Ahms: antidepressants hell

[Ahms]

I have been on citalopram since 2009 then it stopped working. The Dr put me on citalopram and mirtazapine combination which worked for a while then that stopped working. The Dr then put me on mirtazapine and Venlafaxine 150mg XL combination which workes for a while again ans then stopped working. The Dr put me on amitriptyline 50mg saying thay would be the best drug for me while i took 8 months to slowly remove each bead from Venlafaxine capsule to come off it.

 

As soon as I took my last beed i went into crazy angry depression.

 

The dr increased my dosage of amitriptyline from 50mg to 150mg but the side effects were horrible and at this point i got sick of these meds and decided to quit CT. I had horrible withdrawal symptoms and i started acting like a child and not being able to walk, had balance problems.

 

I reinstated back to 50mg amitriptyline since april 2018 and i have been getting worse. I cannot sleep. My vision is so badly affected that i have grainy vision and floaters have increased dramatically . I see after images and it's as if the lights have been turned off. When i begin to fall asleep, i start to have dreams before i actually fall asleep and my brain keep. Waking up just before i am about to sleep. I cannot follow conversations, I mishear things all the time.

 

I am totally dependant on others and i feel people think i have gone crazy. I don't know what to do i am getting worse and worse. I often trip, lose my balance. I hardly have any short term memory and cannot do simplest of things. I cannot even watch anything on TV as i cannot follow.it

 

I'm having major concentration problems. I don't know how. I'm writing this. I cannot work or drive. Please you have no idea how i am putting these sentences together. I need urgent help. Please advice. I have no energy, no appetite. If I'm posting this in the wrong place, please accept my appology as I can hardly read and understand things. P

Edited May 29, 2018 by Petunia
added paragraphs and tags

[Petunia]

Welcome Ahms,

I'm so sorry you are going through this. I know how awful it is, I was exactly the same after I had tapered off lexapro too fast. I completely relate to all the symptoms you describe and the getting worse part. I also got worse before I got better.

 

How long was it before you reinstated back to 50mg of amitriptyline? Are you still taking Mirtazapine? I know you are having problems with concentrating, but would you have a go at putting your drug and withdrawal history in your signature. It appears below each of your posts and helps us to help you by providing a clear picture of your history. Here are instructions for how to do it:

 

Please put your withdrawal history in your signature

 

It sounds like your nervous system is severely destabilized, but I don't know if its because of venlafaxine withdrawal or because of the recent dose changes, ct and then reinstatement of amitriptyline, or a combination of everything.

 

You will recover once you are able to stabilize, but until we have a better understanding of your recent history, its difficult to know what to suggest. I wouldn't make any changes for now, but keep notes of your symptom pattern. Here is some information about how to do it:  Rate symptoms daily to track patterns and progress

 

The best I can offer by way of advice is to listen to your body and avoid those things that set off symptoms as much as possible. Aside from a high quality fish oil and magnesium, avoid supplements. (See King of Supplements: Omega 3 Fatty Acids (Fish Oil) and Magnesium, Nature's Calcium Channel Blocker). They've been helpful to many of us. 

 

Here is the link to our symptoms and self care section, you may find some useful ideas to help manage symptoms as you recover.  Especially read the topics pinned at the top.

 

You will get better, but it may take some time. When we have a few more details, we will be in a better position to offer support and suggestions.

 

Petunia.

[PoetJester]

Hi Ahms,

 

i have the dreaming before i actually fall asleep, too.  they are called hypnagogic hallucinations.  i believe depression and sleep deprivation cause them.  i get them every time i have withdrawn form psych meds.  they are terrible and maddening and cause more sleep deprivation so it ends up being a vicious cycle.  mine are usually about walking down a dark road or walking up to the edge of a deep, deep hole.  one time, i dreamed i was walking down a road and a truck with headlights was coming right for me.  i have to pull myself awake after only a minute or so of sleep even though i am exhausted.  they start about 30 seconds after closing my eyes.

 

Poetjester

[Petunia]

8 hours ago, PoetJester said:

i have the dreaming before i actually fall asleep, too.  they are called hypnagogic hallucinations.  i believe depression and sleep deprivation cause them.  i get them every time i have withdrawn form psych meds. 

 

Yes, I've had these too, they are actually not uncommon in the general population and one study showed that about 25% of people will experience them at one time in their life. I got them frequently in early stages of withdrawal. The cause is unknown, but they do seem to be related to sleep deprivation and changes in brain function for various reasons. Nothing to worry about, they can't hurt you and will go away in time.

[Ahms]

I am still struggling really badly. Having visual snow and after images with a lot of floaters and I feel my vision doesn't keep still. I'm really depressed. A lot of other symptoms.

 

What should i do? Should i still keep taking amitriptyline at 50mg? Could amitriptyline at 50mg be causing all this? I can hardly sleep. As soon as I am falling asleep my brain all of a sudden becomes active and wakes me up then i start getting palpitations and become really anxious. While I am dosing off to sleep, a little noise made by someone else wakes me up and it feels really loud than it actually is.

 

It's really hard to explain what I am going through. I am getting knee pain and generally always so tired. Is this brain damage? Will I ever recover? I constantly have thoughts about suicide. I have been suggested to take vortioxetine by the Dr but I don't want to take it considering all the damage psych drugs have caused me. I feel my face, bite and gait has been distorted. I don't feel the same person anymore. I feel as if my personality, my beliefs, my memory has been erased.

 

I am sorry I still can't create a signature. Please give me some time to do that. 

Edited June 10, 2018 by SkyBlue
added paragraph breaks

[SkyBlue]

On 5/29/2018 at 4:50 AM, Petunia said:

How long was it before you reinstated back to 50mg of amitriptyline? Are you still taking Mirtazapine? I know you are having problems with concentrating, but would you have a go at putting your drug and withdrawal history in your signature. It appears below each of your posts and helps us to help you by providing a clear picture of your history. Here are instructions for how to do it:

 

Please put your withdrawal history in your signature

 

It sounds like your nervous system is severely destabilized, but I don't know if its because of venlafaxine withdrawal or because of the recent dose changes, ct and then reinstatement of amitriptyline, or a combination of everything.

 

You said that you need more time to create a drug signature. I can understand that, but please know that we really can't move forward with recommendations until we know the information that Petunia mentioned, above.

 

Maybe someone near you would be willing to help you put a signature together. 

[Ahms]

Hi. I didn't take any amitriptyline for about 5 days when started having severe withdrawal symptoms. Reinstated at 50mg on 8 April 2018. Thats the only psychotropic drug I am taking. I am not taking mirtazapine. I have tried to create a signature to the best of my knowledge and memory. 

[Altostrata]

Welcome, Ahms.

 

Do you have any venlafaxine left? When you were tapering venlafaxine, what was your tapering schedule? Did you have any withdrawal symptoms while you were tapering venlafaxine?

[Ahms]

13 hours ago, Altostrata said:

Welcome, Ahms.

 

Do you have any venlafaxine left? When you were tapering venlafaxine, what was your tapering schedule? Did you have any withdrawal symptoms while you were tapering venlafaxine?

Hi Altostrata. I don't have any Venlafaxine left. I didnt know about 10% taper that time. Basically Venlafaxine 150mg had 12 pellets/beads in a capsule. I removed one bead each two weeks and took the rest. I did have a lot of depression and anxiety while coming off it but I had no idea at the time that it was withdrawal which I have come to know now. My situation is pretty desperate and I feel there is hardly any point in carrying on with life being disabled like this. 

[Altostrata]

What time of day do you take amitriptyline? What is your symptom pattern in the hours after you take it?

 

My guess is you're suffering from Effexor withdrawal syndrome, which the amitriptyline is not treating. Taking a little Effexor might help. Can you get immediate-release venlafaxine or is it all extended-release in the UK?

[Ahms]

How much of Venlafaxine extended release should I take. Considering its been 3 months since I last took it. 

On 6/13/2018 at 12:08 AM, Altostrata said:

What time of day do you take amitriptyline? What is your symptom pattern in the hours after you take it?

 

My guess is you're suffering from Effexor withdrawal syndrome, which the amitriptyline is not treating. Taking a little Effexor might help. Can you get immediate-release venlafaxine or is it all extended-release in the UK?

[Ahms]

On 6/13/2018 at 12:08 AM, Altostrata said:

What time of day do you take amitriptyline? What is your symptom pattern in the hours after you take it?

 

My guess is you're suffering from Effexor withdrawal syndrome, which the amitriptyline is not treating. Taking a little Effexor might help. Can you get immediate-release venlafaxine or is it all extended-release in the UK?

Hello again Altostrata. How much of Venlafaxine extended release should I take? Considering its been 3 months since I last took it. 

[Altostrata]

I would take 6 beads out of a 37.5mg capsule, if you can get the type that contains a lot of little beads. See what that does.

[Ahms]

On 6/28/2018 at 2:33 AM, Altostrata said:

I would take 6 beads out of a 37.5mg capsule, if you can get the type that contains a lot of little beads. See what that does.

 

Hi Altostrata. Have you heard of visual snow getting better or totally improving? 

On 6/28/2018 at 2:33 AM, Altostrata said:

 

On 6/28/2018 at 2:33 AM, Altostrata said:

 

[Altostrata]

Have you tried the 6 beads?

 

See our Symptoms and Self-care forum for discussions about specific symptoms.

 

[Ahms]

Hi Altostrata. I tried it but it didn't help much. My visual snow is really bad. Is it permanent? 

[Altostrata]

How long did you take 6 beads?

 

I don't know anything about the vision problem, cannot predict recovery.

[Ahms]

About 5 days

[Altostrata]

What happened when you took 6 beads? It takes at least 4 days for the drug to reach steady-state in your bloodstream. Do you think you gave it enough time?

[Ahms]

I didn't notice any improvement in my symptoms

[ChessieCat]

On 8/6/2018 at 5:05 AM, Ahms said:

Has anyone recovered from problems with vision especially visual snow? 

 

I've moved your posts to an existing discussion on this topic:  vision-symptoms-floaters-snow-blurreddimmed-vision-twitching-and-pain

[Ahms]

I withdrew from Venlafaxine around about in March 2018. I was already on 50mg amitriptyline at that time and my dose was increased from 50mg to 150mg in April 2018 over 2 weeks. I couldn't tolerate the side effects so I quit cold turkey and didn't take any amitriptyline for 5 days. I developed severe withdrawal symptoms which I think was because of Venlafaxine withdrawal rather than the amitriptyline. I reinstated back to 50mg amitriptyline. It took me 3 months to stabilise. My biggest problem now is visual snow. I tried reinstating low dose vanlafaxine to see if it will help my visual snow/static but it didn't. I am already taking omega 3 and magnesium. Can anyone suggest anything else? Should I increase my dose of amitriptyline to see if my visual snow goes away? Please advise as I am suffering big time. 

[Ahms]

Please help. I am desperate regarding my visual symptoms. I am seeing visual snow/static and everything is fuzzy also getting a lot of after images. It all started when I came off Venlafaxine. Should I try re-instating Venlafaxine again at a higher dose than what I tried? Considering it's been about 5 months since I stopped taking venlafaxine. 

[Altostrata]

Hello, Ahms. How are you doing?

[Ahms]

On 1/9/2019 at 11:39 PM, Altostrata said:

Hello, Ahms. How are you doing?

Hi Altostrata. I'm a lot better since my initial post, thanks. I was in severe Venlafaxine withdrawal. I still have visual snow caused by that along with palinopsia, nyctalopia, excessive floaters, BFEP and bilateral tinnitus. The biochemical mess in my brain gave me visual snow syndrome which is a bit like HPPD but in my case it was caused by psychiatric meds. I have a tonne of other neurological and physical symptoms. It's been 10 months since I last took the last pellet of Venlafaxine and I'm still suffering. I did try to reintroduce it in the middle where I took a very small amount Venlafaxine for 4 days or so but it didn't help. I want to ask if it's too late to reintroduce it again. I personally want to be off that horrible drug forever but my VS and physical symptoms are bad even though they have improved a lot over months. I have tremors, balance problems, myoclonus type involuntary jerking of both arms.

 

I didn't know about the 10% taper at that time but I did taper 150mg Venlafaxine XR over 7-8 months. I didn't know it was withdrawl. I made a big mistake when I tried to CT Amitriptyline during Venlafaxine withdrawal. I was taking 50mg amitriptyline already and my psychiatrist increased it to 200mg during Venlafaxine withdrawal. He didn't recognise Venlafaxine withdrawal. I titrated amitriptyline to 200mg over 2 weeks and then because I wasn't getting better and had severe side effects from such a large dose, I got frustrated by the damage these drugs caused me and I tried to CT it completely. Very bad idea! My whole nervous system got shocked and destabilised about 3 times in a short period of time. First from the initial Venlafaxine withdrawal, then from titration of Amitriptyline to 200mg during intense Venlafaxine withdrawal and then trying to CT Amitriptyline. I only CT amitriptyline for 5 days and I got much worse so I went back to 50mg amitriptyline which I was initially tolerating but I went into a tail spin where I was bed bound for 4 months, crying openly all the time. I could hardly walk or do any cognitive task. I didn't have to concentration to read a single simple sentence and understand it and I couldn't follow conversations or watch TV because I couldn't follow it. My eyes would uncontrollably shake sideways when I closed them and that wouldn't let me sleep. I had intense dp/dr. My brain wouldn't let me sleep, as soon as I would start to feel asleep, my brain would suddenly wake me up by jerking my whole body and then my heart would pound and I would have panic attacks which I never had in my life up until that point. I had a lot of other intense disabling symptoms. 

 

I know everyone is different but I want to ask how long will it take me for to fully recover from this? I was put on haloperidol to stabalise me by another doctor even though I am not psychotic nor bi-polar. I was only on a small dose which I have stopped after a slow taper recently. I am still taking 50mg amitriptyline but I don't know when i should start tapering it as I want to be off this poison too eventually. My current symptoms which I can remember at the moment are visual snow, palinopsia, nyctalopia, excessive floaters, BFEP, head pressure, balance problems, dp/dr, tremors, myclonus like jerks which last for 10 minutes or so when I get a full on attack. Please don't move this post to the visual symptoms category as I have other symptoms apart from vision problems, as mentioned here. Please advise. 

[Altostrata]

7 minutes ago, Ahms said:

I still have visual snow caused by that along with palinopsia, nyctalopia, excessive floaters, BFEP and bilateral tinnitus. The biochemical mess in my brain gave me visual snow syndrome which is a bit like HPPD but in my case it was caused by psychiatric meds.

 

Please define all these medical terms so our community will understand what you're saying.

 

Which symptoms have gotten better since August and which have gotten worse?

 

Unfortunately, we can't predict how long it will take for anyone to recover. Are you still taking 50mg amitriptyline? Do you feel better after you take it each day?

[Ahms]

20 minutes ago, Altostrata said:

 

Please define all these medical terms so our community will understand what you're saying.

 

Which symptoms have gotten better since August and which have gotten worse?

 

Unfortunately, we can't predict how long it will take for anyone to recover. Are you still taking 50mg amitriptyline? Do you feel better after you take it each day?

Visual snow is seeing millions of tiny static like dots across the whole field of vision like an out of tune old TV set. I have visual snow since April, 2018 - around the time I stopped venlafaxine and reduced amitriptyline dose. Please see the visual snow simulation on the link below to give you a better idea, how my vision is now:

 

https://visionsimulations.com/visual-snow.htm?background=office1.png

 

Palinopsia = after images. Nyctalopia = impaired vision in the dark. BFEP = blue field entoptic phenomenon. When I look at the bright clear sky during the day, I see a lot of squiggly dots moving about. Normal people bave BFEP too but in people with VS, it's more pronounced. I also see a a lot of halos and starbursts around lights. My vision is always fuzzy due to visual snow - as if it's foggy or there is mist in the air. I have had my eyes checked and they are absolutely fine. Visual snow is a neurological condition. 

 

Well my cognitive function and sleep have definitely improved. I can work now and do most things I used to do. My vision has gone worse in terms of visual snow syndrome. Visual snow syndrome is my biggest problems at the moment as its seriously affecting my quality of life. My balance problems, tremors, myclonus have improved but these symptoms are still there. Yes, I'm still taking 50mg Amitriptyline. It helps with sleep sometimes but it's hit and miss. I guess it's keeping the depression at bay but I have lost faith in psychiatric meds. Is it true that they cause brain damage? And if so, is that damage permanent? 

[thecowisback]

how is yoir vision now? have you seen any improvements at all?

[Ahms]

On 1/17/2019 at 6:22 PM, Altostrata said:

 

Please define all these medical terms so our community will understand what you're saying.

 

Which symptoms have gotten better since August and which have gotten worse?

 

Unfortunately, we can't predict how long it will take for anyone to recover. Are you still taking 50mg amitriptyline? Do you feel better after you take it each day?

 

Hi Altostrata or other mem3. I need your urgent help please. I have been taking amitriptyline 50mg for a while. Now on Sunday 21st April, I took an overdose of Amitriptyline 1400mg. I was brought to hospital and obviously haven't been given any amitriptyline. It's 24th April now and I still haven't taken any amitriptyline. Please advise what dose and when to start taking amitriptyline to avoid both overdosing and withdrawal symptoms. Please note I only have 50mg amitriptyline tablets l. Your advice will be much appreciated. 

[brassmonkey]

Hi Ahms-  I'm sorry to hear about your recent trip to the ER.  An overdose of this medication can have very sever and long lasting affects on a persons body.  To start taking the medication again in an unsupervised manner is not a good idea.  It would be best to work with your doctor as to when, if and how much should be restarted.  Your doctor has all the current information on the how, why and results of the overdose, which we are not privy to.  For SA to give recommendations on restarting this drug after an overdose would not be wise for you or us.  I can only suggest that you work with your doctor on this matter.

[WiggleIt]

Hi Ahms,

I'm sorry to hear about your recent ER visit, and I think brassmonkey is spot-on.  Do you have a follow-up visit scheduled with your doctor? 

[Monty95]

Hi Ahms,

 

I think you may be in the effexor support group on facebook? If so, you've been kind enough to offer me some reassurance and advice on a couple of occasions, which has stayed with me and helped me to remain somewhat hopeful in a very dark period, for which I'm very thankful. I just wanted to say my thoughts are with you at the moment and I recognise that none of this is easy, that you're not alone in your suffering. I hope you have a strong support network around you and can rely on your doctor to guide you through this crisis. I'm glad you're receiving medical care and are as okay as you can be after this traumatic event; you are valued. I believe this can get better with time. Please feel free to send me a message if you're ever in need of a friend or just want to vent to somebody who understands.

 

Hang in there,

 

Michelle.

[Ahms]

15 hours ago, brassmonkey said:

Hi Ahms-  I'm sorry to hear about your recent trip to the ER.  An overdose of this medication can have very sever and long lasting affects on a persons body.  To start taking the medication again in an unsupervised manner is not a good idea.  It would be best to work with your doctor as to when, if and how much should be restarted.  Your doctor has all the current information on the how, why and results of the overdose, which we are not privy to.  For SA to give recommendations on restarting this drug after an overdose would not be wise for you or us.  I can only suggest that you work with your doctor on this matter.

Well the doctor might stop amitriptyline and put me on another antidepressant but then I will have withdrawls from amitriptyline. I don't want to take any other psychiatric medication. Also, given how the doctors have messed my brain up with psychiatric meds, how can I ever trust them about withdrawals and overdoses etc. 

[brassmonkey]

2 hours ago, Ahms said:

Well the doctor might stop amitriptyline and put me on another antidepressant but then I will have withdrawls from amitriptyline. I don't want to take any other psychiatric medication.

 

That's a very real possibility.  Because of the overdose your body is quite likely to be kindled and taking any more amitriptyline could cause you some real problems that go way beyond just WD.  Liver and kidney problems, and heart attack are just a few of the possible results and they need to be monitored on the ground by a doctor, not second guessed on line by people who don't have all the information.  You'll have to work out the new medication with your doctor, he may let you stay on the amitriptyline or he may want you to change to something else, you'll have to negotiate that with him.

 

SA is a forum of peer support for getting off of psych drugs and this situation is well out of the realm of our expertise and experience.  We do not have and can not get all the information required to make this sort of call.  The situation calls for daily monitoring of a lot of health issues that just can't be done on line.  I'm truly sorry that you've found yourself in this situation, but for the time being you'll have to try and trust your doctor.

[Ahms]

On 4/25/2019 at 12:13 PM, Monty95 said:

Hi Ahms,

 

I think you may be in the effexor support group on facebook? If so, you've been kind enough to offer me some reassurance and advice on a couple of occasions, which has stayed with me and helped me to remain somewhat hopeful in a very dark period, for which I'm very thankful. I just wanted to say my thoughts are with you at the moment and I recognise that none of this is easy, that you're not alone in your suffering. I hope you have a strong support network around you and can rely on your doctor to guide you through this crisis. I'm glad you're receiving medical care and are as okay as you can be after this traumatic event; you are valued. I believe this can get better with time. Please feel free to send me a message if you're ever in need of a friend or just want to vent to somebody who understands.

 

Hang in there,

 

Michelle.

Thank you Michelle but I pretty much am alone so if I were to get really ill or have severe withdrawals, there will be no one coming to help me. 

[shawny]

I’m really sorry  

 

i hate it for all the stuff the doctor s do  

they have no clue Wat they are doin to ppl like us !

 

i hope they also take the same tablet we take to go theu it  

 

 

one thing I feel where u have been suffering is due to polydrug n it’s no fault o urs  

 

i have bedn on such such low doze n suffering I can imagine ur state  

 

 

i had initially when ur brain wakes up as soon u r about to sleep for quiet some time now I don’t have it .

 

 

the problem with us is we try to solve our problems with drugs but tats not the case with our body  

 

ut can heal in it’s own but only time n patience that is the simple mantra here ! 

 

U said ur snow was better probably when u go off all the drugs it will go 

 

I had grainy vision when I was on amitriptyline it started subsiding 5 months later I stopped the drug ! 

 

 

So we neef wait n have patience I know it’s frustrating cause there is notyn else we can do jus accept n float 

 

prayers to u one day may be a few years later ul remember this phase n thank god u came out fighting like a warrior hold on ! 

 

 

Intell my self tat