Early-morning waking - managing the morning cortisol spike

[Hibari]

5 minutes ago, lalala said:

Hi H, I'm sorry you are going through this, Because of the  cortisol rushes I was having  in the morning I started taking klonopin  at night as needed and it was happening quite often every morning... I mistaked then to be panic attacks ... and ended up taking it for a month and then more time unfortunately... it really did suck but , if I would of known covering my eyes would have helped  i've be in a different position

Thanks lalala.  I wish there was a way to lessen them.  It makes it hard for me to go out when my anxiety is so high from either withdrawal or cortisol.  

 

I feel sad about it all today. 

[lalala]

1 minute ago, Hibari said:

Thanks lalala.  I wish there was a way to lessen them.  It makes it hard for me to go out when my anxiety is so high from either withdrawal or cortisol.  

 

I feel sad about it all today. 

I remember it was exhaustion and traumatizing, but going thorough another wd is now worst to deal with for me ugh... I'm sad too

[Hibari]

15 minutes ago, lalala said:

I remember it was exhaustion and traumatizing, but going thorough another wd is now worst to deal with for me ugh... I'm sad too

It makes it hard to believe that all will be well but I have no other choice than to go forward.  You have my deepest empathy for what you are fools though.  

[lalala]

19 hours ago, Hibari said:

It makes it hard to believe that all will be well but I have no other choice than to go forward.  You have my deepest empathy for what you are fools though.  

It's really  hard for me right  now,  thank you  I'm not in the best  spirits  but I hope  very  much we will be able  to handle  this and be free... 

[Rhiannon]

I have nothing particularly helpful to contribute except to say I HATE CORTISOL MORNINGS

It's hard to remember that there have been times I haven't had this intense cortisol surge in the morning.

 

The most frustrating thing is that when it settles down in the afternoon I could nap, but that's when I have to go to work. So I am sleepy and dopey at work, and wired in the morning when I need to be sleeping in.

 

In a few more years I can retire from this job and honestly the thing I am looking forward to the most is being able to take naps in the afternoon!

[Giulietta]

How early in the morning do these nasty cortisol spikes happen to you?

 

I think I am aroud at 5 a.m.

 

I wear a black out sleep mask and still have them. 😎

On 6/6/2019 at 12:10 PM, Hibari said:

It makes it hard to believe that all will be well but I have no other choice than to go forward. 

 

Positive thinking! In the mean time - has anyone given @Daisy 's suggestions a try:

 

On 8/19/2018 at 6:45 PM, Daisy said:

What helped me was writing the jumble of thoughts on paper until they settled down. Then I would write down my plans for the day and check them off as I got them done. Sometimes they were just simple things like take a shower,

 

 

[Giulietta]

Hello - I found this interesting article by Alto https://beyondmeds.com/2011/07/28/ssriprotractedwithdrawal/

 

 

[alexrosear]

I used to wake with anxiety, but now  I wake with overwhelming doom/depression feelings - so intense that I can't seem to do anything other than pull the covers over and go back to sleep to stop the feelings and also because when I feel like that the absolute last thing in the world that I want is to be awake.

 

Any thoughts?

[Denas1969]

I have this too.  I have had the fear of sleep and the fear of waking up and it did subside for a while but now its back.  Its not as bad as it was durong my first round but still sucks!!  I really thought I was losing my mind (and at times I am so on edge I still do)   I take my symptoms and separate them somehow, like I will repeat "i wish this hip and leg pain wpuld go away" and hyper focus on it.  When it gets better there is usually another symptom waiting to rear its ugly head.  Now its "I wish this on edge near panic feeling will go away" but now the fear of what might take its place is a thing.  I just cannot win!  I wanna try scullcap but so afraid. 

Edited September 28, 2019 by ChessieCat
removed obscenity

[Armorall]

Alto- how do you get the niacinamide in such small amounts if you take it in 200 or 100 mg doses. When I look online they all seem to be sold in 500mg pills? Do you still advise taking these? 

[Denas1969]

You can purchase in powder form or break open the capsules... Stir in a little liquid and drink it down.  

[Armorall]

Ok thanks for that info!

Altostrata -Would you still reccommend using niacinamide? I see that SA usually just backs fish oil and magnesium, so I wonder if after time, you saw that people shouldn't use niacinamide?  @Altostrata

[Cerberus123x]

On 4/13/2018 at 11:06 PM, Altostrata said:

Please read this topic from the beginning.

 

Hello everyone. I noticed that nobody mentioned vivid dreams. I have been off Lexapro for about a year now and I still wake up multiple times during sleep. I have been living like this for 2-3 years. This started when I was on lexapro as I was "leaning" off it.

 

I still see vivid dreams/nightmares. The only thing that lets me go back to sleep peacefully is Seroquel. It's an anti-psychotic for schizophrenics/bipolars and I'm neither of those. I am just desperate to get a full uninterrupted sleep. 

It feels like I this will never go away. I have read through all of the 17 pages in this thread and it's really hard to pinpoint any successful story. There's a lot of trial & error going on and I can't tell what can help us remain asleep or speed up the withdrawal process. So, can someone please let me know what can I do to reduce these withdrawal symptoms such as vivid dreams and multiple awakenings during sleep? Can I go back to lexapro and taper off it even more slowly? 

So far, I've gathered that magnesium helps matters a bit. Thank you!

[Altostrata]

Armorall -- I didn't find any consistent effect from niacinamide. You might try a fraction of a tablet to see what it does for you.

 

Withdrawal syndrome often makes the nervous system hypersensitive to all kinds of things, even supplements. It may tolerate only very gentle interventions. We can't expect dramatic changes from anything discussed in this topic; we're looking for only a slight improvement or diminution in symptom intensity. Reducing light stimulation in the morning is probably the most consistently effective method, but you may still wake up very early in the morning.

 

Using quetiapine to sleep has its own drawbacks. As you may have noticed throughout this topic, we don't discuss taking drugs for the cortisol spike symptom at all. Quetiapine has so many adverse effects, we'd never recommend it for anything. It can upset insulin metabolism and ultimately needs to be tapered to avoid withdrawal.  If you'd like to discuss your use of it further, please post in your Introductions topic.

 

[clarknova]

Morning doom is big for me as well right now. Today it went like this:

 

It's Saturday.

Woke up around 6 am. Didn't feel anxious, just depressed. "Why get up?"

Decided I would just lay there. Try to meditate, maybe even enjoy a lazy Saturday for once. 

Started ruminating. "Why me?", "What's the point?", "What if this, what if that?"

Anxiety started ramping up. "Okay, stay with it. Accept it. Flow with the... No, can't do it!"

Got up in a hurry. Turned lights on. Paced around. 

Sat down in the kitchen. Made a cup of tea. Opened laptop. Read SA forums for an hour. 

Started calming down a little bit. Less anxiety. Less depression. 

Made some eggs. Ate them. 

 

 

[clarknova]

On 8/20/2018 at 12:45 AM, Daisy said:

What helped me was writing the jumble of thoughts on paper until they settled down. Then I would write down my plans for the day and check them off as I got them done. Sometimes they were just simple things like take a shower, brush my teeth, get dressed, feed the dog, walk the dog, feed the cat etc. Then I would list the errands I wanted to run for the day. Sometimes I had to cross things off that I had put down because they did not make sense or were inappropriate. Doing this helped to get my morning brain organized in a more linear fashion instead of going over the same thing or things over and over again. It even helped distract me from the morning anxiety.

If you do this and it works for you, you have gained a tool that helps. If it does not, then you haven't lost anything by giving it a try.

Daisy

 

I remember this really working for me as well last time I was in a wave. I would always have this huge open notebook on my kitchen table, and I would write lists for myself every evening and then do it the next morning - "Get up", "Make bed", "Put on clothes" etc. I would be Night Guy telling Morning Guy what to do and in which order. I would also make check boxes next to every item so it felt good to cross them off. 

 

Thank you, Daisy, for reminding me of this. I'm just two weeks into a pretty rough wave now, so I need to get the huge notebook back out. 

[Avrgejane]

Hi there,

 

Any tips on decreasing morning cortisol? I find that mornings until about 2pm are very sensitive and tough for me. As the evening hits it’s much better. 

 

Any helpful tips? 

 

AJ

[succubus76]

Melatonin

[Altostrata]

@Avrgejane see the discussion above in this topic.

[Cerberus123x]

I can't go back to sleep after I wake up with high cortisol and I haven't seen a single success story for lexapro withdrawal. I can't live like this!!!

[bottlehalffull]

I read something recently that exercise in the morning helps with sleep more than exercise other times of day. So the night before last when I woke up at 4:30 and was still awake when the sun rose, I went for a long walk and just stayed up the rest of the day. I actually felt like my energy level was decent for at least the first half of the day. And last night/this morning I only had my normal wake up and pee once, not my high stress lying in bed waking up from everything not able to fall back asleep. I'm going to try to get my exercise in in the morning more often and see what happens.

[Onmyway]

While looking for something else, just found today that vitamin C may lower high cortisol levels from stress. Haven't tested this with supplements but drinking large amounts of orange juice has been good to me before. May be worth trying. 

 

https://www.psychologytoday.com/us/articles/200304/vitamin-c-stress-buster

 

 

[Andie]

Anyone else notice that the anxiety on waking is worse with disrupted sleep? 

 

If I wake at 4.30-5.30am and go back to sleep, I will have vivid dreams and then panic, shaking and tears on waking. I may also have sleep paralysis and be foggy for a few hours. There dreams are extremely vivid and I can remember them in detail. They are usually emotionally distressing. 

 

If if I sleep right through, I still have the vivid dreaming, don't feel anxious on waking and can only remember vauge details.

 

 

[Denas1969]

I get you. Most of my troubles are around sleep. And my worst days are after a night of broken sleep yes.  

[Andie]

12 minutes ago, Denas1969 said:

I get you. Most of my troubles are around sleep. And my worst days are after a night of broken sleep yes.  

Me too. My most troublesome symptoms are around sleep.  I just noticed the pattern in a very obvious way, as I've had over a week of good sleep since Prozac bridge, and then sudden return of panic waking after a few nights of broken sleep. 

 

I havent had solid sleep sleep for years so I'm not sure what normal feels like. 

[Denas1969]

My sleep got better when i started 5mg prozac and 2.5 olanzapine but now I am down to .66 olanzapine and have good nights and bad ones.  Good mornings and bad ones.  Its like a rollercoaster.  It is so strange to feel stable sometimes and like I am losing it other times.  Ugh!  I just hope I can get off the olanzapine and stabalize on the prozac at a low dose.  And sleeeeeep!  

[Giulietta]

On 2/1/2020 at 1:17 AM, Andie said:

Anyone else notice that the anxiety on waking is worse with disrupted sleep? 

 

Hello Andie,

 

My sleep is affected by the anxiety and positivity the previous day and particularly after 6 pm at night.

 

On mornings when I have cortisol spikeks (awaken at 3 or 4 a.m. agitated, etc.) I may (not) fall back into a good sleep. Anxiety may be worse generally on these days.

 

If I wake up at 1 or 2 quickly and are back to sleep quickly - I am more inclined to sleep soundlythe rest of the night. I generally don't have anxiety on waking and anxiety is better during the day.

 

Both are not affected by dose (which is low).

 

Giuilietta

 

[Estman]

On 3/30/2011 at 1:40 AM, Neuroplastic said:

Oh, yes, Summer! It's precisely this!

 

Also, what helps, Summer, is accepting the fear, by which I mean not accusing yourself of the unability to make it go away. Stan is very right - it's very very much WD-induced. Your writing about "deleting what you've written" and "no sense there" speaks volumes - this irrational fear is, well, so... *irrational*, it escapes words. Been through the *exact* same. I really feel what you're saying here.

 

Hi,

An unfounded fear is then a symptom of withdrawal?
I did not have this before taking antidepressants
Will it decrease over time?

 

 

 

On 3/30/2011 at 1:40 AM, Neuroplastic said:

 

 

[Artistic1]

Just finished reading several pages of this thread. Can't tell you how much it meant to find others with the same problem I have! Fractured sleep and waking with anxiety or lack of motivation or both. This is a symptom I've had since getting hit suddenly with GAD 5 years ago. At first, it was so terrible....it's one of the things that drove me to antidepressants. Since then, with CBT, the strength has lessened considerably, but it's disturbing that it's still there even in a mild form, because in the back of my mind is the fear that it will come back full force. That fear of fear is the one thing I have to work the hardest on.

[Estman]

Yes, fear of fear is also my symptom
There is also a fear that suddenly the wave will not pass this time
there is often fear before going to bed and also in the morning
I understand that this is also a symptom that should go away
 

[Estman]

I have a physically strange symptom for 17 days now
There were very lively and intense dreams at night
When I woke up in the morning, I was very restless when I was in bed
It started with an inner (spiritual) bad mood and turned into a physical feeling of tension
My whole body, especially my back, is under a lot of pressure while I sit still.
This physical tension is sometimes so intense that it creates fear.
Physical symptoms have usually occurred earlier, in the first or second week.
The third week is currently underway.
I am currently maintaining my dose at 34mg
Probably just a body adjustment?

[Estman]

On 2/1/2020 at 10:29 AM, Denas1969 said:

My sleep got better when i started 5mg prozac and 2.5 olanzapine but now I am down to .66 olanzapine and have good nights and bad ones.  Good mornings and bad ones.  Its like a rollercoaster.  It is so strange to feel stable sometimes and like I am losing it other times.  Ugh!  I just hope I can get off the olanzapine and stabalize on the prozac at a low dose.  And sleeeeeep!  

Olanzapine caused me akathisia
I also took it for 3 months in the summer of 2019

[Albert]

On 3/13/2011 at 9:27 PM, Altostrata said:

This seems to be a very common symptom of withdrawal syndrome. Many people report waking up with a surge of panic or anxiety, or a feeling of anxiety early in the morning. A lot of times, people are waking around 4:30 a.m. or closer to dawn. The first glimmers of morning light signal the nervous system to start the morning cycle with a jump in cortisol. At normal levels, cortisol gives you energy. At elevated levels, cortisol gives you a feeling of unease, anxiety, panic, or depression. When you have withdrawal syndrome, your system is on "high alert" all the time. The normal morning peak of cortisol gets exaggerated and what you would normally feel as "wake up" becomes a surge of panic, anxiety, or dread in the early morning.

As I try to reinstate to balance out, is there something that can combat this? 

[Altostrata]

I updated post #1:

 

On 3/13/2011 at 7:27 PM, Altostrata said:

This seems to be a very common symptom of withdrawal syndrome. Many people report waking up with a surge of panic or anxiety, or a feeling of anxiety early in the morning. People generally feel this around 3:30-4:30 a.m. or closer to dawn.

 

The first glimmers of morning light signal the nervous system to start the morning cycle with a normal rise in cortisol. This is a normal part of your circadian rhythm. Normally, cortisol gives you energy. When you have withdrawal syndrome, your system is on "high alert" all the time.

 

For people whose nervous systems have been sensitized by going on and off psychiatric drugs, the normal morning peak of cortisol is felt as exaggerated. What you would normally feel as "wake up" becomes a surge of unease, panic, anxiety, or dread at the start of the day.

 

Since the cortisol increase is signaled by early morning light, you can reduce the stimulation by reducing light in your bedroom with the use of blackout shades and curtains and a sleep mask to shield your eyes. Strengthening your sleep also helps. See

 

What is the sleep cycle?

 

Tips to help sleep -- so many of us have that awful withdrawal insomnia

 

Path to Better Sleep FREE online for everyone from the US Veterans Administration

 

Music for self-care: Calms hyperalertness, anxiety, aids relaxation and sleep

 

Melatonin for sleep: Many people find it helpful

 

TV or computer use in evening can disrupt sleep: Bright light signals the brain that it's daytime

 

[Onmyway]

On 10/23/2019 at 2:46 PM, Avrgejane said:

Hi there,

 

Any tips on decreasing morning cortisol? I find that mornings until about 2pm are very sensitive and tough for me. As the evening hits it’s much better. 

 

Any helpful tips? 

 

AJ

Hi Avrgejane, 

has this improved for you? I have the same symptoms most days. I hate mornings. The one thing that has helped somewhat is to be physically active through it all - like load the dishwasher, clean, water the garden etc. But how I yearn for calm mornings!

[Giulietta]

13 hours ago, Onmyway said:

have the same symptoms most days. I hate mornings. The one thing that has helped somewhat is to be physically active through it all - like load the dishwasher, clean, water the garden etc. But how I yearn for calm mornings!

 

Hello all,

 

I undertand the apprehension of going to bed at night that  when I awaken (or I may be awaked by) I may feel tremors, maybe some panic/high levels of anxiety, heart palpitations and maybe increased respiratory rate. These are crummy and a lousy way to begin the day. This unfortunately seems part and parcel of WD. 😕

 

Things that may be useful for me are CBT and getting up and physical activity.  Deep breathing may or may not help. Someone on site has mentioned putting legs up on a wall - link on SA some place, or on a chair depending on your physical condition. Two other things that were suggrsted to me are: two apps, one called 'calm' and the otehr ' headspace.'

 

Two others that I have been remiss about - 1. meditating (focusing on the breath) - up to 20 min a day. And 3 minutes before bedtime - have nothing but positive thoughts. No worries about this might happen the next morning. If it does, accept that it might and ou will get through it.

 

I am a victim (I consider myself one) of prolonged WD from a veritable CT of cymbalta in 12/2018 by medical error.  This symptom (and others) have come and gone over this period.  The cortisol  spikes have returned in the past 2 weeks and I accept them as part of WD.

 

Hang n there everyone.

 

G.