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ang

Germanwings pilot Lubitz was on citalopram remeron and a sleeping tablet zopiclone

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ang

antidepaware.co.uk/homicides/       pilots have been allowed antidepressant use only since 2010. No one dives for 8 minutes to their death, without a word, read the link, people there actually stab themselves to death, all caused by antidepressants, sending them crazy.     I hope they have finally made the link.  From my readings, I think they finally have.  Lets hope so!  RIP so many innocents.   Hope the drug companies   have to go to the crash site, and witness what all their fake trials, and greed  have done.

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Muddles

I have no doubt in my mind this was caused by psych. Meds. I have read the pilot saw a psychiatrist weeks before.

 

I pray to God this doesn't get missed again.

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btdt

Rules were changed in 2010 I recall posting it on the effexor topix site. Till then pilots were not allowed to work if they were taking antidepressants rules were changed to include certain drugs to be used by pilots.  I think Prozac was one which I found a bad idea but not everyone reacts like I did. 

It is hard to tell ahead of time which person could react... may have something to do with genetics but no genetic testing is done before they give us the drugs.  

 

Here is a bit about how it changed. 

 

"The new FAA rules will allow pilots to use four commonly prescribed medications to counteract depression: Prozac, Zoloft, Celexa and Lexapro. Others may be added to the list as the agency becomes confident they're safe and effective. 

Antidepressants have a long list of side-effects. The most severe are also the rarest, but they include seizures, problems with eyesight, memory loss, hallucinations and thoughts of suicide. Babbitt said the FAA wants to keep those at bay. 

"We want to make certain that those side-effects don't manifest themselves as they go under these medications," he said, adding that's why the new rules include, "a long period of time of evaluation and even when they return to the cockpit, (pilots) will continue to be evaluated the rest of their careers." 

Under the new policy, pilots will be given a six-month grace period. If they come forward during that time and admit they're taking antidepressants, they will avoid civil penalties. But, they may be barred from flying for up to one year as the government undertakes a number of tests and evaluations. "

Often the mistake is made that a people taking any of these drugs are stupid while at times the drugs may make people stupid or irrational ... that is not generally the case.  Uninformed for sure they are but many are not stupid they will not let their lives fall apart by not working .. any more then pharma would let prozac truth come out as it would mean their financial collapse.  On the other hand the brain of pharma as far as we know were not altered by drugs... others brains are and that changes everything as we know.  Seems we just go from one catastrophe to another and never get back to the fixing the errors that have been there since the beginning. My fear is this too will be twisted to sell more drugs one way or the other... and if they can we will be further stigmatized as the drugs are held up and the great cure of the century. Still. 

http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2010/04/02/faa-allowing-pilots-use-anti-depressants-policy-shift/

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btdt

I have no doubt in my mind this was caused by psych. Meds. I have read the pilot saw a psychiatrist weeks before.

 

I pray to God this doesn't get missed again.

 

Isn't it odd how that is always our first thoughts.  One mention on the news yesterday was about school shooting... I thought hey somebody is cluing in... maybe a connection will be made.  Then I thought of how any connection ever made with a school shooting has always resulted in further assessments and drugging of kids and the worry was even more pilots will be druged.. making air travel more dangerous. 

 

I am too jaded to think this will change anything even if they find out the drugs had some link to this disaster people will never really know the connection like we do and they will let it slip away as they always have. I will admit to a slight hope when I first heard that finally maybe the lid would blow off this crap... and I did say a prayer that exactly that would happen. I am just jaded by too many years of not enough... 

 

Not to take away from the great efforts by people like Alto and others who do struggle each and every day to bring this awareness to the world I know it is making a difference and maybe one day things will change it is so agonizingly slow it is literally painful to me. 

 

One more thing...

as they acknowledge the side effects of the drugs which are often dangerous there is no mention of the psych effects of tolerance even if they are watched closely it can come on fast or come on fast with drug interactions which are never noticed either... 

 

Last but not least when they stop taking the antidepressants the psych side effects much like the other side effects listed above hit and nobody will be looking for them... nobody least of all the drug taker. 

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indigo

As soon as I heard about the crash,the cabin door locked and the downward descent button pushed I was sure it was realated to

anti-depressants. As more of the story is coming we can see it's true. This is a critical time to get out the message about the danger 

of SSRI's.  David Healey has been onto this  suicide/homicide link with ADs for years but Big Pharma deliberatey discredit any psychiatrist who speaks out about this.

It will take a ground swell of voices speaking up  in the media to counteract their lies.

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westcoast

treatment...

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westcoast

so unnecessary.

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ang

Shame, can see it all getting twisted already, in favour of the drug companies,,  get help now, help is available, come get your Prozac... oh well.......

 

The ex girlfriend of 6 years ago,suddenly coming out and telling of a a nightmare the pilot had 6 years ago?   Now another  pilot who was depressed twelve months ago  (now setting up a new company).....  next will be the magazine articles paid for by Prozac et al....  oh dear!

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ang

http://www.naturalnews.com/028514_antidepressant_drugs_pilots.html    So I'm going to lay out a prediction here, and even though it may take years for this to come true, there's little doubt it's coming unless the FAA reverses its rules: There will be an airplane crash one of these days where the cause is not merely "pilot error" but actually medication-induced pilot error. Some pilot who is psyched out on antidepressant drugs might fly his plane into a building, mountain, ocean or other landscape feature, and the NTSB will recover the black boxes only to find that the pilot had gone stark raving mad minutes before impact. A little more investigation will reveal he was on psychiatric prescription medications.


How true..... written 2010.

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btdt

This is a link of a pilot chat site. 

http://www.airliners.net/aviation-forums/general_aviation/read.main/6356743/

 

What they are saying a bit like what everybody else is saying we don't have all the facts yet... many are hoping for the facts to make sense for themselves... if there is any sense to be had.  Those here know there are times when ADs and sense are incompatible.  The long drone of not being yourself and having your life spiral while taking all the drugs the doctor ordered ... well that is not hitting the minds of the people on this chat site... like it is hitting my mind. They know nothing about it and I feel ill equipped to inform them. I know it sounds like a cop out even as I say it.  Yet I feel unable to take on the crowds. The associations the lawyers... it is a long list... is it some kind of further injustice that those made unable are the ones that know the truth?  I hope others who feel able just now can pick up the slack.  Sorry. 

 

One interesting point that folks on this site are using as a sign the pilot was not depressed he bought two new matching cars... one for him one for the gf... to them that means looking forward a sound future.  To me it could possibly mean mania... the world view is so different between drugs users and those who have never taken them who expect they are successful treatments doing exactly what they are suppose to do and nothing more. 

 

I worry about copy cats I am glad at one thing poverty means I will not be flying but I do love a lot of people who do fly. 

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ang

https://www.faa.gov/air_traffic/publications/atpubs/aim/aim0801.html   c. Medication.

1. Pilot performance can be seriously degraded by both prescribed and over-the-counter medications, as well as by the medical conditions for which they are taken. Many medications, such as tranquilizers, sedatives, strong pain relievers, and cough-suppressant preparations, have primary effects that may impair judgment, memory, alertness, coordination, vision, and the ability to make calculations. Others, such as antihistamines, blood pressure drugs, muscle relaxants, and agents to control diarrhea and motion sickness, have side effects that may impair the same critical functions. Any medication that depresses the nervous system, such as a sedative, tranquilizer or antihistamine, can make a pilot much more susceptible to hypoxia.

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ang

Thanks btdt, I am like obsessive compulsive... If anyone finds my posts not welcome, let me know.   One link had a reference to hypoxia, wish I had posted that one, how someone suffering it, coulf unwittingly have done what the co pilot did,  ie lack of oxygen,  The video that went will the link, was quite revealing.    

Also the co pilot could have been on statins, they can have the same mind bending effects, as can some of the drugs used to stop smoking....  the ones to stop smoking are worse than the antidepressants... god help us all x

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ang

Smart Drugs?                                                                                                                       omg they are serious?

In relatively new research, there is some indication that normal memory can be enhanced by already existing medications. A study by Stanford University, as reported by BBC News (2002) indicated that the current drug used for Alzheimer's patients could increase the mental power of people without the illness. Tests involving 18 airline pilots with an average age of 52, found that those taking the drug Aricept were better able to retain complex training than those given a placebo. Aricept works because it blocks the action of a body chemical in the brain. This chemical breaks down another called acetylcholine (discussed earlier) which helps pass messages between brain cells in parts of the brain key to memory and conscious thought.

The limitations to the study included a small sample base (validity problems for a larger population), side effects- which included diarrhea and vomiting (not a good thing for a pilot), and costs- Aricept is very expensive. Remember, there is no magic pill, but current research is at least investigating the possibilities of memory enhancement for now and in the future. 

 

http://airlinesafety.com/editorials/PilotsAndMemory.htm

 

Am I a bit of a sceptic, wonder who funded this absurd trial?

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westcoast

Aricept is not good. I read their site.

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btdt

memory and conscious thought.

 

Interestingly enough the two areas in which I felt damaged by effexor. Maybe they have found a drug to treat the damage... but I will pass.  Wonder who these pilots are that they are trying these drugs on... what plane are the flying today?  What is the fallout of those drugs?  

 

In the book "Plato to Prozac... or better living... or both... sorry brain is muddy. 

 

The unsuspecting researchers who took the antidepressant did not notice or mention the fallout of the drug till one other mentioned it... but then it was  like a flood gate opening.  The effects took some time to manifest unexpected side effects they took one pill each that is all... one pill. 

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ang

torn up sick note  ie I have the flu, not coming to work (perhaps)      is now reported as "torn up medical document" omg   the power of inuendo....

 

He always used to be a quiet companion, but in the last year that got worse              ie he got quieter?

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ang

http://news.legalexaminer.com/is-your-pilot-on-prozac-.aspx?googleid=279968  Its premise is that alcoholism and chemical dependencies can be successfully treated medically. HIMS grew out of a grant in the 1970s that joined the Air Line Pilots Association with the National Institute for Alcohol Abuse and Alcoholism.  OH dear, now we know that SSRIs cause alcoholism......?  

Read more: http://news.legalexaminer.com/is-your-pilot-on-prozac-.aspx?googleid=279968#ixzz3Vgoo03CG

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indigo

 Thanks for your posts Ang. I'm also focused on this and freaked by media silence on connection to SSRI's.

This quote hits the nail on the head.

"In the aftermath of revelations that Germanwings co-pilot Andreas Lubitz deliberately crashed the airliner, there has also been complete silence amongst the establishment press as to whether psychiatric drugs played a role, despite Lubitz’ known history of depression.

Pharmaceutical giants who produce drugs like Zoloft, Prozac and Paxil spend around $2.4 billion dollars a year on direct-to-consumer television advertising every year. By running negative stories about prescription drugs, networks risk losing tens of millions of dollars in ad revenue, which is undoubtedly one of the primary reasons why the connection is habitually downplayed or ignored entirely."

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ang

. So, once you are feeling better, have a discussion with your treating physician about discontinuing medication. You will need to be off it entirely for at least 60 days, after which you will then provide the FAA with documentation about your treatment.

 

http://pilot-protection-services.aopa.org/News/2014/November/Depression damn I was fine for six monbths till my crash    you know what I mean?  x

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dcrmt

I'm hopeful that they're going to ask questions about what he was on and it's possible effects.

 

This didn't happen in the USA, it happened in Europe. 
They are going to dig to get to the bottom of this, it wont be satisfactory that he was just crazy.

 

They will investigate his recent medical treatment, they will investigate his prior medical treatment. This may well be the case that makes the homicide link impossible to ignore.

I am fairly confident that if there's anything substantive regarding him being on SSRI's and the potential link, it will be explored.

Remember, this has happened in Europe and it will be investigated by the French and the Germans primarily. Neither of those countries even have native companies that've developed SSRI's that I'm aware of. 

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