Hellbutrin: Wellbutrin nightmare - advice welcome

[DMV64]

6 minutes ago, Hellbutrin said:

I started fish oil to try to help pull me out of my most recent bout of suicidal depression. This episode has lasted since Tuesday, so I hope it ends soon. I'm not really functioning very well dealing with this kind of depression. I think a lot of it is stemming from anxiety so I caved and took .25 mg of Klonopin so that I could calm down and stop ruminating, the ruminating was making the anxiety worse. The Klonopin helps a lot, but I don't want to take it unless I have no other choice. Have you had any luck so far with the fish oil? I've read that fish oil helps with depressive symptoms a lot, so I'm holding out hope that it will help with my suicidal ideation. Thanks for your encouragement, and I hope you are doing well in your journey through this unjust illness. Fish oil really is helping i think! I hope it will help you too. I try to remember that I do not always feel this way. I totally hear you on the anxiety. I got this book "Hope and Help for your Nerves" and it is simple and concise and very helpful!

 

[eric]

+1 to "Hope and Help for Your Nerves!"

 

Also +1 to getting outside.

 

I knew I was climbing out of my depression when one night I gave myself ONE outdoors task to do the next day (blow the leaves off the driveway -- literally a 15-minute task), and told myself all I needed to do was accomplish that one task for the day and I could be happy with myself. And that I'd FORCE myself to do it if I had to. The next day I ended up getting so many more things done in the yard! I really enjoyed being outdoors that day.

 

Good advice DMV64!

[DMV64]

6 hours ago, eric said:

+1 to "Hope and Help for Your Nerves!"

 

Also +1 to getting outside.

 

I knew I was climbing out of my depression when one night I gave myself ONE outdoors task to do the next day (blow the leaves off the driveway -- literally a 15-minute task), and told myself all I needed to do was accomplish that one task for the day and I could be happy with myself. And that I'd FORCE myself to do it if I had to. The next day I ended up getting so many more things done in the yard! I really enjoyed being outdoors that day.

 

Good advice DMV64!

Thanks!  I also got a weighted blanket and black out curtains which help with anxiety. 

[Hellbutrin]

Should I be concerned that this is the worst wave that I've experienced so far? This was the first time that I've had suicidal depression since I tried to cold turkey. Can I expect my waves to get sporadically worse, or can I expect them to get better gradually over time? I want to have a plan for what to do if I experience another wave like the one that I recently had. I've been experiencing the regular windows and waves patterns of withdrawal since I finished my taper, with the exception of this past week. That came out of no where, and it was the first time that I've had a suicidal depression wave. My waves up until then were mainly centered around anhedonia, memory/concentration issues and anxiety, and I would gladly take those waves over the suicidal depressive waves any day. I'm wondering if others can fill me in on what their patterns have been like so that I can get an idea of how my symptoms will change. I understand that we are all different, but hearing about other's experiences helps a lot. Thanks for any information anyone can offer me. 

[Hellbutrin]

I have a question for anyone who has some feedback. Does the dosage of the medication that we took have anything to do with how severe our protracted withdrawal will be?

[DrugfreeProf]

Hellbutrin, I want to say that I too have had waves of suicidal depression--nothing where I actually felt I was in danger of taking my life, but a lot of wishing that I could/would die. In my worst moments, I really do not like this planet.  But I cannot tolerate the thought of reincarnating back on this planet, which might happen if I do not finish off this incarnation in the right way. In any event, I want you to know that if you can just watch the suicidal thoughts, observing them in a neutral way, seeing them as nothing more than a thought form, a fantasy or dark dream, as not real or true or even a part of you, I assure you, THEY WILL PASS. There is a part of you that knows you will get through this. Hang on to that part, pay attention to it, and try to stay centered and focused on it. That is the part of you that is wise and immortal and that knows that this is just an episode in the long journey back to our true selves.

[powerback]

Hi HB ,in my opinion dosage didn't mean a whole lot to the length of protracted withdrawl I've experienced ,I never got above 75mg yet I'm in absolute torture ,going into my second winter of worse depression than the last year ,I really cant believe it .its nearly impossible for me to get off the drug also .I'm much worse than this time  last year .

There is countless variables to each  persons withdrawl .ive since realised I have a highly sensitive nervous system and should never of taken these drugs [like petrol on a fire and only time will tell if I will ever heal ].

Don't get to hung up on the dosage aspect ,slow and steady taper is the best thing and clean up your diet as best you can and toxic people that trigger you .

Take care 

PB

[Hellbutrin]

I'm starting to get really discouraged. I haven't seen any improvement in my depression for two weeks, but at least I'm not suicidal like I was the week before last. Can anyone tell me about instances that they know of where individual's have totally recovered from this awful withdrawal condition?

[ChessieCat]

success-stories-recovery-from-withdrawal

 

Most of the members who are active on SA are here because they need support and help.  I imagine that there are many people who have joined, got the information that they needed and never return.  There would be members who don't even post but just get the information and also people who never join but get the information.

 

Members in the Intro forum with a sun symbol are members who are recovering.

 

Edited November 11, 2017 by ChessieCat

[ChessieCat]

2 hours ago, Hellbutrin said:

I haven't seen any improvement in my depression for two weeks, but at least I'm not suicidal like I was the week before last.

 

I consider not feeling suicidal to be a huge improvement.

[Hellbutrin]

1 hour ago, ChessieCat said:

 

I consider not feeling suicidal to be a huge improvement.

Hi ChessieCat,

 

The suicidal depression comes and goes, but it's less agitated than it was the week before last. I'm just wondering if the waves that I'm going through are the worst of it, or if I can expect it to get worse. In the beginning I had major anhedonia and memory/concentration issues, but it's only been the last three weeks that I've had this debilitating depression. I know it's impossible to know what to expect, but how common is it for antidepressants to leave the user prone to having depression in the future regardless of withdrawal?

[Altostrata]

Hi, Hellbutrin. 

 

Psychiatric jargon such as "suicidal depression" and "agitation" doesn't tell us much. What do you mean by "less agitated"?

 

Like Chessie, I think if the black holes don't seem as deep as before, or if they don't occur as often, that's an improvement.

 

When you're recovering from withdrawal syndrome, you need to think in terms of months rather than weeks.

[Hellbutrin]

14 hours ago, Altostrata said:

Hi, Hellbutrin. 

 

Psychiatric jargon such as "suicidal depression" and "agitation" doesn't tell us much. What do you mean by "less agitated"?

 

Like Chessie, I think if the black holes don't seem as deep as before, or if they don't occur as often, that's an improvement.

 

When you're recovering from withdrawal syndrome, you need to think in terms of months rather than weeks.

Hi Altostrata,

 

Thanks for your feedback! On November 1st through November 6th I was experiencing a wave that resulted in a burning sensation in my head, restlessness, irritability, insomnia, impaired concentration, confusion and depression so bad that I was giving serious thought to taking my own life. Since then it has lifted slightly, but I've noticed that my depression seems to be worse in the morning and gets less debilitating towards the evening. I'm starting to think that maybe I'm experiencing seasonal affective disorder that is making my depressive symptoms worse than normal. I've been researching ways to reset my circadian rhythm, but so far nothing I'm trying seems to be that effective. I'm supplementing with 1000mg of fish oil per day, and 100 mg of magnesium per day, but I'm not sure if they are making much of a difference. I never thought that I would be happy to see a return of my totally anhedonic state, but it is a welcome reprieve from how I felt last week since it makes the depression a little more bearable. This week marks 14 weeks since I completed my taper, and I'm trying to get a feel for how my waves are going to present themselves, since that was the first wave that I've had so far that has resulted in such bad depression. My other waves so far have presented themselves more like anxious states that make it difficult to sleep. I'm also wondering if the worsening of the waves could coincide with my menstrual cycle, my cycle ended on 10/29 and I started experiencing the worsening wave on 11/1. Could there be a correlation with my cycle ending and my wave worsening?

[Hellbutrin]

On 11/11/2017 at 4:21 PM, ChessieCat said:

 

I consider not feeling suicidal to be a huge improvement.

Hi ChessieCat, 

 

I was wondering how my too quick taper is likely to effect my recovery in the long run. Will it make make it difficult to recover completely or will it just take longer for my body to stabilize? 

[Hellbutrin]

Anyone’s input is much appreciated 

[Hellbutrin]

I completed my taper off of Wellbutrin in August, and I've been having a really difficult time functioning with the withdrawal that I'm experiencing. Will I set myself back in the recovery process if I reinstate a small dose? I'm also unsure of the best way to reinstate since I was taking 75 mg Immediate release version which is the "minimum effective dosage". I tapered by skipping days under the recommendation of my doctor. That same doctor also said that I shouldn't cut the Wellbutrin to taper it because 75 mg is the the minimum effective dose. Is it possible to have an adverse reaction to reinstatement and to have my intense depression return? Will reinstatement help with my withdrawal or add a whole other set of issues?

[AliG]

I think with the difficulties you have been experiencing, a small reinstatement would possibly help to alleviate some of your symptoms and help you to eventually stabilize. We are looking for the lowest effective dose which is much smaller than the amount doctors usually advise taking. A low dose lets you explore the option with less risk of being sensitized.

 

The adverse reaction you had when reinstating after your cold turkey was most likely because it was too high a dose. We are only talking about a few mgs to take the edge off withdrawal symptoms. Please have a thorough read through #1 of the reinstatement topic ~

About reinstating and stabilizing to reduce withdrawal symptoms

 

This option has been suggested previously and you have understandably rejected the idea as you didn't want to go back on an antidepressant. I can fully understand your reasoning however a small reinstatement could save you a world of pain in the long term. I wouldn't leave it much longer to make this decision. The more time that passes the less likely it is to work. The length of this window of opportunity varies according to the individual. Sometimes people can successfully reinstate months after quitting. Others cannot.

 

I regret that this option was closed to me unfortunately, as I thought I was too far along in the process C/T. It has now been 3.5 yrs of struggle and I sincerely hope that it can be a different experience for you.

Let us know your thoughts and we can guide you through this, if you do decide to go this route.

Ali

Edited November 14, 2017 by AliG
spacing

[Hellbutrin]

32 minutes ago, AliG said:

I think with the difficulties you have been experiencing, a small reinstatement would possibly help to alleviate some of your symptoms and help you to eventually stabilize. We are looking for the lowest effective dose which is much smaller than the amount doctors usually advise taking. A low dose lets you explore the option with less risk of being sensitized.

 

The adverse reaction you had when reinstating after your cold turkey was most likely because it was too high a dose. We are only talking about a few mgs to take the edge off withdrawal symptoms. Please have a thorough read through #1 of the reinstatement topic ~

About reinstating and stabilizing to reduce withdrawal symptoms

 

This option has been suggested previously and you have understandably rejected the idea as you didn't want to go back on an antidepressant. I can fully understand your reasoning however a small reinstatement could save you a world of pain in the long term. I wouldn't leave it much longer to make this decision. The more time that passes the less likely it is to work. The length of this window of opportunity varies according to the individual. Sometimes people can successfully reinstate months after quitting. Others cannot.

 

I regret that this option was closed to me unfortunately, as I thought I was too far along in the process C/T. It has now been 3.5 yrs of struggle and I sincerely hope that it can be a different experience for you.

Let us know your thoughts and we can guide you through this, if you do decide to go this route.

Ali

Thanks AliG, I wouldnt even know where to start. If I try it will it set me back with the progress that I've made so far if it doesn't work? I was taking 75 mg IR of Wellbutrin, what would be a good dose to try this with?

[Survivor1]

Hello Hellbutrin,

 

Sorry to hear about your suffering.  I wanted to let you know about my experience with reinstatement, as I think it could be an option for you.

 

Last year I ct'd seroquel.  I was OK for 3 months then total disaster.  I had daily anxiety and depression (and other issues) that were almost crippling.  I couldn't bear it any more and decided to reinstate 3.5 months later.  I took a very small dose and was able to stabilize completely.   It took another 3 months, but stability did happen.  I would encourage you to reinstate since your symptoms are so harsh.  Note though that it may take a while to feel better, but hang in there, if reinstating is what you decide.

 

I hope you feel better.  WD is horrible, I don't wish it on anyone ...

[Blondiee1915]

Hi - I also had to reinstate due to terrible WD symptoms .  I came off too quickly after being on meds for a good 10 years .  3 months I was okay and then it became too much - severe dp and dr detachment dizziness and fatigue and this dread.  I was scarred to leave my house and go to work .  I reinstated but then switched to a different ssri a somewhat equivalent dose and I am better compared to where I was last year .  I think a lot of ppl experience the 3 months mark where things get bad and it is not so bad to think about reinstatement .  Decision is of course yours 

hope you will feel better soon 

b 

[Krasiyan]

Hellbutrin what AliG said is very strong advice, and I personaly really feel for him, because he couldn't reinstate. I also suffered withdrawal. Reinstated when it got really bad, and even updosed when the first reinstatment wasn't working. Sure I still get waves of feeling like shi*, but I need time to stabilize. I was losing weight, because I had no interest in food, and was stressed all the time. I read somewhere you said you've been sleeping only 3 - 4 hours. If it was me I'd be going crazy after the second night. Sleep is very important for me, because the waves do exhaust you.

[Hellbutrin]

I had a question that I was hoping someone could answer. If we destabilize our CNS to the point that we are experiencing protracted withdrawal, is it possible that our brains could be changing in a way that causes further destabilization? I'm asking because I seem to be getting worse and not better. I mean is it possible for our brains to only partially heal and for us to have to accept some of the symptoms of withdrawal as permanent changes to our brains? I'm so concerned that I don't seem to be getting better. My waves are getting worse and worse and more and more frequent. How does homeostasis of the brain work? I know that the brain heals by creating new pathways in the brain, but does it want to create pathways that are similar to what was natural to our body before we used the drugs, or is it just doing the best it can with what it has to work with now. Any feedback is appreciated so much! 

[Meeto]

 This is a very good question.  Obviously since healing is not often linear, as viewed by the waves and windows patterns, it could be that you might get worse before getting better as our brains search for homeostasis.  Maybe the pathways it's creating is not good enough and will keep trying to do so.

[nz11]

Hi Hellbutrin

The best of sa is not really intended for a discussion thread simply a posting of favourites

 

8 hours ago, Hellbutrin said:

Is it possible for genes to get turned off and on? Or do they die off? Do all of the gene modifications that the drugs made to us reverse themselves?

imho and from my limited reading on this I would say, yes, yes and good question. 

[Hellbutrin]

I could REALLY use some reassurance that DP/DR and brain fog are not permanent and that they do eventually go away. I'm concerned because most of the reports that I've seen on this forum and others from people who have experienced DP/DR report that they experienced DP/DR in a windows and waves patterns from the beginning of their withdrawal, but mine has been permanent 24/7 since the day I withdrew so there is no evidence for me that this symptom will eventually break up and go away. If I had even one window then I might be able to rationalize with myself that my waves will eventually get longer and easier to manage. But this symptom has remained constant and unwavering for 5 straight months, and I would love to see evidence that this is a temporary. I'm concerned that I might have rewired my brain in a way that is going to be more prone to utilizing DP/DR as s defense mechanism from panic attacks in the future and that I will stay like this. 

[UnfoldingSky]

Hi Hellbutrin,

 

I just PM'd you.  I had DP/DR pretty well all the time for a long time and it cleared up.  Don't lose heart!

 

US

[Blondiee1915]

Hellbutrin -

 

I also struggle with dp/dr.  And like you I don't have windows it is pretty constant .  I wonder too if this is a defense mechanism from panic attacks as I do have anxiety disorder and initially was put on meds bc of panic attacks.  I hope that it will lift for both of us soon enough.  In the meantime I try to manage stress levels bc when I stress it gets much worse.  

 

B 

[bhasski]

9 hours ago, Hellbutrin said:

But this symptom has remained constant and unwavering for 5 straight months, and I would love to see evidence that this is a temporary.

 

I can relate.

[Hellbutrin]

Is it common to experience extreme fatigue this far out? I just slept for a solid 7 hours and I feel like I can't concentrate and want to go back to sleep

[Blondiee1915]

Yes it is normal . I struggle with fatigue for over a year it is somewhat better from what it was before .  I remember having days where I literary had to stay in bed I had no energy or strength and just wanted to rest .  Exercise and good diet helps I also take some b complex vitamins 

[Hellbutrin]

I've had a new symptom emerge in the last couple days. I went from having chronic insomnia to really bad fatigue. I slept for a solid 8 hours and I'm still exhausted. Is this common, will it get better? Or is it going to stick with me until my CNS heals?

[LexAnger]

Hi HB,

 

just found you through another topic.

 

its heartbreaking to know your journey is so tough too!

 

i quickly read through your thread and learned we stopped at similar time and you had the worst WD round 3 months off now I'm having the same at my 2.5 month still going on with new sxs added like you had.

 

do you feel you are out of the worst suisidal depression hit? How are you feeling overall now?

 

Lex

 

 

 

 

[scallywag]

HB: I've moved your question about fatigue to your introduction topic so that all your information, questions and answers are in one place.

 

Fatigue and insomnia are common withdrawal symptoms. They do ease and resolve over time. The hard part is dealing with it while being patient with the fact that you're still dealing with it.

[Hellbutrin]

On 1/6/2018 at 11:28 PM, LexAnger said:

Hi HB,

 

just found you through another topic.

 

its heartbreaking to know your journey is so tough too!

 

i quickly read through your thread and learned we stopped at similar time and you had the worst WD round 3 months off now I'm having the same at my 2.5 month still going on with new sxs added like you had.

 

do you feel you are out of the worst suisidal depression hit? How are you feeling overall now?

 

Lex

 

 

 

 

Hi Lex,

 

I missed your post from Saturday for some reason, sorry about that. I do feel like I'm out of the worst of my suicidal depression wave, and I really hope that I NEVER have to feel like that again. I'm starting to get REALLY concerned because I've done a lot of research online and I'm discovering that extreme protracted withdrawal from Wellbutrin alone is REALLY uncommon, and I'm fearful that I was too sensitive to be taking Wellbutrin in the first place and that now I might have permanently messed myself up. I would love to read a recovery story from someone who had protracted withdrawal symptoms from just being on Wellbutrin that was able to eventually recover, but I haven't seen a case like that since I've been in this situation. I'm starting to get really terrified that this is a permanent state for me. 

[Hellbutrin]

Most of the reports on the forums and articles that I have read say that Wellbutrin is one of the easiest antidepressants with the fewest side effects to come off of. I'm really concerned if that is the case, because I've been in withdrawal for the past 5 months and from what I've read on this site and others my withdrawal experience is just as severe as a lot of individuals that were taking their meds for way longer than I was. Does anyone know of a case where someone had severe protracted withdrawal from taking Wellbutrin?

[scallywag]

People frequently make uneducated and/or ill-informed statements about anti-depressants.  The scientists and medical people have no way of knowing which anti-depressant will "work" best for which individual and they don't know who will deal with difficult withdrawal from one medication and not another.  Arrogance in ignorance.

 

I've added tags to your thread for the drug's brand and generic names.  Click on either tag to see a list of  introduction topics of members who have taken the same med.

 

Have you done a web search on "wellbutrin bupropion withdrawal symptoms severity"?