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David182

 

3 hours ago, RusTW said:

I'm still having pressure in my head headache fog and really bad anxiety.The pressure is above my eyes with restless anxiety.I was getting that heat on my head yesterday.Man this is the worst so far.Hard to believe I had a window recently.

 

I’m sorry man. This really sucks...

I mean there is a little bit of comfort knowing others have similar symptoms but yeah, ugh...

 

have you had a chance to try the magnesium or fishoil yet?

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RusTW
11 minutes ago, David182 said:

 

 

I’m sorry man. This really sucks...

I mean there is a little bit of comfort knowing others have similar symptoms but yeah, ugh...

 

have you had a chance to try the magnesium or fishoil yet?

No I haven't.I'm going to gnc tomorrow.Today I just walked and went home.Thanks David looking forward to some healing discussions with ya man.so puzzling these withdrawals.now smell and sound amped up.We really do have to take it easy on the brain gut and cns.I think I'm doing too much exercise.

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RusTW

Hi David how's things.I feel a tad bit better.

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David182
On 8/21/2018 at 4:31 PM, RusTW said:

Hi David how's things.I feel a tad bit better.

 

Hi RusTW, I’m glad your feeling slightly better. Had a chance to start those supplements yet? I don’t mean to harp on the subject but am eager to see if they help ya.

 

I’m not too bad. Mostly dealing with stiff muscles and slight muscle spasms. My back is the most effected. Staying up on the hydration and taking ibuprofen when it gets really annoying/uncomfortable. Using cold compress on my back in the evening.

 

My sleep has been better the last two nights, so that’s definitely a plus. Kind of crazy something as simple as niquil could cause all of this but after a year an a half or so of dealing with destabilized CNS issues, it’s not surprising. 

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RusTW
1 minute ago, David182 said:

 

Hi RusTW, I’m glad your feeling slightly better. Had a chance to start those supplements yet? I don’t mean to harp on the subject but am eager to see if they help ya.

 

I’m not too bad. Mostly dealing with stiff muscles and slight muscle spasms. My back is the most effected. Staying up on the hydration and taking ibuprofen when it gets really annoying/uncomfortable. Using cold compress on my back in the evening.

 

My sleep has been better the last two nights, so that’s definitely a plus. Kind of crazy something as simple as niquil could cause all of this but after a year an a half or so of dealing with destabilized CNS issues, it’s not surprising. 

Hi David not doing so good today and the last few days I have extreme anxiety and insomnia. I have tried the supplements I got the fish oil melatonin magnesium but I don't feel like it's helping. I'm glad you're getting rest that's a good thing man. Did you ever get hit with bad waves of anxiety

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David182
2 minutes ago, RusTW said:

Hi David not doing so good today and the last few days I have extreme anxiety and insomnia. I have tried the supplements I got the fish oil melatonin magnesium but I don't feel like it's helping. I'm glad you're getting rest that's a good thing man. Did you ever get hit with bad waves of anxiety

Ah shoot, I’m sorry. I’ve read of many people having waves of anxiety. Whenever I have a symptom, it tends to stick around for a few weeks (about a month or so) ;some stick around longer bit still decreases over time.

 

As far as anxiety, on the daily routine it’s always worse in the morning and eases throughout the rest of the day (due to cortisol levels).

 

Sometimes new symptoms can cause me anxiety. I’ve had the chemically/neurotransmitter induced anxiety also. I don’t seem to a waves and windows kind of person, at least not as much as people I’ve read about.

 

I don’t know that it’s good or bad but just how my body deals and heals.

 

I’ve definitely had periods of my journey where sleep was awful for a while. That only contributes to the anxiety. I had to take benedryll when it was really bad and I’d still only sleep for about 4 hours or so. I don’t recommend developing a habit of benedryll. It’s not good for long term use and I didn’t use it any longer than needed. The only problem is a crap shoot as to whether it will help. I don’t advise doing it but that is truthfully what I did. I also used niquil for along time but now I’m having withdrawals from that, lol

 

Epsome salt baths (with lavender) were safer and helped a lot with sleep. Meditation helps calm things down a bit. Essential oils can really help also. 

 

How much magnesium and fishoil are you taking per day? 

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RusTW
7 minutes ago, David182 said:

Ah shoot, I’m sorry. I’ve read of many people having waves of anxiety. Whenever I have a symptom, it tends to stick around for a few weeks (about a month or so) ;some stick around longer bit still decreases over time.

 

As far as anxiety, on the daily routine it’s always worse in the morning and eases throughout the rest of the day (due to cortisol levels).

 

Sometimes new symptoms can cause me anxiety. I’ve had the chemically/neurotransmitter induced anxiety also. I don’t seem to a waves and windows kind of person, at least not as much as people I’ve read about.

 

I don’t know that it’s good or bad but just how my body deals and heals.

 

I’ve definitely had periods of my journey where sleep was awful for a while. That only contributes to the anxiety. I had to take benedryll when it was really bad and I’d still only sleep for about 4 hours or so. I don’t recommend developing a habit of benedryll. It’s not good for long term use and I didn’t use it any longer than needed. The only problem is a crap shoot as to whether it will help. I don’t advise doing it but that is truthfully what I did. I also used niquil for along time but now I’m having withdrawals from that, lol

 

Epsome salt baths (with lavender) were safer and helped a lot with sleep. Meditation helps calm things down a bit. Essential oils can really help also. 

 

How much magnesium and fishoil are you taking per day? 

Thanks D- 500mg fish oil magnesium100mg melatonin 1mg then 1/2 mg last few days.

David  you said chemical anxiety how did you feel when you had that that's what I feel like I have its uncontrolled and its extreme

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RusTW

My arms and face feels numb from the anxiety wierd feeling in spine excited.

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David182
21 minutes ago, RusTW said:

Thanks D- 500mg fish oil magnesium100mg melatonin 1mg then 1/2 mg last few days.

David  you said chemical anxiety how did you feel when you had that that's what I feel like I have its uncontrolled and its extreme

 

Ah ok, it looks like you need to up your intake of fishoil and magnesium.

 

Also magnesium (citrate, correct?) 100mg is only about 25% of the daily recommended value (double check your bottle). I would space it throughout the day and try to hit that 100%. You may want to ease into it as not to shock your system. Maybe try an additional 100mg magnesium citrate before bed tonight. Take one in morning and at night. If your stomach is ok and you don’t feel negative effects, take one at noon also. If all is well after a while try to get to 100% each day.

 

this is the info @Altostrata sent me a little while back...

 

“Magnesium oxide is not a very absorbable type of magnesium. See http://survivingantidepressants.org/topic/15483-magnesium-natures-calcium-channel-blocker/

 

Also see about fish oil http://survivingantidepressants.org/index.php?/topic/36-king-of-supplements-omega-3-fatty-acids-fish-oil/

I’d use Dramamine for the chemical anxiety. It doesn’t solve it but does take off the edge. Easy slow/moderate walks also help. I don’t want to give out bad advice (taking Dramamine) but I didn’t have negative side effects from Dramamine. Also, make sure your getting your hydration and electrolytes.

 

*Just remembered something:

look up B-vitamins on the forum. Sometimes they help, sometimes they make symptoms worse. It depends on your body. They’ve helped me in the past but currently they seem to make me worse.

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RusTW

Thanks D I'm hurtin today.scary times.I gotta go to work like this.the chemical anxiety has gotten worse over the last few days.did u get it at night.That's whats causing insomnia.how did you feel when u had it

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David182
10 minutes ago, RusTW said:

Thanks D I'm hurtin today.scary times.I gotta go to work like this.the chemical anxiety has gotten worse over the last few days.did u get it at night.That's whats causing insomnia.how did you feel when u had it

 

I can relate! There’d be times I didn’t know how I’d make it through work but I always did. Yes, night was bad. That’s when nothing is going on so your all the more in tune with your body. That’s my theory at least. For me, it felt like ice in my veins and being electrically “plugged-in.” Just when I’d start to fall into the oblivion of sleep, I’d jolt awake. Ugh, I hated that. Plus the worry that goes with anxiety...

 

Yeah, I used benedryll for a short while. It helped for me at the time. Anymore, it confuses me and makes me feel weird.

 

Again, i don’t know if that’s the best route to go and I don’t want to recommend anything against the practices of this forum. There are some good articles on here about help with sleep. They may offer a healthier solution.  

 

 

I’m hoping with increasing the fishoil and magnesium citrate, you’ll see some symptoms decreasing and start feeling better.

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RusTW
1 minute ago, David182 said:

 

I can relate! There’d be times I didn’t know how I’d make it through work but I always did. Yes, night was bad. That’s when nothing is going on so your all the more in tune with your body. That’s my theory at least. For me, it felt like ice in my veins and being electrically “plugged-in.” Just when I’d start to fall into the oblivion of sleep, I’d jolt awake. Ugh, I hated that. Plus the worry that goes with anxiety...

 

Yeah, I used benedryll for a short while. It helped for me at the time. Anymore, it confuses me and makes me feel weird.

 

Again, i don’t know if that’s the best route to go and I don’t want to recommend anything against the practices of this forum. There are some good articles on here about help with sleep. They may offer a healthier solution.  

Thanks D appreciate ya man this is the worst so far

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David182
Just now, RusTW said:

Thanks D appreciate ya man this is the worst so far

 

Glad to offer whatever help/info/experience I can. I’m pulling for ya!

 

Something else that just came to mind; per recommendation on one of these forums I read Claire Weekes - Hope and Help for Your Nerves. This book is amazing and really has helped me with facing and dealing with anxiety. 

 

One day day at a time, brother. We WILL get through this.

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RusTW

Right on D -Aeroman also said he liked Clare Weeks.I'm gonna get it.Your right one day at a time.

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Altostrata

RusTW, please post in your own Intro topic and leave this topic to David and his progress.

 

Note: RusTW's symptoms may be due to his testosterone treatment.

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David182

Today was a nice success. Mowed the yard and afterward I actually had the drive and energy to clean up, clean out and organize my garage. Feels really good to be productive. I’m not thinking about or worrying how long this may last, just enjoying now for what it is : )

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David182

I just read that liquid Zoloft has alcohol in it. That’s a bit alarming: considering my nervous systems is already sensitive.

 

Maybe that’s why it it can be tricky switching from pill to liquid form?

 

@Altostrata 

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Altostrata

Many people have used Zoloft liquid to taper. The amount of alcohol you would be taking is tiny.

 

If that worries you, either have Zoloft liquid made by a compounding pharmacy or make your own with water.

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RachelSusan

Greenstone Brand has 12%. Remember it is only 12% of whatever mL you will be taking. I am super sensitive and I haven't had a problem with it, I am not you though. I did have a problem however when I first started the liquid because I didn't cross taper between the hard pill and liquid as suggested here by the mods.

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David182
2 hours ago, Altostrata said:

Many people have used Zoloft liquid to taper. The amount of alcohol you would be taking is tiny.

 

If that worries you, either have Zoloft liquid made by a compounding pharmacy or make your own with water.

 

2 hours ago, RachelSusan said:

Greenstone Brand has 12%. Remember it is only 12% of whatever mL you will be taking. I am super sensitive and I haven't had a problem with it, I am not you though. I did have a problem however when I first started the liquid because I didn't cross taper between the hard pill and liquid as suggested here by the mods.

 

Oh ok, that is reassuring. I believe I should be fine after the initial adjustment period.

 

I’m running out of pills and will be starting the liquid form later this week. I have just enough pills to get me through Friday. 

 

I do remember reading about the cross adjustment route. I wasn’t entirely sure how to go about that (I should have asked) If it isn’t too bad, I may just deal with it. I certainly don’t want to try my doctor’s patience since with getting more pills, eapecially since we are on the same page and all. (She is a wonderful GP, though)

 

thank you both for your replies and for being so quick. I am truely blessed. : )

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David182

If I did cross taper, how would I go about that being on 50mg? @Altostrata

 

@RachelSusan

what symptoms appeared as a result of the hard switch?

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RachelSusan

For me, the hard switch was like going into a too fast taper. Everyone's symptoms are different though. What did you experience the last time you destabilized? For me it was my usual symptoms of internal tremors, hot sweats, burning skin, headache.  It lasted two weeks.  Some people have no problems making the switch from pill to liquid.  I did. You may not.

 

I believe that they recommend you cross taper something like this. Hard pill 75% and liquid 25%, then to 50/50, then to 25% hard pill and 75% liquid.  Then 100% liquid.  I don't recall how long the mods recommend for each stage. I think if I had to do it all over again I would stay at least a week at each level, perhaps two if I felt and symptoms. But again every person is different and these are suggestions, nothing is etched in stone.  Since you are limited on pills you may want to do something like 50/50 until the pills run out. The problem with this stuff is nobody can predict how our bodies will react.

 

I have to say in spite of the complications of going on liquid Zoloft it was a very good thing. It has given me a lot more control over the tapering. I found it very hard to cut the pills as I got into the smaller dosages.

 

David, you can do this. I think you will be fine.

 

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David182
1 hour ago, RachelSusan said:

For me, the hard switch was like going into a too fast taper. Everyone's symptoms are different though. What did you experience the last time you destabilized? For me it was my usual symptoms of internal tremors, hot sweats, burning skin, headache.  It lasted two weeks.  Some people have no problems making the switch from pill to liquid.  I did. You may not.

 

I believe that they recommend you cross taper something like this. Hard pill 75% and liquid 25%, then to 50/50, then to 25% hard pill and 75% liquid.  Then 100% liquid.  I don't recall how long the mods recommend for each stage. I think if I had to do it all over again I would stay at least a week at each level, perhaps two if I felt and symptoms. But again every person is different and these are suggestions, nothing is etched in stone.  Since you are limited on pills you may want to do something like 50/50 until the pills run out. The problem with this stuff is nobody can predict how our bodies will react.

 

I have to say in spite of the complications of going on liquid Zoloft it was a very good thing. It has given me a lot more control over the tapering. I found it very hard to cut the pills as I got into the smaller dosages.

 

David, you can do this. I think you will be fine.

 

Thank you, Rachel Susan!

 

I did find an small amount of extra pills I kept in a different drawer in case of emergencies (pharmacy problems, etc). I forgot I had them.

 

My last upset sucked but it wasn’t unbearable.

I may at least do the 50/50 after all and hope for the best.

 

Thank you again!

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David182

I’m not sure why text size changed in that last post but I didn’t mean to emphasize any part over the other.

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RachelSusan

Hey David,

I'm glad to hear you found those extra pill. It sounds like you have got a good plan. 

RS

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David182

It seems since I quit taking niquil nightly, among other symptoms, I seem to now have a sensitivity to ibuprofen. I was fine before but now that things have been upset again...

 

It interferes with my sleep, causes feelings of hotness and especially warm hands and feet. Trying to fall back asleep can cause what seems like brain zaps. Once I take 100mg of magnesium citrate, things seems to calm down and I normally can fall back asleep after a bit.

 

This isn’t too surprising to me but

just wanted to journal this for future reference. 

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David182

Hi everyone,

How was the Labor Day weekend?

Mine was a bit unique and quite busy.

 

Thursday (8/30/18) my parents were involved in a car accident. Both are OK but Mom is hurting. That was quite an evening at the ER. Needless to say the adrenaline was on high alert for a while until I knew both parents were OK. Had a very busy weekend being involved in a wedding and visiting people etc. Didn't have time to walk for exercise for four days, had a few nights of crummy sleep and missed my evening supplements last Saturday.

 

I'm pretty tired and physically weak. I know this too shall pass but wowee, that fatigue can be rather intense at times!

Goal: taking it easy for the rest of the week while continuing to do my nightly walks. I haven't begun my liquid Zoloft yet, need to even out a bit first.

 

On the plus side, now that I do have my evening walks again, when I go to sleep, I sleep like the dead!

 

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David182

Weakness, tired, lightheadedness (mostly when talking), malaise, tight muscles (not as bad as before), negative mood (trying to stay positive) irritable and bumbed.

 

Better days ahead, taking things one day at a time...

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David182

Been doing ok. Sick with a cold/flu now. 

Doing what I can to avoid meds as I’m so sensitive to pretty much all meds right now. I’ve been using the generic brand of Vic’s vapor rub, fruits, vit C and lots of hydration.

 

The head pressure from the congestion was really intense last night. Sleep was poor so I eventually took 10mg of phenylephrine HCI.

 

It helped with the congestion but gave me a sensation of a restless right foot/leg. Every time I’d almost fall asleep I jerk awake by the drawing of having to move my foot/leg. I took magnesium and finally fell asleep.

 

This hypersensitivity is no fun. Does stabilization mean no sensitivity? Is it ok to taper while sensitive? Is sensitivity just something we have to deal with while we taper? I’m still not 100% sure what all qualifies as stable. Stable being 100% good again or just good enough with lessened / acceptable symptoms? Can we still heal while tapering?

@Altostrata

 

@RachelSusan

Did you gain back your ability to exercise before or after you started tapering?

 

 

 

 

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SkyBlue
1 hour ago, David182 said:

This hypersensitivity is no fun. Does stabilization mean no sensitivity? Is it ok to taper while sensitive? Is sensitivity just something we have to deal with while we taper? I’m still not 100% sure what all qualifies as stable. Stable being 100% good again or just good enough with lessened / acceptable symptoms? Can we still heal while tapering?

 

 

 

Hi Dave,

 

Really good questions.

 

Yes, the hypersensitivity is a bear. It seems that for many of us, the hypersensitivity is indeed something we need to deal with as we taper. There are things we can do to nurture our nervous systems (like the magnesium you're taking) to make it less severe/debilitating. But I definitely hear you with the hypersensitivity. I had to laugh the other day because someone's cell phone buzzed just one buzz, the "you've got a text message" buzz, and I jumped *a mile.* Like a cartoon character. Geez!!!

 

Long story short, it varies for everyone, but "stable" generally means, like you said, "good enough" with acceptable symptoms. Perfectly said. : ) So the question for each person is, are your symptoms acceptable, liveable enough to you that you want to do the next decrease, etc. 


Yes! We can still heal while tapering. I've found definite and lasting improvements while still tapering. It seems our systems are always reaching toward healing, and are grateful for any gentleness we can give them.

 

You might want to try topical magnesium (like lotion). I find it calms my withdrawal-induced restless legs really well. 

 

Hope your cold gets better soon.

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Altostrata

Stable means low-level, predictable symptoms.

 

The hypersensitivity will lessen over time.

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RachelSusan

I agree with all the above posts.  I am still sensitive, 2 plus years into this. However not nearly as sensitive as when it first began. It does lessen over time.  Stabilization means exactly what Altostrata says. The good news with this is there are even some times during the taper when you don't have any symptoms. You feel completely normal. Well whatever your normal is.

 

I am still tapering and I exercise.  I think once I reached some sort of stability is when I started exercising again.  Before I was stable when I would occasionally try to exercise I would get jittery, have tremors, headaches, nausea, dizzy, and sweat far beyond what is normal for any person working out. In short it felt like I was going through withdrawal all over again, at least for a few hours, sometimes it would last a day. But I kept checking back and you know what, I noticed that it got to a point where I could do a light workout without severe symptoms.  There are still times though that I once and a while get a few symptoms that have been induced by exercise but it's ok, it's at such a low level that I can live with it.

 

Feel better David.


RS

 

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David182

@SkyBlue @Altostrata @RachelSusan

 

Thank you you all so very much! It’s hard to put into words just how encouraging your messages have been. 

 

SkyBlue your story about the cellphone buzz put a smile on my face. That is such a wonderful perspective. I’m grateful you  you can laugh at the absurdity our symptoms can present sometimes. : )

 

RS

It seems to be a combination of the body healing with time and gradual exercise increasing the body’s tolerance. It can be so disheartening but in this moment I’m finding it a bit fascinating.

 

I’m curious when and hopeful there will be a major breakthrough in the medical community concerning these meds and CNS reactions/healing. (As I’m sure most of us are!)

 

I hope your all doing well! Much love and positive vibes. 

 

One day day at a time : )

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David182

I’ve been sleeping poorly lately (about 5 or 6 hours per night). This of course exasperates symptoms (hot flashes, nausea, anxiety, lethargy, feelings of hotness in hands and feet).

 

I’m not really sure what’s caused it. I did try that decongestant two weeks ago but that was one time. Maybe splitting those old pills hasn’t been 100% accurate (100mg to 50mg). I have a pill cutter but it’s not always a cleanest cut (but close).

 

I used Vit C and occasional ibuprofen used when sick. I’m over the cold/flu now but then again the illness may have triggered this. Idk. I’m trying not to be caught up in figuring it out as that can only increase anxiety. Trying to accept and float forward but gosh it can be rather discouraging having a setback, especially sleep.

 

I’m going to have to transition to liquid form of Zoloft this weekend so, that’ll be whatever it’s going to be.

 

I’m trying everything I can think of: tart cherry juice, magnesium citrate, epsome salt bath, etc

 

I don’t expect answers to this problem, there maybe nothing more to do than take it easy and wait it out. I just needed to express the setback. I hope your all doing well in your journey! Take care.

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Altostrata

How has your sleep pattern changed recently? Has it been very hot where you live? Are you using the computer late at night? 5 or 6 hours per night is not bad for withdrawal.

 

29 minutes ago, David182 said:

I’m going to have to transition to liquid form of Zoloft this weekend so, that’ll be whatever it’s going to be. 

 

Why do you have to make this change?

 

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MRothbard

So what's your workout routine like these days? Asking because i experience symptoms as you do when i over-exert myself.

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