RainbowDbc: Welcoming myself with my story

[RainbowDbc]

Moderator's note:  link to RainbowDbc's benzo thread - RainbowDbc: What should I do now?

 

 

Hi everyone..My name is Diana. I am 30 years old. I have been on many drugs but particularly rivotril and lithium. It all started at the age of of 18. I had a psychotic episode and was labeled as bipolar. I didnt have a history before on mood swings or any bipolar traits. So they gave me many drugs and I was convinced I needed them. I was told maby lies. That my brain needed or did not produce enough lithium. That it was for life. I gradually developed insomnia and was given rivotril. 5 years later I realized my body and brain had changed a lot. I started to investigate on youtube and other sources. But no one listened. I was coerced by police my psychoatrists especially my parents. I was being forced on meditation even though my instinct told me it was the wrong path. Its been another 5 years. My memory is gone, I have mental fatigue, I am not creative or very empathic anymore or expressive and spontaneous. My life has turned grey. I feel generally stupid and cannot hold a task for too long. I have tapered from 3 pills to one and am having experiences that werentbthere before. Suicide ideation, fatigue, strong insomnia, feeling empty or adhedonia...generally like my brain is really sick and fragile. I have angry bursts but they make no sense as my braon can make all my thoughts coherent when Im a bit emotional. There is more it to my story but this is what is most prevalent. I wish I had cancer to stop this. Im 30 and have been missing out due to being so drugged and spellbinded. Id like to try amino acids and a very healthy diet..Exercise..Tanning. But I dont have a real way to do things effectively with such strong withdrawal effects. I barely want to leave the house. I dont know of anyone that has taken lithium to talk about this with. I hope anyone could give me some orientation and support. Thank you...

Edited August 20, 2017 by Shep
added tags and link to benzo forum thread

[Altostrata]

Welcome, Rainbow.

 

What drugs are you taking now, at what times of day, and what dosages?

 

Which drug did you decrease from 3 pills to one?

 

Please do what you can to stay calm while we puzzle this out. Going on and off drugs can indeed upset your nervous system and cause dark thoughts. Please hold onto the idea that your symptoms are adverse drug effects and not the "real you," you will get through them and feel better eventually.

 

Can you take a walk for maybe 30 minutes a day? That's a way to get started with exercise, and it's good for nervous system functioning.

 

 

[RainbowDbc]

Hi thank you for responding Altostrata. I don't have an accurate recollection of my history with drugs I just recognize their names. I am suppose to be taking respiridone I dont know how much because I never take it. 900 mgs of lithium and 2 mgms of  rivotril. That is what my doctor prescribed me. I am currently taking one pill of lithium and half the dose of rivotril......I dont have an exact time for lithium I cut it in 4 pieces and my body gets anxious and warns me.I should take one piece. By the end of the day I took a whole lithium. I take rivotril at 9 or 10 pm to sleep. I only focus on tapering lithium for now. I exercise as much as I can by walking, swimming, and hiking. My diet is.high on protein good fats and vegetables. I take some supplements like b complex amd omega 3. Some days Im vigorous and stable others Im anxious or falling apart or flat.  I need exercise to be balanced my food has to be nutritious it also balances me. But Ive become hyper sensitive to any changes and suffer from feeling sleep deprived even with rivotril. I dont know how to fix that anymore.  

[Shep]

Hi, RainbowDbc.

 

I saw where you started a topic over in the benzo forum here, but I'm not sure that it's best to taper the benzodiazepine first. We need more information.

 

In order to taper, it's important to take your drugs at the same time every day and very consistently. For now, please set up a routine and schedule so you can take your drugs at the same dose and same time every day. 

 

We really need you to give us the information about your drugs. You say you're supposed to take risperidone, but you don't know how much because you never take it.  Please look at the bottle and post what dose is listed. Do you know when was the last time you took it? How many months / years have you been prescribed this drug?

 

Please set up a signature. Please include drugs, doses, dates, and discontinuations & reinstatements, in the last 12-24 months. Also include supplements. This will help us give you the most accurate advice we can. 

• Any drugs and supplements prior to 24 months ago can just be listed with start and stop years. 
• Please use actual dates or approximate dates (mid-June, Late October) rather than relative time frames (last week, 3 months ago) 
• Spell out months, e.g. "October" or "Oct."; 9/1/2016 can be interpreted as Jan. 9, 2016 or Sept. 1, 2016. 
• Please leave out symptoms and diagnoses. 
• A list is easier to understand than one or multiple paragraphs. 
• Link to Account Settings – Create or Edit a signature.

I'm glad you found Surviving Antidepressants for information and support. This is your thread to list your symptoms and to ask questions. Please keep updating.

 

[RainbowDbc]

Lithium 1 pill, 225 mlgms, I take with no hour set because I take advantage of the moment when i get anxious...it numbs me. But I can arrange a schedule. 

 

Rivotril 1 mlg every night before sleep

 

This is what I[m currently taking, I don't even have a date of my last taper, which is in part irresponsable but i also kind of lost a sense of time, so i will create my first signature....with my current information. 

 

I will create a signature, I'm just new to the website and quite understand. Thank you

 

So I don't write down symptoms or withdrawal effects anywhere?

 

I have some questions but I'm not sure where to post them, it says cannot start a topic, so if I have a question, where can i do this?

 

I honestly don't have any kind of written history, only my doctor does and it's probably full of meds being added and changed constantly, but I know i have been fixed on lithium for years now. I don't have a sense of time and tapering is new to me....I haven't systemized this process completely. 

Edited August 20, 2017 by baroquep
white space

[Shep]

12 minutes ago, RainbowDbc said:

So I don't write down symptoms or withdrawal effects anywhere?

I have some questions but I'm not sure where to post them, it says cannot start a topic, so if I have a question, where can i do this?

 

Hi, Rainbow.

 

Please keep posting your questions here in this thread. This is your thread to document your taper so all of your information is in one place. This makes it easier for us and easier for you.  Yes, it's fine to also list your symptoms.  Thanks for the additional information you are providing. 

[RainbowDbc]

I tried creating a signature but even the smallest photo wont work but Ill manage to fix it soon. 

I wanted to know howmto find people other people that were addicted to lithium...the discontinuation reactions I have might be different yet similar from the rest. 

I am waking up at 4 for no reason, and my brain seems.to be under going changes even while I havent lowered the dose. Its been a stable dosage for a.month now and I wont be tapering soon. 

The person that brought me.to this page Rico has been tapering with me for many months now, we have been on this process together altho online...and were experiencing identical changes and coinciding in many ways at our own rates. I never thought I would become angry easily but I am starting to have feisty reactions. I was very numb before.

This truly feels like a bipolar experience...anxiety comes and goes, suddenly I feel shut off, Im.regulated then slow or just despressed and sad. I do not have chronic fatigue anymore and I have lost a lot of weight. Sometimes Im articulate at other times its very hard to put words together. 

Recently my sleep patterns have changed which does affect everything else. I wake up at 4 am and take a small piece of rivotril to sleep 2 hours more. Its a very superficial kind of sleep. My brain feels accelerated and like its pressing all.over the place like something is happening I just dont know what. I pay close attention to all my reactions....but its incredibly draining that any subtle changes creates chaos constantly...due to hypersensitivity. 

These are all my most recent withdrawal symptoms. I would like to know if taking l triptophan might be a good idea and safe for me.to start learning how to sleep? If I am.sleep deprived the next day is hectic its only when I have good sleep that my day passes by normally.  

[Shep]

18 hours ago, RainbowDbc said:

I wanted to know howmto find people other people that were addicted to lithium...the discontinuation reactions I have might be different yet similar from the rest. 

 

 

Hi, Rainbow.

 

If you go to the top of your page and look under your username over on the left, you'll see "tags" with your drugs listed. If you click on the tag that states "lithium", it will bring up a list of members who also are tagged with that drug. I did that and came up with this list:

 

http://survivingantidepressants.org/tags/lithium/

 

These links will help you understand the withdrawal process more. It's comforting to find out what you're going through is what others going through withdrawal are also experiencing. It will get better.  

 

What is withdrawal syndrome? 
 
The Windows and Waves Pattern of Stabilization

 

How psychiatric drugs remodel your brain

 

Healing from antidepressants. Patterns of recovery - video 4 minutes

[RainbowDbc]

Shep thank you. I will be on it and yes Ill find people that are having a hard time on lithium. Im sure our reactions to withdrawal are different than that of.benzos or antidepressants...but its hard to pinpoint why. I saw the video..I actually had read a lot of those I tend to absorb as much as I can and accepting waves as a healing process gives me a positive outlook it should seem like progress. Im very hands on with what is actually happening but thisninformation is limited. I found not so much info on solutions to lithium withdrawal. I...took the liberty of taking a bit more rivitril to tolerate lithium withdrawal. After hours without lithium I feel a huge sense of activity like my brain is over worked. No anxiety. Just over worked liked feelungs and I stop this with a small.chunk of lithium and it goes away. In order to stop this with less lithium maybe some rivotril can help diminish this symptom. I am afraid of psychosis due to any strange exertion.  I understand that leaving any drug will cause a contrary effect..Lithium being a mood stabiliser (so called, its just a metal) might create mania or psychosis without it. Im trying to dumb myself down with rivotril as a temporary solution. I wish lithium taperers gave me feedback..

[Shep]

15 hours ago, RainbowDbc said:

I found not so much info on solutions to lithium withdrawal.

 

 

Hi, Rainbow. If you haven't already done so, it may help to read the thread on tapering lithium:

 

Tips for tapering off lithium

 

15 hours ago, RainbowDbc said:

I...took the liberty of taking a bit more rivitril to tolerate lithium withdrawal.

 

Before you taper, please start a schedule where you are taking your drugs consistently, at the same time each day and at the same dose. This is very important.

 

Please add a signature:

 

Account Settings – Create or Edit a signature.

Edited August 23, 2017 by Shep

[RainbowDbc]

9Shep thank you. I will be on it and yes Ill find people that are having a hard time on lithium. Im sure our reactions to withdrawal are different than that of.benzos or antidepressants...but its hard to pinpoint why. 

Im having psychosis like symptoms. My brain is flooding with energy and pressure just a lot of energy. Its hard to slow this down and it can induce psychosis well.that is me.previous experience withdrawing...

[Shep]

Hi, Rainbow.

 

I'm not so sure are reactions are different due to the specific drug. It seems it has to do more with how destabilized the nervous system becomes. For some people, their nervous system is profoundly affected by coming off a SSRI and benzo. And for others, the nervous system is destabilized by an antipsychotic. 

 

Regardless of what drug(s) you are dealing with, the best advice is to do a slow taper so your nervous system is treated as gently as possible.

 

18 hours ago, RainbowDbc said:

Im having psychosis like symptoms. My brain is flooding with energy and pressure just a lot of energy. Its hard to slow this down and it can induce psychosis well.that is me.previous experience withdrawing...

 

When you say "psychosis like symptoms", what do you mean? Are you hearing voices or seeing visions? Or do you just feel agitated and restless? Do you feel detached from reality?

 

 

[RainbowDbc]

Its an accelerated constant pressure in my head. It started at 7 pm.yesterday. i woke up completely lost like.my.head is injured. Now today Its like.Im goingbto.pass out. It went from extreme activity to....feeling exhausted. This feels.dangerous. its.not depression related. Someone told.me.that if I withdraw lithium.I can feel rivotril get stronger as a reaction....this got me.very confused. Im only focused on lithium at 225 mgms but everyday the symptoms are getting stronger and I do.not understand why..I dont know what to expect. I tapered the 14th its the 25th and my body is having bizarre reactions. This is new to.me Shep so how.am I suppose to know if something is badly wrong or its a wave?  Im simply getting sicker. Psychosos felt like some incoherent thoughts..no voices. I thought I was aiming that direction so.I took some rivotril to sedate this reaction and it worked apparently..

[Shep]

Hi, Rainbow.

 

Please answer these questions:

 

1.  When did you stop taking Risperidone?  You mention this drug in your post here, and I'm concerned that you are off your antipsychotic without tapering it. How long had you been on it (or any other antipsychotic)?

 

2.  You mentioned you are supposed to take 900 mg of lithium and 2 mg of rivotril in this post here. But in this post, you state you are only on 225 mg lithium and 1 mg rivotril. When did you decrease the lithium and the rivotril? How fast did you taper down to 225 mg lithium and 1 mg rivotril? 

 

Over the weekend, please post your drugs and your symptoms in this format:

 

Keep notes on paper about your drug dosages and daily symptom pattern

 

 

[RainbowDbc]

Um....

Ive always avoided anti psychotics I dont takethem Im not depedent on them either. Only have I taken zyprexa risperidone like during past psychotic episodes. I dont take them at all costs.

I have been on rivotril since I can remember but I tapered from 2 to 1 6  months ago and was satisfied because I need them to sleep...no withdrswal reactions. 

I tapered lithium off since three months ago....and never had a reaction. I tapered from 900 to 225 in these 3 months yes I went a bit fast. 

Now that Im on one pill I have been very shaky. I tapered around a month ago and havent tapered since. Im still on 225 mgms..

 But I am having strange highs then lows.....I dont know if I should go back up. I wish I didnt. 

I have used rivotril as a last resort to calm the over drive from lack of lithium.

I honestly dont know what to do. I feel like Im frying my brain with ovrr activity then complete flatness. 

Im freightened Ive tried to be patient and not fast taper anymore..but my brain is a bit out of control and unpredictable are these just waves or am I doing things all wrong??

Also I am taking the pill in 4 chunks to keep my brain calm as possible. Not a pill at night at the same hour. I dont know if this is a mistake. 

Should I take rivotril to calm the reactions or is this wreckless? 

 

 

[RainbowDbc]

The side effects are of all sorts. 

When I took 900 mlgms of lithium I was numb, chrinicalky fatigued, had a narrow view of things, suffered memory loss...loss of appetite. I seemed bored all the time in extreme apathy. 

 

Now at 225 mlgms my mind isnt foggy, Im faster....I can feel negative emotions more strongly like anger or crying. Im still numb but more responsive. I lost a lot of weight. I have had suicide ideation and depression but I walk it off. Im not chronically fatigued anymore. I can have flash backs. I am prone to anxiety but I try to exercise and its controlled. I have insomnia if room conditions arent right.  I have woken up at 4 am sometimes. I mainly have issues with the overdrive of my brain andcthen it slumps back down to flatness like im completely drained. When its on over drive and migraine like I get disoriented. Id rather deal with severe depression than over drive I feel too much of it will lead me to psychosis. I have taken green tea supplements to.prevent an over heated brain. I do suffer from apathy it comes and goes but always there. There might be more symptoms but these are the most common reactions on a daily basis since I started tapering.  One lithium user described having no breaks once you taper which is the closest metaphor to my problem. It seems like a common reaction but its hard to stop you need to be sedated. Im a bit distressed because I dont have a clue to what my brain is doing during over drive and no one knows apparently.

Rico said taking one lithium in chunks at no fixed hours was wreckless but its how I calm the over drive. If it goes out of hand what then? I know I ask too many questions but objective answers calm me more than venting. If I understood dynamics better I feel more hopeful Shep.

Ill try and describe one day to see if I can spot a pattern. 

[RainbowDbc]

I think one reasonable observation iscthat when I do stop exercising the world around me stops as well. I have way more symptoms pop up. Staying at home makes things worse I need to be busy but not stressed. I also became hypersensitive I wonder if this is for life. Anything triggers something. Anything. I also have metabolic syndrome this doesnt have a fix its irreversible so.my diet is low on carbs sugsrss and processed foods. I feel chained to a certain lifestyle to keep myself balanced. 

[Shep]

12 hours ago, RainbowDbc said:

Ive always avoided anti psychotics I dont takethem Im not depedent on them either. Only have I taken zyprexa risperidone like during past psychotic episodes. I dont take them at all costs.

 

Rainbow, it only takes 1 month to become dependent on an antipsychotic. If you aren't able to answer questions, we aren't going to be able to help you.

 

Again, when were you on antipsychotics in the past? At what dose? Please give the month and year of use. 

 

12 hours ago, RainbowDbc said:

I have been on rivotril since I can remember but I tapered from 2 to 1 6  months ago and was satisfied because I need them to sleep...no withdrswal reactions. 

I tapered lithium off since three months ago....and never had a reaction. I tapered from 900 to 225 in these 3 months yes I went a bit fast. 

Now that Im on one pill I have been very shaky. I tapered around a month ago and havent tapered since. Im still on 225 mgms..

 But I am having strange highs then lows.....I dont know if I should go back up. I wish I didnt. 

 

"Since I can remember" doesn't help us. We need a concrete timeline. 

 

Again, when did you start taking rivotril? Have you been on other benzos? Please list the month or at least the year you started taking rivotril. 

 

The symptoms you are describing are likely coming from your rapid tapering of these drugs and the inconsistent dosing. You state you had "no withdrawal reactions" and yet you are listing many symptoms in your posts. 

 

Please note that these drugs can create a delayed withdrawal. Some people don't experience withdrawal for a number of weeks or months after decreasing. And that looks like what has happened. 

 

Please do your best to answer the questions I highlighted in bold. You likely would benefit from updosing the Lithium, but I'd like to get the other moderators to look at your history before recommending a dose to use with an updose. 

[RainbowDbc]

Ill have to call my doctor to know about my antipsychotics but I genuinely dont know because I throw them away. I actively took seroquel from age 22 to 24 but my doc changed it. Im not taking anti psychotics I just recieve them at the pharmacy out of protocol.  If Ive had 5 or 6 psychotic episodes....then yes I was forced zyprexa but as soon as it stops they tske the anti psychotic off..and I eventually cold taper if they dont. 

I dont have exact date for tapering off rivotril but I tapered from 2 mgm to 1 mg this was atleast 6 months ago if not longer. It solved the drowzyness. I sleep and never had a reaction. I cut my pill literally to half and was ok....one mlgm of rivotril is probably so much I didnt have withdrawal or I got lucky. 

My only tapers have been on lithium. I wish I had written down anything but I cant I have parents that monitor me and they will count pills to make sure I take them. Theres drama on a whole other level due to my pills. 

In the last three months I joined groups read about why tapering had to be slow and figured stuff out recently. I have not tapered off more from lithium. As far as history I have always been on rivotril. (10 years)

Lithium as well. Lithium has been present in my life for 10 years..They gave me other drugs to make therapy more effective but they were not permanent.  For that info I would have to ask my doctor. That alone can get me in trouble. He tries new meds on me when he can. He tried Trileptal for seizues it only caused seizures so yes I left them. He gave me wellbuitrin 24 hours later I was agitating and very suicidal I stopped taking it. I told him I had cognitive dysfunction he gave me Strattera and I stoped it two days later. I was high all day and certainly not smarter...There is a new drug right now an anti psychotic and its an injection that lasts one month and he wants me on it, invega?  I said no Im doing fine with lithium...I am trying to do this without anyone knowing . If I had done everything my doctor wants I would not be able to write or cordinate thoughts today Shep.. I have tried so many drugs and I dont have a sense of time or good memory. Im not being difficult its just the truth. 

Facts:

My rivotril is stable at 1 mlgm. Its only lithium that Im struggling with. If I have to up a dose I will. Because I might have tapered too fast. 

All the symptoms I wrote previously are new to me. I coukd smoke cigarettes all day now I cant finish a whole cigarette. My whole body has changed...All since I last tapered lithium...being on one pill was the limit and I stayed there.  Like the brain squeezes or my eyes hurting all day. I plan on keeping 225 of lithium mlgms for 2 months to be sure I can taper more once Im stable. Is this ok? 

The brain being over active concerns me deeply....

PS- if its delayed withdrawal.... what do ppl do? Do they increase the med?  

 

 

 

[Shep]

On 8/26/2017 at 10:49 AM, RainbowDbc said:

Ill have to call my doctor to know about my antipsychotics but I genuinely dont know because I throw them away. I actively took seroquel from age 22 to 24 but my doc changed it. Im not taking anti psychotics I just recieve them at the pharmacy out of protocol.  If Ive had 5 or 6 psychotic episodes....then yes I was forced zyprexa but as soon as it stops they tske the anti psychotic off..and I eventually cold taper if they dont. 

 

Let's try this to get a timeline for the antipsychotics:

 

1. How old are you now? 

 

2.  When was your last psychotic episode? Did it involve a hospital? If so, how long were you there? 

[JanCarol]

Hey Rainbow - just a few quick notes while I'm away from my desk.

 

Please, Please Put Your Drug History Into your Signature  if you are using from a phone, you might try this:  Complete your Signature from Phone or Tablet

 

There is so much we don't know about you without that, and it is the bare minimum for participation here at SA.   It offers respect to people who are trying to help you, and courtesy to the community at large.

 

What you describe about the Grayness is very similar to what I felt on lithium.  Have you had liver and kidney function (blood) tests while on the lithium?  You say you have been on lithium for 10 years - at 10 years (900 mg), I started to develop toxicity from the lithium.  It is easy to go into toxicity and needs to be monitored closely.

 

It is vital that you are well hydrated!  Drink plenty of water, and consider using electolytes to help with hydration.  Additionally, it only takes one event of dehydration to cause damage to your kidneys.

 

If you are breaking your lithium tablets, you need to be taking it 2x a day for good coverage and minimal symptoms.

 

It may be helpful to quit using the B-complex, as it can really rev up your symptoms, especially those mania-like ones.  I am not an advocate of B-Complex anyway, as the ratios of B-vitamins you need might be different to what is in a compound.

 

On 8/20/2017 at 0:21 PM, RainbowDbc said:

Lithium 1 pill, 225 mlgms, I take with no hour set because I take advantage of the moment when i get anxious...it numbs me. But I can arrange a schedule.

 

It is vital that you take this to a schedule.  If it is XR (Extended release) you can take it 1x a day.  If it is IR (Immediate Release) you must take it 2x a day.  It is fine to break the tablets to do this.  My 250 mg tablets were Immediate Release.  I suggest that you could take 1/2 in the morning and 1/2 at night.  It is important to be disciplined about this - lithium does not have immediate mood effects, but is instead a cumulative effect over time, depending on your levels.

Think of it like chlorine in a pool - you can add chlorine tablets to the pool - but it's the levels of chlorine that you need to manage, depending on sun, rain, etc.  At some point, the chlorine levels can become toxic, and if you use it erratically, it does not do its job.

 

On 8/21/2017 at 9:58 AM, RainbowDbc said:

I would like to know if taking l triptophan might be a good idea and safe for me.to start learning how to sleep?

 

No.  Not safe or recommended, and can be addictive and cause withdrawal symptoms of its own.  In order to sleep, the best path is to do so naturally with Sleep Hygiene.  Important Topics about Symptoms Including Sleep Problems

 

On 8/24/2017 at 3:55 PM, RainbowDbc said:

Ill find people that are having a hard time on lithium. Im sure our reactions to withdrawal are different than that of.benzos or antidepressants...but its hard to pinpoint why

 

Actually, the withdrawals from lithium depend greatly on what other drugs you have been on.  Very few people are on lithium as a monotherapy.  If you have been on antidepressants, then withdrawal from lithium will be like antidepressant withdrawal.  In my experience, anyway.  It is like a buffer, or a cushion.  As you have some experience with neuroleptics (that's what "antipsychotics" are), you may be getting some symptoms from that, too.  This is why Shep asks detailed questions about your various drugs.  Please respect her efforts and answer her questions, in detail.  

 

At toxic levels, lithium is very numbing and anhedonic.  But the dysregulation that happens in lithium withdrawal, also happens in withdrawal from other drugs.

 

Mostly, if you are having severe symptoms (sounds kind of "manic") Then you have tapered too quickly!!!  Withdrawing from lithium too quickly can induce manic-like symptoms!

You may wish to go back up to 337.5 mg of lithium, taking 169 mg am and 168 mg pm, until you stabilise.  That is what I would do if I were in your shoes.  Going into mania was one of my great fears when I tapered lithium, and is vital to why you must go slowly.  Mania can ruin your life and relationships.  Go slowly, and retain your inner center.  Then, after a few months of stability you will have the option to taper more safely.  You will want to get a scale to do this accurately:  

 

.

On 8/25/2017 at 4:22 PM, RainbowDbc said:

Should I take rivotril to calm the reactions or is this wreckless? 

 

This is like asking the devil to save you from sin. Rivotril is addicting, and we don't know how much of your symptoms are from the Rivotril withdrawal, as well.  There is a  delay in symptoms from withdrawal, sometimes 3-6 months or more after quitting or reducing the drug.  So while you say you had "no withdrawal" from reducing Rivotril 6 months ago, some of your symptoms could still be from that reduction.

I believe that most of your symptoms are from coming off the lithium too fast.  The danger here is this:  that once you've reduced the lithium, it may not "cover" the same things it did before.  I would try an updose to see if you can get it covered before things spin out of control.

 

 

That's a lot of information, I know.  I'm sorry for that, but I don't know when I can look in again.

 

Please let us know what you decide to do, and we'll help as we can.

 

I hope you see the sun today (your exercise program sounds really helpful!).

 

 

 

Edited August 29, 2017 by JanCarol
type of tests

[RainbowDbc]

2 hours ago, JanCarol said:

Hey Rainbow - just a few quick notes while I'm away from my desk.

 

Please, Please Put Your Drug History Into your Signature  if you are using from a phone, you might try this:  Complete your Signature from Phone or Tablet

 

There is so much we don't know about you without that, and it is the bare minimum for participation here at SA.   It offers respect to people who are trying to help you, and courtesy to the community at large.

 

What you describe about the Grayness is very similar to what I felt on lithium.  Have you had liver and kidney function (blood) tests while on the lithium?  You say you have been on lithium for 10 years - at 10 years (900 mg), I started to develop toxicity from the lithium.  It is easy to go into toxicity and needs to be monitored closely.

 

It is vital that you are well hydrated!  Drink plenty of water, and consider using electolytes to help with hydration.  Additionally, it only takes one event of dehydration to cause damage to your kidneys.

 

If you are breaking your lithium tablets, you need to be taking it 2x a day for good coverage and minimal symptoms.

 

It may be helpful to quit using the B-complex, as it can really rev up your symptoms, especially those mania-like ones.  I am not an advocate of B-Complex anyway, as the ratios of B-vitamins you need might be different to what is in a compound.

 

 

It is vital that you take this to a schedule.  If it is XR (Extended release) you can take it 1x a day.  If it is IR (Immediate Release) you must take it 2x a day.  It is fine to break the tablets to do this.  My 250 mg tablets were Immediate Release.  I suggest that you could take 1/2 in the morning and 1/2 at night.  It is important to be disciplined about this - lithium does not have immediate mood effects, but is instead a cumulative effect over time, depending on your levels.

Think of it like chlorine in a pool - you can add chlorine tablets to the pool - but it's the levels of chlorine that you need to manage, depending on sun, rain, etc.  At some point, the chlorine levels can become toxic, and if you use it erratically, it does not do its job.

 

 

No.  Not safe or recommended, and can be addictive and cause withdrawal symptoms of its own.  In order to sleep, the best path is to do so naturally with Sleep Hygiene.  Important Topics about Symptoms Including Sleep Problems

 

 

Actually, the withdrawals from lithium depend greatly on what other drugs you have been on.  Very few people are on lithium as a monotherapy.  If you have been on antidepressants, then withdrawal from lithium will be like antidepressant withdrawal.  In my experience, anyway.  It is like a buffer, or a cushion.  As you have some experience with neuroleptics (that's what "antipsychotics" are), you may be getting some symptoms from that, too.  This is why Shep asks detailed questions about your various drugs.  Please respect her efforts and answer her questions, in detail.  

 

At toxic levels, lithium is very numbing and anhedonic.  But the dysregulation that happens in lithium withdrawal, also happens in withdrawal from other drugs.

 

Mostly, if you are having severe symptoms (sounds kind of "manic") Then you have tapered too quickly!!!  Withdrawing from lithium too quickly can induce manic-like symptoms!

You may wish to go back up to 337.5 mg of lithium, taking 169 mg am and 168 mg pm, until you stabilise.  That is what I would do if I were in your shoes.  Going into mania was one of my great fears when I tapered lithium, and is vital to why you must go slowly.  Mania can ruin your life and relationships.  Go slowly, and retain your inner center.  Then, after a few months of stability you will have the option to taper more safely.  You will want to get a scale to do this accurately:  

 

.

 

This is like asking the devil to save you from sin. Rivotril is addicting, and we don't know how much of your symptoms are from the Rivotril withdrawal, as well.  There is a  delay in symptoms from withdrawal, sometimes 3-6 months or more after quitting or reducing the drug.  So while you say you had "no withdrawal" from reducing Rivotril 6 months ago, some of your symptoms could still be from that reduction.

I believe that most of your symptoms are from coming off the lithium too fast.  The danger here is this:  that once you've reduced the lithium, it may not "cover" the same things it did before.  I would try an updose to see if you can get it covered before things spin out of control.

 

 

That's a lot of information, I know.  I'm sorry for that, but I don't know when I can look in again.

 

Please let us know what you decide to do, and we'll help as we can.

 

I hope you see the sun today (your exercise program sounds really helpful!).

 

 

 

Hi Carrol, Thank you fpr responding..I know Ive been difficult as far as techbology Im old school...and tapering has been a very dynammic experience.

 

Im goibg to try and answer as much as I can. They drew blood from me and had to on a monthly basis initially in the first years but everyone trusted that I was fine I was taking 900 mlgms and no one considered my liver or kidneys getting slower and less effective so I developed chronic fatigue which was my bodys way of saying youre intoxicated take a break. I was aware of this before I started tapering.

 

As far as tapering I made it to 1 pill, 225 mlgms and will not taper until I buy a scale to taper off 10%..which will be in around 30 days. Even though I havent tapered in a while my brain ks still evolvibg and changing.

 

My metabolism ia faster I lost weight Im a bit mor focused and respond faster and have less memory loss. On the down side I have lost muscle and hair loss is severe which was expected. When you taper off it backfored like youre taking much more. I dont have the perfect schedule but I tried different things.

 

Rico said (he sent me.to the this group and is a taperbuddy) please take lithium one a day same hour. I tried that it made my mood much more irregular amd ubstable...anxious and depressed as well. Anyways my lithium seems to be out of my system quickly so what would I take the rest of the day to keep me stable? I figured breaking my tablet into four parts would work and it has. I dont have a crash from lithium....and its stable theoughout the day. I always take.it on a full stomach to protect it. After breakfast, after lunch, during the afternoon and after dinner. Have I not done this it would of been chaos....

 

I take a big water bottle wherever I go. I add passion flower to it it soothes my mood. I havent tapered Carrol and I wont until I dont have many symptoms and I get a scale. I also need to find a way to counteract withdrawal reaction....I avoid a mania or psycotic dispersonalized or...just an over heated sensation in my head. I prefer depression and tiredness over over activoty. I can control feeling low or flat I cant afford a mania. As anyone hooked on lithium we understand this all too well. 

 

I have taken a lot of advice from people withdrawing I look for any possible temporary solutions to withdraw and live normally. I believe supplements are like nutritious food, they have a dynamic and can help. 

 

In my own trial and error I took green tea. People associste it with caffeine butnit has much more l.theanine and in high amounts induces sleep relaxed moods and will keep away or mask withdrawal symptoms. I carry a bottle of gren tea and take a pill if I know Im starting to be fidgety. I might take this 3 4 times a week....but it has saved my life more than once. Its neuroprptective as well, it improves cognition and memory and gives you stability. 

 

Inositin or vitamin b7  (8?) in high concentrations has been recommended to control lithium side effects but they dont sell this in my country. I know someone tapering off klonopin and she even sleeps and deals with withdral through this vitamin. It has no effects...

 

As a last resort if Im on a bus or public area and something triggers anxiety racing thoughts or something I need to control I will take one fourth of rivotril .  Its my safety net and even though its.addictive. im already addicted and Im trying to.come.off lithium.first. 

 

I might want to stop lithium taper altogether and reduce some rivotril up.to 30% or until I feel its safe simply because I already feel what rivotril is doing to me. I didbt before I was

...zombied by lithium I had no way to recognise rivotril upsetting me.  Im still not sure if this is the solution. But its most likely I will buy scale soon and taper off lithium first. 

 

Im petrified by benzos I read what people say about them in facebook groups and I will need a temporary sedation until.my brain learns to sleep and be ok on its own. Im hypersentive. The reactions are varoed. My eyes can hurt I can go flat I can have racing rhoughts go blank be very lucid then extremely foggy..calm then disturbingly anxious...and all of these symptoms are going to eventually disappear in a couple of weeks as a sign I can continue tapering. 

 

My hylersensitivity is mindblowing from too mucb sugar to loud noises. Or skippin a meal....

Exercising has issues as well..I swim hike jog and will learn to do yoga soon..too much exercise is causing a mental fatigue that can last 2 days...my body isnt tired but my brain is fatigued. It calms anxiety and Its probably key to neurogenesis. Im doing this taper from all angles I know but im making sure the process doesnt back fire. 

 

I will write and answer questions more accurately but I have class now... 

 

Edited August 29, 2017 by baroquep
White space

[JanCarol]

Hey Rainbow - 

 

I'm glad you have a taper buddy in Rico.  It sounds like you are paying attention to your symptoms, and that is important.  I'm glad you got blood tests.  They only catch the worst of it - my blood tests were "fine," even though I started suffering from kidney problems.

 

So - your tablet is 225 mg, and you break it into 4 pieces?  Lithium has a half-life of 24 hours, so - you probably don't need to drop tablets into the pool all day.  Twice a day should be fine.  Is your tablet 225 mg?

 

You have been having symptoms which are indicative of a too fast reduction in lithium.  It doesn't matter that it was months ago.  Sometimes mania takes awhile to ramp up.  There is a delayed reaction - changes you made months ago will come into effect now.

 

That is why we only make tiny adjustments - and wait - and wait some more, if necessary before making any more changes.

 

Do not taper in a months time.  That is like trying to jump off of a speeding bus.  You might succeed, but it also might hurt a lot.  Our goal here at SA is to prevent such harm.

 

If anything, you could benefit from increasing another 1/2 tablet to stabilize for up to 3 months before continuing.  Take 3/4 tablet in morning and 3/4 tablet in evening and you should be fine.

 

Believe me, I don't offer that suggestion lightly.  I was poisoned by the stuff, it sucked out my soul, damaged my kidneys, and made me fat (metabolic disorder).  I understand that you are glad to be on a lighter dose.   But there are protective benefits.  Like a jaguar, needs to be treated with great respect.  Let the jaguar go to to sleep before you try an sneak past it!

 

When you get to a stable place where your symptoms are fine, you are right.  You will want to hold the lithium, and get off the benzo.  The lithium will protect you from the worst of the benzo withdrawals, and if you do a nice, gentle liquid taper of the benzo (most accurate way to do it), you can come off more safely.

 

But let's get you stable before you taper!  Please consider an updose of lithium by adding 1/2 tablet to your daily dose.  Try to take it 2x daily (it will be easier to taper than 4x a day).  Then, when you are more calm and balanced, consider a taper.  That may not be for another 3-6 months.

 

I know this seems tediously slow - but it can be done, and the slower the better.

 

I have never heard anyone complain that they tapered too slowly.  I have seen much suffering from tapering too quickly.  Please consider the gentler path!

 

I look forward to your next post.

 

 

 

 

[RainbowDbc]

Youre right. My brain might have un unexpected relapse post withdrawal syndrome so Ive heard. I went pretty fast and could up dose. Yes I take 225 mlgms. Maybe I can hold onto lithium. I dont have any experience tapering rivotril. I had a failed attempt had insomnia and just went back rivotril I couldnt stand the insomnia it felt dangerous and mind altering. Do you recommend tapering rivotril instead first?  I found taking a small chunk.of rivotril useful wjen things became messy. I also instinctively believe that lithium is much more damaging over all organs not just my brain. I am 30 I too have metabolic syndrome and have had to correct my diet the hard way. I somehow feel that if I tapered lithium first my cognition could somehow benefit and heal faster....Im willing to keep a regular dose for 2 months maybe by then I could taper on lithium by 10%. I believe in sensitive scales over the water system because the pills might not be in the water homogeneosly so I do prefer buying a scale it just feels more precise....

Im going to stick to rivotril in 1 mlgm for now altho im becoming hypersensitive to it...but I cant just taper it to avoid it as Id like it seems to.come back ten fold. I had no idea rivotril was so.severe...I really did not. But lithium causes a gray like depression while rivitril does not. Im holding onto lithium and upping it by a chunk more. A quarter more and will try taking it twice a day if it doesnt disrupt my mood. I monitor my body all day. 

I had an episode of memory loss for atleast one hour much earlier...its just very bizarre. Then Ive been fatigued on and on. Then I sense a rush or a dejavu of feelings and it fades. This is extremely nasty! Tapering lithium is easier or less traumatic the only issue is mania. But you sense the advancement. I understand what you mean by a fast taper and its complicated because a healing process is...parallel and I hold the conviction that these states of mind are waves of readjustment so Im not totally angry. Some people around me recognize a different me and its been 6 months only. I even agree that psychosis and certain mania should not be completely stopped. Its like surgery it hurts but its necessary. My brain hasnt been naturally harmonic or free to act on its own and these manias are understandable. So I allow them a bit. Again. When benzos are time to be tapered I will use whatever supplements necessary. If I know one thing. Sleep is.more important that food or exercise. Some people can cope with insomnoa for months. It can take me to a hospital. Because I understand this I need a taper much slower than most and supplements that I can use as sleeping aid. 

I dont understand what you mean by signature I wrote my story briefly and skipped the dramatic aspects. 

I had a psychotoc episode at the age of 18 from then I was forced lithium. By 6 months I needed a "sleeping pill". I asked him why and I was young and trusting he said bipolars had a sleeping disorder and a brain that destroys itself thru time. I was "fine" for 5 years. I noticed memory loss and foggyness and like I was becoming a bit stupid. Slow...dumb...careless...apathetic....I was fading. I was simply fading did not recognize myself anymore. Its being dead and alive. Powerless and spellbinded because when you become that insensitive you cant tell how bad it is. I became sensitive to lithium and I will get depressed even with the smallest chunk. I asked for changes and he cold tapered me many times doing a switch so Im not surprised as to why I had a psychosis multiple times especially doing changes. So yes lithiun is highly addictive despite what the media says. My doctor represented Colombia in the American Association of Psychiatrists and even researched and promoted the idea that lithium preserved the brain and in turn generated neurogenesis and this is all online and in medical magazines. That my psychosis induced deterioration and I had a lithium depletion. I had to unlearn everything read investigate and simply follow my instincts. Muchbof what I know is just research trial and error. Inhave been on lots of antipsychotics with pretty insane reactions. Fortunately my doctor knows Im stubborn so I quit on all those meds. But the concept of tapering came a bit later...I was blaming myself for everything I went cold turkey or almost cold turkey. Im not completely disabled but I want my internal life back. Today Im 31 and Im aware this is going to take a very long tedious time. 

[RainbowDbc]

On a more general approach..it was years ago I knew something was wrong. Only my sister felt.I was killing myself but she tried to fix.me.with a fast taper. Things in the family changed. It was very easy to say youre responsable with health and future so stop taking those pills..it became a blame game. My father turned to mental abuse and threats to keep me on meds.and yes I was called mental cripple.many times and harassed by police or simply people that dont know whats what. I was coerced yet ignorant. The first video that terrified me was one made my Peter Breggin...I found it accidently...I was confused shocked and its weird to see a psychiatrist critisize his own career. It made everything have more sense because you wouldnt listen to a bipolar say its not bipolarity its your meds......and I know quite a lot of people on meds and still dogmatized that its their fault. I dont even bother anymore. So yes I had the anger phase the blame.phase...I was a victim phase...how many of us are out there? Who else figured this out? But even doctors against this dont offer solutions. I have emailed David Healy, spoken to Monica Cassani, Laura Delano...listened to Moncrief....admired Peter Breggin Im aware rhe medical field is baloney in some respects but theres no advancement. So much focus on big pharma...conspiracy theories...all.these things have a large mayority feeling powerless. Ive made a few friends that are prone to self determination when you have non and alternative solutions that actually work. Im.hyper focused on my own insight. I listen to those that already tapered. Those that follow health habits are.prone to faster and a.better outlook as well. This may not have nothing to do with the tapering but the psychological aspect is also part of healing. Walking away (or being active.on solutions) felt like a great decision..But I still collapse because I dont see the time of day when I can be myself again. 

[RainbowDbc]

I saw  your post on supplements and you take a lot of them Im sure they have been of inmense help. I was wondering if you took any supplement that kept you immune from mania? I dont have the usual....Im.amazing I feel great...overspending irrational behaviour I just catch myself with a fast brain like its over heating...and I dont recall much of mania just psychosis. I already mentioned taking green tea which does work...but its a bit too much in terms of.relaxation...makes me drowzy and out of focus. But its been extremely beneficial in so many other ways. I have magneseum but I dont feel.anything when I take it. Im not sure why so many people mention magneseum like Im not aware as to how to helps? I doubt it could stop a.mania like reaction. I also have 5 htp....I looked it up...its something that I would want to take once Im on a much lower dose.of both drugs because it does help.sleep and rewires.certain functions of neurotransmitters like.seratonine...and melatonine. im not ready to combine an amino acid that forces the brain a certain direction and to have drugs push towards another direction this might be counterproductive altho Im.just speculating. Im get overly excited by the idea of creating my own sleep....  thank you... 

[RainbowDbc]

Wont be using supplements for a long time except magneseum b complex omega 3 and sometimes green tea. I wont play doctor anymore Im just anxious to.find ways to ease this process. Tried 5 htp. Very bad results. Sorry

I always thought I had a signature but it was never posted apparently because of the photo and its high resolution. Fixed it. 

[RainbowDbc]

On 8/22/2017 at 6:10 AM, Shep said:

 

 

Hi, Rainbow.

 

If you go to the top of your page and look under your username over on the left, you'll see "tags" with your drugs listed. If you click on the tag that states "lithium", it will bring up a list of members who also are tagged with that drug. I did that and came up with this list:

 

http://survivingantidepressants.org/tags/lithium/

 

These links will help you understand the withdrawal process more. It's comforting to find out what you're going through is what others going through withdrawal are also experiencing. It will get better.  

 

What is withdrawal syndrome? 
 
The Windows and Waves Pattern of Stabilization

 

How psychiatric drugs remodel your brain

 

Healing from antidepressants. Patterns of recovery - video 4 minutes

I never said thank you for sending me these links..I look at them from time to time it keeps hopeful..

[RainbowDbc]

I really am sorry for being a nuisance. Thia really hasnt been easy..

My head has twitched on its own, it flattens, I become very lucid, it becomes foggy, sometimes itsnjust anxiety. I can have a sudden memory loss. Or severe adhedonia. All of these things happen automatically. The stable part of me.has somewhat disappeared. If I go back upmto.900 mlgms my life will be as it used to be. But I have to go up a dose enough to comeback to normal. Maybe I tapered way too fast. Like Im hopelessly addicted or.dependent and this scares me. I wanted a minimum.taper and a normal life but this.is too much. I also have a continuous feeling that Im.hurting myself. I love myself too much to notice more weight loss bizarre states and like my brain will fall apart soon. Very soon. 

People closest to.me notice I am.much more responsive and lucid. Less dulled but call it withdrawal or rapid cycling my brain doesnt normalize much throughout the day. 

This is extremely disturbing I rely on a toxic pill to be normal. 

I want to updose to a pill and a half...if this keeps up I dont know. 

Id like to taper rivotril instead even if its in a couple of months. 

I am not crazy but Im starting to feel.like this process is crazy. I even have chest pain. Why. 

I need to updose. 

I just dont understand why my entire body is saying something. I thought this was just depression and anxiety. I dont see a reason as to why I can have complete memory loss for 15 mins and come.back like I have a tumor. 

I feel dispersonalized like I cant recognize people I care about. 

I need to go back. This has been a mess.....I need to taper when Im stable. I feel like i failed. 

 

[Shep]

12 hours ago, RainbowDbc said:

I want to updose to a pill and a half...if this keeps up I dont know. 

Id like to taper rivotril instead even if its in a couple of months. 

I am not crazy but Im starting to feel.like this process is crazy. I even have chest pain. Why. 

I need to updose. 

 

Please update how you're feeling as you updose. In can take 4 days or more for your nervous system to register the updose, so please give it a few days. Hopefully, your symptoms will settle down. 

[RainbowDbc]

8August 31 2017

Thank you, Shep.

Im going to write down symptoms along the way. Might use this as a personal diary to keep my insight somewhere. Maybe see advancement. Maybe someone will benefit. 

My brain blanked out yesterday in full amnesia for 15 minutes coming back home in the hours of the afternoon. 

Overall fatigue and weakness accumulated..like I did.a.marathon. Muscle and fat loss...maybe my body is trying to.compensate.for.extreme.changes. Or my metabolic syndrome kicked in the opposite direction.  I eat extremely well but it stopped making a difference.

By 9 pm I had seizure like movements moved on its own and I laid down it was close to a.minute. 

I woke up at 4 am which was something I really didnt want I need, to recover I took one quarter of rivotril and sept till eight. I felt better. 

Im going to take half a tablet of lithium after breakfast after lunch and after dinner sacradly. Rivotril will.stay at 1 mg but if.my sleeping patterns dont fix up I can take one quarter more. 

This is thw first time I taper seriously and crashed...I was becoming more disconnected.from myself and weaker. I might remove.myself from fb benzo groups. So much struggle.caused a trigger of stress in me. I didnt know I was.taking klonopin..I simply.called.it rivotril..Ive been on klonopin and it.seems.to be the most famous.one.for.its.dependency....and people can barely get out of bed. Its reasonable to be horrified and dismotivated. 

Also worried about apathy and depression induced by lithium. Its like a straightjacket in my head. 

Regards

 

[RainbowDbc]

On 2/21/2017 at 0:27 PM, Tootsieroll said:

powerback I would have to say 16 months was a pretty rough one for me. Maybe you can try something natural like Inositol. Pure Dark chocolate really helped me. It does get better.

I toot...can I have your thoughts on inositol? What does.it do?

[ChessieCat]

There are many existing topics and discussions on SA.  To find the following I used google and typed in survivingantidepressants.org inositol.  If the search term is just mentioned within a topic go to the topic and then use the search bar at the top right and type in inositol and you can find the specific posts.

 

inositol

 

glutamatenmda-inositol-n-aceytl-cysteine-nac-and-serotonin-receptor-re-sensitization

 

[RainbowDbc]

16 hours ago, ChessieCat said:

There are many existing topics and discussions on SA.  To find the following I used google and typed in survivingantidepressants.org inositol.  If the search term is just mentioned within a topic go to the topic and then use the search bar at the top right and type in inositol and you can find the specific posts.

 

inositol

 

glutamatenmda-inositol-n-aceytl-cysteine-nac-and-serotonin-receptor-re-sensitization

 

Ur awesome thank you. I know ppl that take.it and it seems it makes life easier with symptoms....would like to buy some

[RainbowDbc]

On 2017-08-29 at 3:29 PM, JanCarol said:

Hey Rainbow - 

 

I'm glad you have a taper buddy in Rico.  It sounds like you are paying attention to your symptoms, and that is important.  I'm glad you got blood tests.  They only catch the worst of it - my blood tests were "fine," even though I started suffering from kidney problems.

 

So - your tablet is 225 mg, and you break it into 4 pieces?  Lithium has a half-life of 24 hours, so - you probably don't need to drop tablets into the pool all day.  Twice a day should be fine.  Is your tablet 225 mg?

 

You have been having symptoms which are indicative of a too fast reduction in lithium.  It doesn't matter that it was months ago.  Sometimes mania takes awhile to ramp up.  There is a delayed reaction - changes you made months ago will come into effect now.

 

That is why we only make tiny adjustments - and wait - and wait some more, if necessary before making any more changes.

 

Do not taper in a months time.  That is like trying to jump off of a speeding bus.  You might succeed, but it also might hurt a lot.  Our goal here at SA is to prevent such harm.

 

If anything, you could benefit from increasing another 1/2 tablet to stabilize for up to 3 months before continuing.  Take 3/4 tablet in morning and 3/4 tablet in evening and you should be fine.

 

Believe me, I don't offer that suggestion lightly.  I was poisoned by the stuff, it sucked out my soul, damaged my kidneys, and made me fat (metabolic disorder).  I understand that you are glad to be on a lighter dose.   But there are protective benefits.  Like a jaguar, needs to be treated with great respect.  Let the jaguar go to to sleep before you try an sneak past it!

 

When you get to a stable place where your symptoms are fine, you are right.  You will want to hold the lithium, and get off the benzo.  The lithium will protect you from the worst of the benzo withdrawals, and if you do a nice, gentle liquid taper of the benzo (most accurate way to do it), you can come off more safely.

 

But let's get you stable before you taper!  Please consider an updose of lithium by adding 1/2 tablet to your daily dose.  Try to take it 2x daily (it will be easier to taper than 4x a day).  Then, when you are more calm and balanced, consider a taper.  That may not be for another 3-6 months.

 

I know this seems tediously slow - but it can be done, and the slower the better.

 

I have never heard anyone complain that they tapered too slowly.  I have seen much suffering from tapering too quickly.  Please consider the gentler path!

 

I look forward to your next post.

 

 

 

 

Jan, hi

Hi I havent heard from you. I did updose like you proposed and it worked. The first day was awful. I cant stand the adhedonia because I had it for 5 yrs and didnt know until I withdrew lithium too fast. I sensed a big difference. 

 

The weird symptoms are gone even my weight came back in only 2 days. 

 

Taking half a pill am, half a pill midday and quarter chunk at night. It was a subtle increase but yes the chaos banished. 

 

Certain things did come back and I was hoping you could relate. Time is forever and Im reacting and thinking way too slow. Its excruciating. My thoughts are also blurred so.to.speak. This is all.lithium related apparently. 

 

I thought about what you said about tapering benzo first and I know Im.stubborn but I want to know if we saw this another way. 

 

Tapering klonopin is a very long journey and I dont know if having a dulled confused brain in the process helps by being on lithium. 

 

Lithium has a stabilizing zonking effect but Im not lucid and I have a sense of depression when on lithium. My personality changes absolutely. I dont know if this makes sense.to you...and klonopin.doesnt do.this to me. 

 

Klonopin just gets me sleepy. If I have cognitive decline and a bad memory it doesnt disturb me as much as adhedonia and just feeling like %#$÷  all day. Because I know these things do improve over time anyway.

 

The fast taper I had with lithium.was a big mess.I was relying on feeling good andit backfired. My brain was in withdrawal and overworked in a fast aggressive intent to heal because I did get better. I was becoming lucid somehow. The changes are real and my true self is.masked by lithium. 

 

I dont mind tapering lithium first at the slowest pace possible in order to avoid possible disaster.  Even if its 5% the first month. Lithium is a very tricky drug its very prone to relapse BUT you do see changes slowly happening as well. 

 

A lot of people.dont see positive changes from klonopin withdrawal as fast from what Ive read....

 

So far these are my intuitive thoughts and I appreciate that you understand my thoughts because you relate to lithium so well. Thanks....

 

Also I heard about hitting tolerance ad taking klonopin but needing more..or feeling withdrawal.like reactions. This could be masked by lithium...so its a polypharmaceutic party. Either way even if you hit tolerance why would you updose to taper back down?  Do I make sense...? As in if I tapered lithium to start  and feel klonopin take over with withdrawal symptoms. What could I do? 

 

Thank you....

 

I was.never sure if my signature came through...

Edited September 1, 2017 by baroquep
Paragraph breaks

[RainbowDbc]

September 1

Sorry I am having seizure like movements. On and off. 

Read it was a possible fast taper. 

Updosing helped by a bit. 

Not sure what to do. 

Cant hire a doctor either..

Please