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Starboy17

 took 1mg finasteride for near 8years albeit, I did take breaks, additionally I lowered the dose and only took it couple times a week, this is known as a maintenance dose.  However just over a year ago I decided to take a generic versions of propecia and like a shot of lightening I then noticed mood swings, moments of crying spells, it took a couple months to realise that it wasn't university studies and a personal fallout with a friend (although I bet it contributed) however it wasn't until I completely stopped taking finasteride that I experienced insomnia for the first time in my life! I kept having panic attacks after being asleep for two hours I would wake up gasping for air, I also had close to 15 panic attacks during the day, followed by general anxiety disorder, and a feeling of dread that was unlike anything I've ever experienced, that seemed unbaiting I would have to say hands down it was the worst mental breakdown of my life this lasted for at minimum of three months and progressively got worse. To complicate matters  I quit dexamphetamine 30mg a year earlier as I had been naughty on it as I only took it whenever I felt like it for over 3.5 -4yrs unfortunately I have ADHD and still do as an adult, yay lucky me! I also loved alcohol, was often considered the life of the party,(not my own assessment) however I have since decided that I self medicated with it and it only compounded my already fragile mental health, so I'm no longer drinking at all. 

 

I discussed the mood swings etc with my GP in Sydney Australia and was given Lexapro tablet (can't recall the dosage) the morning I felt great, by afternoon a sense of dread crept up on me followed by suicide ideation, whilst driving with my partner down the motorway I had intrusive thoughts about crashing my car, anyone who knows me, would agree that is the polar opposite of my personality, in the end I had no choice but to go to emergency the next day after I couldn't sleep and explain my symptoms, I was given  10mg Valium which did nothing except have a paradoxical effect, I felt more lively instead of relaxed I was later discharged and given 30mg of mirtazapine, I'm a small bloke 65kg but Wow that knocked right out of the water. 

 

Since April 2016 I've been stuck on mirtazapine. Through the haze that is my mirtazapine experience I knew that the dosage was far too high for me and regularly checked in with my GP and advised him, I've never been on an antidepressant before, only dexamphetime, I told the Dr there's no way i'm taking 30mg of mirtazpine!, he agreed to and I lowered the dose to 15mg although this was  still sedating throughout the day along with memory issues, which I never had experienced in my whole life, I've always been a remarkable person for memory so that was really scary for me,  eventually I started my own research, why not I'm a tertiary student, thank God I found this site and Dr Joseph Glenmullens book! I even had to take a semester off study and reduced to part time.  Guess that law degree can wait. 

 

I'm currently on 2.8mg of mirtazapine and can't wait to be off this, however through painful experience the withdrawals are debilitating and that's putting it kindly, I saw a Psychiatrist last month and he mentioned that I must be ultra sensitive, I'm reminding myself regularly that I'm strong and that every day i'm healing and everyday I'm getting stronger.  I'm not one for mantra's but this does actually help

 

Sorry Alto if I raved on or if I didn't put this post in the right place, I've been reading and following your advice for months, quite studiously I will add and been wanting to post my experience so badly but have been so incapacitated by all that I've experienced over the last year. So days I feel I'm holding for dear life, the tapering can be so demoralizing at times and then out of nowhere I get tiny glimpses of gaining my old sense of self again, there's so much more I want to say but for now, i'm amazed I've been able to type what I have.  Peace 

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scallywag

Starboy17 -- Welcome to Surviving Antidepressants (SA)

 

Thank you for writing such a complete account of your experience with finasteride and mirtazapine. It's good that you found the site and have been tapering your dose gradually.  Would you tell us more about how you decreased from 15 mg to your current dose of 2.8 mg?

 

A request: Would you summarize your history in a signature -- drugs, doses, dates, and discontinuations & reinstatements, in the last 12-24 months particularly?

  • Any drugs prior to 24 months ago can just be listed with start and stop years.
  • Please use actual dates or approximate dates (mid-June, Late October) rather than relative time frames (last week, 3 months ago)
  • Spell out months, e.g. "October" or "Oct."; 9/1/2016 can be interpreted as Jan. 9, 2016 or Sept. 1, 2016.
  • Please leave out symptoms and diagnoses.
  • A list is easier to understand than one or multiple paragraphs.
  • Link to Account Settings – Create or Edit a signature.

 

It may be that you have decreased too quickly for your CNS (central nervous system).  Dr. Glenmullen's book is good in that he supports the existence of withdrawal symptoms as withdrawal; his recommendation of taper speed can be too much for many people.  Sadly the only way one discovers that the rate is too fast is by creating disconcerting and painful symptoms, by which time it may take many weeks or months to settle down.

 

I'm guessing from your post that you are relatively young, probably under 25.  Are you willing to challenge your ability to be patient, really test the limits of how you know yourself?  You might do well to hold at your current dose for several months to give your CNS time to catch up to your dose reductions so far.  The content at these two links may help you understand what is happening to create symptoms and the benefit of holding:

How your brain responds to psychiatric drugs - aka "Brain remodeling"

Youtube video, 4 minutes: Healing from antidepressants

 

I hope you'll find the information in the SA forums helpful for your situation. I'm sorry that you are in the position that you need the information, but am glad that you found us.

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Starboy17

Hi Scallyway,

 

Thanks for the quick response and the attachments:D being a novice here I knew I'd put things where I shouldn't.  I did attempt to put in my signature to the best of my ability some of the dates may not be completely correct but pretty darn close. btw i'm in my early 30's, yes I've learnt the hard way that my tapering has been too fast for my CNS which is why I'll be staying on the 2.8mg for a little while longer. The whole tapering progress is a lesson in patience, and that's a complete understatement!  I just feel as though I'm chemically inhibited and though my hyperactivity (ADHD) is coming back my body isn't in the mood for the excitement nor can it sustain the physical activities I once easily took for granted.  So I'm patiently tapering hoping this ordeal would be over it, asap.  But also mindful that it will run its own course and I'm best not to fight it

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scallywag

Not fighting withdrawal or its symptoms is an EXCELLENT approach. Bravo!

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Starboy17

Just wanted to know if anyone here has been fortunate to have successfully tapered off Remeron, I'm new here, although like most I have been lurking for well over 6months,

Edited by scallywag
merged topic "remeron tapering anyone finished"

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scallywag

Starboy, I moved your question about successful tapering off mirtazapine to your introduction topic so that more people will see  your question.

 

The tags below the title at the top of this page are a good way to find others who are tapering mirtazapine.  Just click on the tag and you'll get a list of all other topics, mostly member introductions, that have the same tag.  Off the top of my head, I can suggest that you connect with Santino. He joined SA in June 2016 and has come through difficult symptoms to feeling positive and healthy. Santino's intro topic.

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Hibari
14 hours ago, Starboy17 said:

Just wanted to know if anyone here has been fortunate to have successfully tapered off Remeron, I'm new here, although like most I have been lurking for well over 6months,

Hi Starboy17

 

I have tapered off of Remeron, just recently and have been off for a little over 3 months.  I was on it for a period of 10 months and it took 2 years and 3 months to get off.  I was on two medications at the same time and am very sensitive to medication.  (Still have to finish tapering my second medication).  The tapering at lower doses is harder but again, I survived.  I now am in the post withdrawal stabilizing phase, which for me is up and down.  I am not depressed but I do get anxious and have heat flashes in the early morning and sometimes during the day.  I usually wake with nausea and a headache but these symptoms are getting less intense. 

 

Remeron is one of the most powerful medications out there and is know for it's sedating qualities especially on the lower doses.   I probably could have gone lower in my cuts before I got off but my spirit was getting weary.  If you are feeling wd as you cut, it's a sure sign you need to stabilize and then move down bit by bit.

 

You can do it!

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Starboy17

Hi Hibari,

 

Very much appreciated for responding so quickly, I totally agree with you regarding remeron (mirtazapine) being such a difficult drug to stop.  The tapering annoys me more than anything but I'm gradually coming round to the idea of just accepting it, which is so not me, I really mean it, patience is a virtue but one that I've never possessed.

 

I'm getting better at living in the moment, I'm not worrying about the future (as much)  i'm also no longer using alcohol or my old dexamphetamine tablets recreationally which is a huge improvement, if I could just finish tapering remeron I'll feel all the better. Like yourself I took 1 Lexapro tablet and had a severe reaction, I had suicidal thoughts which I didn't have before I took it, I ended up in emergency and that's when I was given remeron.

 

I'm going to wait til I stabilise until I do another 5% cut as my energy low and my body ahes,  this whole experience has hanged my perspective on prescription medication, especially antidepressants.  But I'm still hoping and thanks again for taking the time out of your day to email me, Blessings xoxox

 

 

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Santino

HI Starboy

One more advice from me my friend. Limit the time of access to WD AD forums and the horror stories. I feel a lot better now that i concentrate on my issues and just enter into SA for updating my topic and checking onto my friends. The help i have gotten here is too much and i really thank all the guys who helped me during my tough times. But sometimes spending tooo much time on the forum makes us loose our focus. As we are nervously weak in case we have problems in life which we can not find solutions we go back to the forum reading and than blame all the things into the Remeron. Ok it might be 70-80% the Remeron the reason for our bad life but we need to concentrate on that 20-30% which is the real us. If we awaken that buddy and try to stick with that real us in time that guy will grow and the remeron one will become smaller in percentage. It has worked for me this was and i do not see a reason why it will not work for you.

You are reaching the end now. You need to be proud of yourself buddy.

Good luck

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Starboy17

so i'm on my third week tapering from 3ml to 2.8ml, and feeling the physical symptoms come back with a vengeance, the pain between my shoulders and yesterday and today legs aching and sore, seems like I'll have to hold for another week, though I really don't want to

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Hibari

I know, it's so counter intuitive to hold when you feel lousy.  It's human nature to want to stop or pull away from pain.

 

I think that has been the hardest thing for me-to fight the urge to stop the med when I feel sick.  Hang in there, you are doing it step by step.

 

 

Edited by ChessieCat
removed blank quote box

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Starboy17

Hi all,

 

just curious has anyone else suffered with sinus issues, or facial pain whilst tapering? I read somewhere not to take any antihistamines whereas others advocate it. My head has been aching pretty much all day

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ShakeyJerr
3 hours ago, Starboy17 said:

Hi all,

 

just curious has anyone else suffered with sinus issues, or facial pain whilst tapering? I read somewhere not to take any antihistamines whereas others advocate it. My head has been aching pretty much all day

 

Antihistamines were the basis for antidepressant meds. You run the risk of giving your system a bit too much of the hair of the dog that bit you.

 

My suggestion is to always go natural. For sinus relief and facial pain, use a humidifier. Cool mist is good for keeping the air moist. Use steam to break up congestion. You can also use moist warm compresses (not hot enough to redden the skin) for short bursts (10 minutes top) applied right to your face/sinus region.

 

Also, inhaling the steam from a hot cup of herbal or decaf tea can help. Just be sure to stay away from teas that can be activating - green tea or anything with caffeine, or Yerba Mate tea. Stick to decaf black tea and chamomile.

 

I'm not a doctor. If you think you have a deep running sinus issue, see one. This is just advice based on my own experiences.

 

SJ

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Starboy17

Thanks ShakeyJerr & ChessieCat,

 

I decided to skip taking Telfast or any antihistamine as last time even the smallest dose felt extremely sedating, almost to the point i felt exhaustion so i knew my body didn't like it one little bit.  As the headache was almost unbearable i took 1 tablet of paracetamol and although they usually did for me  in the past even that 1 tablet was powerful.  Mirtazapine is one powerful med that messed up my entire system...I felt like a 70yr old man with the flu...

 

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Hibari

Can't remember if I shared this before but I was hit by allergies in the fall.  I too did not want to take any antihistamines because they made me feel so out of it.  I was already feeling out of it on Mirt.  So I did some research and ended up trying Stinging Nettle tincture that I bought at a health food store.  It worked so well for me and I have continued using it every time I get sneezey and itchy eyes.  I only use the pure Stinging Nettle stuff, not mixed with anything else.   

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Starboy17

Hi all,

 

the sinus issues are slowly improving but my legs haven't, just continual aching, as though i've hiked up a mountain,  what's the suggestion for aching legs?

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scallywag

Have you searched our site for topics or mentions of muscle aches?

 

I did and found this one:

 

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Starboy17

Hi all,

 

I've been experiencing the usual aches & pains associated with tapering, although the symptoms are gradually receding, however what I'm now left with is

this burning like feeling in my stomach for the past 4 or so days.  I ended up taking a 20mg Somac tablet unsure if it really helped & cautious about taking it again

as we all know adding extra drugs in the mix can complicate/exacerbate issue later on.  I have reduced my caffeine intake to 1 per day and yet I'm still experiencing it. I was thinking this is just the next phase of healing in the tapering process.  I have read elsewhere that this is a very common symptom with tapering mirtazapine

 

Is it a good idea to take the 20mg Somac? Your assistance is greatly and very much appreciated. 

Edited by scallywag
merged topic

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scallywag

Starboy - I've moved your post/question to your introduction topic so that all your information, questions and answers are in one place. This site works somewhat differently than other sites - we ask that you post questions about your situation in your introduction topic (this one) rather than starting a new topic.  If members have previously started a discussion about a technique or symptom, we'll post a link to it for you.

 

What's the generic name of Somac? A quick look up I did says "pantoprazole" a proton pump inhibitor, something that if taken for too long will need to be tapered. Here are links to our discussion topics on digestive symptoms and on PPIs:

Digestive problems: nausea, diarrhea, bloating, GERD (acid reflux).

Tips for tapering off stomach acid blockers or PPIs.

That acid reflux pill may be causing health problems.

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Starboy17

Hi Scallywag

 

My apologies have been feeling really exhausted of late, this last taper has really hit me hard & my capacity to anything has been enormously affected.  I checked out the packet of the somac I have you're right its pantoprazole, I only took it once and only a 20mg at that.  I'm cautious about taking anything, particularly as i'm certain that the heartburn I was experiencing last week was part of the whole withdrawal/tapering issues just manifesting slightly differently.  Also I've read plenty of folks complain of the same issues i'm experiencing whilst tapering mirtazapine.  

 

Thanks for being so kind to respond to my post, you have no idea how grateful I really am.  This is really testing me in ways I've never been tested, nor want to be.  But I know if I have to accept it.  

 

 

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Starboy17

so here I am yet again, its been a month and one day since I tapered from 3mg to 2.8mg I would've thought there would be a better improvement by now but no.  I'm really struggling with that feeling my legs will give out on me when walking, also a weird burning like sensation in my head.  My energy is the lowest its been for a long while, I feel so exhausted and worried about how long until these symptoms improve.  I had a blood test yesterday and have an appointment tomorrow for my aching legs and weakness, though Dr thinks its a very low chance of it being anything other than the withdrawal from tapering.  I guess I just feel really discouraged that this process is not only unpredictable but that the duration is also uncertain.  

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ChessieCat

If you are finding that you are getting worse WD symptoms after a dose reduction it might be time to start slowing down and not reducing by the full 10%.

 

Many members have found that as their dose gets lower they need to make smaller reductions.

 

My suggestion would be to hold for more than 4 weeks this time (at least 6 weeks) to let your brain adapt before making another reduction.  Generally it is better to hold for longer than to try and reduce too quickly.

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Starboy17

ChessieCat, I'm finally getting better, the aching legs has stopped, my energy has also improved.  I'm definitely gonna hold for at least another 2 may even 3 weeks.  You're absolutely right I should've tapered by 2% instead of 5% the lower doses do make the withdrawal process debilitating and in my experience it takes longer to stabilize.  I'm experiencing some nightmares but that's improving to.  Blood test came back normal, yet again, typical withdrawals you'd think its something more serious by the way you feel.  That's a huge positive!

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Hibari

Glad to hear you are feeling better.  Yes the lower dosages are the worst!  

 

You will make it, just keep trusting your body 

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Starboy17

Been on 2.6mg just over a month, i'm noticing in the last two weeks fatigue and what i can only describe as my whole body in particular my torso feeling heavy, every know and then throughout the day it's as though my legs will give out on me.  I wish i could do more exercise but i feel if i did then i would be putting myself in a much worse position. I was thinking of taking a low dose of St Johns Wort but am aware that may potentially help or increase anxiety..  Any thoughts people?

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ChessieCat
1 hour ago, Starboy17 said:

I was thinking of taking a low dose of St Johns Wort but am aware that may potentially help or increase anxiety.

 

If it were me I would not take SJW.  Please see this topic:  st-johns-wort-hypericum-perforatum

 

Even though SJW is natural it would need to be tapered.  See:  tapering-st-johns-wort/

 

 

Have you tried Magnesium?  I have found when I stop taking my magnesium that my anxiety increases and when I start taking it again the anxiety lessens.  This has happened about 3 times during my tapering so I feel sure that the magnesium is helping.

 

Edited by ChessieCat
corrected magnesium link

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Starboy17

Hi ChessieCat,

 

I decided not to try the St Johns Wort, I did try magnesium before, I"m not sure if it made me feel lethargic or it was withdrawal.  I've been somewhat reluctant to try it again is that i have a slightly lower heart rate which sits around at 54bpm, My GP sent me to a cardiologist as it got down to 40bpm whilst sleeping, i had to wear the Holter Monitor, that was anxiety provoking as I just turned 35!    Cardiologist said everything is fine, I guess i could halve the magnesium tablet. This tapering process is so demoralising at times, just when i think i'm making progress i get slammed.  Doing a law degree and tapering is just insane.....btw ChessieCat, thanks so much for responding it feels good to have my feelings validated

 

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ChessieCat

You're welcome.  I'm glad you have decided again SJW.

 

Some people find mixing magnesium with water and sipping throughout the day works for them.  I take 1/2 tablet morning and night and find that works for me.  There are several different varieties of magnesium which the topic discusses.  Also, if taking calcium you need to take them at different times.  I found this out from the topic and have since seen magnesium + calcium being sold in the pharmacy.

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Starboy17

Decided to try some little exercise I ran on the spot for 15 seconds, waited a minute then tried 20 seconds, well that tipped me right over the edge my body just felt like it gave out on me, I felt as though I had run a 10 kilometre marathon, my body just ached so bad that and I was out of breath that I had a panic attack. Mind you I've had been feeling dizzy for over week, I ended up in emergency and after a few tests I was discharged.  I'm still experiencing dizziness no matter what i'm doing, in addition to the mental fog, body aches, and when I walk I feel my legs with give out on me.  This damn tapering process is discouraging and I'm going fairly slow, How do I maintain any sanity when i'm now experiencing the worst withdrawals I've ever experienced.  Despite being on 2.6 for now just over a month, i'm almost considering going back up to 2.7mg this is just utter torture. 

 

Does anyone have any advice what I can or should do?

 

Kind regards,

 

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Kitson

Starboy, it's good to see you post again, I've missed you. Saw your post and wanted to say Hi.

 

I'm sorry you're feeling so poorly right now. I'm sure someone will come along and give you some suggestions. (((Hugs)))

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Starboy17

Thanks for responding Kitson, I still feel awful, just the body aching and increased anxiety.  I had an eye test today which thankfully revealed that i need either bifocals or one pair of glasses for reading and the other for every other activity.  I'm trying my best to practice gratitude, i understand that helps.  I'm continuing to experience fatigue and my body feels so heavy that I'm pushing my self just to get up and walk. 

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Shebon

Hi Starboy:

I experienced the weak muscles in my legs too, and some dizziness.  I decided to see if I could taper off 3.75 mg. remeron in July, by going to 1/2 of 3.75 mg.  By day 26, I had insomnia, dizziness, achiness, chatty mind, and other ugly stuff.  For the achiness, magnesium and Tylenol helped. 

 

I reinstated to 3.75 mg. and felt stabilized around week 6 or so.  But I am determined to begin a proper liquid taper off this stuff in March 2018.  It will take a long time, but hopefully, a better taper this time.

 

Best regards,

Shebon

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Starboy17

Hi Shebon,

 

I'm sorry to read your story and yet i'm not surprised at the hell you must have experienced.  I too did something similar to yourself several months back and halved my 3.75mg tablet for  two days then stopped, 12 days later i was in emergency feeling as though i had either a chest infection or something else.  Turned out it was the mirtazapine withdrawals. I'm taking it slower but i think as of today I've got very little option but to reinstate back up to 2.7mg as the withdrawals are just debilitating to say the least.  i'm still experiencing weakness as though my legs will just give out on me at any moment when walking, intermittent burning sensations between my shoulders, back of my head, legs and feet.   The dizziness is continuing and considering its been 5 weeks and one day i could literally scream from the frustration of having to go back up.  This is getting me so ******* down, my advice is to forget about time frames when you hope to be off this med, don't wanna rain on peoples parade but the reality of this for me and many others is that it will take as long as your body needs to adjust and that is anyone's guess.

 

Anyone on here have any ideas on whether i should just up-dose to 2.7mg?  that was the dose i was at prior to 2.6mg.  I did experience the withdrawals but they were at least tolerable.  ANY ADVICE would be appreciated

 

Kind regards,

 

Greg

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ChessieCat

Oh these tiny doses are enough to drive anyone crazy! :wacko: 

 

My suggestion would be to try a very small increase of of 0.025 (ie 1/4 of 0.1mg) to make a dose of 2.625mg if possible.  Your brain will have made some adjustment in the time you have been on 2.6mg so going all the way back up to 2.7mg will probably be too much.

 

You may need to taper by 0.05 increments from now on.

 

 

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