MNgal1960: need to get off of 3 meds

[MNgal1960]

Didn't cut this week cuz I feel like my symptoms need to settle down. Will cut again next week if I feel better.

[MNgal1960]

Made another tiny cut to the Seroquel. Afraid to make bigger cuts. I guess this is a slow-motion microtaper. My doctor doesn't want me to taper anything, but I find doing nothing to be so depressing I just have to do something even if it's a slow-motion microtaper.

 

Hear the clock ticking and it worries me. Kids will be graduating from college and moving on and probably moving away. I am too ill to move and need their help with so many things. Feel like crying.

 

Started with a new therapist who does CBT on the advice of my doctor. She's rather strict and calls emotional reactions cognitive distortions that I need to challenge with logical thinking. I have this whole big workbook I'm doing to identify my cognitive distortions and come up with challenges to them. I don't think I can argue my way out of feeling bad. Focusing on how I feel and arguing with myself about it just makes me feel worse. So it hasn't been a very good couple of weeks.

 

I thought CBT was supposed to be about gaining coping skills that would help me cope with my struggles. Maybe this therapist is just bad at it. She reminds me of a strict, old school teacher that you can't please unless you say the right thing.

 

Don't you think that the whole mental healthcare system with people always telling you what's wrong with you and how yo need to be fixed is just depressing itself? Of course, nobody believes that these meds are actually to blame and have made me so much worse, not better. Feeling discouraged, disbelieved, demeaned and could use some encouragement.

[KarenB]

In my experience finding a helpful therapist does require shopping around.  To be totally honest, there are some people who just should not be allowed to practice under that title. 

 

Wow, I don't know too much about CBT other than that many here have found it helpful, so I might just not understand the context or something, but I'd be wary of someone labeling emotions as distortions.  Emotions are signals to us, indicating where more healing is needed.  They want to be listened to and acknowledged; pushing them away or challenging them has got to be damaging.  And it sounds like you came away from there feeling unheard yourself - another bad sign.

 

Perhaps your doctor has other options he could refer you to?  Or you could look up who's available near where you live?  Some people here learn CBT online.  You've got enough on your shoulders without needing therapy to help you cope with your therapist !

 

You deserve a lot better than that, MNgal.  For the moment, can you create a little something lovely in your day?  Sit in a comfy chair and listen to soothing music, have sit in a garden for a while, watch a movie you enjoy...

[MNgal1960]

Thanks, Karen. I would have to agree. I have had more terrible therapists than good ones, and, now that I am dealing with trauma, it makes it even harder to find a competent one. I have kept looking around while I continue with this strict CBT person. I see her Tuesday, and if things don't go better, I don't think I will see her again. I'm already dreading Tuesday.

 

I did get a name of another therapist from my HMO (government health insurance group) and looked at her website. She is only in my town (actually, a nearby town) 2 days a week, but she seems to have actual, in-depth training in trauma and an interest in nutrition, both good things. I will see how long it takes to get in to see her. I'd really like to try her and know she's a good fit before I quit this other one. Being in an HMO, I have limited options and being in a semi-rural area doesn't help either.

 

Very on edge these days and not sure if it's the taper or more stress with my son or my neuropathy flaring up or all of the above. Wish it would settle down. I could use a break.

 

Just curious, Karen, I saw you did a hold. Are you still holding? Did you find the hold helpful? My doctor thinks I have so much stress in my life right now that I should just be holding everything. My therapist agrees. Although, since she really isn't listening to me, I'm not sure her opinion matters. My doctor does listen, but she also doesn't see anything wrong with long-term use of these meds, so I'm conflicted about her advice.

[KarenB]

I am still holding, it must have been 6 months by now I think.  For most of that time I don't feel I saw improvement, which was discouraging.  Then a few weeks ago I missed a dose, and that set me back again.  Then I discovered I was very low in iron, which may explain my ridiculous tiredness of late, so I've been working on building that up. 

 

Finally though, these last two weeks or so have shown a definite improvement, so I feel that continuing to hold has been the right move.  I will keep holding while the improvements keep happening, and at some point work out when to reduce again. 

 

I'm glad to hear you have another possibility for therapy - it's unlikely to be worse than who you've got now! 

[MNgal1960]

Ha ha, yes, unlikely to be worse than who I have now. And closer to where I live!

 

I'm sorry the hold has been taking so long to help, but very glad that you are finally seeing some benefit from it. I am thinking that once I get a bit lower on the Q, I will do a good long hold, too, before I try to go at the V.

 

Wishing you many, many more days of improvement.

 

MN

[MNgal1960]

Lots of stress this week, so not cutting.

[MNgal1960]

Even though did not cut because of being very busy this week, have new problems. Wondering if it is from cutting or stress. Feel very weak compared to normal. Am tippy on my feet like I was when I first started the gabapentin. But that was gone for ages. Now it's back. But haven't made any changes to the gabapentin. Only cutting the Seroquel. Also, for several days have had a weird feeling of pressure in my head and am very sensitive to sound. Had to roll up the car windows because the wind noise sounded strange to me, like with a vibration. It's not always. Sometimes it's gone and sometimes it comes back. Dropping things. Knocking things over. Very clumsy.

 

None of this is unbearable, just miserable and discouraging. Hate being cooped up indoors during the summer. Our summers are so short. Want to be out and about. Maybe I overdid the out and about. Or, even though I think my sleep is the same, maybe it's not??? I have been very, very tired.

 

I don't know if this means I'm cutting too fast or if I am trying to do too much or I'm not sleeping well  or some combo.

 

Gosh, typing this was hard. So many mistakes. Think I caught them all.

[MNgal1960]

Unusually cool weather for Minnesota in July so have been getting out for walks some days. Trying not to overdo it this time. Big heat wave coming, though.

 

Still very anxious, especially in the mornings. The weird head pressure has been fading.

 

Making my last Seroquel cut tonight and then going to hold the Seroquel for awhile and practice liquifying my Valium. I have a few extra pills, so I'll see what happens to it when I try to dissolve one. I wonder how long I should wait after holding the Seroquel before I start on the Valium. I'm kind of scared to try at all given what happened the last time. But I so much want to get off of these meds.

 

Still very clumsy. Memory still poor. A bit less tippy on my feet. Mood very low. Lonely. Want my life back. Starting to think it's not going to happen. Everything seems so bleak.

[Shep]

Hi, MNgal. I saw your latest post on the benzo forum and I was catching up with your story here on your home thread. I wanted to reach out because I also had a ton of problems with CBT. It always seemed like too much "magical thinking" for me. I couldn't do it. It brought me down, not up. There were too many words when I simply needed calm. Quiet. Peace.

 

I couldn't find it in CBT and my therapist made me feel like there was something wrong with me for being unable to understand. Fact is, therapists simply talk too much for me to know what they're saying. Replacing a positive word for a negative word just seemed wrong on so many levels. Telling me what to say is too close to telling me what to think. 

 

I agree with Karen 100% - "You've got enough on your shoulders without needing therapy to help you cope with your therapist."

 

I wanted you to know you're not alone in this and there may be sound reason for CBT not working for some people. You mentioned dealing with trauma - there's this really good book called The Body Keeps the Score: Brain, Mind, and Body in the Healing of Trauma by Dr. Bessel van der Kolk. He is a pioneer in trauma research and helping people heal.

 

According to Dr. van der Kolk:

 

CBT was first developed to treat phobias such as fear of spiders, airplanes, or heights, to help patients compare their irrational fears with harmless realities. . . . The idea behind cognitive behavior treatment is that when patients are repeatedly exposed to the stimulus without bad things actually happening, they gradually will become less upset; the bad memories will have become associated with "corrective" information of being safe. CBT also tried to help patients deal with their tendency to avoid, as in "I don't want to talk about it." It sounds simple, but, as we have seen, reliving trauma reactivates the brain's alarm system and knocks out critical brain areas necessary for integrating the past, making it likely that patients will relive rather than resolve trauma. 

 

It could possibly be that withdrawal is hampering your progress with CBT or it could be that CBT is simply not the best treatment for you. I highly recommend this book because Dr. von der Kolk lists many other methods that may work better such as trauma sensitive yoga, EMDR, neurofeedback, and even art, theater, and journaling. My favorites are mindfulness meditation and listening to and playing music. Mindfulness taught me to let my toxic thoughts and emotions simply pass by like tourists, not inviting them in. And the right type of music has a "calming" effect. As the emotional blunting wears off from withdrawal as well as the intrusive and repetitive thoughts, simply relaxing into beautiful music at the end of the day is all that is needed to make me connect to that feeling of being "safe". No words needed.   

 

I also did a lot of trauma journaling and unlike having to "speak" words, being able to "write" worked for me. I didn't have the problems with disassociation I had when speaking to a therapist. So there are ways around it. There is a lot of hope. 

 

At many points in the book, Dr. von der Kolk mentions the importance of feeling "safe". In order for CBT to work, you have to have this baseline feeling of safety. If you've never learned this, CBT probably won't work. Mindfulness was the first type of help I've gotten to establish this very basic feeling of being "safe". 

 

So please don't be discouraged because there really is a lot out there to explore and to heal beyond CBT.  Right now, you simply may be too worn down from the stress of withdrawal for anything to help much, but withdrawal is temporary. Some mindfulness techniques might help with withdrawal, so I'll place some links here for you to explore if you are interested:

 

Non-drug techniques to cope with emotional symptoms

 

The first section lists links to several threads on mindfulness and meditation. 

 

And this may help with sleep:

 

Guided Meditations, Calming Videos, Sleep Hypnosis

 

Sending healing vibes your way. I hope the new therapist you mentioned is a good fit. Please let us know how you do. 

[MNgal1960]

Shep, yes, I so get the magical thinking thing! It's like I'm trying to argue myself into believing something isn't true when I know darn well it is or very likely is. Such as, I have a degenerative nerve disorder that is incurable. Barring a miracle, it's not going to get better. It's going to get worse. But CBT tells me to think positively and say I am OK when I'm not OK. I can't do it. The therapist does indeed have the mindset that I am broken and she needs to fix me. I don't like being around toxic people and she fits my definition of a toxic person.

 

I saw the CBT person once more and this time pretended to play the game and told her I was doing much better with the CBT. (Really, I was just having a window.) She was much more pleasant, told me to continue the CBT worksheets, and said she wanted to talk about my long-term treatment plan at our next meeting. And she implied I might be moving on to someone else in the practice for trauma work (which is so totally over her head). But time was up and she wouldn't say more. Her next evening opening was 6 weeks out. So I got a vacation from her! When I got home from the meeting with her, I sat down, did all my homework in one sitting, and put the book away. And, remarkably, I feel so much better now that I'm not arguing with myself any more!

 

I definitely don't have a baseline of safety and this therapist is so harsh that it will never happen. So I think I'm done with CBT. I just don't want to make this therapist mad because then I will be booted out of the whole group, which would not be good. I don't have a lot of choices in my medical plan.

 

I have an audio-book on mindfulness with guided meditations that I had been using and went back to that instead. I think I am making baby steps on my own with the mindfulness. I bought a more heavy-duty book on it to explore it further, but usually I'm too tired to read something heavy duty. I'll try a bit more today.

 

Meanwhile, I have met once with another therapist. She does EMDR and other stuff, but I didn't find out much. Mostly she took my history. She did seem to actually believe me when I told her these meds are awful and they are so hard to get off of. And she was very kind. But I have only met her once. I am feeling very nervous about trusting any therapist very easily. I will get to see her again and get to know her more before I see the CBT person. And then I will make up my mind about what to do.

 

Thanks for those links. I am going to go look at them now.

 

MN

[AR2003]

Hi Mngal

 

I was looking through the forum and I noticed that you and I have similar history. I too struggled with many antidepressants years ago.

I'm not long joined and I am in the proces of ttapering seroquel 25mgs too. If you see my signature its been pretty hectic since 2013.

I developed pain in January 2014 from many changes and withdrawals and a cold turkey from Cymbalta. All helped by my doctor who tapered me way too fast.

 

How are you doing ? You are having a lot of nerve pain ? You have had a dreadful time of it.

Me too. And I have terrible muscle rigidity and pain. Its horrific.

 

I see you are doing a Valium taper also ? I tried to taper valium before I was placed on seroquel. I think I got down as far as 1 mgs. Drycuts from 9 mgs. My doctor wouldn't give me much help and refused liquid valium. I tried a milk taper but I couldn't handle it at all.

 

I am down to 6.25 mgs. My sleep is better. I am so thankful. There are other symptoms that are less too.

The pain remains.

 

I hope we can support each other through this. You are doing so well.

My best wishes

 

AR ( Aoibherose)

[MNgal1960]

Hi AR. I have paused my tapering at this point and am waiting for the symptoms to settle down. I will wait as long as it takes. My doctor is in no hurry to get me off of any of these drugs, so I guess that's good. I can taper at my own rate. I feel sorry for the people whose doctors are rushing them. I hope your doctor isn't rushing you now.

 

MN

[AR2003]

Hi MNgirl

 

No my doctor isn't rushing me. I have come off so many in the last couple of years that she realised that I need to do what is best for me.

[MNgal1960]

I'm very glad to hear that.

[MNgal1960]

Had been holding. Tried a small cut to Q. Terrible 2 weeks. Backed up. Holding again.

 

Also, new therapist does not want me making any cuts. Says I must be medically stable to do EMDR. Even without cuts, I have an autoimmune disorder and am never really medically stable.

 

Also, I'm supposed to have a strong support system and a "safety plan." Safety plan sounds scary! Support system, well, I've been working on that for over 5 years (since we moved) and my support system has been shrinking, not growing. Not sure how this is going to work out.

 

Am more inclined toward getting lower on the Q, maybe just need to go slower. The hangover in the morning from the Q is terrible. I don't know how I'll cope with that and whatever is in store for me with the EMDR. Whatever it is, it sure doesn't sound pleasant. Safety plan??!!

[KarenB]

How long had it been since you last tried a cut, and what percentage was this recent cut?  You'll want to hold for at least a month now before trying anything else - to give everything a chance to settle again. 

 

I'm not sure, but a safety plan may be quite similar to a support plan, but with a few more specifics as to how you'll keep safe in certain situations.  Are you writing it yourself?  That could help you feel more in charge of it, and therefore less scared of it.  

 

It's important to remember that you can be in charge of things that happen to you.  Emdr, plans, decisions on reductions, therapy - you call the shots, not anyone else.  So your therapist could suggest things, but shouldn't be telling you what will be happening. 

[MNgal1960]

Hi. I've had some very bad days. Things happening in my family that are breaking my heart. Hard to believe anything could hurt this bad. Have lost the will to go on.

 

I have a 25mg tablet of Seroqule that weighs 101mg. I had been dry cutting 1mg off the tablet every week. When my doctor told me to stop cutting anything, I held for 2 or 3 weeks and then tried again. I am wondering if my dry cutting is not accurate.

 

I am down to the tablet weight .068 on my scale. I am going to hold another week, but I really am wondering if my cutting is not accurate. It's a jewelers scale that is the best I can afford.

 

I am wondering if I should go to making a suspension of it. Then even if I were holding, at least it might be accurate. (?)

 

My therapist is only available every other week. So far she has told me very little. Our appointments are very short because she is often late but ends the appointment exactly on time even if she started 10 minutes late. She would not tell me more except I first need to practice coping kills, then we choose targets, then we do a support system. I don't know what to do about that because all I have left is my daughter and one friend. Both are very busy. I am still on coping skills (deep breathing and a mindfulness program that I actually picked out myself). She won't give me any more information except this has to be slow.

 

The last people you would talk to around here is the county "crisis center." My previous therapist used to work for the county and told me to stay away at all cost.They are rude, just quickly screen you for suicidal ideation, then send the cops if they are concerned. If you are on Medicaid (like me), the cops handcuff you and take you to the county hospital, which, according to news reports, is a nightmare with failed inspections and lists of violations (no individualized care plans, falsification of records, no pharmacist, running out of meds, new admissions waiting days to be seen and evaluated, lately a person dumped in there from the jail who scaled 2 fences and escaped).

 

So I am stuck with 3 huge wights crushing me. One is the family crisis. Two is the Seroquel taper and hold not working, possibly because of my dry cutting and scale not being good enough. Three is my new therapist being very slow and cryptic and making me scared. I am in a MEdicaid HMO, and there i sno one else around here who does trauma therapy and will treat me because of my  benzos. They are quick to judge that I must be an addict or I would be off and tell me to go inpatient detox;  and end of the conversation.

 

I wonder if I should just give up the idea of therapy and go back to tapering.

[nz11]

I confess i haven't read all your thread only whats on this page.

Wishing you strength  at this difficult time.

Please don't give up hope. There is hope. SA is a community of hope  and it is so good to have your voice as part of it. There is hope and you can make it.

 

It appears to me that you are using a scale measuring to 0.001g

It also appears to me that you are doing a great and accurate job.

 

If you are cutting at 10% this may be too much for you . You could consider tapering at 5%.

 

Three is my new therapist being very slow and cryptic and making me scared.

Sounds like this person doesnt deserve the privilege and honor of being in your presence and sharing and walking in your world and your journey with you.

Life is to short to have to be putting up with this ...fire them.

This therapist has lost all capacity to minister any therapy/healing. They have undermined your feelings of confidence and self -determination and in doing so have nothing to offer. They have no 'healing presence' whatsoever. imo.

all I have left is my daughter and one friend.

Can you go to your friend for unconditional positive regard and nonjudgmental support.

A friend who wont say 'sometimes we need a little something to get by ...go and talk to your doctor'

 

Two is the Seroquel taper and hold not working, possibly because of my dry cutting and scale not being good enough.

If you are consistent in the way you use the scale i think you are doing fine.

Are you able to hold for another month and see how things are?

 

One is the family crisis.

I am sorry you are hit with this while experiencing stabilizing on drugs issues.

 

 

I am sorry misinformed doctors have put you in this situation.

 

Don't give up MNgal keep hanging on. You can make it.

nz11

[AliG]

MN.  Perhaps you could get a compounding pharmacy to make up a liquid solution for you ?  It might be the answer to your problem if it's at all possible.

 

In regard to your therapy and this is only a personal observation, I have found it more problematic than anything else. My theory is that it's best left for a better time and environment where drugs/ withdrawal aren't involved.  A time when you're possibly over withdrawal and your true emotions aren't getting hijacked because of symptoms. It is only my experience but I thought I would mention it. It's very much a personal decision and there are many factors to be considered . I believe everyone has to weigh it up and decide for themselves which course to take.  No one can tell you what to do in that regard. Perhaps your instinct is the best guide at the end of the day . However, being scared of your therapist doesn't sit well in my opinion and perhaps a change is needed there at least.

 

I'm so sorry that you have a family crisis. I can empathize as I have / am / are / always going through that as well. It can be draining and debilitating, and wear you down. Sometimes , you have to be selfish and look after you first.  Just know that you will get through !  Stay strong. 

Ali

[Altostrata]

MNgal, your 25mg Seroquel tablet weighs 101mg, is that correct?

 

How much Seroquel do you figure you are taking now? I don't understand why your tablet weighs .068 (grams? milligrams?).

[nz11]

Alto i am guessing it is this

if 101mgpw (0.101g)= 25mgai

then 1mgpw = 0.2475mgai

so 68mgpw (0.068g) = 16.83mgai rounded to 17mgai (The drug sig says taking 17mg)

 

The way i have understood it is the current dose of 17mgai is what weighs 0.068g, (68mg). (not the tablet they have done a typo in saying tablet weighs 0.068 ?).

 

MNgal can you confirm this.

[MNgal1960]

The scale says .068, which I think means 68mg.

 

This last bottle of tablets seems to weigh 102mg. Or else the scale is wrong. I had a terrible time trying to cut tablets this week. The scale was drifting so much. I am starting to wonder about my scale, but I was told it was the best I could get unless I paid over $2,000. The thought of liquifying is just overwhelming. I have read and watched videos and my mind is just all jumbled up. So I keep trying dry cutting. I am holding at .068 now for several weeks. For some reason, my neuropathy has been horrific. (I do have an autoimmune disorder that contributes to the neuropathy but I don't know what causes this. And it not usually this bad.)

 

nz, I think what you are saying is right. I am in a bad mental state right now. Something very bad is happening. The neuropathy and my son. I am terrified for my son and my mind seems frozen from the neuropathic pain to the point it is hard to even eat. I'm so scared for my son.

 

I have enough tablets cut to make it through the week, but I don't know how accurate they are. My daughter said she would liquify for me after school every day, but she has ADHD and works and goes to school and does not have the time/focus to figure out how to actually do it. And I can't figure it out either. I don't know what's wrong with my brain. I used to be able to understand this stuff. My insurance will not pay for compounding and I think Q is not stable as a liquid, anyway. I think I read that somewhere. I need to be able to liquify it myself.

 

Do you think making a suspension is more accurate than dry cutting?

[MNgal1960]

About my therapist. I am scared of therapists because I was traumatized by one in the past (who was not a trauma therapist and tried to treat me anyway and re-traumatized me). So even though this person seems nice (as did the last one), it is hard to trust her. My primary doctor would like me to see her because she is actually a certified and experienced trauma therapist. My doctor thinks I need this and wants me to not taper while I see this person. I think I would do better if I weren't so scared for my son. He is a young adult so I cannot protect him. Even though he has some cognitive issues, he is legally an adult now. But he is naive and gullible and I am so afraid for what he has gotten into and how he is being manipulated. I can't even type it here. I have to stop or I will be crying all day again. I was struggling but coping before all this happened with my son.

 

I still want to get lower on the Q because I am afraid of the side effects and I am starting a cataract.

 

I am sorry if I am rambling. I did read. Thank you for the help. Just hard to put my thoughts in order. Need to try to do something more simple now. Brain hurts.

[brassmonkey]

Hi MNgal--  These scales can be very sensitive to their surroundings. Any sort of air movement can cause them to jump around, a fan, A/C running in the other room, heavy breathing can all be a factor. They also need to be on a solid surface like a kitchen or bathroom counter. If the batteries are old could also be a problem.

 

They are designed to weigh in even increments of 1mg. If the dose you put on the scale weighs 1.5mg it confuses the scale and the reading will jump all over the place.  Which is an indication that you need to adjust the dose a tiny bit.  I have found it best to crush the tablets into a fine powder and weigh that instead of trying to cut little bits off of the tablet. Also don't forget to put the calibration weight into the pan and press 'tare" then leave the weight in the pan while making your measurements.

[MNgal1960]

Am getting some relief from holding. Getting some windows. Thank God.

 

Thanks, Brassmonkey for the tips about the scale. Need to cut a bunch more tablets tomorrow. Will certainly keep all those ideas in mind! I don't think I ought to try crushing. My manual dexterity is not that great and I would probably end up with powder all over the place. So will try to cut and be careful of drafts and such. I do always put the scale on the same place on the kitchen counter. I learned pretty quickly that the table was too wobbly. And I did also figure out that the dishwasher needed to be off and closed! My scale has a little pan to put on it and tare it, which I always do. I don't add a weight, though. It would take up most of the little pan. Hope that made sense.

 

With that, good night. I took my Q and am getting very fuzzy.

[MNgal1960]

Had several more days in hell but am seeing some improvement. Still holding everything. At least I hope so. I am wondering if somehow I am messing up my meds.

[MNgal1960]

Finally seeing some symptom relief and have used all but one of my last batch of cut tablets. I decided I am SICK TO DEATH of cutting tablet and am trying liquefying, just suspending in water and shaking like crazy. This should also allow me to make smaller cuts than my scale will allow. Darn tablet, weighing only 100mg or so, is 25% medication so every cut is quite a chunk. Really hoping something like a micro-taper (is that the right term?) will make the symptoms less. Not tapering now, though. Since I liquefied, I have felt soooooo tired and very anxious. And yet my sleep at night is worse. Seems like I may have upset the apple cart somehow.

[brassmonkey]

Switching from tablet to liquid counts as a dose change event and requires a proper hold period for things to stabilize.  Give it a few weeks and things should be back to normal.  "micro-taper" is the correct term and can be a very good way to go.  Combining a micro-taper with a Brassmonkey Slide should really reduce the symptoms.  Might be worth a try.

[MNgal1960]

Thanks. Holding and wondering what a Brassmonkey slide is.

[brassmonkey]

The Brssmonkey Slide is the latest dance move, it's just a jump to the left.  OOps that's the Time Warp.

 

It's a way to minimize WD symptoms by taking a series of small cuts in succession and then waiting for the combined effects to subside, instead of taking a larger drop all at once. The original plan I came up with was dropping 2.5% a week for four weeks and then holding an additional 2 weeks. This gives a total reduction of 10% every 6 weeks. It can be done with any size drops.  There are several people here doing 1.25% a week for four weeks and then a 2 week hold for a total of 5% every 6 weeks. There are others doing different combinations. The purpose is to make the symptoms gentler by taking smaller drops but still progress at a higher total percentage rate.  I've used it my entire taper with great results and the others report doing well too.

[MNgal1960]

Oh, I see. That makes so much sense.

 

So, for example, I would say a 10%/month rate is safe and I would divided it into smaller cuts and cut 1/30th of that every day for a week or two, and then I would hold for awhile, and then I would start up again with the same pace, not speeding up to try to catch up. Doing small cuts and adding holds minimizes symptoms? I sure hope so because I think I am going to lose my mind from these neuropathy flares.

 

On the bright side, I had a real, actual injury (and needed stitches) and was like, oh this is so cool, a real, actual pain from a real injury that will heal right up. I think the ER doc thought I was nuts.

[ChessieCat]

A real injury that will heal.  Woohoo.  That made me laugh.  I felt a bit like that when I had a cold recently.  Even though I was really sick for a couple of days and I did feel a bit miserable, after withdrawal symptoms it was no big deal.

[MNgal1960]

Yup, Cat. Wish this crushing depression would heal like my ankle. Going to try to get a bit lower on the Q and then hold. Maybe it will lift?

 

But, tell me, isn't being isolated depressing? This w/d has caused me to become 99% isolated and the longer it goes on the more depressed I get. Lately I've been wondering how I will get through the winter, or if I will.

[MNgal1960]

I am now liquefying my Seroquel and think I am doing it correctly. I make a small cut once/week. The neuropathy continues to hit me in wave and is sometimes unbearable. I can only lie in bed and try not to scream. Then it subsides to only awful and then to almost not there and then goes up and down again.

 

But, with each cut, my sleep did not change until this last one. It was a week ago and my sleep has been poor. I wake around 3 or 4AM and toss and turn the rest of the night. Poor, however, is better than what I was getting before the Q, which was so little I could not function to even eat and lost 20 pounds.

 

I wonder if I should just hold at this level and see if my sleep returns, or if I have cut too fast and should backstep. Also, how long can I wait and still backstep if I need to? I can't live with this little sleep.

 

BTW, I am still trying to get to the bottom of why my sleep stopped in the first place. I live in an area with a shortage of any kind of mental health professionals so haven't been able to find a competent therapist to help me with this.

[MNgal1960]

Been liquefying and tapering the Q. Depression is still there but not as crushing. Neuropathy has been unbearable. Comes in waves so bad that they make me want to shoot myself. Am not going to cut the Q his weekend like I usually do. Am still isolated and nearly housebound from withdrawal symptoms being so bad. All my health problems started shortly after the move to a new area so I never had the chance to make real friends here. Casual friends disappear quickly when you become ill. I think I am becoming agoraphobic from being stuck indoors and cut off from friends and family. (They are all hundreds of miles away.)

 

My doctor keeps telling that when the nerve pain is really bad, I should double my gabapentin so I can sleep. I haven't done that in a long time because I am afraid of what might happen. Might I get some kind of weird symptoms from occasional extra doses? Might it mess up my tapers?