Chris14: My battle against Efexor

[KarenB]

Hey Chris,

 

I think SG has the right idea in at least giving the drug a chance, ie 4-7 days, to reach a steady state.  When people make quick changes, they usually end up in a worse place.  So even though 'doing nothing' is really hard, I encourage you to sit tight for a bit longer and see what happens. 

 

Keep checking in to let us know what's happening,

Karen

[JanCarol]

Hey Chris - 

 

I know it seems strange that those tiny balls are so powerful, but they are!

 

When you were first given your prescription, your doctor might have told you that it takes 1-2 weeks before the drug is effective.  This has to do with restructuring your brain.

 

Be patient, hold, and hold some more.  Your original plan was to hold the 1 mg for 2 weeks.  That is a good plan, and the mods here seem to agree that you need to hold on.

 

While you are waiting, you can learn about Non Drug Techniques for Coping with Emotional Symptoms  (they work for physical symptoms, too)

 

as well as better learning to understand how withdrawal works:

 

These are cartoons:  Withdrawal Dialogues - cartoons to encourage you

and this is a video which many have found helpful:  Healing from Antidepressants - Patterns of Recovery (by Toxic Antidepressants)

 

Hang in there!  Patience is your best asset right now.  It does get better.

[mammaP]

Is this headache a new symptom Chris? 

[Altostrata]

Hello, Chris.

 

Keep the excess beads in a closed, tinted container -- they may be affected by light and heat. Mark the container with the dosage of the original prescription and its date of expiration. You will be able to use these beads up as time goes on.

 

Do not chew the beads or suck on them, they need to go down into your stomach with their coats on. You can take them in applesauce if you wish.

 

If you don't feel comfortable taking the beads alone, you can purchase empty gelatin capsules (get the largest size available), transfer your dose into an empty capsule, and take that. There is no particular magic in the external Efexor capsule.

[Chris14]

Firstly, thanks to everyone for their responses. You're all probably right in that i should just try the 1mg dosage for at least 1-2 weeks and see where that takes me. I guess i was just frreaking out a little because the first day was such a relief, then to be followed by 2 days which were not that good. Yesterday went well though, I went to a festival with some friends and everything felt good:) 

 

Guess I just really want everything to be steady again, and soon. Patience never was one of my strong sides. I'm always stuck with this idea that the outside world does not wait for me to be fully healed, the world just goes on. I'm young, ambitious and there's so much I want to do.. makes it hard to be patient when that's probably the way to go right now. 

 

The headache is a new symptom, yes. I've never had it before.. it is however a known side-effect of the methylphenidate i'm also taking on a daily basis. Anyway, no headaches yesterday and so far no headaches today.. hope it stays that way;)

 

As for the capsules: i've already ordered them a couple of days ago, they should arrive soon (small size though). I'll also get a closed, tinted container to store the excess beads. 

 

I've watched the video, it was quite helpful, thanks

 

Thanks again for all your responses, i'll try to be patient and keep you guys updated

[mammaP]

Glad you had a good time at the festival Chris.  Patience is key here and hard for most of us, it's easy to think we are feeling a bit better so we can charge on ahead but it becomes a three steps forward and 2 steps back situation! You will get there, as you said you are young, with all your life ahead of you. Have patience now and you will have that life you are wanting sooner rather than later.

[JanCarol]

Hey Chris - this video shows the way healing works - like a Rubik's cube (I know I posted it before, but it's good!)

 

Healing from Antidepressants: Patterns of Recovery (Toxic Antidepressants)

 

Or as my Tai Chi Grandmaster used to say:  In order to go left, you must first go right.  (Prepare to step, by shifting your weight) - sometimes it seems like we are going "backwards," but when you get symptoms, it is a sign that a system is down for repair.

 

Repairing a brain is not a simple, straightforward thing.   Imagine very complicated road works with about 25 intersections coming together.  This week, the traffic lights are shut down, and you need a cop to manage the intersection.  When that is repaired, well, maybe they need to re-work the shoulders, so they can divert traffic onto them for later when the lanes are being repaired.  Then there's the repairing of the lanes - it doesn't all happen at once.  Sometimes they need to rip up the old tarmac, change all the drainage routes, relocate the services for electricity and plumbing, get down to the foundation, and re-grade it, lay new gravel, then steel rebar, pouring concrete foundation, then laying the asphalt.  Sometimes you will go for 5 months, and the road is still closed, but you can't see what they are doing to it!  Each phase requires time to set and dry.  Then you can paint the lines on it, and go to another part of the intersection - perhaps one of the other incoming roads needs the same treatment.  Perhaps there are exit ramps and roundabouts and flyover lanes that need repair.  Each of which takes time.

 

Now imagine the millions of networks in your brain healing - they don't just, "heal" and be done.  It's a construction process:  Road works for the brain. 

 

Just my way of saying, be patient with yourself.  It might be the tarmac this week - but the lines aren't on the road and you're disoriented.  Maybe the signals are crossed at the intersections, or the signs are removed or there are detours.  Be gentle with yourself, be patient with yourself.  It's a complex process, and the gentler you are, the more easily you will heal.  It does no good to shake your fist and yell at the construction guys while they are doing their work!  So just wave (lol, wave!) at the worker, declare to yourself, "This is yet another symptom of withdrawal," and drive carefully past the obstacle.

 

At some point you might wish to address the stimulant, methylphenidate.  Please add this to your signature, it is a psych drug, and can affect your recovery.  Now, is of course, the time to get stable, but after you feel better, you might want to tackle that one before tapering any more effexor.

 

You are young, you can afford to be patient.  

[Chris14]

Hey guys!

 

It's been a truly busy week for me, hence i was not able to post an update. The last 4 days were quite on and off for me, sometimes a good period, quickly followed by pressure on my chest and heavy breathing. The days before that, though, were great. I felt really good and positive and really had an urge to go out, do stuff with friends and have fun (which i did). I've stuck with the 1 mg for 15 days now and I do think there's some improvement going on. Just hoping the good vibes will come back and stay a little longer this time! 

 

As for the Methylphenidate, it could indeed be a good idea to start thinking about going off them once i've stabilized a bit. 

 

I hope everyone here is doing okay, and i'll keep you guys posted

[SquirrellyGirl]

Wow, Chris, that is such great news!!  You're probably feeling a bit off again due to doing too much, which is a temptation when feeling better :-)

 

Always keep in mind that you must be gentle with yourself through this process, that stress can bring up withdrawal which always seems to be lurking under the surface.  Lots of self-care and going easy on yourself.

 

I hope it just gets better and better for you!  Thank you for the update, as we always need reports on the good turn of events!

 

SG

[Chris14]

Yes i had thought of that:) Guess i'll just have to get used to it though.. too busy at the moment with school, work and so on. Whenever i can i'll try to take it easy!

 

Hope you're doing good aswell

[AliG]

Chris.      It's good to hear that you are feeling a little better.  It would be a good idea to keep notes on your symptoms , during this time of reinstatement. When you can, would you mind updating your signature with this 1 mg RI.  It will help everyone here to see at a glance, without having to search back through your thread to see what is current. Please add methylphenidate, as well.

 

Please put your withdrawal history in your signature

 

Rate symptoms daily to track patterns and progress

 

I agree with SG. Take it easy.

Ali

[Chris14]

So, 3 weeks down the line and another update. I'm still getting mixed feelings about the 1 mg reinstatement. My social anxiety, which was completely gone while taking the 37,5 mg daily, is still making my life hard. I was hoping it would be gone by now as it really holds me back at times. Will it ever disappear with the 1mg dosage or should i perhaps think about taking a little more? 

 

Greetings, Chris

[SquirrellyGirl]

It is entirely up to you, Chris, but if you feel like the reinstatement just wasn't enough, that your symptom level is still too uncomfortable, you could try adding another 1 mg.  Though we often suggest giving a reinstatement months to work, it is also about whether your symptoms are tolerable ENOUGH for YOU.  You are the one in the situation living it.  

 

Have you visited this link?  Non-drug techniques to cope with emotional symptoms

 

Many of us ended up on these meds because of emotional difficulties, and the drugs may have helped, but didn't actually cure anything, so we still need to address those issues and do the work eventually.  That link provides lots of good info for doing just that, whether it is CBT, meditation, etc.

 

I hope that helps!

SG

[Chris14]

Thanks for your reaction SG, and sorry for my very late reply. A quick update for everyone interested: 10 days ago, i wrote that i wasn't satisfied with my reinstatement up until then, and was really thinking about adding another mg. The next day, i thought about adding the 1mg, but instead i decided to try out the current dosage for at least one more day. Since then, i have not looked back.. i've been feeling really good for the past 8-9 days or so, my anxiety issues have not returned and all in all, i'm feeling really good!

 

Now, i know there's always the possibility that it won't be as good in maybe a few days, or weeks. But i've really come to realise that it's all about taking two steps forward, and then maybe one step back again. There were also a couple of moments during those days that I came into a situation that would have made me feel the anxiety almost certainly. Instead i chose to accept it, and not think about it anymore. It has worked pretty good  so far:) 

 

So, all in all, it's been a succesfull couple of days for me and i'm looking forward to the days to come

 

Hope everyone here is doing well!

 

Greetings, Chris

[SquirrellyGirl]

Fantastic news, Chris!  Thanks for updating us!  Hopefully this is stabilization, but you'll want to hang out at this dose for a couple of months to really let your system get caught up.  If there's more adjusting to be done, you may have windows and waves, but know the waves will pass. 

 

Enjoy feeling better!  Once you've gotten good and stable, you can resume tapering off the 1 mg.  

 

SG

[Chris14]

Hey guys, new update: Yesterday i've decided to go ahead and take 2 mg instead of 1. After my last update everything quickly went downhill again and i was getting fed up with my feelings getting shaked around.. Good.. bad.. good.. bad. It almost got so bad that I just wanted to take the 37,5 mg and never think about quitting again. Right now i've decided to go with the 2 mg for a time (It's still a really low dosage right?) and get some professional help from a psychologist to help me get through the bad patches. I hope i've made the right decision by taking 2 mg..

 

Greetings,

 

Chris

[KarenB]

Let us know how it goes - sometimes we only know by trying something.  You can note your symptoms and their severity each day, and see what happens over the next week or so.  You could also have a look at Non-Drug Techniques to cope with Emotional Symptoms and add to your own nest of tools to cope with things - the more tools you have the better!

 

I have my fingers crossed for you ,

Karen

[Chris14]

I'll make sure to post weekly updates:) I'ts been a crazy couple of weeks.. school is coming at its end meaning i have to finish more reports and assignments than humanly possible lol.. right now i need to wait until the psychologisch contacts me. I do have to say that this is my last option.. if this doesn't work i dont know what will 

[Chris14]

Could use with some help.. ever since going from 1mg to 2mg it feels like things have been getting worse.. im more socially awkward than ever before, feeling more tired and i'm basically driving myself crazy with these thoughts.. could that be related to going from 1 to 2? I'm not ruling out the possibility that i'm doing this all by myself.. thinking things are not going well too much until they actually aren't anymore. Hope everyone here is okay, i sincerely do

[SquirrellyGirl]

Chris, I'm sorry it isn't going well for you :-)

 

Just to review, when you reinstated the 2nd mg, did you feel worse right away?  On May 24 you wrote:

 

http://survivingantidepressants.org/index.php?/topic/11864-chris14-my-battle-against-efexor/?p=227844

 

I think you are experiencing windows and waves. Could you go over your symptom pattern?  How is your sleep?  Do your symptoms improve at all throughout the day?

 

With school wrapping up you are under stress which could be bringing the withdrawal on stronger.  When are you done?  Some rest and self-care are in order.

 

I've been revisiting mindfulness.  I had gotten it in my head that it required larger time commitments and I just wasn't getting around to it.  Then, cymbaltawithdrawal5600 posted this youtube video yesterday and it got me revved up to try again, truly just focusing on the sensation of the breath, in and out, and if the monkey mind starts up, not a failure, just nudge your focus back to the breath.  I think this could really be helpful, an excellent self-care tool:  https://www.youtube.com/embed/Dt5Qv9tUObI.  This is a long video but Dan Harris is engaging, so watch it if only for distraction purposes :-)

 

So, let us know a little more about what you were experiencing before the up-dose to 2 mg and what happened after.  That will help us determine the next step.

 

SG

[Chris14]

Hmm.. i did not feel worse straight away I think. the last couple of days before i switched from 1 to 2mg were quite frankly, terrible. After switching my moodswings (waves and windows?) however did increase to several times a day, instead of the previous couple of days good, couple of days bad. 

 

When it's bad: I feel tired, only want to lay in bed, can't focus anymore, I mix up things i want to say into weird sentences and basically just become a socially awkward person.

When it's good: I feel normal, I tell myself i'll get through this no matter what it takes, i'm singing and just feel good. 

 

Regarding my sleep: It depends a bit on how tired I am, but generally speaking i've been having trouble sleeping for the past 12 years or so. Basically i just watch Netflix on my phone in bed to distract me until i get so tired i fall asleep. 

 

The last days when i was on the 1mg I was going through a bad period, and did something i should not have done: drinking. I like to drink, and when i feel good everything is fine. If i'm having a bad patch however everything is okay until i get home and i'm alone. So no more drinking for now. 

 

I've been taking the 2mg dosage for 6 days now, and today is the first day i'm feeling good from the moment i woke up (2 hours ago). I think the best course of action right now is to give myself some more time to adjust to the new dosage, and hope i'll get stabile. 

 

Side note: during the 2,5 years i was on the 37,5 mg dosage, I drank at least 2 days a week and never felt a bad reaction towards it. 

 

Hope i'm giving a clear picture here, sometimes my mind wanders off and after posting something i realize it's a bit of a blurry story, especially in English.

 

Greetings, 

 

Chris

[AliG]

 Hi Chris.

 

I've been taking the 2mg dosage for 6 days now, and today is the first day i'm feeling good from the moment i woke up (2 hours ago). I think the best course of action right now is to give myself some more time to adjust to the new dosage, and hope i'll get stabile. 
 

 

This sounds positive. Please keep notes and let us know how you go over the next few days .

[Chris14]

another little update for anyone interested: It's been 3 days now that i've felt good. No feeling down, i have confidence again and am actually getting stuff done. Here's to hoping this lasts. Is there any way to ensure this feeling stays? For one i've found that i should not stare into the distance and let my thoughts go. I need to to be paying attention to what's happening around me. Any more tips that some of you found helpfull?

 

Once again, i really want to say i'm greatly appreciating everything you are all doing here! You guys have pulled me through at times, something i'll never forget:)

[KarenB]

One mistake I've made (often) is to be feeling so good and start to do more and more things till I get exhausted and then crash.  I still need to learn to find that happy pace in the middle somewhere.  So my tip is to look out for that . 

[Chris14]

So, after almost 2 months already of taking the 2mg dosage, im at another breaking point. While the windows have gotten a bit better, the waves also have gotten worse, today being the worst of them all. Besides that, my self-confidence is slowly decreasing because of all the side effects the stress is bringing (my eyes hurt, my ears are constantly throbbing, i've got stomach problems, headaches and just feel no energy at bad days). Now, i realise this is probably all part of the wave phenomena, but i'm having more and more trouble dealing with them.

 

There is so much stuff I need to do right now as ill be leaving on my own for 4 months to England at the beginning of October. I'm beginning to think this might not be the right time to continue tapering the Effexor and maybe should just reinstate my old dosage of 37,5 mg on which i thrived (had a good, happy life, full of energy, no stress and no anxiety). Then, when being fullly stable for like 6 months i can taper off the effexor in the right way, as advocated by this website (10% at a time) instead of quitting cold turkey for 3 months and reinstating 2 mg to help get me through it. 

 

I hope my writing has made some sense as im currently overwhelmed by a lot of thoughts. Also want to apologize for not giving an update sooner, I suck at being consistent when it comes to that.

 

Any tips, thoughts and personal experiences are welcome, thanks in advance.

 

Greetings, Chris

[KarenB]

I hear your frustration Chris.  Effexor is not easy to withdraw from. 

 

I don't recommend returning to 37.5mg.  One reason is that your body will have adapted somewhat to the lower dose, and suddenly giving it a higher dose could cause you even more problems.

 

The other reason is that each time we make changes, it affects our CNS.  So it is unlikely you will be fine at 37.5 just because you were last time. 

 

So that leaves two options:  Keep holding to allow further stabilisation to occur, or try a small up-dose to 3mg.  I'm also mindful of the fact that after you up-dosed to 2mg from 1mg you reported feeling worse.  Do you still think that was the case?  If so, I'd really be inclined to hold for longer. 

 

Are you taking  fish oil and magnesium?

[Chris14]

I'm at a loss basically. I will start taking the fish oil and magnesium, but i'm quite sure that won't heal everything the stress is affecting in my body. Overall i think the step up towards 2mg has helped at first, but slowly the stress has taken over and now i've reached a point where all of my symptoms that caused me to take the antidepressant in the first place have returned. 

 

I feel kind of trapped right now. Going back to 37.5 mg won't guarantee succes, but i also doubt upping the dosage to 3mg will help me get rid of all my troubles. 

[AliG]

Chris. It sounds like the windows & waves pattern to me .  It might be that you are going through a wave , and need to just keep going the distance as best you can. This can often change quite rapidly and if you keep alternating doses trying to keep up with the " undulating landscape " of withdrawal then it could possibly turn into a self defeating exercise in futility as well as being destabilizing at the end of the day, therefore making matters worse.

 

2 mg , while it doesn't sound much is still a fairly considerable dose and you've been on it since the 6th June from my calculations. It seems like you have been doing quite well on that dose until fairly recently.

 

This link can help to explain :

Why taper? Paper demonstrates importance of gradual change in plasma concentration

 

I would stay steady if I were you.  On reading back over your thread, you have had some windows even if they were brief . Try, if you can to think of those windows when in the midst of a wave and remember what it felt like at that time. In my mind they are a sign of rapid healing and I've always found that to be the case, but waves are healing in motion, too I think .Basically,we are always recovering in one way or the other. Have you read this?

Brain Remodelling

 

The fish oil and magnesium is highly recommended here and might surprise you in their efficacy . Please start low and work your way up in dose as most of us are sensitive and need to go so slow. They are both elegant in their simplicity and long term benefits. 

 

I hope it turns around for you very soon as I'm hoping it will . Stay as positive as you can as I have found that it can make all the difference at the various stages of this journey . I have found negative thinking can push me into a wave and keep me there for a while. It's a " push & pull " against the drugs but you have to do the work as well to come out the other side. It doesn't just effortlessly happen. Wouldn't it be lovely , if it did ? 

Wishing you well .

Ali

[Chris14]

Hi guys,

 

Its been a really long time since i've posted an update, so here we go.

 

During the summer, i managed to land a job where I installed solar panels onto people's roofs. This has been, without a doubt, the best 5 weeks since i decided to go off the Venlafaxine. I felt good about myself, was confident, could genuinely laugh again and made some good money I think, looking back at these weeks, the reason i thrived during this period is simple: I woke up daily at the same time, went to bed at a decent time and during the day I was so occcupied by my job that i didn't even had time to think badly about myself or become insecure.

 

At the moment, im back to how i was before: some days with insecurity, tiredness, insomnia and so on, and other days where i seem to get by, but never as good as it used to be during the summer. About a month ago i moved from The Netherlands to The United Kingdom on my own to study here for 4 months. Because of irregular university hours, my sleeping schedule (rhythm?) is just terrible again. I go to bed at 3am, wake up at 11 and just feel tired the rest of the day. I also have so much time to think at the moment that at times i'm driving myself crazy with insecure thoughts and they seem to worsen. 

 

I'm still on the 2mg dosage each day, and have thought about upping it, at times I even thought about just going back to the 37.5 mg dosage, but i know that's not the solution. Anyway, there's my update thus far, hope everyone here is doing alright and hanging in there:) 

 

Greets,

 

Chris

[peng]

A good, clear account for us all, Chris14.

 

I have always known this about being committed to having to go to work, mixing with others, forgetting your cares for a period, and feeling better.

I worked for 24 years in an office, sometimes outdoor inspection/driving job, kept the wolf from the door and supported my wife and three children whilst battling depression and taking (misguidedly?) prescribed tranx then antidepressants.

Was grim and despairing at times, but it is always worth letting other people know that getting out into this scary world with a mission to work, and to feel you are, say, constructing something, should be encouraging for others who feel endlessly trapped and confined in their mental prisons.

 

Try and get on a stable platform to get through your university life.  It can be better for you, with the guidance from the mods on here.

 

The amount of F......exor you are taking is small - I am tapering from 4 TIMES your high of 37.5mg!

Time and your age are on your side - you have every reason to be optimistic.

 

Best.

[Chris14]

Peng,

 

Thanks for your reply and encouraging words, they mean alot! 

Yesterday evening, before i went to sleep, i decided to (quite impulsively) take my dosage of 2mg before i went to sleep, rather than take it in the morning, as i have done for the last 6 months. When i was on the full dosage of 37,5 mg i always took the venlafaxine right before going to bed, and thought it would be more helpfull if i'd go back to this again. The reason for this was that sometimes when i take my dosage as i wake up, i already feel like it's too late, leading to me being down, tired and unfocused the rest of the day. 

 

It started out really well: i woke up feeling good straight away, i was happy and social until about 6pm, where suddenly the effects of the 2mg just stopped, suddenly leaving me in this terrible state of tiredness, feeling down and as if i'm about to cry. at the moment it's almost 10 pm here, and i'm unsure of what to do. continue with taking the dosage before i'll go to bed and hope the effects will last longer tomorrow, go back to my previous habit of taking it in the morning, or up the dosage to 3mg, take it in the morning and hope the additional mg will make me last the entire day?

 

I hope any of this makes sense to anyone as im unsure my ability to write something that's understandable is decent right now.

 

Greetings,

 

Chris

[Chris14]

This question is directed at anyone that could help with this btw, not just Peng ofcourse

[ChessieCat]

This is just my opinion.  It would probably be best to take it tonight and probably continue taking it at night.

[peng]

Good call, Chris14!

I am only a newbie.

[ChessieCat]

It may also be worth considering splitting your dose but I'd wait for the other mods' thoughts on that.

[Chris14]

Okay so for 3 days in a row now, everything is fine until about 6-7 pm. At this moment I reach a state of tiredness, combined with some sort of mindfog and a headache. And thoughts on how to counter this? It's really awkward if I'm hanging out with people the entire day and suddenly my whole mood changes..

 

I do feel that taking the dosage at night is better than taking it at irregular hours in the morning.. maybe add one mg? Or split the dosage as ChessieCat suggested? Any suggestions would be really helpful!