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faultandfracture: Greetings!


faultandfracture

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faultandfracture

Just wanted to say "Hello!"

 

Want to come off 10mg fluoxetine hcl.

Vaulted on to 20mg Lexapro in 2004.

Consistently on until 2009, roughly.

Stopped, cold turkey. <----naïve, didn't know any better. :(

Experienced irritability, dysphoria, and - you guessed it - depression.

Went off and on, on and off for a while.

Experimented with Wellbutrin and Zoloft.

On 10mg fluoxetine hcl for the last 2 years.

 

I believe my erratic medication behavior has compounded my

depression 10 fold, and has made it very hard to live without

AD's. Have gone 2 years without them before, and had to

return. It's that bad.

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  • Moderator Emeritus
SquirrellyGirl

Hello Faultandfracture!  Welcome to SA!

 

I assume you haven't actually started tapering.  Are you on your own or have you discussed it with your doctor?

 

Thank you for filling out your signature block!  I can see that you've already had experience with trying to get off psych drugs before, with the all too common withdrawal side effects landing you back on drugs.  You are among tons of company with that regard here at SA!

 

If your doctor is agreeable to you coming off of Prozac, you will likely find that he/she wants you to do it faster than it ought to be.  Also, they will likely work within the confines of the available dosages, so taking the smallest dose pill and telling you to take half, and then a quarter and then jumping off.  And they will tell you to do cuts every week or maybe every other week, which is way too fast!  

 

To explain why, it helps to check out these links:

 

http://survivingantidepressants.org/index.php?/topic/6036-why-taper-paper-demonstrates-importance-of-gradual-change-in-plasma-concentration/

 

http://survivingantidepressants.org/index.php?/topic/1024-why-taper-by-10-of-my-dosage/

 

http://survivingantidepressants.org/index.php?/topic/759-tips-for-tapering-off-prozac-fluoxetine/?hl=fluoxetine

 

In this article there is a pdf of a list of withdrawal symptoms you may encounter.

 

http://survivingantidepressants.org/index.php?/topic/2390-dr-joseph-glenmullens-withdrawal-symptom-checklist/

 

I'm sure a mod will be along shortly to add to what I have put up for you.

 

I'm glad you made it here!  It's a great community, very supportive, and lots of people with tons of experience with everything withdrawal-related.

 

SG

Started ADs back around 1995 after bad break-up, starting with Prozac.  Switched to Wellbutrin, and then to Effexor in 2002
Effexor XR 2002-2014 up to 225 mg at one point, down to 37.5 mg towards end but back up to 75 mg in 2014; now realize I had W/D as I dropped down, memory very poor about history.  Extreme emotions, poor concentration as I stepped back down, didn't connect the dots!
Summer 2014 reduced to 0 very quickly, was sick of anhedonia/sexual dysfunction due to meds, depression never controlled if not worse. Didn't recognize WD since symptoms built slowly (thought I had ADD! and menopausal on top of it), starting with severe sweats, very bad cog-fog and memory issues, culminating in weight loss, severe anxiety and depression, panic, severe apathy and insomnia by eight months off.  Saw p-doc who put me on Remeron, increased from 7.5 mg/day to 37.5 mg by May 22, 2015; still doing very badly though able to sleep.

June 1. 2015 Reinstated Effexor XR 37.5 mg, Remeron dropped to 30 mg PM. Immediate relief of symptoms, like nothing had ever happened!  Joined SA and began on advice of friend who recognized it was WD all along! Began tapering in July 2015.

Been tapering both meds ever since, focusing on one more than the other or doing no more than 5% of each per month.

12 mg Effexor and 5.8 mg Remeron (mirtazapine SolTabs to make a solution with OraPlus) as of 5/4/2017 

Update 3/14/18: 2.9 mg Remeron and 6 mg Effexor; 6/10/18:  2.6 mg Remeron and 4.9 mg Effexor

 

My intro: http://survivingantidepressants.org/index.php?/topic/9313-squirrellygirl-effexor-withdrawal-etc/page-2#entry196679

This is not medical advice. Discuss any decisions about your medical care with a knowledgeable medical practitioner.

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  • Moderator Emeritus

Hello Faultandfracture,

 

It's good you've turned up here before you start tapering (well, it sounds like you haven't started anyway).  Knowledge is power :).

 

SquirellyGirl gave you some useful links to read through.  When you've had a look you can come back to this thread to ask any questions you might have.  This can be your journal to record your tapering and healing progress. 

 

Have you been having any adverse reactions while on Fluoxetine?  In the links SG provided you'll see that we recommend tapering by 10% each 4-6 weeks.  The reason for this is to avoid destabilising your Central Nervous System as much as possible, and therefore have less w/d symptoms.  Now that you've been through a few tapering/cold-turkeys, your CNS will already be wary of further changes so it's even more important for you to go gently.

 

It takes time and it's not easy, but you can work your way through it.  There is a lot of support for people here, and heaps to read too. 

 

Thanks for filling out your signature.  It would also be useful if you could add in there how you came off those meds. 

 

Best wishes,

KarenB

2010  Fluoxetine 20mg.  2011  Escitalopram 20mg.  2013 Tapered badly and destabilised CNS.  Effexor 150mg. 

2015 Begin using info at SurvivingAntidepressants.  Cut 10% - bad w/d 2 months, held 1 month. 

Micro-tapering: four weekly 0.4% cuts, hold 4 weeks (struggling with symptoms).

8 month hold.

2017 Micro-tapering: four weekly 1% cuts, hold 4 weeks (symptoms almost non-existent).

2020 Still micro-tapering. Just over 2/3 of the way off effexor. Minimal symptoms, - and sleeping well.
Supplements: Fish oil, vitamin C, iron, oat-straw tea, nettle tea.

My story of healing:ContinuedHealing

***I am not a doctor; please do your own research and be able to take responsibility for decisions you make.*** 

           'The possibility of renewal exists so long as life exists.'  Dr Gabor Mate.

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faultandfracture

***I HAVE READ VARIOUS THREADS HERE REGARDING A MIXED SUSPENSION TAPER, JUST THOUGHT I'D ASK IN CASE ANYONE HAD SUGGESTIONS UNIQUE TO MY SITUATION. I APOLOGIZE TO THE SYSOPS OR ADMINISTRATORS IF YOU HAVE TO MERGE THIS THREAD ON ACCOUNT OF IT BEING REPETITIVE***

 

I realize Prozac has one of the longer half-lives and is said to be easier to taper from, but, with my history regarding these meds, the long term results are really what I'm concerned with.

 

I take 10mg in tablet form that is broken in half from a 20mg tab (was supposed to go up to 20mg, which I never did).

 

I've heard of people buying the little milligram scales that have a little cup in the center and crushing up the medication and reducing by (x) amount every (x) weeks or months.

 

Thinking of a 1mg reduction every month, so roughly 9-10 months until ending the taper.

 

A milligram scale would reduce the accuracy vs. precision dilemma, assuming it was highly calibrated and accurate up to and through the final dosing month.

 

The remaining powder could then be infused into 30-50mL of lukewarm water each time.

 

Vaulted on to 20mg Lexapro in 2004.

Consistently on until 2009, roughly.

Stopped, cold turkey. <----naïve, didn't know any better. :(

Experienced irritability, dysphoria, and - you guessed it - depression.

Went off and on, on and off for a while.

Experimented with Wellbutrin and Zoloft.

On 10mg fluoxetine hcl for the last 2 years.

 

I believe my erratic medication behavior has compounded my

depression 10 fold, and has made it very hard to live without

AD's. Have gone 2 years without them before, and had to

return. It's that bad.

Link to post
  • Moderator

Hi FnF-- welcome to the group.  I'm not a whiz at combining threads so I will just answer your questions here.  This thread is for your journal to record about your journey, it is also for asking questions about your personal situation.

 

SG has already given you a link for our thread on tapering fluoxetine, if you haven't read it already it's a good place to start.  She also gave you a link on why to taper at 10% of my current dose, it is very important that you read that one.

 

Using a digital scale is a very good way to measure your doses.  I've been using that method for my whole taper wit great success.  Here is some information on how to do it:

 

Using a digital scale to measure doses

 

Many people choose to make their own liquid:

 

How to make a liquid from tablets or capsules

 

Give those a read and then ask a bunch of questions.

20 years on Paxil starting at 20mg and working up to 40mg. Sept 2011 started 10% every 6 weeks taper (2.5% every week for 4 weeks then hold for 2 additional weeks), currently at 7.9mg. Oct 2011 CTed 15oz vodka a night, to only drinking 2 beers most nights, totally sober Feb 2013.

Since I wrote this I have continued to decrease my dose by 10% every 6 weeks (2.5% every week for 4 weeks and then hold for an additional 2 weeks). I added in an extra 6 week hold when I hit 10mg to let things settle out even more. When I hit 3mgpw it became hard to split the drop into 4 parts so I switched to dropping 1mgpw (pill weight) every week for 3 weeks and then holding for another 3 weeks.  The 3 + 3 schedule turned out to be too harsh so I cut back to dropping 1mgpw every 4 weeks which is working better.

Current dose 0.000mg 04-15-2017

 

"It's also important not to become angry, no matter how difficult life is, because you can loose all hope if you can't laugh at yourself and at life in general."  Stephen Hawking

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  • Moderator Emeritus
SquirrellyGirl

 

I've heard of people buying the little milligram scales that have a little cup in the center and crushing up the medication and reducing by (x) amount every (x) weeks or months.

 

Thinking of a 1mg reduction every month, so roughly 9-10 months until ending the taper.

 

A milligram scale would reduce the accuracy vs. precision dilemma, assuming it was highly calibrated and accurate up to and through the final dosing month.

 

The remaining powder could then be infused into 30-50mL of lukewarm water each time.

I like your style, faultandfracture!  You are a science-minded person like myself LOL!

 

I am using the very inexpensive miligram scale to weigh my venlafaxine beads.  Those are good to +/-3 mg, which, when getting down to it, is too big a margin of error, so going to a liquid, which can be diluted to any degree to get miniscule dosages, is the way I will have to go eventually.  

 

You really have to stay on top of those little Gemini scales.  I calibrate often, and use the 10  mg weight to check that it is still weighing true, in between weighing doses.  I have to tare often; It will drift,  otherwise.  Your 10 mg has fillers in it so 10 mg is of course the active ingredient. My mirtazapine tabs weigh 10 times the active ingredient dosage, so a 30 mg tablet actually weighs 300 mg.  Makes it easier to get fairly accurate.  I haven't gotten low enough on either med to figure out when the +/-3% is going to be a problem.

 

A side note:  I bought another scale that cost 5 times as much as the Gemini, thinking it would be more accurate....NOT!  I use the two side by side to double check, but otherwise it was a waste of money :-)

 

SG

Started ADs back around 1995 after bad break-up, starting with Prozac.  Switched to Wellbutrin, and then to Effexor in 2002
Effexor XR 2002-2014 up to 225 mg at one point, down to 37.5 mg towards end but back up to 75 mg in 2014; now realize I had W/D as I dropped down, memory very poor about history.  Extreme emotions, poor concentration as I stepped back down, didn't connect the dots!
Summer 2014 reduced to 0 very quickly, was sick of anhedonia/sexual dysfunction due to meds, depression never controlled if not worse. Didn't recognize WD since symptoms built slowly (thought I had ADD! and menopausal on top of it), starting with severe sweats, very bad cog-fog and memory issues, culminating in weight loss, severe anxiety and depression, panic, severe apathy and insomnia by eight months off.  Saw p-doc who put me on Remeron, increased from 7.5 mg/day to 37.5 mg by May 22, 2015; still doing very badly though able to sleep.

June 1. 2015 Reinstated Effexor XR 37.5 mg, Remeron dropped to 30 mg PM. Immediate relief of symptoms, like nothing had ever happened!  Joined SA and began on advice of friend who recognized it was WD all along! Began tapering in July 2015.

Been tapering both meds ever since, focusing on one more than the other or doing no more than 5% of each per month.

12 mg Effexor and 5.8 mg Remeron (mirtazapine SolTabs to make a solution with OraPlus) as of 5/4/2017 

Update 3/14/18: 2.9 mg Remeron and 6 mg Effexor; 6/10/18:  2.6 mg Remeron and 4.9 mg Effexor

 

My intro: http://survivingantidepressants.org/index.php?/topic/9313-squirrellygirl-effexor-withdrawal-etc/page-2#entry196679

This is not medical advice. Discuss any decisions about your medical care with a knowledgeable medical practitioner.

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faultandfracture

 

 

I've heard of people buying the little milligram scales that have a little cup in the center and crushing up the medication and reducing by (x) amount every (x) weeks or months.

 

Thinking of a 1mg reduction every month, so roughly 9-10 months until ending the taper.

 

A milligram scale would reduce the accuracy vs. precision dilemma, assuming it was highly calibrated and accurate up to and through the final dosing month.

 

The remaining powder could then be infused into 30-50mL of lukewarm water each time.

I like your style, faultandfracture!  You are a science-minded person like myself LOL!

 

I am using the very inexpensive miligram scale to weigh my venlafaxine beads.  Those are good to +/-3 mg, which, when getting down to it, is too big a margin of error, so going to a liquid, which can be diluted to any degree to get miniscule dosages, is the way I will have to go eventually.  

 

You really have to stay on top of those little Gemini scales.  I calibrate often, and use the 10  mg weight to check that it is still weighing true, in between weighing doses.  I have to tare often; It will drift,  otherwise.  Your 10 mg has fillers in it so 10 mg is of course the active ingredient. My mirtazapine tabs weigh 10 times the active ingredient dosage, so a 30 mg tablet actually weighs 300 mg.  Makes it easier to get fairly accurate.  I haven't gotten low enough on either med to figure out when the +/-3% is going to be a problem.

 

A side note:  I bought another scale that cost 5 times as much as the Gemini, thinking it would be more accurate....NOT!  I use the two side by side to double check, but otherwise it was a waste of money :-)

 

SG

 

 

Good call, SG. Forgot about the fillers in these meds.

 

You're right, so, whatever the approximate weight is of my 10mg tab would be proportionately relative to dose reductions.

 

The scale margin of error towards the end might prompt me to have to directly dissolve in a liquid preparation, but would be a good start and at least get me through most of it.

 

Thanks for the advice!!

Vaulted on to 20mg Lexapro in 2004.

Consistently on until 2009, roughly.

Stopped, cold turkey. <----naïve, didn't know any better. :(

Experienced irritability, dysphoria, and - you guessed it - depression.

Went off and on, on and off for a while.

Experimented with Wellbutrin and Zoloft.

On 10mg fluoxetine hcl for the last 2 years.

 

I believe my erratic medication behavior has compounded my

depression 10 fold, and has made it very hard to live without

AD's. Have gone 2 years without them before, and had to

return. It's that bad.

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  • 1 month later...
  • Administrator

Hello, FnF, you seem to really understand titration!

This is not medical advice. Discuss any decisions about your medical care with a knowledgeable medical practitioner.

"It has become appallingly obvious that our technology has surpassed our humanity." -- Albert Einstein

All postings © copyrighted.

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  • 2 weeks later...
faultandfracture

Even at only 10mg - and with its purportedly longer half-life - after missing a dose of Prozac the other day, I quickly descended into the abyss of severe depression and suicidal ideation. 

 

Thank God I never took a doc or pharmacist's recommendation on an 'every other day' taper plan.

 

Hence, the need for a gradual water titration.

 

Anyone experience the evils of this drug at such a low dose?

Vaulted on to 20mg Lexapro in 2004.

Consistently on until 2009, roughly.

Stopped, cold turkey. <----naïve, didn't know any better. :(

Experienced irritability, dysphoria, and - you guessed it - depression.

Went off and on, on and off for a while.

Experimented with Wellbutrin and Zoloft.

On 10mg fluoxetine hcl for the last 2 years.

 

I believe my erratic medication behavior has compounded my

depression 10 fold, and has made it very hard to live without

AD's. Have gone 2 years without them before, and had to

return. It's that bad.

Link to post
  • Moderator Emeritus

And thankfully you knew what it was and what was causing it!

NEW!!!     INTERVIEW with Altostrata, SA's founder    NEW!!! 

 

Plodding along inch by inch:  12" = 1',  3' =  36 " or 1 yard,  1760 yards  = 63,360" or 1 mile

Current from 27 Mar 2021:  Pristiq 0.295 mg

ADs since ~1992:  25+ years - 1 unknown, Prozac (muscle weakness), Zoloft; citalopram (pooped out) CTed (very sick for 2.5 wks a few months after); Pristiq:  50mg 2012, 100mg beg 2013 (Serotonin Toxicity)  Tapering Oct 2015 

My tapering program   My Intro (goes to my tapering graph)  My website

PLEASE NOTE:  I am not a medical professional.  I provide information and make suggestions.

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faultandfracture

And thankfully you knew what it was and what was causing it!

 

Very true, Chessie. Thanks for the reply.

Vaulted on to 20mg Lexapro in 2004.

Consistently on until 2009, roughly.

Stopped, cold turkey. <----naïve, didn't know any better. :(

Experienced irritability, dysphoria, and - you guessed it - depression.

Went off and on, on and off for a while.

Experimented with Wellbutrin and Zoloft.

On 10mg fluoxetine hcl for the last 2 years.

 

I believe my erratic medication behavior has compounded my

depression 10 fold, and has made it very hard to live without

AD's. Have gone 2 years without them before, and had to

return. It's that bad.

Link to post
  • 2 weeks later...
  • Moderator Emeritus

How are you travelling FandF ?

 

The concept of occupancy rates helps us to understand why a missed dose at low levels has a significant impact.

See discussion here  http://survivingantidepressants.org/index.php?/topic/6036-why-taper-paper-demonstrates-importance-of-gradual-change-in-plasma-concentration/

1987-1997 pertofran , prothiaden , Prozac 1997-2002 Zoloft 2002-2004 effexor 2004-2010 Lexapro 40mg

2010-2012Cymbalta 120mg

Sept. 2012 -decreased 90mg in 6months. Care taken over by Dr Lucire in March 2013 , decreased last 30mg at 2mg per week over 3 months. July 21 , 2013- last dose of Cymbalta

Protracted withdrawal syndrome kicked in badly Jan.2014 Unrelenting akathisia until May 2014. Voluntary hosp. admission. Cocktail of Seroquel, Ativan and mirtazapine and I was well enough to go home after 14 days. Stopped all hosp. meds in next few months.

July 2014 felt v.depressed - couldn't stop crying. Started pristiq 50mg. Felt improvement within days and continued to improve, so stayed on 50mg for 8 months.

Began taper 28 Feb. 2015. Pristiq 50mg down to 45mg. Had one month of w/d symptoms. Started CES therapy in March. No w/d symptoms down to 30mg.

October 2015 , taking 25mg Pristiq. Capsules compounded with slow-release additive.

March 2016 , 21mg

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faultandfracture

How are you travelling FandF ?

 

The concept of occupancy rates helps us to understand why a missed dose at low levels has a significant impact.

See discussion here  http://survivingantidepressants.org/index.php?/topic/6036-why-taper-paper-demonstrates-importance-of-gradual-change-in-plasma-concentration/

Thanks for the links, Fresh.

 

I'm glad to see data in graphed form. It helps to simplify the often abstruse, expository nature of quantitative research to the layperson.

 

I will undoubtedly need some time to further investigate this concept and fully grasp, but I believe I get the gist.

 

Lower doses indeed require the utmost care when tapering.

Vaulted on to 20mg Lexapro in 2004.

Consistently on until 2009, roughly.

Stopped, cold turkey. <----naïve, didn't know any better. :(

Experienced irritability, dysphoria, and - you guessed it - depression.

Went off and on, on and off for a while.

Experimented with Wellbutrin and Zoloft.

On 10mg fluoxetine hcl for the last 2 years.

 

I believe my erratic medication behavior has compounded my

depression 10 fold, and has made it very hard to live without

AD's. Have gone 2 years without them before, and had to

return. It's that bad.

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