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arwilliams Zyprexa long term vs withdrawal

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arwilliams

Because I don't sleep at all with out Zyprexa I am planning to take it long term.

 

Any one done this for over a decade or 20+ years?

 

I am on the lowest does 2.5mg and have decided the weight gain isn't that of a big deal to me but sleep is.

 

 

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Altostrata

Welcome, ar.

 

This is a site for going off drugs. We don't give advise about taking them long-term. I strongly recommend you consult Dr. Google to review the adverse effects of Zyprexa, some of them irreversible. Weight gain can lead to diabetes and a host of serious health problems.

 

Were you taking any psychiatric drugs prior to your sleep problem?

 

If I were you, I'd work on non-drug methods to improve sleep, see Important topics about symptoms, including sleep problems

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arwilliams

I would prefer to be off the medicationsZ. Well if it's between sleeping normally prior taking Zyprexa and not sleeping at all I'm not sure.

 

Prior to taking Zyprexa my sleep was fine after taking it, off Zyprexa it is terrible.

 

Weight gain tapers off after about 33 pounds according to the studies and in my experience.  A lot yes but it doesn't go on forever.  Diabetes happens between 3-5% of cases typically by the sources I have found.  

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arwilliams

@Altostrata So I am ordering a scale and going to try micro tapers at 10% starting at 2.5 mg -> 2.25 -> 2.00 etc...

 

It appears I can not drink the injection powder according to my Googling and there is no Syrup.

 

It makes me laugh and sad when I read stuff like this "7Acute symptoms such as sweating, insomnia, tremor, anxiety, nausea and vomiting have been reported when olanzapine is stopped abruptly."

 

Well I definitely experienced extreme insomnia when stopping so I must be in that 1%.

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arwilliams

So I kinda like sleep a lot.  I'm trying to get of Zyprexa precisely because I think causing sleep with a medication is well a really bad idea.

 

I think one night when I wasn't sleeping well I took 2x20mg tablets.

 

Could this have damaged my brain and may be why I have such difficult coming off the last 2.5 mg of Zyprexa?

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Altostrata

When did you take 40mg? If it was a long time ago, that's worn off.

 

You have rebound insomnia because you are physiologically dependent on Zyprexa. If you taper very gradually, you should be able to sneak off with your sleep intact.

 

Read Tips for tapering off olanzapine (Zyprexa)

 

Only one Introductions topic to a customer. Please put all question about your taper in this topic.

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DaveB
13 hours ago, Altostrata said:

When did you take 40mg? If it was a long time ago, that's worn off.

 

You have rebound insomnia because you are physiologically dependent on Zyprexa. If you taper very gradually, you should be able to sneak off with your sleep intact.

 

Read Tips for tapering off olanzapine (Zyprexa)

 

Only one Introductions topic to a customer. Please put all question about your taper in this topic.

 

Alto, at what point would you consider a "jumping off" point for Zyprexa? I, like arwilliams am on 2.5 mgs and those little pills are tough to cut and there is no syrup. I know you can make your own solution, but the OCD side of me is scared of getting it wrong. I think I am going to get a gemini scale and shave off pieces until I get down to half, then cut in half. Just wondering what you would consider low enough to stop taking. 

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arwilliams

Alto it was 3 years ago.  According to a book I read larger doses can be damaging to the brain.  Injections being a higher if they overwhelm the brain with and even higher dosage then there might be hope.  I don't know the science behind injections vs a high does of Zyprexa.

 

@DaveB How long have you been on Zyprexa 2.5mg? I can't  believe I'm not the only one.  I was although not a minor, I was 18 living in my parents house when I started taking the medication. My biggest regret in life is not moving out or going to college so I didn't get addicted to this stuff.

 

I have tried cutting the pills in half with no success.  My measurement was not very precise though but it was obvious 1.25 mg wouldn't work.

 

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Altostrata

Large doses of antipsychotics taken for a long time can cause long-term adverse effects. One or two doses taken years ago are not a problem.

 

DaveB, we advise going lower than 1mg before stopping -- reduce the dose as long as possible. I am sorry if the process is inconvenient, that's the way it is.

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DaveB
24 minutes ago, arwilliams said:

Alto it was 3 years ago.  According to a book I read larger doses can be damaging to the brain.  Injections being a higher if they overwhelm the brain with and even higher dosage then there might be hope.  I don't know the science behind injections vs a high does of Zyprexa.

 

@DaveB How long have you been on Zyprexa 2.5mg? I can't  believe I'm not the only one.  I was although not a minor, I was 18 living in my parents house when I started taking the medication. My biggest regret in life is not moving out or going to college so I didn't get addicted to this stuff.

 

I have tried cutting the pills in half with no success.  My measurement was not very precise though but it was obvious 1.25 mg wouldn't work.

 

 

I have been taking 2.5 mgs since August 2017. Was prescribed it to help me sleep and get me though a really rough anxiety patch. My anxiety is much more manageable now and I am entertaining the idea of starting a taper. How long have you taken it? 

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arwilliams

@DaveB 3 years basically. I don't sleep for like a week off the medication.

 

I have basically chronic insomnia.

 

I might get an 3-4 hours of sleep a week at at least for the first week.

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DaveB
13 minutes ago, Altostrata said:

DaveB, we advise going lower than 1mg before stopping -- reduce the dose as long as possible. I am sorry if the process is inconvenient, that's the way it is.

 

Haha, thanks Alto, if it keeps me sane, I will take inconvenient all day long! Thanks for all you do and for this site. It has been a lifesaver for me!

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Altostrata

You're very welcome, Dave. I wish it was all easier. In fact, I wish withdrawal syndrome did not exist.

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Spideygsm
Posted (edited)
On 5/22/2018 at 7:07 AM, arwilliams said:

I would prefer to be off the medicationsZ. Well if it's between sleeping normally prior taking Zyprexa and not sleeping at all I'm not sure.

 

Prior to taking Zyprexa my sleep was fine after taking it, off Zyprexa it is terrible.

 

Weight gain tapers off after about 33 pounds according to the studies and in my experience.  A lot yes but it doesn't go on forever.  Diabetes happens between 3-5% of cases typically by the sources I have found.  

arwilliams:

 

I responded to one of your questions in another thread but feel compelled to respond here again. I was on Zyprexa for about 15 years. There is no such thing as a minimum dose. Over the years, my body built up a tolerance and the Doctors kept having to increase my dose above the supposedly max dose of 20mg/day (I got up to 30mg/day). You may start out at 2.5mg but eventually, you'll probably have to go up. I had to go off Zyprexa very quickly due to pre-diabetic (I guess I'm really lucky being in the 3-5%, need to buy a Powerball ticket), very high cholesterol, and very high liver panels along with other health issues I'm not supposed to list. I gained weight, completely changed my diet and lots of exercise helped me lose the weight and keep the weight off (you cannot stop the diet or exercise or the weight comes right back on). When my dose got to 20mg, I immediately gained 25 lbs even though I never stopped the diet or exercise. Couldn't lose it. Once I finally stopped Zyprexa completely, I've lost all the weight. I continue to diet and exercise. Once I stopped the Zyprexa, all of my blood work has returned to normal and my health issues are quickly resolving themselves. Is this a coincidence?

 

My current Doctor said she won't ever start a patient on Zyprexa because of the weight gain and very serious side effects. When I started seeing her 12 years ago, I was already on Zyprexa and it was working for me. That's the only reason I was kept on the medication.

 

I am not a Doctor and try not to act like a medical professional. There are many ways to deal with insomnia. Both herbs, over-the-counter, prescription sleep-aids, and even 100% CBD oil. You're taking a very powerful antipsychotic approved for schizophrenia and bipolar disorders and you're taking it just to sleep?? I took it only because I have a very severe case of bipolar, have tried committing suicide several times, and am a self injurer*. If you ever do have to get off of Zyprexa, then you'll experience real insomnia where you can go several days with zero sleep then luck out and get 1 hour sleep the next 2 nights.

 

My advise is that since you don't have a mental illness that Zyprexa is approved to treat, start getting off it ASAP. You seem to think 2.5mg is a small dose easy to get off of. My symptoms got very severe once I went under 2.5mg. Please be very careful with your thinking. From an outsider reading your post I quoted, it sounds like you're trying to justify staying on Zyprexa in your mind.

 

Not trying to be a jerk or lecturing you. I'm trying to help you. I'm new to this forum like you. I wish I knew this forum existed a long time ago because it sure would have helped me. I'm not a member of any other forum. Only joined because I saw others who need help like I did/do. Good luck. Please keep posting

 

*moderator note:  modified graphic descriptions of self injury.  Please do not describe how you injure yourself, as that can be triggering to others who have used that behaviour as an ill-advised coping mechanism. The type of injury is not a badge of honour.

Edited by JanCarol
graphic descriptions of self injury

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arwilliams

 

@Spideygsm Thank you for the response!  What has worked for sleep for you(that is approved for long term use)?  I actually was on 15 mg of Zyprexa and have gone down overtime.  Went from 15mg all the way to 2.5mg. You are right to say that saying the "lowest dose" is a little misleading but frankly they simple don't make smaller pills.

The only thing keeping me from getting off is the insomnia.

 

Did your sleep with out Zyprexa restore itself? I have managed to go a week with out 2.5mg Zyprexa and frankly gave up.

 

I'm trying to taper 2.5mg doses by 10%.

 

Also how did you go about tapering Zyprexa if at all?

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Spideygsm
Posted (edited)

arwilliams

 

My insomnia has not resolved itself. I’ve only been on 3 medications in my life that helped sleep. Klonipin (prescribed for anxiety but made me sleep) which I became addicted to in 3 weeks and went through terrible withdrawals for about 60 days. Ambien made me fall asleep but not stay alseep and I had to taper for about 30 days to get off it (the first time I took them), and Zyprexa. None of these medications are approved for long term use for sleep. Even Melatonin isn’t approved for long term use nor OTC sleep aids. There’s an herbal sleep aid out of India called Ashwagandha that can be purchased on Amazon. I don’t know any of the specifics or safety. Somebody just told me about it this week. No plans to try it. 

 

Insomnia sucks. I have never been a good sleeper because of Anxiety and depression my whole life. The insomnia caused by Zyprexa withdrawal  is the worst. I was desperate and tried Trazodone out of desperation which I don’t think has worked too well and CBD oil. The CBD seems to be something that works. However, I don’t know for sure and my brain may just be improving. I’m not going to stay on either the CBD or Trazodone. Trazodone taper starts tonight. All of my other symptoms are gone and I’m just left with the insomnia. I can live with it.

 

This Forum strongly recommends tapering by 10%. It seems to work for people. Even dropping from 2.5mg to 1.25mg to 0.625mg is a 50% drop each time. I really struggled after 2.5mg than at any other drop. Getting off Zyprexa is the hardest thing I’ve ever done. However, I had a health situation where I had to get off fast. I was also taking it along time and at a really high dose. 

 

Everybody is different and experieces different things. Before you do anything, educate yourself on this forum and I’d talk to another Doctor. Another because the one you see now put you on Zyprexa for an illness Zyprexa is not approved to treat. Using Zyprexa to treat insomnia is like using dynamite to kill an ant. 

 

Good luck

 

 

 

Edited by ChessieCat
fixed up font size

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ChessieCat

Hi arwilliams

 

There are many existing topics on this site and as Spidey said it is important to educate yourself before trying anything.

 

To search the site I like to use google and add survivingantidepressants.org to my search string.

 

ashwagandha-herb-for-anxiety-stress-and-toxic-overload

 

melatonin-for-sleep

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Spideygsm
8 hours ago, arwilliams said:

 

@Spideygsm Thank you for the response!  What has worked for sleep for you(that is approved for long term use)?  I actually was on 15 mg of Zyprexa and have gone down overtime.  Went from 15mg all the way to 2.5mg. You are right to say that saying the "lowest dose" is a little misleading but frankly they simple don't make smaller pills.

The only thing keeping me from getting off is the insomnia.

 

Did your sleep with out Zyprexa restore itself? I have managed to go a week with out 2.5mg Zyprexa and frankly gave up.

 

I'm trying to taper 2.5mg doses by 10%.

 

Also how did you go about tapering Zyprexa if at all?

arwilliams

 

Sorry, I didn't see the question about how I tapered Zyprexa. I ended up doing approximately 25% tapers and it took approximately 3 months. I had 2.5mg, 5mg, 10mg, and 15mg standard tablets I used to cut. I only quartered a pill when I went from 5 to 3.75 mg and from1.25 to 0.625mg. My Doctor told me to hold the dose at each taper for 10 days. I started around Dec 1, 2017 and took my last dose 3/4/2018. I know the last date because I put it in my calendar (victory day). I'll add my taper to my signature. I saw zero relief or stabilization once I started tapering because it went so fast (per my Doctor's order). It got really bad once I went below 2.5mg, symptoms really increased after my last dose, and got the worst 4 weeks past my last dose.

 

Please read this thread: 

holly57: Hello - tapering off Olanzapine (Zyprexa)

I know you've posted in that thread but I don't know if you've read much of it. Holly57 did a 10% taper over about a 2.5 year period. She reported only having very minimal withdrawals. However, she documented her withdrawal down to just about the very end then kind of dropped off the map. I got very emotional too during my taper so I'm guessing her emotions got to her.

 

I think this forum is the best out there for people suffering from drug dependance and from mental illness. We get to read exactly how people have dealt with drugs as well as dealt with life after drugs. I've said it before, I'll probably never get completely off all drugs because I have a severe mental illness. I've had over 80 electro convulsive therapies because drugs don't work well with me. That said, even though I still have insomnia (not as bad as during Zyprexa withdrawals), I feel better. Actually better than I've felt in 15 years. I never feel real good (except when I'm manic) because of the mental issues I deal with (my entire life), but I do feel better than when I was on Zyprexa. Living with some insomnia is much better than dealing with diabetes, heart issues from high cholesterol, and liver disease as well as other issues.

 

Please feel free to message me or ask a question in a post thread. My only purpose for joining SA is to share what worked for me and what I've gone through. I just wish I knew about SA because it would've been a huge help. I only found this website a couple of weeks ago. However from what I've seen, I don't think anybody will judge you or tell you exactly what to do. You'll probably get a lot of suggestions and a lot of support. I think that's the benefit of SA.

 

From my experience, if and when you stop Zyprexa, I wouldn't trade one dangerous drug (Zyprexa) for another such as Benzodiazepines or even prescription sleeping pills. Neither worked for me (I was desperate for sleep and anxiety relief). I think most people's success has come from diet and EXERCISE which also worked for me. You have to be very mentally tough and very very patient. 

 

Good luck

 

 

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arwilliams

@ChessieCat Thank you for the response!  melatonin makes me feel tired but doesn't actually put me to sleep.  There is reason it isn't prescription(in the USA) because it well really isn't addictive and really can't be abused.  Comparing melatonin to Zyprexa is quite literally comparing a mosquito bite to a bullet wound.

 

I have had a sleep study done and well I am literally not sleeping with out Zyprexa at least for the first couple of nights.  I have only pushed through a week of absolutely no sleep until I give in and go back on Zyprexa.

 

I also search on google "site:http://survivingantidepressants.org insomnia" to search the site.

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Spideygsm

I've read where Melatonin can be addictive and can cause dependance. In some parts of Europe a prescription is needed to get Melatonin. Google Melatonin addiction and side effects.

 

Zyprexa is a very powerful sedative. One of the major side effects is one sleeps too much. One of the major withdrawal symptoms is severe insomnia. You said that yourself. They further I'm getting away from my initial taper, the insomnia is slowly going away. I think you need to make that big decision and get off Zyprexa. Do it very slowly. It's gonna take a long time. Some people get through it better than others. It's not gonna be easy

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Spideygsm
1 hour ago, arwilliams said:

Is your sleep at least a consistent 3-4 hours now?

 

I can go 2 maybe 3 days with out sleep temporarily.

Before I went on Trazodone, I had difficulty falling asleep. I'd say I went more nights with zero sleep than nights with sleep. On the nights I did sleep, I slept 1-2 hours max. When I woke up, that was it. No sleep until the next night. I didn't take any caffeine and couldn't take naps (which I've ever been able to do). It was miserable feeling so tired. After Trazodone, I still had difficulty falling asleep. Typically I'd get 1-2 hours sleep and on the best nights, 2-3 hours sleep. I was never able to fall back asleep once I woke up. When I added CBD oil 1-1/2 weeks ago, the first few days I fell asleep but didn't stay asleep. Once I increased the dose to 20mg, I've fallen right asleep, stayed asleep all but one night, and slept a minimum of 6 hours. On the night I woke up, I was able to fall right back asleep. Maybe it's a placebo effect. I've never in my life tried CBD. I've been a skeptic. However, when my Doctor suggested I try it, I did and it seems to work. I'm not an advocate for CBD oil. I don't think it's a coincidence it's working for me. I'm only gonna use it for a short term. I know some for some people they say it does nothing. I started with 5mg, then 10mg, then 20mg. That's where I'm at now. My Doctor said not to go above 40mg of CBD. She also said to take pure CBD without THC because THC can be addicting.

 

I would not take any antipsychotic drug as a sleep aid. They're ife threatening and dangerous. Did you know that Eli Lilly, the maker of Zyprexa, got sued and payed the highest settlement ever for a drug maker (approx $1.42 billion) in the early 2000's? 

 

"The company made hundreds of millions of dollars by trying to convince health care providers that Zyprexa was safe for unapproved uses," Magid said, noting that they hold the drugmaker "responsible for putting thousands and thousands of patients at risk." She added that off-label marketing circumvents "the very process put in place to protect the public".  Google why did Eli Lilly get sued for Zyprexa

 

They also spent approximately $1.2 billion paying out settlements for lawsuits against product liabilities (adverse side effects such as diabetes, excessive weight gain and many more health related issues). I've read reports where there is concern now that antipsychotic drugs may actually cause permanent brain damage. There's a lot of different alternatives out there for sleep. Try them all. However, get off the Zyprexa. Zyprexa almost killed me. Do you want to take a dangerous life threatening drug by choice all because you can't sleep?

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arwilliams

@Spideygsm so if I understand you right your sleep is still 1-2 hours a night off the CBD oil and trazodone?  Yes or no?  I was expecting some rebound in sleep eventually

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Spideygsm

Incorrect. I started CBD oil 1-1/2 weeks ago. Since the very first night taking CBD oil, I have fallen asleep very quickly. I take the CBD oil 1 hour before I go to bed. The first few nights I fell asleep for maybe 2-3 hours. It may have been that my body was adapting to the CBD oil or that I wasn't taking a high enough dose. However, on the third night I increased the dose to 20mg. Since that night, I've slept a minimum of 6 hours every night. One night I woke up in the middle of the night but fell right back asleep. Some nights I've slept 7-8 hours. This has occurred for 6 straight nights in a row.

 

CBD appears to be working for me. It's no guarantee. Everybody's different. I haven't tried any other herbal treatments other than CBD. If CBD didn't work for me or stops working, I'll try something else like the "Ashwagandha" I told you about earlier today. My friend who told me about the Ashwagandha is an MD. He said it takes about 1-2 weeks for it to start working. There's lots of different herbal remedies for sleep. I won't try Melatonin. However, I will try all of the herbal remedies or even increase my CBD dose. Choose something and try it. If you google any of these remedies, you'll find that it takes time for the remedy to work. Don't stop after the first couple of nights. Start your Zyprexa taper tonight at a very tiny taper and start taking an herbal remedy. You won't know anything until you try. 

 

Please start a post and I'm sure people will offer support. Just remember, you're taking a very powerful depressant that you brain needs to re-learn to operate without Zyprexa. I think there's gonna be some unpleasant nights. I think you're a bit frightened. I'll encourage you along. Just do it.

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Altostrata

Melatonin is not addictive and does not cause dependence. A small dose often works better than a larger dose.

 

Melatonin is a bioidentical hormone, not a drug. Your body naturally makes melatonin at night. It is triggered by darkness. If you are staying up late on the computer, for example, the light exposure can confuse your normal melatonin cycle. The result: No sleep.

 

We now have lots of people who stay on the computer very late for work and play, have sleep problems, and consequently have become dependent in all senses of the word on sleep drugs. Their sleep problem is due to lifestyle.

 

Taking a bit of melatonin signals to your body that it's time to shut down for the night. You need to help it along by lowering the lights and getting off the computer.

 

Given the complexity of your nervous system, using a drug like Zyprexa to force it to sleep "is like using dynamite to kill an ant", as Spideygsm put it. More precisely, it's using a blunt chemical instrument on a delicate neural web.

 

arwilliams, you seem to believe that you have an extraordinary case of insomnia calling for extraordinary measures. Most likely, you have a case of insomnia due to bad sleep habits and you need to retrain your sleep cycle. Yes, a sleep study shows you're not sleeping, wasn't that obvious already?

 

Did the sleep specialists say anything to you about sleep hygiene?

 

 

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Spideygsm

I think I misspoke when I said Melatonin is addictive. Here’s an interesting article on Melatonin.  Maybe it’s not addictive in the true sense of the meaning, but this author definitely feels Melotonin isn’t the greatest or safest sleep aid. 

 

https://m.huffpost.com/us/entry/8855998

 

Sleep hygiene is very important. Put down the phone, shut down the computer, and turn off the TV 1 hour before you go to bed. Only use the bed for sleep or a romantic time with the significant other. Don’t drink any caffeine (even from a soda) after 4 pm. 

 

Insomnia  can be caused from many things such as depression, anxiety, thyroid problems, and even not drinking enough water. See a Doctor. 

 

We’re all lucky because the Moderators have seen just about everything and are way more knowledgeable than most and freeing try and help. What I see from arwilliams topic is he and another member in this posting value their sleep so much they’ll take anything for hours of uninterrupted sleep. My position and my position only is that antipsychotic drugs are a very poor solution. They’re very dangerous, addictive, and if you develop serious side effects down the road like I did and you have to get off the drug quickly, you’re in for either a very rough time of untreatable withdrawals or you’re gonna get put onto another dangerous antipsychotic.

 

I don’t think I have anything productive that I can add to arwilliams present topic. Feel free to ask your questions and I’ll answer if there’s something I can add or please message me if it’s something private. 

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arwilliams

@Altostrata I am going to try exercising more in hope it helps my sleep.  In terms of sleep hygiene specifically well I need to get some blue light glasses still, but I do you a computer a lot for work/school.  Its kinda a requirement of responding to messages and everything in life.  Its funny my sleep was perfect(well I overslept even) before starting Zyprexa and trying to stop off of it it is terrible.

 

I want to make something clear despite doctors recommended antipychotics like seroquel for sleep(literally my neurologist recommended this which is idiot in my opinion) often I was not actually prescribed the medication for sleep but it is the situation I am in now, which is I am taking it for sleep.

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arwilliams

@andy  were you on any other drugs when tapering Zyprexa?  I have considered taking Lithium at least temporarily because it is known to have almost non withdrawal side effects but might help my sleep/stability I'm guessing.

 

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Altostrata

Nobody should take lithium for sleep, it's far too dangerous.

 

What you should do is stop using the computer late at night. If necessary, get up at sunrise to get your computing hours in.

 

Taking a drug for sleep should be an absolute last resort, not a lifestyle supplement. Now you're dependent on Zyprexa and you understand the cost of taking a drug for no good reason.

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Spideygsm

xxxx 1 TRILLION

 

I think this website is just for advice to quit, what not to take. 

 

You’ve got yourself into a pickle. Now you unfortunately get to pay the price. 

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arwilliams

In the same way you advise 10% steps I am advising a intermittent step between Zyprexa and nothing.

 

If you read up on the h1 receptors Zyprexa has the highest affinity of all drugs.  Literally the highest.  https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC487011/

 

That has to be intermittent steps between well a super low dose of Zyprexa and well 0.0.

 

Getting no sleep for weeks is no way to live.

 

Lithium is a salt from what I have gathered which means if are going to step down well it certainly more natural then any of the antipychotic garbage.

 

Alto there is no "getting up" when I come off Zyprexa.  I simply do not fall asleep.  I do agree computer usage is bad but so is not finishing college and during your work/job.  I am rather mad that I am in my early twenties dealing with this nonsense.  I haven't even started seriously working with no school yet and my sleep schedule is completely screwed up.

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Spideygsm

arw (trying to keep it short. Alot to tell you)

 

I was on Lithium for 4 years. It didn’t make me tired or make me sleep. I took it for one purpose. Control manic episodes. There is a very  close gap between when it has any effect at all and when it’s dangerous. I had to have blood tests every week for 4 years. Lithium has the potential to kill you. You just can’t take it without very close Doctor supervision.

 

During my antipsychotic withdrawal, nothing helped me sleep until my brain adjusted to being off Zyprexa. That was 5 months after I started my taper and about 10 weeks beyond my last dose. I DID NOT take antipsychotic drugs for sleep ever. They were used to treat my mental illness. That’s it. Zyprexa had the opposite effect on my sleep. I was so drugged it caused me to not sleep.

 

This site is great because of real world stories. Not internet BS. There is no easy fix other than very slowly taper at even a 1% drop if that works for you. You cannot use a pill cutter for even 10% cuts. Even quartering a pill you’re at best +-5%. 

 

I feel for you. I joined only to help people. Maybe you need to see a different Doctor who does not use antipsychotics as sleep aids and will give you support you need to quit Zyprexa. You’ve been given great advice from I’ve seen on SA. 

 

Regards

 

 

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arwilliams

My concern is that the brain is permanently damaged.  I have been reading Robert Whitakers book and wanted to quote this part.

 

Quote

In short, initial exposure to neuroleptics put patients onto a path where they would likely need the drugs for life. Yet—and this was the second haunting aspect to this story of medicine—staying on the drugs regularly led to a bad end. Over time, Chouinard and Jones noted, the dopaminergic pathways tended to become permanently dysfunctional. They became irreversibly stuck in a hyperactive state,  and soon the patient's tongue was slipping rhythmically in and out of his mouth (tardive dyskinesia) and psychotic symptoms were worsening (tardive psychosis). Doctors would then need to prescribe higher doses of antipsychotics to tamp down those tardive symptoms. "The most efficacious treatment is the causative agent itself, the neuroleptic," Chouinard and Jones said. 

 

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Altostrata

Yes, tardive dyskinesia is one very serious risk of antipsychotics. You would be wise to get away from them before you develop it.

 

Strongly recommend you do some Googling and educate yourself.

 

If you taper properly, you can probably avoid sleep disruption. That exactly why we recommend tapering.

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arwilliams

According to Wikipedia these are the receptors and their affinities.  I posted trazodone because well 

          Trazodone    Zyprexa
5-HT1A      96           2000
5-HT2A      20           1.32
5-HT2B      74           11
5-HT2C      224          6.4
5-HT5A      >10,000      1000
5-HT7       1,000        105
H1          220          0.65

Note: I do not list if they inverse agonist vs inverse antagonist.

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Spideygsm
1 hour ago, arwilliams said:

According to Wikipedia these are the receptors and their affinities.  I posted trazodone because well 


          Trazodone    Zyprexa
5-HT1A      96           2000
5-HT2A      20           1.32
5-HT2B      74           11
5-HT2C      224          6.4
5-HT5A      >10,000      1000
5-HT7       1,000        105
H1          220          0.65

Note: I do not list if they inverse agonist vs inverse antagonist.

I don’t know the difference.  All that tells me is that both drugs are controlling your brain.

 

Since being off Zyprexa I’m not living in a fog cloud, I don’t feel like a drugged zombie, can think clearer, my blood work is all great, and my other health issues also caused by side effects are gone. 

 

What does this tell you? Put down the computer and don’t touch another psych drug.

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