Lakelander82: Sertraline general query and tapering info

[Lakelander82]

Hey Lakelander:

 

 

Jan carol, surely you mean that it's unusual I'm getting these symptoms this early in the taper and not late, I've 32 mgs to go after all and am nowhere near the finish line. Is it beyond comprehension that's ones original condition would start to rear it's head when approaching half the original dosage? Maybe I'm just an anomaly in every respect.

 

 

No, if you read the article, it talks about the "ut-oh" point, the point where small changes in dose create greater changes in plasma.  This is where it becomes harder, and more important to slow down.

 

I'm guessing that 32 mg might be your ut-oh point, and that it is now time to slow down.

 

I hope you see the sun today!

I've read all the articles JanCarol, comprehending the Science is wee buns to me, it's how receptor occupancy translates into tangible symptoms and how a person feels that is the real question.

 

Bit of a mixed bag this last week or so, have felt anywhere from decent, to okish to not so great. I batter on regardless, there's no other choice.

[Lakelander82]

Early part of the day continues to be a struggle for me. I was thoroughly unproductive for a couple of hours upon rising, mind was down and didn't want to really leave the house until my brain started to fire up. It's the mornings when I'm most fragile and when I can't face the outside world or deal with anything stressful. I just don't feel human at all at this time of the day. I notice as well I tend to be pale in the mornings and it takes a few hours for the colour to come into my cheeks. Don't know if it's all down to my sleeping pattern which isn't great if I'm honest, I would tend to fall asleep quite late (i.e. 2- 3am or later) and sleep solidly to 11.30/ 12 noon.

 

My tablets changed again this month, this time I got Accord having been on Dr Reddys for quite some time. I wish to Christ they would keep my brand the same so I could enjoy some level of consistency. It's hard to convey to the Pharmacy how crucial it is to have consistency when tapering. I notice the excipients are the exact same for both brands yet the Accord brand virtually exploded upon contact with the water and disintegrates very quickly yet the Dr Reddys brand takes forever and a day disintegrating. Perhaps it's something to do with the proportions of the excipients in both brands. Maybe I'm thinking too much about this.

[Flowers]

Early part of the day continues to be a struggle for me. I was thoroughly unproductive for a couple of hours upon rising, mind was down and didn't want to really leave the house until my brain started to fire up. It's the mornings when I'm most fragile and when I can't face the outside world or deal with anything stressful. I just don't feel human at all at this time of the day. I notice as well I tend to be pale in the mornings and it takes a few hours for the colour to come into my cheeks. Don't know if it's all down to my sleeping pattern which isn't great if I'm honest, I would tend to fall asleep quite late (i.e. 2- 3am or later) and sleep solidly to 11.30/ 12 noon.

 

My tablets changed again this month, this time I got Accord having been on Dr Reddys for quite some time. I wish to Christ they would keep my brand the same so I could enjoy some level of consistency. It's hard to convey to the Pharmacy how crucial it is to have consistency when tapering. I notice the excipients are the exact same for both brands yet the Accord brand virtually exploded upon contact with the water and disintegrates very quickly yet the Dr Reddys brand takes forever and a day disintegrating. Perhaps it's something to do with the proportions of the excipients in both brands. Maybe I'm thinking too much about this.

Hi Lakelander

 

Mornings are my worst time too. I am getting a bit of window around 11pm just intime to get into bed!!!

 

My pharmacy changed a generic to another generic and shortly afterwards I got hit with a huge wave almost like WD all over again. Too much coincidence I think. I don't think you are over thinking this - just trying to work out why things may not be improving.

[Lakelander82]

The truth is Flowers I just don't know if the different generic is making a difference, in theory it shouldn't. What I do know is that you would have to convince me really hard that there's any sort of healing going on in my body right now. Sorry if I come across as cynical, but cynicism is part of my makeup. I've developed an unsteadiness on my feet and a dizziness very much akin to vertigo. Prior to this, I had popping in my ears for a few weeks, I know the inner ear is related to our balance so maybe there's a connection there.

I'm not going to discuss mornings anymore as I've done so on more than a few occasions, it's suffice to say I take a long time getting going in the first part of the day. My brain feels so god damn tired and bereft of energy at times to the point that I can tackle very little for fear of it overwhelming me. All I can handle at the minute is taking the dog for a walk each day, perhaps going shopping in the next neighbouring town but generally not challenging myself, going anywhere new or socialising at all. It could be just my regular old Depression/Anxiety and nothing to do with withdrawal, it's hard to tell.

Good news is that I was sleeping by 1am last night and slept right through to 11am, I've never had a problem sleeping apart from going to bed too late and getting up too late! :-D

[Flowers]

So sorry that you can't see any form of healing and I forgive your cynicism! I guess we will never know if changing brands, generics or whatever is the culprit to increased WD symptoms. It is just my nature to try and find out what went wrong so it won't happen again!

 

I am struggling with dizziness and unsteadiness problems - I am OK if I am still but when I move about it is awful, so I do sympathise.

 

My day is very limited too and apart from my daily walk and a few household chores I do very little. It is very frustrating not being able to function properly.

 

I think it is great that you are able to sleep even if it is at late hours. Who cares if you are getting your rest. I have always been a doormouse but wake up at 630 every day with heart palps and cannot get back to sleep again. At least if I get up it is daylight at 7am and I am not sitting in the dark.

 

I have just done a little updose a week ago to see if it would help. So far nothing outstanding has happened but it is early days.

 

I notice you have done an updose too back in January. Are you going to sit this out and wait or do another cut?

 

Flowers xxx

[Lakelander82]

I'm going to sit it out for a while Flowers, not updosing in the immediate future anyway. It's crap having to limit ourselves to very basic activities day in day out. I'm often infuriated by people who ask how do you put your day in or do you not get bored sitting at home? I was once asked this by a Psychiatrist, the kind of person, a bit like me da, who thinks activity and occupying your mind cures all your woes. If I was in anyway feeling good in myself do you honestly think I'd be sitting at home limiting myself to just a few menial tasks? I'm limiting myself because it's a protective mechanism more than anything else.

 

I can't see me sitting through the whole spring and summer like this, if I find I'm not getting any better, I'll reinstate the whole 50mg and be done with it. Living a fairly decent drug insulated life

is better than living a miserable non drugged one imo. Living a drug free life maybe a courageous, virtuous, even utopian ideal but for some it may simply not be possible.

[Skeeter]

LL,

Everything you are feeling right now is so common upon those here whose CNS is a bit off kilter, Sadly, issues that we would never think could be issues caused by changes we would never think could in a million years upset our CNS, can affect us many months later. I have seen it over and over again. We seem to have 2 types of reactions to things that happen during withdrawal, those who react immediately, and those who react to changes months later, generally 5-6 months later is when they really start and kick us in the behind. I tell you this because I want you to know that the negative thoughts are part of this, the not wanting to socialize or even go shopping, and the agoraphobia, so is the lack of motivation and wanting to spend time alone.

 

The thing that scares me is that you are thinking of going back up to 50mg. If you updose, please, please go clowly, so you are on the minimum dose you need, and stay there until you are 100 percent stable, then you can chose to stay where yu are for a long time, then taper very slowly IF you choose that route. I actually just found an article about this exact subject that I will give you the link to. You do not have to follow the advice, but it makes sense, so you are not on more meds than you need to be on, because, remember, you said you did not feel "great" when you were on them in the first place. You probably do not want to live your whole life like that. You just need to wait for your system to get back to normal. If that does not happen, keep reading, I have an article for you to read: http://mentalhealthdaily.com/2015/01/16/finding-the-minimal-effective-dose-of-antidepressants-other-drugs/

 

If you ever choose to taper again. do it very slow, slower than you think you need, until you find you correct speed and percentage to drop over what time period and do not care how long it takes, even if you taper 2 percent every 2 months, you will be getting somewhere, and you will not be shocking you body or mind, hopefully (but you have to wait until you are steady as steady can be! Just never, ever cut more than a several percent at once, not the unknowing mistake you made at the beginning before you knew ANYTHING about what the drug companies do NOT tell us about tapering . Now I am one of those people that feels changes right away. I missed 4 days of Lexapro in December because my pharmacy screwed up, and I felt it for about 40 days after, I slept about 18 hours a day. Well it seems like POSSIBLY you are having a delayed reaction to that- we see it all the time here. It does not work right now when you try to force yourself to do something/anything you are just not up to when you feel like this totally due to your CNS being "off kilter", it just makes you feel worse at this point. I do like that you are taking the dog for a walk once a day, as you want to have some movement, and the sun exposure is not bad for vitamin D levels, as long as you are  not getting too much sunlight, as you know.

 

It is much harder to push away the negative thoughts right now. Try to find some things that you like to so that are easy, if you can.

 

I really hope you feel better soon.  I am slowly working on my project, looking at delayed reactions with AD's, and seeing if there are any trends as to which meds seem to have delayed reactions, and your case is one of those I have noted.  It just happens too often, IMHO to be a coincidence!  It is interesting thus far.  I will not know until I have more data.  Do not worry, I am looking only at the data in the end, not the names, FYI.

 

Hang in there!!!

Skeeter

[Lakelander82]

LL,

Everything you are feeling right now is so common upon those here whose CNS is a bit off kilter, Sadly, issues that we would never think could be issues caused by changes we would never think could in a million years upset our CNS, can affect us many months later. I have seen it over and over again. We seem to have 2 types of reactions to things that happen during withdrawal, those who react immediately, and those who react to changes months later, generally 5-6 months later is when they really start and kick us in the behind. I tell you this because I want you to know that the negative thoughts are part of this, the not wanting to socialize or even go shopping, and the agoraphobia, so is the lack of motivation and wanting to spend time alone.

 

The thing that scares me is that you are thinking of going back up to 50mg. If you updose, please, please go clowly, so you are on the minimum dose you need, and stay there until you are 100 percent stable, then you can chose to stay where yu are for a long time, then taper very slowly IF you choose that route. I actually just found an article about this exact subject that I will give you the link to. You do not have to follow the advice, but it makes sense, so you are not on more meds than you need to be on, because, remember, you said you did not feel "great" when you were on them in the first place. You probably do not want to live your whole life like that. You just need to wait for your system to get back to normal. If that does not happen, keep reading, I have an article for you to read: http://mentalhealthdaily.com/2015/01/16/finding-the-minimal-effective-dose-of-antidepressants-other-drugs/

 

If you ever choose to taper again. do it very slow, slower than you think you need, until you find you correct speed and percentage to drop over what time period and do not care how long it takes, even if you taper 2 percent every 2 months, you will be getting somewhere, and you will not be shocking you body or mind, hopefully (but you have to wait until you are steady as steady can be! Just never, ever cut more than a several percent at once, not the unknowing mistake you made at the beginning before you knew ANYTHING about what the drug companies do NOT tell us about tapering . Now I am one of those people that feels changes right away. I missed 4 days of Lexapro in December because my pharmacy screwed up, and I felt it for about 40 days after, I slept about 18 hours a day. Well it seems like POSSIBLY you are having a delayed reaction to that- we see it all the time here. It does not work right now when you try to force yourself to do something/anything you are just not up to when you feel like this totally due to your CNS being "off kilter", it just makes you feel worse at this point. I do like that you are taking the dog for a walk once a day, as you want to have some movement, and the sun exposure is not bad for vitamin D levels, as long as you are not getting too much sunlight, as you know.

 

It is much harder to push away the negative thoughts right now. Try to find some things that you like to so that are easy, if you can.

 

I really hope you feel better soon. I am slowly working on my project, looking at delayed reactions with AD's, and seeing if there are any trends as to which meds seem to have delayed reactions, and your case is one of those I have noted. It just happens too often, IMHO to be a coincidence! It is interesting thus far. I will not know until I have more data. Do not worry, I am looking only at the data in the end, not the names, FYI.

 

Hang in there!!!

Skeeter

You probably misunderstood me Skeeter. If, and I emphasise the word if, I decided to reinstate the full 50mg again I wouldn't bother tapering again.

I'm one of those people who experienced virtually no side effects from taking the drugs apart from a significantly reduced libido. I never had suicidal thoughts in response to the drugs the way some on here have, in fact I was never suicidal to begin with anyway. What I was prior to the drugs, was a cranky, cynical, moderately depressed person with self esteem issues who had panic attacks and couldn't leave the house. The drugs enabled me to get out and about and lead a relatively normal life and not react like a maniac to minor occurrences. What I don't really get on here, is that there are people advising the rest of us about the theory of healing and how it invariably takes place and yet they're far from healed themselves. I admire their confidence, but if I'm honest I don't really know where it comes from. I wish I had it, especially when times are tough.

[Skeeter]

LL,
After some amount of time, these drugs do tend to poop out, and your options at that point are to change drugs or to up the dose on the current drug. If you increase the dose, at some point, esp since you are so young now, you can and most likely will, get to a point where the dose can not be increased any longer, which means switching drugs, and that sometimes, is easier said than done. I did not wish to upset you IF I did by talking about tapering again, if you so choose. Some people, after a rough go of it, do decide to go as slow as a snail, and not make any mistakes, and find that they do have an easier time when they try again, to at least lower the dose the are on. You and I have gotten along fairly well, so I was only offering friendly advice. Of course you do not have to take it. We are all volunteers here (including me), so I have nothing to gain either way, just helping the best I know how.

I understood 100% what you were telling me. I  have been with you for several months here. you and I have been friendly and kind with one another, so I thought I would give you all of the information for whichever way you decided to go.  That article gave great information on how to updose to find your own perfect dose.  I am a volunteer, so it is not like I get commission if you stay on or go off.  I just want you to do it safely.  If you increase your dose too quickly with your desire to go back to 50mg, you can find yourself in a possibly world of hurt worse than you are in now.  Your brain has learned to (sort of) function on a lower dose.  I suggest you try going up slowly to find your perfect dose, sort of like the article discussed to get you back to being comfortable, as you brain should not need as much to work the same as a higher dose would.  Your CNS is not quite normal yet, and once you upset that balance more, you could possibly be in a bigger world of hurt. There is no telling how long that could take to stop

 

I spoke about you POSSIBLY decreasing in the future, because sometimes once people are not so cranky and in so much misery from going faster than their brain can handle while still symptomatic, many times they look at things in a different light, and choose to change their mind, and go slower.  I was only trying to cover all bases, nothing more, nothing less. I am sorry if that made you unhappy.  I was only trying to be kind.

 

I am a little surprised that you would want to stay on this med for longer, as you explained very clearly that you had many days that were not great on this drug.  I was 28 when I started AD's for depression, and am now 43, and coming off slowly first, because I am tired of not feeling true joy anymore is so much harder than I thought.  There are so many people here in their 40's-60's who are sorry they every started on these things, and mine worked perfectly for me AT FIRST, I  cannot imagine the burnout you might go through when this drug that does not work so well for you in the first place.  You may want to talk to your doc about this to find out your options. remember, the longer you are on AD's, the harder they are to come off of

 

What ever your choice, I wish you the very best.

Skeeter

[AliG]

I agree with everything Skeeter has proposed. Do you realize how she has looked after you and spent hours researching your situation ? I hope it goes well for you from hereon and your symptoms settle.

Ali 

[Lakelander82]

Au contraire AliG, I do recognise and appreciate the effort she has put in, did I give you any indication that I didn't? I just wish I was as vociferous a disciple as you are of the healing theory.

Skeeter, In relation to your point about a large updose causing a bump to your nervous system, I'd sincerely like to know how after cutting my dose in half to 25 mg and feeling like crap, I reinstated the 50 mg and felt good again within 3 days?? No bump whatsoever experienced..which certainly contradicts the idea of an updose further destabilising the nervous system.

[scallywag]

Perhaps when discussing updose, we could suggest that there is a risk that it COULD be destabilizing rather than expressing certainty that it WILL be destabilizing. And, of course, the caveat "Everyone's situation is unique."

[Skeeter]

LL,

I totally get why in being at half dose for less than 9 days and then going back up you could feel just fine, as you body did not have the time to totally get used to the lower dose, in fact, your body rejected it badly.  I remember reading how awful you felt.  I do not wish that on ANYONE! 

 

So, let us take a look at what I actually said about going to 50mg:

 

 

LL,

If you increase your dose too quickly with your desire to go back to 50mg, you can find yourself in a possible world of hurt worse than you are in now. .  Your CNS is not quite normal yet, and once you upset that balance more, you could possibly be in a bigger world of hurt. There is no telling how long that could take to stop. [Emphasis Added]

 

What ever your choice, I wish you the very best.

Skeeter

 

 

Other than fixing the tense of one word, this is the exact quote.  Did I guarantee that you would be worse off?  No, of course not, I know better than that.  I am only speaking about possible issues we have seen in others before... I would never want you to suffer as I have seen other do who upped their doses too quickly after a period of withdrawal, so I figured you might want to skip feeling worse if it was a possibility. I do apologize if I was wrong on that. I am not following your thread any longer, and am no longer able to read PM's from you either, to avoid possibly upsetting you in my response.

 

Yet again I do wish you the very best of luck!

S.

[Mjau]

Hi Lakelander,

Greetings from a fellow Sertraline taperer. I see you have made small dose reductions since august. I am a slow taperer myself. How are things going?

[Lakelander82]

Hi Mjau, thanks for chipping in on my thread, I haven't bothered updating it in a while. I did another tiny cut in late February from 32 mg to 31mg which I must update in my signature. I've been okish as of late and will consider another reduction to 30mg very soon - I've decided to move in even mg decreases instead of fractions of mg as its handier to measure via a syringe this way - I'm aware this won't be possible when I get to the lower doses and these even decreases will be larger than 10%. I'll just keep chipping away at 1 mg decreases every 3 or 4 weeks for the time being, which I think works out as roughly 3% drops or slightly over it at this stage.

 

I was at a cousin's wedding yesterday, didn't go overboard on the drink, had about 6 pints or so. Wasn't exactly the most social with all my extended family - the main reason is because I hate them prying as to what I'm doing in terms of work and having to tell them I'm not working is a major sense of embarrassment/shame to me.

 

How's your Sertraline taper going?

[Mjau]

Good to hear you're feeling a bit better as in okish! 3% drops sounds like a smooth plan at this stage, and probably good considering you were earlier about to updose.

 

Did you know Sertraline comes in a liquid formula? I use it right now. It's called Sertraline/Zoloft liquid/oral concentrate, the concentration is 20 mg/ml and I use a 1 ml syringe to get the correct dose. In my country it is only available as a "special prescription". Luckily my doctor was willing to do the prescription although he thinks my withdrawal issues are "all in my head".

 

I reached a point last year when I started having more pronounced wd symptoms so I'm doing a really slow micro-taper at the moment. Wish I could proceed at a faster rate but then I'm afraid my CNS would revolt....

[Lakelander82]

Good to hear you're feeling a bit better as in okish! 3% drops sounds like a smooth plan at this stage, and probably good considering you were earlier about to updose.

 

Did you know Sertraline comes in a liquid formula? I use it right now. It's called Sertraline/Zoloft liquid/oral concentrate, the concentration is 20 mg/ml and I use a 1 ml syringe to get the correct dose. In my country it is only available as a "special prescription". Luckily my doctor was willing to do the prescription although he thinks my withdrawal issues are "all in my head".

 

I reached a point last year when I started having more pronounced wd symptoms so I'm doing a really slow micro-taper at the moment. Wish I could proceed at a faster rate but then I'm afraid my CNS would revolt....

Sertraline isn't available as suspension/liquid in the UK, I looked up the BNF and it's not listed. It may be available as a "special" from some manufacturer though. Would definitely be handy as making your own each day is a pain in the arse.

[Lakelander82]

So I've reached the 20's today - over 40% down from my original dose. I'm ok for the most part, neither on cloud nine or down in the dumps. Still out and about as well, exercising, running errands etc. Still battering away, there's nothing else for it.

[Lakelander82]

Feeling nostalgic this evening so I thought I share with you a few famous Irish ballads. Suffice to say, they don't make music like this nowadays.

 

 

[ChessieCat]

Hi Lakelander,

 

Just dropped in to see how your taper is going.  What mg are you down to now?  At the end of January you posted in my topic that we were neck and neck.

 

I've just reduced to 19mg.  I'm assuming that you are lower that 28mg now.  If so, please update your signature so it is current.  Thanks.

[Lakelander82]

Hi chessie, thanks for dropping by, only seeing your message now, you lot probably thought I had dropped off the face of the earth! I'm down to 22mgs now, just haven't updated my signature in a long while but I will do it in the next few days. The teens are on the horizon so I'm kind of excited about that. I'm very similar to you in your taper, im currently tapering at about 1mg every 3-4 weeks but I might slow that down a bit depending on how I'm feeling. This last three weeks have been rough enough, nervous system has been up the left. I find socialising in big crowds intimidating, especially where there's a lot of big personalities and extroverts and everybody's talking over the top of one another - it's very taxing and overwhelming for me. In groups of two or threes I'm generally fine. I really don't know how much of this is down to my original condition of social anxiety and how much is down to my delicate nervous during this taper. I also notice there's a direct correlation between how I'm feeling mentally and how much tension is my muscles, especially my back and neck. If something stressful has triggered tension in my body I have to go and expunge that muscle tension in my body before i can get back to feeling good and thinking straight. When my body is all tight and tense I find my mind is all sped up and no amount of deep breathing, meditation or positive thinking can bring me out of it. Swimming front crawl  or having a deep muscle massage are the only two things that remove tension from my muscles and restore me back to normality! 

 I keep going however, keep on trucking and battling and never throwing in the towel and hoping that the theory of healing from antidepressants espoused on here is correct. Hope you are also keeping well, we will be over the finishing line at some stage but for me I could see it being at least another two years, but I'm not going to rush it in anyway, I'll take it slow and steady. 

[Lakelander82]

I maybe in the low twenties but I'm definitely in a difficult spot at the minute. I'm sleeping about 9 hours at night and I still wake up wrecked and fatigued, like I only slept about 3 hours - the bags under my eyes some days lay testimony to this. Most people can't sleep at  all whereas I've never had a problem sleeping - in this respect I think I'm atypical. 

 

The other thing that gets to me is the periods of intense sadness and/or anxiety that sweep over me during the day which is followed by my eyes watering up and a subsequent period of calm. An hour or two later I get the unpleasant feelings then cry again and so fourth. So it's calm, cry, calm , cry , calm, cry - this could go on at least 5 or 6 times a day. I've heard of people saying they can get a window or wave for a day or two or even a week, so I'd like to know are all these short periods quintessential Windows and waves?  

[Mjau]

I have similar symptoms as you. I'm at 24 mg and planning to drop to 23 soon. The fatigue is very familiar and the bags under the eyes as well. But I do experience days when I am more alert and connected, and these days are like windows. 

 

The quick changes in mood that you have - seems to me like your nervous system is adapting to the lowering dose of the drug. Sounds like waves and windows!

I  can have these mood changes as well. Maybe not as quick. But I try to go with the flow. Listen to my body. Feel the sadness. I try not to attach myself to the difficult emotions, I try to just let them pass through my body with no resistance. I have found that if I do like this the emotions are easier to bear. But it's not always easy!

[Lakelander82]

Thanks for your contribution Mjau. We’re roughly at the same point in the taper but I do note you have been on AD’s a good deal longer than me and from a much younger age. How are you getting on now? What’s your taper rate now? 

 

I spent Friday to Monday of last weekend over in my brothers in England. It’s only a hop, skip and a jump across the Irish Sea (35 mins on a plane), but I don’t think I will ever be enamoured with flying. I never batted an eyelid about flying when I was young but as I have gotten older I have developed an anxiety about flying - perhaps watching Aircrash investigation down through the years has caused this! I’ve witnessed quite a few hysterically nervous passengers on planes over the years as well, much worse than me and it got me thinking does exposure therapy really work? It’s quite obvious these people are exposing themselves to their fear but are they really getting any relief from their deliberate exposure? I honestly don’t think they are.

 

Anticipatory anxiety continues to be a big problem for me, especially before going away somewhere or going to meet new people, don’t really know the best way to combat this tbh. I seem to be content staying in my own quiet rural part of the world, away from hustle and bustle of big cities. That aside, I’m okish for the most part, still have constant back and neck tension which require mechanical removal via my Theracane or Thumper massager. This back stiffness causes me restless nights with the result that I don’t get to sleep to 2 or 3 in the morning but luckily I sleep solidly for or 8 or 9 hours then...but still wake up tired the next day. Quite often I shout extremely loudly or talk gibberish in my sleep, I don’t really know what causes this and if anybody else gets it on here but it sure causes a bit of consternation for rest of the family, especially when they are sleeping sound! 

 

The teens are very close now so I should be excited but the truth is I can’t really differentiate my old issues from withdrawal ones. The perils of having an inquisitive mind. 

 

 

 

 

 

Edited October 15, 2017 by Lakelander82

[Lakelander82]

I'm so fed up of this tapering malarkey, it's soul destroying beyond belief. I'm down to 20mg of Sertraline, a 60% reduction from my starting dose of 50mg. The 20mgs thats left in the jar after I take out 5ml (5mg) is so pathetic, so weak, so innocuous looking, it leads me down a path of rumination about why I'm not feeling any better at this stage. I wake up with absolutely no vigour in the mornings, only extreme fatigue and dark circles under my eyes after a good 9 hour sleep, as if I haven't slept at all. I struggle through the day, tears come quite often, followed by periods of relative but not total calm in between. Are they windows and waves I keep asking myself. If so why are they alternating so damn quickly in a day...some people talk about having entire days and weeks of either Windows or waves, I could have 8 windows and 8 waves in one day alone! 

 Is it just the Depression coming back again is another question I ask. It's always in the back of my mind that this process could all be for nothing in the end, that it's superfluous, pointless and subjecting oneself to unnecessary suffering. I carry on though into the abyss, not really knowing what the result will be. 

[Cruizer]

Hi Lakelander i am right with you here mate. Im down to 24mg and in the past month i have had a massive spike in symptoms. Crushing head pains, depression, teary, brain fog, irritated. It totally sucks. I too am on zoloft. 

[Lakelander82]

Thanks Cruizer, I’ve improved somewhat from earlier in the month. All we can do is keep trucking on, there’s nothing else for it. The teens are only a week away and I’m happy that I’ve got this far. I think this calls for some more Dubliners and that famous old tune the fields of Athenry. 

 

 

 

[Lakelander82]

Time for an update me thinks. I’ll be down to 13.5 mg of Sertraline this coming Thursday. I’m feeling ok for the most part, hit with waves at least once or twice a day but they pass quickly enough. I was a little bit bold and did a few consecutive cuts of slightly over 10%, more out of curiousity as to how my brain and body would cope. It’s the only time I’ve broken the 10% rule in my entire taper but from here on in I’ll stick to the 10% or less rule. This winter has been throughly long and miserable, snow and ice ad nauseum nearly every single day or every other day at least, I’ll be glad to see the back of it. Today was the first real day when you could honestly say Spring was approaching, we even got to the dizzy heights of double digit temperatures! Hard to believe the wild garlic, bluebells, rhododendrons and cherry trees will be in full blossom in less than 3 months time! 

 

I will leave a link of two versions of a song that I had completely forgot about and only rediscovered recently. Tremendous song. 

 

 

 

[ChessieCat]

Great to hear from you.  Thanks for letting us know how you are doing.

 

On 31/01/2017 at 9:13 AM, Lakelander82 said:

Hey Chessie, just noticed we are neck and neck in the race! :-D

 

And we are still neck and neck.  I'm down to 12mg but have to start slowing up now.

 

3 hours ago, Lakelander82 said:

This winter has been throughly long and miserable, snow and ice ad nauseum nearly every single day or every other day at least, I’ll be glad to see the back of it. Today was the first real day when you could honestly say Spring was approaching, we even got to the dizzy heights of double digit temperatures!

 

And here I have been living through 35+ degrees Celsius and up to mid 40s on and off since mid December.

[Lakelander82]

I seriously need to move somewhere well south of this country. Thought spring had sprung and then the beast from the east blows in. The wind is enough to cut you in two...

 

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-northern-ireland-26018439

 

 

[powerback]

Hi LL I heard Kerry is sunny at the moment ,the whole country on lockdown later until tomorrow .

Stay safe .

[Lakelander82]

Kerry is the kingdom after all PB! 😀

Do you remember December 2010? We hit -18C , Lough Erne was frozen stiff and the country came to a standstill. It was the coldest I’ve ever experienced. I always think if you could somehow tow this country about 1000miles south it would be the perfect place to live! 😀

[powerback]

2 hours ago, Lakelander82 said:

Kerry is the kingdom after all PB! 😀

Do you remember December 2010? We hit -18C , Lough Erne was frozen stiff and the country came to a standstill. It was the coldest I’ve ever experienced. I always think if you could somehow tow this country about 1000miles south it would be the perfect place to live! 😀

ye I remember 2010 ,ile never forget it ,it took 5 hours to get home after work one day when it normal would take 40 minutes  ,I though we would be stuck on the side of the road .

This storm has got a very unusual mix of conditions ,I have friends that are delighted ,there In the pub lol. 

[Lakelander82]

 I’ve had a bad three or four days recently, falling out with various people, overreacting to things, exaggerating things. Fairly intense sadness/tension descends on me quickly which then cause me to tear up followed by periods of relative calm in between the next sadness bout, the next tearing up period and so fourth. This could happen 10 or more times in a single day. It’s so unrelenting, day after day. The tearing up seems to be like a release valve for me to release emotions, as to what what physiological significance this has in the healing process, I don’t really don’t know. If it has something to do with serotonergic receptor regeneration, then I wish to Christ it would hurry the hell up. I still tend to be more on edge and irritable in the morning and early part of the day, the type of mood where you know that you’re fragile and that anyone or anything will set you off. 

[ChessieCat]

8 hours ago, Lakelander82 said:

the type of mood where you know that you’re fragile and that anyone or anything will set you off. 

 

and part of you wishes they would so you can get angry at them.  At least that's how I've been feeling.  I've been feeling "on the verge of tears" every now and then for the last few months.  I've noticed that my anxiety has increased a bit as well.  I'm now down to 11mg.  It could be to do with the "oh oh" point of tapering.

[powerback]

20 hours ago, Lakelander82 said:

 I’ve had a bad three or four days recently, falling out with various people, overreacting to things, exaggerating things. Fairly intense sadness/tension descends on me quickly which then cause me to tear up followed by periods of relative calm in between the next sadness bout, the next tearing up period and so fourth. This could happen 10 or more times in a single day. It’s so unrelenting, day after day. The tearing up seems to be like a release valve for me to release emotions, as to what what physiological significance this has in the healing process, I don’t really don’t know. If it has something to do with serotonergic receptor regeneration, then I wish to Christ it would hurry the hell up. I still tend to be more on edge and irritable in the morning and early part of the day, the type of mood where you know that you’re fragile and that anyone or anything will set you off. 

Oh LL I deeply empathise with this ,I have the ability to create loads of b*llsh*t in my own head its horrific ,I'm learning the hard way not to listen to the first thing that comes into my head ,you are the first person ive noticed to write about the exact thing I'm going through .for your own good you will have to try and avoid some people if you cant control what you say or feel ,I'm months now avoiding a few people and it has worked wonders for me .youl notice that your coming off worse off for this ,your not doing it on purpose but what ever goes on in the brain its creating trouble for you .

this all sounds like the neuro emotions but its dam real that's for sure .try being very mindful of your reaction to something and later write it down in a journal ,I must do this myself ,I often get into situations that my ego is bruised and I feel inferior and all I want to do is burst out and say here I'm not the dummy you are suggesting ,it happened to me this morning  ,I was dying inside but if I react its only fuel to the likes of this person [in a wave today ],ive laughed off remarks before because I was" normal",we need to give ourselves a break ,we are coping with a lot .I find it very difficult to get a situation out of my head ,its such a pain .

As you say about being fragile ,we need to judge how  fragile we are and simply avoid scenarios that will affect us and if we cant we journal our response later on .

 

kudos on your tapering .

Take care .