RainbowDbc: Welcoming myself with my story

[RainbowDbc]

On 8/29/2017 at 7:28 AM, JanCarol said:

Hey Rainbow - just a few quick notes while I'm away from my desk.

 

Please, Please Put Your Drug History Into your Signature  if you are using from a phone, you might try this:  Complete your Signature from Phone or Tablet

 

There is so much we don't know about you without that, and it is the bare minimum for participation here at SA.   It offers respect to people who are trying to help you, and courtesy to the community at large.

 

What you describe about the Grayness is very similar to what I felt on lithium.  Have you had liver and kidney function (blood) tests while on the lithium?  You say you have been on lithium for 10 years - at 10 years (900 mg), I started to develop toxicity from the lithium.  It is easy to go into toxicity and needs to be monitored closely.

 

It is vital that you are well hydrated!  Drink plenty of water, and consider using electolytes to help with hydration.  Additionally, it only takes one event of dehydration to cause damage to your kidneys.

 

If you are breaking your lithium tablets, you need to be taking it 2x a day for good coverage and minimal symptoms.

 

It may be helpful to quit using the B-complex, as it can really rev up your symptoms, especially those mania-like ones.  I am not an advocate of B-Complex anyway, as the ratios of B-vitamins you need might be different to what is in a compound.

 

 

It is vital that you take this to a schedule.  If it is XR (Extended release) you can take it 1x a day.  If it is IR (Immediate Release) you must take it 2x a day.  It is fine to break the tablets to do this.  My 250 mg tablets were Immediate Release.  I suggest that you could take 1/2 in the morning and 1/2 at night.  It is important to be disciplined about this - lithium does not have immediate mood effects, but is instead a cumulative effect over time, depending on your levels.

Think of it like chlorine in a pool - you can add chlorine tablets to the pool - but it's the levels of chlorine that you need to manage, depending on sun, rain, etc.  At some point, the chlorine levels can become toxic, and if you use it erratically, it does not do its job.

 

 

No.  Not safe or recommended, and can be addictive and cause withdrawal symptoms of its own.  In order to sleep, the best path is to do so naturally with Sleep Hygiene.  Important Topics about Symptoms Including Sleep Problems

 

 

Actually, the withdrawals from lithium depend greatly on what other drugs you have been on.  Very few people are on lithium as a monotherapy.  If you have been on antidepressants, then withdrawal from lithium will be like antidepressant withdrawal.  In my experience, anyway.  It is like a buffer, or a cushion.  As you have some experience with neuroleptics (that's what "antipsychotics" are), you may be getting some symptoms from that, too.  This is why Shep asks detailed questions about your various drugs.  Please respect her efforts and answer her questions, in detail.  

 

At toxic levels, lithium is very numbing and anhedonic.  But the dysregulation that happens in lithium withdrawal, also happens in withdrawal from other drugs.

 

Mostly, if you are having severe symptoms (sounds kind of "manic") Then you have tapered too quickly!!!  Withdrawing from lithium too quickly can induce manic-like symptoms!

You may wish to go back up to 337.5 mg of lithium, taking 169 mg am and 168 mg pm, until you stabilise.  That is what I would do if I were in your shoes.  Going into mania was one of my great fears when I tapered lithium, and is vital to why you must go slowly.  Mania can ruin your life and relationships.  Go slowly, and retain your inner center.  Then, after a few months of stability you will have the option to taper more safely.  You will want to get a scale to do this accurately:  

 

.

 

This is like asking the devil to save you from sin. Rivotril is addicting, and we don't know how much of your symptoms are from the Rivotril withdrawal, as well.  There is a  delay in symptoms from withdrawal, sometimes 3-6 months or more after quitting or reducing the drug.  So while you say you had "no withdrawal" from reducing Rivotril 6 months ago, some of your symptoms could still be from that reduction.

I believe that most of your symptoms are from coming off the lithium too fast.  The danger here is this:  that once you've reduced the lithium, it may not "cover" the same things it did before.  I would try an updose to see if you can get it covered before things spin out of control.

 

 

That's a lot of information, I know.  I'm sorry for that, but I don't know when I can look in again.

 

Please let us know what you decide to do, and we'll help as we can.

 

I hope you see the sun today (your exercise program sounds really helpful!).

 

 

 

Jan Carol, 

Ive had manic like and psychotic like episodes and was wondering since you took lithium how was the taper? What percentage of lithium was decreased monthly? Should I reinstate to full 900 mgs to taper rivotril instead? 

Will having lithium affect how I withdraw klonopin? Lithium seems to hide the symptoms as you said but would this hinder the healing process?  Or how will I know my CNS is adjusted if lithium blocks most symptoms? 

I may not be able to taper lithium and should reinstall to 900 mg....and Im sad about this. I think klonopin isa big challenge and having lithium along the way makes it worse...

[JanCarol]

Hey Rainbow - 

 

I'm out today - I just want to acknowledge that I got your question.

 

I think you should stay the same right now, I'll reply in detail as soon as I can get back to the computer.

 

I hope you see the sun today!

[JanCarol]

Hey Rainbow - 

 

Are you feeling "manic"?  Or are you just afraid of it?  Fear of manic is not the same as manic.

 

If you are feeling manic, I would not go up to 900 mg full dose, but if it were me, and I started to feel like I was ramping up, I would add 50 mg every 4 days until I started to calm.

 

There are other things you can to to help with manic.

 

Alternate Nostril Breathing is an excellent technique to use.  Breathing for Well Being

 

Eating healthy fats, protein (especially eggs) seem to be extremely stabilising.  My "bipolar" friends, when they start to spin out, the first question I ask is, "are you eating protein?"

 

My favourite way to settle is magnesium baths:  Epsom Salts - Another Way to Relax with Magnesium

My preference for mood is magnesium chloride salts, but epsom salts work well, too.

 

It's not just the drugs that affect your mood, you have great power over your mood.  You are the only person who does.  Also, I just read a great article on Forest Bathing.

 

https://aeon.co/essays/why-forests-and-rivers-are-the-most-potent-health-tonic-around

 

and to read what other members have said about forest bathing:

 

http://survivingantidepressants.org/topic/1921-forest-bathing-reduces-cortisol-aids-mood-immune-system/

 

Additionally, my psychiatrist didn't want me to taper lithium unless I took a sun walk every day.  This is a walk in the sun (mine was only 10 minutes, so that I had no excuse not to), as early in the day as possible.  Every day.  It is a prescription.  Every day.    Being outside in sunshine can be stimulating for your mood, but it also helps your melatonin kick in at night.  Getting good sleep really helps with mood stabilization.

 

Seeing green grass and trees, and looking at the horizon is helpful for mood, too.  These sound like small things - when I was in my wildest places (in my "success thread" in my signature you can read more about how wild I was) I would've said this would not work.  But now, on the other side, I find that these things - sometimes all of them in concert - help greatly.

 

I agree with you that you should not taper the rivotril while you are experiencing symptoms.  Wait until you find a balance with the lithium before continuing.

 

I hope this helps, and I hope you see the sun today.  (now you know why I say that!)

 

 

[RainbowDbc]

9Jan, my response

Im on 450 mg of lithium. But I am having a strong adverse reaction to it by every dose. I involuntarily move, my brain becomes very fuzzy. It seems like going to steps back evertime I take it. Its not so much mania. Its an over drive of anxiety if I cut lithium off too soon.  

The supplements here in colombia are very very limited. I tried to buy taurine (glutamate antagonist) and they dont have any. 

Even our magneseum isnt pure. 

The problem with letting it go too fast is my brain isnt completrly optimized with gabba so leaving lithoum that dulls me causes an over load of anxiety (symptom of glutamate over drive)....and these over drives are also neurotoxic. And dangerous. So I feel stuck. Ive felt Im losing my mind in extreme fear!

Im doing what I can to switch to valium...

Im deeply terrified at these involuntary movements theyre a sign of much injury in my brain. 

I write to you when Im lucid sometimes Im incapable of getting my thoughts together. 

Do you feel like I should buy a scale? 

It would be easier than liquid taper...

I sense mania is part of becoming stable but I havent allowed it to happen..I think my brain is screaming to have all sorts of reactions ...Jan I honestly dont know how to move forward. Im so sorry

[JanCarol]

Hey Rainbow - 

 

The involuntary movements are not toxicity, but are side effects.  I still have slow reflexes from my years on lithium.

The scale is good for the lithium taper, but the rivotril will need to be a liquid taper that I posted above.

 

But I sense that you may need to hold.  I know the lithium is awful, you are on the verge of "not enough lithium" and "too much lithium."

 

Your options are:

 

1.  Hold

2.  Taper

3.  Updose (please do it carefully, only 50 mg at a time)

 

you can also consider moving the lithium to 2x a day instead of 4x, perhaps that will help.

 

Please look into the non drug techniques I posted above.  I have a whole toolbox of techniques that I can use depending on the situation.

 

Don't worry too much about supplements.  Magnesium and fish oil are good - but eating fish and almonds is good also.

 

Supplements can backfire when you are in crisis.  Food can help, too.

 

I'm sorry I have very little more to offer, other than the encouragement that you can do this.  Only you can do it, I can't do it for you, and nobody else can.  I have done it, and I'm not the only one. 

 

Google "Will Hall" and listen to his podcasts and read his articles.  He was an inspiration to me.

 

I have to go now, please keep us posted.

 

And please see the sun today.

 

 

[RainbowDbc]

I will. And thank you...for your wisdom

[RainbowDbc]

On 9/1/2017 at 0:04 PM, RainbowDbc said:

Jan, hi

Hi I havent heard from you. I did updose like you proposed and it worked. The first day was awful. I cant stand the adhedonia because I had it for 5 yrs and didnt know until I withdrew lithium too fast. I sensed a big difference. 

 

The weird symptoms are gone even my weight came back in only 2 days. 

 

Taking half a pill am, half a pill midday and quarter chunk at night. It was a subtle increase but yes the chaos banished. 

 

Certain things did come back and I was hoping you could relate. Time is forever and Im reacting and thinking way too slow. Its excruciating. My thoughts are also blurred so.to.speak. This is all.lithium related apparently. 

 

I thought about what you said about tapering benzo first and I know Im.stubborn but I want to know if we saw this another way. 

 

Tapering klonopin is a very long journey and I dont know if having a dulled confused brain in the process helps by being on lithium. 

 

Lithium has a stabilizing zonking effect but Im not lucid and I have a sense of depression when on lithium. My personality changes absolutely. I dont know if this makes sense.to you...and klonopin.doesnt do.this to me. 

 

Klonopin just gets me sleepy. If I have cognitive decline and a bad memory it doesnt disturb me as much as adhedonia and just feeling like %#$÷  all day. Because I know these things do improve over time anyway.

 

The fast taper I had with lithium.was a big mess.I was relying on feeling good andit backfired. My brain was in withdrawal and overworked in a fast aggressive intent to heal because I did get better. I was becoming lucid somehow. The changes are real and my true self is.masked by lithium. 

 

I dont mind tapering lithium first at the slowest pace possible in order to avoid possible disaster.  Even if its 5% the first month. Lithium is a very tricky drug its very prone to relapse BUT you do see changes slowly happening as well. 

 

A lot of people.dont see positive changes from klonopin withdrawal as fast from what Ive read....

 

So far these are my intuitive thoughts and I appreciate that you understand my thoughts because you relate to lithium so well. Thanks....

 

Also I heard about hitting tolerance ad taking klonopin but needing more..or feeling withdrawal.like reactions. This could be masked by lithium...so its a polypharmaceutic party. Either way even if you hit tolerance why would you updose to taper back down?  Do I make sense...? As in if I tapered lithium to start  and feel klonopin take over with withdrawal symptoms. What could I do? 

 

Thank you....

 

I was.never sure if my signature came through...

Jan, I would like to ask you a question.relating.psychosis. it is a sensitive subject but I was labeled bipolar 1 as in prone to mania psychosis not so much depression. Is there a link that discussis this phenomenon? Being sleep deprived is a trigger for psychosis so how to get away with a taper? How do people cope with this naturally. Did youbexperience this thru lithiumnwithdrawal? I understand psychosis is worse more recurrent with medication than without it. Id love your thoughts. Any neurobiological aspects of it. Thank you a

[JanCarol]

Hey Rainbow - 

On 04/09/2017 at 1:07 AM, RainbowDbc said:

I have always been a hiker and a swimmer and both require recieving sun, and yes I do notice benefits.of feeling regulated but it has no effect on my sleep.

 

The only way it will benefit your sleep is if you take it at the same time daily.  

 

Your fitness is amazing, to be able to walk for 3 hours at a time, or hike for 8 hours.  But I'd like you to look at follow on effects of that - does it "ramp you up" for a few days? Do you have more of these dystonic movements after your heavy exercise?    Or does the intense exercise relax and restore you?  If the latter - then it is a fine practice for you to have.

 

It is better to walk 20 minutes a day, than to walk 3 hours one day a week.  Slow and steady wins this race.  You're not going to beat metabolic disorder with a long workout - though - the Adrenal Reset Diet recommends Long Slow Distance once a month to "set" adrenal regulation.  Probably not as long as 8 hours, though!

 

I would encourage you to not think about metabolic disorder until you get your mood under control.  It will come, as you stabilise.  I'm worried that your exercise patterns - while amazing - are erratic, and it is better to be regular.

 

On 04/09/2017 at 1:07 AM, RainbowDbc said:

People are controversial about b complex but vitamin depletion is real and probbaly worse during taper. 

 

We generally find it unhelpful in withdrawal.  Hypersensitive to B Vitamin or B-Complex

 

In general, my attitude is that a B-Complex is not designed for you.  It's a shotgun approach, they just put in all the B Vitamins at a ratio that might not be appropriate for you.  

 

If you do decide to try B vitamins, try them 1 at a time, maybe starting with Niacin, to see if it helps.  If you react, then it's not for you.  The same with B12.  But don't hurry into it - you need to be stable before you can experiment with these.

 

On 05/09/2017 at 7:19 AM, RainbowDbc said:

He is obsessed with lithium and says I have a lithium deficiency and that I have abnormal dopamine levels, and that cognition decline is just part of being bipolar...and that every attempt to get off drugs that lead to psychosis is a set back.for my brain. We know this is simply not true....Im getting old with this story

 

OH DEAR!  This is the first time I've ever heard of a "lithium deficiency."  Egads, I'm sorry.  You may need to find another doctor, as you will need one who will do things your way, not "by the book."  (the book, as we all know, was written by pharmaceutical companies who are invested in your failure)

 

On 05/09/2017 at 7:19 AM, RainbowDbc said:

Im.concerned about these involuntary movements. I dont know if its because I tapered lithium.fairy quickly from 900.to 450 mg. Or of it is just a pooping of klonopin.

 

On 05/09/2017 at 7:19 AM, RainbowDbc said:

Ok I read what you sent me on drug induced movement. Can you please tell me of this is reversible? Why would it show up with less lithium? Could lithium have masked it?  There isnt an effective solution for this is there?  Vitamin E? Peter Breggins brings this up over and over in his conferences as severe irreversible damage...I would appreciate some very honest feedback. Are there cases where this is temporary? 

 

Shep & I are concerned about these, too.  Here's what I think:  your last adventure with risperidone (we really need your drug history in your signature, this is important!) ended in June, when you were CT'd off risperidone.  September is well within the time frame of having post-withdrawal reactions.  Please put this information in your signature.

In most cases it is temporary, except where the damage has been poured on for years and years.   Everybody is different.  Removal of the neuroleptic (done) is the key, and waiting is the next piece of the puzzle.  

 

Be patient with yourself.  It's not going to happen overnight.  A year, two years from now you may wonder what that was, and forget you ever had it.

 

There is a protocol in Europe for using neuroleptic drugs to offer relief from the worst of psychosis,  - but it involves just a week or two of use, not months.  

 

You are probably in risperidone withdrawal, and there's another possibility, too - that the lithium was protecting you from this withdrawal, and when you reduced it, the risperidone withdrawal is hitting you full in the face.  (and the rivotril interdose withdrawal is not helping, either!)

 

On 05/09/2017 at 7:19 AM, RainbowDbc said:

My fast tapers with lithium have lead me believe that I will never be able to leave lithium because its much trickier and prone to relapses. ..

 

That's because they were fast.  When I tackled lithium, I took the approach that I would be on the lowest possible dose for mood stabilization.  When I accidentally dropped off (see my signature, I made mistakes), I replaced pharmaceutical lithium with a tiny, tiny microdose of lithium orotate.  I'm really stable, and could probably quit that now, too - it's more like a security blanket than a needed supplement.

It's also important to remember that holds are where you heal. Holding gives your body and brain time to catch up with the reduction in dose.

MammaP says:

Quote

Sadly it isn't a case of  just getting the drug out of the system, it is undoing the changes that were made in the brain while taking them. 

 

I wrote a little story about "sneaking away from the bear or wolf"

 

Quote

Think of the drug as a wolf or a bear.

 

When you are in the wild and you encounter one of these things, the FIRST thing you must do is: KEEP CALM.  (yeah, I know, the meme and all, but it's true)  The next thing you do is DON'T MOVE!

 

If it is a total standoff and you want to get away, you CANNOT run.  It's you and the bear.  If you run, the bear and wolf have a hard-wired instinct to chase, and you will lose.

 

The goal in a standoff with a bear is to sneak.

 

That's what a taper is.  Sneaking away from the wolf.  You've seen a cat stalk - it waits until the prey is not looking, then moves a bit (maybe 10%?)  then it waits.  And waits.  And waits.  Holding will save your life, when you are in a standoff with a bear.  And Saphris and olanzapine are a bear and a wolf respectively!

 

Before, you dropped your berries and ran away, and the bear caught up to you.  Didn't work. 

 

The goal is to sneak the drug out of your system sooooooo slowly that your brain hardly notices it's gone.  And doesn't chuck a wobbly like before.

 

You won't know anything about "damage" until you are at least 5 years out from your drugs.  I'm only 2 years out now, and I'm improving a lot - but there is still room for improvement.  In some ways, I'm better than I have ever been - in other ways I struggle with simple things.  Everyone is different.

 

Fixating on "dopamine" and "neurotransmitters" will not serve you.  Like Shep said - these drugs affect more than one system.  For example, 90% of your serotonin is in the gut - but people get diagnosed (diag-nonsense) with IBS when on a serotonin drug.  The medical profession gives more drugs for drug effects.

 

On 05/09/2017 at 11:34 PM, RainbowDbc said:

 

8:00 Am - My head started to squeeze. My neck started to get very tense and.painful..then my eyes also started getting sore. It seems Im.going to have a.reaction in every part of my body. My head stings in different parts.of the brain. Im not familiar to these symptoms.of.pain. Nerve growth? Theres a tolerable burst of energy or anxiety.  

 

This makes me want to check your water and electrolytes.  The best thing for a headache is a glass of water.   The sore eyes sound like dehydration.   Lithium is severely dehydrating.  If you are taking 8 hour hikes, are you getting adequate hydration?

 

Those hikes may be dangerous while on lithium.  It only takes one incidence of dehydration for lithium to go toxic.

 

There are special electrolyte drinks that you can get for dehydration, or you can make your own using a natural salt, like Celtic Sea Salt or Pink Himalayan salt.  Do not use industrial, commercial salts, as they are mass manufactured, and just pure sodium.  You also want to get potassium and magnesium from your salts.  

 

Management of these drugs is often much more than how much you take and when - and lithium is a particularly demanding master.  It wants you to drink lots of fluids, mind your kidneys and liver, and get electrolyte salts.  Now that you are able to sweat, it is even more vital that you stay hydrated!

 

I'm taking a break for now, but I'll check back with you soon (still a page behind).

 

I hope you see the sun today!

[JanCarol]

On 13/09/2017 at 5:38 AM, RainbowDbc said:

Jan, I would like to ask you a question.relating.psychosis. it is a sensitive subject but I was labeled bipolar 1 as in prone to mania psychosis not so much depression. Is there a link that discussis this phenomenon? Being sleep deprived is a trigger for psychosis so how to get away with a taper? How do people cope with this naturally. Did youbexperience this thru lithiumnwithdrawal? I understand psychosis is worse more recurrent with medication than without it. Id love your thoughts. Any neurobiological aspects of it. Thank you a

 

Hey Rainbow - 

 

"Psychosis" is a state of alternate Truth.  It is a crisis that is trying to tell  you something, albeit in symbols and language that is unique to you.

 

The best "cures" for psychosis involve listening to it, not damping it down.  This is a practice I pursue with my shamanic work - using alternative Reality to address these alternate Truths in a structured way.

 

For example, a friend of mine was seeing a persistent scary face in the trees.  Instead of giving into the fear that "she's going mad" and revving up into a panic, it was important to address the face, the tree.  I suggested that she start a dialogue with the tree.  It turns out that she was afraid of many real world things - losing her housing, reduction in income, not living up to certain standards - and this manifested as fear, as expressed by the scary face.  

 

Another example was a friend who lived in terror that the building she lived in would fall down around her.  It is a new building, made of concrete and steel - and in no danger of falling in consensual reality.  But this was just an image for the dramas that were unfolding among the residents of the building which were frightening her, and it came through in this persistent image.  When she was able to address the dramas of these people, she felt safer in her building.  So you see how the extreme states are symbolic of other things which need to be addressed?

 

Our own Shep has taught me so much by her attitude of curiosity - when she has a symptom that others might call "psychosis" - she releases the fear and the panic, and instead seeks to be curious about it.  You might also consider the withdrawal effects called Derealization and Depersonalization

 

The images and messages of "psychosis" have a basis in your reality, even if other people do not see and hear what you do.  They are a message from you - to you.  And really, only you can understand them.  It is helpful to have a therapist who is willing to delve into them with you, to keep you safe during the process.  Art therapy and journalling are the best ways to work through these.  

 

 

There are, surely, illnesses which involve disconnection from consensual reality.  But in my experience, there is always a spiritual emergence / spiritual emergency - something which your subconscious is trying to communicate to you with these surreal forms.  The subconscious does not have words and language, so it chooses symbols, archetypes to communicate.  They may not make sense at first, until you better understand what they are trying to communicate.

 

Eleanor Longden of the Hearing Voices movement (yes, these are verbal, but you will understand the symbolic nature of it) talked about scary voices saying threatening things to her.  What she learned, was not that she was being attacked by evil - but that she felt afraid in certain situations, and these voices were offering her information about her situation that her waking mind did not understand or perceive.  She has a TED talk about it here:  Eleanor Longden - The Voices In My Head

 

As you get skilled in this, you become deeper and stronger, and no longer fear these extreme states.  

 

I've written about a number of resources for psychosis here:  Alternatives for Psychotic Outbreaks

 

Let me know your thoughts about this.  I especially recommend the Shades of Awakening series  http://www.shadesofawakening.com/, the Crazywise movie, and Ted Borges' TED talk on the subject  Phil Borges TED - Psychosis or Spiritual Awakening?.  I have been in extreme states myself, and have loved ones who visit them regularly.

 

Finally, consider this perspective, from the classic film, Network

 

 

I hope you see the sun today!

 

[Shep]

In addition to all of the wonderful things and great links that JanCarol posted regarding your concern about psyosis,  I'll just add that my visuals and audios early in the experience were quite violent and it took everything I had not to "get caught" in the system again.

 

But the more I nurtured my CNS, the more time I spent with guided meditations (Mooji is my favorite), the audios stopped completely and the visuals "softened" quite a bit. Now my visuals are more in tune with a quietened CNS. I simply don't have the fear. As JanCarol stated, the hallucinations are manifestations of real-world fears. So the calmer you are, the more you approach this with curiosity and wonder, the less reactionary the hallucinations become. It's like they feed on your current mental state. 

 

They also are worse during times of insomnia, so be very mindful of keeping your taper slow and concentrating on non-drug coping skills to make sure you're sleeping. 

 

If you can, spend time in nature. Take it in, ground yourself. Breathe. 

 

When you can't get into nature, try guided meditations or listening to soft classical music with nature sounds (there are a ton of videos on YouTube). Like Jan wrote, create art, write in a journal. Own your withdrawal experience. 

 

I didn't taper so my experience is extreme. Because you are being guided through a careful taper, your experience will likely be a lot less intense and scary. Plus you know ahead of time that what you may experience is rebound psychosis and it's chemically induced.  Nothing more than that. No reason to fear. 

 

I really think with a slow and careful taper, you're going to be just fine. 

[RainbowDbc]

Im going to do whats necessary to not get caught as you said. I am prone to experiences and I need to be looked aftwr until its over. You both are wonderful. Thank you...will look into it. 

[RainbowDbc]

Ive kept many things in mind referring to the tapering process. I am on simply 3 pieces of lithium tiniest chunk. Im still on rivotril. The process is rough as it is and I cant taper unless I know I can ride it out at home with some supervision. 

Leaving lithium was insightful and I know ahead of time tapering rivotril needs to be well thought of and needs a plan b. Many times innthat state you can emergency dose or induse psychosis easily and end up in a hospital where it gets worse. 

Rico for example finally tapered lithium as he fully tapered the rest of his meds. Had a psychotic relapse and simply lost his control and eventual stability. Its important to be monitored by someone that expects these outcomes as part of the healing process. Much like you cant leave any benzo without insomnia or anxiety. Im not in a respurceful situation to taper and lose myself. Im aware about the drugs long term.but its situationally catastrophic if done alone. You actually escaped psychosis. But under psyclsos I can leave home walk around and not remember anything. Its not my moment. Oh well