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Nikki

Learning Not to Talk About w/d

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Nikki

This last time around I had the sudden realization that I may have been driving those around me crazy (with the exception of a few people) with the W/D nightmare (crying, anxiety, depression, flu like symptoms, insomnia, etc.)

 

 

Soooo I made a decision to keep it to myself and a few others who really know what the deal is with these meds. That is how I came across this site, and Thank Heavens I did.

 

Unless you have experienced it, it's hard to believe. My daughter recently went thru w/d from forgettigher Imipramine, and as a result she totally believes in W/D.

 

It does get 'old' and I understand that I become like a broken record. Taking it to my counselor is a good outlet for me. and seeing the Psych Nurse Practitioner is also a God Send.

 

It really does wear people down listening to us (me).

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moses

Hi Nikki,

This is so true. My husband is really tired of hearing my complaints. He is trying to be supportive but no longer wants to engage in the planning of my healing process.

Good friends, a good therapist and lots and lots of prayer to God.

Rosie

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Whatever

For me WD and living on meds for five years was a life changing experience. Hell, i am eight years post WD and I am here, most people would want to put it in their past and carry on.

 

But for me, the whole experience was akin to the Holocaust..

 

Heal thyselves people and don't worry what other's think and don't take care to avoid annoying others. If they are annoyed by you then the burden is on them to open that up to discussion. Worrying what other's thought and being a complaint patient is what wound us up here in the first place!

 

WD is a learning and changing experience in more ways than one. And many relationships I had pre-WD ended for VARIOUS reasons post-WD because I changed.

 

And you are all brave and smart people.

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Barbarannamated

So thankful that you have chosen to stay among us, Wharever! It's incredibly hard to see an end to the tunnel on most days.

 

I don't talk to people right now. I'm too fragile and sensitive to deal with any skepticism, real or imagined. Also, most of my friends and family are on pmeds, are in medicine or pharma. Not a receptive crowd. Additionally, I have the family issues playing out and cousins who used to be my support are judging me for cutting off from family. It's really really hard.

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Nadia

I try to minimize talking about withdrawal as much as I can, because I also have a hard time with people's reactions. I KNOW I am too sensitive to what others think and feel (and then even to what I imagine they think and feel), but I've realized that I've been this way all my life, and though I plan on working on it for the rest of my life, I have to also accept that it's just part of me to be very sensitive and I have to make room for it and not criticize myself for it so much. I guess I try for my approach to be "accept and let pass, don't hold on, don't push away". With that and all my other negative emotions. And also the positive ones, since they pass as well.

 

When you are feeling especially vulnerable, sometimes it's better not to put yourself in a position where you feel you are going to have to argue about what you are going through. OR even deal with a reaction. We don't owe anyone any explanations, we can just say "health issues" and not have to explain. Of course, that is harder in closer relationships.

 

Another reason not to talk about withdrawal is not getting caught up in it. The more you insist on your symptoms the less likely it is they will go away. I recently read an article about a strange epidemic that refers to a medical journal paper titled "If You Have to Prove You Are Ill, You Can’t Get Better." (I have yet to find the paper, but I thought the title very compelling.)

 

I'm still debating whether I will mention any of this to the gynecologist next week (I'm trying to figure out if part of what I am experiencing is perimenopause). I think I might just state the facts, say I am having X symptoms, and tell him I want to rule out there being a hormonal cause.

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Barbarannamated

Nadia,

I think that's a good approach w/GYN. If you hear him prescribe SSRIs for someone's PMS/DD, that'll let you know his perception of the drugs (pharma info on PMS/DD around office also a red flag). I'll be interested to learn if your doc measures FSH and how he interprets. My FSH has been above/outside of the postmenopausal Reference Range (195). I have found nothing in medical lit about very high FSH and why a RR (high level) even exist? Sounds like a Karma question :-)

 

Article sounds interesting. I'll try to find it, too.

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Nadia

Hmm... the only thing I have read is that as you age your FSH goes up. Are you above the reference range for your age? Are you menopausal?

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Nikki

Due to a change of a health insurance carrier, I have a new internist. When I spoke to her about w/d she looked at me like I had two heads

 

The lesson here. Do not tell this doctor another thing about psych meds. I have another doctor for that.

 

To be honest, I have a bit of a resentment towards a friend who does not want to hear about w/d. She only wants to talk about her former spouse whom she divorced 9 years ago day in and day out. Either she is clueless or just totally obsessed.

 

What would these people do if we had cancer or some debilitating disease....W/D is debilitating.

 

I have to count my blessings for those who had my back covered during w/d.

 

Hugs

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Barbarannamated

Hmm... the only thing I have read is that as you age your FSH goes up. Are you above the reference range for your age? Are you menopausal?

 

Yes -- waaay out of any identified range and beyond post menopausal--

FSH gets higher in perimenopause and highest in post menopausal when follicles are trying to stimulate estrogen production -

Can't locate my labs right now but I think the high end of post menopausal range is 130ish and my FSH was 195 most recently and was also above RR 2 years ago and previous endocrinologist just said 'oh you're done with menopause' even though I had no typical symptoms like hot flashes or insomnia - current endocrinologist is unsure if I've gone thru menopause or have amenorrhea -

I have been unable to find ANY info explaining why there is a high end of Reference Range and what it means to be so far out of defined range --

All info I've found is in reference to fertility -

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Barbarannamated

I officially know only 2 people NOT on psychotropics or pain meds - I carefully mentioned what's going on with me to bro and sister-in-law (knowing their daughter is being treated as bipolar) and SIL said she is 'only on Effexor' for anxiety and BIL 'just takes 1mg Xanax every nite' for what began as panic attacks when speaking for business meetings -

I'm not talking anymore -

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alexjuice

What would these people do if we had cancer or some debilitating disease....W/D is debilitating.

 

They would believe us and comfort us because cancer is a "real thing". Outsider friends probably be happy to help you if you had cancer since they'd "know" something was seriously wrong and they could tell others about their friend, possibly framing the episode ... "I am so exhausted this week. I've helping Nikki who, haven't ya heard, just diagnosed with cancer. I brought her some lasagna I made. I think she's be gonna be okay but it's gonna be tough for a while."

 

Sadly, we aren't afflicted with something "real" (your doc will confirm) so we (as the title says) Learn Not to Talk About W/d.

 

Alex

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meistersinger

 

What would these people do if we had cancer or some debilitating disease....W/D is debilitating.

 

They would believe us and comfort us because cancer is a "real thing". Outsider friends probably be happy to help you if you had cancer since they'd "know" something was seriously wrong and they could tell others about their friend, possibly framing the episode ... "I am so exhausted this week. I've helping Nikki who, haven't ya heard, just diagnosed with cancer. I brought her some lasagna I made. I think she's be gonna be okay but it's gonna be tough for a while."

 

Sadly, we aren't afflicted with something "real" (your doc will confirm) so we (as the title says) Learn Not to Talk About W/d.

 

Alex

 

I made the mistake last night of mentioning the problems I'm still having almost 5 months after my mother's death to my brother, who is attempting to buy her house. He got nasty and I was told, get over it, get the f*** out of my house and don't come back. I'm afraid to do anything, what with this monkey called Viibryd on my back. To my brothers, there is no such thing as mental illness, I'm just a lazy fatass motherf***** who stinks to high heaven. I've been looking every day for work, and NOTHING interests me! Of course, the brother that blew up is ex-military, and could care less what I think.

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Baxter

Due to a change of a health insurance carrier, I have a new internist. When I spoke to her about w/d she looked at me like I had two heads

 

The lesson here. Do not tell this doctor another thing about psych meds. I have another doctor for that.

 

To be honest, I have a bit of a resentment towards a friend who does not want to hear about w/d. She only wants to talk about her former spouse whom she divorced 9 years ago day in and day out. Either she is clueless or just totally obsessed.

 

What would these people do if we had cancer or some debilitating disease....W/D is debilitating.

 

I have to count my blessings for those who had my back covered during w/d.

 

Hugs

 

 

Nikki - about the internist, just make sure that her attitude toward withdrawal doesn't extend to her attitude toward people who are or have been on psych meds. If it seems like she doesn't listen to/value your contributions to your health care as an accurate historian, you might want to think about finding another doc.

 

About the friend who can't listen to you about w/d but expects a shoulder to cry on and an always-listening ear about her long ago divorce, maybe she's not a good enough influence or friend for you to be hanging with(?).

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Altostrata

Perhaps we can think about this a little differently -- not that we have to learn not to talk, but that we don't need to be defensive or try to get sympathy from people who aren't sympathetic.

 

For example: Simply state your truth quietly with conviction and don't apologize. Do not accept being belittled. If someone doesn't understand, turn away from that person towards someone who is more accepting.

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ajnjj

I have no one to discuss this with. I'm surrounded by people telling me to " get over it" or its " all in my head" and the best "hypochondria"

 

It's very hard. I suffer in silence. I won't even mention any symptoms to any doctors...which is very scary considering one day somethin might actually be medically wrong.

 

I am happy to have found a communty of people who don't judge and try to help eachother.

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Nikki

Perhaps we can think about this a little differently -- not that we have to learn not to talk, but that we don't need to be defensive or try to get sympathy from people who aren't sympathetic.

 

For example: Simply state your truth quietly with conviction and don't apologize. Do not accept being belittled. If someone doesn't understand, turn away from that person towards someone who is more accepting.

 

Alto there is a saying about why do I "go the the hardware store looking for a loaf of bread."

 

Ajnjj....Baxter has a good point, maybe we need new doctors. No need to suffer in silence we have each other to talk to :)

 

 

Hugs

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ajnjj

Thanks Nikki, sad but true.... I hold in a lot.

 

As for new doctors, well, I've had about 30 new docs in a 2.5 year period lol. Good luck with that one!!!!

 

Hope you are well.

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Barbarannamated

As for new doctors, well, I've had about 30 new docs in a 2.5 year period lol. Good luck with that one!!!!

 

WOW. That's... i cant find the right word. Scary, at the very least. I've had that many but over more years. Makes it very hard to believe in any.

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Nikki

About Psychiatrists....

 

I had an excellent one years back, but he moved. I scrambled to find one and that was how I found the Nurse Practitioner I go to. This all happened when Paxil was pulled from the shelves to introduce the new and improved time released Paxil from Hell.

 

I have seen so many people trying new psyc md's and it's the same story....more meds. I don't know if I have a control issue or cautious issue when it comes to being prescribed meds. I want to make the decision and do the research and find answers and listen/read the experience others have had.

 

I am at another crossroads with this stuff. I am at my wit's end with anxiety. Another post....

 

Hugs

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ajnjj

I know Barb,

When this all began I was frantic to find an answer. I didn't believe that I was depressed or anxious, like they all said, so I kept switching docs and switching specialists. Over 30 total in 2.5 years.

 

Sure, some were compassionate and ordered numerous tests. Some brushed me off. Some labeled me the minute they saw me.

 

It's SCARY. But, knowledge is power. Now, I feel like I know more than they do lol.

 

Still. I wish I could just take a few advil and feel great like everyone around me. Instead I walk around with a smile, sometimes my head is up my ass. Sometimes I'm ok. I try not to fall over from the dizziness. I try really hard to appear normal. To ignore the burning body parts. To quell my nausea. To cool the hot flashes. To tell myself the floor really isn't moving lol.

 

It's hard. Sometimes I just wannna give up. But what would that entail??? Ugh. Can't ever give up. Can't talk to family. Counseling drives me nuts.....

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Barbarannamated

My standard answer when people ask how I'm doing is going to be 'Fine'. I've had a few old friends send messages through Facebook (as that seems the only way people know how to message now) and when ive answered with anything health related - usually just say endocrine failure and don't refer to w/d - there is no response even when im replying to their question. Nothing. I wondered if messages were received and sent quick note to one saying that I answered her message. No response at all. Geez!

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meistersinger

I was roundly told by a not-so-close friend, fraternity brother, and classmate from college on Facebook NOT to talk about it on my alma mater's Marching Band's Facebook page, as it "stifles conversation.". Ironic thing is he is a music director for a large LCMS congregation in Omaha.

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Nikki

I post alot. You read, formulate and respond. You understand. The thought occurred to me that maybe there are some civilians who don't know how to respond, because they simply don't understand.

 

No one knew about WD or the dangers of meds (me included) and then very slowly word got out.

 

I remember saying that you have to see the Grand Canyon to really understand how magnificent it is, pictures and words don't really get it across.

 

The same with WD. Unless it has happened to you or you saw a loved one in physical and mental distress it's hard to get it.

 

Thank God we have one another :D :D :D :D :D

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Barbarannamated

I agree, Nikki. However, my recent situations had no mention of drugs, withdrawal, etc. Just people popping up asking how im doing, not getting a simple 'all is fine' (not anything in depth, either), and then no response. It's bizarre. These are friends of 30 years. I just can't care anymore.

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Skyler

I agree, Nikki. However, my recent situations had no mention of drugs, withdrawal, etc. Just people popping up asking how im doing, not getting a simple 'all is fine' (not anything in depth, either), and then no response. It's bizarre. These are friends of 30 years. I just can't care anymore.

 

I think people do not know how to respond to an illness that does not have a defined end point. They are great when it comes to an acute illness, but chronic conditions, not so much. It may be more difficult with withdrawal, but I'm not convinced. Our world can be a pretty cold place.

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Daisy

My standard answer when people ask how I'm doing is going to be 'Fine'. I've had a few old friends send messages through Facebook (as that seems the only way people know how to message now) and when ive answered with anything health related - usually just say endocrine failure and don't refer to w/d - there is no response even when im replying to their question. Nothing. I wondered if messages were received and sent quick note to one saying that I answered her message. No response at all. Geez!

 

Someone told me their interpretation of the word "fine." F*cking insecure neurotic and emotional. I just could not resist sharing that :lol:

 

Daisy

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Nikki

LOL :D :D :D

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shebop

 

Someone told me their interpretation of the word "fine." F*cking insecure neurotic and emotional. I just could not resist sharing that :lol:

 

Daisy

 

Thank you! This put a smile on my face! I resent that "fine" seems to be the only acceptable answer to the question "How are you?"

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tezza

When someone asks how you're doing they really don't want to know. I don't know why they even ask a question like that. I've learned to reply with "I'm fine". All is well...NOT! But people don't get it and don't care to learn about it either.

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Barbarannamated

When someone asks how you're doing they really don't want to know. I don't know why they even ask a question like that. I've learned to reply with "I'm fine". All is well...NOT! But people don't get it and don't care to learn about it either.

 

Sadly, that is so right. 'How are you?' has come to be a salutation. It puzzles me when people send messages asking how I am, which seems a tad more genuine, then... silence. It hurts.

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Skyler

 

When someone asks how you're doing they really don't want to know. I don't know why they even ask a question like that. I've learned to reply with "I'm fine". All is well...NOT! But people don't get it and don't care to learn about it either.

 

Sadly, that is so right. 'How are you?' has come to be a salutation. It puzzles me when people send messages asking how I am, which seems a tad more genuine, then... silence. It hurts.

 

People want to know about time limited acute type of illnesses, or chronic illnesses that flare up and then resolve. Chronic illnesses that linger, and this includes withdrawal, are not welcomed for the most part. Some of this is rooted in Social Darwinism (hard to compete when we are impaired), which is supported by the rugged individualist mind set we are steeped in. ~S

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Barbarannamated

Interesting, Schuyler! The thought popped into my head the other day as I was thinking about my gene pool/pattern of illnesses/infertility ... "Darwin was onto something"! So I, of course, began researching Darwinism. ;)

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Skyler

"Those that cannot keep up are either left behind or cut off. If evolution, through chance, is solely responsible for life as we now know it, why should that process be countered? If "survival of the fittest" or "kill or be killed" cannot apply in what we define as "decent society," then, which is wrong, society or evolution? If neither, then how do we explain morality, charity, and compassion? Why drain resources from the strong to support the weak? Certainly, we should be charitable and help those in need. " link

 

Big of them, isn't it? A good deal of what we find harsh in our society is predicated on this sort of mind set. Stick rugged individualism into the mix and and you have a perfect storm.

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Barbarannamated

Thought provoking to say the least.

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meistersinger

Thought provoking to say the least.

 

Ok sometimes wonder if big medicine and Pharma, as well as big business conspired to perform social Darwinism, as if classical liberalism is not enough.

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dalsaan

I've learnt to explain rather than complain. It has made a difference to how people resond. They now ask me questions rather than change the subject and I feel less like a broken record

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