 

For the record, just list the ones you are on now in your signature and mention how long you've been on the drug carousel and include the ECT too. Just a short blurb will do. You are among friends here, and don't be surprised at the comments you'll get on your thread. I (and some others) are in the 'anger' phase at how badly we were misled by all the pharma hype and we've been through the hard horrible wringer of withdrawal and are still recovering. To see you wanting to embrace an expensive (and probably ineffective) device so eagerly makes me want to cry.

 

Don't you dare stop taking any of those drugs suddenly, read the links you were given about how to reduce them safely. You'll be glad you did. You won't want to cold turkey off 120 mg cymbalta like I did, I am lucky I did not die. That was in the beginning, the real withdrawal did not hit until a year later. That is a hell I'd like to reserve for the people who invented and marketed this crap and keep pushing it on an unsuspecting public.

 

You found SA because you saw a link to the CES device. Please stay and get educated on the REST of the story.

 

(PS. I am not mean, I always talk this way. And I purposely left out links to stuff. Learning how to use google is a good thing.)

 

That was sort of exactly what I would have liked to say, but I'm not intellectually capable of it in my current state.  Thanks for an awesome post, Cymbaltawithdrawal.

[neilstevenlubin]

z11, I really appreciate the humor with the Noah comment. I updated the signature. Hopefully it'll do. As I stated in it, NO PDoc or me has ever suggested that I taper off anything. I learned about that here. I must have been very lucky because whenever I was moved to a new med it was always cold-turkey and I NEVER has any withdrawal issues/symptoms. Believe me, I would know especially after having the Abilify making me so sick last week.

 

I really understand what you're saying about new PDocs only wanting to re diagnose. Again I must have been very lucky because, except in the beginning when the first PDoc diagnosed me he thought I may have been bi-polar, which I was not. Turned out to be Major Depressive Illness and Generalized Anxiety Disorder. Every PDoc and hospital PDoc afterwards never thought I had the wrong diagnosis and treated me accordingly. Also the fact that I was a pharmacy tech, thus having an interest in meds and medicine in general, has taught me to never NOT question a PDoc if I feel the need. Most of them weren't happy with that as I'm sure you know.

 

Well, like minds and all that, I have the Drug.com Drug Interactions Checker app on my phone and have already checked it. I'm aware of all the issues because of it, including my diabetes, cholesterol and high-blood pressure meds. I simply don't have a solution for those problems right now. I just want you to know that I really appreciate your questions, comments and information. Please don't stop, OK?

 

For those of you, not you z11, who think FDA Certified CES Medical Devices are a scam, yes I said Certified not approved this time since I was incorrect, Through my contacting the FDA I was told that devices are certified and that meds are approved. That's how the system works. When I researched these things I really did. 

 

cymbaltawithdrawal5600, That main study that you linked to wasn't there main study.  The majority of the studies that I have seen and read were the standard double-blind studies, not patient self reports. Now there have been over 130 such studies done on the Alpha-Stim AID, so in my opinion, it's no-where near a scam. Enough said about that. If anyone wants to follow my hopefully daily postings about using the device, here is the link to that section of the forum: http://survivingantidepressants.org/index.php?/topic/4829-alpha-stim-fisher-wallace-sota-biotuner-pons-and-similar-devices/

[cymbaltawithdrawal5600]

Although I am within the time period to edit my post I decided to add this and I see that Neil has also added one. Here is a website that describes all of the documents having to do with the FDA's new ruling on these devices. The language on the FDA site and in the recent study I read all say 'approved' or 'cleared' or 'PMA required' and yada yada and I see that this has done little to dissuade the OP in choosing this therapy. So be it, hope it works and does not make things worse (some people have reported undesirable side effects).

 

The problem I have with the discussion of people here using these devices is that it is not clear WHAT exactly is happening: is the device causing some sort of beneficial change or not in a person that is under the influence of such high doses of psychoactive drugs and especially those with dangerous interactions?

 

And if the person is drug free, but still undergoing the effects of withdrawal. what is really happening: is it a bad effect from the device or the usual course of the 'windows and waves' pattern of recovery (which lasts an excruciatingly long time)? Self reported, unverifiable (and unduplicatable) results muddy the waters. OffEff alludes to such in his reporting (and he's a doc so he knows a bit of the line you should toe when doing 'experiments'. Results should be replicatable by anyone). I would take any reports (both good OR bad) with a grain of salt when coming from this select population of users here on SA. Waaaaay too many variables.

 

I still classify these devices in the 'wish' category: wish they worked and a cure was this easy but jaded enough to know there have undoubtedly been strings pulled and silver has been crossing hands somewhere along the line in the FDA pipeline to these devices being 'approved' (look up the warning letter the FDA served the Alpha Stim maker not too long ago, they got a little lazy on following the rules and they got caught. You have to do things right if you are going to do them at all.). I just wish I would have thought of it first (marketing such devices). I can (with some work) get myself an import license, line up a manufacturer to dress up a 'happy sleep' device in my own cool colors and logo, get someone to code me up a snazzy website and I am in business too. Undercut the ces4me people and laugh all the way to the bank

 

But I am too honest for that. The more I look at these things, the worse they smell. There is nothing new under the sun I am afraid.

 

Now to give Neil his thread back. He's sold on it and that is all that counts.

 

Edit: Ooops, here's the study. "Alterations in the 'default mode network'". Now we're getting somewhere.....

 

But medicinal manipulation of the DMN throws a monkey wrench into things. There's a lot of technical stuff in that study I have only a rudimentary understanding of but it sounds good to me. It is a good place to start in evaluating how these devices might work. They still don't really know. That's comforting, huh?

[oskcajga]

Although I am within the time period to edit my post I decided to add this and I see that Neil has also added one. Here is a website that describes all of the documents having to do with the FDA's new ruling on these devices. The language on the FDA site and in the recent study I read all say 'approved' or 'cleared' or 'PMA required' and yada yada and I see that this has done little to dissuade the OP in choosing this therapy. So be it, hope it works and does not make things worse (some people have reported undesirable side effects).

 

The problem I have with the discussion of people here using these devices is that it is not clear WHAT exactly is happening: is the device causing some sort of beneficial change or not in a person that is under the influence of such high doses of psychoactive drugs and especially those with dangerous interactions?

 

And if the person is drug free, but still undergoing the effects of withdrawal. what is really happening: is it a bad effect from the device or the usual course of the 'windows and waves' pattern of recovery (which lasts an excruciatingly long time)? Self reported, unverifiable (and unduplicatable) results muddy the waters. OffEff alludes to such in his reporting (and he's a doc so he knows a bit of the line you should toe when doing 'experiments'. Results should be replicatable by anyone). I would take any reports (both good OR bad) with a grain of salt when coming from this select population of users here on SA. Waaaaay too many variables.

 

I still classify these devices in the 'wish' category: wish they worked and a cure was this easy but jaded enough to know there have undoubtedly been strings pulled and silver has been crossing hands somewhere along the line in the FDA pipeline to these devices being 'approved' (look up the warning letter the FDA served the Alpha Stim maker not too long ago, they got a little lazy on following the rules and they got caught. You have to do things right if you are going to do them at all.). I just wish I would have thought of it first (marketing such devices). I can (with some work) get myself an import license, line up a manufacturer to dress up a 'happy sleep' device in my own cool colors and logo, get someone to code me up a snazzy website and I am in business too. Undercut the ces4me people and laugh all the way to the bank

 

But I am too honest for that. The more I look at these things, the worse they smell. There is nothing new under the sun I am afraid.

 

Now to give Neil his thread back. He's sold on it and that is all that counts.

 

I agree with Cymbaltawithdrawal.

[neilstevenlubin]

Hi cymbaltawithdrawal5600 and oskajga. I just wanted to let you know that I really do appreciate your comments. I'm not upset, I'm not like that. Just needed to say that we just disagree, that's all.

 

Take care. Bye for now.

[Altostrata]

neil, only the last few years of your drug history need be in your signature.

 

As you probably know by now, a lot of things are called "depression." With your long drug history and the passage of years, you can be assured that your brain and nervous system are not the way they were when you started psychiatric drug treatments.

 

It is possible, though you didn't feel acute withdrawal symptoms, that going on and off many drugs has left your nervous system somewhat stunned and unresponsive to further drug treatment.

 

"Treatment-resistant depression," by definition, is a lack of response to drugs. It does not describe an existential state. All it says is that the drugs don't work for you.

 

(At the moment, a psychiatrist is designing a study investigating the hypothesis that the drugs cause "treatment-resistant depression" which, if you think of it, has to be the inevitable conclusion, because "treatment-resistant depression" does not exist independent of psychiatric drugs. Outside of psychiatric drugs, it's called "major depression" and, prior to widespread use of drugs, was episodic, not continual.)

 

If when you go off a psychiatric drug, you feel a deadening of emotion or even profound despair, it's entirely possible that what you're experiencing is an adverse effect of the drugs. If you look around at the Intro topics, you'll see many people experiencing this as withdrawal syndrome.

 

It's very, very common that people with a history of many psychiatric drugs eventually find the drugs don't do much for them, or even make them worse, because the nervous system is so messed up that it's in defensive mode and is rejecting further intervention.

 

As this is a site for going off psychiatric drugs, you'll probably find that many people, having had terrible experiences with the drugs and psychiatrists, are somewhat negative on both. They tend to be quite critical about all psychiatric treatments.

 

You are welcome to participate, just keep in mind that you're not being criticized for being on drugs, people are venting from their own perspectives.

[neilstevenlubin]

Hi Altostrata.Thanks for all the great information. I've plenty to think about. I hope my current signature is ok since I don't have any dates. Any suggestions are welcome.

 

I understand that there is the occasional disagreement about issues and I'll try to be sensitive to them. I don't feel criticized, it's just that I'm new here and don't know the different personalities yet. But I'll try my best to be as understanding as I can.

 

Anyway, thanks again for all the great information. Take care and bye for now.

[nz11]

"NO PDoc has ever tapered me off a med .......... meds were cold-turkey."

 

Q.E.D.

 

Neil as i said before i am so sorry that doctors have done this to you ...even the drug companies say dont do this. Why? Because they and their chemicals have taken addiction to a whole new level.

 

I humbly and sincerely hope you stay with this site and consider all that has been said.

Why not allow this site to walk yo through safe and sane tapers and yes as CW said it will take years but the end result will be worth it.

[bluebalu86]

Does this mean that a depressed person who took psych meds will develop treatment-resistant depression and be depressed forever?

[neilstevenlubin]

nz11, I know that you are only trying to be caring and understanding and I sincerely appreciate it. I have no intention of leaving the site and of course I'm willing to consider everything. Not an issue for me. I'm too new to the idea of tapering off all my meds. As I learn more from the site, including CW, I'll be in a better position to make a decision about it. Right now I simply want to learn and comment where appropriate and let others here learn from trial of my CES device.

 

Thanks and bye for now.

[Altostrata]

No, bluebalu, you have misinterpreted my post.

[neilstevenlubin]

Day 1: I received my CES device today and had a 20 minute therapy with it. I know that it'll take weeks to months to see any results if I have any of course. I only felt a bit tired after the session, which I'm told is pretty good in that it may help my insomnia.

 

Take care and bye for now.

[neilstevenlubin]

I must apologize because I didn't fully read the pages about what this site is about. This is what I just found: "SurvivingAntidepressants.org provides volunteer peer support for antidepressant withdrawal, while tapering and after you've quit." I'm terribly sorry, because this isn't my situation. If the administrators or members feel that I should't be here, I'll understand. Please let me know because I don't want to post things that go against the site's philosophy.

 

Thanks

[Altostrata]

Post about CES if you wish, but be aware of the context of the site. Thank you.

[neilstevenlubin]

Well, thanks for the kindness that has been shown me here, but I don't feel that I'm in the right forum for me. Thanks for putting up with me. 

[Altostrata]

Please let us know how you're doing.

[neilstevenlubin]

Yeah, thanks altostrata. Bye everyone.