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Early-morning waking - managing the morning cortisol spike


Altostrata

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Well, managed to sleep well and deeply last night, but noticed when I awoke my dread/panic was worse than ever before :(  DH says maybe I just can't get off this drug ever...

1998- Began taking 20 mg. of Paxil for homesickness 2001-CT and crash/hospitalized 1 week for anxiety. Tried quitting, changing to other ADs, gave up. 2014 -Weaned @ 10% every 4 weeks. Latest 5-14 11.7 mg., 6-14 10.5 mg., 8-21 9.5 mg., 9-17 7.7 mg.,10-14 6.9 mg., 11-14 6.2 mg., 12-14 5.6 mg., 1-15 5.0 mg. 2-15 4.5 mg. (miscalculated may actually be 3.3), up-dosed to 3.7 3-17-15. Hydroxyzine HCl 25 mg. as needed (antihistamine) for anxiety.

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You can get off it. Its just that the road out leads through hell back out to the surface. I had a bad morning today. Bad anxiety. And woke twice in the night at the usual times with mild pounding.

That' said its still many times better than it was at its worst. But there are no holidays/weekends off or time out for good behaviour. Its unrelenting.

Keep going Alaskamom

Paxil 10mg 21/2 years to June 2012 after a 2 month taper

 

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I have dealt with this for three years with varied intensities.  At a few points it was so mild I just accepted it as a normal part of my morning.  Lately it has been tough.  This morning is so difficult.  I seem to sleep at the moment which I am so grateful for, but when I awake my body gets a burning, crawling sensation all over, mainly in my back and extremities.  I feel like I want to drift off to sleep again, but as I do the sensations get worse and adrenaline starts pumping. I just want to run from it. When I get up I just feel exhausted and sad. The butterflies that I usually get aren't really there which is a relief, but the burning sensations along with the physical anxiety symptoms is making me feel crazy and agitated.  At night I get some relief, but so disheartening to awaken day to another day like this.  I feel for everyone and I am feeling sorry for myself this morning.  I wish I felt the way I feel at night all the time.  Does anyone else get these burning, crawling sensations on their body in the mornings?

1998-2013 Various antidepressants switches and CTs.

Benzo addiction unknowingly trying to cover withdrawals in 2011

January 2012,, 25 mg Zoloft , March 2012, Remeron 7.5 to sleep and 1 mg Clonazepam.

Tapered Clonazepam from April to June 2012 from 1 mg to .25 mg (stuck)

September to October 2012 tapered Remeron 7.5 mg to 5 mg. December upped to .75 mg Clonazepam due to mothers passing of cancer.

February 2013 to December 2013 tapered off 25 mg Zoloft

January 2014 to March 2014 tapered off 5 mg Remeron Doing not to bad, not perfect but okay. Here is where I screw up May 2014 to October 2014 tapered Clonazepam from .75 mg to .25 mg. Rapidly worsening every week. January 2015 updosed Clonazepam to .5 mg. Big Mistake - Holding

Currently .25 mg  Clonazepam 11 pm at night (give or take an hour)  and .25 mg 9 am in the morning (give or take an hour)

Hope this isn't to confusing.

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Annie am so sorry I know how awful it is. Where are you up to in your withdrawal journey ?

I have had the intense burning sensations, all over, just my back and legs. Then latterly just feet. Haven't had the crawling but know others have particularly coming off benzo s called formulation I think . I m still having quite bad anxiety in the mornings. I know what you mean. About the adrenalin, makes you want to jump out of bed and run away from it. Flight. My burning has stopped. I have found sugar is a trigger for my cortisol mornings. If I had a pudding I d get sky high anxiety and the waking in the night heart pounding , acute anxiety in the morning would start and take weeks to start to settle. Am being scrupulous in avoiding triggers and things are starting to settle ( for the moment ). That's the advice I was given by someone else

Paxil 10mg 21/2 years to June 2012 after a 2 month taper

 

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take a lot of  vitamin c for high cortisol .it works 

''I''took paxil for 30 days (did`nt felt  a lot of side effects when ''I'' stopped it)

after two weeks I developed the worst headache I ever felt (some sort of permanent migraine, tinnitus..).

after a month of headaches a decided to take another pill to see.I took a pill because i was thinking that it  was may be withdrawal and it caused me a what my doctor called `some thing like serotonin syndrome`` which never improved and caused me severe muscle problems...

in retrospect I know that it was not a serotonin syndrome , my receptor were very stimulated and reacted in weird ways

 

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take a lot of  vitamin c for high cortisol .it works 

Thanks tanit,   I am too sensitive to even low doses of Vitamin C :(

1998-2013 Various antidepressants switches and CTs.

Benzo addiction unknowingly trying to cover withdrawals in 2011

January 2012,, 25 mg Zoloft , March 2012, Remeron 7.5 to sleep and 1 mg Clonazepam.

Tapered Clonazepam from April to June 2012 from 1 mg to .25 mg (stuck)

September to October 2012 tapered Remeron 7.5 mg to 5 mg. December upped to .75 mg Clonazepam due to mothers passing of cancer.

February 2013 to December 2013 tapered off 25 mg Zoloft

January 2014 to March 2014 tapered off 5 mg Remeron Doing not to bad, not perfect but okay. Here is where I screw up May 2014 to October 2014 tapered Clonazepam from .75 mg to .25 mg. Rapidly worsening every week. January 2015 updosed Clonazepam to .5 mg. Big Mistake - Holding

Currently .25 mg  Clonazepam 11 pm at night (give or take an hour)  and .25 mg 9 am in the morning (give or take an hour)

Hope this isn't to confusing.

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Annie am so sorry I know how awful it is. Where are you up to in your withdrawal journey ?

I have had the intense burning sensations, all over, just my back and legs. Then latterly just feet. Haven't had the crawling but know others have particularly coming off benzo s called formulation I think . I m still having quite bad anxiety in the mornings. I know what you mean. About the adrenalin, makes you want to jump out of bed and run away from it. Flight. My burning has stopped. I have found sugar is a trigger for my cortisol mornings. If I had a pudding I d get sky high anxiety and the waking in the night heart pounding , acute anxiety in the morning would start and take weeks to start to settle. Am being scrupulous in avoiding triggers and things are starting to settle ( for the moment ). That's the advice I was given by someone else

Thanks Cressida, My withdrawal Journey is complicated starting in 2011 with rapid SSRI tapers and switches leading to benzo dependency. I am now off all SSRI's and dealing with benzo destabilation and dependency issues as well. I believe it was this bad back in 2012 but settled somewhat after I reinstated the SSRI's again. I don't have that option any more. I am currently on . 5 mg Clonazepam and it does nothing for me. It feels so forever as everyone understands. Bad day today. Had a window Friday though, hoping that is a good sign. Are you avoiding all sugar even fruit. I did this a few years ago, following a ketogenic/paleo type diet and I believe it brought windows for me. I will try this again with no sugar.
It has been a long time I feel so sorry.

I eat a " normal diet " excluding all sugar, alcohol, fermented things, fruit. I think don't exclude more than you have to because I have problems when I reintroduce. Everyone is different but there is no doubt about the effect of sugar on me. I have an occasional toasted crumpet 1.9g sugar and occasional small pieces of lower sugar fruit like an apple . Its stopped the burning reduced the cortisol effects. Am still waking sometimes with mild pounding for a few seconds , sleeping later, and am still getting anxiety in the mornings but less and it doesn't last as long. Won't hurt you to cut that out and hopefully you ll see the benefits in a few weeks. The crawling thing is typical of benzo WD but at least you know what it is

Paxil 10mg 21/2 years to June 2012 after a 2 month taper

 

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Natural ways to lower cortisol http://www.livestrong.com/article/28618-lower-high-cortisol-levels-naturally/

 

I wonder anyone can help me with this. I don't know if my cortisol is high. I usually don't feel anxious but my symptoms (headache, body tension, burning,pins needles all over and swelling face hands etc) always have a pattern of worst in morning then lessons late afternoon eventually almost gone most evenings. Are they possibly caused by high cortisol? I'm still tapering the micro fashion. I can't figure out if the symptoms are more from drug side effe t ( too much meds) or withdrawal. The symptoms stays with both higher dose and lower dose.

 

Any thoughts are very much appreciated.

Drug free Sep. 23 2017

2009 Mar.: lexapro 10mg for headache for 2 weeks.

2009-2012: on and off 1/4 to 1/3 of 10mg

2012 June--2013 Jan,: 1/4-1/3 of 10mg generic, bad jaw pain

2013 Jan-Mar: 10 mg generic. severe jaw and head pain;

2013 Mar--Aug. started tapering (liquid ever since) from 10 to 5 (one step) then gradually down to 2.25 mg by July. first ever panic attack, severe head/jaw pain

2013 Aug.: back to 2.75 mg; Nov: back to Brand Lex. 2.75mg -- 3mg,

2014 June: stopped PPI, head pressure/numbness. up-dosed 4.5mg, severe reaction mental symptoms added on

2014 Aug--2015 Aug: Micro taper down to 3.2mg, .025mg (<1%) cut holding 2-3 weeks.

2015 Aug 15th, Accidental one dose of 4.2mg. worsening brain non-functional, swollen head, body, coma like, DR

2016 Feb., started dosing 10am through 11 pm everyday 2/13--3.2mg, 3/15-- 2.9mg, 4/19-- 2.6mg, 6/26--2.2mg, 7/22 --1.9mg, 8/16--1.8mg,8/31--1.7m g, 9/13--1.6mg, 9/27--1.5mg, 10/8--1.4mg, 10/14--1.3mg, 11/1--1.2mg, 11/29--1.1mg, 12/12--1mg, 12/22--0.9mg

2017: 1/7--0.8mg, 1/15--0.7mg, 1/17--0.6mg, 1/20--0.52, 1/21--0.4mg, 1/22--0.26, 1/23--0.2, 2/13--0.13mg, 2/20--0.06mg, 3/18--0.13mg, 6/1--0.12mg, 7/6--0.1mg, 7/14--0.08mg, 8/17--0.04mg, 8/20--0.03mg, 8/28--0.02mg, 9/6--0.0205mg, 9/8--0.02mg, 9/17--0.015mg, 9/20--0.01mg, 9/21--0.0048mg, 9/22--0.0001mg,

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Yes that's the patter almost everyone gets. Its the normal pattern for cortisol but in WD is intensified and causes symptoms.

Paxil 10mg 21/2 years to June 2012 after a 2 month taper

 

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Natural ways to lower cortisol http://www.livestrong.com/article/28618-lower-high-cortisol-levels-naturally/

I wonder anyone can help me with this. I don't know if my cortisol is high. I usually don't feel anxious but my symptoms (headache, body tension, burning,pins needles all over and swelling face hands etc) always have a pattern of worst in morning then lessons late afternoon eventually almost gone most evenings. Are they possibly caused by high cortisol? I'm still tapering the micro fashion. I can't figure out if the symptoms are more from drug side effe t ( too much meds) or withdrawal. The symptoms stays with both higher dose and lower dose.

Any thoughts are very much appreciated.

I always feel worse in the morning. There are still mornings when I have suicidal thoughts. Frankly this was the reason I started lexapro...of course it did not help...

I cannot figure out what it is about with me. In evening I am just so different...

- 12.03.2021- doxepin- 50mg

- 6.11.2020- 75mg

- 16.10.2020- 100mg

- 30.09.2020- doxepin- 125mg

- May 2020, omeprazole 40mg switched to esomeprazole 20mg

- 2012 re-started Doxepin 75mg, evening. Increased to 150mg

- 2012, Atenolol 25mg, twice a day

- 2016, Low dose of HRT in evening, Sandrena and Utrogestan 

- Long term of Nasal spray Otrivine

- 2012, PPI Omeprazole 40mg-evening

24.10.2014- Started ESCITALOPRAM-first 5mg and then 10mg; due to the adverse symptoms reduced on 5.01.2015- Escitalopram- 2.5mg 22.07.2016- re-started reduction by 1% at a time. Completed tappering on  19.03.2020 😇

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Question--Especially for those, I suppose, who have had this improve... The last few mornings, the panic/terror has been very slight, if present at all. I have just been waking in the same time frame (2:00-4:00 a.m.) burning hot. Is this just a DIFFERENT symptom of the cortisol, or perhaps actually an improvement?

Zoloft 100 mg. daily for Chronic Fatigue Syndrome since Oct. 1994 / Synthroid 88 mcg. daily / Supplements: Neptune Krill Oil-1,000 mg. twice daily/Astaxanthin 10 mg. twice daily/Ubiquinol 100 mg. twice daily (These 3 have allowed me to discontinue (approved by doctor) bp meds I was on. Calcium Citrate 500 mg. daily/Vitamin D3 2,400 iu daily/K2 (MK7) 100 mcg daily (osteopenia and fam. hist. of severe osteoporosis). Stress B Complex (1/2 dose)/Quercetin (for allergies/asthma)/Magnesium (400 mg. oral glycinate and about 50 mg. magnesium chloride spray oil a day, divided throughout day).

Tapered Zoloft about 6 wks. Totally off since the end of July (25-29, 2014). 3 wks. vertigo at end of taper, then 3-4 wks. OK, followed by withdrawal symptoms increasing in severity (nausea, gastric disturbances, loss of appetite, insomnia, restlessness, jitters, anxiety, agitation--jumping out of my skin--possible akathisia?) Seem to have paradoxical reactions to everything new, even Vitamin C. Severity of akathisia comes and goes, but is constant to some degree. Hard to leave house, and cannot be home alone. (Retired)

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Question--Especially for those, I suppose, who have had this improve... The last few mornings, the panic/terror has been very slight, if present at all. I have just been waking in the same time frame (2:00-4:00 a.m.) burning hot. Is this just a DIFFERENT symptom of the cortisol, or perhaps actually an improvement?

I guess any improvement is an improvement. My burning went first. The palpitations and anxiety have improved and I am sleeping much later. The vivid dreaming is less. As with everything in WD we re all different with different patterns. I preferred the burning to the palps and anxiety its a pity we can't choose our symptoms ! But great news if something is on the wane

Paxil 10mg 21/2 years to June 2012 after a 2 month taper

 

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Cressida--True. I actually have not been having the burning (much), though. I wondered if it was just trading one symptom for another. Like you, though--I think I prefer that to the panic. I guess time will tell!

Zoloft 100 mg. daily for Chronic Fatigue Syndrome since Oct. 1994 / Synthroid 88 mcg. daily / Supplements: Neptune Krill Oil-1,000 mg. twice daily/Astaxanthin 10 mg. twice daily/Ubiquinol 100 mg. twice daily (These 3 have allowed me to discontinue (approved by doctor) bp meds I was on. Calcium Citrate 500 mg. daily/Vitamin D3 2,400 iu daily/K2 (MK7) 100 mcg daily (osteopenia and fam. hist. of severe osteoporosis). Stress B Complex (1/2 dose)/Quercetin (for allergies/asthma)/Magnesium (400 mg. oral glycinate and about 50 mg. magnesium chloride spray oil a day, divided throughout day).

Tapered Zoloft about 6 wks. Totally off since the end of July (25-29, 2014). 3 wks. vertigo at end of taper, then 3-4 wks. OK, followed by withdrawal symptoms increasing in severity (nausea, gastric disturbances, loss of appetite, insomnia, restlessness, jitters, anxiety, agitation--jumping out of my skin--possible akathisia?) Seem to have paradoxical reactions to everything new, even Vitamin C. Severity of akathisia comes and goes, but is constant to some degree. Hard to leave house, and cannot be home alone. (Retired)

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  • Moderator Emeritus

You can get off it. Its just that the road out leads through hell back out to the surface. I had a bad morning today. Bad anxiety. And woke twice in the night at the usual times with mild pounding.

That' said its still many times better than it was at its worst. But there are no holidays/weekends off or time out for good behaviour. Its unrelenting.

Keep going Alaskamom

 

Cressida, I'm probably misunderstanding you, but it sounds a little like you might be espousing the "no pain no gain keep cutting even if you feel terrible" philosophy. That doesn't actually work very well for people.

 

Again, I'm probably misunderstanding you. Please forgive me. I certainly don't think you have anything but the most compassionate and caring intentions for others and I'm so grateful that you're here to give support to Alaskamom and everyone else.

 

I just wanted to take this opportunity to address this for the sake of newcomers who might be reading. (For every person who posts, there are several who only read, and people will be reading this.)

 

This "no pain no gain" thing has become popular on some forums (especially benzos) and they've probably seen it there, and my fear is that they might interpret your words as espousing that approach.

 

It actually doesn't seem to work that way. We have found that as a rule, worsening during a taper and not fully recovering between cuts means that people need to slow down.

Started on Prozac and Xanax in 1992 for PTSD after an assault. One drug led to more, the usual story. Got sicker and sicker, but believed I needed the drugs for my "underlying disease". Long story...lost everything. Life savings, home, physical and mental health, relationships, friendships, ability to work, everything. Amitryptiline, Prozac, bupropion, buspirone, flurazepam, diazepam, alprazolam, Paxil, citalopram, lamotrigine, gabapentin...probably more I've forgotten. 

Started multidrug taper in Feb 2010.  Doing a very slow microtaper, down to low doses now and feeling SO much better, getting my old personality and my brain back! Able to work full time, have a full social life, and cope with stress better than ever. Not perfect, but much better. After 23 lost years. Big Pharma has a lot to answer for. And "medicine for profit" is just not a great idea.

 

Feb 15 2010:  300 mg Neurontin  200 Lamictal   10 Celexa      0.65 Xanax   and 5 mg Ambien 

Feb 10 2014:   62 Lamictal    1.1 Celexa         0.135 Xanax    1.8 Valium

Feb 10 2015:   50 Lamictal      0.875 Celexa    0.11 Xanax      1.5 Valium

Feb 15 2016:   47.5 Lamictal   0.75 Celexa      0.0875 Xanax    1.42 Valium    

2/12/20             12                       0.045               0.007                   1 

May 2021            7                       0.01                  0.0037                1

Feb 2022            6                      0!!!                     0.00167               0.98                2.5 mg Ambien

Oct 2022       4.5 mg Lamictal    (off Celexa, off Xanax)   0.95 Valium    Ambien, 1/4 to 1/2 of a 5 mg tablet 

 

I'm not a doctor. Any advice I give is just my civilian opinion.

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Yes you are misunderstanding. I never give advice on tapering . But I know what is like to feel you can't take it anymore and feel like giving up. I was trying to offer encouragement but I ll leave that too to the experts

 

Thanks, I thought I probably was.

 

Like I said, I really appreciate you giving support and encouragement to people. Your compassion is so clear and I know it's appreciated by everyone more than you probably realize. This is a terrible, harsh journey and we all need each other's help.

Started on Prozac and Xanax in 1992 for PTSD after an assault. One drug led to more, the usual story. Got sicker and sicker, but believed I needed the drugs for my "underlying disease". Long story...lost everything. Life savings, home, physical and mental health, relationships, friendships, ability to work, everything. Amitryptiline, Prozac, bupropion, buspirone, flurazepam, diazepam, alprazolam, Paxil, citalopram, lamotrigine, gabapentin...probably more I've forgotten. 

Started multidrug taper in Feb 2010.  Doing a very slow microtaper, down to low doses now and feeling SO much better, getting my old personality and my brain back! Able to work full time, have a full social life, and cope with stress better than ever. Not perfect, but much better. After 23 lost years. Big Pharma has a lot to answer for. And "medicine for profit" is just not a great idea.

 

Feb 15 2010:  300 mg Neurontin  200 Lamictal   10 Celexa      0.65 Xanax   and 5 mg Ambien 

Feb 10 2014:   62 Lamictal    1.1 Celexa         0.135 Xanax    1.8 Valium

Feb 10 2015:   50 Lamictal      0.875 Celexa    0.11 Xanax      1.5 Valium

Feb 15 2016:   47.5 Lamictal   0.75 Celexa      0.0875 Xanax    1.42 Valium    

2/12/20             12                       0.045               0.007                   1 

May 2021            7                       0.01                  0.0037                1

Feb 2022            6                      0!!!                     0.00167               0.98                2.5 mg Ambien

Oct 2022       4.5 mg Lamictal    (off Celexa, off Xanax)   0.95 Valium    Ambien, 1/4 to 1/2 of a 5 mg tablet 

 

I'm not a doctor. Any advice I give is just my civilian opinion.

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Natural ways to lower cortisol http://www.livestrong.com/article/28618-lower-high-cortisol-levels-naturally/

I wonder anyone can help me with this. I don't know if my cortisol is high. I usually don't feel anxious but my symptoms (headache, body tension, burning,pins needles all over and swelling face hands etc) always have a pattern of worst in morning then lessons late afternoon eventually almost gone most evenings. Are they possibly caused by high cortisol? I'm still tapering the micro fashion. I can't figure out if the symptoms are more from drug side effe t ( too much meds) or withdrawal. The symptoms stays with both higher dose and lower dose.

Any thoughts are very much appreciated.

I always feel worse in the morning. There are still mornings when I have suicidal thoughts. Frankly this was the reason I started lexapro...of course it did not help...

I cannot figure out what it is about with me. In evening I am just so different...

Just adding to this what I said in the morning...

 

It is almost 9pm and I feels as if I am a different person to the morning one.

Every morning (almost) I have something what I call "skanning for problems", which seems to be out of my control...my mind scans through many aspects of my life until it finds something to worry about...and it seems crazy now, as it is usually something not as essential...today morning I worried that..i will have problems with..:my computer, as I restored it yesterday and my word processor and printer did not work properly, but i expected I would have to print something...

I wrote it purposely here as it show how "strange" this morning drama may be...

If I don't find anything more essential to catastrophise about I will find something...

This computer thing led me to feeling suicidal eventually...

 

I don't know if this is just cortisol thing or the way I remember mornings in my family of origins (kind of imprinting), as my mother was always in a bad mood...

 

Every evening I dread to go to bed, as I don't want to see my morning image...

Somebody mentioned some time about rebelling against this and creating an antidote image...maybe this is what I need to do?

It reminds me about some nlp (neurolinguistc programming) strategy. It is called swish...hope it is ok to paste the link to it, as it may be useful...somebody helped me using this strategy with my cigarette adduction (i don't smoke since 1999)

http://www.nlp-now.co.uk/nlp_swish.htm

- 12.03.2021- doxepin- 50mg

- 6.11.2020- 75mg

- 16.10.2020- 100mg

- 30.09.2020- doxepin- 125mg

- May 2020, omeprazole 40mg switched to esomeprazole 20mg

- 2012 re-started Doxepin 75mg, evening. Increased to 150mg

- 2012, Atenolol 25mg, twice a day

- 2016, Low dose of HRT in evening, Sandrena and Utrogestan 

- Long term of Nasal spray Otrivine

- 2012, PPI Omeprazole 40mg-evening

24.10.2014- Started ESCITALOPRAM-first 5mg and then 10mg; due to the adverse symptoms reduced on 5.01.2015- Escitalopram- 2.5mg 22.07.2016- re-started reduction by 1% at a time. Completed tappering on  19.03.2020 😇

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I've read about the benefits of theanine in black tea for cortisol reduction. I already drink one cup a day in the afternoon. I'm wary of drinking more because of the caffeine, but perhaps I will experiment with a cup of tea in the morning, instead of a cup of decaf coffee.

 

If drinking black tea for theanine, you may want to consider drinking guayusa instead, which has a very high theanine content.   Guayusa is a species of holly that is found in the Ecuadorian rainforest.  You make a tea out of it.  It tastes like Camellia sinesis, (black tea), but is naturally sweet and smooth.

 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ilex_guayusa

 

I buy it by the pound on Amazon.com, and brew 4tb to 18 cups of water for 30 minutes.   Out of several distributors I ordered from, Runa is the brand I found the freshest: http://www.amazon.com/Runa-Amazon-Guayusa-Traditional-Tea/dp/B004FSASKU/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1420357729&sr=8-1&keywords=runa+pound

 

Unlike black tea, guayusa is not bitter and contain tannins that can cause staining and stomach upset.  Also it is best to avoid black/green tea, as it is very effective at pulling fluoride from the ground into the leaves.  Fluoride is very toxic, causes a wide variety of health detriments, and should avoided when possible.

 

http://articles.mercola.com/sites/articles/archive/2005/02/09/fluoride-tea.aspx

 

I wouldn't worry about feeling too caffeinated from drinking tea or guayusa(which contains caffeine), as the high theanine content blunts the jittery effects of the caffeine.

 

", guayusa is not bitter and contain tannins that can cause staining and stomach upset"

 

Is this what you meant to say?  Not a good selling point :) 

if tannin is what is in wine I think it is a trigger for migraines.  

 

Just curious. 

WARNING THIS WILL BE LONG
Had a car accident in 85
Codeine was the pain med when I was release from hosp continuous use till 89
Given PROZAC by a specialist to help with nerve pain in my leg 89-90 not sure which year
Was not told a thing about it being a psych med thought it was a pain killer no info about psych side effects I went nuts had hallucinations. As I had a head injury and was diagnosed with a concussion in 85 I was sent to a head injury clinic in 1990 five years after the accident. I don't think they knew I had been on prozac I did not think it a big deal and never did finish the bottle of pills. I had tests of course lots of them. Was put into a pain clinic and given amitriptyline which stopped the withdrawal but had many side effects. But I could sleep something I had not done in a very long time the pain lessened. My mother got cancer in 94 they switched my meds to Zoloft to help deal with this pressure as I was her main care giver she died in 96. I stopped zoloft in 96 had withdrawal was put on paxil went nutty quit it ct put on resperidol quit it ct had withdrawal was put on Effexor... 2years later celexa was added 20mg then increased to 40mg huge personality change went wild. Did too fast taper off Celexa 05 as I felt unwell for a long time prior... quit Effexor 150mg ct 07 found ****** 8 months into withdrawal learned some things was banned from there in 08 have kept learning since. there is really not enough room here to put my history but I have a lot of opinions about a lot of things especially any of the drugs mentioned above.
One thing I would like to add here is this tidbit ALL OPIATES INCREASE SEROTONIN it is not a huge jump to being in chronic pain to being put on an ssri/snri and opiates will affect your antidepressants and your thinking.

As I do not update much I will put my quit date Nov. 17 2007 I quit Effexor cold turkey. 

http://survivingantidepressants.org/index.php?/topic/1096-introducing-myself-btdt/

There is a crack in everything ..That's how the light gets in :)

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The Guayusa sounds like that drink they love in Argentina...what is it called? Anyway it is also from a plant in the Holly genus. Yerba maté! It contains either caffeine or a similar chemical, and it seems scientists still argue about it. I drank it for while a few years ago and recall that it gives an uplift like coffee but without the slight uneasiness coffee can give. I wouldn't try it if you are sensitive to caffeine, that's for sure.

2009: Cancer hospital said I had adjustment disorder because I thought they were doing it wrong. Their headshrinker prescribed Effexor, and my life set on a new course. I didn't know what was ahead, like a passenger on Disneyland's Matterhorn, smiling and waving as it climbs...clink, clink, clink.

2010: Post surgical accidental Effexor discontinuation by nurses, masked by intravenous Dilaudid. (The car is balanced at the top of the track.) I get home, pop a Vicodin, and ...

Whooosh...down, down, down, down, down...goes the trajectory of my life, up goes my mood and tendency to think everything is a good idea.
2012: After the bipolar jig was up, now a walking bag of unrelated symptoms, I went crazy on Daytrana (the Ritalin skin patch by Noven), because ADHD was a perfect fit for a bag of unrelated symptoms. I was prescribed Effexor for the nervousness of it, and things got neurological. An EEG showed enough activity to warrant an epilepsy diagnosis rather than non-epileptic ("psychogenic") seizures.

:o 2013-2014: Quit everything and got worse. I probably went through DAWS: dopamine agonist withdrawal syndrome. I drank to not feel, but I felt a lot: dread, fear, regret, grief: an utter sense of total loss of everything worth breathing about, for almost two years.

I was not suicidal but I wanted to be dead, at least dead to the experience of my own brain and body.

2015: I  began to recover after adding virgin coconut oil and organic grass-fed fed butter to a cup of instant coffee in the morning.

I did it hoping for mental acuity and better memory. After ten days of that, I was much better, mood-wise. Approximately neutral.

And, I experienced drowsiness. I could sleep. Not exactly happy, I did 30 days on Wellbutrin, because it had done me no harm in the past. 

I don't have the DAWS mood or state of mind. It never feel like doing anything if it means standing up.

In fact, I don't especially like moving. I'm a brain with a beanbag body.   :unsure:

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Just to share, apparently good for high cortisol:

 

Recipe: Pico de Gallo

 

Pico de Gallo of Mexican origin, can be defined as being a relish, salad or even sauce. It's great with grilled meats and egg dishes.

 

Ingredients:

6 roma or plum tomatoes, diced

1 small red onion, finely chopped

4 TB cilantro

1 small jalapeño pepper, seeded and minced

1 lime, juiced

1 garlic clove, finely minced

pinch of ground cumin

pinch of dried oregano to taste

sea salt and ground black pepper to taste

 

Chris Kresser, https://chriskresser.com/high-cortisol-and-brain-fog

- 12.03.2021- doxepin- 50mg

- 6.11.2020- 75mg

- 16.10.2020- 100mg

- 30.09.2020- doxepin- 125mg

- May 2020, omeprazole 40mg switched to esomeprazole 20mg

- 2012 re-started Doxepin 75mg, evening. Increased to 150mg

- 2012, Atenolol 25mg, twice a day

- 2016, Low dose of HRT in evening, Sandrena and Utrogestan 

- Long term of Nasal spray Otrivine

- 2012, PPI Omeprazole 40mg-evening

24.10.2014- Started ESCITALOPRAM-first 5mg and then 10mg; due to the adverse symptoms reduced on 5.01.2015- Escitalopram- 2.5mg 22.07.2016- re-started reduction by 1% at a time. Completed tappering on  19.03.2020 😇

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  • 2 weeks later...
  • Moderator Emeritus

Late response:  I've been waking up to anxiety for the last two weeks or so.  I started to tell myself 'of course you are anxious, things are tough right now, you don't know how the day will be - so this is a very appropriate, logical response.  And then as I settled into accepting the anxiety, it quickly turned into sadness.  Sadness at the grief in my life, the difficulty of getting life to work.  So then I work at accepting the sadness 'today I will let myself be sad.'  

 

I find it much easier this time round with acceptance, than all my other big depressions/anxieties over the years when I panicked and fought.

2010  Fluoxetine 20mg.  2011  Escitalopram 20mg.  2013 Tapered badly and destabilised CNS.  Effexor 150mg. 

2015 Begin using info at SurvivingAntidepressants.  Cut 10% - bad w/d 2 months, held 1 month. 

Micro-tapering: four weekly 0.4% cuts, hold 4 weeks (struggling with symptoms).

8 month hold.

2017 Micro-tapering: four weekly 1% cuts, hold 4 weeks (symptoms almost non-existent).

2020 Still micro-tapering. Just over 2/3 of the way off effexor. Minimal symptoms, - and sleeping well.
Supplements: Fish oil, vitamin C, iron, oat-straw tea, nettle tea.

2023 Now on 7 micro-beads of Effexor. Minimal symptoms but much more time needed between drops.

 'The possibility of renewal exists so long as life exists.'  Dr Gabor Mate.

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Sometimes, high morning cortisol seems to make my normal or pleasant dreams turn into nightmares around 4am and then I wake up in a panic (from the nightmare).  Has anyone else noticed this?

I'm not a doctor.  My comments are not medical advise. These are my opinions based on my own experience and what I've learned. Please discuss your situation with a medical practitioner who has knowledge of tapering and withdrawal...if you are lucky enough to find one.

My Introduction Thread

Full Drug and Withdrawal History

Brief Summary

Several SSRIs for 13 years starting 1997 (for mild to moderate partly situational anxiety) Xanax PRN ~ Various other drugs over the years for side effects

2 month 'taper' off Lexapro 2010

Short acute withdrawal, followed by 2 -3 months of improvement then delayed protracted withdrawal

DX ADHD followed by several years of stimulants and other drugs trying to manage increasing symptoms

Failed reinstatement of Lexapro and trial of Prozac (became suicidal)

May 2013 Found SA, learned about withdrawal, stopped taking drugs...healing begins.

Protracted withdrawal, with a very sensitized nervous system, slowly recovering as time passes

Supplements which have helped: Vitamin C, Magnesium, Taurine

Bad reactions: Many supplements but mostly fish oil and Vitamin D

June 2016 - Started daily juicing, mostly vegetables and lots of greens.

Aug 2016 - Oct 2016 Best window ever, felt almost completely recovered

Oct 2016 -Symptoms returned - bad days and less bad days.

April 2018 - No windows, but significant improvement, it feels like permanent full recovery is close.

VIDEO: Where did the chemical imbalance theory come from?



VIDEO: How are psychiatric diagnoses made?



VIDEO: Why do psychiatric drugs have withdrawal syndromes?



VIDEO: Can psychiatric drugs cause long-lasting negative effects?

VIDEO: Dr. Claire Weekes

 

 

 

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Yes.a lot of 'chasing' dreams around that time..

2000 - sertraline for job anxiety low confidence (17 years old) ..which turned the next 16 years into nightmare!

 

On/off sertraline severe withdrawals every time. 2014 - felt better as reduced dose of sertraline no more inner restlessness. Doctor rushed off again. Hit severe withdrawal. Lost the little I had in life. Couldn't get stable again on 12.5mg. Was switched to prozac. Had severe reaction to prozac..came off in November 2015 at 6mg as felt more confused and damaged on it..Even more withdrawal ..rage, depression, dyphoria, near constant suicidal ideation, self harm impulses, doom, concrete block in head, unable to do much of anything with this feeling in head..went back on 6mg of sertraline to see if would alleviate anything. It didn't..reduced from December to June 2016 came off at 2.5mg sertraline as was hospitalised for the severe rage, suicidal impulses, and put on 50mg lofepramine which in 2nd week reduced all symptoms but gave insomnia which still have..psych stopped lofepramine cold turkey..no increased withdrawal symptoms new symptoms from lofepramine except persistant insomnia which has as side effect.

 

Taking Ativan for 8 months for the severe rage self harm impulses 1-3 times a week (mostly 2 times a week) at .5mg. Two months (I'm unsure exactly when the interdose started to happen) ago interdose withdrawal seemed to happen..2 days I think after the Ativan.

 

 

Nightmare that could have been avoided!

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I seem to be having some success by not eating after 8 pm at the latest and especially not carbohydrate.

Paxil 10mg 21/2 years to June 2012 after a 2 month taper

 

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Sometimes, high morning cortisol seems to make my normal or pleasant dreams turn into nightmares around 4am and then I wake up in a panic (from the nightmare).  Has anyone else noticed this?

I did not think I had slept last night, but I think there was an 1/2 hour to an hour of the sleep that is so light that you are aware of your surroundings, but yet dreaming.  I sat up in bed and literally seen a forest that was clear-cut over by my closet, but it was so dream like.  lol It only lasted a 1/2 second though it was so weird.  This was just at 4 am.  But I too start dreaming some intense dreams around this time, but only when I am in waves and the cortisol is high.

1998-2013 Various antidepressants switches and CTs.

Benzo addiction unknowingly trying to cover withdrawals in 2011

January 2012,, 25 mg Zoloft , March 2012, Remeron 7.5 to sleep and 1 mg Clonazepam.

Tapered Clonazepam from April to June 2012 from 1 mg to .25 mg (stuck)

September to October 2012 tapered Remeron 7.5 mg to 5 mg. December upped to .75 mg Clonazepam due to mothers passing of cancer.

February 2013 to December 2013 tapered off 25 mg Zoloft

January 2014 to March 2014 tapered off 5 mg Remeron Doing not to bad, not perfect but okay. Here is where I screw up May 2014 to October 2014 tapered Clonazepam from .75 mg to .25 mg. Rapidly worsening every week. January 2015 updosed Clonazepam to .5 mg. Big Mistake - Holding

Currently .25 mg  Clonazepam 11 pm at night (give or take an hour)  and .25 mg 9 am in the morning (give or take an hour)

Hope this isn't to confusing.

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Late response:  I've been waking up to anxiety for the last two weeks or so.  I started to tell myself 'of course you are anxious, things are tough right now, you don't know how the day will be - so this is a very appropriate, logical response.  And then as I settled into accepting the anxiety, it quickly turned into sadness.  Sadness at the grief in my life, the difficulty of getting life to work.  So then I work at accepting the sadness 'today I will let myself be sad.'  

 

I find it much easier this time round with acceptance, than all my other big depressions/anxieties over the years when I panicked and fought.

I need to work on this acceptance thing as I feel that I am grieving daily over lost time. 

1998-2013 Various antidepressants switches and CTs.

Benzo addiction unknowingly trying to cover withdrawals in 2011

January 2012,, 25 mg Zoloft , March 2012, Remeron 7.5 to sleep and 1 mg Clonazepam.

Tapered Clonazepam from April to June 2012 from 1 mg to .25 mg (stuck)

September to October 2012 tapered Remeron 7.5 mg to 5 mg. December upped to .75 mg Clonazepam due to mothers passing of cancer.

February 2013 to December 2013 tapered off 25 mg Zoloft

January 2014 to March 2014 tapered off 5 mg Remeron Doing not to bad, not perfect but okay. Here is where I screw up May 2014 to October 2014 tapered Clonazepam from .75 mg to .25 mg. Rapidly worsening every week. January 2015 updosed Clonazepam to .5 mg. Big Mistake - Holding

Currently .25 mg  Clonazepam 11 pm at night (give or take an hour)  and .25 mg 9 am in the morning (give or take an hour)

Hope this isn't to confusing.

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Me too, Annie.

 

Maybe "battling" and treating depression is the wrong idea. Maybe you just find the help you need to get through it, and should treat it like it is temporary. Frankly, a housekeeper (and nanny?) would do me a lot more good than a therapist, and be cheaper for my health insurance company.

 

Lots of us here are in a state of near-panic, worrying that this will never end, which of course makes it worse.

2009: Cancer hospital said I had adjustment disorder because I thought they were doing it wrong. Their headshrinker prescribed Effexor, and my life set on a new course. I didn't know what was ahead, like a passenger on Disneyland's Matterhorn, smiling and waving as it climbs...clink, clink, clink.

2010: Post surgical accidental Effexor discontinuation by nurses, masked by intravenous Dilaudid. (The car is balanced at the top of the track.) I get home, pop a Vicodin, and ...

Whooosh...down, down, down, down, down...goes the trajectory of my life, up goes my mood and tendency to think everything is a good idea.
2012: After the bipolar jig was up, now a walking bag of unrelated symptoms, I went crazy on Daytrana (the Ritalin skin patch by Noven), because ADHD was a perfect fit for a bag of unrelated symptoms. I was prescribed Effexor for the nervousness of it, and things got neurological. An EEG showed enough activity to warrant an epilepsy diagnosis rather than non-epileptic ("psychogenic") seizures.

:o 2013-2014: Quit everything and got worse. I probably went through DAWS: dopamine agonist withdrawal syndrome. I drank to not feel, but I felt a lot: dread, fear, regret, grief: an utter sense of total loss of everything worth breathing about, for almost two years.

I was not suicidal but I wanted to be dead, at least dead to the experience of my own brain and body.

2015: I  began to recover after adding virgin coconut oil and organic grass-fed fed butter to a cup of instant coffee in the morning.

I did it hoping for mental acuity and better memory. After ten days of that, I was much better, mood-wise. Approximately neutral.

And, I experienced drowsiness. I could sleep. Not exactly happy, I did 30 days on Wellbutrin, because it had done me no harm in the past. 

I don't have the DAWS mood or state of mind. It never feel like doing anything if it means standing up.

In fact, I don't especially like moving. I'm a brain with a beanbag body.   :unsure:

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I have the chasing dreams all night. Every two to three hours. Heart is racing, intestines are rolling, body temp is up. But I have a pretty good theory on why it won't abate. Imagine you're walking through your entire day and every time you pass a door, you know there could be person behind it ready to jump out and scare you. You have no idea WHICH door this person will pop out of, but you know it will happen. So all day, you brace yourself for this scare. Sometimes it happens, but sometimes it doesn't. It's completely unpredictable. But it's coming. So the end of for day comes, and you get into bed…where you are supposed to relax and go to sleep. Now ask yourself this: Just where exactly do you think all that adrenaline you've been banking all day goes? What happens to it? Does it just disappear? No. It rips through your body all night long trying to find a way out. Hence the dreams, the anxiety and the panic. It's worse in the morning because you haven't slept and you're blown out - but also because you know that person is still somewhere out there behind door number 1… or 2… or 12. And the **** starts all over again. When we were all comfortably on our ADs (or whatever we were taking for relief), the boogeyman was on vacation in Aruba. Well he's back. And it looks like he's staying for a while because our bodies no longer know how to manage fight or flight responses. Basically, we are all victims of PTSD.

Short term low dose Klonopin use back in 2004
Acute, protracted withdrawal after discontinuing
Began Lexapro in 2005 to ease Benzo withdrawal
Took 2 years to stabilize
Rapid taper from Lexapro in July/August 2012
Return of anxiety, insomnia and cardiac issues
Failed reinstatement early August 2012
Acute withdrawal for 9 months; intermittent symptoms for another 6

Relief on February 9, 2014 after addition of Taurine

Almost complete remission of symptoms w/addition of 12.5mg Atenolol daily

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I think the PTSD idea is not too far off the mark. Losing control of your own behavior is a shattering experience. Having your own body torment you is not a lot different than having someone else do it.

2009: Cancer hospital said I had adjustment disorder because I thought they were doing it wrong. Their headshrinker prescribed Effexor, and my life set on a new course. I didn't know what was ahead, like a passenger on Disneyland's Matterhorn, smiling and waving as it climbs...clink, clink, clink.

2010: Post surgical accidental Effexor discontinuation by nurses, masked by intravenous Dilaudid. (The car is balanced at the top of the track.) I get home, pop a Vicodin, and ...

Whooosh...down, down, down, down, down...goes the trajectory of my life, up goes my mood and tendency to think everything is a good idea.
2012: After the bipolar jig was up, now a walking bag of unrelated symptoms, I went crazy on Daytrana (the Ritalin skin patch by Noven), because ADHD was a perfect fit for a bag of unrelated symptoms. I was prescribed Effexor for the nervousness of it, and things got neurological. An EEG showed enough activity to warrant an epilepsy diagnosis rather than non-epileptic ("psychogenic") seizures.

:o 2013-2014: Quit everything and got worse. I probably went through DAWS: dopamine agonist withdrawal syndrome. I drank to not feel, but I felt a lot: dread, fear, regret, grief: an utter sense of total loss of everything worth breathing about, for almost two years.

I was not suicidal but I wanted to be dead, at least dead to the experience of my own brain and body.

2015: I  began to recover after adding virgin coconut oil and organic grass-fed fed butter to a cup of instant coffee in the morning.

I did it hoping for mental acuity and better memory. After ten days of that, I was much better, mood-wise. Approximately neutral.

And, I experienced drowsiness. I could sleep. Not exactly happy, I did 30 days on Wellbutrin, because it had done me no harm in the past. 

I don't have the DAWS mood or state of mind. It never feel like doing anything if it means standing up.

In fact, I don't especially like moving. I'm a brain with a beanbag body.   :unsure:

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  • Moderator Emeritus

everyone, hey.

one thing has helped me with the "cortisol mornings" for a long while and i wanted to mention it. i actually began implementing this in late 2012 when a period of acute benzo withdrawal-induced insomnia was starting to loosen its grip on me.

during my periods of insomnia, i found that on mornings when i was awake at the time the old cortisol began its uptick (for me, around 4am), i suffered a lot less under it than the mornings i actually was asleep and the cortisol woke me up and i woke into it. i found that the mix of the abrupt wake-up and the cortisol activation was terrifying. so i tried a little experiment in the way of setting my alarm clock for 3:45 a.m. and i have held this with few exceptions for the better part of the last two years.

i was never a huge fan of pre-dawn go-times. i wasn't all that big on sleeping-in either. an average wake-up time i suppose. 6am on weekdays, 7 to 8am at week's end. so that was a shift for me. but the insomnia i was experiencing had made me an anything-goes kind of human in the sleep dept. i was up for experimentation.

in my experience, waking before cortisol does its thing lessons the severity of it for me - immensely. magnesium has always helped too, but the early wake-up has been my key. i look at it as short-circuiting the mechanism. i wearily get up, stretch, get a hot beverage, put my ipod on to put something soothing and/or positive into my head, and the cortisol comes and goes with a lot less hoopla than when i am asleep for its arrival. that's not to say that there are no difficult mornings. but i see a radical change being awake for the release.

i would suggest that it is worth a try. it is a remedy based solely on conditions of living - that is to say, you don't need to ingest anything to make this work. if anyone has luck (or not) with this, i'd love to hear about it.

hang in there.

dave

1996 - .5mg Ativan as needed, 7.5mg Remeron daily2008 - .5mg Xanax, Ativan discontinued, Remeron continued2012 - .5mg Xanax, .25mg Ativan 3x daily, Remeron continued2/2012 - Jumped from Remeron, continued .5mg Xanax .25mg Ativan 3x daily4/2012 - Began rapid taper of .5mg Xanax .25mg Ativan 3x daily6/2012 - Jumped from Xanax and Ativan, voluntary hospitalization followed7/2012 - 2nd voluntary hospitalization, reinstated Remeron, bumped to 30mg, also given risperidone.8/2012 - discontinued risperidone, tried gabapentin, dicontinued gabapentin, Remeron 30mg continued10/2012 to current - tapered Remeron 10% every 4 to 6 weeks (sometimes more time) using liquid compound12/2014 - 2mg Remeron 1/16/2015 - 1.9mg Remeron 8/1/2015 -1.6mg Remeron - 03/1/2016 - 1.5mg Remeron - 1/2/2017 1.3mg - 5/7/2017 1.2mg - 5/13/2017 - syringe size change - 6/8/2017 - 1.1mg - 7/10/2017 - 1mg - 9/1/2017 - 0.9mg - 10/22/2017 - 0.8mg - 11/22/2017 - 0.7mg - 2/2/2018 - 0.6mg - 3/13/2018 - new compound pharmacy - 5/20/2018 - 0.5mg - 8/31/2018 - 0.4mg - 11/16/2018 - 0.3mg - 12/24/2018 - 0.2mg - 4/1/2019 - 0.1mg - 5/1/2019 - .05mg - 0mg achieved 2019-06-15. 🤞

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I love being awake at around that time..feel great..but then I end up totally wiped by 9am!

2000 - sertraline for job anxiety low confidence (17 years old) ..which turned the next 16 years into nightmare!

 

On/off sertraline severe withdrawals every time. 2014 - felt better as reduced dose of sertraline no more inner restlessness. Doctor rushed off again. Hit severe withdrawal. Lost the little I had in life. Couldn't get stable again on 12.5mg. Was switched to prozac. Had severe reaction to prozac..came off in November 2015 at 6mg as felt more confused and damaged on it..Even more withdrawal ..rage, depression, dyphoria, near constant suicidal ideation, self harm impulses, doom, concrete block in head, unable to do much of anything with this feeling in head..went back on 6mg of sertraline to see if would alleviate anything. It didn't..reduced from December to June 2016 came off at 2.5mg sertraline as was hospitalised for the severe rage, suicidal impulses, and put on 50mg lofepramine which in 2nd week reduced all symptoms but gave insomnia which still have..psych stopped lofepramine cold turkey..no increased withdrawal symptoms new symptoms from lofepramine except persistant insomnia which has as side effect.

 

Taking Ativan for 8 months for the severe rage self harm impulses 1-3 times a week (mostly 2 times a week) at .5mg. Two months (I'm unsure exactly when the interdose started to happen) ago interdose withdrawal seemed to happen..2 days I think after the Ativan.

 

 

Nightmare that could have been avoided!

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But yeah being shattered at 9am would sure beat the cortisol wake up.

2000 - sertraline for job anxiety low confidence (17 years old) ..which turned the next 16 years into nightmare!

 

On/off sertraline severe withdrawals every time. 2014 - felt better as reduced dose of sertraline no more inner restlessness. Doctor rushed off again. Hit severe withdrawal. Lost the little I had in life. Couldn't get stable again on 12.5mg. Was switched to prozac. Had severe reaction to prozac..came off in November 2015 at 6mg as felt more confused and damaged on it..Even more withdrawal ..rage, depression, dyphoria, near constant suicidal ideation, self harm impulses, doom, concrete block in head, unable to do much of anything with this feeling in head..went back on 6mg of sertraline to see if would alleviate anything. It didn't..reduced from December to June 2016 came off at 2.5mg sertraline as was hospitalised for the severe rage, suicidal impulses, and put on 50mg lofepramine which in 2nd week reduced all symptoms but gave insomnia which still have..psych stopped lofepramine cold turkey..no increased withdrawal symptoms new symptoms from lofepramine except persistant insomnia which has as side effect.

 

Taking Ativan for 8 months for the severe rage self harm impulses 1-3 times a week (mostly 2 times a week) at .5mg. Two months (I'm unsure exactly when the interdose started to happen) ago interdose withdrawal seemed to happen..2 days I think after the Ativan.

 

 

Nightmare that could have been avoided!

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L&L, absolutely!

i found that dragging my bum around mid-morning was far superior to the hobbling wobble that would keep on wobbling when i allowed the cortisol to bring me into the day. it really is an experiment i can't recommend enough. it totally changed the cortisucks experience for me.

want to give it a try? :D ha ha!

hang in there.

dave

1996 - .5mg Ativan as needed, 7.5mg Remeron daily2008 - .5mg Xanax, Ativan discontinued, Remeron continued2012 - .5mg Xanax, .25mg Ativan 3x daily, Remeron continued2/2012 - Jumped from Remeron, continued .5mg Xanax .25mg Ativan 3x daily4/2012 - Began rapid taper of .5mg Xanax .25mg Ativan 3x daily6/2012 - Jumped from Xanax and Ativan, voluntary hospitalization followed7/2012 - 2nd voluntary hospitalization, reinstated Remeron, bumped to 30mg, also given risperidone.8/2012 - discontinued risperidone, tried gabapentin, dicontinued gabapentin, Remeron 30mg continued10/2012 to current - tapered Remeron 10% every 4 to 6 weeks (sometimes more time) using liquid compound12/2014 - 2mg Remeron 1/16/2015 - 1.9mg Remeron 8/1/2015 -1.6mg Remeron - 03/1/2016 - 1.5mg Remeron - 1/2/2017 1.3mg - 5/7/2017 1.2mg - 5/13/2017 - syringe size change - 6/8/2017 - 1.1mg - 7/10/2017 - 1mg - 9/1/2017 - 0.9mg - 10/22/2017 - 0.8mg - 11/22/2017 - 0.7mg - 2/2/2018 - 0.6mg - 3/13/2018 - new compound pharmacy - 5/20/2018 - 0.5mg - 8/31/2018 - 0.4mg - 11/16/2018 - 0.3mg - 12/24/2018 - 0.2mg - 4/1/2019 - 0.1mg - 5/1/2019 - .05mg - 0mg achieved 2019-06-15. 🤞

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I don't wake up ahead, but I get up early when the restlessness starts, 3:30 to 5...I don't have dread or panic at this point. That inner tension will morph into regular energy if I get going, but just gets worse if I stay in bed. In the rare times I am free I can usually go back to bed peacefully, sometimes to sleep but mostly to rest, after being up about 1.5 hrs. In a small way I like it because naturally I have a hard time getting up in the mornings.

1st round Prozac 1989/90, clear depression symptoms. 2nd round Prozac started 1999 when admitted to dr. I was tired. Prozac pooped out, switch to Cymbalta 3/2006. Diagnosed with bipolar disorder due to mania 6/2006--then I was taken abruptly off Cymbalta and didn't know I had SSRI withdrawal. Lots of meds for my intractable "bipolar" symptoms.

Zyprexa started about 9/06, mostly 5mg. Tapered 4/12 through12/29/12

Wellbutrin. XL 300 mg started 1/07, tapered 1/18/13 through 7/8/13

Oxazepam mostly continuously since 6/06, 30mg since 12/12, tapered 1.17.14 through 8.26.15

11/06 Lithium 600mg twice daily, 2.2.14 400mg TID DIY liquid, 2.12.14 1150mg, 3.2.14 1100mg, 3.18.14 1075mg, 4/14 updose to 1100mg, 6.1.14 900 mg capsules 7.8.14 810mg, 8.17.14 725mg, 8.24.24 700mg...10.22.14 487.5mg, 3.9.15 475mg, 4.1.15 462.5mg 4.21.15 450mg 8.11.15 375mg, 11.28.15 362.5mg, back to 375mg four days later, 3.4.16 updose to 475 (too much going on to risk trouble)

9/4/13 Toprol-XL 25mg daily for sudden hypertension, tapered 11.12.13 through 5.3.14, last 10 days or so switched to atenolol

7.4.14 Started Walsh Protocol

56 years old

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westcoast, hello!

that's the beauty of it. the opposite side of the coin is also quite nice - that is, i'm not much fun on a friday nights as i start getting reallllly tired around 8pm. and once the little dribble of mirtazapine goes into me, i am gone to the world by about 9pm. this doesn't apply to when i am particularly symptom-addled. i tend to rack out later when symptoms are keeping me charged, maybe 10 or 11pm during those periods. but i still make myself GO at 3:45am, so i am really dragging tail then - but almost too tired to feel activated.

so it works for me by short-circuiting the cortisol before it can jolt me awake, and it puts me on a better sleep-hygiene path of racking out earlier and more consistently. i don't know if i will ever let it go, even after cortisol mornings have abated. they've certartainly lost a ton of their power over me as i have healed. so happy the terror stopped for you, too!

and Meimeiquest, you're sort of doing it without intention - which is cool. you hit the floor at onset. i like that you can go back to sleep peacefully on occasion. peace is way good! :)

hang in there,

dave

1996 - .5mg Ativan as needed, 7.5mg Remeron daily2008 - .5mg Xanax, Ativan discontinued, Remeron continued2012 - .5mg Xanax, .25mg Ativan 3x daily, Remeron continued2/2012 - Jumped from Remeron, continued .5mg Xanax .25mg Ativan 3x daily4/2012 - Began rapid taper of .5mg Xanax .25mg Ativan 3x daily6/2012 - Jumped from Xanax and Ativan, voluntary hospitalization followed7/2012 - 2nd voluntary hospitalization, reinstated Remeron, bumped to 30mg, also given risperidone.8/2012 - discontinued risperidone, tried gabapentin, dicontinued gabapentin, Remeron 30mg continued10/2012 to current - tapered Remeron 10% every 4 to 6 weeks (sometimes more time) using liquid compound12/2014 - 2mg Remeron 1/16/2015 - 1.9mg Remeron 8/1/2015 -1.6mg Remeron - 03/1/2016 - 1.5mg Remeron - 1/2/2017 1.3mg - 5/7/2017 1.2mg - 5/13/2017 - syringe size change - 6/8/2017 - 1.1mg - 7/10/2017 - 1mg - 9/1/2017 - 0.9mg - 10/22/2017 - 0.8mg - 11/22/2017 - 0.7mg - 2/2/2018 - 0.6mg - 3/13/2018 - new compound pharmacy - 5/20/2018 - 0.5mg - 8/31/2018 - 0.4mg - 11/16/2018 - 0.3mg - 12/24/2018 - 0.2mg - 4/1/2019 - 0.1mg - 5/1/2019 - .05mg - 0mg achieved 2019-06-15. 🤞

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 I also fall asleep around 9pm. In fact I've given up going out at night because of this.

 I wake around 4 am every morning  also with anxiety and dread which disolves later.

I remembered reading here it might be connected to Cortisol levels. Still feel unsure

of how or why this works. Wonder if this will be affected by the time change March 8th.

On 20 mg of Prozac for about ten years. Sept 2012 started reducing 10% a drop using gram scale, with average of one month holds.

When I'd reached the half way mark, taking 10 mg  powder out of the 20 mg capsules, I switched over to 10 mg capsules and cutting

down from those. Withdrawals got harder the lower I dropped.  May 2013 changed to 5% drops, holding until all withdrawal symptoms gone.

January 2015 changed to liquid prozac (concentration of 20MG per 5 mL) using a 1mL oral syringe.

Current dose of fluoxetine solution equivalent 3.4 mg. Any effort to drop below this has been disastrous so for the time being I'm staying at this level.
Adding 200 mg Tryptophan and 200 GABA a day has helped with anxiety.
Also take 1,300mg Omega- 3,  875mg  Magnesium, 1800mg Curcumin, 1000mg Vit C, 5000 Vit D.
 

 

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