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BfromNJ: mirtazapine taper

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Altostrata
2 hours ago, BfromNJ said:

as far as the reduction, I suppose keep at the 25% ?  

 

Do you really have to ask?

 

Please answer all my questions above.

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BfromNJ
34 minutes ago, Altostrata said:

 

Do you really have to ask?

 

Please answer all my questions above.

im sorry if i asked a stupid question.  with all i had going on last night and today, i was worried about the taper and going to fast.  I will keep at it.  

 

Yes, i do have some of my other seroquel left and i had planned to take it tonight.  

 

as far as the tinnitus and gaba, i think i answered that previously.  I dont know for sure,  tinnitus did not start until a month after i stopped gaba in december.   and was ongoing before i started it again this time. its just worse now at times.  so many factors could be at play, but something definitely aggravates it.   

 

thank you for your responses.  I appreciate it.  and disregard my message, seems the forums are okay now, something went wrong before.  :)

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BfromNJ

 

@Altostrata

@Shep

Hello.  I am attaching my taper schedule from the  Luvox.  this is based on still being able to handle the 25%.  could change if I decide to go slower at 10%  . My question is - once I get down to those very very small numbers, is there a point on here that I can cut off prior to the very end? What looks like a safe spot?   or do I see it through to the end?  I was just wondering because it seems like those 0.01s etc are tiny. 

 

thanks. 

taper schedule.xlsx

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BfromNJ

@Altostrata

@Shep

Also , I forgot to ask in above,

 

I saw in someone elses post that if doing a more rapid taper due to adverse reactions that you speed up the time as well as the percentage?  but is this more for when its been under a month still of starting the med? I am at about 45 days when I started my taper.      Should I still do a month between dose changes?   I want to make sure im doing the right thing.   

 

I just wanted to make sure I am doing this right.  also, my concern is coming of the mirt. in Feb. and other changes of not doing anything to make myself any more unstable.   

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Shep
On 4/9/2019 at 8:19 PM, BfromNJ said:

Yes, i do have some of my other seroquel left and i had planned to take it tonight.  

 

How did you sleep with the previous brand of seroquel? 

 

20 hours ago, BfromNJ said:

I saw in someone elses post that if doing a more rapid taper due to adverse reactions that you speed up the time as well as the percentage?  but is this more for when its been under a month still of starting the med? I am at about 45 days when I started my taper.      Should I still do a month between dose changes?   I want to make sure im doing the right thing.   

 

Yes, if this is an adverse reaction, you would speed up the time and not hold for a month.

 

BUT it will depend on your symptoms and how much your nervous system can handle. 

 

Your symptoms will be your guide. 

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BfromNJ
9 minutes ago, Shep said:

 

How did you sleep with the previous brand of seroquel? 

 

 

Yes, if this is an adverse reaction, you would speed up the time and not hold for a month.

 

BUT it will depend on your symptoms and how much your nervous system can handle. 

 

Your symptoms will be your guide. 

I am sleeping better with the older Seroquel brand.   How much do a speed it up?  Im at day 7 now today.   don't want to rush too much.    I seem to be okay.  sleeping okay, just a bit more anxiety.  but its okay.   its really hard Shep because I have the added problem of the gabapentin, which I think is causing me problems as well.  I noticed last night, that I was feeling good, pretty calm no tinnitus really, clear headed and relaxed.  I took my gabapentin then knocked out on the couch for a bit.  after about an hour of taking it, when I awoke my tinnitus was horrible and my head felt terrible.  maybe a flute but I don't know.  I will need to keep an eye on it.     I am wondering if it was the culprit all along, or a combination of everything.  unfortunately I am stuck with it for now I suppose.   

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Shep

Your increase in gabapentin was February 20, 2019, so you are not quite 2 months into that increase. 

 

So you may be able to decrease that back down some.

 

But please don't do so while still working with the Luvox rapid taper. Once the Luvox is down low enough, you may want to consider removing some of the gabapentin. We normally don't recommend switching back and forth like this, but your history of adverse reactions to psych drugs and your short term use makes you more of an exception than a rule.

 

So please don't ask if others have done this. We rarely get anyone in the forum that has short term use AND possible adverse reactions to several drugs at one time. Please read through the success stories and take comfort from them. With your short history of use, you have every reason to expect to heal from this. 

 

Your symptoms will be your guide, so make sure you are keeping record of your symptoms and drugs daily by keeping up your journal. If you don't want to post it every day here on the forum, perhaps keep a Word doc and if you have specific questions, you can copy and paste it here in your thread. 

 

How do you feel about another 25% decrease in the Luvox? 

 

Are you able to get enough of your prior brand of Seroquel? It sounds like the prior brand is working better. 

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BfromNJ
22 minutes ago, Shep said:

Your increase in gabapentin was February 20, 2019, so you are not quite 2 months into that increase. 

 

So you may be able to decrease that back down some.

 

But please don't do so while still working with the Luvox rapid taper. Once the Luvox is down low enough, you may want to consider removing some of the gabapentin. We normally don't recommend switching back and forth like this, but your history of adverse reactions to psych drugs and your short term use makes you more of an exception than a rule.

 

So please don't ask if others have done this. We rarely get anyone in the forum that has short term use AND possible adverse reactions to several drugs at one time. Please read through the success stories and take comfort from them. With your short history of use, you have every reason to expect to heal from this. 

 

Your symptoms will be your guide, so make sure you are keeping record of your symptoms and drugs daily by keeping up your journal. If you don't want to post it every day here on the forum, perhaps keep a Word doc and if you have specific questions, you can copy and paste it here in your thread. 

 

How do you feel about another 25% decrease in the Luvox? 

 

Are you able to get enough of your prior brand of Seroquel? It sounds like the prior brand is working better. 

the gabapentin on 2/20 was not an increase.  It was a new start.  I had previously stopped it on 12/8.   And 2/20 started new with 600 mg instead of 300 mg.      so its unusual to have adverse reactions to more than one drug?   so maybe its more of an interaction then?     I think I can try another decrease.  Also, I wanted to move the time I take the luvox to 5-6 pm. Currently I take it at noon.  is that a bad idea? 

 

I have a lot of Seroquel prior brand now.  I think I can still get the old brand if I ask my doctor for the 50 mg and cut in half like I am doing.   But how do I find out if its still being made? do I call the manufacturer or ask pharmacist before its filled? 

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BfromNJ

im very nervous. my head does not feel right.    its like my brain is pulsing or loose in my skull.  ive had before but its really bad this morning.  is there a name for this weird phenomenom?  :/    I really hate all this stuff we need to go through.  once again I have such regret over even starting these meds.  and such a long road ahead.   

 

I just wish I knew if all that I have going on is from withdraw of mirt in feb, or new med.  maybe both.  is frustrating not knowing.  not that anything can be done about it 

 

Thank you to anyone who reads my rant.  I know this is the place that people understand this kind of thing. 

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BfromNJ

I am posting my journal for the last few days per @Shep and @Altostrata.   I don't know if I see myself the symptoms occurring of the adverse reaction to the luvox after I am taking it as much, at least not right after.  maybe the lower dose?  The symptoms I have seem to come at different times now, so I can pin point it. 

 

4/6
5:30- awoke but stayed in bed.  once awake can't ever fall back asleep.   had the weird pulsing/shaking feeling in head when I'm just laying there.  feels like my brain is loose .
8:00 out of bed - feel disconnected from surroundings, foggyheaded.  weird throat sensation is there.  bad dp this morning? 
8:30  - 200 mg gabapentin
10:30- somewhat better.  some anxiety this morning. buzzing in head.  
12:00- lunch
- luvox 18.75 mg (start of taper)
-  still ringing/buzzing, feeling very out of sorts. 
2:30- 200 mg gabapentin. 
calmer as afternoon went on.  
4:00- weird sensation in head.  like a pulsing,  tight feeling/pressure feeling. makes me feel like I have to crack my neck all time.   headache. 
5:30- dinner
headache subsiding some by around 8.  more clear headed.  
9- gabapentin 200 mg
10- headache returning . headpresure returning.   ringing/buzzing. 
10:30- seroquel 25 mg (new manufacturer and actual 25 mg pill instead of splitting).
 
4/7-
7:30- out of bed.  pretty clear headed
7:45/8? - gabapentin - 200 mg .
8:20-  some buzzing in head/ears and weird throat sensation. bit of head pressure/ache/coming on.  (this is making me question as to whether it's the gabapentin giving adverse affects). 
9:30- throat sensation increases,  as well as zinging/buzzing
12:00-  feel calmer now, but still some buzzing/ringing and internal shakeyness.  bad head ache coming on. 
 -  luvox 18.75 
- dizzyness.  
feeling okay while sitting outside, but still very dizzy.  hard to tell dizzyness from dp.  more anxiety today than normal. 
2:30- gabapentin 200 mg 
5:30-  feeling hot all over.  this is new.  but I am perimenopausal.  
7:00- legs feeling funny.  sore , stiff and feel like I need to move them.  like agitated. 
-took nice walk outside . 
8:00- another hot feeling. 
legs still feeling funny.  heating pad helped
9:00- gabapentin 200 mg
10:00- seroquel 25 mg (different manufacturer)
- ear ringing did not seem as prominent when going to sleep tonight
 
4/8- 
did not sleep well.. not sure if related to luvox lowering or boyfriend snoring and restless as he was sick.  
5 30- up.  not feeling too bad for not sleeping well.  some anxiety.  weird pulsing feeling in head.  ears seem plugged up.  legs feeling sort of restless in thighs like last night, this subsided.   
6:15 - breakfast 
 - 200 mg gabapentin & probiotic
7:15- shakey/loose/rumbling/pressure feeling in head (I have trouble explaining how this feels)  I can hear a crack sometimes.  a bit out of sorts now.  some nausea.  
8:00- at work. 
9:00- feeling better, but head feelings still there
10- feeling pretty good even with head symptoms. clear headed and more present.. 
noting some ear ringing. 
11:30- anxiety creeping in more.  worried about the taper/wd and fixated on when I'm going to feel really bad again.  catastrophizing.   
12: 00- luvox 18.75 mg (taper day 3)
felt funny around 1. increased ringing/buzzing.  dizzy and out of sorts.  head pressure and foggyness.  not as clear headed as earlier 
2:00- feeling a bit better, but headache coming on and pressure still there. 
2:30- gabapentin 200 mg
6:00- anxiety creeping in.  tingling through out body.  legs feel a bit restless.  internal shaking/tremor pressure feeling in head. 
still feeling more cleared headed though and more connected to my surroundings.  mood is good.
8:30- gabapentin 200 mg
9:30 - seroquel 25 mg (new manufacturer)
10- bed. not able to fall asleep.  again.  usually knocked out with seroquel. like I was wired.  boyfriend snoring, anticipating snoring? very agitated.   finally asleep around 1.  up at 4:45.  
 
4/9- 4:45 -woke up.  ear ringing is very bad.  very unusual for morning.  usually is none upon wakening.   worst I've had in while.  scared about it.  
6: 15 - breakfast
 - 200 mg gabapentin and probiotic.
8:00- work.   
ringing is still very bad.  feeling a bit disconnected from surroundings, but not as much as usual.
dizzyness and pressure in head.   rumbling in ears.   weird feeling.  chills.  maybe a bit of dp.
9:30- feeling better.  anxiety lower.  clear headed, even though I am experiencing the above awful symptoms.  
11 :00- starting to feel some disconnect/dp.  
nervous .  
12- luvox 18.75 mg (taper day 4).
tinnitus not letting up.  very worrisome. 
2:00- gabapentin 200 mg. 
mild headache .  rumbling in head still.  
4:00- tinnitus still bad.  very  hard to deal with.  
despite no sleep last night feel wired.  maybe nerves or drop in luvox.  
5:00 - dinner.
tinnitus still horrible.  no tolerance to noise.  
8:00- gabapentin 200 mg
8:45 - seroquel 25 mg (old maudacturer script)
9:00- tried for bed early.  hard to relax.  tinnitus unbearable.  and whole body felt like a vibrating/pulsating.  
10:30-11- maybe fell asleep? 
 
4/10
4:30- awoke .  tinnitus lower.  
5:45 -up
tinnitus still tame but can hear it starting up. it is now like a whistling sound.  some anxiety spike.  tingling/electrical sensation in throat.  
6:30- breakfast
-200 mg gaba
9:00- headache but slight.  clear headed.  
11 30- very bad heartburn.  
12:00- lunch
 - luvox 18.75 mg (taper day5)
 1:00- zinging /buzzing in head .  tinnitus increase or zaps? which is growing increasingly worse along with rumbling sensation/noise . starting to feel a bit out of sorts and fuzzy.  anxiety.   
2:00- gabapentin 200 mg
4:00- gym.
6:30-dinner
8:30- gabapentin 200 mg 
9:30- seroquel 25 mg
 
4/11-  
4:30- woke up layed in bed.  no tinnitus or weird rumbling etc in head.  
5:45 got up. 
tinnitus low or not there.
anxiety.  
weird throat/back of head sensation.  I'm beginning to think this is brain zaps.  
6:15- breakfast
-200 mg gaba
7:30- work
headache 
11:00- persistent headache/pressure.  shakey brain feeling. zaps continuing.  
11:45- luvox 18.75 mg (taper day 6)
12:00- increasing anxiety.  feeling very strange, out of sorts.  
this did calm down, but tinnitus/zaps has increased.
2:15- 200 mg gabapentin 
rumbling/pulsing in head.   weird sensation through out body.  jittery.  
-  forgot to take notes for rest of afternoon.
6:00- dinner.
no symptoms.  felt calm.   tinnitus/zaps not bothersome.  able to read.  
8:30- gabapentin 200 mg. 
knodded off on couch .  
9:30-  tinnitus bad again.     headache/pressure/heaviness.  
-  25 mg seroquel. 
10- bed
 
 

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BfromNJ

@Shep

Hey there.  Think I'm gonna hold my luvox where it's at.  At least a few days.  Not feeling well.  Is that best?  I don't wanna go back up but should I hold ? 

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Shep
On 4/12/2019 at 8:29 AM, BfromNJ said:

Also, I wanted to move the time I take the luvox to 5-6 pm. Currently I take it at noon.  is that a bad idea? 

 

We recommend moving it one hour a day. 

 

Is Luvox sedating for you? 

 

1 hour ago, BfromNJ said:

Not feeling well. 

 

Please list your symptoms. Are you sleeping okay? 

 

Are you taking any supplements? I don't see any listed in your drug and symptoms journal but I wanted to mention it because there is an interaction between magnesium and gabapentin. 

 

On 7/8/2012 at 11:39 PM, Altostrata said:

NOTE There is an interaction between gabapentin and magnesium, see http://www.webmd.com/drugs/2/drug-9845-8217/neurontin-oral/gabapentin-oral/details/list-interaction-details/dmid-1207/dmtitle-gabapentin-aluminum-magnesium-containing-compounds/intrtype-drug. Taking magnesium at the same time as gabapentin decreases the absorption of gabapentin. Avoid taking aluminum or magnesium containing products (such as antacids) for 2 hours before your gabapentin.

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BfromNJ
38 minutes ago, Shep said:

 

We recommend moving it one hour a day. 

 

Is Luvox sedating for you? 

 

 

Please list your symptoms. Are you sleeping okay? 

 

Are you taking any supplements? I don't see any listed in your drug and symptoms journal but I wanted to mention it because there is an interaction between magnesium and gabapentin. 

 

 

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BfromNJ

Luvox is a sedating ssri.  they normally recommend taking it at night, but initially when i started it i thought it was keeping me up.  so i will do that and move it one hour each day.  so technically, i am on three brakes?  but i think in europe, they use it as an antidepressant.  here is mainly ocd i believe?  and i think that the immediate release is supposed to be twice a day?  from stuff ive read, but they have me on once a day.  

 

maybe i will again in a few more days.

 

No, i am not taking any supplements.  

 

as far as not feeling well, last night i had a bad nights sleep, could not fall asleep.  and in the am, once i wake up, there is no going back to sleep.  i was up at 2:30 and layed there, mind racing and rumminating, etc.    its like the serquel wears off and thats it.     i felt anxious before i went to bed.   woke up this morning feeling horrible, ears ringing awful, buzzing in the head, dizzy, disconnected.  however that may have been lack of sleep.  

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BfromNJ
4 hours ago, BfromNJ said:

 

Luvox is a sedating ssri.  they normally recommend taking it at night, but initially when i started it i thought it was keeping me up.  so i will do that and move it one hour each day.  so technically, i am on three brakes?  but i think in europe, they use it as an antidepressant.  here is mainly ocd i believe?  and i think that the immediate release is supposed to be twice a day?  from stuff ive read, but they have me on once a day.  

 

maybe i will again in a few more days.

 

No, i am not taking any supplements.  

 

as far as not feeling well, last night i had a bad nights sleep, could not fall asleep.  and in the am, once i wake up, there is no going back to sleep.  i was up at 2:30 and layed there, mind racing and rumminating, etc.    its like the serquel wears off and thats it.     i felt anxious before i went to bed.   woke up this morning feeling horrible, ears ringing awful, buzzing in the head, dizzy, disconnected.  however that may have been lack of sleep.  

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BfromNJ

i am having such a hard time determining if i am having adverse reactions or interactions with three meds im on.  or maybe both?  this sucks.  :( 

 

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Altostrata

I would stay at present Luvox 18.75mg for a few more days, track symptoms.

 

Right now, It looks to me like you are still having an adverse reaction to Luvox in combination with gabapentin.


You'll have to reduce one or the other drug to reduce the symptoms after you take Luvox. What do you want to do?

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BfromNJ
32 minutes ago, Altostrata said:

I would stay at present Luvox 18.75mg for a few more days, track symptoms.

 

Right now, It looks to me like you are still having an adverse reaction to Luvox in combination with gabapentin.


You'll have to reduce one or the other drug to reduce the symptoms after you take Luvox. What do you want to do?

Hi Alto.  I'm confused by your question. Do you mean which drug would I like to reduce? Could I reduce the gaba at this point and hold on the luvox?  Shouldn't I stick with the luvox but wait a few days?  I do know something is just going haywire in my system and I do feel the gaba may be too much. 

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BfromNJ

This is my journal for today.  Not a good day.  Its day 8 of luvox taper of 25% due to possible adverse reactions.  Maybe too much?  Should gaba be lower?  

 

4/13-  bad night sleep., up since about 2:30 am then just laying in bed- rumination,  anxiety, constant pulsing/shaking/tremor feeling in head. 
7:30-  up.  headache and tinnyness/zinging.  fullness in head/ears.   feeling horrible. 
- 200 mg gabapentin.
10:00- headache, but more clear headed as morning went on.
- 12:30 -ringing increases. filling up room. weird throat feeling .  anxiety and slight feeling of disconnect. 
1:30- gaba 200 mg and luvox 18.75 mg (day 8 of taper)
(normally take luvox at 12 and gaba at 2). trying to move luvox to later)
2:45- pulsing/tremor/shaking feeling in head . my own voice bothers my ears and headache.
4:00- headache.  ringing won't let up. 
6:15-  ringing/buzzing is still intense.  ear pain.
8:30- ears are pulsing with noise. 
       - 200 mg gaba

 

I fear a worsening of symptoms due to luvox drop (25%).  may need to hold a while.  this is worse day I've had in a while ear and head wise. ( these are my predominant symptoms.)  have I messed myself up more with drop?  I hope not.  I am clear headed surprisingly.   but this is very upsetting and debilitating.  Maybe it's just a wave?  

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BfromNJ

Another bad night of sleep.  the ringing and buzzing was horrific to try and fall asleep.   Woke up to horrific buzzing/ringing this morning as well.  not coping well with this at all.     Might this be withdraw from luvox drop?  do i hold or up it?  if i go back up from 18.75 to 25, will i have further problems?  maybe i will stablize where i am ? i would hate to have to go back up.   this will be day 9 of my taper.   

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ChessieCat
8 hours ago, BfromNJ said:

if i go back up from 18.75 to 25, will i have further problems?

 

If you increase your dose it is better to increase by a small amount.  Please read Post #1 of this topic which is relevant to updosing as well:  About reinstating and stabilizing to reduce withdrawal symptoms

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BfromNJ

@Shep

@Altostrata

I'd love your input on my above few posts.  Even though I was adversely reacting to luvox did I go to fast?  Should I hold ? Or go up a bit as chelsie said?  Primarily sleep is off and my ears and head are ringing and buzzing insanely.  I'm having trouble determining if is tinnitus or zaps or both.  

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ChessieCat
1 hour ago, BfromNJ said:

Or go up a bit as chelsie said?

 

Please note that I did not suggest that you increase.  I made the statement "if you decide to increase".

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BfromNJ
9 hours ago, ChessieCat said:

 

Please note that I did not suggest that you increase.  I made the statement "if you decide to increase".

I understand.  Thanks.  

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Shep
12 hours ago, BfromNJ said:

I'd love your input on my above few posts.  Even though I was adversely reacting to luvox did I go to fast?  Should I hold ? Or go up a bit as chelsie said?  Primarily sleep is off and my ears and head are ringing and buzzing insanely.  I'm having trouble determining if is tinnitus or zaps or both.  

 

Are you feeling better or worse OVERALL? By that I mean, back in February, you posted this:

 

On 2/15/2019 at 6:07 AM, BfromNJ said:

Im having a really tough time now.   Not sleeping,  anxiety is through the roof, im beside myself.  I dropped to 3.75 two nights ago.  I hear you with the ear zinging.   I woke up on January 5 with really bad ringing.  Ive had iltinnitus but never that i noticed and not this bad.  I actually forgot it was there.  Not sure where this came from but its been pretty much what has kept me in a persistent state of anxiety.  But now its different on mirt.  Its like an electrical current.  I feel like im going mad.  Hearing also very sensitive.  Cant stand quiet but noise is bothersome.   No quality of life here.  I am tired of it all.   

 

Are you feeling better now than you were when you posted the above quote from two months ago? 

 

As we've mentioned, you are dealing with a number of variables - mirtazapine withdrawal, adverse reactions, drug interactions, etc. 

 

And then there's the battle fatigue factor from just being exhausted from being destabilized for weeks or months at a time. 

 

So it's important to parse through it and figure out what is what, to the extent that that is possible. 

 

You are going to be the best judge of this, but do take a look through your thread and let us know if you feel that you are doing better, worse, or the same as you were. 

 

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BfromNJ
2 hours ago, Shep said:

 

Are you feeling better or worse OVERALL? By that I mean, back in February, you posted this:

 

 

Are you feeling better now than you were when you posted the above quote from two months ago? 

 

As we've mentioned, you are dealing with a number of variables - mirtazapine withdrawal, adverse reactions, drug interactions, etc. 

 

And then there's the battle fatigue factor from just being exhausted from being destabilized for weeks or months at a time. 

 

So it's important to parse through it and figure out what is what, to the extent that that is possible. 

 

You are going to be the best judge of this, but do take a look through your thread and let us know if you feel that you are doing better, worse, or the same as you were. 

 

I think Shep that I am better now then back then.  of course, the Seroquel is helping with the sleep when back then I was not sleeping well.  And yes, I have so many variables its frustrating . the three meds now are all sedating, so I guess coming off the one (luvox) will increase anxiety some.  OVERALL, id say im better than I was back then.  Its just that I am having a hard time with the tinnitus/buzzing, ear issues etc.  its very hard for me to parse through and really pin point it.  that being said, Im honestly not sure if I should stay where I am for a bit in my luvox taper.  im thinking it may be for the best.  I suppose I can expect some symptoms with a dosage drop. 

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BfromNJ
1 hour ago, BfromNJ said:

I think Shep that I am better now then back then.  of course, the Seroquel is helping with the sleep when back then I was not sleeping well.  And yes, I have so many variables its frustrating . the three meds now are all sedating, so I guess coming off the one (luvox) will increase anxiety some.  OVERALL, id say im better than I was back then.  Its just that I am having a hard time with the tinnitus/buzzing, ear issues etc.  its very hard for me to parse through and really pin point it.  I do fear that it has worsened with these three meds and that is frustrating and scary for me.  I fear the longer I am on all of them, that it can be permanent.  Not that it wouldn't be anyway , one never knows.  But of course I have the fear of "which med is it" ? 

 

    Im honestly not sure if I should stay where I am for a bit in my luvox taper?   im thinking it may be for the best.  I suppose I can expect some symptoms with a dosage drop.    I can also slow down the drop to less, maybe 15% .

 

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Altostrata
On 4/13/2019 at 2:43 PM, Altostrata said:

I would stay at present Luvox 18.75mg for a few more days, track symptoms.

 

Right now, It looks to me like you are still having an adverse reaction to Luvox in combination with gabapentin.


You'll have to reduce one or the other drug to reduce the symptoms after you take Luvox. What do you want to do?

 

What this means is: I would stay at present Luvox 18.75mg for a few more days, track symptoms.

 

We don't recommend changing more than one drug at a time, therefore, you're not going to be changing gabapentin until the Luvox change settles.

 

I am very confused by your symptom reports. Looking back in your topic, I see you were sleeping poorly and had tinnitus before reducing Luvox to 18.75mg. How has your symptom pattern changed in the last week?

 

When you have a drug-drug interaction, you can reduce either drug to reduce the interaction. It appears you are having an adverse reaction after you take gabapentin every day. Did your sleep, tinnitus, etc. get worse AFTER you increased gabapentin to 200mg 3 times a day on February 20 but BEFORE you reduced Luvox on April 6?

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BfromNJ
6 hours ago, Altostrata said:

 

What this means is: I would stay at present Luvox 18.75mg for a few more days, track symptoms.

 

We don't recommend changing more than one drug at a time, therefore, you're not going to be changing gabapentin until the Luvox change settles.

 

I am very confused by your symptom reports. Looking back in your topic, I see you were sleeping poorly and had tinnitus before reducing Luvox to 18.75mg. How has your symptom pattern changed in the last week?

 

When you have a drug-drug interaction, you can reduce either drug to reduce the interaction. It appears you are having an adverse reaction after you take gabapentin every day. Did your sleep, tinnitus, etc. get worse AFTER you increased gabapentin to 200mg 3 times a day on February 20 but BEFORE you reduced Luvox on April 6?

I am sorry to confuse you.  I was sleeping okay before the luvox reduction, because of seroquel.  At same time the reduction started, I also had seroquel manufacturer change.  This may have been reason for poorer sleep at that time (4/6).  now I am getting about 5 hours.  not a lot but I think its deep sleep.  

 

I would say yes the tinnitus is worse since the gaba increase.   And worse in last two weeks.  Its horrific at night.   Screeching.  Then much better in morning upon awakening.  almost nonexistent.    then is starts up.     it almost seems like its the build up all the meds in my system for the day?  Maybe I should try and take my luvox at night?  

 

I'm sorry to be confusing is there an easier way I can track my symptoms?  I'm having trouble myself trying to figure out what is causing symptoms, I assume all meds together.  

 

My tinnitus started about a month after stopping gaba 300 mg.  (Taken for 14 days).  

 

I cannot say for sure it was the cause.  I had other factors- dental work,  upper endoscopy,  antibiotic.  But the meds have not helped the situation. 

 

so if I am having a drug-drug interaction, it does not matter which one is reduced first?  but if I am having a reaction to each med, then what? i do feel that i am reacting to both meds.  

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

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Shep
22 hours ago, BfromNJ said:

OVERALL, id say im better than I was back then. 

 

Then you're moving in the right direction.

 

But, it's a non-linear, windows and waves pattern. 

 

45 minutes ago, BfromNJ said:

so if I am having a drug-drug interaction, it does not matter which one is reduced first?  but if I am having a reaction to each med, then what? either way I would assume one at a time.  

 

Please note these statements Alto made in her previous post: 

 

6 hours ago, Altostrata said:

We don't recommend changing more than one drug at a time, therefore, you're not going to be changing gabapentin until the Luvox change settles.

 

6 hours ago, Altostrata said:

When you have a drug-drug interaction, you can reduce either drug to reduce the interaction. It appears you are having an adverse reaction after you take gabapentin every day

 

Please let us know if this answers your questions. 

 

Right now, holding is the thing to do. Then we can reassess and see if the gabapentin should be decreased. However, we won't know which direction to go until we come to that road. 

 

You may be one of those people who has a very analytical mind mixed in with a worrying mind. This can cause you to go in 60 different directions at one time and loads of questions (why?, how?, how much?, why not?) all come at you at once.

 

If you can, try a short guided meditation several times throughout the day. Learn how to do the deep-breathe, then learn how to float, to let your thoughts glide past you like clouds in the sky without engaging in dialogue with them. Or, if your thoughts are like loud, annoying neighbors, learn to shrug them off, knowing they come from a place of pain and you don't want any of what they're offering. This is mindfulness. 

 

This is what you should be doing NOW. Think of withdrawal as many, many opportunities to practice these skills. In time, you'll master them. If you can master them during withdrawal, you'll come out of this with a bit of the Buddha in you.

 

Some videos to try. Again, these need to be done every couple of hours throughout the day. Set an alarm or an email reminder. 

 

4-7-8 Breathing: Health Benefits & Demonstration

 

The Breathing Space by Jon Kabat Zinn video (4 minutes)

 

For tinnitus, yes, it's uncomfortable. Yes, it's like sirens screaming bloody red into your ears and head all day. But it is temporary. If you can use white noise or a fan to help tone it down, that can be helpful. 

 

10 Hour Shower Best Tinnitus Masking Therapy Ever White Noise video (10 hours)

 

Within an hour of going to bed, try listening to a guided meditation on how to let go of thoughts. This is one that got me through acute withdrawal and if you don't like this one, there are thousands of them out there on YouTube.

 

Guided Meditation for Detachment From Over-Thinking (Anxiety / OCD / Depression) video (42 minutes)

 

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BfromNJ
7 minutes ago, Shep said:

 

Then you're moving in the right direction.

 

But, it's a non-linear, windows and waves pattern. 

 

 

Please note these statements Alto made in her previous post: 

 

 

 

Please let us know if this answers your questions. 

 

Right now, holding is the thing to do. Then we can reassess and see if the gabapentin should be decreased. However, we won't know which direction to go until we come to that road. 

 

You may be one of those people who has a very analytical mind mixed in with a worrying mind. This can cause you to go in 60 different directions at one time and loads of questions (why?, how?, how much?, why not?) all come at you at once.

 

If you can, try a short guided meditation several times throughout the day. Learn how to do the deep-breathe, then learn how to float, to let your thoughts glide past you like clouds in the sky without engaging in dialogue with them. Or, if your thoughts are like loud, annoying neighbors, learn to shrug them off, knowing they come from a place of pain and you don't want any of what they're offering. This is mindfulness. 

 

This is what you should be doing NOW. Think of withdrawal as many, many opportunities to practice these skills. In time, you'll master them. If you can master them during withdrawal, you'll come out of this with a bit of the Buddha in you.

 

Some videos to try. Again, these need to be done every couple of hours throughout the day. Set an alarm or an email reminder. 

 

4-7-8 Breathing: Health Benefits & Demonstration

 

The Breathing Space by Jon Kabat Zinn video (4 minutes)

 

For tinnitus, yes, it's uncomfortable. Yes, it's like sirens screaming bloody red into your ears and head all day. But it is temporary. If you can use white noise or a fan to help tone it down, that can be helpful. 

 

10 Hour Shower Best Tinnitus Masking Therapy Ever White Noise video (10 hours)

 

Within an hour of going to bed, try listening to a guided meditation on how to let go of thoughts. This is one that got me through acute withdrawal and if you don't like this one, there are thousands of them out there on YouTube.

 

Guided Meditation for Detachment From Over-Thinking (Anxiety / OCD / Depression) video (42 minutes)

 

thanks Shep.  Yes i do do guided meditation, but i am not consistant.  I have a hard time with it sometimes because the tinnitus and hypeacusis is so bad.   and i do use masking at night. but i can only turn it up so much , as it almost seems like the tinnitus will try and outdo it.  if that makes sense.  might be because of the hyperacausis.   and it annoys my boyfriend. :)   i think you pegged me right.  Better than i psych doctor.  do i owe you a copay now?  lol.    I really do hope the tinnitus is temporary.  its just such a long road tapering these meds.  if only i hadn't gotten back on any.  if only.... 

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BfromNJ
29 minutes ago, Shep said:

 

Then you're moving in the right direction.

 

But, it's a non-linear, windows and waves pattern. 

 

 

Please note these statements Alto made in her previous post: 

 

 

 

Please let us know if this answers your questions. 

 

Right now, holding is the thing to do. Then we can reassess and see if the gabapentin should be decreased. However, we won't know which direction to go until we come to that road. 

 

You may be one of those people who has a very analytical mind mixed in with a worrying mind. This can cause you to go in 60 different directions at one time and loads of questions (why?, how?, how much?, why not?) all come at you at once.

 

If you can, try a short guided meditation several times throughout the day. Learn how to do the deep-breathe, then learn how to float, to let your thoughts glide past you like clouds in the sky without engaging in dialogue with them. Or, if your thoughts are like loud, annoying neighbors, learn to shrug them off, knowing they come from a place of pain and you don't want any of what they're offering. This is mindfulness. 

 

This is what you should be doing NOW. Think of withdrawal as many, many opportunities to practice these skills. In time, you'll master them. If you can master them during withdrawal, you'll come out of this with a bit of the Buddha in you.

 

Some videos to try. Again, these need to be done every couple of hours throughout the day. Set an alarm or an email reminder. 

 

4-7-8 Breathing: Health Benefits & Demonstration

 

The Breathing Space by Jon Kabat Zinn video (4 minutes)

 

For tinnitus, yes, it's uncomfortable. Yes, it's like sirens screaming bloody red into your ears and head all day. But it is temporary. If you can use white noise or a fan to help tone it down, that can be helpful. 

 

10 Hour Shower Best Tinnitus Masking Therapy Ever White Noise video (10 hours)

 

Within an hour of going to bed, try listening to a guided meditation on how to let go of thoughts. This is one that got me through acute withdrawal and if you don't like this one, there are thousands of them out there on YouTube.

 

Guided Meditation for Detachment From Over-Thinking (Anxiety / OCD / Depression) video (42 minutes)

 

 

1 hour ago, BfromNJ said:

I am sorry to confuse you.  I was sleeping okay before the luvox reduction, because of seroquel.  At same time the reduction started, I also had seroquel manufacturer change.  This may have been reason for poorer sleep at that time (4/6).  now I am getting about 5 hours.  not a lot but I think its deep sleep.  

 

I would say yes the tinnitus is worse since the gaba increase.   And worse in last two weeks.  Its horrific at night.   Screeching.  Then much better in morning upon awakening.  almost nonexistent.    then is starts up.     it almost seems like its the build up all the meds in my system for the day?  Maybe I should try and take my luvox at night?  

 

I'm sorry to be confusing is there an easier way I can track my symptoms?  I'm having trouble myself trying to figure out what is causing symptoms, I assume all meds together.  

 

My tinnitus started about a month after stopping gaba 300 mg.  (Taken for 14 days).  

 

I cannot say for sure it was the cause.  I had other factors- dental work,  upper endoscopy,  antibiotic.  But the meds have not helped the situation. 

 

so if I am having a drug-drug interaction, it does not matter which one is reduced first?  but if I am having a reaction to each med, then what? i do feel that i am reacting to both meds.  

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

i would like to mention that i am a bit more clear headed since the reduction of luvox, not so much dp.  i feel overall crappier as the day goes on, i believe from the overall drug load going into my system.

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Shep
12 minutes ago, BfromNJ said:

i think you pegged me right.  Better than i psych doctor.  do i owe you a copay now?  lol.    I really do hope the tinnitus is temporary.  its just such a long road tapering these meds.  if only i hadn't gotten back on any.  if only.... 

 

LOL, nope, no copay needed. Just a promise that you'll practice the mindfulness videos regularly on a daily basis. You don't really need to do anything - just set an alarm or an email reminder and listen to them. And you can find many more on YouTube. Or write down some notes that help you remember what to do, and do the gentle breathing exercises even when you're not around your computer. Learn to push "pause" in your daily life for this. 

 

Your comments of "if only if only" are the kinds of thoughts you need to learn to ignore.

 

If a stranger walks up to you on the street and repeatedly asked you the same question again and again and again, would you invite him or her into your home? Would you make this person your best friend, someone you will stop everything in order to listen to? 

 

By engaging in your thoughts this way, you are doing exactly that -  Inviting in problems. But you can learn to ignore them.  It takes some work, but once you learn this technique and it becomes solid, it becomes automatic. 

 

That's peace of mind. 

 

As mindfulness teacher Mooji says, "You thoughts are like visitors and you are NOT a hotel. Don't invite them in!"

 

Look at withdrawal as an opportunity to practice this and you stop dreading waves. Easier said than done, but having an attitude of gratitude is much better than an attitude of fear and apprehension.

 

I've listen to Jon Kabat-Zinn's breathing space thousands of times during withdrawal. And he has many more videos out there that you might want to explore. 

 

12 minutes ago, BfromNJ said:

i would like to mention that i am a bit more clear headed since the reduction of luvox, not so much dp. 

 

This tallies with our thoughts that you're having an adverse reaction, so thank you for reporting this. 

 

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BfromNJ
1 minute ago, Shep said:

 

LOL, nope, no copay needed. Just a promise that you'll practice the mindfulness videos regularly on a daily basis. You don't really need to do anything - just set an alarm or an email reminder and listen to them. And you can find many more on YouTube. Or write down some notes that help you remember what to do, and do the gentle breathing exercises even when you're not around your computer. Learn to push "pause" in your daily life for this. 

 

Your comments of "if only if only" are the kinds of thoughts you need to learn to ignore.

 

If a stranger walks up to you on the street and repeatedly asked you the same question again and again and again, would you invite him or her into your home? Would you make this person your best friend, someone you will stop everything in order to listen to? 

 

By engaging in your thoughts this way, you are doing exactly that -  Inviting in problems. But you can learn to ignore them.  It takes some work, but once you learn this technique and it becomes solid, it becomes automatic. 

 

That's peace of mind. 

 

As mindfulness teacher Mooji says, "You thoughts are like visitors and you are NOT a hotel. Don't invite them in!"

 

Look at withdrawal as an opportunity to practice this and you stop dreading waves. Easier said than done, but having an attitude of gratitude is much better than an attitude of fear and apprehension.

 

I've listen to Jon Kabat-Zinn's breathing space thousands of times during withdrawal. And he has many more videos out there that you might want to explore. 

 

 

This tallies with our thoughts that you're having an adverse reaction, so thank you for reporting this. 

 

i do also think im having an adverse reaction to the gaba as well, but one at a time. :)  , i just feel overall crappier as the day wears on.  i will try and set a schedule to do the meditation, i know it will be helpful consistently.  i do utilitize the 4-7-8 breath technique.  i am eating healthy, exercising , trucking along.  :) 

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BfromNJ
Posted (edited)

Topic title:  strange feeling when laying down

 

not sure where to post this. I have always chalked this up to just anxiety over going to sleep or laying down. I say this because i have very bad tinnitus, and since laying down to rest is when it is worse, i just assumed the anxiety of it was what this symptom is.  

 

I have this strange sensation through my body, it almost feels activated, like a vibration type of thing? like my whole body is shaking or vibrating.   i get dizzy and just feel off.  even just closing my eyes and resting my head provokes this.   if that makes sense?  is this a cortisol spike, anxiety, fear or something else physical that i am missing? could it be akathisia? 

 

i can never seem to just calmly lay down to rest, so naps are out of the question.  I just didn't know if it was my anxiety of the tinnitus or something else.  

 

Edited by ChessieCat
added topic title

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