JensenWinchester Advice on tapering 10mg of paxil

[JensenWinchester]

Hi, I have been on about 10MG of paxil for around a year now for anxiety and mild depression and I want to get completely off it due to weight issues and elevated liver enzymes. I went to the doctor 2 days ago for advice on tapering and they suggested that I should just go "cold turkey" because I'm on such a "low" dose however I'm not sure if this is a good idea as I herd paxil has pretty crazy withdrawal symptoms. For Now I have broken the 10mg of paxil in half and been taking 5mg for the last 3 days (no withdrawals yet) and I plan to do continue to take the 5mg for another 4 days and then i'll take 2.5 mg for 7 days and then go off it completely. Is this a good idea? thanks

[brassmonkey]

Hi Jensen--  welcome to the group, I think you found us just in time.  You heard right Paxil can have some very bad WD symptoms is tapered off of in the wrong manner.  Your doctor appears to be pretty typical in that he hasn't any idea of how these drugs work.  A CT from 10 mgs can put you in serious WD for a really long time.  A big problem with gettig off of these drugs is that the symptoms can be delayed for several months before they hit you hard.  Many people report feeling great for several weeks after stopping or making a big drop, and then get blindsided with the symptoms.

 

The last 10mgs, or in your case where you are starting from, are the hardest, as they have the greatest effect on the CNS (central nervous system) and have to be handles very carefully and slowly.  I would suggest going back to your full dose, giving it several weeks to stabilize and then starting a slow 10% a month taper.  Here is some good reading on the subject;

 

Why taper by 10% of my dosage?

 

What is withdrawal syndrome? 

 

Tips for tapering off Paxil (paroxetine)

 

Thankfully your drug history isn't long or complicated (it's really to your advantage) but if you would please fill out a signature block it would really help us keep track of what is happening;

 

 

Please put your withdrawal history in your signature

 

[JensenWinchester]

Hi Jensen--  welcome to the group, I think you found us just in time.  You heard right Paxil can have some very bad WD symptoms is tapered off of in the wrong manner.  Your doctor appears to be pretty typical in that he hasn't any idea of how these drugs work.  A CT from 10 mgs can put you in serious WD for a really long time.  A big problem with gettig off of these drugs is that the symptoms can be delayed for several months before they hit you hard.  Many people report feeling great for several weeks after stopping or making a big drop, and then get blindsided with the symptoms.

 

The last 10mgs, or in your case where you are starting from, are the hardest, as they have the greatest effect on the CNS (central nervous system) and have to be handles very carefully and slowly.  I would suggest going back to your full dose, giving it several weeks to stabilize and then starting a slow 10% a month taper.  Here is some good reading on the subject;

 

Why taper by 10% of my dosage?

 

What is withdrawal syndrome? 

 

Tips for tapering off Paxil (paroxetine)

 

Thankfully your drug history isn't long or complicated (it's really to your advantage) but if you would please fill out a signature block it would really help us keep track of what is happening;

 

 

Please put your withdrawal history in your signature

 

 

Thanks for the response.I made a 2nd thread for updates.

[JensenWinchester]

Hey guys. I have been on 10mg of Paxil for abit over a year for Social anxiety & mild depression. 3 days ago I went completely cold turkey. 

 

On this thread will give daily updates on my withdrawal symptoms. 

 

 

9/11/2015 - Completely cold turkey from Paxil

 

10/11/2015 - No withdrawal symptoms yet however did have a "surge" of happiness a day after going cold turkey it lasted for a few hours. 

 

11/11/2015 - Day 2 - Been having some slight dizziness/lightheadness when I move my head and eyes to fast. Very Vivid nightmares (I can literally feel/smell/hear in my dreams and remember every detail when I wake up) Been having some slight nausea, however it go's away after a few hours. Ginger tea helps alot with the nausea. No anxiety or depression yet.

 

 

 

 

Supplements/Herbs I'm on -

 

Astaxanthin 12 mg - Most potent antioxidant it's 6000 times stronger then Vitamin C it also has the ability to cross the blood-brainer barrier, I really feel like this supplement is helping alot with my withdrawals

 

Vitamin D3 - 5000 IU - Low levels of vitamin D are associated with an increase in depression which is why I take this supplement. Ever since taking Vitamin D I feel alot better with my depression. 

 

Krill Oil 1000 MG - Omega 3 acids in Krill/Fish oil have proven to relieve depression in studies which is why I take this supplement daily

 

Green Tea  - Green tea has the ability to cross the blood brainer barrier and has a "calming effect".

 

Ginger Tea - Great for nausea caused from withdrawals. 

[DLB]

Oh boy, be prepared for a possible wild horrible ride. I was on 10 mg. And went through hell to get off but i was on it for 11 years. You might want to rethink. Ir you could be one of the "lucky" ones. It took me 2-3 months after fast tapers before I got hit with withdrawal.

[Austin]

Hey Jensen—

 

I went cold turkey off Effexor 225mg/day and felt the wooziness, shakiness and nausea almost immediately.  Been a week off and still having trouble sleeping, all kinds of mood swings, the lot.

 

I started taking a b12 complex, a multi vitamin and a 1200mg omega three on about day three of withdrawal and it's really helped with the wooziness.  Still get extreme dizzy spells, even while sitting or standing still, but less frequent.

 

Hang in there.

[nz11]

Did the doc advise a CT ?

Be aware that  the onset of crying spells and psychological distress is classic withdrawal symptoms.

I was the same as DLB i did this in 2003 it took about 3 months and then presented back to doc. to get answers sadly i was pushed back on.

I also did some very silly impulsive things in this time ...like sell the house. ahhhhh. What the heck was i not thinking!

Be on your guard for out of character reckless actions.

[ChessieCat]

Hi Jensen,

 

Welcome to SA.

 

This is a list of Withdrawal Symptoms that you might like to have available to assess your situation.

 

The idea of tapering is that you reduce your dose by a small amount to enable your brain to adjust to the new dose WITHOUT SUFFERING extreme withdrawal.

 

I don't know how much of the information you have read on this site so here is a list of helpful topics:

 

Why Taper?

Why Taper by 10%

Reinstatement

Tips for Tapering Paxil

 

I recently dropped my Pristiq from 100 mg to 50 mg and had trouble coping.  With the suggestions from members and information here, I reinstated (up to 75 mg) after 2 weeks and felt better within a few hours.

 

Any questions you have can be asked here on your Intro/Update topic.

 

Best wishes,

 

CC

[JensenWinchester]

Hey Jensen—

 

I went cold turkey off Effexor 225mg/day and felt the wooziness, shakiness and nausea almost immediately.  Been a week off and still having trouble sleeping, all kinds of mood swings, the lot.

 

I started taking a b12 complex, a multi vitamin and a 1200mg omega three on about day three of withdrawal and it's really helped with the wooziness.  Still get extreme dizzy spells, even while sitting or standing still, but less frequent.

 

Hang in there.

 

Thanks Austin and yeah, omega seems to be working really well. I'm also still experiencing dizzy spells when I move my eyes/head around. Get well soon

 

 

Did the doc advise a CT ?

Be aware that  the onset of crying spells and psychological distress is classic withdrawal symptoms.

I was the same as DLB i did this in 2003 it took about 3 months and then presented back to doc. to get answers sadly i was pushed back on.

I also did some very silly impulsive things in this time ...like sell the house. ahhhhh. What the heck was i not thinking!

Be on your guard for out of character reckless actions.

 

Yes doctor to me to quit CT because 10 mg if such a low dose according to them.

 

 

Hi Jensen,

 

Welcome to SA.

 

This is a list of Withdrawal Symptoms that you might like to have available to assess your situation.

 

The idea of tapering is that you reduce your dose by a small amount to enable your brain to adjust to the new dose WITHOUT SUFFERING extreme withdrawal.

 

I don't know how much of the information you have read on this site so here is a list of helpful topics:

 

Why Taper?

Why Taper by 10%

Reinstatement

Tips for Tapering Paxil

 

I recently dropped my Pristiq from 100 mg to 50 mg and had trouble coping.  With the suggestions from members and information here, I reinstated (up to 75 mg) after 2 weeks and felt better within a few hours.

 

Any questions you have can be asked here on your Intro/Update topic.

 

Best wishes,

 

CC

 

Thanks for the links If my withdrawals get unbearable I'll most likely go back on Paxil and taper my self off this time. Until then going to try and hang in there.  

[JensenWinchester]

12/11/2015 - Feeling mildly depressed however it's not to severe. Also still having frequent dizzy spells. Nausea seems to be gone for now. Will note any more symptoms if I get anymore today.  

[Altostrata]

Welcome, Jensen.

 

Please plan to stay at 5mg for a good while, a month or more, then consider a 10% per month taper. Paxil can be a very difficult drug to quit.

 

Dizziness is a very common withdrawal symptom.

 

You can use search in the Intro forum to see the experiences of others who tried to go off Paxil quickly.

 

I merged your new topic with this one. There's only one Intro topic per member, so you can keep your progress notes all in one place. Please put your updates in this, your Intro topic.

 

Daily updates are not necessary, only when there are important changes.

[ChessieCat]

Hi Jensen,

 

(Altostrata must have posted just as I was about to Post as I had an issue, but I've decided to post it anyway.)

 

Yes doctor to me to quit CT because 10 mg if such a low dose according to them.

 

Unfortunately, as I've discovered from this site and people's experiences with most of the medical fraternity, very few of them seem to understand the withdrawal syndrome of many of the medications they prescribe for depression/anxiety etc.  Some of the members who have tapered very slowly and carefully are now on extremely low doses of their medication and are having difficulty tapering by even a small % and their doctors think that the amount they are on is not worth taking because it is so low.

 

If you do decide to reinstate, I suggest you read and understand the Reinstate topic that I gave you the link to.  And ask questions on this thread if you have any.

 

(It's been 2 months since you went CT.  Edit:  Just realised your dates are Aussie dates, not US.)

 

This is an except from Reinstatement.  Underlining is mine:

 

What is known about reinstatement

from my reading and from patient experience as posted on online support sites:

• According to medical knowledge, reinstatement is the only way to alleviate withdrawal symptoms.
• Reinstatement is best done immediately upon appearance of withdrawal symptoms. The more time that passes, the less likely it is to work.
• The length of this window of opportunity varies according to the individual. Sometimes people can reinstate successfully months after quitting. Others cannot.
• Some find a partial dose will relieve withdrawal symptoms. If, for example, you were taking 20mg Paxil and quit rapidly only a few days ago, 5mg or 10mg may be enough. Others find they need a higher dose.
• Start low to see what you need. You can always increase if necessary. If you've been off the drug for a month or more, many people can find relief from antidepressant withdrawal symptoms by reinstating as little as 1mg-5mg.

I'm not trying to convince you reinstate, just present you with the information so you can make an informed decision.

 

CC

[JensenWinchester]

Welcome, Jensen.

 

Please plan to stay at 5mg for a good while, a month or more, then consider a 10% per month taper. Paxil can be a very difficult drug to quit.

 

Dizziness is a very common withdrawal symptom.

 

You can use search in the Intro forum to see the experiences of others who tried to go off Paxil quickly.

 

I merged your new topic with this one. There's only one Intro topic per member, so you can keep your progress notes all in one place. Please put your updates in this, your Intro topic.

 

Daily updates are not necessary, only when there are important changes.

 

Thank you for the info

 

Hi Jensen,

 

(Altostrata must have posted just as I was about to Post as I had an issue, but I've decided to post it anyway.)

 

Yes doctor to me to quit CT because 10 mg if such a low dose according to them.

 

Unfortunately, as I've discovered from this site and people's experiences with most of the medical fraternity, very few of them seem to understand the withdrawal syndrome of many of the medications they prescribe for depression/anxiety etc.  Some of the members who have tapered very slowly and carefully are now on extremely low doses of their medication and are having difficulty tapering by even a small % and their doctors think that the amount they are on is not worth taking because it is so low.

 

If you do decide to reinstate, I suggest you read and understand the Reinstate topic that I gave you the link to.  And ask questions on this thread if you have any.

 

(It's been 2 months since you went CT.  Edit:  Just realised your dates are Aussie dates, not US.)

 

This is an except from Reinstatement.  Underlining is mine:

 

What is known about reinstatement

from my reading and from patient experience as posted on online support sites:

• According to medical knowledge, reinstatement is the only way to alleviate withdrawal symptoms.
• Reinstatement is best done immediately upon appearance of withdrawal symptoms. The more time that passes, the less likely it is to work.
• The length of this window of opportunity varies according to the individual. Sometimes people can reinstate successfully months after quitting. Others cannot.
• Some find a partial dose will relieve withdrawal symptoms. If, for example, you were taking 20mg Paxil and quit rapidly only a few days ago, 5mg or 10mg may be enough. Others find they need a higher dose.
• Start low to see what you need. You can always increase if necessary. If you've been off the drug for a month or more, many people can find relief from antidepressant withdrawal symptoms by reinstating as little as 1mg-5mg.

I'm not trying to convince you reinstate, just present you with the information so you can make an informed decision.

 

CC

 

Yes, I think Im going to get a new doctor. The doctor who told me to quit cold turkey didnt even know what "Paxil" was when I told her I wanted to taper of it... She had to google it. I do feel kind of silly for going cold turkey but I was just following doctors orders anyway Ill try and survive the withdrawals but if they get bad Ill get back on paxil and taper of slowly thank you for the info reading the links now 

[ChessieCat]

Hi again Jensen,

 

I've just found a Topic that I thought might help if you are the "macho" kind wanting to tough it out (no offense meant just aware that men - and young men at that - can be a bit "bull-headed" at times!!!).  I only read the very first post but it just seemed so appropriate being from another male contributor (and posted in 2011):

 

six-mistakes-ive-made-in-withdrawal/

 

(BTW did you get my PM?)

 

CC

[nz11]

Yes doctor to me to quit CT because 10 mg if such a low dose according to them.

Wow, I just cant understand why on earth these people are doing this.

 

Yeah i was told the same 75mg of effexor is a small dose not being given a taoer schedule is a minor issue.

 

Just love those aussi dates ....they are talking our lingo!! Go dd/mm/yy

[JensenWinchester]

Hey guys its 13th of november here in Australia. Just had the most horrible vivid dream in my life. The dream started out of my having difficulties breathing, and I stopped breathing and I felt my heart stop in the dream like I was actually dying... Then after I went to the hospital in the dream and had "open heart surgery" while I was still awake in the dream. Absolutely horrible dream. I really hope they go away.   

[JanCarol]

Hey Jensen, it sounds like you're gonna do what you're gonna do, in spite of the wise advice here.

 

That is your choice.  And maybe, just maybe, you will be one of the lucky ones who walks away with no pain, no suffering.  But if you look around this site, it is chockers full of people who "wanted to get it over with" and "CT'd or fast tapered on my Doctors advice" and ran into grave trouble.  Everyone wants to believe that it won't happen to them.  

 

Are you sure you want to take those kinds of risks with your brain, your life?  The reason we recommend tapers is to put you in charge of your symptoms.  If you go into full blown paxil withdrawal, are you prepared to take a year or three off of work?  Eat a bland diet, no coffee, no alcohol? Lose motivation, sexual function, energy? Have headaches, insomnia, brain zaps, sensitivities to light and sound and smell?  Wear a sleep mask?  Avoid wheat and dairy?  Wrestle with emotional symptoms that make no sense at all - and yet relentlessly come after you?  I'm not trying to scare you, I'm just recounting some of the possible changes that  may have to take place if you go into full blown withdrawal.

 

Additionally, I'm confused.  You said you were on 5 mg.  Then on Nov 9, you announced a CT from Paxil.  Which is it?  Please include dates in your signature:  when you dropped to 5 mg, when you went CT - so that we can reference your symptoms from every post without re-reading everything.

 

It's your choices, your life.  We're here to support you - though - we are not in favor of CT of any sort (unless there are damaging side effects from a drug that stop upon discontinuation.)

 

And yes, the nightmares are a symptom, a warning.  How many symptoms are you going to accumulate before you reinstate?  Where do you draw the line? The longer you wait, the less likely a reinstatement will work.  Please, climb back up the cliff, and rappell down slowly, gradually.  Control your descent with an abseiling taper.  You are in free fall right now, and it might take as long as 6-8 months before you hit the bottom and realize that you have crashed, and try and repair the damage (Paxil is famous for delayed withdrawal reactions).  A taper is to prevent that damage.

 

Have you read any of the lovely links that Chessie sent?  especially the http://survivingantidepressants.org/index.php?/topic/919-six-mistakes-ive-made-in-withdrawal/  

 

Also, feel free to check in to: http://survivingantidepressants.org/index.php?/topic/6284-australia-members-please-check-in-here/ to see about SA Aussies here in Australia, and topical information for here.

 

Welcome to SA!

[direstraits]

please go back on now and taper the right way...you don't want to go thru the hell I've been in for 18 mos....what I'd give to do it over again if I had the chance...this is nothing to play around with...you're playing with fire! good luck. ds

[JensenWinchester]

Hey Jensen, it sounds like you're gonna do what you're gonna do, in spite of the wise advice here.

 

That is your choice.  And maybe, just maybe, you will be one of the lucky ones who walks away with no pain, no suffering.  But if you look around this site, it is chockers full of people who "wanted to get it over with" and "CT'd or fast tapered on my Doctors advice" and ran into grave trouble.  Everyone wants to believe that it won't happen to them.  

 

Are you sure you want to take those kinds of risks with your brain, your life?  The reason we recommend tapers is to put you in charge of your symptoms.  If you go into full blown paxil withdrawal, are you prepared to take a year or three off of work?  Eat a bland diet, no coffee, no alcohol? Lose motivation, sexual function, energy? Have headaches, insomnia, brain zaps, sensitivities to light and sound and smell?  Wear a sleep mask?  Avoid wheat and dairy?  Wrestle with emotional symptoms that make no sense at all - and yet relentlessly come after you?  I'm not trying to scare you, I'm just recounting some of the possible changes that  may have to take place if you go into full blown withdrawal.

 

Additionally, I'm confused.  You said you were on 5 mg.  Then on Nov 9, you announced a CT from Paxil.  Which is it?  Please include dates in your signature:  when you dropped to 5 mg, when you went CT - so that we can reference your symptoms from every post without re-reading everything.

 

It's your choices, your life.  We're here to support you - though - we are not in favor of CT of any sort (unless there are damaging side effects from a drug that stop upon discontinuation.)

 

And yes, the nightmares are a symptom, a warning.  How many symptoms are you going to accumulate before you reinstate?  Where do you draw the line? The longer you wait, the less likely a reinstatement will work.  Please, climb back up the cliff, and rappell down slowly, gradually.  Control your descent with an abseiling taper.  You are in free fall right now, and it might take as long as 6-8 months before you hit the bottom and realize that you have crashed, and try and repair the damage (Paxil is famous for delayed withdrawal reactions).  A taper is to prevent that damage.

 

Have you read any of the lovely links that Chessie sent?  especially the http://survivingantidepressants.org/index.php?/topic/919-six-mistakes-ive-made-in-withdrawal/  

 

Also, feel free to check in to: http://survivingantidepressants.org/index.php?/topic/6284-australia-members-please-check-in-here/ to see about SA Aussies here in Australia, and topical information for here.

 

Welcome to SA!

 

 

Hi Jan thanks for getting back to me.

 

And yes sorry Ill include the 5mg in my signature 

 

I was only on 5mg of paxil for 3 days before I went cold turkey at the 11th of this month. 

 

Honestly, I'm not feeling that bad. I do still get the occasional "head zaps" however they're certainly getting weaker and weaker everyday and my appetite is sort of down hill but I have no problem eating a big meal and keeping it down. I also had no crazy scary vivid nightmares last night and overall my vivid dreams are sort of fading away. Additionally I got 0% sexual dysfunction now which is great, I really didn't think I would recover so fast with the sexual problems but I did and I'm so happy about that!

 

I got no depression and anxiety either. In fact their's moments I'm actually very happy. I do get some what "emotional" more easily when I see something sad but It's good to feel strong emotions again. 

 

But as you just said the withdrawals could be delayed and this scares me a hell of alot. I really feel like I'm getting better each and everyday and it would suck if I get bad withdrawals months from now out of no where.

 

I just got no idea what to do... I'm not sure if I should go back on paxil or continue to recover. I just feel like I have recovered to much to go back on paxil and start over again  

 

Additionally I got my genes tested on the site '23andme" they basically tell you your genes for $100 through a saliva test. Interesting enough I have a gene called " rs2032583(T;T)" And the information on that gene states this -

 

" You're 7x less likely to respond to certain antidepressants. This version of a blood brain barrier protein blocks many common antidepressants from entering the brain, including: amitriptyline (Elavil), citalopram (Celexa), paroxetine (Paxil), and venlafaxine (Effexor). That makes those antidepressants 7 times less effective."

 

Additionally I also have 2 other genes that both make antidepressants 7x less like to respond... so combine them together I'm apparently 21x less effective on antidepressants due to my blood brainer barrier protein blocking most of them of the antidepressants reaching my brain. 

 

rs4148740(T;T)

 

 

rs7787082(G;G)

 

(feel free to click the genes in blue its a link it will take you to a site showing the information on the gene).

 

 

 

I'm no Genetic expert but maybe this is why I'm not having such crazy withdrawals at the moment? because my blood brain barrier is making paxil 21x  less effective? I'm not sure but I feel like this is true as Paxil never really helped me with social anxiety at all which is basically 1 of the reasons I went cold turkey on paxil in the first place, I feel like they aren't helping me as much. 

[nz11]

Wow that was a great post by Jancarol that is how it was for me for sure.

 

JW as for all that gene blah blah i dont know so much.

 

'7 times less likely to respond' ...gee how on earth do they figure this ..?

[JensenWinchester]

Wow that was a great post by Jancarol that is how it was for me for sure.

 

JW as for all that gene blah blah i dont know so much.

 

'7 times less likely to respond' ...gee how on earth do they figure this ..?

 

I got no idea. It's interesting though. I'm going to do more research on the genes to find out more. 

[JensenWinchester]

Hey guys it's the 16th here and my brain zaps are basically 95% gone. My vivid dreams are clearing. I still got some nausea but it's not that bad. I also had some pretty blurry vision today but it only last 2 hours. Other then that feel good. Sexual dysfunction symptoms are 100% gone.

 

I hope to see 99% better in another 7 days.

 

It;s day 7 since I went cold turkey from 10mg of paxil (1 year).

[JanCarol]

Hey JW - it's been over a month since you posted last.

 

I'm hoping that means that you've gone on with your life and forgotten about withdrawal symptoms - if this is so, please drop by and let us know!

 

I hope you see the sun today.