ChronicallyHopeful: Too many tapers, too soon - crickey mama!

[ChronicallyHopeful]

This spring, I switched to a func med dr and he demanded that I quit my legally prescribed opioid in six months. I did it in one month. It was bad, but I was not addicted. 

 

I felt more clear-headed, so I took the next month to get off Tramadol, because after starting to research seratonin syndrome, I suspected I may have had it. I was in a complete stupor. Drunk like. Sleeping all day. Brain fog. Falling. Weak. 

 

My previous Drs had me on Tramadol and 5HTP and Escitalopram, all of which up seratonin synergistically. 

 

After Tramadol, I decided to tackle Gabapentin. Again, in one month. 

 

I was still in a stupor, so I switched taking my 10 mgs (for three years) Escitalopram to night time first and it helped. Slept better at, less brain fog during the day. 

 

Not to be outdone by so much so-called success, I talked to my Dr about tapering it. 

 

I was told the 25% per week schedule. 

 

Not too bad, until I went from 5 mg to 2.5 and then all hell broke loose. Rigid muscles, jitters, vomiting, migraines. I did that for 10 days and then zero. That was when the real hell started. Been in that hell for 16 days.

 

Obviously, too much, too soon, too quickly. Even my wonderful func med dr doesn’t really understand how slowly this has to happen. 

 

After finding this site two days ago, I reenstated 2.5 mg of the Escitalopram today, and will hold this dose for a week, until I stablize, or go up a tiny bit more then. 

 

I would love to know if you all feel like this is mostly from the AD. As in, should I have NOT even attempted a taper, since I had just gone off these other meds? 

 

If that is true, I wonder how long I should go, once I restablize, before attempting to taper 10%? 

 

 

 

 

[Songbird]

Hi ChronicallyHopeful, welcome to SA.  I'm glad you've found us - as you've discovered, the 25% per week taper is way too fast. 

 

7 hours ago, ChronicallyHopeful said:

My previous Drs had me on Tramadol and 5HTP and Escitalopram, all of which up seratonin synergistically. 

 

That's a terrible idea - looks like a recipe for serotonin syndrome.

 

7 hours ago, ChronicallyHopeful said:

After finding this site two days ago, I reenstated 2.5 mg of the Escitalopram today, and will hold this dose for a week, until I stablize, or go up a tiny bit more then. 

 

This looks like a reasonable reinstatement plan to me.  It will likely take more than a week to stabilise, but hopefully you'll get some significant improvement soon.  If symptoms are not alleviated enough then a small updose might help.  Do you have a way to accurately measure very small doses (e.g. liquid escitalopram)?

 

7 hours ago, ChronicallyHopeful said:

I would love to know if you all feel like this is mostly from the AD. As in, should I have NOT even attempted a taper, since I had just gone off these other meds? 

If that is true, I wonder how long I should go, once I restablize, before attempting to taper 10%? 

 

In general, we suggest giving your system a break from tapering for a while before starting the next taper.  I would give it a good long while to get really stable before starting another taper (think months rather than weeks).

 

Thanks for creating a signature - please can you update it to show the start dates for each of your meds.  Are you still taking 5HTP?  What about Tramadol and Gabapentin - are you still taking those?

 

Please post all your updates and questions about your situation here in your introduction topic, and we will try to help as best we can.

 

 

Edited July 10, 2018 by Songbird
add info

[ChronicallyHopeful]

Thank you, @Songbird I woke up feeling happy and rested this morning, after my reenstatement dose. Could be placebo, could be real. If real, that means that I am really sensitive to the drug. Will see how today goes at work, with real life stress. Just thankful for one morning without the hellish anxiety. 

 

I am no longer taking the Tramadol, or 5HTP. Now that I understand all of this, I realize that I went from a Seretonin overload to none in WAY too short of a time. Realizing now how much supplements can affect us too. 

 

I will hold the reenstatement dose (whatever it ends up being) for some months before I start a taper again. 

 

I will have to get some liquid at some point. Right now, I am cutting my 10 mg pills in quarters, being very accurate in the cutting. Is this okay, or should I get liquid now? Do you guys use a syringe to measure the liquid as you taper 10%? 

 

I will have to call the pharmacy for my start dates. Cannot remember for sure. Will come back and edit my sig, once I get that info. 

[ChessieCat]

Hi CH and welcome from me too,

 

Here's the topic:  Tips for tapering off Lexapro (escitalopram)

 

 

[ChronicallyHopeful]

@ChessieCat thanks for the great info. I read up on how to make the liquid and so forth. As long as the 2.5 mg i started yesterday continues to stabilize me, I will cut my 10’s in 1/4. When I begin to taper, in several months, I will make the liquid. 

 

Buying the liquid without insurance is $100, so I am going to try to make my own. 

 

In the meantime, I will get the syringes, etc. 

 

Really appreciate your help. I feel like I can do this now, at a much slower rate like this. Praying for everyone on here. It is truly awful what these drugs do to our brains. 

[Carmie]

9 hours ago, ChronicallyHopeful said:

@ChessieCat thanks for the great info. I read up on how to make the liquid and so forth. As long as the 2.5 mg i started yesterday continues to stabilize me, I will cut my 10’s in 1/4. When I begin to taper, in several months, I will make the liquid. 

 

Buying the liquid without insurance is $100, so I am going to try to make my own. 

 

In the meantime, I will get the syringes, etc. 

 

Really appreciate your help. I feel like I can do this now, at a much slower rate like this. Praying for everyone on here. It is truly awful what these drugs do to our brains. 

 

Hi chronicallyhopeful, 

 

Just wanted to let you know I’ve been doing water titration for ages now. It is really easy once you get the hang of it. I’m hopeless at math but I managed to get myself down from 300mg of Seroquel to 7.5mg. I’ve got many, many years to go but water titration helps you go down slowly.

 

Wishing you all the best in your tapering 💚

 

 

[ChronicallyHopeful]

@Carmie wow, good strong work on your taper. You have really inspired me. That is amazing. Helps me know that I can do this, too. 

 

Ya’ll are such a godsend to me. I litterally thought I was losing my mind. And was sooo mad that I would have to go back on the meds and never get off. 

 

I must have read 154 posts and articles about getting off AD in the last month. I gave up. Then one particularly anxious day, I tried another term in Googke search, read 16 more posts and finally found an article that linked to this site. Praise God! 

[ChronicallyHopeful]

I just talked to my Dr and he is onboard with this plan. That helps. 

[Carmie]

3 hours ago, ChronicallyHopeful said:

I just talked to my Dr and he is onboard with this plan. That helps. 

 

 

Hi ChronicallyHopeful, 

 

Yes this site certainly is a blessing for anyone trying to get off these dreaded meds. Read the success stories if you need more encouragement.

 

Tapering isn’t smooth sailing and it isn’t linear but we will all get there in the end. It’s still going to take me a really long time to get off the meds because the smaller the dosage the tinier the cuts, but all forward movement is good. Have been having a break from tapering but will start again at the end of August. 

 

I’m glad your doctor is on board, that makes things easier. My doctor just lets me figure out my own tapering schedule too as he knows nothing about withdrawals. They are taught how to put you on meds but don’t realise how hard the withdrawal process is, some don’t even believe there is such a thing. 

 

All the best, and yes, we will all get there in the end 💚

 

 

[ChronicallyHopeful]

Can I ask a question on reinstating and stabilizing. Not sure how to ask it. I am beginning my reinstatement at 2.5 mg of Lexapro. I had been on 10 for 3 years. 

 

Does one ever stabilze on LESS than their usual dose? Like, could I stablize at less than 10? Is that even a thing? 

 

If not, do you then typically stablize at your usual dose when you get there, or do you have to go higher? 

 

Not sure what my goal will feel like. My #1complaint is clenching and holding my breath. Not sure if that is anxiety, fear, emotional dysregulation or what. I feel tight in my stomach and like I cannot breathe.

 

Will I know I have finished my reinstatement when that goes away? God, pleeeez let it go away. It is torture. 

[ChronicallyHopeful]

@Songbird when you get a chance, can you look at my question above? I really aporeciate your advice and help. 

 

Btwm today, was either a window, or the 2.5 is kicking in. The anxiety was there, but much more manageable. This segueas into my question above. At what point, do you say you are at the smallest manageable reinstatment dose? 

 

Is the goal to reinstate the least dosage that gets you fairly symptom free, or do I need to go full bore and try to get symptom free. I don’t feel like that will happen either direction, because on my full dose, I was having terrible symptoms. Serotonin Syndrome. I don’t want to go back to that. 

 

But in tapering too quickly, I got too much anxiety, and couldn’t function. 

 

About where is the happy medium? 

[Songbird]

On 7/12/2018 at 10:15 AM, ChronicallyHopeful said:

Does one ever stabilze on LESS than their usual dose? Like, could I stablize at less than 10? Is that even a thing? 

 

It's possible you could stabilise on less than your usual dose, but it's hard to predict the dose.  The dose needed to stabilise can vary according to what your usual dose was, how long you've been off, and other factors.  It's best to start with a lower dose, as your system may have become very sensitive and could potentially react badly to higher doses.  See about reinstating and stabilizing to reduce withdrawal symptoms. 

 

6 hours ago, ChronicallyHopeful said:

Is the goal to reinstate the least dosage that gets you fairly symptom free

 

In general, yes.  Some people may eventually stabilise at symptom free, others may have some mild or at least bearable residual symptoms.  In general, the sooner the reinstatement is done, the better.  It takes some time to stabilise - it could be several months - so you need to be patient.  If you are already feeling some improvement since your reinstatement, that's a good sign.

 

I can't tell from your signature when you started each med, and when you started tapering each med.   (e.g. If you look at my signature you can see I started citalopram at 20mg in May 2016, then started tapering down Oct 2016).  Please add some more dates to your signature.

 

[Carmie]

Hi ChronicallyHopeful, 

 

Just wondering how you’re doing?💚

[ChronicallyHopeful]

Gosh, thanks for asking! I am two weeks stable, back on 10 mg of Lexapro. I am going to stay on this stable dose for awhile and rebuild my health. Resolve some genetic and supplement issues, and continue wiith my sports medicine chiro to resolve my pain issues, before attempting to wean down again. A little leary of weaning off during the winter due to SADD, so may wait until March to start. 

[Carmie]

On 8/13/2018 at 11:22 PM, ChronicallyHopeful said:

Gosh, thanks for asking! I am two weeks stable, back on 10 mg of Lexapro. I am going to stay on this stable dose for awhile and rebuild my health. Resolve some genetic and supplement issues, and continue wiith my sports medicine chiro to resolve my pain issues, before attempting to wean down again. A little leary of weaning off during the winter due to SADD, so may wait until March to start. 

 

Hi chronicallyHopeful, 

 

So glad you’ve been stable. Sometimes it’s good to have a little break from tapering. I’ve had one, but will be tapering again soon. 

 

I hope the chiro is helping with your pain issues. 

 

Sending hugs🤗

[ChronicallyHopeful]

@Songbird @Carmie @ChessieCat Well, I had something shocking happen and my stability on 10 mg of Lexapro has been shattered. I feel like I am in withdrawals even though I have not missed any doses. This thing happened a week ago, or was it that? I cried for two days, ended up getting heat exhaustion after half an hour outside (not typical) on the third, taken in an ambo to ER. I have been on the descent into hell ever since. 22 hours sleep in 7 days. Many calls to my dr who finally told me he has no idea what to do for me or what is wrong. Told me to get therapy. He is convinced that this is emotional, rather than serotonin related. I am having electrical shocky things in my extremities, insomnia, tremors, 24/7 muscle clenching, inability to unclench to talk, unable to form words, remember things, terror, no appetite, normal sounds bother me. Could this be Lexapro related? I really feel like it is. I am terrified to start EMDR therapy while feeling this terrified, as my Dr suggests. He offered to double my Lexapro and I filled the 20 mg rx, but haven’t taken any extra yet, in case this is something else. I really need some advice. Thanks in advance. 

[ChessieCat]

What is your current daily symptom pattern?

 

Specifically:

 

What time do you take your Lexapro?

 

What time to the symptoms worsen/lessen?

 

1 hour ago, ChronicallyHopeful said:

ended up getting heat exhaustion after half an hour outside

 

[ChessieCat]

If you had been okay up until the heat exhaustion and the symptoms worsened afterwards, then it is most likely caused by the heat exhaustion.  It's stressed you nervous system.  It will be important to keep yourself as calm as possible and use  Non-drug techniques to cope to get through the discomfort.  It may take several weeks for things to settle down.  Please don't taper again until you have about 2 weeks of "normal" withdrawal.

[ChronicallyHopeful]

Thanks for that article! VERY interesting. Makes sense. 

 

I take my Lexapro at 7 am everyday. (Come to think of it, I was taking it at night before I withdrew.) 

 

I wake up chilly and wet from sweats, gritting my teeth, clenching my stomach, tremors in arms and legs. I get prickly electrical shocky things in my hands, mostly. Feel like I need to stay in bed all day. Everything feels horrifying and dangerous. Everything makes me cry. I feel very overwhelmed. 

 

By 3-4 pm, I am having chills and goosebumps. Need to get on heating pad to warm up. 

 

At about 8 pm I start the overheating and sweating. I have night sweats and overheat while I sleep. Have to keep the house REALLY cold at night. 

 

Go to sleep at 10 pmish. 

 

I wake up like clockwork at 1:30 am everynight. Lay there until 7 when I take my Lexapro. 

[ChessieCat]

Q:  Did these symptoms start after the heat exhaustion?

 

body-temperature-dysregulation-fever-chills-shivering-too-hot-too-cold

 

 

[ChessieCat]

The other possibility (depending on your age) is menopause.

[ChronicallyHopeful]

I am seven years post complete hysterectomy.

 

this is the low down: 

 

July 30 stable again on 10 mg of Lexapro

 

August: starting to feel wear and tear

—Took in 19 yo family member who turned out to be borderline p d

—Sleep was disturbed by this person on a number of occasions

—Stage Two Adrenal Fatigue dx

—Thyroid Cancer Scare and now lymph node cancer scare

—Accountant made a mistake on taxes and government tried to take my house

 

Sept: 

—Business stress, possible merger

—Last Thursday (Sept 13) bpd family member moves out suddeny without a word, I worry, I cry for two days. 

—Friday (Sept 14), was able to work all day, but clenching was exhausting

—Last Sat (Sept 15) heat exhaustion, I collapse at Art In The Park, cannot form words, tachicardia, weak, cannot stand. 

—Sunday (Sept 16) I start feeling like I did on WD, bedridden until Thursday (Sept 20). Racing heart. Palps. Feeling like I am going to passout. Nurse says I am fine and to meditate. 

—Saturday (Sept 22)  and today I work all day trying to catch up. Feel very momentary times that I feel kind of normal, then my brain fealizes it, and the clenching starts. 

—slept all night last night for first time in a week. 

 

Edited September 24, 2018 by ChessieCat
Added dates from member's addition info

[ChessieCat]

18 minutes ago, ChronicallyHopeful said:

I am seven years post complete hysterectomy.

 

It may possibly be hormonal issues.

 

You've had a lot of stress in a short period of time.

[ChronicallyHopeful]

It happened a week ago Saturday. 

 

Yes, the stress has been beyond belief. 

[ChessieCat]

9 hours ago, ChronicallyHopeful said:

i see my mistake in my list. Where is says last Thursday and so on, it shoukd have said Thursday Sept 13, then Fri Sept 14, and where it says Art at the Park, that was the 15th and so on. The 15th was the heat exhaustion. Thanks for catching that! 

 

I've made the corrections.  Please double check that it's now accurate.  Thanks.

[ChronicallyHopeful]

Yes, thanks a million @ChessieCat! You are the best. 

[ChessieCat]

You're welcome.

 

From what you have written it sounds like things are settling down.

[ChronicallyHopeful]

I believe that I may be experiencing brain damage from a decade on gabapentin. Just read that it is a neuro toxin, and I have a LOT of those symptoms. I only hope the brain damage is not completely permanent. I weaned off (too fast) from it in May.