Ladybug's Pax-hell Journey

[ladybug]

On 8/22/2017 at 1:28 AM, grandmaD said:

Hi ladybug!  How are you doing these days?  Have you continued to drop or are you still holding?

 

Hi Gran! Yes, I have very cautiously resumed my taper. Because of all the major life changes I had in a short amount of time (and also because I was feeling pretty stable) I did some longer than usual holds. Now that I am working full time I was very wary of doing full 2% drops so eased into it doing half drops. I realized the other day that because I've gotten lower my full drops are now closer to 2.5% than to 2%. Basically, for a couple of years now a full drop for me is going down .002 grams on my digital scale. The lower I go in dose and the higher a percentage this drop becomes, although still very gradually. Anyway, I did a half drop of 1.3% two weeks ago and for once I do believe I'm actually feeling it as I've been in a crappier than usual wave lately. Increased anxiety, feeling twitchy, increased DR, sleep issues, etc. It's basically been a huge reminder for me that healing is not linear and another reminder that stability is a fragile thing and WD is as unpredictable as ever. 

 

On the bright side I did my second weekend trip last month and it went well. I only slept maybe 2 hours the first night but the second night I do believe I got maybe 4-5 which is a HUGE improvement. I would love to one day be well enough to take a trip overseas. Brassmonkey and his adventures around the world gives me hope!

 

In other news, I have recently gotten the opinions of two separate dermatologists for my skin issues and they both agree Accutane is the only option left. This really depresses me as Accutane is one of the few drugs I think is worse than Paxil/ADs! Most people will eventually heal from AD damage, but there are people who took Accutane decades ago who still have terrible issues. On the other hand (like ADs) there are millions who have taken it with minimal issues and it completely cured their acne for life. I've been going back and forth as to what I should do and I wanted to see if anyone on this board had experience with it so I did a search and funny enough I saw a post that I made warning someone on the acne thread to stay far away from it! So it's like my past self is warning my present self lol. My acne really puts me in a bad place psychologically as I'm 37 now and shouldn't have to worry about this crap! I find myself turning down going out with friends because of how I look and I alternate between avoiding mirrors at all costs or looking at one and obsessing sometimes to the point of tears. I really should look into therapy for it as I've read there is such a thing as Acne Dysmorphic Disorder so maybe that's what I have. 

 

Thanks for listening to another novel-length rant of mine! Hope everyone is having a good day or at least coping.

[grandmaD]

Ladybug, it is so good to see you got to being stable, which proves that holds do work.  I can't figure them out either, because during a hold 8 symptoms improve while the other 8 get worse!  I will just see how I go with this hold.  I was dropping by .002g (by weight that is) for some time but then had to drop by .001g also.

 

I hope you continue to cope with your drops and live your life and find some normality in all of this.

 

Like you, I hope to do an overseas trip one day also.  My dad died in 2012 and left me money to do so, and i thought I could do it the next year... and here we are now at 2017!  GRRRRRR!!!  I guess it is a nice aim for us and something to hope for.  That was another reason for switching, because I have been dropping at .5mg per year and at that rate it will be another 7 years and I will be 70!

 

I am sorry about your acne, perhaps therapy will help.  Remember it isn't what you look like on the outside but what you are on the inside, and I can vouch that you are BEAUTIFUL on the inside!!!  That is what is important!  Love you babygirl x

[Cheeky]

Hey ladybug,

just wanting to say hi 😃

I love reading your posts as it gives me  confidence that I too will get down to a small

dose of Paxil eventually.  Your only 38 so you have so much to look forward to in life. Congratulations on getting so low in dose.

[Songbird]

Hi Ladybug!  Good to see your taper progressing well.  Your comment about your skin reminded me that my skin has been a lot better since getting off paroxetine.  My pimples were very cyclical, I got them each month along with terrible PMS.  It's hard to say that paroxetine was definitely responsible as I'm "peri-menopausal" anyway, but I do suspect paroxetine messes with hormones a lot more than citalopram.  Many years ago I knew a guy who took roaccutane for serious acne and it was brilliant for him, it cleared it all up, though he was still left with some scarring.  Your fear about your decision to take it or not reminds me of when I had the steroid injection for my frozen shoulder.  I was worried I would have a bad reaction to the steroid, and I did, and ended up in a mess.  I can't tell you what decision to make, but I will say I think you are right to be cautious.  If you do decide to try it, make sure you are as stable as possible first.

[coldturkmama]

1 hour ago, Songbird said:

Hi Ladybug!  Good to see your taper progressing well.  Your comment about your skin reminded me that my skin has been a lot better since getting off paroxetine.  My pimples were very cyclical, I got them each month along with terrible PMS.  It's hard to say that paroxetine was definitely responsible as I'm "peri-menopausal" anyway, but I do suspect paroxetine messes with hormones a lot more than citalopram.  Many years ago I knew a guy who took roaccutane for serious acne and it was brilliant for him, it cleared it all up, though he was still left with some scarring.  Your fear about your decision to take it or not reminds me of when I had the steroid injection for my frozen shoulder.  I was worried I would have a bad reaction to the steroid, and I did, and ended up in a mess.  I can't tell you what decision to make, but I will say I think you are right to be cautious.  If you do decide to try it, make sure you are as stable as possible first.

 

You could always try going to a naturopathic dr, they can give you things that will help your skin issues. Deficiencies in certain minerals will mess up your skin. 

[ladybug]

On 9/5/2017 at 2:48 AM, Cheeky said:

Hey ladybug,

just wanting to say hi 😃

I love reading your posts as it gives me  confidence that I too will get down to a small

dose of Paxil eventually.  Your only 38 so you have so much to look forward to in life. Congratulations on getting so low in dose.

 

Thank you, Cheeky! It’s crazy that I’ve been doing this whole wd thing for as long as I have, been gradually reducing my dose for almost 10 years now but I’ve  been crazy sensitive. Heck if I can get this far anyone can. You will get there too! ❤️❤️

[ladybug]

On 10/22/2017 at 5:22 AM, Songbird said:

Hi Ladybug!  Good to see your taper progressing well.  Your comment about your skin reminded me that my skin has been a lot better since getting off paroxetine.  My pimples were very cyclical, I got them each month along with terrible PMS.  It's hard to say that paroxetine was definitely responsible as I'm "peri-menopausal" anyway, but I do suspect paroxetine messes with hormones a lot more than citalopram.  Many years ago I knew a guy who took roaccutane for serious acne and it was brilliant for him, it cleared it all up, though he was still left with some scarring.  Your fear about your decision to take it or not reminds me of when I had the steroid injection for my frozen shoulder.  I was worried I would have a bad reaction to the steroid, and I did, and ended up in a mess.  I can't tell you what decision to make, but I will say I think you are right to be cautious.  If you do decide to try it, make sure you are as stable as possible first.

 

Good to see you, Songbird! I missed my fellow turtle so much while you were taking a break and I’m so freaking happy your switch was a success. I know you will do great on your new taper. As for the acne I absolutely believe it’s caused by the taper as I started breaking out when I was 26 which is also when I started my taper. I’m bummed I still have years to go until I’m off this beast so can’t look forward to clear skin anytime soon. Argh!

[ladybug]

On 10/22/2017 at 6:24 AM, coldturkmama said:

 

You could always try going to a naturopathic dr, they can give you things that will help your skin issues. Deficiencies in certain minerals will mess up your skin. 

I would love to if this was something as simple as a mineral issue. I hope to be able to finally start addressing some health issues when I get insurance. Thanks for the advice.

[ladybug]

Time for an update! 

As far as my continuing skin issues I was sooo close to starting the process for getting Accutane and then chickened out at the last moment because I figured I must be crazy to be considering a drug that seems even worse than Paxil and might compromise my fragile stability. I just read way too many horror stories of people getting permanent anhedonia, depression, panic attacks, autoimmune diseases, and even psychosis! I’ve made another appt. to see if we can try anything else and sadly the acne has affected my so negatively psychologically that I’m still considering it if we can’t find an alternative.

 

In other “omg should I be doing this” news, I’ve started going to they gym again for the first time since my last crash. I’ve been so scared of doing anything that can possibly compromise my stability but at the same time it can’t be good for me to be so out of shape. I’m fortunate to be naturally thin but boy do I have a gut and also little to no muscle tone. Hahaha. So it’s been nice to be working on that even though I do notice it can ramp up my anxiety a bit afterwards and I make sure not to work out too hard or too late in the day as I’m still having sleep issues since I tried that pill for my acne. My menstrual cycle has also been affected which is crazy because I was only on it for 6 days. Safe to say I’m still crazy sensitive to anything that messes with my hormones, even spearmint tea and vitamin d cause me a lot of issues. Ugh.

 

And in the most major news, we’ve had a big shakeup at work and half of my dept was let go, including the woman I was brought on to assist meaning I will now be doing her position along with other responsibilities and since it came out of left field I didn’t have time to got trained in everything she does. Needless to say I’m freaking out and of course it all happens shortly after my last drop (I have no idea how to update my signature in my phone but I dropped to 4.2 a few weeks ago.) For the first time since I’ve started I’m actually dreading going to work because I just don’t know how I’m going to handle it all. My whole thing when I was returning to work is that I didn’t want a position with a lot of stress and where people were depending on me. It eased my anxiety to think that I could just leave if my WD got too bad. On the other hand, I’m in my late 30s and my work trajectory has already been so compromised by crashes and WD that I’m not where I feel someone at my age “should” be in their career. So the part of me that yearns to be normal is excited that I will be getting a promotion, going from hourly to salary+benefits, my own office, etc. but the anxious part of my brain goes “now here is where WD will mess it all up for you...” All I can do is try my best I suppose, what happens will happen. Hoping for the best.

Thanks for listening, hope everyone is doing well or at least coping today. ❤️

[coldturkmama]

6 hours ago, ladybug said:

I would love to if this was something as simple as a mineral issue. I hope to be able to finally start addressing some health issues when I get insurance. Thanks for the advice.

 

 

I hope it's Ann easy fix!

my skin was horrible while on Paxil and looked nasty for the first two years off and now even tho I'm almost 38, I loveee my skin and how it's looking these days. I don't even break out around my period anymore. I take a lot of vitamins and minerals.  

[ladybug]

44 minutes ago, coldturkmama said:

 

 

I hope it's Ann easy fix!

my skin was horrible while on Paxil and looked nasty for the first two years off and now even tho I'm almost 38, I loveee my skin and how it's looking these days. I don't even break out around my period anymore. I take a lot of vitamins and minerals.  

 

That’s awesome! I’m almost 38 too. My skin used to be perfection so it’s really hard to accept that it will never be that again because even I mange to find a cure I am permanently scarred. It’s very depressing. No one with good skin can understand the terrible toll it can take on your self esteem and mental well being. 

[coldturkmama]

19 minutes ago, ladybug said:

 

That’s awesome! I’m almost 38 too. My skin used to be perfection so it’s really hard to accept that it will never be that again because even I mange to find a cure I am permanently scarred. It’s very depressing. No one with good skin can understand the terrible toll it can take on your self esteem and mental well being. 

 

I understand! It sucks!

[Songbird]

13 hours ago, ladybug said:

the part of me that yearns to be normal is excited that I will be getting a promotion, going from hourly to salary+benefits, my own office, etc. but the anxious part of my brain goes “now here is where WD will mess it all up for you...” All I can do is try my best I suppose, what happens will happen. Hoping for the best.

 

I went through another big bout of job stress last year that set off anxiety problems and along with the reaction to the steroid injection led me to the citalopram switch.  But this year I'm a lot happier and feel like I'm doing well.  I don't earn much money but I'm doing work I enjoy.  I believe the universe works in mysterious ways, and sometimes things work out for the best in ways we aren't expecting, and we only see that later on when we look back.  Another way to look at it is that each change in your life need not be permanent, and this new job may be just a stepping stone along your path to somewhere better.

[Rachelina]

Hi Ladybug! Congratulations on your promotion. That's amazing news and I'm thrilled for you. Of course fear is totally normal, but don't believe the thoughts that say withdrawal is going to mess things up. Look back at how far you have come in the past decade or so. You've always been able to handle whatever challenges came up, and I am sure you are going to handle this beautifully as well. 

[grandmaD]

Hi Ladybug,  You are always in my thoughts and prayers!  It has been 2 months since the last post, so it must be time for an update???  Hope you are turtling on just fine!

[Songbird]

I've also been wondering how you are, Ladybug.

[ladybug]

Sorry guys for the late reply, I must not get notifications for any posts on my thread, have to change that. I'm still here turtling away! I've actually just completely thrown out the calendar at this point because I figure I am at a point where I am more happy and functional than I've been since I started Paxil, and I figure I will just taper when it feels right for fear of rocking the boat. I have just done a drop to 3.9mg which is crazy! So far so good, but I tend to feel drops much later than I used to, like a few weeks at least, which is another reason for me taking longer holds. Just to make sure everything has settled before dropping again. 

 

Some great updates in my life: I'm still working full time and actually managed to negotiate a big promotion and raise recently. Only a few years ago I was stuck in my wd, jobless, car-less, living with my mom. Now I am working full time, bought my own car, and live on my own (well with a roommate.) It's truly unbelievable! I also had a BIG accomplishment recently by making my first international trip ever! I and some friends went for a few days to Playa Del Carmen, Mexico. I hadn't flown in 14 years so that was huge. If you've read my thread you know I've had a lot of sleep issues in WD and still have trouble sleeping anywhere other than my bed so I've always figured traveling was not in my cards. Unfortunately , sleep was still an issue in Mexico but that adrenaline kicked in and I got through it. Not only did I get through it but I went snorkeling for the first time ever (got to see the beautiful coral reef). I mean I can barely even swim and don't like to venture more than knee deep in the water but here I was in deep water, snorkeling away seeing huge stingrays, beautiful schools of fish. It was magical. The next day we traveled to Tulum and went ziplining in the jungle and I even rappelled into a cenote (cave pool.) I truly could not believe this was me doing all these things, but I pushed past my fears and it was so worth it. 

 

Some less than great updates: Recently starting dating again and the vulvodynia has reared it's ugly head. I truly thought I had healed from it but guess not. So have to go see a specialist again and the one I saw is no longer there and her replacement can't see me until February of next year. Reading about it I'm worried if it doesn't resolve I'll have to go on a low dose of amitryptiline as that seems to be the preferred treatment for treating what is likely overactive nerves down there. I am definitely going to try all I can before resorting to that (pelvic floor therapy, acupuncture, etc.) It's pretty depressing to be dealing with this and STILL dealing with the acne. It's like "I get it Universe, you want me to be single forever!" I'm still debating whether to try Accutane but I feel like that would be such a mistake considering it seems to ruin even more lives than ADs do. So still trying everything else I can before that. Also dealing with severe anemia so was referred to a hematologist for that as well. If I were "normal" I would take birth control pills or an IUD to stop my period but all I can think of is the horrible crash I had in 2004 after starting birth control pills so am too scared to try anything hormonal. I'm still pretty sensitive to supplements like vitamin D or B vitamins and still don't ingest caffeine. I am able to enjoy a drink or two from time to time which is huge for me, but I try to keep it in check. 

 

So that's whats being going on in my life. I apologize for not keeping up with the board. I love you all, i really do. But I do want to be a testament to the fact that when people rarely post or disappear altogether it really CAN be because they are feeling better and don't want to be reminded of such an awful time in their life. Don't get me wrong, I don't believe I'm out of woods yet, but I have noticed that when I read something on the boards it will get my mind to worrying again, and the "what ifs" start, when I was feeling ok before putting that in my head. Don't forget I'm a hypochondriac so if I read of someone having something I always tend to wonder if I have that and if I don't, when I will. So it's just not healthy for me mentally to look at people's posts who are struggling. But I will always answer a PM from anyone who is struggling with something I've struggled with and needs any support or questions answered. I hope you are all doing well, much love and healing vibes to everyone out there whether stable or struggling. I promise you, it does get better!

[Martina23]

Ladybug, I really loved reading your update.

[brassmonkey]

Hi Ladybug-- that's such a fantastic update, I'm so excited for you.  It looks like some major corners have been turned. Keep up the good work and get out there and enjoy life.

 

((((((((((((((((((((HUGS))))))))))))))))))

 

Brassmonkey

[ladybug]

Thank you so much, guys! ❤️

[Rachelina]

Ladybug, I have been wondering how you're doing, and this is such a wonderful update. I haven't been on the site much either. I think long-term tapering like we are doing will go better if we don't focus on the tapering, but on life. I used to think that I would get off Paxil, finish healing, and then start living again. I now realize it's not going to happen in that order, and have started really living again even though I'm still on Paxil and nowhere near healed. So happy to read how your life has been blossoming. Congratulations on your flight to Mexico!! I'm nowhere near being able to fly yet, but have at least started to think it will be possible someday. Good luck with your health issues, and keep posting updates every once in a while!

[Songbird]

Hi Ladybug - thanks for posting an update - I've been thinking about you and wondering how things were going with you.  Great to see all the positive stuff!  I've never been snorkelling or ziplining - that sounds amazing!

 

6 hours ago, Rachelina said:

I used to think that I would get off Paxil, finish healing, and then start living again. I now realize it's not going to happen in that order, and have started really living again even though I'm still on Paxil and nowhere near healed. 

 

I used to think the same, very focussed on getting to zero, but it hasn't happened.  By turtle tapering, symptoms are milder and we can live fairly normal lives.  It's good to see you again too, Rachelina!

[ladybug]

On 8/10/2018 at 8:21 PM, Rachelina said:

 I used to think that I would get off Paxil, finish healing, and then start living again. I now realize it's not going to happen in that order, and have started really living again even though I'm still on Paxil and nowhere near healed. 

 

This 100%!! I've now seen that healing can indeed happen while still on so I'm not focusing on how long it will take me to get off, and part of me has come to accept that I might not ever be able to get off, who knows. I guess at this point I'm trying to get to the smallest possible dose that I can be functional and if that's zero then all the better.  It's so good to hear from you and that you are doing ok too! I think of you every time I hear Amity by Elliott Smith haha. ❤️

 

On 8/11/2018 at 3:26 AM, Songbird said:

Hi Ladybug - thanks for posting an update - I've been thinking about you and wondering how things were going with you.  Great to see all the positive stuff!  I've never been snorkelling or ziplining - that sounds amazing!

 

It was amazing! Looks like we are around the same dose, fellow turtle! I think I am going even slower than a turtle at this point though lolol. Good to see you are doing ok. ❤️

 

A little over 2 weeks on this dose and so far so good. Maybe some increased physical anxiety and bouts of depression but at this point, and I've mentioned this before, it's hard to know what is WD and what is my monthly hormonal rollercoaster. I track my cycle closely so now I see the pattern of when I'm going to have increased anxiety, when I'm going to have trouble sleeping, when I'm going to be rageful, when I'm going to have crying episodes, when I'm going to want to eat everything in sight and when I'm going to barely have an appetite, and when I'm going to feel the most normal and like myself. I go through this EVERY MONTH.

 

I did have a couple days of depressive episodes last weekend and part of me is wondering whether I should try some sort of talk therapy. My only issue is I feel like if I open up to someone they will suggest meds. All I can think of is when this guy I dated for a few months (who I was very open with about my WD and was witness to the up and downs) told me as we were breaking up "now I know you don't have bipolar disorder, but you act very bipolar." But this is coming from a guy who popped a pill for any ailment (antidepressants, ambien, viagra) and seemed very UN-emotional to me. So yeah I definitely can go from laughing and joking around one day, to feeling down and crying about my situation the next or sometimes even in the same day, but isn't that just part of being human? A hormonal one at that! But lately I've been wondering "what if it's NOT normal?" And of course EVERYONE is bipolar these days. They can put almost anyone somewhere on the spectrum, which I think is bull. So I guess I'm just worried I would see a therapist and they would tell me "oh yeah, you're definitely bipolar and need meds." ugh. I think that talk therapy can be very beneficial though so I'm going to at least try and find someone to talk to who isn't a pill pusher. 

[megb]

Hi Ladybug, just checking in on you. How awesome to be at 4.3mg!!!! Go you! I am at 6.6 and feeling pretty good. 

 

I don't know if it will help you or anyone else but I can see/feel improvements by changing my diet in a big way. My WD is less intense, sometimes nonexistent, and anxiety has decreased by 60% at least. Since you are under 10mg and tapering still I thought I'd mention it. I'm doing AIP - autoimmune protocol. It's similar to Paleo but is more restrictive and focuses on eliminating common foods that trigger inflammation and adding foods in to heal the gut and help our bodies be able to do their best (where they are.) I don't think it's a cure all for sure - lifestyle aspects of getting more sleep, reducing stress, etc. are crucial too. BUT man I see a difference and I'm so pumped! You can find more about it on www.thepaleomom.com and www.autoimmunewellness.com. 

 

I also have 2+ autoimmune diseases that I originally started AIP to help manage, but it is doing wonders for my tapering life too

 

Let us know how talk therapy goes!! HUGE fan of therapy. All the best, Meg

[ladybug]

On 8/22/2018 at 1:39 PM, megb said:

Hi Ladybug, just checking in on you. How awesome to be at 4.3mg!!!! Go you! I am at 6.6 and feeling pretty good. 

 

I don't know if it will help you or anyone else but I can see/feel improvements by changing my diet in a big way. My WD is less intense, sometimes nonexistent, and anxiety has decreased by 60% at least. Since you are under 10mg and tapering still I thought I'd mention it. I'm doing AIP - autoimmune protocol. It's similar to Paleo but is more restrictive and focuses on eliminating common foods that trigger inflammation and adding foods in to heal the gut and help our bodies be able to do their best (where they are.) I don't think it's a cure all for sure - lifestyle aspects of getting more sleep, reducing stress, etc. are crucial too. BUT man I see a difference and I'm so pumped! You can find more about it on www.thepaleomom.com and www.autoimmunewellness.com. 

 

I also have 2+ autoimmune diseases that I originally started AIP to help manage, but it is doing wonders for my tapering life too

 

Let us know how talk therapy goes!! HUGE fan of therapy. All the best, Meg

 

Thank you, Meg! I will definitely check that out as I feel a lot of my issues are connected somehow to inflammation. Where in Texas do you live? Also, I've actually dropped to 3.9 mg. now.

 

Ok guys, a little bit of an update and I'm in desperate need of some advice. My biggest issues are still the vulvodynia and acne issues which seems to have caused body dysmorphic disorder. Thankfully I have an appt with the vaginal disorder specialist next week so we will see about that. In regards to the acne I finally found a derm who is willing to try me on low dose Accutane instead of nuking it with crazy high doses like all the other derms wanted to do so I'm going to start that soon. Terrified it will bring on a crash but I have to do something.

I also made an appt with a therapist to work on my self esteem issues. The problem is: I have finally found someone I am very, very interested in. We had an instant connection and have so much in common. For some reason, he thinks I'm beautiful despite all my perceived flaws. It's brought so much stuff up because my BDD and low self esteem tells me I'm not good enough for anyone. So I've been honest with him about it and he has tried to reassure me but when you have BDD no amount of reassurance will help. Here's the problem: He's a doctor and thinks I really, really need meds. I've tried to tell him about my issues with SSRI's, why I hate psych meds, etc. but he just does not get it. Not only that, his best friend is a psychiatrist and he regularly consults her about my issues. He keeps telling me I just need to find the right one. I just don't know what to do!! I really like him but if this is always going to be an issue should I just end it now? Or could he possibly be right? The last person I dated couldn't handle my moods either. But I feel all my rollercoaster emotions are caused by withdrawing from Paxil! I just want someone to support me in this journey because it's hard enough as it is. But sometimes I wonder how much is WD and how much is the real me? I'm sooo much more functional at this low dose than I ever was on a higher dose and I feel like that is proof enough that these drugs are just not for me. But sometimes I wonder if I am just inherently mentally ill and need a drug to be happy. I'm happy without drugs, but I do have lows. I do have OCD and OC spectrum issues like health anxiety and BDD. Am I stupid to think I can live without drugs? Am I blaming the drugs for all my issues when it's really just me? What do you guys think?

[ladybug]

Also, how the heck do you edit your signature on here?? LOL.

[Rosetta]

See if this link helps you edit your signature https://www.survivingantidepressants.org/settings/signature/

[Rachelina]

Ladybug!! This is amazing news. I'm so excited for you.  It must be really frustrating though, that he is not willing to believe your experience. Doctors are trained to think scientifically, which means trusting only what is shown by large amounts of data, not individual experience. So, take the scientific angle!! The science in support of antidepressants has completely collapsed in recent years, and he is probably not aware of this. You might start by having him read this two-part New York Review of Books article by Marcia Angell, who was Editor-in-Chief of the New England Journal of Medicine, the most prestigious medical journal in the country.  I'm guessing he will know who she is and consider her a credible person. Then, since the article discusses Anatomy of an Epidemic by Robert Whitaker, you could have him read that book, or at least the SSRI chapter. 

 

https://www.nybooks.com/articles/2011/06/23/epidemic-mental-illness-why/

https://www.nybooks.com/articles/2011/07/14/illusions-of-psychiatry/

 

Another more recent book you could read him parts of is Lost Connections: Uncovering the Real Causes of Depression - and the Unexpected Solutions by Johann Hari. The first two chapters demolish the chemical imbalance theory and the myth that antidepressants work. It's got a big blurb from Hillary Clinton on the cover, which, no matter what his politics are, at least shows that this is becoming mainstream thinking. And I would recommend reading the whole book for yourself. He convincingly argues that depression (and I would include the other mental health issues you mentioned) doesn't occur in our isolated brains but is a symptom of larger societal problems. So even if you do have what is called mental illness, there's actually nothing wrong with you. Which doesn't solve your problems but for me at least, it's hugely liberating to realize I'm not defective. And it does point towards many possible avenues of healing.

 

And I don't think it matters how much is withdrawal and how much is "you". I've long since given up trying to figure that out about myself.  I know it's a lot of both, but they're so entangled that it's impossible to separate them.  The same sensitivity that makes you vulnerable to mental health issues also makes you more sensitive to withdrawal. And then there's the fact that withdrawal symptoms make your life really difficult, and so you naturally get even more depressed and anxious because of that. Right now I think I'm operating under the assumption that it's mostly me. And that that's OK. And that healing is possible. And that withdrawal is contributing something but I don't know how much, and maybe I will be pleasantly surprised with amazing improvements once I finally am done with withdrawal. And maybe not. But I already HAVE had amazing improvements (and so have you!) in spite of withdrawal. So yeah, I don't think it matters. What we DO know is that more drugs won't help. I think it would be helpful to read some of the above mentioned material to convince yourself of this, but really, you said it yourself when you wrote, "I'm sooo much more functional at this low dose than I ever was on a higher dose and I feel like that is proof enough that these drugs are just not for me."

 

So, congratulations and good luck!!! He sounds amazing in so many ways. But don't let him sway you from your own truth. 

 

[Songbird]

Hi Ladybug!  I agree with everything Rachelina said.  It's great that you've found someone, but it sounds to me as if you are starting to doubt yourself and I do find that a bit concerning.

 

On 9/26/2018 at 9:30 AM, ladybug said:

I'm sooo much more functional at this low dose than I ever was on a higher dose and I feel like that is proof enough that these drugs are just not for me. But sometimes I wonder if I am just inherently mentally ill and need a drug to be happy. I'm happy without drugs, but I do have lows. I do have OCD and OC spectrum issues like health anxiety and BDD. Am I stupid to think I can live without drugs? Am I blaming the drugs for all my issues when it's really just me? What do you guys think?

 

Everyone has lows, that's life, that's normal.  It's unrealistic to expect to be happy all the time.  You're definitely not stupid.  "So much more functional" sounds like a good thing to me.

 

I like Rachelina's suggestion of gently trying to educate - maybe point him towards the works of other doctors, such as David Healy, Peter Breggin, Kelly Brogan, Peter Gotzsche, and so on. 

 

On 9/26/2018 at 9:30 AM, ladybug said:

his best friend is a psychiatrist and he regularly consults her about my issues. 

 

I find this quite concerning, unless you have actually asked him to do this.  I think the bottom line is, this guy needs to accept you the way you are, not try to change you or "fix" you.  I hope the two of you can work this out.

 

 

 

[ladybug]

Rachelina, your advice is SPOT ON! Yes, he is definitely scientific minded and doesn't give much credence to anecdotal evidence. 

 

On 9/26/2018 at 8:34 AM, Rachelina said:

And I don't think it matters how much is withdrawal and how much is "you". I've long since given up trying to figure that out about myself.  I know it's a lot of both, but they're so entangled that it's impossible to separate them.  The same sensitivity that makes you vulnerable to mental health issues also makes you more sensitive to withdrawal. And then there's the fact that withdrawal symptoms make your life really difficult, and so you naturally get even more depressed and anxious because of that. Right now I think I'm operating under the assumption that it's mostly me. And that that's OK. And that healing is possible. And that withdrawal is contributing something but I don't know how much, and maybe I will be pleasantly surprised with amazing improvements once I finally am done with withdrawal. And maybe not. But I already HAVE had amazing improvements (and so have you!) in spite of withdrawal. So yeah, I don't think it matters. What we DO know is that more drugs won't help. I think it would be helpful to read some of the above mentioned material to convince yourself of this, but really, you said it yourself when you wrote, "I'm sooo much more functional at this low dose than I ever was on a higher dose and I feel like that is proof enough that these drugs are just not for me."

 

I love this sooo much, I want to print it out and put it on my wall.  Thank you for your insight. It's really made things so much more clearer for me.

 

6 hours ago, Songbird said:

Everyone has lows, that's life, that's normal.  It's unrealistic to expect to be happy all the time.  You're definitely not stupid.  "So much more functional" sounds like a good thing to me.

 

I agree 100%! I don't understand the medical field's obsession with medicating away any unhappiness. It's crazy to me. Yet, WE are the ones who are mentally ill? It's the entire system that's broken, not us. 

 

6 hours ago, Songbird said:

I find this quite concerning, unless you have actually asked him to do this.  I think the bottom line is, this guy needs to accept you the way you are, not try to change you or "fix" you.  I hope the two of you can work this out.

 

Again, I agree, and I've spoken to him about how this makes me uncomfortable. Thank you so much for your advice, guys. Ultimately I feel like this relationship is just not going to work out. For the concerns I've already mentioned and some others. At least I am still willing to put myself out there trying to find someone. It's definitely not easy to do, and REALLY hard to do when you have BDD.  I'm so excited to be starting therapy next week, hopefully I can work through my issues and maybe I'll find a healthy relationship with myself and that will lead to being able to have a healthy relationship with someone else. Love you guys!

[Songbird]

11 hours ago, ladybug said:

hopefully I can work through my issues and maybe I'll find a healthy relationship with myself and that will lead to being able to have a healthy relationship with someone else.

 

I think this healthy relationship with ourselves is really important.  Although I don't have BDD, I have had similar issues of low self-esteem and not feeling "good enough" all my life.  I think on one level we really do know we are okay, but there's an inner child part that doesn't believe it.  I've found it helps me to realise that I am not the inner child.  She is a part of me and I need to accept her, but I am also the observer that can see and understand more than she does.  Anyway, I hope your therapy works well for you!

[coldturkmama]

That guy sends some warning signs. 

I just never think it’s a good idea to talk to someone of the opposite sex about your personal issues.

hmmm yeah, hat doesn’t sit well with me.

also, we are human and all have highs, lows, anxious days etc but it seems like everyone wants to diagnose those range of emotions. 

[Altostrata]

Hi, ladybug, how are you doing?

[ChessieCat]

Just posting this here so there is more chance of @ladybug seeing it and responding:

 

Original post in the Skin Issues topic:

 

On 2/18/2012 at 1:49 PM, ladybug said:

Yes! I had PERFECT skin my whole life. Even during puberty I only got a few pimples. In 2006 (I was 26 years old) is when I started tapering from 37.5mg. My skin slowly started to break out and the lower in dose I got the worse it got. At one point I could count 15 active pimples at one time! Even worse is for every single pimple I get a post inflammatory hyperpigmentation scar that last several months to over a year! My skin was covered in dark marks from all the pimples. Even worse than that the other day I was plucking my eyebrows by a lamp and as I turned my face in certain direction a shadow was cast over my face and it was bumpy as if I had some indented scars! This is after I have finally gotten my acne under control using a Benzoyl Peroxide regimen every day. I still have a lot of marks that I am trying to get rid of with weekly lactic acid peels. Bottom line: WD has absolutely messed up my skin. If I truly do have indented scars those won't ever go away. Yet another reason I hate this poison.

 

Ryguy's question:

 

35 minutes ago, Ryguy said:

Hey I know you wrote this 7 years ago and are probably healed by now, I hope. But I am in a very similar situation, a family of perfect skin, including me, but I’ve had acne for years due to withdrawal and have scars all over my face now, I’m still in withdrawal and it’s getting worse , the pimples always come when I have seizures or spasms and anger problems or hallucinations , my body is completely dysfunctional. My question is, did it ever get better , or do you scars now for life? I’ll understand if you don’t use the site any longer and don’t answer , but would love to know, it’s ruining my life worrying about when I finally get past withdrawal I’ll be permanently  scarred from it, literally. It’s entirely not genetic since not a single person in my family has ever gotten pimples . 

 

 

[Guest]

12 hours ago, ChessieCat said:

Just posting this here so there is more chance of @ladybug seeing it and responding:

 

Original post in the Skin Issues topic:

 

 

Ryguy's question:

 

 

 

Thank you 

[ShadowDancer]

Hi @ladybug.

How are your visual symptoms now if I may ask