dowdaller: Hello

[dowdaller]

That's great that you're doing a mindfulness class. I'm doing one online and am finding it to be quite helpful.

 

For those of us who came off benzodiazepines (such as Xanax), alcohol can be extremely problematic because it hits the GABA receptors, just like a benzo. So it may be quite awhile before you're able to handle alcohol. I had to give it up in my twenties. If only I'd known that my prescription drugs were so much worse for my brain. 

 

I'll be interested in how you do with your mindfulness class. The research on mindfulness is reason for hope for us. This is a video that was linked in my online class and it's really amazing what mindfulness can do:

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_8-6XzURntE&list=PLbiVpU59JkVbFtkacXoByNjHJgGc4AryM&index=1

 

Sending healing vibes your way. 

 

Thanks shep , I attended a class last year, during my taper which really helped a lot, my doctor told to start doing the mindfulness, he was very progressive in that way, the guy thats was doing the class last night was more into the more spiritual side, my doc recommended jon kabat zinn to me, and explained how it works to me from a scientific background. I have been able to handle small amounts of alcohol up till now, but it appears that binges are out of the question for me. Good vibes to you too, thanks for your input.

[dowdaller]

The weekend went well for me some anxiety nothing major my sleep was okay. I had a good day Sunday just a normal day. Monday was okay, I struggled on Tuesday yesterday was okay, my sleep has deteriorated in the past 3 weeks, it started off with me getting a bad cold, and I have been getting about 6 hours a night before this I was getting at least 7.

 

My mood has been really low today, my wife is working till late in the evenings.I am feeling pretty low at work and dont really feel like talking to my colleagues, but I am pushing myself to make the effort. It is the autumn here at the minute, and I have struggled in September in the past. 

I just feel tired today and my energy is also low, I am just hanging in, Its my little girls birthday the weekend we are having a bouncy castle. I am just determined to plod forward, its all I can do, doesn't make it any easier. 

[Shep]

Hi, dowdaller.  I'm sorry you're having such a low time right now. 

 

Quick question - did you take any medication for your cold? Sometimes even OTC meds can affect us profoundly during withdrawal and well into recovery. Drugs that affect histamine can be especially troubling for some of us. And this can affect sleep and mood. 

 

I had to stop using any kinds of OTC meds for colds and instead use China Oel, which is a very potent peppermint oil, for congestion and I use sick leave more than I used to for colds and just allow myself to rest. I don't know if that's an option for you, but thought I'd mention it for in the future.

 

Sending healing vibes your way. I hope you have a good weekend and your little girl enjoys that bouncy castle. It sounds like you have a lot to look forward to after you heal. 

[dowdaller]

Shep, I am in a bit of a pickle right now I only slept for 2and half hours. I have people coming to the house and I am basically putting on a brave face. The only things I took for the cold was parcertimol codiene based tabs. I started taking a pro biotic about 1 month and that also may have triggered this horrible crap. Or maybe the booze I drank two weeks. Whatever it was my sleep is shot to s#*t. And I am in survival mode, again.

[Shep]

Codeine could definitely put you into a wave or like you say, it could be the combination of the alcohol that already had weakened your CNS. 

 

But waves are temporary, so try to be as gentle on yourself as possible this weekend. It's hard when you have to wear the brave face and put out that extra energy that you really don't have to spare right now.

 

Embrace your mindfulness training, watch your daughter and her friends play, knowing that over the coming months, healing will happen again, the wave will end, and life will be good again. 

[dowdaller]

Thanks shep for your kind and wise words. I took Panasonic extra yea it possibly mixed with the drink has knocked me for 6, but as you say just put on the brave face and get on with it, I have been suppringly okay considering I slept very little. Thank again peace and love to you too

[peng]

Panasonic extra?

We are getting more Irish comedians on the telly over here, so I like that one! - Did you just make it up deliberately or -  was it an accident?

 

Kindof like Les Dawson's joke about the lady who was in hospital having had an operation she called a "hysterical rectum".

 

Best wishes, man.

[dowdaller]

Stupid autocorect supposed to be panadol, i suppose if you didnt laugh you would cry, ;-) just in the shop gettin my rambo survival kit brocoli kale garlic lemons bannas oranges, going to make a shake, and i will cut down on the caffeine for a while, my sleep is all over the shop.

[dowdaller]

I think I have figured out what happened my sleep. I should have thought of it already, I had been suffering with a cold/ chest infection, for about 3 weeks. Me being stupid was avoiding taking meds as much as possible, but a few times i took solphadeine panadol etc before I went to bed. So what I think has happened is that my system is still craving the paracetimol/codeine, i have a history of benzo an sleeping tabs in the past. My problem was not being able to stay asleep while in the past I struggled to go asleep.

[scallywag]

Interesting -- let us know your conclusions as you test your hypothesis.

[dowdaller]

I slept 4 hrs last night it was an improvment on 2,.i went for a swim.today i swam 10 lengths of 25 meter pool and I went to the sauna and steam room. So hopefully it might help. Time will tell. I also had the green smoothie ali was talking about. So I am hoping to stabilise again.

[AliG]

Dowdaller. An improvement in sleep is a good sign. Just be careful not to overdo it in the exercise department. I made that mistake in the beginning and pushed too hard - going to the gym , even with very little or no sleep and I ended up eventually " falling in a heap". It  was too much. 

 

It's hard to find that balance but as you become more experienced in " listening to your body" , it should become easier in time. 

[dowdaller]

I didnt sleep a wink last night. Maybe 2 hours tops. I did a few stupid things before going to bed I ate chocalate and smoked a cigarette. I then was tossing and turning for an hour then i woke up at about 3:30 about 2hours latter and was unable to sleep. So I am up now writing this waiting to go to work. This has been my worst bout of insomia in about 3 years. But my mood is okay. I am just trying to stick to the programme of going to work and distracting myself during the.day. The childs party went well and my mood was good. And I was doing some volunteer work yesterday, so apart my sleep issues. I am doing relatively okay.

[dowdaller]

The week went okay, I tidied up my "sleep hygiene" Monday night I went to a mindfulness class, I sat on a very comfortable seat and slept through the majority of the class. I slept that night reasonably well about five hours, tuesday something similar. I was reading on pages for insomnia and they recommended about 30 mins of cardio during the day to  encourage sleep, On Wednesday night I slept for nearly 7 hours. So yesterday I did some light weight training and swam a few lengths of the pool last night. And I was very tired about an hour before my bed time. I had a cigarette and a protein shake next thing I was wide awake , I tried mindfulness but fell asleep. So I went up to bed tossed and turned for about 30 mins and then slept for about 3 hours. Then I dozed for about 2 hours.  

So what I have learned no cigarettes after 9:30pm, no phone after that either. The day I did the cardio was the night I slept the best.My nervous system seems very sensitive cigarettes have never kept me up before. So at the moment I am just trying to establish a good sleep routine, thanks for all the support from the members last weekend.

[DaddyCee]

Hi Dowdaller.

 

What kind of protein shake are you taking? There could be an ingredient in it, which is active to your system and could be contributing to your current problems. I have found that certain foods have made me highly sensitive since coming off from Escitalopram. It can also depend on how I am feeling psychologically on that day as to the severity of the reaction. It is all kind of strange but is suppose that is the nature of withdrawal and protracted withdrawal.

 

Wishing you the best,

 

DC.

[dowdaller]

Hi Dowdaller.

 

What kind of protein shake are you taking? There could be an ingredient in it, which is active to your system and could be contributing to your current problems. I have found that certain foods have made me highly sensitive since coming off from Escitalopram. It can also depend on how I am feeling psychologically on that day as to the severity of the reaction. It is all kind of strange but is suppose that is the nature of withdrawal and protracted withdrawal.

 

Wishing you the best,

 

DC.

 

Thanks DC for the reply its a forever ultra soya based protein shake, I want to eat something that fills me so I dont wake up hungry but I dont want something that keeps me up all night. I just thought my sleep was stabilising and another little set back, but I suppose thats the nature of the game we are all playing. Thanks for your input.

[DaddyCee]

Sounds all very natural, so not like the chemical based ones that you find in sports or health food stores.

 

I found eating half a banana before bed and then the other half when I woke to help with Cortisol issues.  I went approx. 1 - 2 months with sleep issues and it was hell on earth, so I can completely sympathise with you current situation.

[dowdaller]

I have had a few days that weren't as bad my sleep returned to some extent when | began trying to do about 30 mins jogging per day, but as expected my ocd started to ramp up, I am still trying to find he balance between doing enough exercise to sleep without over doing it, which is difficult, I didnt sleep well last night , I was trying to sort out some money issues at work and I have an important meeting today. I went to my mindfulness class which went okay, so all in all there hasn't been much improvement but I am still trying to stick to my routine for my wife and kids, I am going to keep going on this path I have chosen, for them and myself its not easy but it is not impossible either.

[Shep]

Hi, dowdaller. 

 

I'm dealing with trying to get back into exercise, too, but finding cardio can be difficult. Are you able to walk instead of run? Getting 30 minutes of walking (perhaps even a power walk) outside every day might be enough to help without stressing your CNS.

 

I have a staff meeting at work today, so I do understand the stress involved with working during this illness.

 

Glad you're continuing the mindfulness class. I didn't get immediate results with mindfulness, but it's a process that has been very important in my recovery, and I know I wouldn't be nearly as functional without it. 

 

Sending healing vibes your way. 

[dowdaller]

Hi, dowdaller. 

 

I'm dealing with trying to get back into exercise, too, but finding cardio can be difficult. Are you able to walk instead of run? Getting 30 minutes of walking (perhaps even a power walk) outside every day might be enough to help without stressing your CNS.

 

I have a staff meeting at work today, so I do understand the stress involved with working during this illness.

 

Glad you're continuing the mindfulness class. I didn't get immediate results with mindfulness, but it's a process that has been very important in my recovery, and I know I wouldn't be nearly as functional without it. 

 

Sending healing vibes your way. 

 

Yes I am going for a walk beside the sea at lunch time may upload a pic latter for my profile. Yes the mindfulness it usually gets me to sleep, I slept for about 4 hours, I am cutting down on my caffeine I use to drink about 10 cups a day and maybe a few cups of coffee thrown in, So i am trying to cut back on that gradually because I known quitting cold turkey is not a great idea. Irish people drink lots of tea, so apart from that shep I am eating these garlic laced green smoothies which make me reek, I also heard from a pal that magnesium and zinc before bed may help, I will let you know, research suggests that the cardio may take a month before it effects my insomnia. So fingers crossed.

[scallywag]

I am tapering caffeinated coffee.  I mix up a blend of regular and decaffeinated, about 4 days worth of 80% regular. Then mix up some at 60% regular, then 40%. I'll be making the 20% for tomorrow and the rest of the week. Tapering caffeine this way is easier to do, of course, when the coffee is brewed at home.  I haven't thought about how I'd do it buying from a coffee shop.

 

Last night I noticed feeling sleepy as if someone flipped a switch at 22:20. At 22:19 I was fine, one minute later I was struggling to keep my eyes open. I hope your coffee reduction works as well.

[dowdaller]

I am tapering caffeinated coffee.  I mix up a blend of regular and decaffeinated, about 4 days worth of 80% regular. Then mix up some at 60% regular, then 40%. I'll be making the 20% for tomorrow and the rest of the week. Tapering caffeine this way is easier to do, of course, when the coffee is brewed at home.  I haven't thought about how I'd do it buying from a coffee shop.

 

Last night I noticed feeling sleepy as if someone flipped a switch at 22:20. At 22:19 I was fine, one minute later I was struggling to keep my eyes open. I hope your coffee reduction works as well.

Hope so scally going from regular sleep to irregular sleep makes things a lot harder, hoping that all the little things will add up and make the difference.

[herewego]

I have read your thread previously but not recently so hopefully I am not repeating anyone else, but have you tried melatonin for sleep? It will only help you fall asleep though, it doesn't help with early morning wakening. There is a thread on melatonin on this site. They recommend taking a much smaller amount then what you buy at the store. If you can find 1 mg pills, quarter them. I can only find 2 mg pills so I cut them in 1/8ths. Taking too much melatonin can have the opposite effect. Your body only makes .15 mg of melatonin, so taking .25 mg is much closer to what your body is used to. Here they recommend you take the melatonin at night fall. I take it about an hour before I want to sleep and that seems to work but I have read the effect can wear off so I only take it for 3 - 5 days when I hit a rough patch. Hope you sleep better soon.

[dowdaller]

I have read your thread previously but not recently so hopefully I am not repeating anyone else, but have you tried melatonin for sleep? It will only help you fall asleep though, it doesn't help with early morning wakening. There is a thread on melatonin on this site. They recommend taking a much smaller amount then what you buy at the store. If you can find 1 mg pills, quarter them. I can only find 2 mg pills so I cut them in 1/8ths. Taking too much melatonin can have the opposite effect. Your body only makes .15 mg of melatonin, so taking .25 mg is much closer to what your body is used to. Here they recommend you take the melatonin at night fall. I take it about an hour before I want to sleep and that seems to work but I have read the effect can wear off so I only take it for 3 - 5 days when I hit a rough patch. Hope you sleep better soon.

 

Thanks for the input , I can only get melatonin of my doctor on prescription, and I dont really want to go back to my doc I have 5htp at home I dont know if I should use it or not.

[scallywag]

We don't encourage the use of 5-HTP.  I hope you can find a combination of sleep-assisting tactics that work for you and that don't include 5-HTP or L-tryptophan.

5-HTP (5-Hydoxytryptophan) and L-tryptophan

[dowdaller]

We don't encourage the use of 5-HTP.  I hope you can find a combination of sleep-assisting tactics that work for you and that don't include 5-HTP or L-tryptophan.

 

5-HTP (5-Hydoxytryptophan) and L-tryptophan

Will do scally I am probably looking for a quick fix, which doesnt exist , thanks for the link, I am taking rhodiolia, is there a thread on this supplement?

[scallywag]

A google search using these search terms "survivingantidepressants" "rhodiola"

 

https://www.google.ca/?gfe_rd=cr&ei=Ihj1V4PjIcXL8Af8wa3oDQ#q=survivingantidepressants+rhodiola

[herewego]

 

I have read your thread previously but not recently so hopefully I am not repeating anyone else, but have you tried melatonin for sleep? It will only help you fall asleep though, it doesn't help with early morning wakening. There is a thread on melatonin on this site. They recommend taking a much smaller amount then what you buy at the store. If you can find 1 mg pills, quarter them. I can only find 2 mg pills so I cut them in 1/8ths. Taking too much melatonin can have the opposite effect. Your body only makes .15 mg of melatonin, so taking .25 mg is much closer to what your body is used to. Here they recommend you take the melatonin at night fall. I take it about an hour before I want to sleep and that seems to work but I have read the effect can wear off so I only take it for 3 - 5 days when I hit a rough patch. Hope you sleep better soon.

 

Thanks for the input , I can only get melatonin of my doctor on prescription, and I dont really want to go back to my doc I have 5htp at home I dont know if I should use it or not.

 

Perhaps the next time you have to go in to see your doctor you could try to remember to ask for a prescription for say 1 mg melatonin and get a pill cutter. It's nice to have in your back pocket for when you start having a hard time falling asleep. Just knowing I have melatonin, even when I don't take it, helps me relax. Knowing there are options that work for me is helpful. Hopefully it will be helpful for you too.

[dowdaller]

I have been getting between 6 and 7 hours sleep per night since about a week ago, and I even had a window yesterday. I have been doing about 30 mins jogging most days, I find it hard to motivate myself to do it, but once its done my mood lifts, the dread is still there most mornings and sometimes the nausea, but all in all I have coped okay. I try to get into the swimming pool and jacuzzi in the evening because it makes going to sleep a lot easier. I am still on the fish oils, wheat grass I bought off a farmer which has boosted my energy but also my anxiety.

So all in all I am in better place than a week ago, so again the learning part is all things pass.

[AliG]

DD.    6 - 7 hrs sleep is awesome.  You are doing well     I hope it continues for you.

Wheat grass is strong. You might want to add a bit slowly to your juice or even give it up for now if it causes anxiety.

Keep up the good work .

Ali

[herewego]

Dowdaller,

That is great to hear your sleep has been good and that you have had a window. It is encouraging to hear more successful stories of people that were once on the drug I am on - it can be done!

[dowdaller]

DD.    6 - 7 hrs sleep is awesome.  You are doing well     I hope it continues for you.

Wheat grass is strong. You might want to add a bit slowly to your juice or even give it up for now if it causes anxiety.

Keep up the good work .

Ali

 

Thanks Ali you are legend hope you are well, My sleep has returned my mood has still remained low, i feel quiet anxious at work I dont stay still for long. But I am doing okay, still taking those garlic smoothies, people are still giving me a wide berth due to the smell of garlic from me, just putting in the days, not as bad when you are sleeping. 

I am still trying to do 30 mins of cv exercise per day followed by sauna, steam room and Jacuzzi. And it has worked for me for the last number of weeks.

 

Dowdaller,

That is great to hear your sleep has been good and that you have had a window. It is encouraging to hear more successful stories of people that were once on the drug I am on - it can be done!

 

No doubt HWG it can be done, but it is hard as hell. Just take the taper slow not like me, and just take one day at a time.

 

I am taking evening primrose, fish oils, maca, udos oil, vit c and vit b. magnesium and zinc

[Nicki1722]

Yes I need to hear some positives. I'm still struggling!

[Shep]

i feel quiet anxious at work I dont stay still for long. 

 

 

 

I am taking evening primrose, fish oils, maca, udos oil, vit c and vit b. magnesium and zinc

 

 

 

Hi, dowdaller. 

 

You are doing extremely well considering your polydrugging background. Being able to work through this shows you are doing so many things right.

 

I'm wondering if your supplements may be contributing to the anxiety you're experiencing at work?  B vitamins can ramp up anxiety for many of us. I'm not familiar with maca and udos oil but please research these to see if there is anything "stimulating" that might make withdrawal more difficult. 

 

There are ways of getting B vitamins and other important nutrients through food which may be less stimulating. During withdrawal, some of us become sensitive to meds, supplements, and even foods we may have tolerated quite well before withdrawal. 

 

Just a thought in case these supplements are having a negative impact. And as Ali mentioned a few posts back, be careful of overdoing the exercise, as that can also flare up symptoms. It's a most difficult balancing act, this nonlinear healing. We feel better so we want to do more and to experiment with new supplements and foods, not knowing if it's a wave or reaction to a new supplement or activity level. This is how we become gurus as we learn how to adapt and grow through this process. 

 

This is an interesting thread listing a lot of things that members say caused a spike in symptoms, which includes supplements and exercise:

 

http://survivingantidepressants.org/index.php?/topic/11175-things-that-caused-activation-or-withdrawal-symptoms/

 

 

If your symptoms of anxiety are very specific to work and you aren't troubled by them on your days off, perhaps it's anxiety from the working environment and as I've found out myself, there's not a lot you can do about that but try to tune out what you can and know you're still healing. 

 

At only about a year off all of those meds, you really are doing well. Thanks for sharing your journey with us. 

 

Sending healing vibes your way.  

[dowdaller]

Just checking in, the last week has been a mixed bag, I have had a few very anxious days, my sleep was good even got seven hours two nights ago, last night back to about five. So I was feeling pretty shaky today, I am still in the middle of this wave havnt felt this bad since I went off 2.5mg of olzapine 2 and a half years ago. I had nine bad weeks in a row after that.

I am trying to do 30 minutes exercise per day. My mood lifts after the exercise and I have genrally been sleeping, but my ocd is ramped up during the day, So I reckon the exercise is causing the amplification of these symtoms. But if I continue on with my routine my brain should adjust in time. 

 

 

i feel quiet anxious at work I dont stay still for long. 

 

 

 

I am taking evening primrose, fish oils, maca, udos oil, vit c and vit b. magnesium and zinc

 

 

 

Hi, dowdaller. 

 

You are doing extremely well considering your polydrugging background. Being able to work through this shows you are doing so many things right.

 

I'm wondering if your supplements may be contributing to the anxiety you're experiencing at work?  B vitamins can ramp up anxiety for many of us. I'm not familiar with maca and udos oil but please research these to see if there is anything "stimulating" that might make withdrawal more difficult. 

 

There are ways of getting B vitamins and other important nutrients through food which may be less stimulating. During withdrawal, some of us become sensitive to meds, supplements, and even foods we may have tolerated quite well before withdrawal. 

 

Just a thought in case these supplements are having a negative impact. And as Ali mentioned a few posts back, be careful of overdoing the exercise, as that can also flare up symptoms. It's a most difficult balancing act, this nonlinear healing. We feel better so we want to do more and to experiment with new supplements and foods, not knowing if it's a wave or reaction to a new supplement or activity level. This is how we become gurus as we learn how to adapt and grow through this process. 

 

This is an interesting thread listing a lot of things that members say caused a spike in symptoms, which includes supplements and exercise:

 

http://survivingantidepressants.org/index.php?/topic/11175-things-that-caused-activation-or-withdrawal-symptoms/

 

 

If your symptoms of anxiety are very specific to work and you aren't troubled by them on your days off, perhaps it's anxiety from the working environment and as I've found out myself, there's not a lot you can do about that but try to tune out what you can and know you're still healing. 

 

At only about a year off all of those meds, you really are doing well. Thanks for sharing your journey with us. 

 

Sending healing vibes your way.  

 

 

shep my anxiety is as bad at home as it is in work, so I reckon if I am going to feel like crap I might as well get paid for it. Its not who can hit the hardest its who can endure the most, I am still relatively young so I reckon 5 or 6 months of misery isnt that much in the greater scheme of things, so I will endeavor to persevere. And hope this wave F#@ks off,  

I have also been trawling the internet for success stories, the common thread seems to be people just being incredibly brave and strong and keeping going. So basically it comes down to a battle of wills, where there is only one way and that is forward through the vile tempest. 

[Shep]

shep my anxiety is as bad at home as it is in work, so I reckon if I am going to feel like crap I might as well get paid for it.

 

Lol! Gotta love the humor in this. I feel the same way at work.

 

I do think that the way forward is one foot in front of the other, stoically journeying forward. I also think the effort you've put into non-drug coping skills is helping, too, dowdaller, so please give yourself much credit for getting this far and having a good attitude. 

 

Sending healing vibes your way.