compsports Posted April 12, 2016 Share Posted April 12, 2016 Hi Compsports Yeah i learnt ghee is a kind of butter. Have you priced that collagen stuff gee that is perhaps one of the most expensive supplement i have seen....its like gold dust. I thought the same about using peanut butter too. Dont sure i can bring myself to putting 'butter' in my smoothie ...is that healthy?? It sure sounds like a glassful of fat! Doesnt that defeat the purpose....hmmm. Hi NZ11, This link might answer your question about saturated fats: http://eatingacademy.com/nutrition/how-did-we-come-to-believe-saturated-fat-and-cholesterol-are-bad-for-us No, I didn't price the ghee but I don't doubt what you are saying about it being expensive. Drug cocktail 1995 - 2010 Started taper of Adderall, Wellbutrin XL, Remeron, and Doxepin in 2006 Finished taper on June 10, 2010 Temazepam on a PRN basis approximately twice a month - 2014 to 2016 Beginning in 2017 - Consumption increased to about two times per week April 2017 - Increased to taking it full time for insomnia Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
simack Posted April 13, 2016 Share Posted April 13, 2016 "I’ll be honest: some people who currently are taking antidepressants won’t be able to safely taper and may have to continue using the drugs indefinitely or until medicine has better solutions" I could have done with this info a year ago... MEDS HISTORY 2004 hospitalized for acute alcohol induced psychosis and started on my psych drug merry-go-round.2004-2006 SSRI > SNRI Merry-go-round finally settled on Effexor. Also was started on Risperdal in 2004 but switched to seroquell after I had a bad reaction to it.2008. Was switched from Effexor to pristiq, Also managed to successfully Quit Seroquel Cold Turkey.Asenapine- 5mg- August 2014 ~ May 2015. Was put on for Social Anxiety, was great at first then started developing disabling side effects, did a rapid taper and so started my withdrawal nightmare... MEDS CURRENT Pristiq-100mg ~ Currently holding Olanzapine- 3.75mg May 2015 ~ Currently tapering by -.06mg per week (Jan 2016, 3.5mg ~Feb 2016 intractable insomnia updose to 3.75mg) Quetiapine- 50mg June 2015 ~Dec 25 2015 Quit cold turkey. ~(Feb 6 2016 hit with intractable insomnia - reinstated 50mg.) August 2016 : Became destabilised after messing around with cutting doses, trying THC oil etc eventually stabilised, Held doses for 5 years. January 2022: Hit poop out, struggling to get more than 3 hours sleep, been one week straight of pure hell, praying to hold on. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nz11 Posted April 13, 2016 Share Posted April 13, 2016 Compsports i havent priced the ghee...haven't found any yet, but i nearly fell over when i was given a price for the collagen hydrosylate ..which they didnt have any off. Simack don't let that statement scare you ...we don't know those peoples situations ....we don't know their previous taper history or anything. I think that Kelly shouldnt say unqualified things like that in the public arena because it is not helpful. imo Secondly she starts people off on a 25% (?) decrease...well that could be triggering trouble for some anyway imo. Thought for the day: Lets stand up, and let’s speak out , together. G Olsen We have until the 14th. Feb 2018. URGENT REQUEST Please consider submitting for the petition on Prescribed Drug Dependence and Withdrawal currently awaiting its third consideration at the Scottish Parliament. You don't even have to be from Scotland. By clicking on the link below you can read some of the previous submissions but be warned many of them are quite harrowing. http://www.parliament.scot/GettingInvolved/Petitions/PE01651 Please tell them about your problems taking and withdrawing from antidepressants and/or benzos. Send by email to petitions@parliament.scot and quote PE01651 in the subject heading. Keep to a maximum of 3 sides of A4 and you can't name for legal reasons any doctor you have consulted. Tell them if you wish to remain anonymous. We need the numbers to help convince the committee members we are not isolated cases. You have until mid February. Thank you Recovering paxil addict None of the published articles shed light on what ssri's ... actually do or what their hazards might be. Healy 2013. This is so true, with anything you get on these drugs, dependance, tapering, withdrawal symptoms, side effects, just silent. And if there is something mentioned then their is a serious disconnect between what is said and reality! "Every time I read of a multi-person shooting, I always presume that person had just started a SSRI or had just stopped." Dr Mosher. Me too! Over two decades later, the number of antidepressant prescriptions a year is slightly more than the number of people in the Western world. Most (nine out of 10) prescriptions are for patients who faced difficulties on stopping, equating to about a tenth of the population. These patients are often advised to continue treatment because their difficulties indicate they need ongoing treatment, just as a person with diabetes needs insulin. Healy 2015 I believe the ssri era will soon stand as one of the most shameful in the history of medicine. Healy 2015 Let people help people ... in a natural, kind, non-addictive (and non-big pharma) way. J Broadley 2017 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nz11 Posted April 15, 2016 Share Posted April 15, 2016 I mightn't be able to go the legal route, but I am doing what I can. Good news. I've had an email reply and he said he has been reading Brogan's book. They will be revamping their Withdrawal Resources soon and he has passed my suggestion on to the person responsible for Helpful Websites. wow that was some email you must have wroted cc.....thunderbirds are go! great job. http://www.madinamerica.com/resources/ cc do you think you could write my next complaint letter for me? Thought for the day: Lets stand up, and let’s speak out , together. G Olsen We have until the 14th. Feb 2018. URGENT REQUEST Please consider submitting for the petition on Prescribed Drug Dependence and Withdrawal currently awaiting its third consideration at the Scottish Parliament. You don't even have to be from Scotland. By clicking on the link below you can read some of the previous submissions but be warned many of them are quite harrowing. http://www.parliament.scot/GettingInvolved/Petitions/PE01651 Please tell them about your problems taking and withdrawing from antidepressants and/or benzos. Send by email to petitions@parliament.scot and quote PE01651 in the subject heading. Keep to a maximum of 3 sides of A4 and you can't name for legal reasons any doctor you have consulted. Tell them if you wish to remain anonymous. We need the numbers to help convince the committee members we are not isolated cases. You have until mid February. Thank you Recovering paxil addict None of the published articles shed light on what ssri's ... actually do or what their hazards might be. Healy 2013. This is so true, with anything you get on these drugs, dependance, tapering, withdrawal symptoms, side effects, just silent. And if there is something mentioned then their is a serious disconnect between what is said and reality! "Every time I read of a multi-person shooting, I always presume that person had just started a SSRI or had just stopped." Dr Mosher. Me too! Over two decades later, the number of antidepressant prescriptions a year is slightly more than the number of people in the Western world. Most (nine out of 10) prescriptions are for patients who faced difficulties on stopping, equating to about a tenth of the population. These patients are often advised to continue treatment because their difficulties indicate they need ongoing treatment, just as a person with diabetes needs insulin. Healy 2015 I believe the ssri era will soon stand as one of the most shameful in the history of medicine. Healy 2015 Let people help people ... in a natural, kind, non-addictive (and non-big pharma) way. J Broadley 2017 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
btdt Posted April 19, 2016 Share Posted April 19, 2016 Hi Compsports Yeah i learnt ghee is a kind of butter. Have you priced that collagen stuff gee that is perhaps one of the most expensive supplement i have seen....its like gold dust. I thought the same about using peanut butter too. Dont sure i can bring myself to putting 'butter' in my smoothie ...is that healthy?? It sure sounds like a glassful of fat! Doesnt that defeat the purpose....hmmm. Hi NZ11, This link might answer your question about saturated fats: http://eatingacademy.com/nutrition/how-did-we-come-to-believe-saturated-fat-and-cholesterol-are-bad-for-us No, I didn't price the ghee but I don't doubt what you are saying about it being expensive. You can make your own ghee grass fed will cost more I looked at two recipes one said use a double boiler to heat the butter then take the scum off the top and strain the rest thru a thin siv I can't spell siv... you know what I mean I hope... but made it before by heating the butting in a normal pan when the crap comes on top I skim it off and then poor the middle section into a dish leaving the other bits in the pan... that is my way. As for the supplement Great Lakes Gelatin | Collagen Joint Care for Consumers www.greatlakesgelatin.com/consumer/CollagenFAQ.php Collagen Hydrolysate... What is it? Hydrolyzed Collagen is unique in its amino acid structure because of its high amounts of glycine, lysine and proline, which ...Great Lakes Gelatin - Nutritional Labels - Nutritional Info It is pricey but may spare damage to joints would be worth it for me as mine hurt like he double hockey sticks. there is no way I could eat raw eggs not even to stop wd... not even for that... ugh... Fat is actually suppose to be good for the brain tho I did not look at the link the coconut oil would be good for you I have tried so many things one would think raw eggs would be a small price to pay but I know they would not stay down not for me. I have been ill and have a half hearted take on her book... ok for those who are not on the drugs yet but I do worry many will try her 30 day program and expect magic... who knows maybe they will find magic but I have some doubts. Anyone who has been on these drugs for years has to deal with a body that has changed and no 30 day regime is going to fix that... imo...not humble just jaded. I am hoping this first book is just that an attempt at helping and the start of something bigger... she opened the window a crack I am waiting for the book where she opens the window and climbs out on the ledge.... maybe it will come or maybe somebody new will build on her work. Time will tell. Great work on this topic WARNING THIS WILL BE LONG Had a car accident in 85 Codeine was the pain med when I was release from hosp continuous use till 89 Given PROZAC by a specialist to help with nerve pain in my leg 89-90 not sure which year Was not told a thing about it being a psych med thought it was a pain killer no info about psych side effects I went nuts had hallucinations. As I had a head injury and was diagnosed with a concussion in 85 I was sent to a head injury clinic in 1990 five years after the accident. I don't think they knew I had been on prozac I did not think it a big deal and never did finish the bottle of pills. I had tests of course lots of them. Was put into a pain clinic and given amitriptyline which stopped the withdrawal but had many side effects. But I could sleep something I had not done in a very long time the pain lessened. My mother got cancer in 94 they switched my meds to Zoloft to help deal with this pressure as I was her main care giver she died in 96. I stopped zoloft in 96 had withdrawal was put on paxil went nutty quit it ct put on resperidol quit it ct had withdrawal was put on Effexor... 2years later celexa was added 20mg then increased to 40mg huge personality change went wild. Did too fast taper off Celexa 05 as I felt unwell for a long time prior... quit Effexor 150mg ct 07 found ****** 8 months into withdrawal learned some things was banned from there in 08 have kept learning since. there is really not enough room here to put my history but I have a lot of opinions about a lot of things especially any of the drugs mentioned above. One thing I would like to add here is this tidbit ALL OPIATES INCREASE SEROTONIN it is not a huge jump to being in chronic pain to being put on an ssri/snri and opiates will affect your antidepressants and your thinking. As I do not update much I will put my quit date Nov. 17 2007 I quit Effexor cold turkey. http://survivingantidepressants.org/index.php?/topic/1096-introducing-myself-btdt/ There is a crack in everything ..That's how the light gets in Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bubbles Posted April 19, 2016 Share Posted April 19, 2016 Does she really have a 30 day program? Or just a fairly standard taper protocol? 2005 St John's Wort / 2006-2012 Lexapro 20mg, 2 failed attempts to stop, tapered over 4.5 months in early 2012 January 2013 started Sertraline, over time worked up to 100mg July 2014 Sertraline dropped from 100mg to 75mg, held for six months, slower tapering until 2019 22 Dec 3.2mg 2020 Sertraline 19 Jan 3.1mg, 26 Jan 3.0mg; 1 Mar 2.9, 7 Mar 2.8, May (some drops here) 24 May 2.5, May 29 2.4, June 21 2.3, June 28 2.2mg, July 4 2.1mg, July 24 (or maybe a bit before) 2mg, early Nov switched to home made suspension; 29 Nov 1.8mg; approx 25 Dec 1.6mg) 2021 Some time in about Jan/Feb realised probably on more like 1.8mg and poss mixing error in making suspension; doses after 10 Feb accurate; 10 Feb 1.6mg; 7 Mar 1.4, continued monthly 10% drops until 1mg, then dropped 0.1mg monthly. May 2022,0.1mg, now dropping 0.01mg per week 29 August 2022 - first day of zero! My thread here at SA: https://www.survivingantidepressants.org/topic/1775-bubbles/page/21/ Current: Armour Thyroid Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
btdt Posted April 19, 2016 Share Posted April 19, 2016 I can't answer that but it looks like Nz can... if anyone here ever communicates with her suggest she take a look at Grace E Jacksons work seems to me it would help her progress. WARNING THIS WILL BE LONG Had a car accident in 85 Codeine was the pain med when I was release from hosp continuous use till 89 Given PROZAC by a specialist to help with nerve pain in my leg 89-90 not sure which year Was not told a thing about it being a psych med thought it was a pain killer no info about psych side effects I went nuts had hallucinations. As I had a head injury and was diagnosed with a concussion in 85 I was sent to a head injury clinic in 1990 five years after the accident. I don't think they knew I had been on prozac I did not think it a big deal and never did finish the bottle of pills. I had tests of course lots of them. Was put into a pain clinic and given amitriptyline which stopped the withdrawal but had many side effects. But I could sleep something I had not done in a very long time the pain lessened. My mother got cancer in 94 they switched my meds to Zoloft to help deal with this pressure as I was her main care giver she died in 96. I stopped zoloft in 96 had withdrawal was put on paxil went nutty quit it ct put on resperidol quit it ct had withdrawal was put on Effexor... 2years later celexa was added 20mg then increased to 40mg huge personality change went wild. Did too fast taper off Celexa 05 as I felt unwell for a long time prior... quit Effexor 150mg ct 07 found ****** 8 months into withdrawal learned some things was banned from there in 08 have kept learning since. there is really not enough room here to put my history but I have a lot of opinions about a lot of things especially any of the drugs mentioned above. One thing I would like to add here is this tidbit ALL OPIATES INCREASE SEROTONIN it is not a huge jump to being in chronic pain to being put on an ssri/snri and opiates will affect your antidepressants and your thinking. As I do not update much I will put my quit date Nov. 17 2007 I quit Effexor cold turkey. http://survivingantidepressants.org/index.php?/topic/1096-introducing-myself-btdt/ There is a crack in everything ..That's how the light gets in Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nz11 Posted April 19, 2016 Share Posted April 19, 2016 KB provides a day-to-day menu plan for one week which is to serve as a model for planning your meals for the remaining three weeks. Recipes are provided at the back of the book. Her diet does not ask you to count calories, limit fat intake, or worry about portion sizes. She says drink nothing but pure, filtered water over the 30 days. Drinking half of your body weight in ounces of water daily. E.g if 150 pounds then drink at least 75 ounces of pure water per day I hate it when she does this ….later… [ok for those of us who are aren’t living in the stone age …this is approx. the same as multiply your weight in kg by 33.3 and drink that in mls each day. Eg 68 kg (150 pds) times 33.3 gives 2,264ml (2.3litres = 75.5ounces) We are to drink two glasses of filtered water before each meal with the balance throughout the day. This is interesting the local gym attendant told me exactly the same …drink two glasses of water before each meal… And he said if it doesn’t grow like that then don’t eat it. This is interesting she says emotional or compulsive overeating and eating processed foods, which are engineered to disrupt body wisdom so you eat more and more of the wrong food, are what interfere most with body wisdom. [i guess that means no more trying to get your money’s worth at the smorgasbord meals] btdt says 'Anyone who has been on these drugs for years has to deal with a body that has changed and no 30 day regime is going to fix that... imo...not humble just jaded. ' im with you on that one btdt. I think KB must surely know this too cos if she has to taper people at 0.001mg per month then the diet doesnt seem to be doing a great deal does it. Remember 0.001mg per month means a person on 1mg of drug will need 83 yrs to taper off!! (maybe its longer if no 30 day pre taper detox diet?) nz11 Must eat a 'wild' fish ....as apposed to a 'domesticated' one i guess. oh dear its 7pm and i still gotta drink 2000mls of water ....gulp!! Later..... Thought for the day: Lets stand up, and let’s speak out , together. G Olsen We have until the 14th. Feb 2018. URGENT REQUEST Please consider submitting for the petition on Prescribed Drug Dependence and Withdrawal currently awaiting its third consideration at the Scottish Parliament. You don't even have to be from Scotland. By clicking on the link below you can read some of the previous submissions but be warned many of them are quite harrowing. http://www.parliament.scot/GettingInvolved/Petitions/PE01651 Please tell them about your problems taking and withdrawing from antidepressants and/or benzos. Send by email to petitions@parliament.scot and quote PE01651 in the subject heading. Keep to a maximum of 3 sides of A4 and you can't name for legal reasons any doctor you have consulted. Tell them if you wish to remain anonymous. We need the numbers to help convince the committee members we are not isolated cases. You have until mid February. Thank you Recovering paxil addict None of the published articles shed light on what ssri's ... actually do or what their hazards might be. Healy 2013. This is so true, with anything you get on these drugs, dependance, tapering, withdrawal symptoms, side effects, just silent. And if there is something mentioned then their is a serious disconnect between what is said and reality! "Every time I read of a multi-person shooting, I always presume that person had just started a SSRI or had just stopped." Dr Mosher. Me too! Over two decades later, the number of antidepressant prescriptions a year is slightly more than the number of people in the Western world. Most (nine out of 10) prescriptions are for patients who faced difficulties on stopping, equating to about a tenth of the population. These patients are often advised to continue treatment because their difficulties indicate they need ongoing treatment, just as a person with diabetes needs insulin. Healy 2015 I believe the ssri era will soon stand as one of the most shameful in the history of medicine. Healy 2015 Let people help people ... in a natural, kind, non-addictive (and non-big pharma) way. J Broadley 2017 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bubbles Posted April 19, 2016 Share Posted April 19, 2016 Hmm, interesting. OK water - I thought that was a myth? Fish - wild caught vs farmed, I've heard that before as healthier (due to the fish having a better and more species-appropriate diet, like grass-fed vs grain-fed meat) 0.001mg per month!!! Could that have been a mis-speak? 2005 St John's Wort / 2006-2012 Lexapro 20mg, 2 failed attempts to stop, tapered over 4.5 months in early 2012 January 2013 started Sertraline, over time worked up to 100mg July 2014 Sertraline dropped from 100mg to 75mg, held for six months, slower tapering until 2019 22 Dec 3.2mg 2020 Sertraline 19 Jan 3.1mg, 26 Jan 3.0mg; 1 Mar 2.9, 7 Mar 2.8, May (some drops here) 24 May 2.5, May 29 2.4, June 21 2.3, June 28 2.2mg, July 4 2.1mg, July 24 (or maybe a bit before) 2mg, early Nov switched to home made suspension; 29 Nov 1.8mg; approx 25 Dec 1.6mg) 2021 Some time in about Jan/Feb realised probably on more like 1.8mg and poss mixing error in making suspension; doses after 10 Feb accurate; 10 Feb 1.6mg; 7 Mar 1.4, continued monthly 10% drops until 1mg, then dropped 0.1mg monthly. May 2022,0.1mg, now dropping 0.01mg per week 29 August 2022 - first day of zero! My thread here at SA: https://www.survivingantidepressants.org/topic/1775-bubbles/page/21/ Current: Armour Thyroid Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
compsports Posted April 19, 2016 Share Posted April 19, 2016 Hi Compsports Yeah i learnt ghee is a kind of butter. Have you priced that collagen stuff gee that is perhaps one of the most expensive supplement i have seen....its like gold dust. I thought the same about using peanut butter too. Dont sure i can bring myself to putting 'butter' in my smoothie ...is that healthy?? It sure sounds like a glassful of fat! Doesnt that defeat the purpose....hmmm. Hi NZ11, This link might answer your question about saturated fats: http://eatingacademy.com/nutrition/how-did-we-come-to-believe-saturated-fat-and-cholesterol-are-bad-for-us No, I didn't price the ghee but I don't doubt what you are saying about it being expensive. You can make your own ghee grass fed will cost more I looked at two recipes one said use a double boiler to heat the butter then take the scum off the top and strain the rest thru a thin siv I can't spell siv... you know what I mean I hope... but made it before by heating the butting in a normal pan when the crap comes on top I skim it off and then poor the middle section into a dish leaving the other bits in the pan... that is my way. As for the supplement Great Lakes Gelatin | Collagen Joint Care for Consumers www.greatlakesgelatin.com/consumer/CollagenFAQ.php Collagen Hydrolysate... What is it? Hydrolyzed Collagen is unique in its amino acid structure because of its high amounts of glycine, lysine and proline, which ...Great Lakes Gelatin - Nutritional Labels - Nutritional Info It is pricey but may spare damage to joints would be worth it for me as mine hurt like he double hockey sticks. there is no way I could eat raw eggs not even to stop wd... not even for that... ugh... Fat is actually suppose to be good for the brain tho I did not look at the link the coconut oil would be good for you I have tried so many things one would think raw eggs would be a small price to pay but I know they would not stay down not for me. I have been ill and have a half hearted take on her book... ok for those who are not on the drugs yet but I do worry many will try her 30 day program and expect magic... who knows maybe they will find magic but I have some doubts. Anyone who has been on these drugs for years has to deal with a body that has changed and no 30 day regime is going to fix that... imo...not humble just jaded. I am hoping this first book is just that an attempt at helping and the start of something bigger... she opened the window a crack I am waiting for the book where she opens the window and climbs out on the ledge.... maybe it will come or maybe somebody new will build on her work. Time will tell. Great work on this topic Actually, I had strange reactions to the gelatin she recommended so that is why I am very cautious about any supplement recommendations. You're not being jaded, you're being realistic. Drug cocktail 1995 - 2010 Started taper of Adderall, Wellbutrin XL, Remeron, and Doxepin in 2006 Finished taper on June 10, 2010 Temazepam on a PRN basis approximately twice a month - 2014 to 2016 Beginning in 2017 - Consumption increased to about two times per week April 2017 - Increased to taking it full time for insomnia Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nz11 Posted April 19, 2016 Share Posted April 19, 2016 0.001mg per month!!! Could that have been a mis-speak? Well thats what i thought too. But no, page 62 it says this in black and white: "In fact, even when i have tapered woman off of Celexa at extremely low increments of 0.001 mg a month, it can be hard to imagine another class of substances on earth so potentially complicated to discontinue." Is she referring here to an uncompleted action? Is she referring to an accomplishment? She could have used 'from' and not 'off of' but it seems more definite with off of imo i got no idea.... Could KB be a lot older than she appears? Whataya reckon? Could it be a typo? and a mis-speak? Thought for the day: Lets stand up, and let’s speak out , together. G Olsen We have until the 14th. Feb 2018. URGENT REQUEST Please consider submitting for the petition on Prescribed Drug Dependence and Withdrawal currently awaiting its third consideration at the Scottish Parliament. You don't even have to be from Scotland. By clicking on the link below you can read some of the previous submissions but be warned many of them are quite harrowing. http://www.parliament.scot/GettingInvolved/Petitions/PE01651 Please tell them about your problems taking and withdrawing from antidepressants and/or benzos. Send by email to petitions@parliament.scot and quote PE01651 in the subject heading. Keep to a maximum of 3 sides of A4 and you can't name for legal reasons any doctor you have consulted. Tell them if you wish to remain anonymous. We need the numbers to help convince the committee members we are not isolated cases. You have until mid February. Thank you Recovering paxil addict None of the published articles shed light on what ssri's ... actually do or what their hazards might be. Healy 2013. This is so true, with anything you get on these drugs, dependance, tapering, withdrawal symptoms, side effects, just silent. And if there is something mentioned then their is a serious disconnect between what is said and reality! "Every time I read of a multi-person shooting, I always presume that person had just started a SSRI or had just stopped." Dr Mosher. Me too! Over two decades later, the number of antidepressant prescriptions a year is slightly more than the number of people in the Western world. Most (nine out of 10) prescriptions are for patients who faced difficulties on stopping, equating to about a tenth of the population. These patients are often advised to continue treatment because their difficulties indicate they need ongoing treatment, just as a person with diabetes needs insulin. Healy 2015 I believe the ssri era will soon stand as one of the most shameful in the history of medicine. Healy 2015 Let people help people ... in a natural, kind, non-addictive (and non-big pharma) way. J Broadley 2017 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bubbles Posted April 19, 2016 Share Posted April 19, 2016 I wonder if she'd be receptive to us asking her? She must read here sometimes - if she referenced SA in her writing... That sort of slow taper ... If you only get down such a tiny bit, I wonder... 2005 St John's Wort / 2006-2012 Lexapro 20mg, 2 failed attempts to stop, tapered over 4.5 months in early 2012 January 2013 started Sertraline, over time worked up to 100mg July 2014 Sertraline dropped from 100mg to 75mg, held for six months, slower tapering until 2019 22 Dec 3.2mg 2020 Sertraline 19 Jan 3.1mg, 26 Jan 3.0mg; 1 Mar 2.9, 7 Mar 2.8, May (some drops here) 24 May 2.5, May 29 2.4, June 21 2.3, June 28 2.2mg, July 4 2.1mg, July 24 (or maybe a bit before) 2mg, early Nov switched to home made suspension; 29 Nov 1.8mg; approx 25 Dec 1.6mg) 2021 Some time in about Jan/Feb realised probably on more like 1.8mg and poss mixing error in making suspension; doses after 10 Feb accurate; 10 Feb 1.6mg; 7 Mar 1.4, continued monthly 10% drops until 1mg, then dropped 0.1mg monthly. May 2022,0.1mg, now dropping 0.01mg per week 29 August 2022 - first day of zero! My thread here at SA: https://www.survivingantidepressants.org/topic/1775-bubbles/page/21/ Current: Armour Thyroid Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nz11 Posted April 20, 2016 Share Posted April 20, 2016 I wonder if she'd be receptive to us asking her? She must read here sometimes - if she referenced SA in her writing... That sort of slow taper ... If you only get down such a tiny bit, I wonder... Great idea go for it ... You could email the media liason person or whoever and ask what 0.001mg scale might they recommend. And where does one buy it. Thought for the day: Lets stand up, and let’s speak out , together. G Olsen We have until the 14th. Feb 2018. URGENT REQUEST Please consider submitting for the petition on Prescribed Drug Dependence and Withdrawal currently awaiting its third consideration at the Scottish Parliament. You don't even have to be from Scotland. By clicking on the link below you can read some of the previous submissions but be warned many of them are quite harrowing. http://www.parliament.scot/GettingInvolved/Petitions/PE01651 Please tell them about your problems taking and withdrawing from antidepressants and/or benzos. Send by email to petitions@parliament.scot and quote PE01651 in the subject heading. Keep to a maximum of 3 sides of A4 and you can't name for legal reasons any doctor you have consulted. Tell them if you wish to remain anonymous. We need the numbers to help convince the committee members we are not isolated cases. You have until mid February. Thank you Recovering paxil addict None of the published articles shed light on what ssri's ... actually do or what their hazards might be. Healy 2013. This is so true, with anything you get on these drugs, dependance, tapering, withdrawal symptoms, side effects, just silent. And if there is something mentioned then their is a serious disconnect between what is said and reality! "Every time I read of a multi-person shooting, I always presume that person had just started a SSRI or had just stopped." Dr Mosher. Me too! Over two decades later, the number of antidepressant prescriptions a year is slightly more than the number of people in the Western world. Most (nine out of 10) prescriptions are for patients who faced difficulties on stopping, equating to about a tenth of the population. These patients are often advised to continue treatment because their difficulties indicate they need ongoing treatment, just as a person with diabetes needs insulin. Healy 2015 I believe the ssri era will soon stand as one of the most shameful in the history of medicine. Healy 2015 Let people help people ... in a natural, kind, non-addictive (and non-big pharma) way. J Broadley 2017 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Persephone Posted April 20, 2016 Share Posted April 20, 2016 Hows this Its best if i do pencil i already have library fines. Ill do pen when others have had it and then they wont know who did it. NZ11, what about printing up a little slip of paper with the link and inserting it in? Would look less like graffiti and more like a professional suggestion to other readers. I just think the library will figure out it's you, if you write in all four copies. They are smart that way. And writing in a book in pen is a far more serious library "crime" than having overdue fines. Everyone has overdue fines. I just don't want you to get banned from the library! 1980-84?: tricyclic antidepressant? unknown dosage, gradually quit by forgetting to take it 2011: Cipralex 10 mg increased to 20 mg after two months, Zyprexa 2.5 mg increased to 5 mg after one month 2012: Cipralex 20 mg, Zyprexa reduced to 2.5 mg, then stopped (withdrawal symptoms attributed to depression), Abilify 2 mg, then increased to 5 mg 2013: Cipralex 20 mg, Wellbutrin 150 mg, Abilify decreased to 2 mg and then stopped 2014: Cipralex reduced to 10 mg (no taper and withdrawal symptoms), Wellbutrin 150 mg 2015-16: Cipralex 10 mg, Wellbutrin 150 mg Started tapering Cipralex on March 31, 2016: 9 mg; April 27: 8.25 mg, May 25: 7.25 mg Off Cipralex late fall 2016 after a slow taper. Off Wellbutrin late winter/early spring 2017 after a taper. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
btdt Posted April 20, 2016 Share Posted April 20, 2016 I use to be such a picky person about books never write in them as they were sacred vessels of learning... lol ... that was the old me who was a poor kid who could never afford to own books... my how I have changed and the internet has changed a lot of those book ideas... I write in library books all the time... I do so kill me.... I don't care. I suggest you not take the book out just the one you already took out and write in all the rest while in the library so you don't get caught... video cameras could bust you if they are into that sort of thing so be real sneaky about it... make a stamp and just stamp them all... fast in and out... but more obvious lol all joking aside. Tho Alto's example is we have to play fair and that is how she does things which I respect... my thinking is how fair has this been to us and to heck with fair... getting people help who need it is more important than a clean page of a book.. books are tools to be used and sometimes they are used in a more creative way... that is my out of the box not nice thinking on this subject from the trenches. I have read so many books which could have all be the same book as they all say the same thing that when something new pops up I highlight it... yes I am the libraries worst nightmare... when it comes to wd books only. wishing you peace on your journey nz if you get caught the most I think they would do is make you buy the book... that is my guess. WARNING THIS WILL BE LONG Had a car accident in 85 Codeine was the pain med when I was release from hosp continuous use till 89 Given PROZAC by a specialist to help with nerve pain in my leg 89-90 not sure which year Was not told a thing about it being a psych med thought it was a pain killer no info about psych side effects I went nuts had hallucinations. As I had a head injury and was diagnosed with a concussion in 85 I was sent to a head injury clinic in 1990 five years after the accident. I don't think they knew I had been on prozac I did not think it a big deal and never did finish the bottle of pills. I had tests of course lots of them. Was put into a pain clinic and given amitriptyline which stopped the withdrawal but had many side effects. But I could sleep something I had not done in a very long time the pain lessened. My mother got cancer in 94 they switched my meds to Zoloft to help deal with this pressure as I was her main care giver she died in 96. I stopped zoloft in 96 had withdrawal was put on paxil went nutty quit it ct put on resperidol quit it ct had withdrawal was put on Effexor... 2years later celexa was added 20mg then increased to 40mg huge personality change went wild. Did too fast taper off Celexa 05 as I felt unwell for a long time prior... quit Effexor 150mg ct 07 found ****** 8 months into withdrawal learned some things was banned from there in 08 have kept learning since. there is really not enough room here to put my history but I have a lot of opinions about a lot of things especially any of the drugs mentioned above. One thing I would like to add here is this tidbit ALL OPIATES INCREASE SEROTONIN it is not a huge jump to being in chronic pain to being put on an ssri/snri and opiates will affect your antidepressants and your thinking. As I do not update much I will put my quit date Nov. 17 2007 I quit Effexor cold turkey. http://survivingantidepressants.org/index.php?/topic/1096-introducing-myself-btdt/ There is a crack in everything ..That's how the light gets in Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Persephone Posted April 20, 2016 Share Posted April 20, 2016 ... books are tools to be used and sometimes they are used in a more creative way... that is my out of the box not nice thinking on this subject from the trenches. Out-of-the-box, creative thinking is great. Some ebooks let you highlight and write comments for others to see if they want. Wouldn't it be great if there was a way to do this for library books? Perhaps Post-It notes and QR codes. Speaking of which, NZ11, here is a QR Code for survivingantidepressants.org, if you are inclined to include it in the library books: Well got the book from the library today. Guess what i read first? Here's some stuff from references to tapering ... ... The best way to promote resiliency is to bring back a signal of safety to the mind and body. And that signal comes in the form of simple lifestyle habits via nutrition, a clean environment, an ideal light cycle throughout the day and night, as well as movement: the evidence for the strategies is amassing in the literature. Psychiatrists are driven by fear and a need to control and regulate the emotional experience. As healers, we have the opportunity to meet this fear with compassion and equanimity. We can put aside our obsessive preoccupation with reactive intervention and liability- driven care and learn to tolerate what is uncomfortable about a patient’s distress. Given that the data supports the undeniable fact that the current model of medication based intervention is failing, we must do this ... I love those two paragraphs. I wish I had worked on my light cycle a long time ago. And I have definitely experienced doctors prescribing me medication because of their uncomfortableness over what I was going through. My local libraries don't have this book. Those of you who've seen it, is it worth buying? I almost think, no matter what the content of the book, it might worth buying just to have the cover and title lying around where my teenaged daughter can see it: A Mind of Your Own: The Truth About Depression and How Women Can Heal Their Bodies to Reclaim Their Lives. To undo the messages that I have been sending her by taking all these meds. 1980-84?: tricyclic antidepressant? unknown dosage, gradually quit by forgetting to take it 2011: Cipralex 10 mg increased to 20 mg after two months, Zyprexa 2.5 mg increased to 5 mg after one month 2012: Cipralex 20 mg, Zyprexa reduced to 2.5 mg, then stopped (withdrawal symptoms attributed to depression), Abilify 2 mg, then increased to 5 mg 2013: Cipralex 20 mg, Wellbutrin 150 mg, Abilify decreased to 2 mg and then stopped 2014: Cipralex reduced to 10 mg (no taper and withdrawal symptoms), Wellbutrin 150 mg 2015-16: Cipralex 10 mg, Wellbutrin 150 mg Started tapering Cipralex on March 31, 2016: 9 mg; April 27: 8.25 mg, May 25: 7.25 mg Off Cipralex late fall 2016 after a slow taper. Off Wellbutrin late winter/early spring 2017 after a taper. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nz11 Posted April 20, 2016 Share Posted April 20, 2016 Hows this Its best if i do pencil i already have library fines. Ill do pen when others have had it and then they wont know who did it. NZ11, what about printing up a little slip of paper with the link and inserting it in? Would look less like graffiti and more like a professional suggestion to other readers. I just think the library will figure out it's you, if you write in all four copies. They are smart that way. And writing in a book in pen is a far more serious library "crime" than having overdue fines. Everyone has overdue fines. I just don't want you to get banned from the library! Great idea. Actually sa is mentioned in the book so there really is no need to mark it. I have removed all markings. (ok two choice sentences were underlined in pencil shhh). Regarding fines yeah we get an email when your book is ready to be picked up and if you don't pick it up within one week you get fined. Sometimes i forget...ugh!! You get fined (per day) if its overdue too. Libraries take purchase suggestions so why not make a suggestion. Regarding whether to buy the book i say 'yes' go for it. This is a person who says 'i don't prescribe' and that needs supporting. Lets hope her book is so successful she makes pharma bribes and kickbacks look tiny.....lets help make honesty and integrity pay. imo nz11 Thought for the day: Lets stand up, and let’s speak out , together. G Olsen We have until the 14th. Feb 2018. URGENT REQUEST Please consider submitting for the petition on Prescribed Drug Dependence and Withdrawal currently awaiting its third consideration at the Scottish Parliament. You don't even have to be from Scotland. By clicking on the link below you can read some of the previous submissions but be warned many of them are quite harrowing. http://www.parliament.scot/GettingInvolved/Petitions/PE01651 Please tell them about your problems taking and withdrawing from antidepressants and/or benzos. Send by email to petitions@parliament.scot and quote PE01651 in the subject heading. Keep to a maximum of 3 sides of A4 and you can't name for legal reasons any doctor you have consulted. Tell them if you wish to remain anonymous. We need the numbers to help convince the committee members we are not isolated cases. You have until mid February. Thank you Recovering paxil addict None of the published articles shed light on what ssri's ... actually do or what their hazards might be. Healy 2013. This is so true, with anything you get on these drugs, dependance, tapering, withdrawal symptoms, side effects, just silent. And if there is something mentioned then their is a serious disconnect between what is said and reality! "Every time I read of a multi-person shooting, I always presume that person had just started a SSRI or had just stopped." Dr Mosher. Me too! Over two decades later, the number of antidepressant prescriptions a year is slightly more than the number of people in the Western world. Most (nine out of 10) prescriptions are for patients who faced difficulties on stopping, equating to about a tenth of the population. These patients are often advised to continue treatment because their difficulties indicate they need ongoing treatment, just as a person with diabetes needs insulin. Healy 2015 I believe the ssri era will soon stand as one of the most shameful in the history of medicine. Healy 2015 Let people help people ... in a natural, kind, non-addictive (and non-big pharma) way. J Broadley 2017 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nz11 Posted April 24, 2016 Share Posted April 24, 2016 This is KBs spring analogy: "If you squeeze a spring and you hold it there, steadily for a couple of hours, and then you suddenly let go, what happens? It bursts into expansion, maybe double its natural size and reverberates for a while until it comes to a resting place. This is the example that I use when I describe the effects that antidepressants have on brain chemistry over time – they squeeze the spring and if you let it go too quickly, it’s mayhem." This is an interesting way to look at it. Healy also has the spring analogy however like Healy i imagine a spring as something that stretches not something that is compressed. I can relate more to the stretching perspective. Our brain is the spring the drug is a weight that stretches the spring if you take the weight off too quickly the spring compresses with a 'bang' (ouch mind those neural -fingers!) as a result of this risk it is better to reduce the weight of the spring sloooowly...so there is no damaging compression. But here is the thing like all springs that have been held in a stretched position for a long period of time they may not go back to the original position easily. Sorry Meimei i think i have hijacked your thread. Thought for the day: Lets stand up, and let’s speak out , together. G Olsen We have until the 14th. Feb 2018. URGENT REQUEST Please consider submitting for the petition on Prescribed Drug Dependence and Withdrawal currently awaiting its third consideration at the Scottish Parliament. You don't even have to be from Scotland. By clicking on the link below you can read some of the previous submissions but be warned many of them are quite harrowing. http://www.parliament.scot/GettingInvolved/Petitions/PE01651 Please tell them about your problems taking and withdrawing from antidepressants and/or benzos. Send by email to petitions@parliament.scot and quote PE01651 in the subject heading. Keep to a maximum of 3 sides of A4 and you can't name for legal reasons any doctor you have consulted. Tell them if you wish to remain anonymous. We need the numbers to help convince the committee members we are not isolated cases. You have until mid February. Thank you Recovering paxil addict None of the published articles shed light on what ssri's ... actually do or what their hazards might be. Healy 2013. This is so true, with anything you get on these drugs, dependance, tapering, withdrawal symptoms, side effects, just silent. And if there is something mentioned then their is a serious disconnect between what is said and reality! "Every time I read of a multi-person shooting, I always presume that person had just started a SSRI or had just stopped." Dr Mosher. Me too! Over two decades later, the number of antidepressant prescriptions a year is slightly more than the number of people in the Western world. Most (nine out of 10) prescriptions are for patients who faced difficulties on stopping, equating to about a tenth of the population. These patients are often advised to continue treatment because their difficulties indicate they need ongoing treatment, just as a person with diabetes needs insulin. Healy 2015 I believe the ssri era will soon stand as one of the most shameful in the history of medicine. Healy 2015 Let people help people ... in a natural, kind, non-addictive (and non-big pharma) way. J Broadley 2017 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bubbles Posted April 24, 2016 Share Posted April 24, 2016 NZ11, where did you find the Healy analogy? 2005 St John's Wort / 2006-2012 Lexapro 20mg, 2 failed attempts to stop, tapered over 4.5 months in early 2012 January 2013 started Sertraline, over time worked up to 100mg July 2014 Sertraline dropped from 100mg to 75mg, held for six months, slower tapering until 2019 22 Dec 3.2mg 2020 Sertraline 19 Jan 3.1mg, 26 Jan 3.0mg; 1 Mar 2.9, 7 Mar 2.8, May (some drops here) 24 May 2.5, May 29 2.4, June 21 2.3, June 28 2.2mg, July 4 2.1mg, July 24 (or maybe a bit before) 2mg, early Nov switched to home made suspension; 29 Nov 1.8mg; approx 25 Dec 1.6mg) 2021 Some time in about Jan/Feb realised probably on more like 1.8mg and poss mixing error in making suspension; doses after 10 Feb accurate; 10 Feb 1.6mg; 7 Mar 1.4, continued monthly 10% drops until 1mg, then dropped 0.1mg monthly. May 2022,0.1mg, now dropping 0.01mg per week 29 August 2022 - first day of zero! My thread here at SA: https://www.survivingantidepressants.org/topic/1775-bubbles/page/21/ Current: Armour Thyroid Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nz11 Posted April 24, 2016 Share Posted April 24, 2016 "Your brain has adjusted to the presence of an antidepressant and the removal of this stimulus now requires the brain to readjust. In some cases, some people readjust in the way a spring does when a weight is removed – it springs back into shape. For others the spring will get back to normal provided the weight is removed gradually. For some others, the spring will not readjust." Healy 2009 taken from http://survivingantidepressants.org/index.php?/topic/1454-dr-david-healy-on-prolonged-antidepressant-withdrawal-syndrome-2009/ Thought for the day: Lets stand up, and let’s speak out , together. G Olsen We have until the 14th. Feb 2018. URGENT REQUEST Please consider submitting for the petition on Prescribed Drug Dependence and Withdrawal currently awaiting its third consideration at the Scottish Parliament. You don't even have to be from Scotland. By clicking on the link below you can read some of the previous submissions but be warned many of them are quite harrowing. http://www.parliament.scot/GettingInvolved/Petitions/PE01651 Please tell them about your problems taking and withdrawing from antidepressants and/or benzos. Send by email to petitions@parliament.scot and quote PE01651 in the subject heading. Keep to a maximum of 3 sides of A4 and you can't name for legal reasons any doctor you have consulted. Tell them if you wish to remain anonymous. We need the numbers to help convince the committee members we are not isolated cases. You have until mid February. Thank you Recovering paxil addict None of the published articles shed light on what ssri's ... actually do or what their hazards might be. Healy 2013. This is so true, with anything you get on these drugs, dependance, tapering, withdrawal symptoms, side effects, just silent. And if there is something mentioned then their is a serious disconnect between what is said and reality! "Every time I read of a multi-person shooting, I always presume that person had just started a SSRI or had just stopped." Dr Mosher. Me too! Over two decades later, the number of antidepressant prescriptions a year is slightly more than the number of people in the Western world. Most (nine out of 10) prescriptions are for patients who faced difficulties on stopping, equating to about a tenth of the population. These patients are often advised to continue treatment because their difficulties indicate they need ongoing treatment, just as a person with diabetes needs insulin. Healy 2015 I believe the ssri era will soon stand as one of the most shameful in the history of medicine. Healy 2015 Let people help people ... in a natural, kind, non-addictive (and non-big pharma) way. J Broadley 2017 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
btdt Posted April 25, 2016 Share Posted April 25, 2016 Interesting how Healy thinks of brain cells springs? I am still looking for the science behind this ... give me some grace on this post as it is off topic... http://survivingantidepressants.org/index.php?/topic/8870-dan998-cold-turkey-reinstatement-and-tapering-citalopram/page-13 post447 at any rate if Kelly find this by looking up her name online some day maybe she will tell us the answer Posted 19 April 2016 - 11:36 PM Dan998, on 19 Apr 2016 - 10:29 AM, said: I found this description of how antidepressants work. I've not seen this explanation before and can't decide whether it's cow's excrement or not. "The SSRIs all increase levels of the neurotransmitter serotonin in the brain by preventing the reabsorption of serotonin at synapses (spaces between nerve cells). With increased serotonin, the number of serotonin receptors on nerve cells in the brain can decrease (not as many are needed). The reduction in serotonin receptors takes place over the first month or two of taking an SSRI and is technically called downregulation. Downregulation allows the millions of nerve cells in the serotonin receptor system (particularly those in parts of the brain responsible for anxiety) to become less sensitive to changes in the neurochemical environment of the brain created by stress. That means less dramatic shifts in mood and less vulnerability to anxiety." ~The anxiety and phobia workbook / Edmund J. Bourne. -- 5th ed. p381 Yes I heard this before it was a big talk at paxil progress for a time there was one thread in particular about just this topic. It was the explanation for wd... and how the brain recovers and why it may not ect.... this is what I can recall from there and what I have learned since. The number of receptors decrease because the body says hey there is too much serotonin here we need to shut it down... sot hey kill off some receptors... In a study on baboons I think it was baboons the receptors were twisted after the ssri... and seven years later they were still twisted... like a cork screw... so not so much drug can get in the brain even tho they are flooded in it serotonin... Not only that but the body stops making so much serotonin it put the brakes on the best it can but it takes time to do this and when it does it sometimes it goes too far... that is my own idea... and it can't do it as fast as taking a drug can make the change... So when you stop taking a drug suddenly the body now knows low serotonin because the body has adapted to having a drug by shutting down receptors and not making as much serotonin... because you got it is pill form... now stop the drug suddenly your body cannot ramp up making more serotonin to make up for the pill... and the receptors once twisted do not untwist... the body apparently does grow new receptors but from what I read they are fragile maybe they need time to mature maybe they are not as good as the old ones... who knows what it takes to grow receptors ... (looking up when humans develop serotonin receptors in the brain may be helpful or maybe not.... if we knew what stage they were made it could point to some new clues...) Going cold turkey leaves your body not making enough serotonin and not able to use the amount you are making because of lack of receptors. I have wondered about this in the people who have set backs at eighteen months out... some of them get protracted... like me I wonder where the fault is... if the receptors were originally created at birth or shortly after in that supreme human growth spurt we know only toddlers have maybe these new receptors fail because they are missing something from that time.... or maybe it just takes years for them to grow up.. and fly straight... It is an interesting part of this situation and it has been on the table for years likely almost ten years... as I read it at paxil progress years ago. They had all the pages of science to back it up I am not sure if they are here or not. Tho I have read it other places too... I will say it seems the decent science I use to be able to find on ssri regarding this and other ssri subjects seems to have been culled in the last five or so years a lot of pages have gone 404 or been corrupted beyond recognition... I spent the last many years in wd seeking answers I had a lot of information on an old computer I cannot find anymore. So I appreciate you posting this as I am not sure if it is readily accessible. What I wrote above... "Not only that but the body stops making so much serotonin it put the brakes on the best it can but it takes time to do this and when it does it sometimes it goes too farmaybe causes this suicidal bit whcih I also had.... I wonder... WARNING THIS WILL BE LONG Had a car accident in 85 Codeine was the pain med when I was release from hosp continuous use till 89 Given PROZAC by a specialist to help with nerve pain in my leg 89-90 not sure which year Was not told a thing about it being a psych med thought it was a pain killer no info about psych side effects I went nuts had hallucinations. As I had a head injury and was diagnosed with a concussion in 85 I was sent to a head injury clinic in 1990 five years after the accident. I don't think they knew I had been on prozac I did not think it a big deal and never did finish the bottle of pills. I had tests of course lots of them. Was put into a pain clinic and given amitriptyline which stopped the withdrawal but had many side effects. But I could sleep something I had not done in a very long time the pain lessened. My mother got cancer in 94 they switched my meds to Zoloft to help deal with this pressure as I was her main care giver she died in 96. I stopped zoloft in 96 had withdrawal was put on paxil went nutty quit it ct put on resperidol quit it ct had withdrawal was put on Effexor... 2years later celexa was added 20mg then increased to 40mg huge personality change went wild. Did too fast taper off Celexa 05 as I felt unwell for a long time prior... quit Effexor 150mg ct 07 found ****** 8 months into withdrawal learned some things was banned from there in 08 have kept learning since. there is really not enough room here to put my history but I have a lot of opinions about a lot of things especially any of the drugs mentioned above. One thing I would like to add here is this tidbit ALL OPIATES INCREASE SEROTONIN it is not a huge jump to being in chronic pain to being put on an ssri/snri and opiates will affect your antidepressants and your thinking. As I do not update much I will put my quit date Nov. 17 2007 I quit Effexor cold turkey. http://survivingantidepressants.org/index.php?/topic/1096-introducing-myself-btdt/ There is a crack in everything ..That's how the light gets in Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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