amcallum: off of Lexapro

[amcallum]

Hi, new here!  I found this group by searching "anger when withdrawing from anti-depressants".  HELP.  I feel like a raging maniac.  Honestly, over the past year or so even when I was on the meds I had episodes of rage.  I started to wonder if maybe it was related to the antidepressants, and sure enough I found some info that said it could be related.  For various reasons, I thought I'd give it a try going off.  I weaned down for 2 1/2 months.  I haven't had any in 2 weeks.  And my emotions are going from sad to angry and everywhere in between.  I keep yelling at my kids and I feel like total **** afterwards and cry.  Is this going to get better?  It's taking everything in me to not go to my doc and get a new scrip.

 

Thanks for listening

[ChessieCat]

Hi amcallum and welcome to SA,

 

What you are now experiencing are withdrawal symptoms from stopping the drug too quickly.  Dr Joseph Glenmullen's Withdrawal Symptoms

 

I am really pleased that you have found SA so early after stopping your drug.  I was also fortunate and found SA 2 weeks after reducing my Pristiq from 100mg to 50mg and suffered 2 weeks of very bad withdrawal symptoms.  After reinstating I have since been successfully tapering following SA's protocol and am now down to 4.5mg and only experience mild withdrawal symptoms.

 

You have tapered too quickly and what you are experiencing are withdrawal symptoms.  SA recommends tapering by no more than 10% of the current dose followed by a hold of about 4 weeks to allow the brain to adapt to not getting as much of the drug.  Why taper by 10% of my dosage?

 

The only known way to reduce withdrawal symptoms is to take the same drug that the brain has adapted to.  Because it's only been 2 weeks since you stopped takingy our drug, there is a very good chance that reinstating the drug will be successful.  Please read Post #1 of this topic:   About reinstating and stabilizing to reduce withdrawal symptoms

 

Because your brain will have already made some adaptations during the time you have been off the drug, it is better to start with a lower dose than you last took.  It is better to start with a small dose and increase if needed than to risk taking too much.  The idea of reinstating isn't to get rid of withdrawal symptoms completely but to bring them to a bearable level.  You will need to stay as calm and patient as possible and try not to panic.  When we panic we can make bad decisions.  Some members have panicked and increased too much and/or increased too soon and made things much worse.

 

Once we know how you tapered and what your last dose was we can suggest a dose for you to try.  It generally takes about 4 days for a dose to get to full level in the blood and a bit longer for it to register in the brain.  It's a good idea to keep daily symptom notes on paper so you can see the effect that reinstatement is having on your symptoms.  It is also helpful to provide us with those notes so we can assess whether you might need to take a tiny bit more.

 

It is also important to take the same dose, every day, at about the same time.  The brain likes consistency.  Do not skip doses to taper.  It will most probably take at least 3 months, if not more, before you would start tapering.  It is better to hold for longer than to risk tapering too soon.  You might consider doing a <10% reduction for the first reduction to test to see if you have stabilised.

 

You haven't mentioned which drug you stopped.  This topic has links to various drugs and they explain how to get the dose you need:  Important topics in the Tapering forum and FAQ

 

Tapering Calculator - Online

 

 

Please create your drug signature using the following format.   Keep it simple.  NO diagnoses or symptoms please - thank you.

• details for last 2 years - dates, ALL drugs, doses
• summary for older than 2 years - just years and drug/s

Account Settings – Create or Edit a signature

 

 

I will provide some more information in the next couple of posts.  This is your own introductions topic where your can ask questions about your own situation and journal your progress.

[ChessieCat]

Here's some additional information which might help you to understand what is happening:

 

Recovery isn't linear it happens in a Windows and Waves Pattern

 

Withdrawal Normal Description

When we take a psychiatric drug, we are adding chemical/s to the brain.  The brain then has to change to adapt to getting the chemical/s.  It might have to change something to do with A and then once that change has been made it affects B so another change has to be made and so on down the line.  It is a chain reaction, a domino effect.

 

The same thing happens when we take the drug away.  That's why it's possible to experience such a vast array of withdrawal symptoms, and they can change, and be of different intensity.

 

are-we-there-yet-how-long-is-withdrawal-going-to-take

 

These explain it really well:

 

Video:  Healing From Antidepressants - Patterns of Recovery

 

On 8/31/2011 at 5:28 AM, Rhiannon said:

When we stop taking the drug, we have a brain that has designed itself so that it works in the presence of the drug; now it can't work properly without the drug because it's designed itself so that the drug is part of its chemistry and structure. It's like a plant that has grown on a trellis; you can't just yank out the trellis and expect the plant to be okay. When the drug is removed, the remodeling process has to take place in reverse. SO--it's not a matter of just getting the drug out of your system and moving on. If it were that simple, none of us would be here. It's a matter of, as I describe it, having to grow a new brain. I believe this growing-a-new-brain happens throughout the taper process if the taper is slow enough. (If it's too fast, then there's not a lot of time for actually rebalancing things, and basically the brain is just pedaling fast trying to keep us alive.) It also continues to happen, probably for longer than the symptoms actually last, throughout the time of recovery after we are completely off the drug, which is why recovery takes so long.

 

AND

 

On 12/4/2015 at 2:41 AM, apace41 said:

Basically- you have a building where the MAJOR steel structures are trying to be rebuilt at different times - ALL while people are coming and going in the building and attempting to work.

It would be like if the World Trade Center Towers hadn't completely fallen - but had crumbled inside in different places.. Imagine if you were trying to rebuild the tower - WHILE people were coming and going and trying to work in the building!  You'd have to set up a temporary elevator - but when you needed to fix part of that area, you'd have to tear down that elevator and set up a temporary elevator somewhere else. And so on. You'd have to build, work around, then tear down, then build again, then work around, then build... ALL while people are coming and going, ALL while the furniture is being replaced, ALL while the walls are getting repainted... ALL while life is going on INSIDE the building. No doubt it would be chaotic. That is EXACTLY what is happening with windows and waves.  The windows are where the body has "got it right" for a day or so - but then the building shifts and the brain works on something else - and it's chaos again while another temporary pathway is set up to reroute function until repairs are made.  

 

[ChessieCat]

During any taper, there will be times of discomfort.  We strongly encourage members to learn and use non drug coping techniques to help get through tough times.

 

Understanding what is happening helps us to not get caught up with the second fear, or fear of the fear.  This happens when we experience sensations in our body and because we don't understand them we are scared of them and then start to panic.

 

This document has a diagram of the body explaining what happens in the body when we become anxious:

 

https://www.getselfhelp.co.uk/docs/AnxietySelfHelp.pdf

 

Anxiety Stuff - all kinds of stuff about anxiety attacks and things that help ...

 

Audio FEMALE VOICE:  First Aid for Panic (4 minutes)

 

Audio MALE VOICE:  First Aid for Panic (4 minutes)

 

Non-drug techniques to cope

 

dealing-with-emotional-spirals

 

Dr Claire Weekes suffered from anxiety and learned and taught ways of coping.  There are videos available on YouTube.

 

Claire Weekes' Method of Recovering from a Sensitized Nervous System

 

Audio:  How to Recover from Anxiety - Dr Claire Weekes

 

CBT Course:  An Introductory Self-Help Course in Cognitive Behaviour Therapy

 

Resources:  Centre for Clinical Interventions (PDF modules that you can work through, eg:  Depression, Distress Intolerance, Health Anxiety, Low Self-Esteem, Panic Attacks, Perfectionism, Procrastination, Social Anxiety, Worrying)

 

On 4/28/2017 at 4:03 AM, brassmonkey said:

 

AAF: Acknowledge, Accept, Float.  It's what you have to do when nothing else works, and can be a very powerful tool in coping with anxiety.  The neuroemotional anxiety many of us feel during WD is directly caused by the drugs and their chemical reactions in the brain.  Making it so there is nothing we can do about them.  They won't respond to other drugs, relaxation techniques and the like.  They do, however, react very well to being ignored.  That's the concept behind AAF.  Acknowledge, get to know the feeling involved, explore them.  Accept, These feelings are a part of you and they aren't going anywhere fast. Float, let the feeling float off as you get on with your life as best as you can.  It's a well documented fact that the more you feed in to anxiety the worse it gets.  What starts as generalized neuroemotinal anxiety can be easily blown into a full fledged panic attack just by thinking about it.

 

I often liken it to an unwanted house guest.  At first you talk to them, have conversations, communicate with them.  After a while you figure out that they aren't leaving and there is nothing you can do to get rid of them.  So you go on about your day, working around them until they get bored and leave.

 

It can take some practice, but AAF really does work.  I hope you give it a try.

 

 

[amcallum]

Ok, I was on Citalopram for about 4 years this go around (was off awhile was I having kids).  I was taking 10mg per day.  I tapered slow, but maybe not slow enough.  I basically cut them in half and 2 halfs one day, 1 half the next day for about 3 weeks.  Then I went to just half for a few weeks.  Then half every other day for a few weeks.  Then half like every 3 days.  Then to none.  It would say it was a total of 10 weeks of tapering.  

 

I don't understand how you taper by 10%?  Do you cut the pills????  Please help me understand.....

[ChessieCat]

Okay, I've tried to interpret what you have posted and this is what I think you mean.  I don't know how long you were on the last step of every 3rd day so I have assumed 1 week, but it may be a bit longer, and the 3 week periods may be a bit shorter for a total of 10 weeks.

 

 

Citalopram 4 years 10gm

 

10 weeks reducing

 

10mg, 5mg alternating for 3 weeks (average 7.5mg per day)

 

5mg for 3? weeks

 

5mg alternate days (average 2.5mg) for 3? weeks

 

5mg every 3rd day (average 1.67mg) for (1)? weeks

 

Off completely for 2 weeks

 

 

Skipping days to taper is not recommended.  The brain likes consistency.  Skipping Days vs Every Day Dosing Graph



It is better to start with a low dose.  You could try reinstating 1mg and see how that affects your symptoms.  If there is no improvement at all in 4 days you could increase by a bit more, perhaps to 1.5mg.  If you find that taking 1mg causes some improvement in your symptoms you could wait for a total of 1 week before reassessing whether you might need to increase, again to 1.5mg.  It is better to increase slowly than to risk taking too high

 

This topic explains how to get the doses you need:  Tips for tapering off Celexa (citalopram)

 

You can make your own liquid by dissolving tablets in water.  If you need some help working out how to get 1mg please let us know and we can help you with that.

 

how-to-make-a-liquid-from-tablets-or-capsules

 

[Carmie]

Hi amcallum, 

 

How are you doing? Could you please answer ChessieCat’s questions. I know you are scared and overwhelmed by what is happening to you. 

 

Did you reinstate? Please let us know how you’re doing, Sendng hugs🤗