India: withdrawal (dissociation) after 9 years on citalopram

[RandyJames]

1 hour ago, India said:

@Tom37  and @Carmie

 

My personality has changed, noise invokes my fight/flight response and leaves me intensely angry. Same with personal space. I constantly battle my irritability and cannot be social for long. I find any conversation directed towards me intolerable. Even though I feel incredibly lonely and previously loved social interaction. I also can’t seem to integrate sensory information and can only attend ( badly) to one thing at a time.

 

I am quite impatient in many respects so this is such a battle.

 

Hi India.  I am so sorry you are going through all of this and I can definitely relate.  It is truly the most horrifying thing to go through.  I was in Benzo and Cymbalta WD at the same time 9 years ago and was completely destroyed.  2 years in I made the mistake of going back on an SSRI because I was too impatient.  I am now back in the same boat and am having tolerance withdrawal while taking Lexapro.  It started up in February while not even lowering my dose.   Now I will be tapering from here and fear it will be really hard from the tolerance I already have.

 

The encouragement I can give you is that there was some improvement during that time I was in benzo and Cymbalta WD to where I was actually retaining information better again and even began to do a tiny bit of artwork. At 2 years however I folded and started Lexapro.  Looking back I realize that I had been having windows and small improvements so I fully believe that by now I would have made it if I had just had more patience.  Just hang in there and don't give up.  It's good that you are walking and trying to move.  I didn't do that at all and I believe it really made things worse as laying in bed for 2 years even without WD on top of it would make anyone feel like crap.  This time I have been trying more to keep my strength up and have been walking and forcing myself to et more.  

 

I know you will improve.  I look forward to reading about it!

[puthappinessfirst]

3 hours ago, India said:

noise invokes my fight/flight response and leaves me intensely angry.

 

Hi India,

 

Just popping in to say that I deal with this too, but instead of anger it is panic/fear. Sooooo many noises, loud or subtle set me off. They either send chills up my spine or scare me, for no reason at all whatsoever. It is a pain in the booty, I know how you feel! 

[jozeff]

Hi India,

 

I'm so sorry for your suffering. It must be really hard for you to struggle this much. Thanks so much for stopping by in my topic! Appreciate it a lot.

 

The time goes by and it is hard to believe we'll ever heal completely. Month after month go by without noticeable improvements. I recognize this so much.

The same symptoms over and over again. Then, suddenly some other trouble but never complete Peace as we once had. 

 

You felt severely depressed you said. Do you fill a bit relieved from that? This feeling can be so upsetting. The crippling depressed feelings are killing sometimes. Sometimes I pray them to leave my head. At night things tend to get better for me. Do you have this phenomenon as well?

 

Your plan sounds reasonable to stabilize a year or so. Redicilously long of course but we have no other options. Time is our enemy but also our friend here. 

 

I hope you will find some stabilisation soon! 

 

Wish you all the best!!

 

Jozeff

[Baxter]

Hi, India,

 

I am a long term SSRI/SNRI user who stopped withdrawing from 60mg of Cymbalta at 30mg and lived with withdrawal symptoms for many months at the halfway point. Fast forward 10 years. Cymbalta pooped out and I was forced to make a change to another SSRI. Citalopram. I am currently on 15mg and just to give you an idea, it took me a year to transfer from Cymbalta to Citalopram and get down to 15mg. I read your description of sensory overload, limited attention and retreating from beloved social activity and thought that you and I have much in common.

 

I am just writing to offer support. One of the reasons I was on 30mg of Cymbalta was because I couldn't face dealing with the effects of withdrawing. Then the drug dropped out on me. I am hopeful that I can slowly decrease my citalopram (taking liquid is making the whole process so much easier than counting those cymbalta spheres bouncing around...) Hang in! Putting your taper on hold is not a bad idea at all. But don't wait for it to crap out on  you!

 

All the best and Jozeff sorry for the thread hijack.

[Baxter]

Hi, India,

 

I am a long term SSRI/SNRI user who stopped withdrawing from 60mg of Cymbalta at 30mg and lived with withdrawal symptoms for many months at the halfway point. Fast forward 10 years. Cymbalta pooped out and I was forced to make a change to another SSRI. Citalopram. I am currently on 15mg and just to give you an idea, it took me a year to transfer from Cymbalta to Citalopram and get down to 15mg of Citalopram. I read your description of sensory overload, limited attention, and retreating from beloved social activity and thought that you and I have much in common.

 

I am just writing to offer support. One of the reasons I was on 30mg of Cymbalta was because I couldn't face dealing with the effects of withdrawing. Then the drug dropped out on me. I am hopeful that I can slowly decrease my citalopram (taking liquid is making the whole process so much easier than counting those cymbalta spheres bouncing around...) Hang in! Putting your taper on hold is not a bad idea at all. But don't wait for it to crap out on  you!

 

All the best and Jozeff sorry for the thread hijack.

[Carmie]

Hi India, 

 

Hope you’re coping as best you can today. You asked how I go with reading, not too great a lot of the time. I can barely think through my thick molasses brain fog much of the time. I read when I can though. 

 

A lot of people going through withdrawals can’t stand noise, like yourself. There are times when I feel overstimulated by noise, but it’s not too bad. I go to lots of concerts, they are very noisy with loud music and crowds, and I have no problems at all.

 

Someone was telling me they haven’t even been able to watch a movie since 2010 because of the over stimulation. They can only listen to music 1 to 3 times a week, but for no more than an hour or so. We are all so different.

 

Take care, sending hugs🤗

[India]

Thank you everyone. Your comments have kept me going another day. Another day and  hopefully  another small step towards recovery. 

I will reply individually after I get enough energy together .

[Gracee]

Hi India.   I just read your thread and your tapering signature.   You have made good progress by going slow and steady with your taper.   Have faith in yourself and don't give up.   I learned that lesson the hard way.  This time I am determined to succeed and I believe you will too.

HUGS!

G.

[bhasski]

Hi,

The issues you describe will get settled down slowly. I CTed and could feel it gets better. 

Though I am still sensitive but now could manage to go out and do little.

[Rosetta]

HI India,

The sensitivity to light, sound, touch is very familiar to me.  I am noticing that it has calmed down over time.  It has calmed so slowly that I could not have noticed it happening.  It does come back stronger during waves.  I can handle hugs now.  I can make eye contact. I can ignore sounds sometimes.  Light is not as painful.  You will get there.  I realized recently that I don't walk through places trying to avoid any and all bumps into people at all cost.  I have done that for many years.  Overall my system is settling down.  Yours will, too.  I know it is all very hard right now.  

 

Rosetta

[India]

For my own reference : 

https://www.google.co.uk/amp/s/amp.theguardian.com/books/2018/apr/01/the-drugs-that-changed-our-minds-lauren-slater-review

[India]

I am so angry today. I feel broken by it all. My brain fog, my cognitive capacities. It is utter misery. 9 months now. Hardly any improvement. So much stolen. Stealing of time. Unforgiveable- the destruction of these drugs.

[India]

Re read everyone’s comments and it’s given me some strength. With a sieve for a brain, how easily I forget!! Thank you everyone for the support.

[withhopeinmyheart]

Just want to send some healing thoughts! 

[intothewoods]

I'm so sorry you're suffering extra this month, @India Please hang on and know you're much beloved. 

 

Did I mention I've already started writing our success stories in my head? 😊👍💙

 

Catherine 💞

Edited April 20, 2019 by intothewoods
Added blue username bubble

[Carmie]

Hi India, 

 

Just popping around to let you know I’m thinking of you. I’m really sorry you’re struggling so much. I tapered from 7.25mg to 7mg a number of days ago. The withdrawals don’t usually hit until approximately day five or so. 

 

Our poor brains are so sensitised and struggling hard to reach equilibrium each and every day. Wouldn’t it be great if we could see  the repair that’s happening each and every day. We may feel like nothing is happening because of all the symptoms we have, but every day is a day closer to healing. We will win this fight!

 

Sending hugs🤗

[India]

Sorry. I fell into a hole. I’ve been unable to write. A total block. I still think of you all here Carmie , into the woods, with hope .i am still alive , surviving.

Anxiety is through the roof. Depression too. Extreme emotion and all the cognitive stuff 

[intothewoods]

@India, it's wonderful to hear from you. Please don't apologize for falling into a hole. We're all in a black hole or we wouldn't be here. @Altostrata said her hope is that one day, she can close the site because there will be no need for support in WD off these meds. But for now, we are all here, growing in number (hang on @Altostrata! :) and no way are we going to let each other go. This does end, the more I learn day by day, the more I'm amazed that it for sure, does end.

 

On 4/29/2019 at 7:00 PM, India said:

I’ve been unable to write. A total block.

  

It's terrifying, isn't it? Like: how can I not type out a sentence? For WEEKS? Or call someone about mundane daily life? 

 

But we can't mostly for now. I felt despair the last couple of weeks as I couldn't access the recesses of normal thinking. The meds trick our brains but only temporarily. India, it surely seems you are going through the hardest part right now. We'd love for it to pass but we're all in for a run, maybe longer than shorter. Let it run. Let it come. 

 

Strength is hard won. Just living one hour at the time and being alive at the end of the day is victory. 

 

You are an inspiration. Don't let go. 

 

Catherine 💜

 

 

 

[India]

Dearest @intothewoodsyou are so generous with your writing and kind thoughts. This is all I can write right now. I want to explain some things that have been happening once I can write again. In the meantime, you are doing amazingly well.  I agree with everything you wrote so beautifully put. It’s definitely an extended acid trip, the good, the bad, the ugly. I’ve never experienced anything like it, and I haven’t lived a sheltered life. How I would of got through it without the site? I don’t think I would have. 

It is my dream too that the reality of what has been happening to all of us on here is validated and accepted.

until I can write again, much healing energy 

[intothewoods]

On 5/2/2019 at 8:59 PM, India said:

This is all I can write right now. I want to explain some things that have been happening once I can write again

 

Dearest @India,

 

I apologize for not responding sooner. But as you said, we simply can't a lot of the time or most of the time. Until we reach "WD Normal," we can't navigate very well, even life basics. But I am here for you and I know you are there. It doesn't change. That is sustaining beyond words for me. 

 

My mom read your thread this week and said "What a beautiful person. It's horrible what she's going through." She was ripped off Effexor last year and is still stabilizing on a lower dose. So she gets what's happening to us. And she's almost 80. Age doesn't matter in person terms; she is like us and loves fashion and food and wine and coming to know people. All the things that will come back again.

 

On 5/2/2019 at 8:59 PM, India said:

It’s definitely an extended acid trip, the good, the bad, the ugly. I’ve never experienced anything like it, and I haven’t lived a sheltered life.

 

Those two sentences are branded on my brain since you penned them. I've never heard it described so perfectly, and poignantly. It doesn't seem to end. That's the sinister aspect built into the meds: that we will never be free of this horror that no one could know. But we will.

 

On 5/2/2019 at 8:59 PM, India said:

It is my dream too that the reality of what has been happening to all of us on here is validated and accepted.

 

Not a dream but a given. No matter what, over time people will know. For now, your words compel me to keep fighting to carefully craft a piece that will reach the public's heart. And then a book. There are many fighting for that behind the scenes at SA. As you said, what would we do without the site? It's more pivotal in this global med withdrawal community than I ever realized.

 

I know you haven't budged with your Celexa since February. I've held my four meds since January. We just have to hold on and not cave in to making a move until it's the right time. SA has seen our journeys coming and going for almost a decade now. We are in safe hands.

 

Much strength and joy to you, always, India.

 

Catherine 💓

 

[India]

Lost my post. 

Have had a complete writers block , just not been able to write long bits of text  but felt I’d reached wd normal . Dropped to 5.4mg 10 days ago. 

Didn’t know I’d end up with an infection and  on two lots of antibiotics over weekend plus a dose of heavy painkillers . 

WD has kicked in, my anxiety is through the roof.. Seems even 10% has made a huge difference. I’m trying to work on the fear, it’s horrid. How long to resolve I wonder. I can see i’m going to struggle to get to O. Going to have to stick on this dose for quite some time. 

My therapist thinks it’s the ssri not the antibiotics. She says I should not change the dose anytime soon as I am already in the embers. I feel so raw. I am also feeling terrified of everything and everyone.

Hello to @intothewoods @Carmie

[intothewoods]

Dear @India, 

 

You are definitely in the embers and it sounds as if the 10 percent drop was too much. Many of us are very sensitive, like @Carmie and I can only reduce by 4-5 percent with long holds. Now with the infections and antibiotics -- it's a typhoon.

 

5 hours ago, India said:

I feel so raw. I am also feeling terrified of everything and everyone.

 

I feel the same way every day. I had to switch back to dreck generic Prozac on Saturday because I"m not able to drive the four hours RT to get them and it's like: Frankenstein! It sneaks up on us because we think we couldn't get any sicker but, yikes, we can. I'm finding there are degrees of more or less terror and maybe your brain took too much of a hit with the 10 percent. You're on the liquid so you can easily adjust. Maybe one of the mods can weigh in. 

 

Hang on, we're going to make it, hour at the time. 

 

Catherine💜

 

p.s. ~ I'm getting in the car now to get the better generics! 

[India]

Almost a year since I came off these ssri’s . A year of being so so  ill. A whole year stolen from me, iatrogenic caused and preventable. 

I am so angry. I am angry beyond measure. I have an absolute right to that anger, that fury. A whole year of my life stolen from me.

I am on 5.4mg. I’ve had a resurgence of symptoms.

 

These were crutial years for me. Before the drugs I was lucid and alive, yes, I’d get depression, yes, the trauma, yes, the dyspraxia but if those impediments were affecting 30/40% of my total functional capacity , by comparison I am 90% affected in withdrawal . I was still full of life and energy. I was also physically healthy. 

I now have the equivalent of dysautonomia and amnesia, but without the support that comes with that. 2 days ago i developed a hand tremor 

 

It is an utterly true statement to say that these ssri’s have destroyed my health and my life. 

 

I, like many on this site, have become a tragedy. 

 

I just moved, a beautiful thing but as usual the WD eats away at anything good.

 

Still the cognitive disablement. 

 

Sorry, everyone. This is all I can write for now . I seem to only be able to write on one plane.

 My coordination has taken a significant turn for the worst. 

 

I have been on 5.4mg for 5 weeks. I won’t change now. 

 

Healing to intothewoods, Carmie and everyone else.

[India]

On 5/15/2019 at 4:07 PM, intothewoods said:

Dear @India, 

 

You are definitely in the embers and it sounds as if the 10 percent drop was too much. Many of us are very sensitive, like @Carmie and I can only reduce by 4-5 percent with long holds. Now with the infections and antibiotics -- it's a typhoon.

 

 

I feel the same way every day. I had to switch back to dreck generic Prozac on Saturday because I"m not able to drive the four hours RT to get them and it's like: Frankenstein! It sneaks up on us because we think we couldn't get any sicker but, yikes, we can. I'm finding there are degrees of more or less terror and maybe your brain took too much of a hit with the 10 percent. You're on the liquid so you can easily adjust. Maybe one of the mods can weigh in. 

 

Hang on, we're going to make it, hour at the time. 

 

Catherine💜

 

p.s. ~ I'm getting in the car now to get the better generics! 

You don’t deserve it. Keep warrioring

[Purplerain]

On 3/18/2019 at 2:11 PM, India said:

 

 

A note about dyspraxia , which is a neurological condition affecting the cellebrum. There is very little understanding of the condition unlike dyslexia . Subjectively though, the WD has considerably worsened my previous symptoms constituting my dyspraxia. The hypothesis that dyspraxia causes interruption of messages due to immaturity of neurones in brain stem. I wonder if anyone else here has noticed impact on their dyspraxia? 

There are theories that childhood trauma/stress results in higher rates of learning difficulties though possibly also genetic and sometimes as a result of brain damage.

 

 

 

Hi India, just read through your thread and wanted to send some love your way. I’m sorry you’ve been suffering so much. Please continue to update us and let us know you’re ok, we care 💛

 

I really relate to you on a lot of things, particularly the dyspraxia and the type of men you attract into your life. With regards to the dyspraxia, my symptoms have most certainly worsened throughout my taper. I cannot take verbal instructions at all, and I become disoriented and lost frequently. I’m definitely more clumsy and it sometimes takes me a while to ‘process’ what a person is saying to me, which is particularly embarrassing at work when dealing with customers. I work in a bookshop and have recently been relocated; I find I make frequent mistakes with basic things on the tills and lack the cognitive capability to reverse what I’ve done so end up asking my colleagues to help. I’m sure they all think I’m completely dim. I’d had respite from my symptoms for years due to my daily meditation practice but the withdrawal has brought it all back. Its maddening what these drugs do to us. Sending love your way, stay strong you are doing amazingly xx

[Carmie]

Hi India, 

 

Thinking of you and sending hugs🤗

[India]

Hello everyone, 

 

Ive has such a block around writing!

I want to report that I had 2 10 minute windows yesterday and today in which I felt 70% my former self. It was the most emotional overwhelming experience . I think the cognitive blocks will be my nemesis but overall there is much improvement from the original torture. I still get many symptoms and feel depressed but I am starting to see how far I’ve come. This feels like a paradox, as i often feel intense depression. Withdrawal is so complex and like no other experience I’ve ever had. 

Recently overwhelmed with emotion , this seems to be a component of healing the other neurological stuff.  A correlation. 

 

My biggest anxiety is over my cognivity. 

I’m not as ill as I was even if I am still ill.

the windows were like heaven!

 

keep holding on and healing everyone 

[intothewoods]

33 minutes ago, India said:

I want to report that I had 2 10 minute windows yesterday and today in which I felt 70% my former self

 

Fireworks! Excitement! I"m so happy beyond words to hear this India. You are healing. 

 

34 minutes ago, India said:

the windows were like heaven

 

Isn't it something? Now you know what lies ahead. You never have to guess if you'll be better. You have proof. 

 

It's so so good to hear your voice this way.

 

Yes, we'll keep holding and healing. 💜

[India]

I hope so @intothewoods and thank you for the support.  I should celebrate it. 

My phone isn’t functioning very well - the keypad is off- due to dropping it so many times because of my coordination issues.

Neither is my body. Back in a wave which has engulfed me in misery but less misery than some months back.. Subtle changes

To report :

concussed feeling as usual— did not pass today 

working/ semantic memory not working well. Weak encoding for reading 

cfs- seems I have a med induced form of fatigue. Problems with executive functioning stilll- making this site hard to use.. I think the Vision disturbances don’t help- I am slow to focus but better than before .

Coordination issues- swimming and as if my limbs are aliens and so weighted I cannot lift them

Depression/anedonia ( some waves of feeling)No will!!!

Intense anger.. Well, who wouldn’t ..

Waves Of intense emotional pain ( which I am hoping equates to healing)

Intense social isolation. 

Fears about the future 

sleeping a lot - naturally a long sleeper but always sleep a lot when unhappy. Plus, fatigue.. 

Also, pssd! It took me a long time to register this but looking at the pssd topic I have experienced a lot of these symptoms. My libido is practically non-existent. As if I am dead inside.

All this to deal with on top of my previous issues. 

Discharged from psychiatrist so will only be dealing with gp.

Probably a good thing as the psychiatrist didn’t even know citalopram liquid existed ( yes, this is a consultant psychiatrist). 

 

@Carmie @intothewoods @jozeff @withhopeinmyheart

 

How are you all this week? 

 

[India]

 had all of these symptoms

[Clatterbust]

Has anyone tried the approach he did in the video? 

[India]

4 hours ago, koivukovy said:

Has anyone tried the approach he did in the video? 

I think it can’t hurt, right?

My friend has also recommended oxygen therapy, red-light therapy, lions mane ( mushroom) supplement. He used this for his tbi which he sustained during a martial arts competition ( his brain starved of oxygen for 5 minutes in a headlock.)

 

Many of the symptoms described on this site he experienced..

[India]

I’m in a wave and feel so f**king furious at the devestation this has caused me and my life..

and the months and months and months of this..

[Peachy]

On 7/31/2019 at 3:22 PM, India said:

I think it can’t hurt, right?

My friend has also recommended oxygen therapy, red-light therapy, lions mane ( mushroom) supplement. He used this for his tbi which he sustained during a martial arts competition ( his brain starved of oxygen for 5 minutes in a headlock.)

 

Many of the symptoms described on this site he experienced..

I’m curious about trying oxygen therapy as well. What type does your friend use/suggest? The exercise form?

amd what form of red light therapy? I wonder if Lyons main would trigger symptoms. I can’t even handle chocolate right now...

Thanks! 

Xx

 

[Peachy]

On 3/18/2019 at 7:57 AM, India said:

Does anyone know how many members of surviving antidepressants there are? Interested in this in respect to scale of issue. Ian Singleton at BTP says they take 300 cases a year . 

Who is Ian Singleton at BTP?

[India]

On 8/7/2019 at 3:17 AM, Peachy said:

Who is Ian Singleton at BTP?

Bristol tranquilliser project .