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IanM
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16 minutes ago, Altostrata said:

Antibiotics can trigger waves of anxiety, etc.  too.

 

 

How long has this pattern been going on? What is your sleep schedule?

 

Yes, antibiotics have not been good for me. 25 years ago, they gave me a c-difficile infection and my gut never recovered. And the recent, single dose of cipro for my prostate biopsy has caused a permanent white layer on my tongue, with a swab showing nothing unusual.

 

This sleep pattern has been going on for 6 months or more. I follow a rigorous schedule...in bed at 10pm, asleep by 11, then jolt awake with anger/rage at either midnight or 2-3am. Day after day.

 

I've tried melatonin, both immediate and sustained release, in doses ranging from 0.3mg to 3mg, and they not only don't help me stay asleep, but they significantly worsen my already black depression the following day. I won't go anywhere near it anymore.

 

All I take at bestime is 100mg elemental magnesium from glycinate and 90mg epa/dha (I ordered a much better brand yesterday that will give me 1000mg epa/dha in a single dose...seems I've been under-supplementing my fish oil for a long time).

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Altostrata

What is your drug schedule, again?

 

Have you tried melatonin?

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IanM
16 minutes ago, Altostrata said:

What is your drug schedule, again?

 

Have you tried melatonin?

 

Melatonin:

 

I've tried melatonin, both immediate and sustained release, in doses ranging from 0.3mg to 3mg, and they not only don't help me stay asleep, but they significantly worsen my already black depression the following day. I won't go anywhere near it anymore.

 

Drug Schedule:

 

7:00am 6.25mg seroquel

1:00pm. 6.25mg seroquel

7:00pm. 6.25mg seroquel

 

Thanks.

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Altostrata

Looks like you get breakthrough symptoms from Seroquel around 6 hours after you take it at 7 p.m.

 

Do your daytime symptoms follow a pattern?  Please keep daily notes of times of day you take your drugs, their dosages, and your symptoms throughout the day. You can post 24 hours of notes at a time in this topic, in a simple list format with time of day on the left and notation (symptom or drug and dosage) on the right.

 

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manymoretodays

Hi IanM,

How are you doing?

On 3/2/2020 at 2:13 PM, IanM said:

 

Melatonin:

 

I've tried melatonin, both immediate and sustained release, in doses ranging from 0.3mg to 3mg, and they not only don't help me stay asleep, but they significantly worsen my already black depression the following day. I won't go anywhere near it anymore.

 

Drug Schedule:

 

7:00am 6.25mg seroquel

1:00pm. 6.25mg seroquel

7:00pm. 6.25mg seroquel

 

Thanks.

 

Are you just on the Seroquel now then?  I'm just looking at your signature, and copied it below:

 

Drug history: various SSRIs (all of which made me much worse), Seroquel, Olanzapine, Abilify, Trazedone, Remeron, Gabapentin, Lyrica, klonopin.

Drug schedule (records only kept since June 2018)

-Gabapentin - jun 7/2018 300mg, jul 8/2018, 200mg

- Olanzapine jun 7/2018 2.5mg, jun 30/2018 1.875mg, aug 1/2018 2.5mg, aug 6/2018 1.875mg, aug 18/2018 1.25mg/2.5mg alternating days, sep 8/2018 2.5mg, oct 8/2018 1.875mg, oct 11/2018 1.25mg, oct 18/2018 2.0mg, oct 21/2018 2.5mg.

-klonopin jun 7/2018 - present, very erratic, dose ranging from 0.0625mg twice a day to 0.25mg twice a day, and frequent skipped doses or extra doses. Currently at 0.0625mg twice daily since early September.

- Lamotrigine aug 2/2018 25mg, aug 8/2018 12.5mg, oct 1/2018 9.375mg

- Discontinued - 1.125mg lithium orotate every 3 days for the past 4 months. No variation.

- Magnesium citrate and fish oil, sporadic, vitamin D3 daily.

 

And noticed with the Klonopin, 2018-present so thought I would ask.

 

You can update/edit your signature here:  Account Settings/signature

 

Thanks, and best,

L, P, H, and G,

mmt

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IanM
51 minutes ago, manymoretodays said:

Hi IanM,

How are you doing?

 

Are you just on the Seroquel now then?  I'm just looking at your signature, and copied it below:

 

Drug history: various SSRIs (all of which made me much worse), Seroquel, Olanzapine, Abilify, Trazedone, Remeron, Gabapentin, Lyrica, klonopin.

Drug schedule (records only kept since June 2018)

-Gabapentin - jun 7/2018 300mg, jul 8/2018, 200mg

- Olanzapine jun 7/2018 2.5mg, jun 30/2018 1.875mg, aug 1/2018 2.5mg, aug 6/2018 1.875mg, aug 18/2018 1.25mg/2.5mg alternating days, sep 8/2018 2.5mg, oct 8/2018 1.875mg, oct 11/2018 1.25mg, oct 18/2018 2.0mg, oct 21/2018 2.5mg.

-klonopin jun 7/2018 - present, very erratic, dose ranging from 0.0625mg twice a day to 0.25mg twice a day, and frequent skipped doses or extra doses. Currently at 0.0625mg twice daily since early September.

- Lamotrigine aug 2/2018 25mg, aug 8/2018 12.5mg, oct 1/2018 9.375mg

- Discontinued - 1.125mg lithium orotate every 3 days for the past 4 months. No variation.

- Magnesium citrate and fish oil, sporadic, vitamin D3 daily.

 

And noticed with the Klonopin, 2018-present so thought I would ask.

 

You can update/edit your signature here:  Account Settings/signature

 

Thanks, and best,

L, P, H, and G,

mmt

 

Signature updated, thanks for the reminder.

 

 

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IanM

6 days ago, I made the mistake of trying lithium orotate again (2.5mg), along with some Inositol (750mg). I stopped both two days ago, and I have never been sicker than I am now. I may have to go to the hospital, but I'm trying to hang in to see if being away from those two 'supplements' for a few days will bring about a bit of recovery to my baseline.

 

Why oh why did I do it...?

 

 

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IanM

I also want to say that I used a PEMF device (magnetic pulser) on my head twice a day for probably 10 days, all while taking the above supplements. Any or all of it could have caused my deterioration.

 

Oh, and something else... 

For three days in a row, I went outside for short walks and bike rides, 30 minutes and 10 minutes, respectively, and I believe that made me way worse, too (in fact, I know it did). Troubling.

 

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Spideygsm

IanM,

 

So you’re taking everything on your list except Lithium which you took every 3 days for 4 months. Then you suddenly stopped taking that? When I took lithium I took it twice per day, got a blood test every two weeks because there’s a small window of range in the blood it’s effects. Just above the top of the range it can be deadly. 

 

No offense brother but I see you’re tinkering with doses, going down and up then down with multiple medications at the same time not giving your body any chance to adjust to anything. Plus if you use the PEMF device at too high a power and too long, it can make you extremely dizzy and headaches and lethargic for a long time. I have the device. That information is in the literature. 

 

From a person who’s been on every one of those drugs, sounds like you’re self medicating meaning you’re reducing one drug while using another to to make you feel better. Doesn’t work that way. Im not a Doctor and neither are you. Maybe you need to look yourself in the mirror and decide how bad you want off these drugs?

 

The moderators have given you great advice. Slow, little by little, one drug at a time. It’s gonna suck. But not as bad if you listen to the moderators. 

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IanM
2 minutes ago, Spideygsm said:

IanM,

 

So you’re taking everything on your list except Lithium which you took every 3 days for 4 months. Then you suddenly stopped taking that? When I took lithium I took it twice per day, got a blood test every two weeks because there’s a small window of range in the blood it’s effects. Just above the top of the range it can be deadly. 

 

No offense brother but I see you’re tinkering with doses, going down and up then down with multiple medications at the same time not giving your body any chance to adjust to anything. Plus if you use the PEMF device at too high a power and too long, it can make you extremely dizzy and headaches and lethargic for a long time. I have the device. That information is in the literature. 

 

From a person who’s been on every one of those drugs, sounds like you’re self medicating meaning you’re reducing one drug while using another to to make you feel better. Doesn’t work that way. Im not a Doctor and neither are you. Maybe you need to look yourself in the mirror and decide how bad you want off these drugs?

 

The moderators have given you great advice. Slow, little by little, one drug at a time. It’s gonna suck. But not as bad if you listen to the moderators. 

 

Hi Spidey. I am not taking everything on my list, as can be seen in the last entry. I am only taking seroquel. Also, it's not lithium I took, but extremely low dose lithium orotate, an OTC form of lithium. And Inositol is just a B vitamin (or so they say).

 

I knew perfectly well I was taking a chance taking these things, and I'm now paying the price. I just wanted to document it here, as perhaps a warning to others (but I'm not one to tell others what they should or shouldn't do, either...each person should decide for themselves what things they want to try to make life more bearable during WD, and this site is superb for helping to make such decisions).

 

Take care...

 

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Spideygsm

IanM,

 

If the hospital just CT’d you off off the drugs listed on March 13, 2020. No wonder you feel like Crap. It took me 60 days of hell getting off Klonopin itself. 
 

Ride it out, stay strong. Your medication list is confusing to me. But none of us feel like doing one anyway. Good luck

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IanM
8 minutes ago, Spideygsm said:

IanM,

 

If the hospital just CT’d you off off the drugs listed on March 13, 2020. No wonder you feel like Crap. It took me 60 days of hell getting off Klonopin itself. 
 

Ride it out, stay strong. Your medication list is confusing to me. But none of us feel like doing one anyway. Good luck

 

The hospital cold-turkeyed me about 10 months ago, and I agreed to do 10 rounds of ECT right after that, then they put me on seroquel. I have been on seroquel for about 9.5 months. 

 

The drugs they cold-turkeyed were:

 

Olanzapine (for sure)

Klonopin (for sure)

Gabapentin (for sure)

Lamotrigine (I think)

 

I believe I am still suffering the effects of that cold-turkeying.

 

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manymoretodays
On 3/15/2020 at 5:35 PM, IanM said:

I believe I am still suffering the effects of that cold-turkeying.

 

Hi IanM,

Okay good job on the signature update. 

I see 18.75 mg of Seroquel, as your only medication now.

Any improvement since the 15th of March, when you stopped the Lithium oratate?

 

On 3/15/2020 at 1:53 PM, IanM said:

I also want to say that I used a PEMF device (magnetic pulser) on my head twice a day for probably 10 days, all while taking the above supplements. Any or all of it could have caused my deterioration.

 

Oh, and something else... 

For three days in a row, I went outside for short walks and bike rides, 30 minutes and 10 minutes, respectively, and I believe that made me way worse, too (in fact, I know it did). Troubling.

 

On the exercise, here's what we've got:

Exercise.....Do more, do less, do nothing? What worked for you?

 

If you can, go ahead and do the simple list or daily notes for us:

And so forth. A diary, in chronological order, looking something like this:
 
6 a.m. Woke with anxiety
8 a.m. Took 2.5mg Lexapro
10 a.m. Stomach is upset
10:30 a.m. Ate breakfast
11:35 a.m. Got a headache, lasted one hour
12:35 p.m. Ate lunch
4 p.m. Feel a bit better
5 p.m. Took 2.5mg Lexapro
6 p.m. Ate dinner
9:20 p.m. Headache
10:00 p.m. Took 50mg Seroquel
10:20 p.m. Feeling dizzy
10:30 p.m. Fell asleep
2:30 a.m. Woke, took 3mg Ambien (NOT "took 1/2 tablet Ambien")
2:45 a.m. Fell asleep
4:30 a.m. Woke but got back to sleep

 

Take a look at the first post, in that link too.  Something might stand out.  Include your Omega 3's and Magnesium, and sleep, as well as any other supplements.

And yes, unfortunately, recovery from ECT ,and all the drugs, and then some of your other trials, may take some time.  Be patient with yourself  and look for improvements in symptoms too.  Hoping that there are some.

 

Best, L, P, H, and G,

mmt

 

 

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IanM
On 3/23/2020 at 12:44 PM, manymoretodays said:

 

Hi IanM,

Okay good job on the signature update. 

I see 18.75 mg of Seroquel, as your only medication now.

Any improvement since the 15th of March, when you stopped the Lithium oratate?

 

 

On the exercise, here's what we've got:

Exercise.....Do more, do less, do nothing? What worked for you?

 

If you can, go ahead and do the simple list or daily notes for us:

And so forth. A diary, in chronological order, looking something like this:
 
6 a.m. Woke with anxiety
8 a.m. Took 2.5mg Lexapro
10 a.m. Stomach is upset
10:30 a.m. Ate breakfast
11:35 a.m. Got a headache, lasted one hour
12:35 p.m. Ate lunch
4 p.m. Feel a bit better
5 p.m. Took 2.5mg Lexapro
6 p.m. Ate dinner
9:20 p.m. Headache
10:00 p.m. Took 50mg Seroquel
10:20 p.m. Feeling dizzy
10:30 p.m. Fell asleep
2:30 a.m. Woke, took 3mg Ambien (NOT "took 1/2 tablet Ambien")
2:45 a.m. Fell asleep
4:30 a.m. Woke but got back to sleep

 

Take a look at the first post, in that link too.  Something might stand out.  Include your Omega 3's and Magnesium, and sleep, as well as any other supplements.

And yes, unfortunately, recovery from ECT ,and all the drugs, and then some of your other trials, may take some time.  Be patient with yourself  and look for improvements in symptoms too.  Hoping that there are some.

 

Best, L, P, H, and G,

mmt

 

 

 

Thanks, manymoretodays. I will endeavour to provide a journal, but find it too difficult right now.

 

And I just got hit with a new thing to add to the misery: I have shingles. Very painful, as other victims can attest to. I am taking an anti-viral in the hopes that it will prevent long term complications. I'll deal with side effects when/if they occur.

 

My symptoms are convincing enough to two doctors, diagnosed over the phone with emailed photos of the rash, but I also have a symptom that is not normal for shingles, and that is explosive diarrhea. I may need a trip to emergency if that doesn't clear up soon (it's been 3 days).

 

There is something positive that may come out of this, but I'm waiting several more days before I talk about it, just to be sure to be sure.

 

I hope everyone is staying covid-19-free, and take care all.

 

 

 

 

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IanM
11 hours ago, IanM said:

There is something positive that may come out of this, but I'm waiting several more days before I talk about it, just to be sure to be sure.

 

OK, I can safely say that the 'positive' thing is a bust.

 

My symptoms of sickness started 5 days ago, beginning with severe, sharp pain in the area of my descending colon and accompanied by explosive diarrhea. I immediately put myself on a clear liquids-only diet and maintained that through till today. During this 'fast', I felt remarkably better mentally, so I was hoping that a dramatic diet change going forward would really help WD, but alas, as of today, I'm back to bad WD symptoms.

 

Oh well, I just hope I don't wind up in hospital due to severe shingles symptoms now.

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manymoretodays
Posted (edited)

Oh IanM,

So sorry to hear about the shingles.

Have the GI symptoms gotten any better.? Hoping you can move into the BRATTY diet and tolerate it now.  That's what we used to use with babies and very young children when they got the gastroenteritis.  B- bananas, R- cooked rice, or rice pudding, A- applesauce, T- weak tea,  T- dry toast,  and Y- yogurt.  And then the clear fluids as well.  You don't want to get dehydrated now.

 

Well, I'm glad you felt mentally better for a bit.

And yes, no hospital would be good.

 

We do have a topic, and members experiences with Shingles, and so I'll share that link with you now:

Anyone had shingles, postherpetic pain, shingles vaccine?

^ has some good information and ideas for coping in it

 

12 hours ago, IanM said:

I am taking an anti-viral in the hopes that it will prevent long term complications. I'll deal with side effects when/if they occur.

Are you doing okay with the Acyclovir or equivalent medication?  When did you start it?  I did check Drugs.com for interactions with your Seroquel and there were none reported so that's good.  More about your drug and side effects, can also be found there.  Just plug in the name of your drug in the top box there.

I did see GI symptoms listed as a side effect.

 

And oh IanM,  sounds tough and painful to boot!  Keep us updated please.  Think of what you have already gotten through, to date.  You can get through this.  Still.......seems so unfair.

 

Best, L, P, H, and G,

mmt

 

Doing okay here, with the Covid19 precautions, and restrictions.  Hope everyone else is doing okay too.

Edited by manymoretodays
grammar, spelling

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IanM
1 hour ago, manymoretodays said:

Oh IanM,

So sorry to hear about the shingles.

Have the GI symptoms gotten any better.?

 

Unfortunately, GI symptoms have not improved, and if they continue I may need hospital visit. I did find one web site that said GI trouble is possible with shingles, including diarrhea.

 

1 hour ago, manymoretodays said:

 

Hoping you can move into the BRATTY diet and tolerate it now.  That's what we used to use with babies and very young children when they got the gastroenteritis.  B- bananas, R- cooked rice, or rice pudding, A- applesauce, T- weak tea,  T- dry toast,  and Y- yogurt.  And then the clear fluids as well.  You don't want to get dehydrated now.

 

My plan is to go on The Specific Carb Diet when I'm able as it helped my gut immensely several years ago. Sadly, many of the BRATTY menu items are forbidden on SCD.

 

1 hour ago, manymoretodays said:

We do have a topic, and members experiences with Shingles, and so I'll share that link with you now:

Anyone had shingles, postherpetic pain, shingles vaccine?

^ has some good information and ideas for coping in it

 

Thanks for the link...I actually found it and read it yesterday.

 

1 hour ago, manymoretodays said:

Are you doing okay with the Acyclovir or equivalent medication?  When did you start it?  I did check Drugs.com for interactions with your Seroquel and there were none reported so that's good.  More about your drug and side effects, can also be found there.  Just plug in the name of your drug in the top box there.

I did see GI symptoms listed as a side effect.

 

I am taking Famciclovir, three doses so far, and best I can tell, no side effects yet.

 

Thanks much.

 

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Altostrata

I'm so sorry about the shingles, Ian. Please do let us know how you're doing.

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IanM
14 hours ago, Altostrata said:

I'm so sorry about the shingles, Ian. Please do let us know how you're doing.

 

Thanks so much, AS.

 

It's 2:51am here and I'm lying awake -- not unusual in and of itself, but now I have the added bonus of shingles pain. 

 

I had appendicitis several years ago and thought the pain from that was bad, but it pales in comparison to shingles pain. I was warned it would hurt, but I wasn't prepared for this.

 

But I've taken an extra strength Tylenol and I'm pretty sure it will help. Also, I'm hanging on to the knowledge that day time will bring some relief, something that most shingles victims will attest to... night time is way worse for some reason.

 

Sorry for the downer post...i just needed a distraction, however brief, while the Tylenol works its way into my veins 🙂.

 

Actually, I just realized that the Dr. Ho I applied to the base of my spine just before starting this post has reduced the pain a fair bit. Or maybe it's just the act of typing that's helping? Either way, it's good.

 

Take care, all.

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IanM

Hi all. A brief update on my WD and shingles...

 

Well, I was warned by many that shingles would be painful, and they weren't wrong. It's pretty miserable. And while the rash is starting to resolve, along with the diarrhea (thank goodness), the pain is actually going the other way and getting much worse. I'm taking Tylenol occasionally, but it's really not doing much now that the pain has ramped up.

 

I made it through the 7-day course of antiviral (famvir), seemingly with no side effects, but a day after I stopped, I fell into a crushing depression that's still with me. Who knows if it's related to seroquel WD, the antiviral drug, the shingles virus itself, or the shingles pain (although I'm doing well at ignoring the pain and am mostly able to find a comfortable position to lie/sit that minimizes it).

 

Anyway, I hope you're all doing OK amidst this covid thing, or at the very least, coping.

 

Take care.

 

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Altostrata

Very sorry you have to cope with this, Ian. It's possible the antiviral had some interaction with your drugs. If you're curious, you might find it in the Drug Interactions Checker https://www.drugs.com/drug_interactions.php

 

Hang in there. Drug reactions tend to go away in a week or so.

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IanM
5 hours ago, Altostrata said:

Very sorry you have to cope with this, Ian. It's possible the antiviral had some interaction with your drugs. If you're curious, you might find it in the Drug Interactions Checker https://www.drugs.com/drug_interactions.php

 

Hang in there. Drug reactions tend to go away in a week or so.

 

Thanks, AS. I checked for interactions before I began the antiviral, and nothing showed up. But that isn't always reliable for those of us in withdrawal, I believe.

 

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Altostrata

Antibiotics often can have unexpected adverse effects. Many people here have experienced this.

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IanM

Just a quick note to say that I am holding at 18.75mg of seroquel until the shingles has resolved, which as I understand it, is anywhere from 1 to 3 months. I'm currently at the 14 day mark, so I have a ways to go yet (and I pray I don't end up with permanent pain, as a lot of shingles victims do).

 

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