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Tanha: never stabilize under diazepam but want to taper


Tanha

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4 minutes ago, powerback said:

Itl come back to you some day ,ive had severe noise sensitivity on and off  for more than 2 years .

Love my nature walks also ,they've stopped the last 6 months during my sickest. External health issues have exacerbated my situation hugely .

Take care.

Thank you for sharing this with me. 

I wish you a good calm new year or whatever you like.

2010-2018 sertralin, venlafaxin, cymbalta 120 mg, march bupropio, Lorazepam 4 to 0,5 mg qetiapine 200-400 mg Apr mirtazapin 30 - 45 mg, lo tapered, to 0; Apr switch to diazepam 3 mg; jun/jul 15mg, taper to approx. 4,5 mg, Aug: 200 to 400 mg q, 50 mg levomepromazine, m 45 to 30 mg; since tapered q 400-230 mg, m 30 to 15 mg, 1dez m to 16 mg, 4dez 250 mg q, 31. dec 200 mg q

March 1, 2019 - 200 mg quetiapine, 4,5 mg diazepam, 16 mg mirtazapine

March 3, 2019 - 200 mg quetiapine, 4,0 mg diazepam, 16 mg mirtazapine

March 4, 2019 - 200 mg quetiapine, 4,2 mg diazepam,16 mg mirtazapine, 

june 5, 2019 - 100 mg quetiapine, 3 mg Diazepam, 12,185 mg mirtazapine 

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12 minutes ago, Tanha said:

I dearly hope that holding doses for a while will make the terrible flue go away. 

I hope anhedonia lessens soon. 

don't fight it ,its energy you need to get well ,it will change .

I remember the first few months of withdrawl [75mg down to 37.5mg at the time Effexor  ] I had this and flehm would come off my chest for months ,it will change.

its your body reacting normally to what it perceives  a toxin ,please ride it out .get vitamin c into you ,this is water soluble and needs replenishing every 3 hours  .

I drink lemon and lime water everyday .I add manuka honey and garlic if I feel it coming on bad .

Alcohol free since February 2015 

1MG diazepam

4.5MG PROZAC.

 

 

 

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4 minutes ago, powerback said:

don't fight it ,its energy you need to get well ,it will change .

I remember the first few months of withdrawl [75mg down to 37.5mg at the time Effexor  ] I had this and flehm would come off my chest for months ,it will change.

its your body reacting normally to what it perceives  a toxin ,please ride it out .get vitamin c into you ,this is water soluble and needs replenishing every 3 hours  .

I drink lemon and lime water everyday .I had manuka honey and garlic if I feel it coming on bad .

 

 What do you mean by „ I had this and flehm would come off my chest for months ,it will change.“

 

I need to taper extremely slowly so I hope the flue gets better before I can significantly can reduce any toxine. 

 

I have a special vitamin juice. Cellagon aurum. I like supplements to be as natural as possible

 

Thank you so much @powerback

2010-2018 sertralin, venlafaxin, cymbalta 120 mg, march bupropio, Lorazepam 4 to 0,5 mg qetiapine 200-400 mg Apr mirtazapin 30 - 45 mg, lo tapered, to 0; Apr switch to diazepam 3 mg; jun/jul 15mg, taper to approx. 4,5 mg, Aug: 200 to 400 mg q, 50 mg levomepromazine, m 45 to 30 mg; since tapered q 400-230 mg, m 30 to 15 mg, 1dez m to 16 mg, 4dez 250 mg q, 31. dec 200 mg q

March 1, 2019 - 200 mg quetiapine, 4,5 mg diazepam, 16 mg mirtazapine

March 3, 2019 - 200 mg quetiapine, 4,0 mg diazepam, 16 mg mirtazapine

March 4, 2019 - 200 mg quetiapine, 4,2 mg diazepam,16 mg mirtazapine, 

june 5, 2019 - 100 mg quetiapine, 3 mg Diazepam, 12,185 mg mirtazapine 

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9 minutes ago, Tanha said:

 What do you mean by „ I had this and flehm would come off my chest for months ,it will change.“

I presumed you were talking about withdrawl flu ,you must of meant the typical flu .

Alcohol free since February 2015 

1MG diazepam

4.5MG PROZAC.

 

 

 

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Latest withdrawl:

 

Last cut of quetiapine 11 days ago 

(250-235 mg)

 

the cut before is only 3,5 weeks ago

(262 - 230 mg)

 

emergencyupdose (230 - 250 mg a week before last cut) due to severe withdrawl

 

before that a cut another 4 weeks ago

(275 - 262 mg)

 

august 2018: 400 mg quetiapine up from 200 mg by doctors during diazepamwithdrawl-crisis (hyperarousel, total insomnia)

since then always tapered.

 

Cut mirtazapine 1 month ago from 20-16 mg

 

27 dec

 

5 am.        woke, swallowing problems,

                  sore throat, sick

                  airhunger, diaahrrea 

7 am.        fatigue, anxiety, despair

7:30 am.  meat, cucumber, oats, 

                  hempprotein

                  magnesium

                  50 mg quetiapine       

                  1 mg diazepam

                  vitamin d

8 am.        arousel, can not make my 

                  body do anything. Fatigue, No

                  musclecontrol-feeling,

                  no will/interest. bedridden.  

                  cannot eat or wash myself

 .                sore throat until late

                  severe anhedonia

9 am.        arousel, dry mouth, fatigue

9:40 am.   hyperarousel worse, 

                   severely  Fluelike sick, feels  

                  like cannot control muscles

                  total apathy, empty

10:30 am. dizzy, no therapy attended, 

                   feeling like low bloodpressure

                   Total dead inside, restless 

11 am.       burning chest, sick, anxiety 

                   and hyperarousel worse

                   Noni juice

noon.         meat, vegetables,potatoe

                   55 mg quetiapine        

                   1,5 mg diazepam

                   Depression less painful

                   flue better

1:15 pm.    hyperarousel and akathisia

                    muscleproblem

2 pm.          eyes bad, arousel

2:30 pm.    bad akathisia, bad flue, 

                    dizzy, severe anhedonia,

                    weak muscles

                    Vitamine juice

                    magnesium

3:30 pm.    akathisia milder

5:30 pm.    flue better, 

                    meat, cucumber

                    oats, hempprotein

                    magnesium

                    62,5 mg quetiapine      

                    1,5 mg diazepam     

                    magnesium

6:30 pm.     bad flue back, sore thtoat,

                     weak

7:30 pm.     buttercroissant

8 pm.          16 mg mirtazapine 

9:30 pm.     67,5 mg quetiapine    

                    1 mg diazepam

                    still flue, dizzy, weak, fatigue

 

compared to days before:

 

sore throat all day, flue severe, most of the day with small breaks, akathisia worse, hyperarousel not as bad but all day, all day anhedonia, in the morning terrible anhedonia and physical state and fatigue, no feelings all day, most of the day out of my mind, bad eyes all day

2010-2018 sertralin, venlafaxin, cymbalta 120 mg, march bupropio, Lorazepam 4 to 0,5 mg qetiapine 200-400 mg Apr mirtazapin 30 - 45 mg, lo tapered, to 0; Apr switch to diazepam 3 mg; jun/jul 15mg, taper to approx. 4,5 mg, Aug: 200 to 400 mg q, 50 mg levomepromazine, m 45 to 30 mg; since tapered q 400-230 mg, m 30 to 15 mg, 1dez m to 16 mg, 4dez 250 mg q, 31. dec 200 mg q

March 1, 2019 - 200 mg quetiapine, 4,5 mg diazepam, 16 mg mirtazapine

March 3, 2019 - 200 mg quetiapine, 4,0 mg diazepam, 16 mg mirtazapine

March 4, 2019 - 200 mg quetiapine, 4,2 mg diazepam,16 mg mirtazapine, 

june 5, 2019 - 100 mg quetiapine, 3 mg Diazepam, 12,185 mg mirtazapine 

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I hope so dearly that time is a healer for me, too!

 

This is my first „hold“ since I am on these s... drugs. 

 

The flue must get better soon.

 

😱

2010-2018 sertralin, venlafaxin, cymbalta 120 mg, march bupropio, Lorazepam 4 to 0,5 mg qetiapine 200-400 mg Apr mirtazapin 30 - 45 mg, lo tapered, to 0; Apr switch to diazepam 3 mg; jun/jul 15mg, taper to approx. 4,5 mg, Aug: 200 to 400 mg q, 50 mg levomepromazine, m 45 to 30 mg; since tapered q 400-230 mg, m 30 to 15 mg, 1dez m to 16 mg, 4dez 250 mg q, 31. dec 200 mg q

March 1, 2019 - 200 mg quetiapine, 4,5 mg diazepam, 16 mg mirtazapine

March 3, 2019 - 200 mg quetiapine, 4,0 mg diazepam, 16 mg mirtazapine

March 4, 2019 - 200 mg quetiapine, 4,2 mg diazepam,16 mg mirtazapine, 

june 5, 2019 - 100 mg quetiapine, 3 mg Diazepam, 12,185 mg mirtazapine 

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4 hours ago, Tanha said:

The doctors said it is vital to take diazepam 4 times a day against interdosewithdrawl. ....

 

This seems unlikely for diazepam. Even doctors know it has a long half-life. The doctors might have been referring to lorazepam or other benzo.

 

To me, the pattern of "akathisia" and "hyperarousal" shortly after taking your diazepam-quetiapine cocktail throughout the day indicates the drugs are causing the symptoms. They are not breakthrough symptoms. Insomnia also can be caused by too much drugs.

 

As your symptoms are caused by taking too much of the drugs, reducing your drug burden is the only way to reduce the drug-induced reaction. We do not have any magic powers to eliminate your symptoms while keeping your drug intake constant.

 

Most likely, you are addicted to the level of diazepam you are taking. My suggestion was to carefully reduce the quetiapine. The rest is up to you.

This is not medical advice. Discuss any decisions about your medical care with a knowledgeable medical practitioner.

"It has become appallingly obvious that our technology has surpassed our humanity." -- Albert Einstein

All postings © copyrighted.

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Here is a link to Jane Austen LibriVox audio books.  Because they are in the public domain they are free.

 

https://librivox.org/author/155?primary_key=155&search_category=author&search_page=1&search_form=get_results

* NO LONGER ACTIVE on SA *

MISSION ACCOMPLISHED:  (6 year taper)      0mg Pristiq  on 13th November 2021

ADs since ~1992:  25+ years - 1 unknown, Prozac (muscle weakness), Zoloft; citalopram (pooped out) CTed (very sick for 2.5 wks a few months after); Pristiq:  50mg 2012, 100mg beg 2013 (Serotonin Toxicity)  Tapering from Oct 2015 - 13 Nov 2021   LAST DOSE 0.0025mg

Post 0 updates start here    My tapering program     My Intro (goes to tapering graph)

 VIDEO:   Antidepressant Withdrawal Syndrome and its Management

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11 hours ago, Altostrata said:

 

This seems unlikely for diazepam. Even doctors know it has a long half-life. The doctors might have been referring to lorazepam or other benzo.

 

To me, the pattern of "akathisia" and "hyperarousal" shortly after taking your diazepam-quetiapine cocktail throughout the day indicates the drugs are causing the symptoms. They are not breakthrough symptoms. Insomnia also can be caused by too much drugs.

 

As your symptoms are caused by taking too much of the drugs, reducing your drug burden is the only way to reduce the drug-induced reaction. We do not have any magic powers to eliminate your symptoms while keeping your drug intake constant.

 

Most likely, you are addicted to the level of diazepam you are taking. My suggestion was to carefully reduce the quetiapine. The rest is up to you.

Dear @Altostrata

 

thank you. 

I have been reducing my drug burden very fast and many drugs parallel in the last months as you can see.

i am so sick and bedridden I think of both, withdrawl and the drugs itself. 

 

You mentioned again that i won‘t get better by keeping my drugs constant.

But isn‘t that what „holding“ is about? 

 

do you see any chance that I can stabilize a bit before making the next cut at all? My symptoms are really severe which means holding and stabilizing for long, right? 

 

If not how do I proceed? how long do I wait? (How does the flue fit in having it for more than two months now?)

I „hold“ for at least another month which is best I can do now, right??????? Because I cut so much so fast until now and symptoms are so severe, or do you think differently?

 

I know that I have to cut quetiapine very slowly because anhedonia and hyperarousel get terrible after a cut. I also know that I get sicker while on the drugs. Do you have any idea how the flue and hyperarousel (both getting worse)  fit into this pattern or what the next steps are to find that out?

 

Would it be possible that i continue to post my daily pattern and you help me in a while looking at it from a distance and sorting out what has helped and what not for me getting a more stable withdrawl Rythm? I am not functioning at all which is no good for stabilizing and withdrawing by myself but doctors are of no help at all. My judgment is so impaired and of course I lack experience of a working withdrawl pattern. I know I have to find it out for myself but it would make such a huge difference if you could stick with me for a little while. I am so lost in all my agony.

 

2010-2018 sertralin, venlafaxin, cymbalta 120 mg, march bupropio, Lorazepam 4 to 0,5 mg qetiapine 200-400 mg Apr mirtazapin 30 - 45 mg, lo tapered, to 0; Apr switch to diazepam 3 mg; jun/jul 15mg, taper to approx. 4,5 mg, Aug: 200 to 400 mg q, 50 mg levomepromazine, m 45 to 30 mg; since tapered q 400-230 mg, m 30 to 15 mg, 1dez m to 16 mg, 4dez 250 mg q, 31. dec 200 mg q

March 1, 2019 - 200 mg quetiapine, 4,5 mg diazepam, 16 mg mirtazapine

March 3, 2019 - 200 mg quetiapine, 4,0 mg diazepam, 16 mg mirtazapine

March 4, 2019 - 200 mg quetiapine, 4,2 mg diazepam,16 mg mirtazapine, 

june 5, 2019 - 100 mg quetiapine, 3 mg Diazepam, 12,185 mg mirtazapine 

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Doing anything or holding?

Is a withdrawl-flue selflimiting or not?

It can be a sideeffects if the drug and only stop if I stop the causing drug (I have three drugs to choose from and years of tapering that - does that mean I have this flue for years? I have it for more than two months and it is lifethreatening because I loose weight and get weaker and weaker cannot eat wash function).?

 

Can my flue get any better by holding the doses? It used to be there only for Agee hours around noon, now it is 24/7!

It is so disabling as the hyperarousel and anhedonia are, too.

I wonder if my last cut of quetiapine causes this severe situation and how to deal with that. 

Or ct cymbalta in March could have caused it or reducing mirtazapin and levomepromazine too fast.

 

I read a lot that only updosing will help but I do not want to do that. 

 

please, any encouragement is welcome because during withdrawl for this whole year now I have never done anything right to stabilize. Symptoms are so severe and worsening. I need to find a way getting me out of this while I am getting weaker and weaker. 

2010-2018 sertralin, venlafaxin, cymbalta 120 mg, march bupropio, Lorazepam 4 to 0,5 mg qetiapine 200-400 mg Apr mirtazapin 30 - 45 mg, lo tapered, to 0; Apr switch to diazepam 3 mg; jun/jul 15mg, taper to approx. 4,5 mg, Aug: 200 to 400 mg q, 50 mg levomepromazine, m 45 to 30 mg; since tapered q 400-230 mg, m 30 to 15 mg, 1dez m to 16 mg, 4dez 250 mg q, 31. dec 200 mg q

March 1, 2019 - 200 mg quetiapine, 4,5 mg diazepam, 16 mg mirtazapine

March 3, 2019 - 200 mg quetiapine, 4,0 mg diazepam, 16 mg mirtazapine

March 4, 2019 - 200 mg quetiapine, 4,2 mg diazepam,16 mg mirtazapine, 

june 5, 2019 - 100 mg quetiapine, 3 mg Diazepam, 12,185 mg mirtazapine 

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I found an interesting theory about withdrawl-flue as a healing crisis.

 

It might help understanding why and what is withdrawl-flue but gives no guidance of what to do if one got it already or if it is selflimitating as most doctors believe.

 

it promotes that this flue symptoms are do to too fast tapering or ct.

 

The theory is about cytokine-Storm and the hypothesis of inflammation:

 

http://antidepressantwithdrawal.info/forum/showthread.php?1002-Cytokine-storm-Paxil-flu-detox-flu-healing-crisis

2010-2018 sertralin, venlafaxin, cymbalta 120 mg, march bupropio, Lorazepam 4 to 0,5 mg qetiapine 200-400 mg Apr mirtazapin 30 - 45 mg, lo tapered, to 0; Apr switch to diazepam 3 mg; jun/jul 15mg, taper to approx. 4,5 mg, Aug: 200 to 400 mg q, 50 mg levomepromazine, m 45 to 30 mg; since tapered q 400-230 mg, m 30 to 15 mg, 1dez m to 16 mg, 4dez 250 mg q, 31. dec 200 mg q

March 1, 2019 - 200 mg quetiapine, 4,5 mg diazepam, 16 mg mirtazapine

March 3, 2019 - 200 mg quetiapine, 4,0 mg diazepam, 16 mg mirtazapine

March 4, 2019 - 200 mg quetiapine, 4,2 mg diazepam,16 mg mirtazapine, 

june 5, 2019 - 100 mg quetiapine, 3 mg Diazepam, 12,185 mg mirtazapine 

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My question is:

how long to hold between cuts if symptoms don‘t stabilize?

 

eg. the flue or hyperarousel or anhedonia  do not get any better. 

 

How do I find out if withdrawl itself or the drugsideeffects are the cause of severe persistent symptoms? 

Particularly if many drugs are involved and a year long withdrawl is in danger because one gets weaker and weaker too fast.

This puts the whole project of slow withdrawl and survival at danger.

 

for me it is very important to get my muscles back after being and while being bedridden for almost a year now. The persistent flue is making this almost impossible. 

To get my brain rewired is also very difficult with a bad flue all the time.

2010-2018 sertralin, venlafaxin, cymbalta 120 mg, march bupropio, Lorazepam 4 to 0,5 mg qetiapine 200-400 mg Apr mirtazapin 30 - 45 mg, lo tapered, to 0; Apr switch to diazepam 3 mg; jun/jul 15mg, taper to approx. 4,5 mg, Aug: 200 to 400 mg q, 50 mg levomepromazine, m 45 to 30 mg; since tapered q 400-230 mg, m 30 to 15 mg, 1dez m to 16 mg, 4dez 250 mg q, 31. dec 200 mg q

March 1, 2019 - 200 mg quetiapine, 4,5 mg diazepam, 16 mg mirtazapine

March 3, 2019 - 200 mg quetiapine, 4,0 mg diazepam, 16 mg mirtazapine

March 4, 2019 - 200 mg quetiapine, 4,2 mg diazepam,16 mg mirtazapine, 

june 5, 2019 - 100 mg quetiapine, 3 mg Diazepam, 12,185 mg mirtazapine 

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Dear @Altostrata

 

i am sorry but I always get the notion that you don‘t See me getting better with holding my dose inbetween cuts.

i did never hold long enough though. 

I am always very insecure of what you want to tell me. 

Do you think the recommended hold of four weeks is sufficient or on the other side not helpful?

 

I am so unstable and severely sick that I cannot think of any procedure to work. 

To accept this state as my wd normal for years is impossible. 

How do I stabilize to get ahead with my tapers?

2010-2018 sertralin, venlafaxin, cymbalta 120 mg, march bupropio, Lorazepam 4 to 0,5 mg qetiapine 200-400 mg Apr mirtazapin 30 - 45 mg, lo tapered, to 0; Apr switch to diazepam 3 mg; jun/jul 15mg, taper to approx. 4,5 mg, Aug: 200 to 400 mg q, 50 mg levomepromazine, m 45 to 30 mg; since tapered q 400-230 mg, m 30 to 15 mg, 1dez m to 16 mg, 4dez 250 mg q, 31. dec 200 mg q

March 1, 2019 - 200 mg quetiapine, 4,5 mg diazepam, 16 mg mirtazapine

March 3, 2019 - 200 mg quetiapine, 4,0 mg diazepam, 16 mg mirtazapine

March 4, 2019 - 200 mg quetiapine, 4,2 mg diazepam,16 mg mirtazapine, 

june 5, 2019 - 100 mg quetiapine, 3 mg Diazepam, 12,185 mg mirtazapine 

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There is an intersting source about

 

The Anti-Depressant, Brain Fog, And Histamine Intolerance Connection

by Alison Vickery, 

 

mainly based on information from David Healey. 

Several Hypothesis are introduced if and how antidepressants interfere with the histaminsystem, mainly be destabilizing it. 

 

https://alisonvickery.com.au/the-anti-depressant-brain-fog-and-histamine-intolerance-connection/

2010-2018 sertralin, venlafaxin, cymbalta 120 mg, march bupropio, Lorazepam 4 to 0,5 mg qetiapine 200-400 mg Apr mirtazapin 30 - 45 mg, lo tapered, to 0; Apr switch to diazepam 3 mg; jun/jul 15mg, taper to approx. 4,5 mg, Aug: 200 to 400 mg q, 50 mg levomepromazine, m 45 to 30 mg; since tapered q 400-230 mg, m 30 to 15 mg, 1dez m to 16 mg, 4dez 250 mg q, 31. dec 200 mg q

March 1, 2019 - 200 mg quetiapine, 4,5 mg diazepam, 16 mg mirtazapine

March 3, 2019 - 200 mg quetiapine, 4,0 mg diazepam, 16 mg mirtazapine

March 4, 2019 - 200 mg quetiapine, 4,2 mg diazepam,16 mg mirtazapine, 

june 5, 2019 - 100 mg quetiapine, 3 mg Diazepam, 12,185 mg mirtazapine 

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12 days since last cut of quetiapine

1 month and 1 week after last cut mirtazapine

65 days since cutting levomepromazine to zero

9 months since ct cymbalta and promethazine

 

28 dec

 

5:30 am.  woke from muscle cramps,

                  sore throat, fluelike sick

                  airhunger, diaahrrea 

6 am.        severe anhedonia, despair

                  Bedridden, impaired vision,

                  severe flue and sore throat

7:30 am.  meat, cucumber, oats, 

                  hempprotein

                  magnesium

                  50 mg quetiapine       

                  1 mg diazepam

                  vitamin d

10 am.      can not make my 

                  body do anything,

                  no will/interest. bedridden.  

                  cannot eat or wash myself

 .                sore throat until late

                  severe anhedonia

                  severe flue, very dizzy

                  feeling of low bloodpressure 

11 am.      Noni juice

noon.         meat, cabbage, ,rice

                   55 mg quetiapine        

                   1,5 mg diazepam

                   Anhedonia less painful

1pm.          slight arousel, worse 

                   akathisia, heartpounding,

                   bad sore throat

2:30 pm.    everything worse, very weak,

                    but arousel still mild

                    Vitamine juice

                    magnesium

                    cake

4:20 pm.    Anhedonia through the roof,

                    Bad dp, akathisia

5:30 pm.    meat, cucumber

                    oats, hempprotein

                    magnesium

                    62,5 mg quetiapine      

                    1,5 mg diazepam     

                    magnesium

6:30 pm.     bad flue and sore throat

8 pm.          16 mg mirtazapine 

7:20 pm.     Hyperarousel bad, akathisia

9:30 pm.     67,5 mg quetiapine    

                    1 mg diazepam

                    still flue, dizzy, weak

 

compared to days before:

 

less muscleweakness, less arousel, anhedonia worse and more, flue and sore throat worse and longer, utter despair, bad eyes all day

2010-2018 sertralin, venlafaxin, cymbalta 120 mg, march bupropio, Lorazepam 4 to 0,5 mg qetiapine 200-400 mg Apr mirtazapin 30 - 45 mg, lo tapered, to 0; Apr switch to diazepam 3 mg; jun/jul 15mg, taper to approx. 4,5 mg, Aug: 200 to 400 mg q, 50 mg levomepromazine, m 45 to 30 mg; since tapered q 400-230 mg, m 30 to 15 mg, 1dez m to 16 mg, 4dez 250 mg q, 31. dec 200 mg q

March 1, 2019 - 200 mg quetiapine, 4,5 mg diazepam, 16 mg mirtazapine

March 3, 2019 - 200 mg quetiapine, 4,0 mg diazepam, 16 mg mirtazapine

March 4, 2019 - 200 mg quetiapine, 4,2 mg diazepam,16 mg mirtazapine, 

june 5, 2019 - 100 mg quetiapine, 3 mg Diazepam, 12,185 mg mirtazapine 

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Thank you for all the help so far. 

 

Thank you „SA“ for sharing sooooo many real experiences. Not one doctor can provide such broad „clinical“ experience from a patients perspective!

 

i am glad that here is so much to read through. 

2010-2018 sertralin, venlafaxin, cymbalta 120 mg, march bupropio, Lorazepam 4 to 0,5 mg qetiapine 200-400 mg Apr mirtazapin 30 - 45 mg, lo tapered, to 0; Apr switch to diazepam 3 mg; jun/jul 15mg, taper to approx. 4,5 mg, Aug: 200 to 400 mg q, 50 mg levomepromazine, m 45 to 30 mg; since tapered q 400-230 mg, m 30 to 15 mg, 1dez m to 16 mg, 4dez 250 mg q, 31. dec 200 mg q

March 1, 2019 - 200 mg quetiapine, 4,5 mg diazepam, 16 mg mirtazapine

March 3, 2019 - 200 mg quetiapine, 4,0 mg diazepam, 16 mg mirtazapine

March 4, 2019 - 200 mg quetiapine, 4,2 mg diazepam,16 mg mirtazapine, 

june 5, 2019 - 100 mg quetiapine, 3 mg Diazepam, 12,185 mg mirtazapine 

Link to comment

Isn‘t it funny that every post ends with the question „save“ and then „saving“?

 

Yes, I do want to be saved (or cancelled if that is not posdible).

 

I have so little believe to survive but only a moment longer.

 

it is simple logic:

 

i take medicine that gives me as a paradoxical reaction hyperarousel and as sideeffects or withdrawleffect akathisia (restlessness). 

(i also suffer from Depression.)

 

I can only slowly taper this, taking years.

 

while tapering I have hyperarousel due to withdrawl and due to paradoxical reaction, making it a double load of arousel. Plus akathisia. 

I suffer greatly, not only from hyperarousel and akathisia! 

and the hyperarousel in itself is bearly  manageable. 

What a bright future lies ahead of me with hyperarousel and hyperarousel and .... akathisia, anhedonia,dp!

 

so far I havn‘t Had my feelings back. If they do they come they come at first as ....

well, right, as arousel (before I notice them as feelings with too much energy to them.)

 

the body protects itself from all this stress by dissociation which feeds my 24/7 dp that I have since December last year. 

A really frightening condition in Itself. 

 

I believe dp and all the arousel is being caused by a neurotoxic trauma: having been taking 120 mg cymbalta for years, a totally overpowerd stimulant converting my normal emotions into -yep- high arousel states. ct cymbalta created even a new state for me called panic attack and dp. Never had that before!!!

 

and now my poor body is fighting like hell to keep me alive around all this medication induced ongoing disregulation 

and

yes, I don‘t want this life ....

with severe symptoms playing pingpong. 

Not one window cause my body is fighting in the darkness not finding the enemy nor the path to calmness or even back to something I could call „myself“. 

 

and finally:

the latest thing in all this impairment „Hype“ within me are neuroemotions. You can have these even as an anhedonic zombie. Drug induced emotions which at best one considers as not being ones true emotions. They are incredibly painful.

 

i would love to think: this too shall pass.

but there are so many layers of fog and emptiness around and within me for a whole year now that I lost all paths and all hopes. I have friends and relatives who have hope for me though. That helps a bit. 

 

Enduring hyperarousel, akathisia, anhedonia, fatigue, withdrawlsyndrome (flue) and dp are my depressive mantra. Surviving the next half hour is my daily goal. No closing eyes, no relaxation (only heavily overdrugged sleep), no distraction from this agony (no tv, no Book, no smalltalk), no calming down ever. Just pacing and pacing - mentally and physically - one step after another. 

 

I am really wondering why my mind bothers me with a functioning memory of what life was until cymbalta and all the other hells that I intake now (ad‘s, ap‘s, Benzos).

 

And i Wonder why my body bothers me with only five sensations (being left) but no other: 

pain, numbness, alienation, hyperarousel, sickness (flue). 

 

I wonder what kind of „self“ my poor soul and body will create around these obstacles. I fear this person I might be, if at all. I am shattered to pieces and cannot or fear to imagine that this too shall pass. 

 

 

I cannot read my beloved Shakespeare or David Foster Wallace (infinite jest).

yet:

Wow, brainfog is bad but I still can make up these words. Whyyyy?

2010-2018 sertralin, venlafaxin, cymbalta 120 mg, march bupropio, Lorazepam 4 to 0,5 mg qetiapine 200-400 mg Apr mirtazapin 30 - 45 mg, lo tapered, to 0; Apr switch to diazepam 3 mg; jun/jul 15mg, taper to approx. 4,5 mg, Aug: 200 to 400 mg q, 50 mg levomepromazine, m 45 to 30 mg; since tapered q 400-230 mg, m 30 to 15 mg, 1dez m to 16 mg, 4dez 250 mg q, 31. dec 200 mg q

March 1, 2019 - 200 mg quetiapine, 4,5 mg diazepam, 16 mg mirtazapine

March 3, 2019 - 200 mg quetiapine, 4,0 mg diazepam, 16 mg mirtazapine

March 4, 2019 - 200 mg quetiapine, 4,2 mg diazepam,16 mg mirtazapine, 

june 5, 2019 - 100 mg quetiapine, 3 mg Diazepam, 12,185 mg mirtazapine 

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  • Administrator

Holding between cuts is not going to bring about stabilization if you continue to overdose yourself several times a day.

 

On 12/27/2018 at 10:39 AM, Tanha said:

Last cut of quetiapine 11 days ago 

(250-235 mg)

 

the cut before is only 3,5 weeks ago

(262 - 230 mg)

 

emergencyupdose (230 - 250 mg a week before last cut) due to severe withdrawl

 

before that a cut another 4 weeks ago

(275 - 262 mg)

 

Are you taking 235mg quetiapine per day now? Did your symptoms get worse after you reduced quetiapine from 250mg to 235mg on December 16? It doesn't look like they did.

 

Do you always get "Hyperarousel bad, akathisia" after taking mirtazapine at night?

 

What exactly is your drug schedule now? Please post only your drug schedule, no commentary.

This is not medical advice. Discuss any decisions about your medical care with a knowledgeable medical practitioner.

"It has become appallingly obvious that our technology has surpassed our humanity." -- Albert Einstein

All postings © copyrighted.

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Dear altostrat,

 

my daily drugschedule since 18. dec:

235 mg quetiapine 

16 mg mirtazapine 

5 mg diazepam

magnesium

fishoil

vitamin d

 

Symptoms didn‘t change a lot after reducing quetiapine from 250 mg to 235 mg but the pattern:

 

cannot say anhedonia or flue are worse but I used to have windows during the day and directly two days after a cut. This is gone.

 

anhedonia i have now every morning more persistently since the cut but hasn‘t changed otherwise.

 

Sore throat is new.

i am definitely not sick or have allergies though it feels like an allergic reaction.

 

More often dizzy Izzy but less intense.

Less spike but during the day more persistent.

 

The hyperarousel always 1,5 hours after taking meds (except mirtazapine) is 

slightly better.

akathisia spikes are better and less physical agitation.

 

pattern has changed a lot:

 

the hyperarousel every day at 5 pm has gotten more intense now and is more regularly and longer again (as it was until updose from 200 to 400 mg in July). I didn‘t have this for long. Also before lunch arousel is often a bit more I think.

i Never ever had any arousel after taking mirtazapine at 8 pm. This is definitely worse.

 

the fluelike sickness is much longer now during the day, actually 24/7 and has two spikes instead of one (starts immediately after getting up and never ends whereas before the cut I had it only from 10 am to 2 or 3 pm). 

The flue is slightly better between 1 pm and 3 pm. Spikes at 10 am and 3 pm.

Before a week ago it was opposite to this: absolutely no flue in mornings and evenings but very bad between 10am and 2/3 pm. 

 

No nausea for a week but I think this will come back. 

Sore throat started after the last cut and Persists. I am not in a normal way sick or allergic! 

 

feeling of not being able to control muscles and will is a little worse (always more from 9 am to 1 pm). this is a fairly new symptome (started or increased only 4 weeks ago after cutting quetiapine from 262 to 230 mg or after the small updose to 250 mg 3 weeks ago). 

 

bouts of fatigue on some days is absolutely new after last cut.

 

A little more anxiety in the mornings.

 

Other feelings seem to be even more distant and are persistently gone. 

I had windows with no flue and good feelings for two days after every cut of quetiapine. This didn‘t happen this time.

 

akathisia is more mental and more at the same level during the day than before. Less spikes. I would say: improvement!

 

All symptoms always almost used to subside after taking mirtazapine at 8 pm in the evening (except brainfog and some days depression). Akathisia ist still better after taking mirtazapine but since a couple of days arousel and flue are not better after 8 pm. This is absolutely new. I was always back to almost normal after 8 pm throughout the year.

 

I wake a little aerlier.

Diarrhea is the same. 

The urge to urinate is less often.

 

more memories all day since a week but feel not connected. 

 

 

Daily dosages:

 

7:30 am.   50 mg quetiapine     

                   1 mg diazepam      

                    magnesiumglyzinate

                    vitamin d (colicaliciferole)

 

11 am.       Noni juice

 

noon.         55 mg quetiapine     

                   1,5 mg diazepam

 

2:30 pm.   Vitamine juice

                   magnesiumglyzinate

 

5:30 pm.   62,5 mg quetiapine    

                   1,5 mg diazepam

                   magnesiumglyzinate

 

8 pm.         16 mg mirtazapine 

 

9:30 pm.    67,5 mg quetiapine     

                    1 mg diazepam

2010-2018 sertralin, venlafaxin, cymbalta 120 mg, march bupropio, Lorazepam 4 to 0,5 mg qetiapine 200-400 mg Apr mirtazapin 30 - 45 mg, lo tapered, to 0; Apr switch to diazepam 3 mg; jun/jul 15mg, taper to approx. 4,5 mg, Aug: 200 to 400 mg q, 50 mg levomepromazine, m 45 to 30 mg; since tapered q 400-230 mg, m 30 to 15 mg, 1dez m to 16 mg, 4dez 250 mg q, 31. dec 200 mg q

March 1, 2019 - 200 mg quetiapine, 4,5 mg diazepam, 16 mg mirtazapine

March 3, 2019 - 200 mg quetiapine, 4,0 mg diazepam, 16 mg mirtazapine

March 4, 2019 - 200 mg quetiapine, 4,2 mg diazepam,16 mg mirtazapine, 

june 5, 2019 - 100 mg quetiapine, 3 mg Diazepam, 12,185 mg mirtazapine 

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Forgot one improvement:

burning skin is much milder now.

 

But

feeling of airhunger is new.

2010-2018 sertralin, venlafaxin, cymbalta 120 mg, march bupropio, Lorazepam 4 to 0,5 mg qetiapine 200-400 mg Apr mirtazapin 30 - 45 mg, lo tapered, to 0; Apr switch to diazepam 3 mg; jun/jul 15mg, taper to approx. 4,5 mg, Aug: 200 to 400 mg q, 50 mg levomepromazine, m 45 to 30 mg; since tapered q 400-230 mg, m 30 to 15 mg, 1dez m to 16 mg, 4dez 250 mg q, 31. dec 200 mg q

March 1, 2019 - 200 mg quetiapine, 4,5 mg diazepam, 16 mg mirtazapine

March 3, 2019 - 200 mg quetiapine, 4,0 mg diazepam, 16 mg mirtazapine

March 4, 2019 - 200 mg quetiapine, 4,2 mg diazepam,16 mg mirtazapine, 

june 5, 2019 - 100 mg quetiapine, 3 mg Diazepam, 12,185 mg mirtazapine 

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Is it valuable to take n-Acetylcystein during withdrawl?

 

my brainfog is bad and I have a strange symptome: it feels like I cannot control my arms or legs and my will but it only feels like it. Akathisia, anxiety and depression.

i also have a permanent fluelike sickness. 

 

At what dose may I start a try? 

2010-2018 sertralin, venlafaxin, cymbalta 120 mg, march bupropio, Lorazepam 4 to 0,5 mg qetiapine 200-400 mg Apr mirtazapin 30 - 45 mg, lo tapered, to 0; Apr switch to diazepam 3 mg; jun/jul 15mg, taper to approx. 4,5 mg, Aug: 200 to 400 mg q, 50 mg levomepromazine, m 45 to 30 mg; since tapered q 400-230 mg, m 30 to 15 mg, 1dez m to 16 mg, 4dez 250 mg q, 31. dec 200 mg q

March 1, 2019 - 200 mg quetiapine, 4,5 mg diazepam, 16 mg mirtazapine

March 3, 2019 - 200 mg quetiapine, 4,0 mg diazepam, 16 mg mirtazapine

March 4, 2019 - 200 mg quetiapine, 4,2 mg diazepam,16 mg mirtazapine, 

june 5, 2019 - 100 mg quetiapine, 3 mg Diazepam, 12,185 mg mirtazapine 

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i am actually not allowed to know my diazepam dosage. I also have to take it 4 times a day at the mentioned times. 

I start a big discussion if I want to have the diazepam dosages changed. 

But if necessary/helpful I do so.

2010-2018 sertralin, venlafaxin, cymbalta 120 mg, march bupropio, Lorazepam 4 to 0,5 mg qetiapine 200-400 mg Apr mirtazapin 30 - 45 mg, lo tapered, to 0; Apr switch to diazepam 3 mg; jun/jul 15mg, taper to approx. 4,5 mg, Aug: 200 to 400 mg q, 50 mg levomepromazine, m 45 to 30 mg; since tapered q 400-230 mg, m 30 to 15 mg, 1dez m to 16 mg, 4dez 250 mg q, 31. dec 200 mg q

March 1, 2019 - 200 mg quetiapine, 4,5 mg diazepam, 16 mg mirtazapine

March 3, 2019 - 200 mg quetiapine, 4,0 mg diazepam, 16 mg mirtazapine

March 4, 2019 - 200 mg quetiapine, 4,2 mg diazepam,16 mg mirtazapine, 

june 5, 2019 - 100 mg quetiapine, 3 mg Diazepam, 12,185 mg mirtazapine 

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I have a window 

and it is caused ...

 

 

by inflammation!

 

since today I am having a cold and I believe that is the reason why my 

persistent symptoms (bad fluelike sickness, anxiety, anhedonia, dp, sore throat)

feel less bad:

 

my body is throwing its natural painkillers at them (which are actually aimed at the cold).

 

cymbalta, mirtazapine, diazepam are all painkillers, quetiapine I don‘t know. 

Withdrawing them causes pain or can be sensed similar to an inflammation (fluelike or else). 

 

Sad!

2010-2018 sertralin, venlafaxin, cymbalta 120 mg, march bupropio, Lorazepam 4 to 0,5 mg qetiapine 200-400 mg Apr mirtazapin 30 - 45 mg, lo tapered, to 0; Apr switch to diazepam 3 mg; jun/jul 15mg, taper to approx. 4,5 mg, Aug: 200 to 400 mg q, 50 mg levomepromazine, m 45 to 30 mg; since tapered q 400-230 mg, m 30 to 15 mg, 1dez m to 16 mg, 4dez 250 mg q, 31. dec 200 mg q

March 1, 2019 - 200 mg quetiapine, 4,5 mg diazepam, 16 mg mirtazapine

March 3, 2019 - 200 mg quetiapine, 4,0 mg diazepam, 16 mg mirtazapine

March 4, 2019 - 200 mg quetiapine, 4,2 mg diazepam,16 mg mirtazapine, 

june 5, 2019 - 100 mg quetiapine, 3 mg Diazepam, 12,185 mg mirtazapine 

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I wonder how important hormones are during depression/anhedonia?

 

and how important allergies are?

 

i remember being suddenly longtime anhedonic during puberty. 

I also had a persistent sore throat for years then.

 

It reduced significantly after puberty which coincidences with moving out of our house (which I know had lots of toxic substances on its woodconstruction). 

 

I never had this sore throat until two weeks ago (reducing quetiapine and mirtazapine).

I can think of a connection between my sore throat as a reaction to toxins (allergic reaction) which subsided after moving away from these toxins. Not having a sore throat Althea time enabled me to have joy in life which I did not with a sore throat. 

 

Things improved even more after I met my now wife in 1997. 

which would strengthen the Hormon idea of depression/anhedonia.

 

half of my family is anhedonic and that got worse with age. Hormones?

 

can I do something about this?

which hormones can get checked?

dhea or natural progesterone?

2010-2018 sertralin, venlafaxin, cymbalta 120 mg, march bupropio, Lorazepam 4 to 0,5 mg qetiapine 200-400 mg Apr mirtazapin 30 - 45 mg, lo tapered, to 0; Apr switch to diazepam 3 mg; jun/jul 15mg, taper to approx. 4,5 mg, Aug: 200 to 400 mg q, 50 mg levomepromazine, m 45 to 30 mg; since tapered q 400-230 mg, m 30 to 15 mg, 1dez m to 16 mg, 4dez 250 mg q, 31. dec 200 mg q

March 1, 2019 - 200 mg quetiapine, 4,5 mg diazepam, 16 mg mirtazapine

March 3, 2019 - 200 mg quetiapine, 4,0 mg diazepam, 16 mg mirtazapine

March 4, 2019 - 200 mg quetiapine, 4,2 mg diazepam,16 mg mirtazapine, 

june 5, 2019 - 100 mg quetiapine, 3 mg Diazepam, 12,185 mg mirtazapine 

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  • Moderator Emeritus

Hey Tanha - 

 

On 12/28/2018 at 1:52 AM, Tanha said:

change my ad to Wellbutrin/bupropion (only for five weeks),

 

So another problem in addition to Cymbalta withdrawal.

 

I don't think that the tapering of the diazepam is what got you (I'll see if our benzo mod can look in), but that you are in acute and possibly chronic withdrawal from antidepressants.

 

All the benzos in the world won't cover that up - and to reduce your benzos while that is happening to you - 
 

On 12/28/2018 at 1:52 AM, Tanha said:

in hospital we started to cut 3,5 mg diazepam by 0,5 mg and hyperarousel and insomnia went through the roof. I freaked out. 

 

- might be why this happened.

 

Doctors are operating on the premise that withdrawal only lasts 3 weeks, or 3 months at most (if they are good doctors).  That's why they think it is "interdose withdrawal," because they are unwilling to consider that antidepressants can mess with you longer than 3 weeks.

We operate on a longer timeline, and have found that these antidepressant changes can interfere with you 18 months - or more - out.  Especially CT - you have now had TWO (2) CT's that I can find - the Wellbutrin counts as a CT, too (what dose?  Please put this in your signature!)

 

On 12/28/2018 at 4:20 PM, Tanha said:

do you see any chance that I can stabilize a bit before making the next cut at all? My symptoms are really severe which means holding and stabilizing for long, right? 

 

Yes.  Let's see how the first month of holding goes, and if you get any windows at all, we will know we are on the right track.  It's hard to do much while in hospital, it's hard to be in control of your environment, your food, your taper, anything while in hospital.

On 12/28/2018 at 4:39 AM, Tanha said:

diaahrrea 

 

I'm still looking to see how much magnesium? you are on.  You may wish to decrease it.

 

On 12/28/2018 at 6:38 PM, Tanha said:

it promotes that this flue symptoms are do to too fast tapering or ct.

 

 

I'm inclined to agree.

 

1 hour ago, Tanha said:

Is it valuable to take n-Acetylcystein during withdrawl?

 

Not until you are symptom free, or at least more stable.  This is not the time to throw new supplements into the mix.  NAC is supportive of Glutathione, which was awesome helpful for me during tapering - but I never got destabilised like you are now.

 

Maybe later, maybe down the track.

20 minutes ago, Tanha said:

I have a window

 

THAT's what I want to see.  It may be that your body is tired of all the symptoms and is throwing natural opiates at it - OR - it may be that your body is re-regulating.

 

Keep on keeping on!

 

* * *

Instead of talking about what you miss - find out and explore what you have.  Do you have a window?  When you walk in the forest, or around the building - you are moving your body.  Can you work on feeling your toes?  Your fingers?  Any little bit of mindfulness that is going to help pull you through?  Non Drug Techniques for Coping with Emotional Symptoms

 

* * *

 

How much freedom do you have in your hospital?  Can you come and go as you please?  Can you order out for pizza?  Or is this a locked ward?  

 

I hope you see the sun today!

"Easy, easy - just go easy and you'll finish." - Hawaiian Kapuna

 

Holding is hard work, holding is a blessing. Give your brain time to heal before you try again.

 

My suggestions are not medical advice, you are in charge of your own medical choices.

 

A lifetime of being prescribed antidepressants that caused problems (30 years in total). At age 35 flipped to "bipolar," but was not diagnosed for 5 years. Started my journey in Midwest United States. Crossed the Pacific for love and hope; currently living in Australia.   CT Seroquel 25 mg some time in 2013.   Tapered Reboxetine 4 mg Oct 2013 to Sept 2014 = GONE (3 years on Reboxetine).     Tapered Lithium 900 to 475 MG (alternating with the SNRI) Jan 2014 - Nov 2014, tapered Lithium 475 mg Jan 2015 -  Feb 2016 = GONE (10 years  on Lithium).  Many mistakes in dry cutting dosages were made.


The tedious thread (my intro):  JanCarol ☼ Reboxetine first, then Lithium

The happy thread (my success story):  JanCarol - Undiagnosed  Off all bipolar drugs

My own blog:  https://shamanexplorations.com/shamans-blog/

 

 

I have been psych drug FREE since 1 Feb 2016!

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Dear @Altostrata

this is an addendum (an extra) to the requested list of symptoms (see above).

 

i forgot 4 very important new symptoms: 

 

5 days after the last cut of quetiapine I had a severe new symptom. 

A sudden extreme spike:

Heartracing, hyperarousel, Heat, like fainting, dizzy, severe fatigue, right chest, disorientation, loosing control, a real blow which I thought I cannot survive. But it didn‘t come to my mind this could be a panicattac. Am not sure about that. But didn’t sense fear consciously.

Had this 3 days in a row, once for hours (but then less intense).

Very bad condition. Today again.

Happened mostly 2 hours after food and medication (quetiapine and diazepam).

 

eye worse: 

now I have all day problems to focus my eyes. Frightens me. Got definitely worse after last reduction. 

 

 

Two days ago I Lost during the morning totally contact with outsideworld, disorientation. Didn’t‘t know where I was, needed help toxins the toilet. Never had this before. Very extreme stuff.

 

airhunger and tight chest is a rather new symptome after the last cut.

 

rereading my notes shows that burning skin got intense after the cut but is better the last four days.

2010-2018 sertralin, venlafaxin, cymbalta 120 mg, march bupropio, Lorazepam 4 to 0,5 mg qetiapine 200-400 mg Apr mirtazapin 30 - 45 mg, lo tapered, to 0; Apr switch to diazepam 3 mg; jun/jul 15mg, taper to approx. 4,5 mg, Aug: 200 to 400 mg q, 50 mg levomepromazine, m 45 to 30 mg; since tapered q 400-230 mg, m 30 to 15 mg, 1dez m to 16 mg, 4dez 250 mg q, 31. dec 200 mg q

March 1, 2019 - 200 mg quetiapine, 4,5 mg diazepam, 16 mg mirtazapine

March 3, 2019 - 200 mg quetiapine, 4,0 mg diazepam, 16 mg mirtazapine

March 4, 2019 - 200 mg quetiapine, 4,2 mg diazepam,16 mg mirtazapine, 

june 5, 2019 - 100 mg quetiapine, 3 mg Diazepam, 12,185 mg mirtazapine 

Link to comment
2 hours ago, Tanha said:

Forgot one improvement:

burning skin is much milder now.

 

But

feeling of airhunger is new.

Got worse first days after reduction though.

2010-2018 sertralin, venlafaxin, cymbalta 120 mg, march bupropio, Lorazepam 4 to 0,5 mg qetiapine 200-400 mg Apr mirtazapin 30 - 45 mg, lo tapered, to 0; Apr switch to diazepam 3 mg; jun/jul 15mg, taper to approx. 4,5 mg, Aug: 200 to 400 mg q, 50 mg levomepromazine, m 45 to 30 mg; since tapered q 400-230 mg, m 30 to 15 mg, 1dez m to 16 mg, 4dez 250 mg q, 31. dec 200 mg q

March 1, 2019 - 200 mg quetiapine, 4,5 mg diazepam, 16 mg mirtazapine

March 3, 2019 - 200 mg quetiapine, 4,0 mg diazepam, 16 mg mirtazapine

March 4, 2019 - 200 mg quetiapine, 4,2 mg diazepam,16 mg mirtazapine, 

june 5, 2019 - 100 mg quetiapine, 3 mg Diazepam, 12,185 mg mirtazapine 

Link to comment

Dear @JanCarol

 

Thank you so much for your reply. 

 

I would love to cut the Benzos first. 

BUT this is what we tried so often this year (May, June, July ,sept) and failed traumatically.

actually I am bedridden only since cutting lorazepam from 0,5 to 0 mg. Akathisia was unsurvivable then, too.

 

when we tried a small reduction from diazepam 3,5 mg to 3 mg in June I stopped sleeping at all and had to be hold tight due to immense hyperarousel (We Switches from lorazepam to diazepam for taper.) 

I could not close my eyes for a second for tree days or more and was crawling all day instead of walking due to vertigo, akathisia and feeling of fainting nonstop. Not normal fainting, real bad fainting. Still cannot close eyes during the day or lying down to relax. Absolute impossible still. 

 

A small updose of diazepam to 4 mg didn‘t do nothing. Upping dose to 15 mg helped too little. Only upping quetiapine 200 to 400 mg and levomepromazine Safed me. 

 

The last reduction from 7,5 to 5 mg around August was the most of hyperarousel I could and can take. 

 

For me the hyperarousel before the next dose of meds is a good indicator of how bad my underlying problem (ct cymbalta eg) is coming through.

so far this pattern is back which scares me but it seems to be survivable. 

Is it good to have this problem back or is it stopping me from becoming functional at all? 

Getting able again to wash myself would be great!

 

I only want to reduce the drugs all the time. Is that but a dream that has to wait?

 

In Hospital: 

i can come and go, but food is difficult

 

magnesium: 

today I took it different:

 

3 times 360 mg magnesiumglyzinate. 

 

I took the last two days at night extra magnesium (360 mg) cause of cramps. 

 

Until two two days ago I took

2 times daily 200mg magnesiumcitrate and once 360 mg magnesiumglyzinate. 

 

With less I had bad musclecramps.

 

i also believe I still suffer from ad-ct.

which makes me desperate because I cannot heal by withdrawing something as I thought I could and reducing my actual drugburden seems to be impossible with this underlying problem. 

 

Instead what happens is that all the underlying ct symptoms come up once I reduce any of the sedative medications. 

Since I am not functional at all this is in a way not a feasible solution if recovery means getting out of bed and things done (with constant flu). 

 

New bad symptoms:

Total lack of orientation, could not find toilet or my room without help

fainting-hot chest flashes,

worse anhedonia

worse eyesight

 

 

how to proceed: 

holding doses because everything else makes it worse and wait for years to start healing?

i can nonly find recoverystories from people how didn‘t such a drugburdrn after their ct! 

And cymbalta is bad!

 

Do i heal from ad ct while covering it up with other terrible meds?

 

without this medication sleep would be nonexistent i think. Hyperarousel going through the roof.

 

Is it better to stay on these meds (nooooo I don‘t want that) or risking a slow reduction with more terrible symptoms showing up like it has been this whole year?

 

what helps recovery most? 

 

Certainly not me getting more and more symptoms, more and more problems with the actual medication getting paradoxical?

 

recovering from cymbalta ct lasts for most members more than three years. i seem to be the least functional person of most.

I try hard but cannot concentrate or control my muscles and will - as much as would be needed to order pizza or else. 

 

Is it important for recovery from ct cymbalta and Wellbutrin that I reduce all my meds and live through the ct wd symptoms (which is actually not possible because it is unbearable right now already)? 

I guess becoming functional is the key but I don‘t know how?

 

going home tomorrow again (in agony and ad anxiety and flue but I need braininput). 

Home gives me bad dp but I guess I have to confront this although I have not enough strength for this. 

 

But there will be a time in the future when we discuss books rather than meds.

2010-2018 sertralin, venlafaxin, cymbalta 120 mg, march bupropio, Lorazepam 4 to 0,5 mg qetiapine 200-400 mg Apr mirtazapin 30 - 45 mg, lo tapered, to 0; Apr switch to diazepam 3 mg; jun/jul 15mg, taper to approx. 4,5 mg, Aug: 200 to 400 mg q, 50 mg levomepromazine, m 45 to 30 mg; since tapered q 400-230 mg, m 30 to 15 mg, 1dez m to 16 mg, 4dez 250 mg q, 31. dec 200 mg q

March 1, 2019 - 200 mg quetiapine, 4,5 mg diazepam, 16 mg mirtazapine

March 3, 2019 - 200 mg quetiapine, 4,0 mg diazepam, 16 mg mirtazapine

March 4, 2019 - 200 mg quetiapine, 4,2 mg diazepam,16 mg mirtazapine, 

june 5, 2019 - 100 mg quetiapine, 3 mg Diazepam, 12,185 mg mirtazapine 

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Dear @JanCarol

 

Don‘t get me wrong. I do want to come off the diazepam as soon as possible!!!

 

 

New bad symptoms since last cut of quetiapine:

Total lack of orientation for hours, could not find toilet or my room without help

fainting-hot chest with loosing control

worse anhedonia

worse eyesight

Problems with musclecontrol and willcontrol for hours every morning till after noon

 

scares me like s...

 

i am really sorry for throwing all my misery at you. 

It just never felt like now like loosing really my mind (window closed). 

 

I wish you all the best of course. 

Edited by Tanha
New

2010-2018 sertralin, venlafaxin, cymbalta 120 mg, march bupropio, Lorazepam 4 to 0,5 mg qetiapine 200-400 mg Apr mirtazapin 30 - 45 mg, lo tapered, to 0; Apr switch to diazepam 3 mg; jun/jul 15mg, taper to approx. 4,5 mg, Aug: 200 to 400 mg q, 50 mg levomepromazine, m 45 to 30 mg; since tapered q 400-230 mg, m 30 to 15 mg, 1dez m to 16 mg, 4dez 250 mg q, 31. dec 200 mg q

March 1, 2019 - 200 mg quetiapine, 4,5 mg diazepam, 16 mg mirtazapine

March 3, 2019 - 200 mg quetiapine, 4,0 mg diazepam, 16 mg mirtazapine

March 4, 2019 - 200 mg quetiapine, 4,2 mg diazepam,16 mg mirtazapine, 

june 5, 2019 - 100 mg quetiapine, 3 mg Diazepam, 12,185 mg mirtazapine 

Link to comment

dear @Altostrata

addendum 2.0

 

i just noticed that I have difficulty to say if this feeling of not being able to control muscles and will is similar to akathisia.

But this (new?) sensation of muscleweakness and feeling no control over muscles makes me stay in bed or stay unmoved throughout the day much more.

 

this would mean that akathisia did not improve as i stated become rather being masked by other symptoms.

I find this symptom difficult to get e grip on at the moment. 

 

But i am definitely not pacing as much as before. The mental restlessness might also have slowed down in that bad spikes are missing but instead I have it all the time until I take mirtazapine. This would mean it persists longer and no windows.

 

i also have more fatigue and fluelike weakness while feeling restless. This could let me pace less. 

 

Sorry for being difficult. 

This simply is difficult and once more debilitating.

 

thank you so much for all your patience.  

2010-2018 sertralin, venlafaxin, cymbalta 120 mg, march bupropio, Lorazepam 4 to 0,5 mg qetiapine 200-400 mg Apr mirtazapin 30 - 45 mg, lo tapered, to 0; Apr switch to diazepam 3 mg; jun/jul 15mg, taper to approx. 4,5 mg, Aug: 200 to 400 mg q, 50 mg levomepromazine, m 45 to 30 mg; since tapered q 400-230 mg, m 30 to 15 mg, 1dez m to 16 mg, 4dez 250 mg q, 31. dec 200 mg q

March 1, 2019 - 200 mg quetiapine, 4,5 mg diazepam, 16 mg mirtazapine

March 3, 2019 - 200 mg quetiapine, 4,0 mg diazepam, 16 mg mirtazapine

March 4, 2019 - 200 mg quetiapine, 4,2 mg diazepam,16 mg mirtazapine, 

june 5, 2019 - 100 mg quetiapine, 3 mg Diazepam, 12,185 mg mirtazapine 

Link to comment

13 days since last cut of quetiapine

1 month and 1 week after last cut mirtazapine

66 days since cutting levomepromazine to zero

9 months since ct cymbalta and promethazine

8 months since ct bupropion (only 5 weeks)

 

29 dec

 

4 am.       woke, 

4:45 am.  Fell asleep

5:30 am.  woke,

                  sore throat, normal cold 

7:30 am.  meat, cucumber, oats, 

                  hempprotein

                  360 mg magnesium

                  50 mg quetiapine       

                  1 mg diazepam

                  vitamin d

                  diarrhea, anxiety all morning,

                  anhedonia and akathisia all

                  day, sore throat all day

                  impaired vision all day

10 am.      feeling like no Control over

                  Body and will all day intense,    

                  no musclecontrol

                  no will/interest.  

                  cannot eat or wash myself

 .                sore throat until late

                  Dizzy, anxiety 

11 am.      Noni juice

noon.         meat, tomatoesauce, rice

                   bread

                   55 mg quetiapine        

                   1,5 mg diazepam

                   Anhedonia less painful

12:20.        Depression worse, arousel,

                   akathisia worse

1:30 pm.    bad depression

2:30 pm.    Vitamine juice

                    360 mg magnesium

                    suddenly Heartracing, heat,

                    feeling like loosing control,

                    tight chest, burning chest,

                    arousel, dizzy, bad fatigue

                    eyes worse

3:40 pm.    All better but Anhedonia

4:50 pm.    hyperarousel, anhedonia

                    worse, loosing control again,

                    chest burning, dizzy

5:30 pm.    meat, cucumber

                    oats, hempprotein

                    magnesium

                    62,5 mg quetiapine      

                    1,5 mg diazepam     

                    magnesium

                    arousel bearable

                    extreme anhedonia

6:15 pm.    Slight shivering,

                    sudden loss of control,

                    like loosing my mind and

                    orientation fully

6:45 pm.     all better also anhedonia,

                     Problem with musclecontrol

                     akathisia

7:20 pm.     anxiety, sore throat worse

7:45 pm.     anhedonia less painful, dp

8 pm.          16 mg mirtazapine 

                     360 mg magnesium

9:30 pm.     67,5 mg quetiapine    

                     1 mg diazepam

              

compared to days before:

 

More anxiety in the morning

 

no flue but a real cold,

less skinburning,

sudden extreme loss of control and disorientation happened again twice,

anhedonia in the morning a little less intense, more feeling of no musclecontrol all day, akathisia mental all day

less dp but in the evening (strange)

2010-2018 sertralin, venlafaxin, cymbalta 120 mg, march bupropio, Lorazepam 4 to 0,5 mg qetiapine 200-400 mg Apr mirtazapin 30 - 45 mg, lo tapered, to 0; Apr switch to diazepam 3 mg; jun/jul 15mg, taper to approx. 4,5 mg, Aug: 200 to 400 mg q, 50 mg levomepromazine, m 45 to 30 mg; since tapered q 400-230 mg, m 30 to 15 mg, 1dez m to 16 mg, 4dez 250 mg q, 31. dec 200 mg q

March 1, 2019 - 200 mg quetiapine, 4,5 mg diazepam, 16 mg mirtazapine

March 3, 2019 - 200 mg quetiapine, 4,0 mg diazepam, 16 mg mirtazapine

March 4, 2019 - 200 mg quetiapine, 4,2 mg diazepam,16 mg mirtazapine, 

june 5, 2019 - 100 mg quetiapine, 3 mg Diazepam, 12,185 mg mirtazapine 

Link to comment

This new condition with sudden heartracing, chestburn, dizziness, fatigue, loosing control, really severe.

 

and disorientation 

really are frightening me. 

 

Having them now longer and more than once a day is no good sign. Never ever had this before. Started a few days ago. 

Real severe condition.

 

no panic though.

2010-2018 sertralin, venlafaxin, cymbalta 120 mg, march bupropio, Lorazepam 4 to 0,5 mg qetiapine 200-400 mg Apr mirtazapin 30 - 45 mg, lo tapered, to 0; Apr switch to diazepam 3 mg; jun/jul 15mg, taper to approx. 4,5 mg, Aug: 200 to 400 mg q, 50 mg levomepromazine, m 45 to 30 mg; since tapered q 400-230 mg, m 30 to 15 mg, 1dez m to 16 mg, 4dez 250 mg q, 31. dec 200 mg q

March 1, 2019 - 200 mg quetiapine, 4,5 mg diazepam, 16 mg mirtazapine

March 3, 2019 - 200 mg quetiapine, 4,0 mg diazepam, 16 mg mirtazapine

March 4, 2019 - 200 mg quetiapine, 4,2 mg diazepam,16 mg mirtazapine, 

june 5, 2019 - 100 mg quetiapine, 3 mg Diazepam, 12,185 mg mirtazapine 

Link to comment
  • Administrator

Tanha, you're going to have spikes in symptoms here and there because your nervous system is struggling with your drug intake and possibly withdrawal syndrome in the background.

 

Every day, your excessive drug intake batters your nervous system again.

 

It's up to you to decide whether you've taken a downturn after reducing quetiapine almost 2 weeks ago or if you're having the usual run of intense symptoms from drug overdose throughouot the day.

 

From what you're reporting, it looks to me that stuff like this

36 minutes ago, Tanha said:

10 am. feeling like no Control over

                  Body and will all day intense,    

                  no musclecontrol

                  no will/interest.  

                  cannot eat or wash myself

 

is because of the 50mg quetiapine and 1 mg diazepam you took at 7:30 -- and that's on top of the 235mg quetiapine and 5mg diazepam you took throughout the previous day.

 

If you find no muscle control and being unable to eat or wash yourself intolerable, my guess is you need to take less drugs. Those are not withdrawal symptoms, they are caused by the drugs you're taking.

 

I have to respectfully disagree with  @JanCarol , my feeling is you should continue to reduce quetiapine fairly aggressively. I do not see any point in holding longer than 2 or 3 weeks to monitor your awful adverse reactions to the constant overdosing. Although it appears your nervous system is exceptionally resilient, I fear for the health of your organs.

This is not medical advice. Discuss any decisions about your medical care with a knowledgeable medical practitioner.

"It has become appallingly obvious that our technology has surpassed our humanity." -- Albert Einstein

All postings © copyrighted.

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Dear altostrata,

 

thank you for your reply.

 

These symptoms are new to me that‘s why I cannot judge myself.

 

puh, every 3 weeks is tough. 

It makes me happy to hear that I should taper faster. I always wanted this.

 

i will give it a try to continue the cutting in one week which would make it a three week cut.

 

How do i deal with the symptome of hyperarousel, akathisia and fluelike-sickness, disorientation and anhedonia if 

a) they get worse after next cut?

b) don‘t get any better before the next cut?

 

i kind of need a crisisplan in case I cannot think or speak or move my body anymore. I need to tell my wife now what to do if crisis gets worse.

 

Jancarol really got me thinking that the ct cymbalta and bupropion is the cause of my problems 

which means cutting quetiapine aggressively brings up the symptoms of that ct. 

 

What can I tell my wife to do exactly, if the cut goes wrong so to speak?

 

Thank you so much to getting into my case!

 

I have been on this dose in June/July and hyperarousel killed me. Doesn‘t need to be the same now.

 

tanha

2010-2018 sertralin, venlafaxin, cymbalta 120 mg, march bupropio, Lorazepam 4 to 0,5 mg qetiapine 200-400 mg Apr mirtazapin 30 - 45 mg, lo tapered, to 0; Apr switch to diazepam 3 mg; jun/jul 15mg, taper to approx. 4,5 mg, Aug: 200 to 400 mg q, 50 mg levomepromazine, m 45 to 30 mg; since tapered q 400-230 mg, m 30 to 15 mg, 1dez m to 16 mg, 4dez 250 mg q, 31. dec 200 mg q

March 1, 2019 - 200 mg quetiapine, 4,5 mg diazepam, 16 mg mirtazapine

March 3, 2019 - 200 mg quetiapine, 4,0 mg diazepam, 16 mg mirtazapine

March 4, 2019 - 200 mg quetiapine, 4,2 mg diazepam,16 mg mirtazapine, 

june 5, 2019 - 100 mg quetiapine, 3 mg Diazepam, 12,185 mg mirtazapine 

Link to comment
  • Administrator
Quote

How do i deal with the symptome of hyperarousel, akathisia and fluelike-sickness, disorientation and anhedonia if a) they get worse after next cut? b) don‘t get any better before the next cut?

 

From what I'm seeing, you are putting your nervous system into crisis FOUR TIMES A DAY, every time you take quetiapine and diazepam and God knows what else. You will have to stop panicking at every adverse reaction. You will need to be patient while you taper off quetiapine and stop complaining to the hospital staff.

 

On 12/20/2018 at 11:02 AM, Tanha said:

I wonder how long I can pretend to function in order to avoid this new pill which I am not allowed to know the name. They say I have too much control over my pills and now they want one that they an control.

 

If you have not been hospitalized against your will, you need to file a complaint with the hospital administration. They are giving you too many drugs.

 

Please note that the more you complain about "withdrawal symptoms, " the more drugs they will give you because they think you're deluded and they want to shut you up. At this point, I cannot see ANY withdrawal symptoms in your daily notes. All I see is drug adverse reactions -- both oversedation and paradoxical reactions. NONE of these are withdrawal symptoms.

This is not medical advice. Discuss any decisions about your medical care with a knowledgeable medical practitioner.

"It has become appallingly obvious that our technology has surpassed our humanity." -- Albert Einstein

All postings © copyrighted.

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Thank you sooooo much. 

I will go for it.

(Just to make sure we read the same posts: So you don’t believe the ct cymbalta is the cause of my hyperarousel and the insomnia in summer?)

I expect my hyperarousel and akathisia and flue go through the roof. We‘ll see.

 

Still i need to give my wife a clear advice what to do in crisis. 

 

like if I cannot move my body or really loose orientation all day (which means I cannot take my medicine)!

 

I will write down that I don‘t want to be put on no more Medication like a patients testimony. Doctors tend to accept this. But they will put me in the closed unit if I freak out with arousel and akathisia. They don‘t know about my withdrawl yet. 

 

i had two severe crises in summer where I was begging for help because I couldn‘t survive hyperarousel, akathisia and not closing eyes for a second in three days, insomnia for weeks.

 

i don‘t want the doctors to give me lorazepam again what they will do if I freak out. 

Can you recommend an emergencyupdose of any medication being less harmful?

Is it advisable if in crisis that my wife helps me to cut more or to hold

 if I am not able to tell that at the time?

Had this problem before. That’s how I got on these meds but never asked for „help“ ever since because I didn’t want more medication.

 

i am talking about a real crisis (if I cannot move or orientate myself at all or akathisia or hyperarousel freaks me out like in June) not a normal crisis.

 

i just wanted to ask you how do I know that I feel better after a cut because I don’t know that anymore. Have to laugh about myself thinking this. 

2010-2018 sertralin, venlafaxin, cymbalta 120 mg, march bupropio, Lorazepam 4 to 0,5 mg qetiapine 200-400 mg Apr mirtazapin 30 - 45 mg, lo tapered, to 0; Apr switch to diazepam 3 mg; jun/jul 15mg, taper to approx. 4,5 mg, Aug: 200 to 400 mg q, 50 mg levomepromazine, m 45 to 30 mg; since tapered q 400-230 mg, m 30 to 15 mg, 1dez m to 16 mg, 4dez 250 mg q, 31. dec 200 mg q

March 1, 2019 - 200 mg quetiapine, 4,5 mg diazepam, 16 mg mirtazapine

March 3, 2019 - 200 mg quetiapine, 4,0 mg diazepam, 16 mg mirtazapine

March 4, 2019 - 200 mg quetiapine, 4,2 mg diazepam,16 mg mirtazapine, 

june 5, 2019 - 100 mg quetiapine, 3 mg Diazepam, 12,185 mg mirtazapine 

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