☼ Ogres: Prozac

[RealMe]

14 hours ago, Ogres said:

But too much ungrounded pessimism is not so. 

Hi Ogres,

Agreed.  I looked up depressive realism; boy, there's a term for everything.  I'm doing ok.  Hope you are too.

 

[Ogres]

17 months off of AD! Edging closer to 1,5 years mark!

 

Had a horrible cold or a flu virus recently which is a stress to organism. And as any stress, it made my WD worse. Psychological and physiological symptoms worsened. Bloody thing lasted several weeks!

But I've almost recovered now, which is good. Getting back to my normal routine of work, exercising, socializing (when possible and when feeling like it).

 

I’m noticing that my emotional range is getting bigger. Some films or books can even bring tears into my eyes. Hasn’t happened for a while. Also, I’m dreaming during the night more often. I guess it’s a sign of some improvement as it’s known that ADs mess up REM sleep.

Trying to do all the right things like eating healthy food, exercising, avoiding stress, being gentle on myself, etc. But at the same time trying to push myself a bit to do the things which make me feel psychologically better afterwards. Like socializing, travelling and exercising when I don’t feel like it. Stress is bad, but living totally stress-free in a protective bubble doesn’t help with my mental development and recovery. Like a muscle needing exercise to get stronger. It’s my theory, anyway. On the other hand, I’m really lucky and grateful that my current job is not very stressful and demanding and I can control the level of exposure myself. I also understand that some people are suffering with WD much more than I am. So, my advice is to listen to yourself first.

 

Feeling apathetic mainly, but some simple things give me pleasure. Like watching a movie or reading a nice book. Speaking of books, there is one I read and enjoyed: ‘Lost Connections: Uncovering the Real Causes of Depression - and the Unexpected Solutions’ by J Hari. It has been mentioned on this website already. Being familiar with the subject, the conclusions are similar to what we know consciously or subconsciously already. Chemical imbalance is a myth (surprise surprise) and the roots of depression and anxiety are in the way we live our lives. Rather than chemically anesthetising, it makes sense to listen to one’s worries and trying to address them whenever possible. Another positive thing to take from this book is the fact that the author himself has been on ADs for quite some time and recovered, apparently, to a point where he can function as a journalist and a writer. Certainly gives me hope that with time we’ll all get better.            

 

Best wishes to everyone and have a speedy recovery!

[RealMe]

5 hours ago, Ogres said:

Rather than chemically anesthetising, it makes sense to listen to one’s worries and trying to address them whenever possible.

So true.  I cannot help but regret all the time I wasted trying to avoid or medicate the causes of my discontent instead of addressing them.  Of course, we need to keep learning the tools that will help address the worries.  One of those tools is the mutual support I find here.  I'm definitely

going to put the books you recommended on my reading list.  I just finished two books by William Glasser on reality and choice therapy.   According to Psychology Today, "He was among the first to question and doubt the existence of the mental diseases described in all editions of the DSM, and the subsequent use, overuse, and abuse of powerful mind altering medications."

5 hours ago, Ogres said:

But I've almost recovered now, which is good. Getting back to my normal routine of work, exercising, socializing (when possible and when feeling like it).

So glad you are over that flu.  I've been phobic about catching it.

Congratulations on being off drugs.  It gives me so much hope that I will be able to do it too.  So happy to read your amazing progress!

 

[Ogres]

22 minutes ago, RealMe said:

So true.  I cannot help but regret all the time I wasted trying to avoid or medicate the causes of my discontent instead of addressing them.  Of course, we need to keep learning the tools that will help address the worries.  One of those tools is the mutual support I find here. 

Hi RealMe, thanks for reading my update! 

I also think that having a bit more tolerance and acceptance towards oneself and others around without judging or labeling. It helps remembering that even the most sane and strong people faced with certain life situations feel down, anxious, afraid, etc. Accept lows, try to work and change where you can. 

Well, hope I'll be able to think like that in the midst of a dark WD wave   

[RealMe]

On 2/2/2018 at 1:10 PM, Ogres said:

Well, hope I'll be able to think like that in the midst of a dark WD wave

That's what I'm trying to do today.  Having a wave from you-know-where.  No escape except tv and computer.

[nz11]

Hi Ogres

Haveyou considered making a submission to the Scottish govt.

Thanks in advance for giving it some thought. No pressure though. ITs up to you.

thankyou 

nz11

[Ogres]

On 04/02/2018 at 1:29 AM, RealMe said:

That's what I'm trying to do today.  Having a wave from you-know-where.  No escape except tv and computer.

Hi RealMe, sorry, just noticed your post... Hope you're felling better now. The only thing which keeps me going in a wave is remembering moments when I felt great, believing that light is around the corner.   

[Ogres]

On 04/02/2018 at 1:31 AM, nz11 said:

Hi Ogres

Haveyou considered making a submission to the Scottish govt.

Thanks in advance for giving it some thought. No pressure though. ITs up to you.

thankyou 

nz11

Hi NZ,

thanks for the info. let me check.

I had been mostly prescribing ADs to myself, but when I went to a GP once I was very surprised how easy it was to obtain prescription... In any case, there should be information publicly available about the dangers, side effects and withdrawal symptoms. 

[RealMe]

2 hours ago, Ogres said:

Hi NZ,

thanks for the info. let me check.

I had been mostly prescribing ADs to myself, but when I went to a GP once I was very surprised how easy it was to obtain prescription... In any case, there should be information publicly available about the dangers, side effects and withdrawal symptoms. 

I remember when the first psychiatrist suggested the first antidepressant (tofranil/imipramine) I agreed to take.  I specifically asked him if it was addictive and what the side effects were.  He said "not addictive, possibly a little weight gain and dry mouth."  Hah!

[RealMe]

3 hours ago, Ogres said:

Hi RealMe, sorry, just noticed your post... Hope you're felling better now. The only thing which keeps me going in a wave is remembering moments when I felt great, believing that light is around the corner.   

I haven't experienced feeling great in a long, long time.  Can't remember when.  But I have had some windows, had a bit of one yesterday.  Thanks for the thought, "believing that light is around the corner."  I will keep that in mind.  Thanks for responding to me, friend! xo

[Ogres]

18 hours ago, RealMe said:

I remember when the first psychiatrist suggested the first antidepressant (tofranil/imipramine) I agreed to take.  I specifically asked him if it was addictive and what the side effects were.  He said "not addictive, possibly a little weight gain and dry mouth."  Hah!

it's very sad indeed... the drugs are life-changing

17 hours ago, RealMe said:

I haven't experienced feeling great in a long, long time.  Can't remember when.  But I have had some windows, had a bit of one yesterday.  Thanks for the thought, "believing that light is around the corner."  I will keep that in mind.  Thanks for responding to me, friend! xo

I totally understand. 'great' is probably the wrong word for WD. Better. I hope you feel better and windows will become longer with time. Hang in there, my friend   

[RealMe]

Hi Ogres,

Miss you.  Hope you are well.

xo RM

[Ogres]

15 hours ago, RealMe said:

Hi Ogres,

Miss you.  Hope you are well.

xo RM

Hi RM, thanks for checking my thread! was just about to publish my update!

[Ogres]

Update at 1,5 years off of AD. Or another way of looking at it: in the last 32 months I was on Prozac for half a year.

Things are getting better. I think I recover quicker from stress (and from hangovers, which are also stressful to the body :)). Sleeping better too - falling asleep within 2-3 hours after an intense cardio session. Still wake up most nights at least once. Seeing dreams.

 

I drink 2-3 cups of coffee a day, but not very late in the afternoon. Stopped taking magnesium as in the brand i was taking there are a lot of supplementary substances which my body will be better off w/o. Going to stop taking Omega 3 as I think I have enough of this nutrient from my diet (fish/nuts/etc.) and I’ve read somewhere that too much of it can be detrimental.

 

Exercising 3-4 times a week: cardio and weight lifting.

 

Psychologically and physically I’m nearest to my baseline mood/performance as I’ve been in a very, very long time. But, hopefully, will improve more. Trying to figure out whether something is WD related or a general health issue. Like my knees hurting. Maybe it’s sports related, but it started after Prozac discontinuation. Physically I’m feeling fine most of the time and don’t have WD symptoms unless I’m sleep deprived or hangover. The only area where I’d like to see more improvement with time is libido. Orgasms are better than while on AD for sure, but erections are weaker and ejaculations are terribly premature. Hopefully, sexual health has been assigned lowest healing priority as it matters less from a survival standpoint.

 

I’m living a somewhat quiet life at the moment, trying to avoid stress, staying in my comfort zone most of the time.

 

Wondering how I’ll be able to cope with big life events… Prozac did give me some confidence, but I think my brain and CNS changed significantly already and quite possibly if I’ll ever decide to take AD again reaction will be different or bad. Not that I want to take it ever again. Certainly, not to get rid of physical WD symptoms. But in case I’m unable to cope without psychologically. Anyway, I’ll stay without chemical crutches for another 6 months at least and see how it goes.     

 

I’m hoping to emerge as a better version of myself on the other side of this. I’ve learned some things I didn’t know before. For example, I now know that I can function (work, exercise) after several sleepless nights. It’s much impaired functioning and, probably, with long term health consequences. But when there is no alternative. It shows that there are some reserves.

 

It’s hard to find meaning in life, but for a time-being meaning of my life is to prove that I’m stronger than these chemicals. It’s a bit shallow, hopefully I’ll find something bigger to be passionate about.

 

Best wishes to everyone and thanks for reading.

 

 

Edited March 9, 2018 by ChessieCat
added spacing

[Ogres]

Checking in at 19 months off.

Gradually improving, but still having some very bad days. Usually, after poor sleep. As soon as I had posted my last updated, I was hit by a wave of insomnia.

It lasted around a week and made all other symptoms (depression, anxiety, fatigue) worse. Strangely, sometimes I lie in bed with a book and feel like falling asleep any minute (what a great feeling!) and then suddenly wide awake for the rest of the night! Like missing the precise moment to fall asleep.

Still, there is improvement. If in the past there were totally sleepless nights, now it's more like very bad sleep with constant waking up.

These waves happen sometimes totally out of the blue. But other times it's due to my personal life. I'm in a long distance relationship now and when we're not together with my GF, I have these persistent thoughts that she is with someone else and that she's lying to me. I think and overthink late into the night, despite that she tells me she doesn't have anyone else and wants to be with me. I'm trying to learn how to trust and how not to fall victim of my own groundless fantasies.     

I remember how different it was when on ADs... With blunted emotions and feelings, I didn't care where my then GF was at any moment.

I think even if I knew she'd cheated I would have probably made peace with that after some time. I try to remember how to be in a relationship when you actually have feelings.   

No major change in other areas. I try to eat clean, exercise, be outside as much as possible. Great it's spring now and there are longer and sunnier days ahead. I haven't consumed alcohol in more than 5 weeks now as it does make things worse. But hopefully in the future I'll be able to enjoy a drink or two again.    

As a pleasant side effect, I think I look better and fitter. 

Thanks for reading and best wishes.

[RealMe]

On 4/9/2018 at 5:27 AM, Ogres said:

I haven't consumed alcohol in more than 5 weeks now as it does make things worse.

That is so good, Ogres!  Are you doing that alone?  I wasn't able to, but I found talking to others in the same boat gave me good ideas about how to manage.  That's what made me open minded about this forum even though it took me too many years to realize ADs were not helping me.

 

On 4/9/2018 at 5:27 AM, Ogres said:

I have these persistent thoughts that she is with someone else and that she's lying to me. I think and overthink late into the night, despite that she tells me she doesn't have anyone else and wants to be with me. I'm trying to learn how to trust and how not to fall victim of my own groundless fantasies.     

It takes a long time to build trust with someone.  It's ok to have doubts in a new relationship.  You are perfectly fine.  If it doesn't work out, I am absolutely certain you will find another, better, trustworthy GF!  But maybe it will work out; you are just giving it a good try.

 

On 4/9/2018 at 5:27 AM, Ogres said:

If in the past there were totally sleepless nights, now it's more like very bad sleep with constant waking up.

I have the opposite problem--oversleeping.  Have you tried some dairy before bed? or a little magnesium? or cut out coffee at night?

On 4/9/2018 at 5:27 AM, Ogres said:

As a pleasant side effect, I think I look better and fitter. 

Of course you do.  You are most likely a great catch for some lucky girl!

xo RM

[Ogres]

3 hours ago, RealMe said:

That is so good, Ogres!  Are you doing that alone?  I wasn't able to, but I found talking to others in the same boat gave me good ideas about how to manage.  That's what made me open minded about this forum even though it took me too many years to realize ADs were not helping me.

I can't say that it's very difficult for me to abstain. I don't have cravings as such. It's just when socializing or visiting relatives it's not easy not to drink. So far I've managed to stay away from it due to health consequences. I even went to a strip club with friends and drunk only soft drinks during the whole evening! I should be in the Guinness book of records.

I remember wild parties with plenty of booze when on prozac. Actually, I think ADs made me crave alcohol previously. I would buy couple of bottles of beer even after gym session which is far from ideal for recovery, etc. 

I still want to enjoy alcohol moderately when I'm better. A pint of cold beer in the evening near the beach... Or when socializing with friends/colleagues to "connect".

Agree that talking, discussing and sharing if there is an issue or concern is paramount. And that's what I'm doing and thanks for taking the time to read.     

 

3 hours ago, RealMe said:

It takes a long time to build trust with someone.  It's ok to have doubts in a new relationship.  You are perfectly fine.  If it doesn't work out, I am absolutely certain you will find another, better, trustworthy GF!  But maybe it will work out; you are just giving it a good try.

Thanks for advice and you're right, building a relationship requires time. In WD I'm more sensitive and with low tolerance for conflict etc. When there is an argument or I'm overthinking afterwards I feel bad physically, like I'm being kicked in the head. Trying my best to overcome and recover as soon as I can. And my GF doesn't know that I'm in WD from ADs. I only say I have occasional insomnia and that's why I can be moody, fatigued, irritable, etc. I think I'll keep it this way for now. She is far from it and it will take some effort to explain. Maybe later. 

 I'm taking one step at a time. 

 

3 hours ago, RealMe said:

I have the opposite problem--oversleeping.  Have you tried some dairy before bed? or a little magnesium? or cut out coffee at night?

I sometimes drink protein shakes (with milk) before bed. I'm not taking magnesium now but took in the past. Probably it helped, not sure. Some nights I sleep w/o magnesium, some nights I absolutely can't sleep whatever I do or take or not take... As for coffee my rule is couple of cappuccinos before 2pm. And maybe one green tea before 3 pm.     

I was oversleeping on ADs I remember. I could sleep for 10 hours. Now I feel mostly OK on 6.5-8 hours.

 

3 hours ago, RealMe said:

Of course you do.  You are most likely a great catch for some lucky girl!

This made me laugh  I am more serious now in terms of long term relationship and starting a family. I preferred open relationships before and could broke up with a GF easily just because I wanted to actively explore other options, didn't want to commit, didn't want to be loyal. No emotions of feelings rather than sexual interest. Hopefully, I'm changing for good.   

 

Thanks, RealMe, for your kind words and interest

[Ogres]

Quick update at 20 months off...

Recently, I was away for 4 nights, staying in a hotel with my girlfriend and there was only 1 night where I slept badly. 75% success rate. It's quite an achievement for me to be able to sleep in an unknown place on a narrow bed with someone else! And even this sleepless night was after an argument. Still having issues with my sensitized nervous system, when every negative emotion is magnified out of all proportions giving way to cortisol influx.

l’m relatively pleased with the intimate side of things as well. We averaged 15 km a day walking and I still had energy and was able to have and enjoy (so was my gf, hopefully) sex.

Looking forward to the next milestone: in 2 months it’s going to be 3 years when I first tried to get off of prozac completely. Unfortunately, back then I didn’t know the truth about the drug, what it does long term and horrible withdrawals. Hence I went back on it and stayed for another half a year.

Meanwhile I try to deal with emotions on my own and hope that I’m going to recover even more with time.

Best wishes to everyone who is suffering.   

[RealMe]

On 5/1/2018 at 3:26 AM, Ogres said:

update at 20 months off...

Wow 20 months off!  That is certainly something I aspire to.  I'm down to .81mL.  Considering the boatload of drugs and alcohol I had been on, it's a miracle.  I can't believe I am on my way to being drug free.

So glad things are working out with your girlfriend.  Like you describe, I tend to be very intense with my emotions as well.  The only difference today is that I don't think that characteristic is something that needs to be medicated.  I just try not to act out, and I'm getting better at that.  I never get very high; it's the negative emotions that are strong in me when they occur.  I wasn't feeling anything real for a very long time--anhedonia is what I think they call it.

On 5/1/2018 at 3:26 AM, Ogres said:

I try to deal with emotions on my own and hope that I’m going to recover even more with time.

I stopped seeing the new therapist after three visits, and I'm dealing with emotions pretty much on my own as well.  I do have a good relationship with my husband, but I try not to burden him too much.  It upsets me more and makes me feel guilty when he worries about me.  I also have a sister who is good to talk to in a general way.  I hope your girlfriend is someone you can talk to about how you feel.

On 5/1/2018 at 3:26 AM, Ogres said:

there was only 1 night where I slept badly. 75% success rate.

I still struggle with waking up during the night and being tired and anxious in the morning, but it has been better the past couple of days.  I'm still in the windows and waves pattern; but overall, I see improvement.

It is so good to hear from you, dear Ogres.  You have been a strong presence in my WD recovery process!  Wishing you the very best!

xo RM

 

[Ogres]

On 5/16/2018 at 12:59 AM, RealMe said:

Wow 20 months off!  That is certainly something I aspire to.  I'm down to .81mL.  Considering the boatload of drugs and alcohol I had been on, it's a miracle.  I can't believe I am on my way to being drug free.

So glad things are working out with your girlfriend.  Like you describe, I tend to be very intense with my emotions as well.  The only difference today is that I don't think that characteristic is something that needs to be medicated.  I just try not to act out, and I'm getting better at that.  I never get very high; it's the negative emotions that are strong in me when they occur.  I wasn't feeling anything real for a very long time--anhedonia is what I think they call it.

The only difference between our cases is timing. I don't have any doubts that you'll be med free one day!

I as well try to listen to my worries and negative thoughts and try to do what can be done. 

On 5/16/2018 at 12:59 AM, RealMe said:

I stopped seeing the new therapist after three visits, and I'm dealing with emotions pretty much on my own as well.  I do have a good relationship with my husband, but I try not to burden him too much.  It upsets me more and makes me feel guilty when he worries about me.  I also have a sister who is good to talk to in a general way.  I hope your girlfriend is someone you can talk to about how you feel.

First and foremost listen to yourself. A therapist is there to help you. Get rid of him if there is no benefits. Simple as that, from my point of view. Glad to hear that your husband is understanding and that you have a sister you can share your worries with. 

I haven't disclosed that I'm in WD nor that I was on AD to my GF... Not to anyone, for that matter! Maybe at some point when I'm fully healed. I only say that I have occasional insomnia from my previous break up. Hopefully, I'll continue appearing normal when in my depressive, dark thoughts so that my distress is not apparent from outside.

On 5/16/2018 at 12:59 AM, RealMe said:

I still struggle with waking up during the night and being tired and anxious in the morning, but it has been better the past couple of days.  I'm still in the windows and waves pattern; but overall, I see improvement.

It is so good to hear from you, dear Ogres.  You have been a strong presence in my WD recovery process!  Wishing you the very best!

Great that you see improvements! There is more to come for sure, keep walking!

I also struggle after a bad night's sleep, but my mood and energy normally lifts a tiny bit by the afternoon for me to be able to proceed with my normal routine of work/exercise/etc.

Thanks for following my story, RealMe! Best wishes to you and speedy recovery!

[Ogres]

21 months off.

I feel like most of the time I’m very close to being my normal, unmedicated self. There are no major physical WD symptoms on its own and I can function day-to-day without limitations. However, there are very dark days when I feel depressed. When it happens, I’m fatigued and don’t want to do anything.

On average, I have 1 night a week when I struggle with insomnia. More often, it’s not totally sleepless, but with 1-3 hours sleep, which is still a progress, comparing to what it was before. Not sure what brings it. I have the same routine every day in terms of what I eat and drink (coffee, tea) or exercise. Alcohol impacts my sleep very negatively, but I abstain, mostly. Recently, I noticed that if I spend too much time sunbathing (trying to get as much vit D as possible while it lasts in this country:) ), I can’t sleep at night. There must be some relationship. Sun causes changes in body chemistry which have stimulating effect. Googling vit D and cortisol proved inconclusive. Other, normal, nights I wake up at 4am, but mostly able to fall asleep again. I noticed that for some reason, ice-cold shower after sauna helps with sleep. Even if going to bed several hours after. Actually, I should try ice cold showers when unable to sleep.

In terms of psychological symptoms, I’m depressed some days. I think it’s just ‘feeling down’ which is hugely magnified by WD. I’m trying to listen to what depression tries to ‘say’. As there are some things in my life which need changing. When on AD I simply didn’t care, but now they bother me more. I think one of the areas is my long distance relationship. I miss close/intimate daily connection with someone. Sometimes I’m not sure if it’s going to work out in the end with my current GF and if we’re compatible. When we argue, I ruminate long time thereafter. Negative feelings are then blown out by the WD and, voilà, I can’t sleep and then fall into depression. I try to drag myself out and do whatever I had planned to do anyway. Like going to the gym. Even simply spending time outside walking or cycling aimlessly helps.

Another thing is that I live in a foreign country where I had moved being an adult already. My childhood friends and friends I went to uni with are all far away and I only see them once or twice a year. I have people I know here, but it’s a bit different. In other words, I’m home sick. Thinking that starting a family will help. I’m working on it.  

Soon, I’m embarking on a 2 week road trip with couple of friends which is a challenge as it will involve a lot of driving, sleeping at different hotels, new and unfamiliar places. The only thing I’m a bit nervous about is insomnia. If it hits me hard, it will be very difficult to function and enjoy the trip. I won’t be able to change the schedule to allow some rest time and adjustment as I’ll be travelling with ‘healthy’ people :). Fingers crossed.

Looking forward to the next milestone beginning of July. It’s going to be 3 years when I first tried to get off of ADs completely. It was a mistake to go back on after half a year. I think it didn’t help that I went back on generic fluoxetine either. It felt different. Strange that same active ingredient and same dosage can have different effect. It felt different, even considering that I re-instated at the full dose. Less potent, at least and with more side effects.          

Thanks for reading and best wishes to everyone.

[RealMe]

On 6/1/2018 at 9:20 AM, Ogres said:

I won’t be able to change the schedule to allow some rest time and adjustment as I’ll be travelling with ‘healthy’ people :). Fingers crossed.

Hi Ogres,

You didn't say when the road trip is, so maybe I'm late in wishing you a wonderful time with your friends.  Hope it's great!  As far as worry about your insomnia symptoms, I've found I can push through some of my worst symptoms if I have to be part of a group--at least for a short time.  What I tend to do when I have disturbing symptoms is to isolate, but I have been consciously fighting that urge to isolate because I know socializing is good for me.  Socializing with 'healthy' people imprints some healthy thoughts on the limbic system of my poor brain.  I've read on this forum that magnesium and fish oil are helpful supplements.  I wonder if they help with insomnia.  I can't take magnesium for some reason because it gives me weird sensations in my mouth, but it is recommended here for WD symptoms.  Have you tried them?

 

Loneliness was and continues to be a gigantic issue with me.  It was worse when I was drinking years ago.  I didn't want to need anybody because of traumas in my past, and drinking aided me in that faulty logic.  I got married when I was 21, and at the time shouldn't even have had a driver's license.  Luckily, over the years, we have both matured and learned how to live compatibly and rewardingly together. We have so many differences, especially my tendency to "depress" and take substances for relief.  He has problems, but he doesn't have that problem.  When he realized I had alcohol trouble, he just stopped drinking with me altogether and remains supportive to this day.  I think the reason we are good together is that, in spite of our personality differences, we share many of the same values.  I hope your GF shares your values.  If not, I hope you find a lovely girl who does!  Everything else can be negotiated!

 

Let me know how your trip turns out!  Thanks for your encouragement.  I'm looking forward to getting completely off this AD train!

 

Best to you,

xo RM

 

 

 

 

[RealMe]

On 2/2/2018 at 6:45 AM, Ogres said:

‘Lost Connections: Uncovering the Real Causes of Depression - and the Unexpected Solutions’ by J Hari

Forgot to tell you I read this book you recommended and got a lot of positives from it!

 

[Ogres]

On 6/3/2018 at 5:56 PM, RealMe said:

Hi Ogres,

You didn't say when the road trip is, so maybe I'm late in wishing you a wonderful time with your friends.  Hope it's great!  As far as worry about your insomnia symptoms, I've found I can push through some of my worst symptoms if I have to be part of a group--at least for a short time.  What I tend to do when I have disturbing symptoms is to isolate, but I have been consciously fighting that urge to isolate because I know socializing is good for me.  Socializing with 'healthy' people imprints some healthy thoughts on the limbic system of my poor brain.  I've read on this forum that magnesium and fish oil are helpful supplements.  I wonder if they help with insomnia.  I can't take magnesium for some reason because it gives me weird sensations in my mouth, but it is recommended here for WD symptoms.  Have you tried them?

Hi RealMe, I'm so glad to hear from you! Thanks for your encouraging words!

My opinion is the same about socializing. I push myself to go out as much as possible even if I feel anxious. I "fake it till I make it". Like forcing myself to laugh and look positive and confident. It tricks my brain and it releases feel-good chemicals. It doesn't always work, but you regroup and try again. Humans are highly social creatures and contact with people is essential. On some occasions it does more harm than good, unfortunately. Especially in our vulnerable state. Sometimes you feel physically hurt. But we should keep trying and grow thicker skins.    

The road trip is next week. I'll try to enjoy it as much as I can, whatever happens. I'm ready for several sleepless nights. From past experience, I know I won't die :) Actually, I noticed that after several sleepless nights I sometimes feel very confident and not anxious, although a bit slow :)

Taking magnesium and omega 3 again. Not sure if it's helping. At least it has placebo effect.

 

On 6/3/2018 at 5:56 PM, RealMe said:

Loneliness was and continues to be a gigantic issue with me.  It was worse when I was drinking years ago.  I didn't want to need anybody because of traumas in my past, and drinking aided me in that faulty logic.  I got married when I was 21, and at the time shouldn't even have had a driver's license.  Luckily, over the years, we have both matured and learned how to live compatibly and rewardingly together. We have so many differences, especially my tendency to "depress" and take substances for relief.  He has problems, but he doesn't have that problem.  When he realized I had alcohol trouble, he just stopped drinking with me altogether and remains supportive to this day.  I think the reason we are good together is that, in spite of our personality differences, we share many of the same values.  I hope your GF shares your values.  If not, I hope you find a lovely girl who does!  Everything else can be negotiated!

I wish I'll have someone as understanding as your husband. It's great that you've learned how to live together supporting and understanding each other. 

I want to be close with someone, but I don't want to be dependent. And I don't want to be rejected. I'm learning how to trust and how to open up in a relationship. We're still finding out about each other with my GF. We argue and then everything is fine again. Taking each day as a new one without expecting too much and see what happens. I want a family, but not just for the sake of it. I want mutual feelings, respect, friendship, understanding. Otherwise it will not work long term. 

 

On 6/3/2018 at 6:03 PM, RealMe said:

Forgot to tell you I read this book you recommended and got a lot of positives from it!

  Great that you enjoyed the book! It gave me food for thoughts. Like it's normal to feel down sometimes. Quite possibly there is a signal for change as some of the basic human needs are not met. By medicating, you just trying to run from yourself, ignoring issues. You'll not be able to solve them this way.  

[Ogres]

22 months.

Just returned from a 2 week road trip with my friends. I was very cautious embarking on it in the first place with WD symptoms, especially, insomnia. But it went OK-ish. I was functioning probably at 85% capacity of my normal self. There were couple of nights with bad (3 or less hours) sleep, but the rest of the time it was the same as at home (6.5-7 hours with couple of times waking up). Pleasantly surprised, I thought it would be worse. Especially with 8 hour jet lag. My healthy friends most likely didn’t notice that there’s something wrong with me. And sometimes it seemed like I even had more energy than them, because I faked having more energy! We drove 2000 miles, changed 7 hotels, walked/cycled every day, ate fast food, went out some nights. It had been stressful and I even lost 3 kilos and noticed that I was losing more hair than normal. Like after brushing or washing. It’s looking better now when I’m back home and hopefully I’ll recover some lost hair with time.

This time 3 years ago I had tried to get off of prozac completely and stayed clean for 8 months. It was a mistake to go back on ADs for another half a year… Who knows, maybe I would have been fully recovered by now had I persevered and stayed off. Well, nothing can be done and regretting is pointless.        

Had one sleepless night since I returned which I blame jetlag for. Hope I’ll stabilize and it will be better soon.

Best wishes

[RealMe]

Hi Ogres,

Hope you are well.  I'm doing ok, just started reading Amy Cuddy's Presence.

xo RM

[Ogres]

11 hours ago, RealMe said:

Hi Ogres,

Hope you are well.  I'm doing ok, just started reading Amy Cuddy's Presence.

xo RM

Hello, RealMe.

So nice to hear from you. Hope you like Presence. I enjoyed it. Some good ideas about self acceptance and non-drug coping techniques. About being proud of who you are as you are.

I practice power poses from time to time. 

Will be posting an update at 23 months off. 

I've been travelling so much for the last 3 months. Sometimes I think I'm stretching it too much. It's stressful and it shows in that I can't sleep.

How are you, my friend? I can see you're progressing towards your goal. Well done!        

[RealMe]

8 hours ago, Ogres said:

can't sleep.

How are you, my friend? I can see you're progressing towards your goal. Well done!        

Hi Ogres,

So good to hear from you.  I wonder if things worked out with the girlfriend you had last time we updated!  I've been reading a lot on the internet about good sleep habits because without ADs I have to try other methods.  I wake up about three to four times a night, and that makes me tired in the morning.  I've been taking long (slow) walks, and I read that exercise shouldn't be done too late in the day because it will keep you up.  I've cut way back on my coffee which was hard because it feels like my last treat.  Are you traveling for fun or work?  

 

Thanks for the encouragement!  I feel like I have come such a long way since last year.  Learning to cope without drugs -- that's our mission!

Looking forward to your 23 month update!

xo RM

[Ogres]

12 hours ago, RealMe said:

Hi Ogres,

So good to hear from you.  I wonder if things worked out with the girlfriend you had last time we updated!  I've been reading a lot on the internet about good sleep habits because without ADs I have to try other methods.  I wake up about three to four times a night, and that makes me tired in the morning.  I've been taking long (slow) walks, and I read that exercise shouldn't be done too late in the day because it will keep you up.  I've cut way back on my coffee which was hard because it feels like my last treat.  Are you traveling for fun or work?  

 

Thanks for the encouragement!  I feel like I have come such a long way since last year.  Learning to cope without drugs -- that's our mission!

Looking forward to your 23 month update!

xo RM

Hi RealMe,

It's still ongoing with my GF. I was partially right that she's seeing someone else. But still not sure how serious it was between them. And I can also blame myself for that as in the past I was saying to her openly that I couldn't see any future for our relationship as we're too different and incompatible. She was free to spend time with someone else. But, eventually (and because I suspected she's with someone else!), I developed feelings for her and knowing that she could be with someone else hurt like hell. I had many sleepless nights because of that. Obviously I can't force her to be with me. She does say that she has feelings for me also but I decided to leave it like this for some time. We don't discuss our future at this stage. We just see each other, travel and spend time together. We both seem to like each other's company. 

Yes, I'm travelling for fun, mostly. I'm in my home town currently. I was here one year ago exactly during the time when I was suffering from intense withdrawals and insomnia. What a difference a year makes. I'm sleeping better and other physical WD symptoms are mostly absent. However, it all can change quickly for the worse after a stressful event. After an argument with my GF or when I'm jealous. Every small negative emotion is magnified by WD.         

Good sleep habits are very important. There is plenty of useful information on this subject. I also like coffee, but drink it mostly in the morning. And if late in the afternoon, camomile or other herbal brew will do.

Yes, be careful with intense exercise. I noticed that it can keep me awake for quite some time thereafter. Mostly, it's my heart pumping blood. Same happens after a stressful event. Trying to learn how to slow it down with breathing exercises. 

Hope your bedroom is properly dark and cool as this is very important as well. 

All the best and keep walking!

  

 

[Ogres]

A quick update at 23 months off. 

I’m fine physically most of the time, close to my baseline. There is a big BUT, however. I’m fine unless stressed. And stress tolerance is very, very low. I’ve been travelling a lot recently which has over stimulated my nervous system manifesting in insomnia, anxiety and depression. I’m also trying to sort out my love life. It doesn’t seem to be working as I want it to. Trying to make peace with the situation, with imminent break up, but it’s still leaving me depressed. I’ve had many sleepless nights because of that. On the other hand, it shows that I’m alive and can feel normal human emotions albeit enormously magnified by WD.    

Hoping to get back to my normal routine soon. Going to (my own) bed and waking up at the same times, exercising, eating healthily, etc.

Looking forward to being clean for 2 years next month. 

All the best   

  

[thecowisback]

You should post in success stories - we need to hear of people like you who are well on the way to total recovery 😁

[Ogres]

1 hour ago, thecowisback said:

You should post in success stories - we need to hear of people like you who are well on the way to total recovery 😁

I still feel very, very low sometimes. Much lower than normal. There is darkness and emptiness inside me. Doing my best to behave and look normal from the outside, thinking it's wd and it will pass one day. 

I seem to have an existential crisis at the same time. I need a new goal, a reason to live for. 

I'll sure post a success story when feeling like it. 

Thanks for your interest, thecowisback. 

 

[thecowisback]

so sorry to hear you're still having problems 😪

[Ogres]

Just a quick note at 2 years and 5 months off of prozac. Hopefully, it will give some hope to fellow members.

 

I feel fine and some days I even feel great! Following withdrawal symptoms are gone mostly or completely: nausea, light-headedness, GI problems, bone ache, muscle pain, blurred vision, bleeding gums, insomnia for several nights in a row, blushing, extreme anxiety w/o a reason.

 

There are still some residual WD related issues, like insomnia and deep depression. But they mostly appear after a trigger event, like a big argument with my partner. And for feeling depressed, winter sun (or lack of it) doesn’t help either. Otherwise, there are no symptoms, which limit my day-to-day functioning. I do what any other healthy person does: work, work out, travel, break-up/get back together/live with a partner, go out, etc. I even survived an event where I was the centre of attention without any external chemicals in my brain (though working out beforehand to get some natural endorphins calmed me down quite a bit).

 

I just need to make sure I don’t overstimulate myself like I did last summer when I travelled extensively, drank too much, ate unhealthily and as a result nearly reached a breaking point.

I’m mostly back to being my normal, un-medicated self with some situational social anxiety, which I’m addressing through non-drug coping techniques.    

 

I think I deserve a shining sun badge!

 

All the best!     

[thecowisback]

wow - this is fantastic news!!! you certainly do deserve that badge!!!!!

[Ogres]

😪 no badge for me...