Jump to content
SkyStreamer

SkyStreamer: tapering off Cipralex / escitalopram safely

Recommended Posts

SkyStreamer

Hello,

 

I was on 10 mg of Cipralex for 3 years (2011). Then, increased to 15 mg of Cipralex for 5 years (2016). 2 years ago, I started tapering off this 15 mg dosage by reducing my amount by 2.5 mg (12.5 mg) for two weeks. Then, I tapered off another 2.5 mg (10 mg) for two weeks immediately thereafter. That was pretty tough experience. Not exactly like 'throwing your brain off a cliff,' but definitely like playing pro-football everyday for two months without wearing a helmet or any protective equipment. About 2-3 months after finishing this tapering off of 5 mg, I experienced a ton of unpleasant feelings. Irritability. Anger. Over-sensitiveness to minor insults and rude people. And, a bunch of minor physical health issues (chronic body aches, muscle/tendon tears & soreness, etc.) As a result of these unpleasant effects, I did not taper off for another year.

 

Then, recently (i.e, 2 months ago), I mustered up enough courage and resumed tapering off my remaining Cipralex dose (10mg). But, this time I decided to taper off using a new dose schedule that seemed a bit more balanced and safe. I tapered off another 2.5 mg gradually (7.5 mg) over the course of 7 weeks. The dose schedule was as follows:

 

Week 1- 6 days at 10 mg, 1 day at 7.5 mg
Week 2- 5 days at 10, 2days at 7.5
Week 3- 4 days at 10, 3 days at 7.5
Week 4- 3 days at 10, 4 days at 7.5
Week 5- 2 days at 10, 5 days at 7.5

Week 6- 1 day at 10, 6 days at 7.5
Week 7- 7 days at 7.5

 

A woman online said she used this dose schedule to taper off 10 mg of Cipralex on the advice of her Doctor. And, she said she had no withdrawal symptoms at all. She called her Doctor a "genius."

 

For the 2 months I tapered off on this does schedule, things seemed a bit better than my first tapering off experience a year ago. I still had irritability, anger, etc. But, it all seemed less intense and long-lasting. I went through a short period of heightened negative emotions (anger, irritability, lack of hope, etc.). But, this was also around the time when experienced a few very stressful life events in the same period of about two weeks. So, I get a hunch that this short period of intense negative emotions was more a result of my life situation than the reduction of my Cipralex dose. 

 

I have remained on 7.5 mg of Cipralex now for about one month after completing the initial phase of this current dose schedule. But, I would like to continue tapering off the rest of my dose on this same dosage schedule as early as next week. The rest of this continued dose schedule would look like this (following from the first round mentioned above):

 

Week 8- 6 days at 7.5, 1 day at 5
Weeks 9 to 14- follow the schedule
Week 15- 6 days at 5, 1day at 2.5
Weeks 15 to 21- follow the schedule
Week 22- 6 days at 2.5, 1 day no pill
Week 28- you are finished.

 

I am aware that Cipralex is one of strongest SSRIs on the market. I am also aware that this site strongly recommends a schedule of tapering off 10%  of a dosage over the course of two months. However, my preference is to continue with the most recent dosage schedule. This is because I can only obtain 10 mg Cipralex pills in Canada, and I find it too difficult to cut the pills by a 10% size with exact, or close to exact, precision. (There is always a bit of guess work when using a razor or pill cutter). I also find making a liquid version of the remaining dosages much too cumbersome. Moreover, my current dosage schedule doesn't really seem that much different in terms of the amount of the reduced dosage. For example, even though I am reducing by 2.5 mg, the fact that I am gradually integrating this amount over the course of two months would seem to be somewhat equal to doing 1.25% for two months (which is almost 10% of my dosage). 

 

This all leads to my question: given the approximate similarity of my dosage schedule to your site's recommended dosage schedule, do you think continuing with my dosage schedule to be a reasonable and safe decision? Or, do you consider a consistent 10% reduction of my dosage over the course of two months (your site's preference) to be the better option?

 

Any sound thoughts, advice, or recommendations would be greatly appreciated.

 

Thanks!

 

image.png

Edited by ChessieCat
reduced font size

Share this post


Link to post
ChessieCat

Hi SkyStreamer and welcome to SA,

 

SA's suggested tapering protocol is to reduce by no more than 10% of the current dose (not the original dose) followed by a hold of about 4 weeks to allow the brain to adapt to not getting as much of the drug.  This trellis analogy is very helpful in understanding this:

 

On 8/31/2011 at 5:28 AM, Rhiannon said:

 

When we stop taking the drug, we have a brain that has designed itself so that it works in the presence of the drug; now it can't work properly without the drug because it's designed itself so that the drug is part of its chemistry and structure. It's like a plant that has grown on a trellis; you can't just yank out the trellis and expect the plant to be okay. When the drug is removed, the remodeling process has to take place in reverse. SO--it's not a matter of just getting the drug out of your system and moving on. If it were that simple, none of us would be here. It's a matter of, as I describe it, having to grow a new brain. I believe this growing-a-new-brain happens throughout the taper process if the taper is slow enough. (If it's too fast, then there's not a lot of time for actually rebalancing things, and basically the brain is just pedaling fast trying to keep us alive.) It also continues to happen, probably for longer than the symptoms actually last, throughout the time of recovery after we are completely off the drug, which is why recovery takes so long.

 

 

One of our moderators who did a very careful taper and is now off his drug completely wrote this topic which is very helpful:  are-we-there-yet-how-long-is-withdrawal-going-to-take

 

Why taper by 10% of my dosage?

 

Dr Joseph Glenmullen's Withdrawal Symptoms

 

Tips for tapering off Lexapro (escitalopram) This topic explains how to get the doses you need.

 

Your brain likes consistency and the more accurate and consistent you can get your dose the better.  Lexapro is available in a prescription liquid.  We have other members tapering off this drug.  You can find them by typing Lexapro in the search at the top right.  Search separately for escitalopram and also Cipralex to find more.

 

You might find this topic interesting and helpful in understanding the reason for tapering using the 10% method:  Why taper paper: dose-occupancy curves

 

Please create a drug signature.  Keep it simple by following these instructions (NO diagnoses or symptoms please - thank you):

  • details for last 2 years - datesALL drugs, doses
  • summary for older than 2 years - just years and drug/s

Account Settings – Create or Edit a signature

 

This is your own Introduction topic where you can ask questions about your own situation and journal your progress.

Share this post


Link to post
SkyStreamer

Thanks, ChessieCat!

 

Very helpful information. Makes complete sense. A lot of us seem to have that impulse to want to rid ourselves of our pills as soon as possible. But, you're right - it is likely not in our best interest.

 

I'm in Canada, and I don't think we can get liquid Cipralex here. But, I'd be willing to buy it out of pocket if I could get it from another country. Anything you can direct me to in terms of this?

 

Thanks!

Share this post


Link to post
SkyStreamer

I'm currently on 7.5mg of Cipralex. Just reduced by 2.5mg over two recent months (October & November). But, I've resolved to taper off by the 10% dosage schedule from this point forward. I will be holding to try and stabilize for the next month or two before starting. 

 

In the meantime, I'm trying to decide what is best to taper off with - liquid or solid pills (Cipralex)? Which is better for accurate measurements? I'm a bit worried over whether the Cipralex will be evenly distributed through the proportional water solution. And, I think that high-end weigh scales might be able to better measure the 10% dosage reduction amounts. But, I'm not really sure.

 

Also, where can I find the info on all the required equipment for both methods?

 

Thanks!

Share this post


Link to post
ChessieCat

From Post #1 of tips-for-tapering-off-lexapro-escitalopram

 

On 5/27/2011 at 12:16 PM, Altostrata said:

 

Do-it-yourself liquid
People report that they can make their own liquid from Lexapro tablets and water.

It is soluble in water, see http://www.drugbank.ca/drugs/DB01175 -- stability (shelf-life of dilution) is unknown.

See How to make a liquid from tablets or capsules

 

 

There are other members tapering the same drug.  To find them click on the SA logo (top left).  Use the search function at the top right of the Introductions Forum type in the drug and select This Forum then click on the magnifying glass.  Do separate searches for the different names of the drug.  Cipralex, Lexapro, escitalopram.

 

Also see:  using-a-digital-scale-to-measure-doses

 

Many members use the Gemini 20 scales and can measure small amounts.  Moderator BrassMonkey used this scale for his taper.

 

Check out:  How to make a liquid from tablets or capsules

 

 and Making a citalopram solution yourself  This is about citalopram (Celexa) but can be applied to most tablets that are not extended-release or sustained-release

 

When the tablet is dissolved in water, there will be fillers that don't dissolve.  Moderator Rhiannon has dissolved her tablets successfully.  She started off using a bit of ethanol and then changed to all water.  You just need to stir the solution immediately before drawing out with the syringe.

 

Both methods are doable and reasonably accurate and consistent if done carefully using the same tools and methods.

 

You will need to research both methods and decide which suits you best.

Share this post


Link to post
SkyStreamer

Thanks ChessieCat! Very helpful!

 

Do either of the two methods have a greater margin for error? I'm just wondering whether the solution might be more vulnerable to mishaps, given the fact that the liquified pill solution might not be evenly distributed when withdrawing with the syringe (even if you stir immediately before withdrawing).

Share this post


Link to post
ChessieCat
21 hours ago, ChessieCat said:

Moderator Rhiannon has dissolved her tablets successfully. 

 

Rhiannon has experience with lab stuff which is why she was using pipettes.  I can't remember exactly what and I'm not going to try and find it.  Her and other members have done the dissolved pill with no issues.  If I was able to dissolve my tablets that's what I would be doing.  You need to do everything the same way using the same equipment.  Same place on the bench or table so it always reads the same way.  When you get to smaller doses you dilute in more water and/or use smaller syringes.   The graduated cylinders are not very expensive and increase accuracy.  It's a good idea to write down your "recipe instructions" and doses so that if your mind ever goes blank, and it happens to everyone, not just taperers, you can refer to your notes.

 

There is one type of drug that doesn't dissolve in water and a tiny bit of alcohol needs to be added to it.  I can't remember which one (it's not the one that Rhiannon was taking, she stopped using alcohol).  And even with compounding there is no guarantee of the doses being all identical.

 

The more important thing for accuracy is the tools and the process.  Eg if you dissolve a tablet in water and it makes enough for 4 doses you would always extract with a syringe, even for the last dose.  There may be a tiny bit left over so if you assumed that it was the same as the other 3 doses and you just took what was left you may end up taking more on the last day.  And syringes.  A member mentioned recently that she had to get a new syringe (different brand) and even though they said the same measurement they were actually a little bit different.  So you try to keep everything as much the same as possible.  And like me, you just have to realise that you are doing the best you can with what you are doing and "believe" that the doses are fairly close.  Worrying about it just adds extra stress and extra stress diverts the brains attention away from doing what it needs to do.

Share this post


Link to post
SkyStreamer

Thanks ChessieCat!

 

Maybe I'll reach out to Rhiannon and BrassMonkey and ask them some follow-up questions. 

 

Appreciate your patience. :)

Share this post


Link to post
SkyStreamer

The two dose reductions I did two years ago, and the one I just did a few months ago were utter hell.

 

The biggest obstacles that arise during these withdrawal symptom periods are intense anger, which I believe covers over a lot of emotional hurt from my upbringing. I also experience severe anxiety and fear. 

 

My self-care practices are pretty strong, in my opinion: daily prayer & meditation, exercise for 1 hour 6 days per week, journalling every other day, healthy eating, breathing, listening to mindfulness and self-care talks, relaxation CDs. Gosh, I'm not sure I could really add anything to this. This is a healthy abundance of self-care. But, even with this, I still struggle intensely, but during the waves of withdrawal symptoms, and outside these.

 

My biggest challenges right now are dealing with my intense anger and anxiety. But, even more challenging than this, is dealing with my wife. We are both negatively reactive to each other. But, this happens all the time. For instance, during this last wave I experienced after my latest 2.5mg reduction, I experienced a tone of despair, sadness, lack of motivation, anxiety, etc. And, to top this all off, my wife picked this time to tell me the most negative things about me and our relationship. She said: (1) she wanted to leave with our daughters until I had completely come off my antidepressants, saying that I was unbearable; (2) that she thinks her and our kids would thrive without me; (2) and that I am like one of our kids which she is constantly having to take care of. Some of these, I reacted negatively to. Others, I just simply expressed my opinion that these comments were not helpful and should not be said during these withdrawal periods. The bottom line is that my wife is one of my biggest triggers of pain, anger, anxiety and despair, and I am having a hard time dealing with her. 

 

Responses welcome!

Share this post


Link to post
eymen23

Hi SkyStreamer,

 

Sorry to hear of the difficulties of both the withdrawals and the home situation. 

 

I think everything you’ve mentioned above points towards the value in taking long holds between dosage changes and tapering very slowly. 

 

I’ve just tried to look through your intro quickly and I didn’t see a reason for why you’re trying to taper off. Do you need to keep tapering? Would it be beneficial to complete an extended hold and then taper very slowly (maybe even at 5% or less a month) at a later date? 

 

As you’re aware, you’ve made some fairly big drops in the past (greater than 10%) and this last drop was completed faster than recommended here and in a way that’s not recommended (inconsistent daily dosing). I think you definitely need to weigh up your desire to be off the drug as quickly as possible vs on the consequences the other elements of you life.

 

In respect of the situation with your wife. I can’t pretend to be an expert, but have you sat down and talked through this at a time when you’re perhaps more emotionally available I.e. away from the usual stresses of daily life. I find these conversations with family tend to go a lot better when I speak to them outside of otherwise stressful periods. Do you think this relationship has difficulties that go far beyond withdrawal? Would it be wise to try relationship counselling or reconsider the relationship entirely?

 

 

 

 

Share this post


Link to post
SkyStreamer

Thanks eymen23 for responding!

 

I'll probably hold for at least one or two months. Then, I'll start trying to taper off by the 10% method.

 

Unfortunately, I made the large dosage reductions before coming across this site. 

 

My reason for tapering off is because the drugs have lost their initial effect of decreasing my anxiety and emotional unpleasantness. In fact, they are making me worse (mine and my wife's opinion). Additionally, these antidepressants seem to be negatively affecting my memory, overly numbing my feelings, and making me feel, generally, like someone I am not. I want to taper off my AD so that I can eventually be who I truly am, and face my underlying hurt and pain with all the many self-care tools I've come to learn about and practice.

 

My wife and I have done the counselling stuff off and on for a while. It's just a tough relationship, with two types of personalities that clash with more than complement each other. When I express my frustrations about her over this forum, it's only to give myself an opportunity to express my feelings and hurt in a safe environment, and to possibly hear some encouragement from people who are battling with other similar (if only indirectly related) challenges.

 

By the way - did you just start taking Escitalopram? Your signature card notes 5mg from Nov. 3rd?

Share this post


Link to post
eymen23
2 minutes ago, SkyStreamer said:

By the way - did you just start taking Escitalopram? Your signature card notes 5mg from Nov. 3rd?

 

That’s right, I have been on 5mg for 8 weeks and never before have I tried an SSRI. I have not enjoyed the experience thus far, although I can see other people have had much worse reactions to these drugs. 

 

It’s good you came across this site now, hopefully it’s going to make your future tapering process much easier to deal with. 

 

This makes sense in regards to why you want to taper. From what I’ve read on this site, once the drug stops working the way it used to, it can be a frustrating process of getting off; because you have to deal with any negative effects of the drug whilst still not going too fast otherwise you will hit a hard withdrawal. 

 

In regards to the situation with your wife, I can see how this will be difficult. It’s not exactly the same, but this process of trying SSRI’s and now wanting to stop has been very stressful for my family to hear about and has caused lots of arguments. If you already have very different personalities that can clash at times, I can see how this could cause a lot of conflicts. 

 

My only advice (I’m sure somebody else will have more to say) is that it’s key you focus on yourself and do what is right for you. So many times in my life I’ve tried to mould around other people and do things to appease them and it has never worked out well for me. I’ve always been so glad of the times I’ve done what was best for me. If getting off the drug is the most important thing you can do for yourself right now, I think it will be a case of carrying on with the taper slowly and finding a way to tolerate the difficulties with your wife. 

Share this post


Link to post
SkyStreamer

Thanks eymen23! Yes, self-care is my top priority right now.  I'll try and keep persevering, as well as try and accept all the unpleasantness that comes with my situation (WD & wife). :) 

 

The two things I'm trying to figure out presently are:

 

1. How long I should hold for (considering I just went through a difficult large taper of 2.5mg)?

 

2. Whether I should taper off with a liquid or solid pill form?

 

CheesieCat - what do you think about the first question?

Share this post


Link to post
Gridley

Other than the standard month between drops (to allow the neurotransmitters to adjust), there is no specific time to hold.  It should be based on how you're feeling and whether you are stable.  "Stable" doesn't mean without symptoms but rather that things are more or less the same day-to-day without wild swings.  That said, your drop from 10mg to 7.5mg over a period of two months is in excess of the recommended 10% and leads me to suggest that you hold more than the standard month, perhaps two or even three months to let things stabilize.  

 

Regarding a liquid vs. solid taper, that is completely an individual decision based on which you are more comfortable with.   The liquid taper is often recommended by Alto and moderators.  In my Lexapro taper, I was drawn the other way, just feeling more comfortable with the solid pills and the Gemini-20 scale.  I patterned my taper on Brassmonkey's.  He used the scale throughout his taper without difficulty.  I am also using his tapering method, which is a way of making microtaper reductions weekly as opposed to a larger reduction once a month.

 

 
 

Share this post


Link to post
xyz

hi SkyStreamer,

if your CNS is sensitized, you will feel the difference between minuscule cut and between tapering with pill or with the liquid.

if your CNS is stable enough and you have a good handle on your neuro emotions, then it won't matter as long as you are tapering sensibly.

 

i am sorry to say that with lexapro, you will have to learn precision if your CNS is sensitized, whether you dry cut or reduce the liquid.

it is a powerful SSRI, especially when you approach the lower dose, every 0.01mg will make a difference. if you don't feel the reduction during the taper, you will feel it once you are off the med.

your brain will still have to do the work to adjust the new level of meds.

 

we all want to be done with the meds yesterday but our brain has a different schedule.

i think trying to make the situation more liveable for you and your family should take precedence over getting off the meds.

think about the responsibility you and your wife both share in bringing up your children, you don't want them to end up on meds one day as well... 

my two cents.

Share this post


Link to post
SkyStreamer

Thanks for your response, Gridley! Much appreciated. 

 

Two or three month hold seems to make sense - given my recent 2.5mg reduction. 

 

For some reason, I feel more drawn to the solid pills & scale method too. But, I'm just trying to confirm that this is doable, will not require too much time each day, and can be done accurately.

 

Just a few follow-up questions regarding the full taper with sold pills & a scale:

 

1. My pharmacist told me that Escitalopram is evenly distributed throughout the solid pill. However, I've also heard that you are less likely to get an accurate tapered dose when you are dry cutting it because of the filler & coating ingredients (i.e. you might be shaving more of the escitalopram than the filler & coating on one particular day, which might leave you with two different escitalopram dosage amounts, even though they weigh the same on the scale). Can you comment on this?

 

2. Once you began tapering below 5mg, did you find that the cutting & shaving took a lot of time?

 

3. Why did you feel drawn to dry cutting & the scale over making your own liquid lexapro?

 

4. What do you find are some of the challenges of dry cutting & scale tapering?

Share this post


Link to post
SkyStreamer

Thanks xyz for your response! I can really sense that you care - and that is extremely important!
 

Precision makes sense. This is my guiding principle for trying to determine whether to taper with solid pill or liquid form.

 

You're right that I need to try and maintain a balanced and good family life. However, this is actually why I have decided to begin tapering off my AD. These pills were slowly making worse all of my initial symptoms: anxiety, anger, sadness, despair. And, they were also giving me new ones which were not there before: loss of memory, erosion of my personality, overly numbing my emotions, terrible nightmares, constant irritability, a significant loss of empathy, and generally just not being and feeling like myself. All of this is a huge problem to maintaining a balanced and good family environment. And, my heart tells me, that the problems that this has created, and will continue to create, is far greater than the problems that may arise by doing a slow, safe, and full taper of my AD.

 

The crucial point, I think, is to do a slow and safe 10% taper. I will still experience unpleasant symptoms. But, they can be made manageable with a lot of support and self-care, which I've been avidly practicing over the last five years. If I kept tapering huge amounts, like I was doing, I think you're right - it might lead to unnecessary problems with my children and wife. But, if I stick to this slow tapering method, advocated by this forum, then I think I have a good chance of experiencing great healing and recovery, which I believe would also benefit my family in the long run. Overall, I believe we always need to do what is best for ourselves, and this will, in turn, be best for all the other people in our lives. This is kind of like the idea of the oxygen mask on airplanes: always grab a mask for yourself first, and only then will you be able to be a benefit to others around you, including your family members. 

 

I'm very committed to doing this 10% tapering method (maybe at times, even lower %). No stopping me here. I just need help in making sure I'm going to be doing it safely, reasonably, and with as much encouragement and support as possible. 

 

 

Share this post


Link to post
Gridley
Posted (edited)
1 hour ago, SkyStreamer said:

 

Just a few follow-up questions regarding the full taper with sold pills & a scale:

 

1. My pharmacist told me that Escitalopram is evenly distributed throughout the solid pill. However, I've also heard that you are less likely to get an accurate tapered dose when you are dry cutting it because of the filler & coating ingredients (i.e. you might be shaving more of the escitalopram than the filler & coating on one particular day, which might leave you with two different escitalopram dosage amounts, even though they weigh the same on the scale). Can you comment on this?

 

I've never heard of this problem so I can't comment.

 

Quote

2. Once you began tapering below 5mg, did you find that the cutting & shaving took a lot of time?

 

Really no difference in time from the higher doses.  I might be be off a tiny bit from pill to pill but that's acceptable to me (no method is perfect).

 

Quote

3. Why did you feel drawn to dry cutting & the scale over making your own liquid lexapro?

 

I just prefer dealing with something solid that I can see.  Somehow the liquid method seemed more daunting, couldn't wrap my head around it.  Some people don't do well on the liquid.

Quote

 

4. What do you find are some of the challenges of dry cutting & scale tapering?

Once you get a new bottle, you have to weigh around 10 pills to get an average that you will use as your standard for that bottle.  Putting the tiny pieces on the scale to get the weight you want can be intricate work but not really difficult.  It will probably get harder when I get down very low, but so far it's gotten faster and faster.

Edited by Gridley

Share this post


Link to post
SkyStreamer

Thanks so much Gridley! I'm glad you chimed on to my intro thread!

 

That's my initial feeling as well right now: more comfortable with a substance I can see and manipulate by hand; and a bit worried & overwhelmed having to deal with making a liquid.

 

 

Share this post


Link to post
SkyStreamer

I've decided to try and write down how each day is going, so that I can better register my symptoms/emotions and have a log to reference as I go on.

 

NIGHT: slept 7 hours; woke up once for an hour & decided to read (George Elliot's 'MiddleMarch')

6:45am: woke up; went on SA; responded to some comments

7am: prayed for 30 mins.

8am: drove to mass; had a small panic attack while driving; was able to recuperate by accepting the situation and my feelings as they were, and by focusing on my breathing

9am: felt hopeless at mass; my 3 year old made me smile a few times though

11am: returned home; extreme underlying tension with my wife; wife really unhappy with my ongoing symptoms and her having to try and accommodate me

11am-12noon: feeling hopeless; high anxiety

1:30 (now): taking a two hour break; trying to relax and rest (tv, sleep, lying down, etc.); feeling very hopeless, but I know it is just a feeling and that it "too will pass.'

Share this post


Link to post
Altostrata

Please add when you take your drugs and their dosages to these daily notes, that would be very helpful.

Share this post


Link to post
ChessieCat
2 hours ago, SkyStreamer said:

Given my 2.5mg reduction in the last few months, and the difficult symptoms I've been experiencing, and am still experiencing, how long do you think I should hold for before I start my 10% taper? One, two, three months? Or is it just a matter of when I am feeling like the symptoms become more tolerable, consistently?

 

You will need to listen to your body/symptoms.  Keeping a daily symptom diary like you have started doing is a good idea.

 

Withdrawal Normal Description

 

You can also rate your symptoms.

 

Rate Symptoms Daily to Check Patterns and Progress

 

Dr Joseph Glenmullen's Withdrawal Symptoms

Share this post


Link to post
SkyStreamer
35 minutes ago, ChessieCat said:

You will need to listen to your body/symptoms.  Keeping a daily symptom diary like you have started doing is a good idea.

 

Withdrawal Normal Description

 

You can also rate your symptoms.

 

Rate Symptoms Daily to Check Patterns and Progress

 

Dr Joseph Glenmullen's Withdrawal Symptoms

 

Thanks ChessieCat!

 

Sometimes, I just want someone to "tell" me the answer. :) But, you've been on here long enough, and have dealt with a lot of us, to know that listening to our own bodies and symptoms is best for us in both the short and long term,. 

Share this post


Link to post
SkyStreamer
49 minutes ago, Altostrata said:

Please add when you take your drugs and their dosages to these daily notes, that would be very helpful.

 

Thanks for chiming in Altostrata. I like your cat picture. I see wisdom in those eyes! :)

 

You're right - adding in my dose times would help. I always take my dosage within the first hour after I wake-up in the morning. Since my wake-up time differs from time to time, especially during these WD periods, it is usually between 7:30am-9:30am.

 

I wanted to keep adding my daily routine and symptom details in the same individual post (the one I did midday today), but I can't seem to edit it. Do I have to post these all individually, or can I just add to the first one I already did?

Share this post


Link to post
Altostrata

You will have to make a new post, you can edit a post only within an hour.

 

Inconsistent dosing times can cause problems. Please pick a time, such as 9:30 a.m., to take Cipralex every day, this will produce a more legible symptom pattern.

Share this post


Link to post
ChessieCat
1 hour ago, SkyStreamer said:

Sometimes, I just want someone to "tell" me the answer.

 

With drugs, tapering, withdrawal etc, sometimes there is no answer.  Alto explains it as we are all an experiment where N=1.

 

1 hour ago, SkyStreamer said:

Do I have to post these all individually, or can I just add to the first one I already did?

 

It is best to post the whole of one day all at one time, not part of a day in one post and the rest in another.

Share this post


Link to post
SkyStreamer
10 minutes ago, ChessieCat said:

 

With drugs, tapering, withdrawal etc, sometimes there is no answer.  Alto explains it as we are all an experiment where N=1.

 

 

It is best to post the whole of one day all at one time, not part of a day in one post and the rest in another.

 

Makes sense.

Share this post


Link to post
SkyStreamer
1 hour ago, Altostrata said:

You will have to make a new post, you can edit a post only within an hour.

 

Inconsistent dosing times can cause problems. Please pick a time, such as 9:30 a.m., to take Cipralex every day, this will produce a more legible symptom pattern.

 

Ok - both make sense! Thanks!

Share this post


Link to post
Carmie

Hi SkyStreamer, 

 

Just wanted to say welcome to SA from me too. You made me laugh when you said sometimes you want someone to tell you the answer to withdrawals etc instead of having to listen to your body. I’m afraid the only indicator to tell us when we are ready to taper again is our bodies. 

 

Sometimes people think they are going okay for a week or more after big drops, but then it catches up with them and they have to hold even longer. We don’t get anywhere quicker doing it that way. It may actually slow down our taper as it might take ages to stabilise again. I’ve done this in the past before I knew much about withdrawals. Not a good plan whatsoever!😀

 

I’m glad you’re going to hold for a while. 

 

Sending hugs🤗

 

 

 

Share this post


Link to post
Shoehorn

Hey SkyStreamer, I'm in Canada and you're correct, liquid Cipralex isn't available here.

 

I've also been tapering from 15mg Cipralex since June. I'm down to 7mg now. I do the liquid suspension, it's super easy and quick. I use a small glass cup, 10mg generic Cipralex pills, and a 10ml oral syringe (drugstores and pharmacies will often give you a couple for free). Each morning before breakfast, I put 10ml water in the cup, add 1 pill, let it sit for 10 - 15 minutes to dissolve, give it a good shake, draw 3mg out with the syringe and squirt it down the sink, and drink the rest in the cup (7ml / 7mg). Rinse the cup and syringe. Done!

 

I find that different brands of generics have different fillers, so see if you can get the same manufacturer each time you refill your prescription.

Share this post


Link to post
SkyStreamer
2 hours ago, Carmie said:

Hi SkyStreamer, 

 

Just wanted to say welcome to SA from me too. You made me laugh when you said sometimes you want someone to tell you the answer to withdrawals etc instead of having to listen to your body. I’m afraid the only indicator to tell us when we are ready to taper again is our bodies. 

 

Sending hugs🤗

 

 

 

 

Carmie - thanks so much for your comments. It's so nice to receive positive support from people on here. And, a big thanks fo hugs!!! Very nice. 

 

I will be working on listening to my body from here-on-in. Please revisit my thread whenever you can with any comments and contributions!

Share this post


Link to post
SkyStreamer

[Re-submitting the breakdown of my day today in full]

 

 

NIGHT: slept 7 hours; woke up once for an hour & decided to read (George Elliot's 'MiddleMarch')

6:45am: woke up; went on SA; responded to some comments

7am: prayed for 30 mins

7:30am: took 7.5mg Cipralex dose (will be trying to consistently take at 9am from now on)

8am: drove to mass; had a small panic attack while driving; was able to recuperate by accepting the situation and my feelings as they were, and by focusing on my breathing

9am: felt hopeless at mass; my 3 year old made me smile a few times though

11am: returned home; extreme underlying tension with my wife; wife really unhappy with my ongoing symptoms and her having to try and accommodate me

11am-12noon: feeling hopeless; high anxiety

1:30 (now): taking a two hour break; trying to relax and rest (tv, sleep, lying down, etc.); feeling very hopeless, but I know it is just a feeling and that it "too will pass.'

2-2:30pm: did mindfulness guided meditation for 20 mins; slept for 30 mins; woke up re-energized; less despair; a glimmer of hope and motivation

4-5pm: exercise (skipping for 30 mins); shower

5-6:30pm: birthday dinner for my little daughter with presents, cake, etc.

7pm: return of anxiety, despair, anger, feeling like I'm 'losing it'

8pm: spoke to my mom by phone; broke down crying & sobbing to my mom (first time in about 1 year); felt a bit of internal relief after speaking and crying to my Mom

9pm: revisit and post to SA; pray for 1 hour

10pm: BED (Made it!!  - a Miracle!!!)

Share this post


Link to post
Carmie
12 minutes ago, SkyStreamer said:

 

Carmie - thanks so much for your comments. It's so nice to receive positive support from people on here. And, a big thanks fo hugs!!! Very nice. 

 

I will be working on listening to my body from here-on-in. Please revisit my thread whenever you can with any comments and contributions!

 

Hi again SkyStreamer, 

 

Yes, listening to your body is really the only way to go, there really is no other way. Going by a calendar doesn’t work whatsoever. If we go faster than we ought to go or we don’t hold long enough we ending up going into major waves that take longer to recover from. We don’t actually make any ground in our tapering journey. I’ve definitely learnt that lesson. 

 

I hope that you find some good distractions while going through withdrawals. I have found sooooo many to help me. At the moment my wrist is sore so I’m a bit limited. I did a lot of crocheting for years to help me cope with the waves. Can’t do that now because of my wrist. I found doing diamond paintings was a great distraction. I still do them now. They are little resin beads that you stick onto the numbers n letters on the canvas. I love arts n crafts, photography n music, and I’ve spent a lot of hours watching DVDs, YouTube n Netflix to get me through the day. 

 

We will win this fight! It might take a while but we will eventually heal. 

 

Take care💚

 

 

Share this post


Link to post
SkyStreamer

I woke up last night at around 1:30am due to the most terrifying nightmare. In my dream, I was having all my teeth pulled [cringing!]. They were all rotted, and once they came out, I discovered that their were rotted almonds in their place. There was also a rotten substance of some kind all around the almonds. I know that sounds kind of funny and strange. But, it was absolutely terrifying. I wasn't even able to talk to my wife about it when I woke at 1:30am. As soon as I woke at 1:30am from this nightmare, I felt an immediate panic attack coming on. I tried my go-to practices: 'I do not have to be afraid of this. I do not have worry about this. I do not have to give this attention. This too shall pass.' These helped a bit, but I was constantly on the verge of a full-blown panic attack, which I felt could lead to me fainting. I eventually started reading CNN on my cell phone. I know this is not the ideal, from what I've read (i.e. electronics off early before bed, for the night!). But, it helped me get through my panic attack, and prevented it from getting worse and helped me not faint.

 

After all this, before going to back to sleep, I had a feeling of complete and utter hopelessness. That I will never get off these AD. That this wave will never end. That my panic attacks will get more frequent. That my panic attacks will get more powerful. I thought to myself that maybe I should reinstate my 10mg Cipralex dose, or at least reinstate another 1mg, to see if my WD symptoms reduce (I'm having a very tough time enduring this narly wave!). But, my wife told me I can push through and stay at this 7.5mg dose, and that things will eventually get better, if only very minimally. She seems to think that I need to just cultivate the belief that I will get through this rough period at 7.5mg, and that this will help me overcome it. I think she is right to some extent. 

 

I'm very disappointed that I reduced 2.5mg back in October from 10mg to 7.5mg. But, I didn't know any better at the time, before I discovered SA. I am where I am now, and I think maybe I should just try and push through until I hopefully stabilize at 7.5mg. Any thoughts from those more experienced in this area?

 

One positive side to last night's awful ordeal is that I am very grateful, this morning, to have my full set of teeth. The downside, though, is that almonds do not seem as tasty to me as they once did. :)

 

P.S. If anyone feels so inclined to inject some mild, but respectful, humour, to any of their posts/comments on my thread, please feel free to do so. I find humour so refreshing and hope-inspiring!!! It's one of my favourite healthy defence mechanisms.  :)

Share this post


Link to post
eymen23
1 hour ago, SkyStreamer said:

 

P.S. If anyone feels so inclined to inject some mild, but respectful, humour, to any of their posts/comments on my thread, please feel free to do so. I find humour so refreshing and hope-inspiring!!! It's one of my favourite healthy defence mechanisms.  :)

 

You found almonds in place of your teeth?!?! My goodness, you really are going nuts.

 

Gosh, that was awful. Hope somebody else can do better :) 

Share this post


Link to post
xyz

hi SKy,

i used to have terrible terrible, terrible terrible nightmare

so bad that when i described it to people, they had goose bumps.

dream of dead people, of haunted house, of me being dead and not knowing it. sad dream of deserted island.

it is our injured brain.

 

it will get better. learn from this "nightmare". the taper at 10% will feel like vacation.

each time i have a bad wave, i think "but look at the brighter side, the window will be much more enjoyable"- and it is true, after a bad wave, comes the clarity, the peace, the love, the gratitude of being able to go shopping without a panic attack.

the excitement of mundane things such as repainting the kitchen...

 

the best is yet to come!

 

 

 

Share this post


Link to post

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.
Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.

×
×
  • Create New...