☼ Leo1983: SSRI withdrawal

[Leo1983]

Hi all.

 

Just been having a chat this evening with a Dr friend of mine. 

 

Can anyone answer this for me. 

 

Does all these symptoms anxiety, brain fog etc just go away with time. Like a broken leg healing. 

 

Or do you only heal if you eat well, change your thought patterns, get involved with god, take supplements. 

 

Just your broken leg would heal without taking magnesium, or praying or changing your mind set. 

 

I thought i had it all sussed! I thought if you had a broken leg, you would have to accept it was broken and you could not live life the way you did before the break. But i did think the leg would heal without going to church, taking fish oil, or changing your mind set. 

 

Is this the same for healing fro AD? 

 

Thanks

[Happy2Heal]

Leo

you  are going to heal regardless of what you do.

 

it's not exactly like a broken leg, a  leg is a much MUCH simpler body part than your BRAIN.

Brains are very complex. It only makes sense that healing will take longer and be more complicated.

 

you don't need to take supplements, pray, meditate, or do anything else- to heal. It will just happen on it's own.

 

All of the suggestions made here about  eating well, taking magnesium, gentle exercise, changing your self defeating thought patterns, etc etc- these are ways to cope with the distressful symptoms of healing.

They are also, incidentally, ways to deal with the very emotions and faulty thinking patterns that may have led some us to be put on these drugs in the first place.

 

Not everyone who takes antidepressants has trouble coming off of them.  No one knows for sure how many people do.

I went on and off many different drugs when I was younger and don't recall having any withdrawal from them (but then again, I was usually put on a different drug)

 

the suggestions made on this forum are ways to help you deal with symptoms, if you have any. 

The symptoms let you know that your brain is busy doing the work of healing. It's unfortunate that they are very uncomfortable and distressing. When we first took these drugs, we had no way of knowing that this is what we were potentially signing up for when we started them

 

 

but you're in withdrawal, and you have symptoms, so you have to decide if you need to or want to do anything to help manage those symptoms. that's all. 

 

it won't change the eventual outcome, your brain is healing. As many of us have found out, the thing that helps the most is simply TIME.

it can take a long time for your brain to heal

 

but knowing that, and knowing that you may have these distressing symptoms for awhile,  do you want to find ways to distract yourself and help yourself feel better while you wait?

 

some ppl choose to go back on the antidepressant, and that's their choice, too.

 

 

you have to find what works for you. 

 

 

Edited November 16, 2018 by Happy2Heal
typos

[Leo1983]

No way im going back on. They have been awful eaxh time i was on one. 

 

Oh god they were awful. 

 

I will see this through. 

 

Thanks H2H. 

[Happy2Heal]

you can to do it Leo

 

it's surely not easy 

just take it one day at a time

 

or one minute,  when it gets really rough ok?

 

 

[ChessieCat]

Really great post H2H. ☺️

 

The best thing is that understanding about withdrawal symptoms means that we don't get scared and feel like we are getting worse, have something new or imagining things.  Being able to say, oh that is possibly a withdrawal symptom means that we don't start worrying.  Obviously if something continues and it concerns you it is best to get it checked out.

 

It's like when the kids are grumpy and you know that it's because they are tired or hungry.  You are more gentle and understanding with them because you know what is causing their behaviour.  We need to be the same way with ourselves.

[ChessieCat]

I think trouble socialising can be contributed to by this:  anhedonia-apathy-demotivation-emotional-numbness

 

Other members have the same issue.

[Leo1983]

Yeh that was my thoughts on this anyways.

 

Thanks CC

[Leo1983]

Hi All.

 

Just been for my first session with Psychology. The guy was a Dr of CBT there!

 

Told him my story and within 5 minutes you have iatrogenic illness. 

 

He said why do you sound like you want me to be suprised? " i believe you ". He said its you thats shocked. 

 

Basically he believed me. He said however there is also trauma of this, worry and distress which is contributing to your way of feeling. I was so hell bent on the is ALL WD qnd nothing else. 

 

It took a while for me to accept what he was saying. Hes accepting withdrawal bit telling me i am making it all worse basically. 

 

Thats now my GP and my therapist who have not questioned the damage from drugs. 

 

 

[Asta]

Today is not to bad,  a lack of sleep. My symptoms are changing a lot during the day, more time comes when I feel like myself, but I also have bad symptoms.

[Leo1983]

You are also reducing a drug too. That will cause symptoms. 

 

You will be just fine. Keep reducing.

 

[ChessieCat]

Wow Leo.  You have been fortunate to find someone who recognises withdrawal.

 

CBT is good.  It challenges our bad thinking, but it is not the only non drug coping tool.  Different things work better at different times.

 

[Leo1983]

Hi SA 

 

Hope everyone is well as can be. 

 

I have spoken to Sami Timimi today who is a Psychiatrist and may i say what a waste of time it was. Sami is a reccomended Dr to help us.

 

Talk about given someone increased anxiety. My question was do we heal? Well its difficult to predict he says. Very Helpful. Then im very sorry but i cant help individuals who have suffered the adverse effects of these drugs. Then he ignored my second email. 

 

Can i ask is Iatrogenic damage the same as Withdrawal? 

 

Is withdrawal just damage basically? 

 

I wont be going back to CBT until im feeling better as he just got on about my worry and fear causing sone symptoms i have. 

 

Then i email Dr Who today who basically just ramps my anxiety up with his non chalont answers. 

[ChessieCat]

I suggest you work through this:  CBT Course:  An Introductory Self-Help Course in Cognitive Behaviour Therapy

 

And I'm sure we've provided you with links to non drug coping techniques.  You will need to go through them and try them to see what works for you.  Different things work better at different times for different things.

 

You might find this one helpful:  https://www.cci.health.wa.gov.au/Resources/Looking-After-Yourself/Tolerating-Distress

 

They have other different ones as well:  Resources:  Centre for Clinical Interventions (PDF modules that you can work through, eg:  Depression, Distress Intolerance, Health Anxiety, Low Self-Esteem, Panic Attacks, Perfectionism, Procrastination, Social Anxiety, Worrying)

[Sadboy]

Hey leo mate. Our cases are much alike. I am a 22 year old guy who is now in month 8 of a cold turkey from 75mg of zoloft i was on for 5 months. Started at 25mg, upped to 50 and ended at 75mg. All the time using the meds I felt horrible but they told me to keep upping the dose, cause that would work (lol) . I used to be a very social guy, center of attention (maybe a little too much haha) but also with obsessive thoughts and anxiety. Thats why I took the meds. They made me utterly depressed during and after using. Also they ruined my sleep during and after using. I am now like you, anhedonic, depressed, hella anxious, and even more obsessed than i used to be. The problem i notice is that my obsessive character doesnt really help in my withdrawal. I obsess about every new symptom i notice which makes it worse. Not worse in the way that the symptom becomes worse, but worse in a way that i feel even more bad about me having the symptom. I read your story and i notice u too obsess about symptoms and keep worrying. The thing is, when i look back 3 months i am way better. I even had days where I felt normal and was the social guy ones again, enjoying peoples company without feeling anxious about looking them in the damn eyes. Time will heal, it takes so slow that you dont even notice. It's like when the download of a file is so big you cant see the bar going, but when you look 4 hours later u see it moved a little. To be honoust the only thing u can do is accept everything that will come to you and think **** it. U have absolutely 0 control when it comes to all this ****, so just let it flow. Man i was so controlling and it made everything 10x worse. Symptoms are hell, but obsessing about them will make them hell times 10. Just think i cant do anything about it and will make the best of it. 2 other things that really helped me in this time are using cbd oil and nofap. Cbd oil is number one when it comes to things that helped me. It gives me some form of relaxation when needed, without causing addiction or hangovers. Also helps me with sleep, but for some it gives them an energy boost when needed. Nofap is the quitting porn and keeping in your beloved semen. This **** gives me the positive i dont give a **** mindset that is so needed in this period of my life. It will make me think this withdrawal will all end well instead of thinking of all kinds of doom. I hope i helped u a little and u can always message me in this thread. I am in therapy with a psychiatrist that him himself went through withdrawal and opened a clinic for people like us. He gave me this perspective. Withdrawal is one thing, but not accepting it is utter hell

[Leo1983]

So are you any better in 8 months then? 

 

Are your symptoms gone? 

 

Lee

[Leo1983]

Cheers for that info also.

[Sadboy]

Yeah man i am definitly seeing progress. I sleep better, i start to socialize more and more and my libido and emotions are coming back. I posted in this thread before and u can see i was in a worse place before. Ofcourse i dont feel like i used to yet, my days are still a 4/5 with sometimes a 7 or 8 and sometimes a 2 or 3. But it used to be a 2 all the time with sometimes a 5 or 6 (from a scale from 1 to 10). I notice the fear that you think this will never end etc. My psychiatrist told me that this crap can take long, but also that he sees that everyone heals. We both for sure will man, we took this crap for not even half a year. The fact that i see changes shows me that my brain is doing something about it, and i believe it will keep doing this till homeostasis is achieved. Try to accept that you wont be yourself anytime soon, and accept the new you. This will make every positive change a present. I know its hard. I hadn't cried for 7 years untill i had to accept in this period that the old me is "dead" in a way. Try to make the best of what you have now, focussing on who you were in the past isnt gonna get you anywhere. And again, u will feel normal again, but it may take longer than you want. So waiting for it everyday is going to let you down everyday. 

[powerback]

14 hours ago, Leo1983 said:

Hi SA 

 

Hope everyone is well as can be. 

 

I have spoken to Sami Timimi today who is a Psychiatrist and may i say what a waste of time it was. Sami is a reccomended Dr to help us.

 

Talk about given someone increased anxiety. My question was do we heal? Well its difficult to predict he says. Very Helpful. Then im very sorry but i cant help individuals who have suffered the adverse effects of these drugs. Then he ignored my second email. 

 

Can i ask is Iatrogenic damage the same as Withdrawal? 

 

Is withdrawal just damage basically? 

 

I wont be going back to CBT until im feeling better as he just got on about my worry and fear causing sone symptoms i have. 

 

Then i email Dr Who today who basically just ramps my anxiety up with his non chalont answers. 

Hi leo I hope your well ,don't go down this rabbit hole while in withdrawl ,I have and now i am trapped ..park all this until you are much more healed .there mostly arrogant people that don't like being challenged ,I find this to be  hypocrisy .I did introspection before withdrawl but the last guy that got hold of me has destroyed my self worth [2 months ago].I don't think our nervous systems are up to it. 

Keep on your path of healing for now ,theres an Irish guy  called terry lynch ,he has a nice manner about him that you mite like listening to while vulnerable .google or YouTube him .he actually quit being a GP because he could see the madness of just prescribing drugs so he retrained in phycology.

Take care  

[Leo1983]

Just been for a run 1 mile im stuck in my chest lol. 

 

Im just the same mate still feel like shite. Just a daily way now. 

 

My symptom patter. 

 

Work, eat, feel like **** repeat. 

 

Lol.

 

Rabbit hole??? What ya mean? Talking to people who will say its all me and that im mad. 

 

Hope ya ok. 

[powerback]

19 minutes ago, Leo1983 said:

Just been for a run 1 mile im stuck in my chest lol. 

 

Im just the same mate still feel like shite. Just a daily way now. 

 

My symptom patter. 

 

Work, eat, feel like **** repeat. 

 

Lol.

 

Rabbit hole??? What ya mean? Talking to people who will say its all me and that im mad. 

 

Hope ya ok. 

 

21 minutes ago, Leo1983 said:

Rabbit hole??? What ya mean? Talking to people who will say its all me and that im mad. 

kind of ye ,its very hard to find a sympathetic knowledgeable one that has a bedside manner we need .it could be decades before this is even understood on the ground in there circles .

Look into what your eating ,after a shock to your nervous system ,you mite see benefits in cutting out or down ,sugar ,dairy ,gluten ,processed meats/foods ,sugary drinks/junk food .

feel like crap ,cheers mate ,take care.oh I miss my rambles/hikes .

 

 

[Leo1983]

Leo

you  are going to heal regardless of what you do.

 

it's not exactly like a broken leg, a  leg is a much MUCH simpler body part than your BRAIN.

Brains are very complex. It only makes sense that healing will take longer and be more complicated.

 

you don't need to take supplements, pray, meditate, or do anything else- to heal. It will just happen on it's own.

 

All of the suggestions made here about  eating well, taking magnesium, gentle exercise, changing your self defeating thought patterns, etc etc- these are ways to cope with the distressful symptoms of healing.

They are also, incidentally, ways to deal with the very emotions and faulty thinking patterns that may have led some us to be put on these drugs in the first place.

[Leo1983]

I like this pb. Its frank and honest.

[powerback]

11 minutes ago, Leo1983 said:

I like this pb. Its frank and honest.

Ye exactly mate ,take care .👍.

[Leo1983]

Well i guess thats 1 week without much talk of myself on here. Thats good for me. 

 

Can anyone skip over these for me. Im now 6 months off! Yes 6 month i know i know. Thanks. 

 

My symptoms. 

 

Daily anxiety - slightly better. Mornings are awful still. I still get anxious in groups and 1.1 stuff but i manage. 

 

Depression. This has not improved much. Still anhedonic. Still have to go through motions. 

 

Cognition - long term memory better. Short term still not good but abit better. 

 

Brain pressure. Still bad. Heads feels like its swells on inside. 

 

Lethergy. Oh my days this is a killer. My body is like a tonne weight. So it feels. But i manage. 

 

Sleep - my sleep has been funny all along. However most nights i sleep from 10pm till 6pm. I still have the odd night of multiple wake ups and early mornings. 

 

Balance. This has improved. Not as dizzy. However still some general odd feelings. 

 

Confidence/ ability to challenge. Still not good. However it must be because i go to work and do what i have to in a day. Just not much pleasure or rest in my body. 

 

Headaches - odd 1. Not much problem. More head pressure an issue. 

 

Thoughts/ feelings. I think theey are slightly better. But i cant plan or thi k ahead. I have zero ability to plan ahead and organise. 

 

I would love some feedback. Its been along 6 month. 

[Happy2Heal]

hey there

 

I know it seems like a long time, but look at it this way: you don't go thru time in 6 month chunks

 

You go thru time literally ONE MINUTE at a time. that is ALL you need to do, is get thru the next minute

 

It does no good to think about how long it's been nor how much longer it may take.

 

I'd very much like for you to re write your symptom list this way: tell me all the things that are BETTER

 

we all know WD/recovery is bad, it's hard. but when we only focus on that, we just feel worse

 

This sounds like some pollyanna bullsh*t, but trust me it DOES make a difference

 

I go thru your list and right away I see that you're sleeping a full night thru!! 8hrs?!??! really??
You are so blessed! you really are! so many of us were getting maybe 20 mins sleep a night, if any, and then maybe a couple of hours, if we were lucky, with unrelenting anxiety thru out the day. very long days, too, when you only sleep a couple of hours!

I'm not saying this to make you feel bad, or to feel sorry for those who had it worse in some respects. Everyone's journey is hard in it's own way

 

but it truly does help to look for the bright spots, the things that are getting better

 

if you feel you can't do that, then at the very least, don't list the bad things. It will only serve to reinforce them

 

I read several books over the last few years, one called Hardwiring Happiness, that has a lot of tips for just regular ppl to use to help themselves feel less depressed and anxious.

 

it talks about how we are hardwired to pay attention to bad things, to threats, - this helped us survive in the earliest times, to keep from being eaten by wild animals etc

 

but now, it doesnt help us to focus on bad things all the time.

 

we can counteract this tendency for bad things to stick and for good happy things to slip away and be forgotten by PURPOSELY focusing MORE on the things that are good.

 

it makes a big difference

it's probably the one thing that helped me get thru WD the most

 

I still fall back into letting bad things stick in my mind too.  I have to keep reminding myself to work to see the good and to let the good stuff sink in and nourish my soul and spirit

 

anyone can do this. 

 

if you can, try to find that book, ok?

 

you are already getting better, things ARE improving

focus on the IMPROVEMENTS and not the things that are still not yet where you want them to be

 

you ARE Going to get there, you are! don't spend any time worrying about that

 

instead, think about what you are going to do when you feel better. think about how you are already feeling better than you were before

 

it will help!!

[Rosetta]

On November 21, 2018 at 8:13 AM, Leo1983 said:

Hi All.

 

Just been for my first session with Psychology. The guy was a Dr of CBT there!

 

Told him my story and within 5 minutes you have iatrogenic illness. 

 

He said why do you sound like you want me to be suprised? " i believe you ". He said its you thats shocked. 

 

Basically he believed me. He said however there is also trauma of this, worry and distress which is contributing to your way of feeling. I was so hell bent on the is ALL WD qnd nothing else. 

 

It took a while for me to accept what he was saying. Hes accepting withdrawal bit telling me i am making it all worse basically. 

 

Thats now my GP and my therapist who have not questioned the damage from drugs. 

 

 

Wow. Just wow!

[Leo1983]

Hi all.

 

Update on symptoms. 

 

Sleeping alot better. 10am til 7pm most nights. 

 

I feel more present. Less derealization. 

 

Memory is abit better. 

 

Concentration is abit better. Level of interest has improved slightly. 

 

I have my kids virus which is very helpful, i must thank them. 

 

Hope this gives some hope. Still not back but abit better. 

[Asta]

Lee, I am glad to hear that you are getting better.

[Leo1983]

Thankyou 😁

[Leo1983]

Hi

 

Little update... 

 

As you can see in my thread i have been on holiday to HELL the past 6 month. 

 

The past 4 days i have seen a glimpse of my old self. I have even been outside putting up xmas decorations chatting with the neighbours tonight and even been out visiting family. I must say it was nice not to feel scared of my own mother..... strange strange..... but i see WD is strange.

 

I still have morning anxiety however i have not woke up chewing my tongue thinking how much i cant take another day of been in my own head. 

 

Im more present to my surroundings. My memory is slightly better. 

 

I have some emotion however i am still blunted. 

 

I am sleeping 8 hrs per night.

 

I have had a virus so im not sure whats what..... dizziness was part of that virus... just what i needed!!

 

If it continued like this for a while i would be very happy. However i still want the old me back fully. 

 

I think some of what i feel atm is fear of the WD... will i stay like i am now? Am i getting better? Is my time here? 

 

Hope this helps. It could change but i hope not. 

 

Also i dont feel as much that i have to talk about WD or look for reassurance.. This is massive for me. 

 

Cheers

 

Leo.

[Carmie]

Hi Leo, 

 

So glad you’re starting to see a glimpse of your old self again. This is quite a ride, isn’t it? Even when we’re in waves for a really long time the windows do eventually come. I’ve been in mainly waves for over three months but the windows are coming now. I’ve pretty much been in a window all day. 

 

That’s really fabulous you’re sleeping eight hours a night. 

 

We will all eventually heal.

 

Sending sunshine your way☀️☀️☀️☀️ 

[Leo1983]

Hi.

 

Thanks very much. 

 

Yeh it has been nice. I have been hit with a sickness bug and it was ok at first as i knew it was the bug. Its now 4 days and i have alot of head pressure and body temperature. Im confused is it a wave or my body and the virus. 

 

Anyways hopefully its the virus and with time it goes away.

 

I hope your keeping well and managing. 

 

Yes we all heal in the end. It is the worst ride ive ever been on. 

 

Your guna be great. 😉

[Carmie]

1 minute ago, Leo1983 said:

Hi.

 

Thanks very much. 

 

Yeh it has been nice. I have been hit with a sickness bug and it was ok at first as i knew it was the bug. Its now 4 days and i have alot of head pressure and body temperature. Im confused is it a wave or my body and the virus. 

 

Anyways hopefully its the virus and with time it goes away.

 

I hope your keeping well and managing. 

 

Yes we all heal in the end. It is the worst ride ive ever been on. 

 

Your guna be great. 😉

 

Hi again Leo, 

 

I’m so sorry you have a virus. Yes, any stress can make the waves worse. Pleeeease get plenty of rest. 

 

Sending hugs🤗🤗

[Leo1983]

Hi.

 

Anyone tell me if running upstairs and heart almost beating out of your neck, feeling faint.

 

Is this an autonomic thing due to WD? 

 

Only thing i have thats different is a virus which sort of mimics WD anyways. 

[Leo1983]

Hi.

 

I have had a winter bug and virus. Can i ask is the body able to handle this in WD? As in temp regulation, balance, heart rate etc. 

 

This virus has floored me. Can it create a wave? Or ramp up symptoms. 

[ChessieCat]

Any added stress on your body can cause the withdrawal symptoms to worsen.  This stress could be an external stress (loud music, crowds, work stress, an argument) and even good stress (as in doing something exciting - I had a helicopter flying lesson last year and my anxiety increased for a couple weeks after), can worsen things.  Even strenuous exercise can too.  So yes, your body trying to fight a virus or an infection can cause the symptoms to ramp up.