Rosetta: cold switch May 2011 & too fast taper Feb 2017

[Rosetta]

Thanks Rus, Rabe and FGW for your thoughts.

 

Last night, there was muscle tension at bedtime.  Today, I had quite a bit of anxiety from before daylight to the time of getting up.    There was slight nausea.

 

My period arrived today.  So, that may account for some of my symptoms -- muscle tension, mood, etc.. WD makes all of that worse, of course.  Made it through the day.  Took a shower.  Did very little else.  No walk.  Hoping to do that soon before the light is gone.  

[Carmie]

Hi Rosetta, 

 

I googled that desert you  mentioned that you went too. It looks lovely. Have you taken photos with the dinosaur statues? Were the cacti flowering?🌵🌸

 

I hope you start feeling a bit better now that you have your period. I’m way past mine, I’m in my 50’s. I used to get really severe PMs too, that on top of withdrawals would be awful. I’m so sorry you have to go through that. 

 

Sending hugs your way🤗

[Rabe]

Hope things continue to improve now that the hormones settle down some.  Also hope you got your walk in.  💜 and hugs Rosetta.

[Rosetta]

Very few cacti flowering, but they had buds.  It will happen soon.  No, no photos of the metal dinosaurs.  Some of the cacti and the wild flowers, and the painted lady butterflies.  They were all over -- hundreds and hundreds flying past us.  

 

Thanks, Rabe.  This must normalize eventually.  Slowly, slowly I will get better.  The improvements are so slow.  Less of my hair is falling out.  I'm more functional overall.  The anxiety is still SO very debilitating!!!  You know how it is, I suppose.  I always assume everyone feels what I feel, but I'm realizing that's really not true.  There are certain symptoms people tend to have over and over, and anxiety really does fade rather early for some people.  It's been 25 months since I quit, but the anxiety started almost 8 years ago when my baby was born, and the doctor switched my AD.  I'm "ready" for it to Go!!!  Sometimes it's impossible to

believe it will, but I must or I can't imagine going on.

[RusTW]

Hi Rosetta sorry you're still getting those anxiety waves. To me they are the most disturbing. From some of your post all it seems like you're getting some windows from the anxiety.

Nice job getting out there and going out to the desert. Staying productive and busy is a key as you know.

Wishing you a good night sleep tonight

Russ

[neroli]

Hello Rosetta

 

The anxiety is difficult.  I get spikes and longer periods during the day and it brings anything everything down again.

 

Got to have faith that these will fade in time as your system gets more stabilised.

 

Glad you got out to the desert.

 

Thinking of you

 

xxx Neroli 💜

[Rabe]

On 3/14/2019 at 7:42 PM, Rosetta said:

 Sometimes it's impossible to

believe it will, but I must or I can't imagine going on.

I can feel your feelings in your words Rosetta.  Sending love and hugs to you my dear friend...sometimes I dont even know what to say except you have come a long way and I care so much!!💜

[Rosetta]

Neroli, Rus and Rabe, Thank you for posting.  Even if I can't write, it means so much to see that you responded to give support.  

 

Last night was very, very hard.  I woke up early in the morning feeling so sad that my mother didn't love me, that I was so neglected as a child, that I was abused as a pre-teen and teenager by my mother.  I was feeling that all of that will never let me go.  With this muscle pain, I lose hope in the middle of the night.  I know that with sunlight I will feel less despondent.  So, I tell myself that over and over.  The muscle tension has been pretty bad in the night.  It's real pain these nights, not just ache.  My teeth, my jaw, my temples, my neck, chest and shoulders are so tense.  I can't read right now or it gets worse in the day.  That's why I don't write much on other threads.  I'm trying to stretch and use the muscles as much as I can.  

 

Miraculously, yesterday, I was able to collect some toys and books to give away.  This is very unusual for me.  Between apathy, fatigue, anxiety and cog fog that prevents me from making decisions and sorting it is very rare that I can emotionally, mentally and physically accomplish that feat.  So ridiculous are the effects of this syndrome!!!  So, I saw this as a sign of hope that I may be coming to the end of this wave, but I have been knocked back so many times that these little glimmers don't really give me much hope at this point 2 years into this CT.  I'm trying to tell myself this could be the last bad wave.  Don't lose hope.  Don't let my mind go there, etc.  I am so tired.

 

I taught art on Friday.  The classroom teacher needed the kids to draw self portraits.  It was emotionally draining.  Teaching 24 kids that sort of thing is simply not feasible.  Three or four kids in a small group would be ok. So, they didn't pay attention, they didn't understand, they this, they that . . .  But I got through it, and during the ordeal I didn't feel too bad --not as bad as I did during some art classes last Fall.  Afterward, I felt pretty fragile.  Sad, frustrated, a bit scared.  I couldn't remember that I drove there for a moment, etc.. I did go for a walk that day.

 

Friday night was hard just like last night with muscle tension pain.  The thought that I wish I would never wake up has come to  me night after night, again and again this last week.   I don't really want that, of course.  I simply want the nightly torture to stop.  I'm really at the point that if there was a muscle relaxer in my house I'm afraid I would use it.  I don't have the energy to get in the bath in the night.  I heated my shoulder wrap a couple of times, but it didn't help much.

 

Yesterday I was home all day, but I went for a walk in the park by myself.  That was better than not.  The night last night was so horrible.  I have vey little energy to "change the channel."  None, in fact.  This has gone on too long.  How does anyone survive this long?

 

@JanCarol  Any advice, please?

 

There's a birthday party I have to take my daughter to at Chuckee Cheese today.  Her favorite boy friend is having the party.  It will be Hell, loud, frenetic, truly a horror, but it's important that I go.  I hate Chuckee Cheese so much.  Why does it have to there?!!! But I need her to play with other kids.  She is so lonely.  She wants a friend to come over, but I just can't bear that.  It's easier to go somewhere else, but, of course, no one ever invites us.  Unless I organize something we do nothing with other kids.  I guess I have said no too many times to other people, and many people are sick with colds right now.  I never envisioned her childhood like this.  It's so hard.  I'm in tears.  I'm so exhausted.  This has gone on too long.

 

I feel that I don't belong here on this Earth, that I never have.  It's silly, but it's a very strong feeling.  My life has not been that bad compared to some, but I really, really wish I never existed.  The physical pain added to all the rest is too much.

[RusTW]

Rosetta it seems to be a strange process as we're going through waves some of the stuff that may affected our psyche through the years comes out for us to deal with. I believe that's a part of our recovery. We can't heal if we can't sort that out with ourselves.

It's so strange how we're in the middle of a wave it seems like eternity. Yesterday I was in the deepest wave since about a week and a half ago and in the afternoon it just dropped off like it was never there _unbelievable. Today I just have a headache.

I'm sorry you feel so depressed. I hope today goes better for you. Thanks for being there when I needed you.

Russ💢

[India]

On 1/14/2018 at 8:55 PM, Rosetta said:

A few more of my thoughts about having taken Celexa while pregnant:

 

Maybe I should be grateful if it's true that my daughter stopped getting ADs after birth.  If Zoloft did not go through the breast milk she might be luckier than if I had stayed on Celexa and she received that for a year or two.  I don't know.  CT could not have been a good thing for her, but I didn't know about tapering anyway.  I doubt the dose she would have received would have been the same in gestation as in breastfeeding.  I try to think back to how she reacted when she stopped getting Zoloft in the breast milk, but nothing stands out.  She's been a normal kid for an only child.  Of course, I feel these drugs shouldn't be given to women who might have children, period.  It's absurd.  They shouldn't be given to anyone at all quite frankly.

 

I suppose that even if doctors understood ADWD the OB who suddenly meets a pregnant woman and finds out she's on ADs would have a tough time helping her through WD?   I've considered all the possibilities, of course.  Am I glad the gestation OB didn't tell me to quit cold turkey or on a fast taper?  Do I wish he had?  I don't know.  There is no way to know what might have happened if I had done that.  

 

I did have a very good first 6 months with my child.  Perhaps that would not have been possible if I had stopped the drug quickly upon becoming pregnant.  Who knows?  We had another 1.5 years before I became unstable and another 2 years before extreme confusion and irrationality set in.  Those are very important years for a child.  We bonded well.  She knows she is loved by me.  Maybe these past 2 or 2.5 years have been easier for her because of that early time we had together.  I hope so.

 

I do worry that I became somewhat distant because of confusion and OCD when she was 2 or 3 (as the dose of Zoloft went up.) She's been intermittantly clingy with me when I try to drop her off at school this past year and a half.  She never did that at the preschool.  She started preschool at 2 1/2, and she loved it all the way through to 4 years old.  She went to the same preschool for 3 years and had the same teacher for the second and third years.  That may have given her stability despite my erratic emotions and behavior.  If not for that maybe there would have been more signs of an issue.  For the first half of kindergarten and this initial first half of First Grade, she has found it challenging to let me go at times.  Yet, she's never had much separation anxiety once I leave her at school.  The teachers have always denied that she continues to be upset. I have to hope that she's going to be ok.  

 

At least I wasn't absent or in bed all the time, and I wasn't abusive thank God.  The awful ways these drugs affect some people!!   I do continue to wonder what mechanism caused me to go downhill 4 years after the birth.  Did the high dose of Zoloft cause side effects that resulted in increased confusion and OCD?  Did I hit tolerance?  Is that why I had so many WD symptoms while I was still taking Zoloft?  Was it all caused by WD from Celexa catching up with me?  It could be a combination of all three.  I'll probably never know.  

 

Rosetta

Don’t punish yourself. Have you heard of the British psychologist Winnicott and the “good enough parent”? Build on the good. Know what you mean about kindling, I experienced deep depressions but also a slight mania. I was never hungry on citalopram . My bruxism/rls I put down to the drug too.

[Rosetta]

Thanks, India.  Thanks, Rus.

 

The pain subsided yesterday around 3 or 4.  I slept without pain last night and woke up with quite strong anxiety, but no pain.  What a relief.  Now to recover emotionally if I can beforeit comes back.  Emotionally, I'm still very fragile.  This is a very traumatic experience.  Each hard wave seems to leave me lower in terms of hope, but it must get better.  How can I get through?  I hope I can.  I cried and cried yesterday.  I couldn't stop.  Now, I'm teary, but not distraught.  I feel quite down.  Going for some sunshine.

[direstraits]

2 hours ago, Rosetta said:

Thanks, India.  Thanks, Rus.

 

The pain subsided yesterday around 3 or 4.  I slept without pain last night and woke up with quite strong anxiety, but no pain.  What a relief.  Now to recover emotionally if I can beforeit comes back.  Emotionally, I'm still very fragile.  This is a very traumatic experience.  Each hard wave seems to leave me lower in terms of hope, but it must get better.  How can I get through?  I hope I can.  I cried and cried yesterday.  I couldn't stop.  Now, I'm teary, but not distraught.  I feel quite down.  Going for some sunshine.

I'm so sorry you're suffering like this....I understand how it feels,you're not alone.

I think you're doing an incredible job with your daughter under such horrible circumstances.

this has to end at some point, we can do this!

 

enjoy the sunshine.❤️☀️

[Rosetta]

Thanks, @direstraits.  I see you have the sunshine symbol.  That's really wonderful.  I remember when you were very sick.

 

Thanks for the kind words.  My husband says that March and April have been awful for me for as long as he can remember.  He thinks my cycle is much more intense this time of year.  I can't find any suggestion that that would be the case for women generally.  Maybe it's a WD issue for me or it's caused by the changing light or the time change.  I remember saying the same thing on my thread at this time last year.  He tells me I'll feel better in May.  He told me the same thing last year.  I keep having wave after wave.  So, it's hard for me to judge whether this is a typical bad wave or this is something especially awful because of the time of year.

 

My sleep issues continue to be troubling in terms of waking in the dead of night with deeply depressed thoughts and fears.  I miss my grandparents a lot.  Memories, neuro-emotions.  I don't want to go to bed.

 

I have had no pain today thank goodness.  Took a walk -- more strenuous than usual -- up a big hill, ate well today, but nothing tasted good as if my tastebuds aren't working.  Trouble staying hydrated.  It was hot today here - high 70s - and it's warmer at night.  I felt better around 1:00 today in terms of anxiety, but mostly lethargic the rest of the day.  I had little glimpses of wanting to throw things away.  I couldn't actually get up to do it.  

 

Tomorrow, I'm supposed to volunteer in my daughter's class.  

[Rosetta]

Very intense anxiety this morning, electrical feeling in my legs and arms with SI -- Akathisia -- again!!  I did make it to the school.  My heart wasn't in it.  I just wanted to get out of there.  I sat on warm concrete at my house when I got home, in the sun, and that helped, but after I went in the house for a while I had to cry.  My husband got some good food for me -- avocados, acai sorbet, berries, and then took me for a walk.  I don't know how I would survive without him.  

 

I went to gymnastics, but I'm really in a bad way, no appetite, very nervous, very uncomfortable, all the signs of a nervous system off kilter.  My jaw and cheeks and neck are quite tense.  I'm considering Benadryl before bed.  Dreading bed, dreading awakening in fear.  I have to believe that there will be an end to these recurring waves, but I don't know.  I just don't know if I'll ever be free.

[Rabe]

Oh Rosetta...I am so sorry you are struggling so right now.  I am so glad you got to the desert the other day.  

You are incredible in the midst of all this to get to school and gymnastics...that is so hard!  

I wish I could take it all away, Rosetta, somehow.  I do know that you will come out of this...you always do it seems.  So hard when it returns.  I hope you get some sleep and that tomorrow has some easier moments.  It is hard to function when burdened with the load of symptoms.  

Love and hugs to you dear Rosetta!  💜

[Carmie]

I’m so sorry you’re struggling so much Rosetta, 

 

Just wanted to pop by and send you hugs🤗🤗

[wantrelief]

15 hours ago, Rosetta said:

I have to believe that there will be an end to these recurring waves, but I don't know.  I just don't know if I'll ever be free.

There will be an end, Rosetta, and you will be free.  It just all takes way more time than we would like but you will get there.

[Rosetta]

@Carmie @Rabe  @wantrelief , thank you for caring.  Yes, I always come out of it.  Thank you for taking the time to write and show you care.  It means a lot.  This is a nightmare I could never have imagined.

 

Yesterday, after I left the school, during the walk home I felt that feeling that someone had died.  That feeling we get after the shock has worn off and the reality sets in.  That happened to me a lot last year.  Something about being done with a task and walking away from everyone to go home to my reality makes me such intense grief.

 

I took 1/2 a tab of Unisom/Benadryl last night before bed.  But I had anxiety and nausea in the early morning.  I worried about losing photographs again.  Every time I woke up I worried about that the way I would worry about losing a person.

 

At least the muscle tension left.  This morning I'm "hung over" -- feeling so tired that I couldn't get out of bed.  My daughter was 2 hours late to school.  My husband had to get her ready and take her.  I feel guilty, but I'm doing the best I can.  I guess I can't use Unisom on a school night again.  

[Rabe]

11 hours ago, Rosetta said:

I felt that feeling that someone had died.

Hi Rosetta...I can understand this..I actually said that to myself ... the person I knew has died.  There is a huge sadness with that...btu I also know I am in there somewhere...and I can say you are.  You are so wonderful...in so many ways.  But i understand what you are saying.  Hope sleep comes for you tonight.

Love and hugs!💜

[neroli]

Hello Rosetta

 

12 hours ago, Rosetta said:

This is a nightmare I could never have imagined.

 

So sorry that you are having so much difficulty at the moment - and hope you come out of it soon.

 

Thinking of you over there.

 

Neroli xx 💜

[Rosetta]

Thank you @Rabe and @neroli. Today has been easier except for the wake up.  The cumulative effect on my life is really taking its toll.  My house is worse than ever.  All I can do is lie here.  My friend cancelled our playdate.  I think she forgot.  It's raining.  I'm just giving in to inertia today.  I'm supposed to teach art tomorrow.  I'll figure it out from there, I suppose.

[RusTW]

Hi Rosetta I just wanted to wish you a nice evening. Hopefully you can feel peaceful and relaxed. I used to like to stay inside during the rains down there. That's what I liked about Southern California is after the rains everything is all magnified and clean. LOL

Russ

[Rabe]

  Im grateful to hear that some things have gotten easier in past days..though I know 'easier' is hardly really that.  Glad you just gave in to the inertia...thats ok...because in general your life is far from inert!  Thinking about you and hoping tonight goes better as well and that you are able to get to art tomorrow.  Love and hugs to you dear Rosetta!!💜

[withhopeinmyheart]

Hugs from one WD traumatized soul to another. 💜

[Rosetta]

@RusTW @Rabe @withhopeinmyheart  Hi, thanks for checking in.  Today has been ok.  Some anxiety about waking up, but nothing severe and no nausea.  

 

My brain worked this morning!!!  (It was the first time in so long I was able to play with my daughter, too!)  First, I picked up a lot of Legos without getting confused or obsessive about how they should be organized.  More or less I put them all in a box except for the Elves Legos.  Two catagories -- elves and non- elves.  That may seem so ordinary, but usually my brain gets very overwhelmed and worries about all the catagories that might exist and the thought of lumping everything together is extremely panic inducing.  I know it's absurd as its happening, but I can't stop it.  I can't be relaxed about it.  An OCD type reaction perhaps, but really absurdly intense.  

 

I don't even know what bad thing I think will happen if the Lego sets can never be built again.  A little sadness from my daughter?  Probably a fear that my neuro emotion to her sadness will be extreme and affect her development?  I think that might be a logical explanation for my fear, but I doubt that's what my brain is experiencing.  I think it's more likely that my brain isn't working -- no logic processing ability -- and that fact by itself causes me to feel severely brain damaged.  Of course, my inability to put anything in a box means there will be no organization or culling of the stuff in my house and the state of my house causes me to feel very depressed.  I'm very, very unhappy here.  I wish I could move into an apartment until WD is over.

 

Well, today I didn't care if all the Legos went into one box.  Who cares?!! Who cares if they ever reconnect with their companions from each set again?!  I don't.  Who cares if the sets are ever built again?  Not me.  How great that felt.  

 

I wish I felt that way every day.  I could probably get my house in order.  I know it will disappear again.  I'm trying to be glad I had that short time for things to be in order enough that I could play with my daughter.  How wonderful.  Usually the chaos makes me feel so anxious and uncomfortable that I can't play with her.  I think I could play with her in a neat, orderly environment.  That's probably a major source of my distress -- that I can't be natural and just play with my daughter inside my own house.  She almost 8.  My time to do that is disappearing fast.  That time is dying and all I can do is lie there and watch the time slip away.  It makes me feel like she is dying.  In a very real way she is.  The seven year old is disappearing, and I can't even savor a few hours of playtime with her.  I have felt this way since she was 5 -- when I CT'd Zoloft.  

 

We played with her Lego people.  It was great.  I was creative and fun and she laughed with me.  The people had a party, and the main activity turned out to be tic tac toe.  It was a tournament.  About 15-20 Lego people played tic tac toe for hours.  That I was able to do that was really unusual and wonderful.  The cat kept trying to get in the middle of it all, and the Lego people would say, "Did a giant cat just walk through here?"  The baby dragon Lego flew up and scratched the cat's head.   Eventually, I had to stop.  

 

We have been in front of the TV for a while now.  I wish I could jump up and use my properly operating brain to cull and organize everything, but each time I have tried to push it I collapse.  I risk having a bad day if I get overwhelmed by stretching myself.  I hate to ruin a good day with my daughter that way.  I feel normal today if quite lazy and so on.  I long for the day that doing laundry and picking up stuff is just an ordinary thing to do -- something I don't even think about, but at least I got to play with my daughter!

[Rosetta]

It's been such a nice window today.  Even my appetite and ability to taste food improved.  I don't want to go to bed because I'm afraid it will all disappear.  But I have to sleep.  

 

The last couple of weeks muscle tension in the jaw is bad for me at night.  Crossing my fingers that tonight I will get a break from that, too.  Wish me luck!  Goodnight.

[neroli]

Hello Rosetta

 

Sounds like you had a lovely day - I'm so pleased you got a break and were able to enjoy your daughter and playing.

 

6 hours ago, Rosetta said:

I wish I could jump up and use my properly operating brain to cull and organize everything, but each time I have tried to push it I collapse.  I risk having a bad day if I get overwhelmed by stretching myself.  I hate to ruin a good day with my daughter that way

 

Much better to have the good time with your daughter than to over-extend and risking a bad day.  

 

Oh, I hope you can savour some more moments like this.

 

Love and thoughts..

 

Neroli xx 💜

[Carmie]

YAY for having window days Rosetta!!!💚

[RusTW]

Nice glad you're getting widows.its so nice isn't it.hope it continues. 

Russ

[Rabe]

14 hours ago, Rosetta said:

but at least I got to play with my daughter!

 words cannot equate to your joy so.....😍🎀💝💞🎁🦋🌹☺️ What a blesses gift the time with your daughter!!!  I am SO happy for you Rosetta!!!💜

[RusTW]

🧚‍♀️so happy for ya.

[DMV64]

Hi Rosetta,

I just wanted to stop by and say hi, stay connected. Hope you are well! xo

[Rosetta]

The window lasted another half day through to Sunday evening.  I did manage to walk both Sunday and Monday and I felt good in the afternoons.  I have been having some mania like symptoms in the evenings.  I didn't get to sleep last night until about 1:00 am.  In the mornings I feel very bad.  This morning was better than yesterday morning.  The physical pain and discomfort is really tough on too of the mental misery.  Epsom salt baths yesterday and today.  Trying to eat better and stay hydrated.

[neroli]

Hi Rosetta

 

It sounds like it's been a real mixture of ups and downs over the past few days.  Hope that things settle.  So sorry to hear you have had the sleeping/mania-type issue as well as the physical pain.

 

Thinking of you, wishing you the very best

 

Neroli xx 💜

[Rosetta]

Thanks @neroli Rus, Rabe and Carmie

 

Yesterday, I walked at the lake.  I picked my daughter up at school, went to gymnastics, and went to dinner at my mother in law.  When I lay down to sleep I felt very peaceful and relaxed.  It was a feeling of normalcy I don't usually have.  My sleep was much better.  I didn't worry in the night.  When I did wake up I fell back asleep easily until early morning when I awoke quite anxious.

 

This has been a very strange day.  I don't know what to think about it, but I hope that it means I'm getting better soon.

 

This morning I woke up when it was time to get up, and I was very anxious.  I was going to stay home while my husband took my daughter to school, but I decided that going for a walk early might be a better course of action to deal with my anxiety.  So, I got my daughter up, and I got dressed and after she was at school I went to get breakfast.  I had very little appetite.  My walk was disasterous.   I was just a little way into it when I broke down in tears and I couldn't stop crying.  I had to give up.  Then I went home and about an hour later I fell asleep!. I slept so deeply that I dreamed, and when my husband tried to wake me at 1:00 he couldn't.  I didn't wake up until about 1:30 when he came home with my daughter.  I didn't even know that he had left through the door right next to me.  Then, I was very groggy for another hour or two.

 

This is Very unusual for me.  Usually, I can't sleep in the daytime and if I do any little thing will wake me up.  Generally, I don't try to sleep in the day because of "toxic naps" -- waking with a panic, a pounding heart and nausea soon after falling asleep.  It's been a while since I had a toxic nap, a long while, but it's also been a long time since I felt sleepy in the day.  It happens about once or twice a month and it's usually close to the time I have to pick up my daughter.  It's rare that I fall asleep and if I do it's not for very long.  

 

The deepness of my sleep today reminds me of the deep sleep I had on Zoloft.  I don't think I have ever slept that deeply or long in the day since I quit Zoloft.

 

Could this mean that my nervous system is getting closer to finding its balance?

 

 

[RusTW]

Oh right soo happy to hear this for you Rosetta. I cant nap so this is very encouraging for me too hurray for you.