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Onmyway: I want this to stop


Onmyway

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Dear Onmyway, 

 

Thank you for all of your kind messages you have recently left me.  I wish I could reciprocate myself, as I was up until recently able to.  Unfortunately with the deterioration I am struggling a little.  We seem to have so many similarities.  I wish I could give you a hug.  I feel what you feel. 

 

Firstly, you might want to exclude an inner ear infection/labyrinthitis or fluid build up in your ears, if you haven’t already done so. 

Plus a side effect of Melatonin can be dizziness. Pins and needles can be due to dysregulation and anxiety.  My sister had it exactly the same.  She was fully checked out. 

 

Yes, I too feel like I am being carpet bombed. I flit from place to place alternately trying to stay active, eat and find relief. 

 

We must hang on and no matter how small or infrequent the windows just run towards the light and make the most of when we can function.  Neuroplasticity is the golden key. 

 

I pray for us all and once again I thank you that you sought me out. You sound like a wonderful, lovely person. I really do wish you well.  

 

Bless you and hope you sleep well and keep healing. Sending you big hugs. 

 

R xxxxxxx🌼🌼🌼🌼🌼🌼🌼

 

 

Pantoprazole 40mg 2016 to 2019 Mirtazapine 15mg May to Aug 2017 (Akathisia)

Seroquel and Abilify July 2017 (caused itching and SI) stopped immediately 

Lorazepam July 2017 to February 2018 (up to 3mg daily) tapered to 1mg by Feb ‘18

Escitalopram 20mg Aug 2017 to 18 April 2019 tapered over 13 months from Feb 2018 

Diazepam crossed over from Lorazepam 1mg to 10mg tapered to 1mg by June ‘18

Updosed back to 2mg bad crash June 2018 . Restarted taper Dec 2018 to present

April 2019 reached 0.15mg Diazepam and was holding. 

CRASH 24 April 2019  Severe suicidal feelings, anxiety, akathisia started suddenly.

Updosed Diazepam immediately to 0.5mg x 2, up again to 1mg x 2 on April 30th

Zopiclone 7.5mg 3rd May for 1 week RI Escitalopram at 2.5mg on 6th May, inc to 5mg 9th May then 10mg by mistake on 21st May, red to 7.5mg 27th May Updosed to 10mg per pysch team 5th July. Lorazepam fully switched to Diazepam 11mg 5th July 

 

 

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Still going through my wave, feeling slightly better in the evenings and trying to get some work done then.

 

Edited by Onmyway

"Nothing so small as a moment is insurmountable, and moments are all that we have. You have survived every trial and tribulation that life has thrown at you up until this very instant. When future troubles come—and they will come—a version of you will be born into that moment that can conquer them, too." - Kevin Koenig 

 

I am not a doctor and this should not be considered medical advice. You can use the information and recommendations provided in whatever way you want and all decisions on your treatment are yours. 

 

In the next few weeks I do not have a lot of capacity to respond to questions. If you need a quick answer pls tag or ask other moderators who may want to be tagged. 

 

Aug  2000 - July 2003 (ct, 4-6 wk wd) , citalopram 20 mg,  xanax prn, wellbutrin for a few months, trazodone prn 

Dec 2004 - July 2018 citalopram 20 mg, xanax prn (rarely used)

Aug 2018 - citalopram 40 mg (self titrated up)

September 2018 - January 2019 tapered citalopram - 40/30/20/10/5 no issues until a week after reaching 0

Feb 2019 0.25 xanax - 0.5/day (3 weeks) over to klonopin 0.25 once a day to manage severe wd

March 6, reinstated citalopram 2.5 mg (liquid), klonopin 0.25 mg for sleep 2-3 times a week

Apr 1st citalopram 2.0 mg (liquid), klonopin 0.25 once a week (off by 4/14/19- no tapering)

citalopram (liquid) 4/14/19 -1.8 mg, 5/8/19 - 1.6 mg,  7/27/19 -1.5 mg,  8/15/19 - 1.35, 2/21/21 - 1.1 (smaller drops in between), 6/20/21 - 1.03 mg, 8/7/21- 1.025, 8/11/21 - 1.02, 8/15/21 - 1.015, 9/3/21 - 0.925 (fingers crossed!), 10/8/21 - 0.9, 10/18/21 - 0.875, 12/31/21 - 0.85, 1/7/22 - 0.825, 1/14/22 - 0.8, 1/22/22 - 0.785, 8/18/22 - 0.59, 12/15/2022 - 0.48, 2/15/22 - 0.43, 25/07/23 - 0.25 (mistake), 6/08/23 - 0.33mg

 

Supplements: magnesium citrate and bi-glycinate

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On 7/13/2019 at 1:48 AM, Gridley said:

 

There is just no telling when these symptoms will appear.

 

Delayed onset of withdrawal symptoms

 

 

Thanksk @Gridley, it is one of the scarier parts that you never know what  will come along. I try to be optimstic rather than expect the worst. I guess I get caught by surprise but that must be better than being gloomy all the time about the future. The neuro-emotions already cover that part. But this not knowing makes me put things on hold such a moving/buying a place of my own and other big decisions. This withdrawal really teaches one how to stay still, doesn't it? It challenges every fiber of my psyche and results in self-criticism for not doing but I am working on that as well. 

 

 

"Nothing so small as a moment is insurmountable, and moments are all that we have. You have survived every trial and tribulation that life has thrown at you up until this very instant. When future troubles come—and they will come—a version of you will be born into that moment that can conquer them, too." - Kevin Koenig 

 

I am not a doctor and this should not be considered medical advice. You can use the information and recommendations provided in whatever way you want and all decisions on your treatment are yours. 

 

In the next few weeks I do not have a lot of capacity to respond to questions. If you need a quick answer pls tag or ask other moderators who may want to be tagged. 

 

Aug  2000 - July 2003 (ct, 4-6 wk wd) , citalopram 20 mg,  xanax prn, wellbutrin for a few months, trazodone prn 

Dec 2004 - July 2018 citalopram 20 mg, xanax prn (rarely used)

Aug 2018 - citalopram 40 mg (self titrated up)

September 2018 - January 2019 tapered citalopram - 40/30/20/10/5 no issues until a week after reaching 0

Feb 2019 0.25 xanax - 0.5/day (3 weeks) over to klonopin 0.25 once a day to manage severe wd

March 6, reinstated citalopram 2.5 mg (liquid), klonopin 0.25 mg for sleep 2-3 times a week

Apr 1st citalopram 2.0 mg (liquid), klonopin 0.25 once a week (off by 4/14/19- no tapering)

citalopram (liquid) 4/14/19 -1.8 mg, 5/8/19 - 1.6 mg,  7/27/19 -1.5 mg,  8/15/19 - 1.35, 2/21/21 - 1.1 (smaller drops in between), 6/20/21 - 1.03 mg, 8/7/21- 1.025, 8/11/21 - 1.02, 8/15/21 - 1.015, 9/3/21 - 0.925 (fingers crossed!), 10/8/21 - 0.9, 10/18/21 - 0.875, 12/31/21 - 0.85, 1/7/22 - 0.825, 1/14/22 - 0.8, 1/22/22 - 0.785, 8/18/22 - 0.59, 12/15/2022 - 0.48, 2/15/22 - 0.43, 25/07/23 - 0.25 (mistake), 6/08/23 - 0.33mg

 

Supplements: magnesium citrate and bi-glycinate

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On 7/13/2019 at 2:00 PM, AlanC said:

So sorry to hear you're suffering from the dizziness, and I really hope you see the back of it soon. It really is one of the nastier symptoms because of the way it can impact your ability to get on with normal daily activities.

 

As for your GP, I think he's gaslighting you: trying to delegitimise your statements that the symptoms are down to withdrawal since he clearly doesn't believe that is possible. I'm really not sure what you can do in such a situation other than try to find another, more sympathetic, doctor.

Hi Alan, 

I actually hadn't thought of that wrt to my GP but I think you are right. what he is doing is literally gaslighting. I guess if I have a problem with a new prescription the next time I will switch. Otherwise I will just not share/ask him for anything. The funny thing is, he assumes that I have health anxiety which I don't. I have anxiety over other issues but health has never been something I worry about much. He forgets that before wd, he never saw me for 5 months after I moved to this practice (from abroad). The fact that he sees me through wd is not an indication of who I am as a patient. Anyway, I shouldn't need to defend myself with my doctor anyway. To be honest, I don't think he likes being a doctor much.

"Nothing so small as a moment is insurmountable, and moments are all that we have. You have survived every trial and tribulation that life has thrown at you up until this very instant. When future troubles come—and they will come—a version of you will be born into that moment that can conquer them, too." - Kevin Koenig 

 

I am not a doctor and this should not be considered medical advice. You can use the information and recommendations provided in whatever way you want and all decisions on your treatment are yours. 

 

In the next few weeks I do not have a lot of capacity to respond to questions. If you need a quick answer pls tag or ask other moderators who may want to be tagged. 

 

Aug  2000 - July 2003 (ct, 4-6 wk wd) , citalopram 20 mg,  xanax prn, wellbutrin for a few months, trazodone prn 

Dec 2004 - July 2018 citalopram 20 mg, xanax prn (rarely used)

Aug 2018 - citalopram 40 mg (self titrated up)

September 2018 - January 2019 tapered citalopram - 40/30/20/10/5 no issues until a week after reaching 0

Feb 2019 0.25 xanax - 0.5/day (3 weeks) over to klonopin 0.25 once a day to manage severe wd

March 6, reinstated citalopram 2.5 mg (liquid), klonopin 0.25 mg for sleep 2-3 times a week

Apr 1st citalopram 2.0 mg (liquid), klonopin 0.25 once a week (off by 4/14/19- no tapering)

citalopram (liquid) 4/14/19 -1.8 mg, 5/8/19 - 1.6 mg,  7/27/19 -1.5 mg,  8/15/19 - 1.35, 2/21/21 - 1.1 (smaller drops in between), 6/20/21 - 1.03 mg, 8/7/21- 1.025, 8/11/21 - 1.02, 8/15/21 - 1.015, 9/3/21 - 0.925 (fingers crossed!), 10/8/21 - 0.9, 10/18/21 - 0.875, 12/31/21 - 0.85, 1/7/22 - 0.825, 1/14/22 - 0.8, 1/22/22 - 0.785, 8/18/22 - 0.59, 12/15/2022 - 0.48, 2/15/22 - 0.43, 25/07/23 - 0.25 (mistake), 6/08/23 - 0.33mg

 

Supplements: magnesium citrate and bi-glycinate

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So the wave has deepened. Heightened? Nausea is back and I am feeling exhausted and restless at the same time. Haven't made any changes. Had an external stressor, nothing big, but it elicited an inordinate response in terms of anxiety and depression. I don't often feel like this but I don't see the point of living like this. I feel battered and weathered and weary by this life. Wouldn't it be nice to disappear into nothingness right about now. Or just sleep without jolts of dread. For a very long time. I need respite. 

"Nothing so small as a moment is insurmountable, and moments are all that we have. You have survived every trial and tribulation that life has thrown at you up until this very instant. When future troubles come—and they will come—a version of you will be born into that moment that can conquer them, too." - Kevin Koenig 

 

I am not a doctor and this should not be considered medical advice. You can use the information and recommendations provided in whatever way you want and all decisions on your treatment are yours. 

 

In the next few weeks I do not have a lot of capacity to respond to questions. If you need a quick answer pls tag or ask other moderators who may want to be tagged. 

 

Aug  2000 - July 2003 (ct, 4-6 wk wd) , citalopram 20 mg,  xanax prn, wellbutrin for a few months, trazodone prn 

Dec 2004 - July 2018 citalopram 20 mg, xanax prn (rarely used)

Aug 2018 - citalopram 40 mg (self titrated up)

September 2018 - January 2019 tapered citalopram - 40/30/20/10/5 no issues until a week after reaching 0

Feb 2019 0.25 xanax - 0.5/day (3 weeks) over to klonopin 0.25 once a day to manage severe wd

March 6, reinstated citalopram 2.5 mg (liquid), klonopin 0.25 mg for sleep 2-3 times a week

Apr 1st citalopram 2.0 mg (liquid), klonopin 0.25 once a week (off by 4/14/19- no tapering)

citalopram (liquid) 4/14/19 -1.8 mg, 5/8/19 - 1.6 mg,  7/27/19 -1.5 mg,  8/15/19 - 1.35, 2/21/21 - 1.1 (smaller drops in between), 6/20/21 - 1.03 mg, 8/7/21- 1.025, 8/11/21 - 1.02, 8/15/21 - 1.015, 9/3/21 - 0.925 (fingers crossed!), 10/8/21 - 0.9, 10/18/21 - 0.875, 12/31/21 - 0.85, 1/7/22 - 0.825, 1/14/22 - 0.8, 1/22/22 - 0.785, 8/18/22 - 0.59, 12/15/2022 - 0.48, 2/15/22 - 0.43, 25/07/23 - 0.25 (mistake), 6/08/23 - 0.33mg

 

Supplements: magnesium citrate and bi-glycinate

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It's really quite alarming how sensitive we become to things that, ordinarily, we'd be able to shrug off or deal with without too much of a problem. And I can certainly relate to feeling exhausted yet restless, and to wishing I could just blank it all out, not have to experience it, and come back when it's run it's course. Unfortunately, this is how we are when things are at their worst: we feel like we're trapped forever, we can't remember what being happy feels like, and we don't believe it's possible for us to ever feel happy in the future. But it doesn't last: sooner or later it will pass. In the meanwhile it's probably best to avoid anything (and anyone) that could add to the distress - take everything as gently as you possibly can.

1999 - 2001: Paroxetine 20mg, 2003: Venlafaxine 75mg, 2003 - 2014: Escitalopram 20mg

1999 - December 2017: Lansoprazole 15mg

2014 - December 2017: Citalopram 20mg

December 2017: Mirtazapine 30mg, stopped after 4 days due to immediate bad reaction, Zopiclone 3.75mg, stopped after 2 days due to immediate bad reaction

January 2018 - April 2018: Citalopram liquid, tapering, final dose 0.1mg

December 2018 onwards: Vitamin C 1000mg

October 2021: Loratadine 10mg for 6 days (23/10 to 28/10)

Long term (for asthma): Salbutamol and Salmeterol inhalers, Salmeterol stopped March 2021 due to migraine headaches

Occasional use for headaches: Paracetamol 40mg or Ibuprofen 40mg

4th December 2021: Eustachian tube infection: Amoxicillin 500mg 3 per day for 5 days, Dexamethasone & Neomycin ear spray 3 per day for 1 week, Beclometasone nasal spray 2 per day for 2 weeks.

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Thanks Alan for the kind message. The emotional spirals are my main symptom right now.  The pins and needles have abated quite a bit. The anger/anxiety is relentless until I feel absolutely exhausted and then fall asleep and wake up with anxiety/anger/urgency again. I so hope that this ends soon. I need a window. 

 

I was reading the analogy about the brain as a horse/elephant being driven by a rider. The horse/elephant is the emotional part of the brain and the rider is the rational part that presumably keeps the emotional in check. This works quite well when the terrain is smooth, the weather is good and the there are only small bumps in the road. However, when there is trauma (this book was about trauma - "The body keeps the score")* the elephant gets easily spooked and attempts at controlling are futile, or if not futile, quite hard. I feel like withdrawal is similar. The horse is really spooked and I am working hard at trying to calm things down. 

 

The wave has gotten a bit worse today. Part of it is because I am trying to change the time I take my 1.6 mg. Because I was getting dizzy before my dose (tipsy is a better description!) I decided that I would split it into 2. I usually take the full dose in the evening (midnight) and the last two days have been taking 0.6 mg at 5 pm and 1 mg at midnight. The tipsiness is better but emotional symptoms are worse. I am hoping that is a transitional period. I don't even know if it matters but thought I'd try to see if I can eventually take 0.8 mg at midnight and 0.8 mg at noon so that the blood levels are less variable. 


Does anyone else dread mornings? 

 

 

Edited by Onmyway

"Nothing so small as a moment is insurmountable, and moments are all that we have. You have survived every trial and tribulation that life has thrown at you up until this very instant. When future troubles come—and they will come—a version of you will be born into that moment that can conquer them, too." - Kevin Koenig 

 

I am not a doctor and this should not be considered medical advice. You can use the information and recommendations provided in whatever way you want and all decisions on your treatment are yours. 

 

In the next few weeks I do not have a lot of capacity to respond to questions. If you need a quick answer pls tag or ask other moderators who may want to be tagged. 

 

Aug  2000 - July 2003 (ct, 4-6 wk wd) , citalopram 20 mg,  xanax prn, wellbutrin for a few months, trazodone prn 

Dec 2004 - July 2018 citalopram 20 mg, xanax prn (rarely used)

Aug 2018 - citalopram 40 mg (self titrated up)

September 2018 - January 2019 tapered citalopram - 40/30/20/10/5 no issues until a week after reaching 0

Feb 2019 0.25 xanax - 0.5/day (3 weeks) over to klonopin 0.25 once a day to manage severe wd

March 6, reinstated citalopram 2.5 mg (liquid), klonopin 0.25 mg for sleep 2-3 times a week

Apr 1st citalopram 2.0 mg (liquid), klonopin 0.25 once a week (off by 4/14/19- no tapering)

citalopram (liquid) 4/14/19 -1.8 mg, 5/8/19 - 1.6 mg,  7/27/19 -1.5 mg,  8/15/19 - 1.35, 2/21/21 - 1.1 (smaller drops in between), 6/20/21 - 1.03 mg, 8/7/21- 1.025, 8/11/21 - 1.02, 8/15/21 - 1.015, 9/3/21 - 0.925 (fingers crossed!), 10/8/21 - 0.9, 10/18/21 - 0.875, 12/31/21 - 0.85, 1/7/22 - 0.825, 1/14/22 - 0.8, 1/22/22 - 0.785, 8/18/22 - 0.59, 12/15/2022 - 0.48, 2/15/22 - 0.43, 25/07/23 - 0.25 (mistake), 6/08/23 - 0.33mg

 

Supplements: magnesium citrate and bi-glycinate

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I like the analogy of the horse getting spooked. My personal horse currently seems to have a severe case of the jitters and every time anything goes wrong it does its best to kick the stable down. Stupid emotions. I really hate the way withdrawal makes them go out of control, and it's so difficult to deal with them when they turn traitorous on you, disrupting a situation where you really need to keep calm.

 

Sorry to hear splitting the dose is proving to be difficult. I'd perhaps hazard a guess that you're right about the symptoms being caused by the transition: perhaps your brain was used to the effect of the full dose taken all at once and is now reacting to the fact it's not getting that "spike" in the level of citalopram. Hopefully it'll calm down. If not, I wonder if it might be helpful to split the dose three quarters / one quarter for a while so the change is more gradual?

1999 - 2001: Paroxetine 20mg, 2003: Venlafaxine 75mg, 2003 - 2014: Escitalopram 20mg

1999 - December 2017: Lansoprazole 15mg

2014 - December 2017: Citalopram 20mg

December 2017: Mirtazapine 30mg, stopped after 4 days due to immediate bad reaction, Zopiclone 3.75mg, stopped after 2 days due to immediate bad reaction

January 2018 - April 2018: Citalopram liquid, tapering, final dose 0.1mg

December 2018 onwards: Vitamin C 1000mg

October 2021: Loratadine 10mg for 6 days (23/10 to 28/10)

Long term (for asthma): Salbutamol and Salmeterol inhalers, Salmeterol stopped March 2021 due to migraine headaches

Occasional use for headaches: Paracetamol 40mg or Ibuprofen 40mg

4th December 2021: Eustachian tube infection: Amoxicillin 500mg 3 per day for 5 days, Dexamethasone & Neomycin ear spray 3 per day for 1 week, Beclometasone nasal spray 2 per day for 2 weeks.

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So an update again. Things have improved ever so slightly from last week's torture chamber. Still difficult emotions, still anxiety and depression and dizziness and pins and needles and weakness in the legs and some early awakenings but overall more manageable. I gave up on trying to split the med into two different times during the day. It was highly inconvenient (hard to take a liquid with a syringe with you when you are out) and I think it is better to keep dosing at night rather than in the afternoon as more of the meds are available in the  morning that way than if dosing at 5 pm and midnight. So midnight it is for now. 

 

And I think I may have figured out what caused the addition of the tipsy feeling (in addition to the dizziness). It is a theory I am going to be testing but it is so ridiculous that maybe will provide some comic relief. So the last few weeks-month I have been drinking a lot of fresh squeezed unpasteurized store-bought orange juice. It has been easing my anxiety ever so slighty and I attributed that to the high vit C content. Not sure it matters but it was a nice surprise to observe. Now, I think that I have been getting drunk on orange juice. Yep! It turns out that orange juice has about 0.5% alcohol content and I am usually quite sensitive to alcohol and get tipsy from a glass of wine. But given wd, I think I may have become even more sensitive. I have quit coffee (which I miss a lot) and alcohol and haven't had any for 4 months (save for two decaf espressos). I haven't even had more than an oz of choclate in the last 6 mos. So I think I have been getting drunk on orange juice. Unwittingly. At my age. On 0.5% alcohol content orange juice. What else to do but laugh at the absurdity of this situation. 

"Nothing so small as a moment is insurmountable, and moments are all that we have. You have survived every trial and tribulation that life has thrown at you up until this very instant. When future troubles come—and they will come—a version of you will be born into that moment that can conquer them, too." - Kevin Koenig 

 

I am not a doctor and this should not be considered medical advice. You can use the information and recommendations provided in whatever way you want and all decisions on your treatment are yours. 

 

In the next few weeks I do not have a lot of capacity to respond to questions. If you need a quick answer pls tag or ask other moderators who may want to be tagged. 

 

Aug  2000 - July 2003 (ct, 4-6 wk wd) , citalopram 20 mg,  xanax prn, wellbutrin for a few months, trazodone prn 

Dec 2004 - July 2018 citalopram 20 mg, xanax prn (rarely used)

Aug 2018 - citalopram 40 mg (self titrated up)

September 2018 - January 2019 tapered citalopram - 40/30/20/10/5 no issues until a week after reaching 0

Feb 2019 0.25 xanax - 0.5/day (3 weeks) over to klonopin 0.25 once a day to manage severe wd

March 6, reinstated citalopram 2.5 mg (liquid), klonopin 0.25 mg for sleep 2-3 times a week

Apr 1st citalopram 2.0 mg (liquid), klonopin 0.25 once a week (off by 4/14/19- no tapering)

citalopram (liquid) 4/14/19 -1.8 mg, 5/8/19 - 1.6 mg,  7/27/19 -1.5 mg,  8/15/19 - 1.35, 2/21/21 - 1.1 (smaller drops in between), 6/20/21 - 1.03 mg, 8/7/21- 1.025, 8/11/21 - 1.02, 8/15/21 - 1.015, 9/3/21 - 0.925 (fingers crossed!), 10/8/21 - 0.9, 10/18/21 - 0.875, 12/31/21 - 0.85, 1/7/22 - 0.825, 1/14/22 - 0.8, 1/22/22 - 0.785, 8/18/22 - 0.59, 12/15/2022 - 0.48, 2/15/22 - 0.43, 25/07/23 - 0.25 (mistake), 6/08/23 - 0.33mg

 

Supplements: magnesium citrate and bi-glycinate

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Topic title:  Holding vs Tapering (the trellis)

 

I have been holding on a dosage for almost 3 months now and have gotten better. Still waves and one window but better than before. 

 

If I stayed on this low dose 2 mg citalopram, though, I wonder if my brain will rebalance only to have the trellis withdrawn again. My question I guess is: "WIll the withdrawal symptoms - recovery timeline restart when I start tapering again?" I know there is no good time to re-start tapering. I think if I wait to be completely normal at 2 mg it may take years. Will wd symptoms restart again if I chose that route? I am looking for experiences here fully knowing that nobody can predict how things will go for me if that's the choice I make. 

 

Edited by ChessieCat
added topic title

"Nothing so small as a moment is insurmountable, and moments are all that we have. You have survived every trial and tribulation that life has thrown at you up until this very instant. When future troubles come—and they will come—a version of you will be born into that moment that can conquer them, too." - Kevin Koenig 

 

I am not a doctor and this should not be considered medical advice. You can use the information and recommendations provided in whatever way you want and all decisions on your treatment are yours. 

 

In the next few weeks I do not have a lot of capacity to respond to questions. If you need a quick answer pls tag or ask other moderators who may want to be tagged. 

 

Aug  2000 - July 2003 (ct, 4-6 wk wd) , citalopram 20 mg,  xanax prn, wellbutrin for a few months, trazodone prn 

Dec 2004 - July 2018 citalopram 20 mg, xanax prn (rarely used)

Aug 2018 - citalopram 40 mg (self titrated up)

September 2018 - January 2019 tapered citalopram - 40/30/20/10/5 no issues until a week after reaching 0

Feb 2019 0.25 xanax - 0.5/day (3 weeks) over to klonopin 0.25 once a day to manage severe wd

March 6, reinstated citalopram 2.5 mg (liquid), klonopin 0.25 mg for sleep 2-3 times a week

Apr 1st citalopram 2.0 mg (liquid), klonopin 0.25 once a week (off by 4/14/19- no tapering)

citalopram (liquid) 4/14/19 -1.8 mg, 5/8/19 - 1.6 mg,  7/27/19 -1.5 mg,  8/15/19 - 1.35, 2/21/21 - 1.1 (smaller drops in between), 6/20/21 - 1.03 mg, 8/7/21- 1.025, 8/11/21 - 1.02, 8/15/21 - 1.015, 9/3/21 - 0.925 (fingers crossed!), 10/8/21 - 0.9, 10/18/21 - 0.875, 12/31/21 - 0.85, 1/7/22 - 0.825, 1/14/22 - 0.8, 1/22/22 - 0.785, 8/18/22 - 0.59, 12/15/2022 - 0.48, 2/15/22 - 0.43, 25/07/23 - 0.25 (mistake), 6/08/23 - 0.33mg

 

Supplements: magnesium citrate and bi-glycinate

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  • Moderator Emeritus

The idea of tapering is to keep withdrawal symptoms to a minimum by allowing the brain to adapt as it goes to getting less of the drug.  I've been tapering following SA's tapering protocol and still get withdrawal symptoms, which can be worse at times of stress (good and bad), but they have been bearable.  I've gone from 100mg Pristiq and am now down to 2.5mg.

 

We don't have to be feeling at our best before tapering:  WDnormal (withdrawal normal)

 

And remember you don't have to reduce by 10%.  You can always make a smaller reduction.  This is a good idea if you think you might be okay to make a reduction but you are not quite sure.  I call this a test reduction to see if your brain has adapted enough to make a reduction.  You could make a test reduction of anything from 1%-2.5%.  If things don't worsen you could always make a larger (perhaps 5% or even the full 10% - it's up to you to decide what you feel comfortable trying) reduction after 4 weeks.

* NO LONGER ACTIVE on SA *

MISSION ACCOMPLISHED:  (6 year taper)      0mg Pristiq  on 13th November 2021

ADs since ~1992:  25+ years - 1 unknown, Prozac (muscle weakness), Zoloft; citalopram (pooped out) CTed (very sick for 2.5 wks a few months after); Pristiq:  50mg 2012, 100mg beg 2013 (Serotonin Toxicity)  Tapering from Oct 2015 - 13 Nov 2021   LAST DOSE 0.0025mg

Post 0 updates start here    My tapering program     My Intro (goes to tapering graph)

 VIDEO:   Antidepressant Withdrawal Syndrome and its Management

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Thanks Chessicat for the encouragement and the support. This is exactly what I needed!

I made my cut (6.25%) yesterday and so far today things seem to be OK. I realize that it takes a while for things to surface so I am not counting my chickens just yet. Last time the nausea was awful and it came on immediately (next day) but the cut was also higher and I had been destabilized for a while. Keeping fingers crossed! Will update on how things are as they develop. Hope you have a great weekend!

 

 

"Nothing so small as a moment is insurmountable, and moments are all that we have. You have survived every trial and tribulation that life has thrown at you up until this very instant. When future troubles come—and they will come—a version of you will be born into that moment that can conquer them, too." - Kevin Koenig 

 

I am not a doctor and this should not be considered medical advice. You can use the information and recommendations provided in whatever way you want and all decisions on your treatment are yours. 

 

In the next few weeks I do not have a lot of capacity to respond to questions. If you need a quick answer pls tag or ask other moderators who may want to be tagged. 

 

Aug  2000 - July 2003 (ct, 4-6 wk wd) , citalopram 20 mg,  xanax prn, wellbutrin for a few months, trazodone prn 

Dec 2004 - July 2018 citalopram 20 mg, xanax prn (rarely used)

Aug 2018 - citalopram 40 mg (self titrated up)

September 2018 - January 2019 tapered citalopram - 40/30/20/10/5 no issues until a week after reaching 0

Feb 2019 0.25 xanax - 0.5/day (3 weeks) over to klonopin 0.25 once a day to manage severe wd

March 6, reinstated citalopram 2.5 mg (liquid), klonopin 0.25 mg for sleep 2-3 times a week

Apr 1st citalopram 2.0 mg (liquid), klonopin 0.25 once a week (off by 4/14/19- no tapering)

citalopram (liquid) 4/14/19 -1.8 mg, 5/8/19 - 1.6 mg,  7/27/19 -1.5 mg,  8/15/19 - 1.35, 2/21/21 - 1.1 (smaller drops in between), 6/20/21 - 1.03 mg, 8/7/21- 1.025, 8/11/21 - 1.02, 8/15/21 - 1.015, 9/3/21 - 0.925 (fingers crossed!), 10/8/21 - 0.9, 10/18/21 - 0.875, 12/31/21 - 0.85, 1/7/22 - 0.825, 1/14/22 - 0.8, 1/22/22 - 0.785, 8/18/22 - 0.59, 12/15/2022 - 0.48, 2/15/22 - 0.43, 25/07/23 - 0.25 (mistake), 6/08/23 - 0.33mg

 

Supplements: magnesium citrate and bi-glycinate

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You might consider the Brass Monkey Slide which is a gentler way of making reductions and also allows you to hold any time symptoms increase too much.

 

Basically it is making a 10% reduction over a 6 week period, reducing a part of the total reduction each week for 4 weeks and then not reducing again until week 7.  That averages out to a 6.66% monthly reduction.  But you can always make a smaller reduction.

* NO LONGER ACTIVE on SA *

MISSION ACCOMPLISHED:  (6 year taper)      0mg Pristiq  on 13th November 2021

ADs since ~1992:  25+ years - 1 unknown, Prozac (muscle weakness), Zoloft; citalopram (pooped out) CTed (very sick for 2.5 wks a few months after); Pristiq:  50mg 2012, 100mg beg 2013 (Serotonin Toxicity)  Tapering from Oct 2015 - 13 Nov 2021   LAST DOSE 0.0025mg

Post 0 updates start here    My tapering program     My Intro (goes to tapering graph)

 VIDEO:   Antidepressant Withdrawal Syndrome and its Management

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Thanks so much ChessieCat. I really appreciate your care and advice. 

I did consider it and will see how things go with this cut before I make a decision for the next cut. I am on day 4 (was waiting for the dreaded day 4-5) to post and so far things are bearable. Symptoms have ramped up a bit - more dizziness and instability (but ok), more drunk feeling (bearable), more pins and needles (also bearable). Nausea is making an appearance but 1/10 so compared to April, OK. Emotional spirals are creeping up, esp. depression. Holding steady for now though and hope it stays that way. New symptom which appeared for a short time was light sensitivity like when they put the eye drops to dilate your pupils. 

 

Holding and watching and working on being kind to myself as much as possible. Not easy for me but all we can do is try. 

 

Thanks @ChessieCat and hope that you are doing well as well. I saw that you made a cut to 2.5 recently from your signature! Congratulations. You've come so far!

How are you feeling? 

"Nothing so small as a moment is insurmountable, and moments are all that we have. You have survived every trial and tribulation that life has thrown at you up until this very instant. When future troubles come—and they will come—a version of you will be born into that moment that can conquer them, too." - Kevin Koenig 

 

I am not a doctor and this should not be considered medical advice. You can use the information and recommendations provided in whatever way you want and all decisions on your treatment are yours. 

 

In the next few weeks I do not have a lot of capacity to respond to questions. If you need a quick answer pls tag or ask other moderators who may want to be tagged. 

 

Aug  2000 - July 2003 (ct, 4-6 wk wd) , citalopram 20 mg,  xanax prn, wellbutrin for a few months, trazodone prn 

Dec 2004 - July 2018 citalopram 20 mg, xanax prn (rarely used)

Aug 2018 - citalopram 40 mg (self titrated up)

September 2018 - January 2019 tapered citalopram - 40/30/20/10/5 no issues until a week after reaching 0

Feb 2019 0.25 xanax - 0.5/day (3 weeks) over to klonopin 0.25 once a day to manage severe wd

March 6, reinstated citalopram 2.5 mg (liquid), klonopin 0.25 mg for sleep 2-3 times a week

Apr 1st citalopram 2.0 mg (liquid), klonopin 0.25 once a week (off by 4/14/19- no tapering)

citalopram (liquid) 4/14/19 -1.8 mg, 5/8/19 - 1.6 mg,  7/27/19 -1.5 mg,  8/15/19 - 1.35, 2/21/21 - 1.1 (smaller drops in between), 6/20/21 - 1.03 mg, 8/7/21- 1.025, 8/11/21 - 1.02, 8/15/21 - 1.015, 9/3/21 - 0.925 (fingers crossed!), 10/8/21 - 0.9, 10/18/21 - 0.875, 12/31/21 - 0.85, 1/7/22 - 0.825, 1/14/22 - 0.8, 1/22/22 - 0.785, 8/18/22 - 0.59, 12/15/2022 - 0.48, 2/15/22 - 0.43, 25/07/23 - 0.25 (mistake), 6/08/23 - 0.33mg

 

Supplements: magnesium citrate and bi-glycinate

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Day 7 after cut. Yesterday symptoms ramped up a bit - depression/dizziness increased, brain fog was quite bad (couldn't focus). 

Today things are worse - insomnia is back - managed to get about 4 hrs of sleep. Anxiety/urgency/emotional spirals are also back as well as my old friend nausea at a level of

 6-7/10. I am wondering if there is any average pattern to the emergence and settling of symptoms after a cut. Seems like usually symptoms emerge days 4-5  from reading the threads (for me apparently it's days 6-7) but when do they get better after the normal 10% cut (mine was just 6%). Would love to know if there is any patterns that can be expected.  

"Nothing so small as a moment is insurmountable, and moments are all that we have. You have survived every trial and tribulation that life has thrown at you up until this very instant. When future troubles come—and they will come—a version of you will be born into that moment that can conquer them, too." - Kevin Koenig 

 

I am not a doctor and this should not be considered medical advice. You can use the information and recommendations provided in whatever way you want and all decisions on your treatment are yours. 

 

In the next few weeks I do not have a lot of capacity to respond to questions. If you need a quick answer pls tag or ask other moderators who may want to be tagged. 

 

Aug  2000 - July 2003 (ct, 4-6 wk wd) , citalopram 20 mg,  xanax prn, wellbutrin for a few months, trazodone prn 

Dec 2004 - July 2018 citalopram 20 mg, xanax prn (rarely used)

Aug 2018 - citalopram 40 mg (self titrated up)

September 2018 - January 2019 tapered citalopram - 40/30/20/10/5 no issues until a week after reaching 0

Feb 2019 0.25 xanax - 0.5/day (3 weeks) over to klonopin 0.25 once a day to manage severe wd

March 6, reinstated citalopram 2.5 mg (liquid), klonopin 0.25 mg for sleep 2-3 times a week

Apr 1st citalopram 2.0 mg (liquid), klonopin 0.25 once a week (off by 4/14/19- no tapering)

citalopram (liquid) 4/14/19 -1.8 mg, 5/8/19 - 1.6 mg,  7/27/19 -1.5 mg,  8/15/19 - 1.35, 2/21/21 - 1.1 (smaller drops in between), 6/20/21 - 1.03 mg, 8/7/21- 1.025, 8/11/21 - 1.02, 8/15/21 - 1.015, 9/3/21 - 0.925 (fingers crossed!), 10/8/21 - 0.9, 10/18/21 - 0.875, 12/31/21 - 0.85, 1/7/22 - 0.825, 1/14/22 - 0.8, 1/22/22 - 0.785, 8/18/22 - 0.59, 12/15/2022 - 0.48, 2/15/22 - 0.43, 25/07/23 - 0.25 (mistake), 6/08/23 - 0.33mg

 

Supplements: magnesium citrate and bi-glycinate

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@OnmywayI'm so sorry you're feeling so bad. Thinking of you 💜

* Fluoxetine: 40 mg 1999-2012; 60 mg 2012-March 2019;  45.2 mg at present.

* Provigil: 25-100 mg PRN 2005 to mid-2015; 200-300 mg mid-2015 to early 2016; tapered from 300 mg in early 2016 to 100 mg early 2017; tapered from 100 mg early 2017 to 33 mg June 15, 2019;  8.9 mg at present.

* Amitriptyline: 10-15 mg 2002-2013; 25 mg 2014 to December 5, 2018; December 15, 2018 converted to water suspension and tapered to 16.5 mg at present

* Diazepam: 5 mg at night 2002-present

 Supplements: Iron for anemia

Recent tapering timeline:

2019:  Fluoxetine 60 mg        Provigil 33.5 mg      Amitriptyline 25 mg   Diazepam 5 mg

2022:          45.2 mg                      8.9 mg                     16.5 mg                        5 mg

Back Story: From 2012 thru early 2017, relocated and cycled through over 20 primary and psych docs (supposedly for severe Chronic Fatigue Syndrome) who prescribed two dozen different psych meds in search of the "perfect therapeutic combo." Took most for only a few days, some for a week. Included Wellbutrin, Cymbalta, Lexapro, Seroquel, Lamictal, Klonopin, Lyrica, Gabapentin, Belsomra, Tramadol, Librium, Halcyon, Remeron and -- the last straw, Trintellix. Began in early 2016 when it was still called Brintellix (Pharma's attempt to combine the words "brilliance" and "intelligence" in a pill name), became unable to eat or sleep, lost 25 lbs and the ability to speak. Slowly tapered myself back to Prozac by 2017 but was unable to stop akathisia, cortisol mornings and kindling which continue, actively, through present.

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Topic title:  Symptom emergence/worsening and stabilization after a cut

 

For those who are doing the proper 10% or less tapering monthly, how long until your symptoms emerge/worsen after a cut? How long until they resolve/stabilize after that? I am curious to know if there are any patterns.  I have read about the symprom re-emergence after day 4-5. When do said symptoms get better/stabilize after that? I am not looking for advice for me as we are all different, just for people's experience.

 

Edited by ChessieCat
added topic title

"Nothing so small as a moment is insurmountable, and moments are all that we have. You have survived every trial and tribulation that life has thrown at you up until this very instant. When future troubles come—and they will come—a version of you will be born into that moment that can conquer them, too." - Kevin Koenig 

 

I am not a doctor and this should not be considered medical advice. You can use the information and recommendations provided in whatever way you want and all decisions on your treatment are yours. 

 

In the next few weeks I do not have a lot of capacity to respond to questions. If you need a quick answer pls tag or ask other moderators who may want to be tagged. 

 

Aug  2000 - July 2003 (ct, 4-6 wk wd) , citalopram 20 mg,  xanax prn, wellbutrin for a few months, trazodone prn 

Dec 2004 - July 2018 citalopram 20 mg, xanax prn (rarely used)

Aug 2018 - citalopram 40 mg (self titrated up)

September 2018 - January 2019 tapered citalopram - 40/30/20/10/5 no issues until a week after reaching 0

Feb 2019 0.25 xanax - 0.5/day (3 weeks) over to klonopin 0.25 once a day to manage severe wd

March 6, reinstated citalopram 2.5 mg (liquid), klonopin 0.25 mg for sleep 2-3 times a week

Apr 1st citalopram 2.0 mg (liquid), klonopin 0.25 once a week (off by 4/14/19- no tapering)

citalopram (liquid) 4/14/19 -1.8 mg, 5/8/19 - 1.6 mg,  7/27/19 -1.5 mg,  8/15/19 - 1.35, 2/21/21 - 1.1 (smaller drops in between), 6/20/21 - 1.03 mg, 8/7/21- 1.025, 8/11/21 - 1.02, 8/15/21 - 1.015, 9/3/21 - 0.925 (fingers crossed!), 10/8/21 - 0.9, 10/18/21 - 0.875, 12/31/21 - 0.85, 1/7/22 - 0.825, 1/14/22 - 0.8, 1/22/22 - 0.785, 8/18/22 - 0.59, 12/15/2022 - 0.48, 2/15/22 - 0.43, 25/07/23 - 0.25 (mistake), 6/08/23 - 0.33mg

 

Supplements: magnesium citrate and bi-glycinate

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  • Moderator Emeritus

It takes about 4 days for a dose change to get to full level (aka steady state) in the blood and a bit longer for it to register in the brain.

 

Just as there are no specific symptoms which appear there is no specific time line for symptoms appearing/easing.  And during a taper a person can experience difference symptoms and different patterns of symptoms appearing/easing at different times during their taper.  Everything is so variable.  It can be affected by internal/external stress (good and bad, eg sickness, holidays, relationship/work issues etc), for females the time of the monthly cycle can affect them too.

 

You might find that for a few reductions you get similar symptoms at about the same time after a drop, then you might find that things changes.  As Altostrata says, we are all an experiment where N=1.  For example, some members find that a certain supplement helps them whereas another member can have a bad reaction.

 

Also, many members have found that there are doses which they find difficult to get "past".  This is why it is important to listen to your symptoms and only make another reduction when you are feeling at WDnormal (withdrawal normal).  If you don't know if it is time to reduce again it is generally better to hold for longer than to reduce too soon.  If you think you are ready but are not quite sure you can always make a smaller reduction. 

 

On 12/4/2015 at 2:41 AM, apace41 said:

 

Basically- you have a building where the MAJOR steel structures are trying to be rebuilt at different times - ALL while people are coming and going in the building and attempting to work.

It would be like if the World Trade Center Towers hadn't completely fallen - but had crumbled inside in different places.. Imagine if you were trying to rebuild the tower - WHILE people were coming and going and trying to work in the building!  You'd have to set up a temporary elevator - but when you needed to fix part of that area, you'd have to tear down that elevator and set up a temporary elevator somewhere else. And so on. You'd have to build, work around, then tear down, then build again, then work around, then build... ALL while people are coming and going, ALL while the furniture is being replaced, ALL while the walls are getting repainted... ALL while life is going on INSIDE the building. No doubt it would be chaotic. That is EXACTLY what is happening with windows and waves.  The windows are where the body has "got it right" for a day or so - but then the building shifts and the brain works on something else - and it's chaos again while another temporary pathway is set up to reroute function until repairs are made.

 

 

* NO LONGER ACTIVE on SA *

MISSION ACCOMPLISHED:  (6 year taper)      0mg Pristiq  on 13th November 2021

ADs since ~1992:  25+ years - 1 unknown, Prozac (muscle weakness), Zoloft; citalopram (pooped out) CTed (very sick for 2.5 wks a few months after); Pristiq:  50mg 2012, 100mg beg 2013 (Serotonin Toxicity)  Tapering from Oct 2015 - 13 Nov 2021   LAST DOSE 0.0025mg

Post 0 updates start here    My tapering program     My Intro (goes to tapering graph)

 VIDEO:   Antidepressant Withdrawal Syndrome and its Management

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  • Moderator

Thanks @ChessieCat, I really like this analogy and can see it playing out in myself. I can clearly feel the difference in symptoms (7 days after cut). It is just regular symptoms amplified (neuro emotions and spirals), return of something that had left about 2 months ago - nausea and light sensitivity (worse today). Yes, I can definitely feel the relationship to the cycle as well and time my cuts that way. I have such a long way to go from 1.5 mg.  I was hoping that cutting such small amounts (6%)  would be smoother but maybe I will do the BM slide for my next cut. 

"Nothing so small as a moment is insurmountable, and moments are all that we have. You have survived every trial and tribulation that life has thrown at you up until this very instant. When future troubles come—and they will come—a version of you will be born into that moment that can conquer them, too." - Kevin Koenig 

 

I am not a doctor and this should not be considered medical advice. You can use the information and recommendations provided in whatever way you want and all decisions on your treatment are yours. 

 

In the next few weeks I do not have a lot of capacity to respond to questions. If you need a quick answer pls tag or ask other moderators who may want to be tagged. 

 

Aug  2000 - July 2003 (ct, 4-6 wk wd) , citalopram 20 mg,  xanax prn, wellbutrin for a few months, trazodone prn 

Dec 2004 - July 2018 citalopram 20 mg, xanax prn (rarely used)

Aug 2018 - citalopram 40 mg (self titrated up)

September 2018 - January 2019 tapered citalopram - 40/30/20/10/5 no issues until a week after reaching 0

Feb 2019 0.25 xanax - 0.5/day (3 weeks) over to klonopin 0.25 once a day to manage severe wd

March 6, reinstated citalopram 2.5 mg (liquid), klonopin 0.25 mg for sleep 2-3 times a week

Apr 1st citalopram 2.0 mg (liquid), klonopin 0.25 once a week (off by 4/14/19- no tapering)

citalopram (liquid) 4/14/19 -1.8 mg, 5/8/19 - 1.6 mg,  7/27/19 -1.5 mg,  8/15/19 - 1.35, 2/21/21 - 1.1 (smaller drops in between), 6/20/21 - 1.03 mg, 8/7/21- 1.025, 8/11/21 - 1.02, 8/15/21 - 1.015, 9/3/21 - 0.925 (fingers crossed!), 10/8/21 - 0.9, 10/18/21 - 0.875, 12/31/21 - 0.85, 1/7/22 - 0.825, 1/14/22 - 0.8, 1/22/22 - 0.785, 8/18/22 - 0.59, 12/15/2022 - 0.48, 2/15/22 - 0.43, 25/07/23 - 0.25 (mistake), 6/08/23 - 0.33mg

 

Supplements: magnesium citrate and bi-glycinate

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  • Moderator

@ChessieCat, I do want that thread in the Symptoms section as well, though as I want to hear others' opinions and experiences. I think it would be useful for the whole community to both share and know if there are patterns. I looked for information on this and couldn't find it. When we all share, our experiments of N=1 become N=more and I find value in what others have shared even though they have also been N=1. In the end, that is how we gain our shared collective knowledge. 

"Nothing so small as a moment is insurmountable, and moments are all that we have. You have survived every trial and tribulation that life has thrown at you up until this very instant. When future troubles come—and they will come—a version of you will be born into that moment that can conquer them, too." - Kevin Koenig 

 

I am not a doctor and this should not be considered medical advice. You can use the information and recommendations provided in whatever way you want and all decisions on your treatment are yours. 

 

In the next few weeks I do not have a lot of capacity to respond to questions. If you need a quick answer pls tag or ask other moderators who may want to be tagged. 

 

Aug  2000 - July 2003 (ct, 4-6 wk wd) , citalopram 20 mg,  xanax prn, wellbutrin for a few months, trazodone prn 

Dec 2004 - July 2018 citalopram 20 mg, xanax prn (rarely used)

Aug 2018 - citalopram 40 mg (self titrated up)

September 2018 - January 2019 tapered citalopram - 40/30/20/10/5 no issues until a week after reaching 0

Feb 2019 0.25 xanax - 0.5/day (3 weeks) over to klonopin 0.25 once a day to manage severe wd

March 6, reinstated citalopram 2.5 mg (liquid), klonopin 0.25 mg for sleep 2-3 times a week

Apr 1st citalopram 2.0 mg (liquid), klonopin 0.25 once a week (off by 4/14/19- no tapering)

citalopram (liquid) 4/14/19 -1.8 mg, 5/8/19 - 1.6 mg,  7/27/19 -1.5 mg,  8/15/19 - 1.35, 2/21/21 - 1.1 (smaller drops in between), 6/20/21 - 1.03 mg, 8/7/21- 1.025, 8/11/21 - 1.02, 8/15/21 - 1.015, 9/3/21 - 0.925 (fingers crossed!), 10/8/21 - 0.9, 10/18/21 - 0.875, 12/31/21 - 0.85, 1/7/22 - 0.825, 1/14/22 - 0.8, 1/22/22 - 0.785, 8/18/22 - 0.59, 12/15/2022 - 0.48, 2/15/22 - 0.43, 25/07/23 - 0.25 (mistake), 6/08/23 - 0.33mg

 

Supplements: magnesium citrate and bi-glycinate

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  • Moderator Emeritus

We try to keep similar information in one topic so it is easier for members to find.  the-windows-and-waves-pattern-of-stabilization topic covers discussion of symptom patterns.

 

* NO LONGER ACTIVE on SA *

MISSION ACCOMPLISHED:  (6 year taper)      0mg Pristiq  on 13th November 2021

ADs since ~1992:  25+ years - 1 unknown, Prozac (muscle weakness), Zoloft; citalopram (pooped out) CTed (very sick for 2.5 wks a few months after); Pristiq:  50mg 2012, 100mg beg 2013 (Serotonin Toxicity)  Tapering from Oct 2015 - 13 Nov 2021   LAST DOSE 0.0025mg

Post 0 updates start here    My tapering program     My Intro (goes to tapering graph)

 VIDEO:   Antidepressant Withdrawal Syndrome and its Management

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  • Moderator
1 hour ago, ChessieCat said:

We try to keep similar information in one topic so it is easier for members to find.  the-windows-and-waves-pattern-of-stabilization topic covers discussion of symptom patterns.

 

I've read that topic backwards and forwards but don't see anyone discussing a pattern after cutting. It seems that there is a pattern.  

"Nothing so small as a moment is insurmountable, and moments are all that we have. You have survived every trial and tribulation that life has thrown at you up until this very instant. When future troubles come—and they will come—a version of you will be born into that moment that can conquer them, too." - Kevin Koenig 

 

I am not a doctor and this should not be considered medical advice. You can use the information and recommendations provided in whatever way you want and all decisions on your treatment are yours. 

 

In the next few weeks I do not have a lot of capacity to respond to questions. If you need a quick answer pls tag or ask other moderators who may want to be tagged. 

 

Aug  2000 - July 2003 (ct, 4-6 wk wd) , citalopram 20 mg,  xanax prn, wellbutrin for a few months, trazodone prn 

Dec 2004 - July 2018 citalopram 20 mg, xanax prn (rarely used)

Aug 2018 - citalopram 40 mg (self titrated up)

September 2018 - January 2019 tapered citalopram - 40/30/20/10/5 no issues until a week after reaching 0

Feb 2019 0.25 xanax - 0.5/day (3 weeks) over to klonopin 0.25 once a day to manage severe wd

March 6, reinstated citalopram 2.5 mg (liquid), klonopin 0.25 mg for sleep 2-3 times a week

Apr 1st citalopram 2.0 mg (liquid), klonopin 0.25 once a week (off by 4/14/19- no tapering)

citalopram (liquid) 4/14/19 -1.8 mg, 5/8/19 - 1.6 mg,  7/27/19 -1.5 mg,  8/15/19 - 1.35, 2/21/21 - 1.1 (smaller drops in between), 6/20/21 - 1.03 mg, 8/7/21- 1.025, 8/11/21 - 1.02, 8/15/21 - 1.015, 9/3/21 - 0.925 (fingers crossed!), 10/8/21 - 0.9, 10/18/21 - 0.875, 12/31/21 - 0.85, 1/7/22 - 0.825, 1/14/22 - 0.8, 1/22/22 - 0.785, 8/18/22 - 0.59, 12/15/2022 - 0.48, 2/15/22 - 0.43, 25/07/23 - 0.25 (mistake), 6/08/23 - 0.33mg

 

Supplements: magnesium citrate and bi-glycinate

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  • Moderator Emeritus
14 minutes ago, Onmyway said:

It seems that there is a pattern.

 

Yes, but it's an individual pattern, which itself can change during an individual's taper.  There are some questions that are not able to be answered.  It is better to learn Acceptance instead of trying to get answers.

* NO LONGER ACTIVE on SA *

MISSION ACCOMPLISHED:  (6 year taper)      0mg Pristiq  on 13th November 2021

ADs since ~1992:  25+ years - 1 unknown, Prozac (muscle weakness), Zoloft; citalopram (pooped out) CTed (very sick for 2.5 wks a few months after); Pristiq:  50mg 2012, 100mg beg 2013 (Serotonin Toxicity)  Tapering from Oct 2015 - 13 Nov 2021   LAST DOSE 0.0025mg

Post 0 updates start here    My tapering program     My Intro (goes to tapering graph)

 VIDEO:   Antidepressant Withdrawal Syndrome and its Management

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  • Moderator
7 hours ago, ChessieCat said:

 

Yes, but it's an individual pattern, which itself can change during an individual's taper.  There are some questions that are not able to be answered.  It is better to learn Acceptance instead of trying to get answers.

 

We don't actually know that it's an individual pattern and general trends can't be observed. Research is started from individual patterns. In the end all of our experiences are individual but we have learned a tremendous amount about WD from sharing.

 

If we explore, we might find out. If people share maybe we will learn the way we have learned about other things. Not everybody has reactions to supplements but by sharing we learn that some people do, for example. The specific windows and waves that people get might also be an individual pattern or even random  but the pattern of windows and waves in general exists and people like us found out through sharing. In the end, on a site dedicated to withdrawal where so little is known, I'd expect we'd be more curious. 

I understand there is a general need to keep the site tidy but in this specific case it seems to defeat the purpose. There are superfluous topics (vit B AND B6) etc. 

 

Either way, it's your site we're just guests here. I am not specifically attached to the topic but I am a curious person and I thought we were curious about learning from each other's experience. 

 

I agree that acceptance is necessary. I am firmly on the "we'll need to suck it up" camp. But again that doesn't mean that we should not be curious about our collective experience.  

"Nothing so small as a moment is insurmountable, and moments are all that we have. You have survived every trial and tribulation that life has thrown at you up until this very instant. When future troubles come—and they will come—a version of you will be born into that moment that can conquer them, too." - Kevin Koenig 

 

I am not a doctor and this should not be considered medical advice. You can use the information and recommendations provided in whatever way you want and all decisions on your treatment are yours. 

 

In the next few weeks I do not have a lot of capacity to respond to questions. If you need a quick answer pls tag or ask other moderators who may want to be tagged. 

 

Aug  2000 - July 2003 (ct, 4-6 wk wd) , citalopram 20 mg,  xanax prn, wellbutrin for a few months, trazodone prn 

Dec 2004 - July 2018 citalopram 20 mg, xanax prn (rarely used)

Aug 2018 - citalopram 40 mg (self titrated up)

September 2018 - January 2019 tapered citalopram - 40/30/20/10/5 no issues until a week after reaching 0

Feb 2019 0.25 xanax - 0.5/day (3 weeks) over to klonopin 0.25 once a day to manage severe wd

March 6, reinstated citalopram 2.5 mg (liquid), klonopin 0.25 mg for sleep 2-3 times a week

Apr 1st citalopram 2.0 mg (liquid), klonopin 0.25 once a week (off by 4/14/19- no tapering)

citalopram (liquid) 4/14/19 -1.8 mg, 5/8/19 - 1.6 mg,  7/27/19 -1.5 mg,  8/15/19 - 1.35, 2/21/21 - 1.1 (smaller drops in between), 6/20/21 - 1.03 mg, 8/7/21- 1.025, 8/11/21 - 1.02, 8/15/21 - 1.015, 9/3/21 - 0.925 (fingers crossed!), 10/8/21 - 0.9, 10/18/21 - 0.875, 12/31/21 - 0.85, 1/7/22 - 0.825, 1/14/22 - 0.8, 1/22/22 - 0.785, 8/18/22 - 0.59, 12/15/2022 - 0.48, 2/15/22 - 0.43, 25/07/23 - 0.25 (mistake), 6/08/23 - 0.33mg

 

Supplements: magnesium citrate and bi-glycinate

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  • 2 months later...

Hello @Onmyway . Just checking in. We are both in London and on citalopram. You have gone before me in terms of tapering.  

1999:  Paroxetine (20mg). Age 16. 2007-2008: Fluoxetine (Prozac) for 1.5 years (age 25) Citalopram 20mg 2002-2005, 2009: Escitalopram (20mg), 2 weeks, (age 26) (adverse  reaction)/*Valium 5mg/Temazepam 10mg 2010: Mirtazipine (Remeron)( do not remember dosage) 2010, 5 months.                     2010-2017: Citalopram (20mg) (age 27 to 34) 2016: i.1st Sept- 31st Oct Citalopram 10mg , ii.1st November 2017-30th November 2017, Citalopram 5mg iii.1st December 2017- 4th February 2018, Citalopram 0mg, iv.5th February 2018- March 2018 Citalopram 5mg (10mg every other day) 28th February- tried titration of 5mg ( some adverse effects)

2018: 1st March 2018- 1st June Citalopram 10 mg (tablet form) /started titration 8mg , then 7 mg.2018: June 15th- 10th July Citalopram 10 mg pill every other day 2018: 10th July - 13th Sept Citalopram- 0mg  (CBD oil first month of 0mg, passiflora on and off) 2018 13th Sept Citalopram  2mg ,  approx 16th Sept 4mg , approx 25th Sept 6mg held.  2019: 11 Feb 19: 7mg (instant bad rxn) 12 Feb 19 6mg held 1 May 19 5.4mg held 5 Oct 19 5.36mg 22 Oct 19 5.29mg 30 Oct 19 5.23mg 4/NOV/19 5.18mg 12 Nov 19 5.08mg 20 Nov 19 4.77mg 7 May 22 2.31mg 17/09/2023 0.8mg

(Herbal/Supplements since 1st September: Omega Fish Oil 1200mg, 663mg of EPA- 2 tablets a day, magnesium and magnesium bath salts)

I did not die, and yet I lost life’s breath
- Dante
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  • Moderator
On 10/6/2019 at 10:26 AM, India said:

Hello @Onmyway . Just checking in. We are both in London and on citalopram. You have gone before me in terms of tapering.  

Hiya @India. Nice to meet you here :)

I haven't been much to the site as I find it triggers me a bit but will pm you my personal email so we can get in touch here. I am holding for now as I have a lot of external stress from work and personal issues and I simply can't function while dropping. I am experiencing windows and waves. Surprisingly, after a proper 10% cut I thought I'd get better after a month but instead got a wave that stayed and stayed with very brief windows - even now after almost 2 weeks. I realize how sensitive I am when I made a measuring mistake and took 4 mg one night instead of 1.35 and even though didn't take anything the next day to help it stabilize, it threw me off for weeks with a return to initial cortisol mornings. 

 

I tried to read your thread (the beginning of it) but the descriptions really triggered me (sorry) so stopped but would love to stay in touch and get to know you and your journey. We need to hang in there and support each other. At this point I am looking at years of tapering at the lowest possible rate to maintain function. I have made my peace with that. How are you feeling now? Have you stabilized? 

 

 

"Nothing so small as a moment is insurmountable, and moments are all that we have. You have survived every trial and tribulation that life has thrown at you up until this very instant. When future troubles come—and they will come—a version of you will be born into that moment that can conquer them, too." - Kevin Koenig 

 

I am not a doctor and this should not be considered medical advice. You can use the information and recommendations provided in whatever way you want and all decisions on your treatment are yours. 

 

In the next few weeks I do not have a lot of capacity to respond to questions. If you need a quick answer pls tag or ask other moderators who may want to be tagged. 

 

Aug  2000 - July 2003 (ct, 4-6 wk wd) , citalopram 20 mg,  xanax prn, wellbutrin for a few months, trazodone prn 

Dec 2004 - July 2018 citalopram 20 mg, xanax prn (rarely used)

Aug 2018 - citalopram 40 mg (self titrated up)

September 2018 - January 2019 tapered citalopram - 40/30/20/10/5 no issues until a week after reaching 0

Feb 2019 0.25 xanax - 0.5/day (3 weeks) over to klonopin 0.25 once a day to manage severe wd

March 6, reinstated citalopram 2.5 mg (liquid), klonopin 0.25 mg for sleep 2-3 times a week

Apr 1st citalopram 2.0 mg (liquid), klonopin 0.25 once a week (off by 4/14/19- no tapering)

citalopram (liquid) 4/14/19 -1.8 mg, 5/8/19 - 1.6 mg,  7/27/19 -1.5 mg,  8/15/19 - 1.35, 2/21/21 - 1.1 (smaller drops in between), 6/20/21 - 1.03 mg, 8/7/21- 1.025, 8/11/21 - 1.02, 8/15/21 - 1.015, 9/3/21 - 0.925 (fingers crossed!), 10/8/21 - 0.9, 10/18/21 - 0.875, 12/31/21 - 0.85, 1/7/22 - 0.825, 1/14/22 - 0.8, 1/22/22 - 0.785, 8/18/22 - 0.59, 12/15/2022 - 0.48, 2/15/22 - 0.43, 25/07/23 - 0.25 (mistake), 6/08/23 - 0.33mg

 

Supplements: magnesium citrate and bi-glycinate

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  • Moderator

I haven't been really dropping for 2 months now and am going through the usual windows and waves (mostly waves) but wanted to note here that my GP apologized to me last Friday for being short with me about WD. He has now read the articles (horowitz) and believes that some people have a harder time getting off of ADs. This may have something to do with some new guidance that GPs have received according to the daily mail but I can't find the guidance itself. Here's the daily mail article from Oct 12, last Friday. Progress is progress and I'll take it. 

 

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/health/article-7566063/How-help-youre-hooked-antidepressants.html

"Nothing so small as a moment is insurmountable, and moments are all that we have. You have survived every trial and tribulation that life has thrown at you up until this very instant. When future troubles come—and they will come—a version of you will be born into that moment that can conquer them, too." - Kevin Koenig 

 

I am not a doctor and this should not be considered medical advice. You can use the information and recommendations provided in whatever way you want and all decisions on your treatment are yours. 

 

In the next few weeks I do not have a lot of capacity to respond to questions. If you need a quick answer pls tag or ask other moderators who may want to be tagged. 

 

Aug  2000 - July 2003 (ct, 4-6 wk wd) , citalopram 20 mg,  xanax prn, wellbutrin for a few months, trazodone prn 

Dec 2004 - July 2018 citalopram 20 mg, xanax prn (rarely used)

Aug 2018 - citalopram 40 mg (self titrated up)

September 2018 - January 2019 tapered citalopram - 40/30/20/10/5 no issues until a week after reaching 0

Feb 2019 0.25 xanax - 0.5/day (3 weeks) over to klonopin 0.25 once a day to manage severe wd

March 6, reinstated citalopram 2.5 mg (liquid), klonopin 0.25 mg for sleep 2-3 times a week

Apr 1st citalopram 2.0 mg (liquid), klonopin 0.25 once a week (off by 4/14/19- no tapering)

citalopram (liquid) 4/14/19 -1.8 mg, 5/8/19 - 1.6 mg,  7/27/19 -1.5 mg,  8/15/19 - 1.35, 2/21/21 - 1.1 (smaller drops in between), 6/20/21 - 1.03 mg, 8/7/21- 1.025, 8/11/21 - 1.02, 8/15/21 - 1.015, 9/3/21 - 0.925 (fingers crossed!), 10/8/21 - 0.9, 10/18/21 - 0.875, 12/31/21 - 0.85, 1/7/22 - 0.825, 1/14/22 - 0.8, 1/22/22 - 0.785, 8/18/22 - 0.59, 12/15/2022 - 0.48, 2/15/22 - 0.43, 25/07/23 - 0.25 (mistake), 6/08/23 - 0.33mg

 

Supplements: magnesium citrate and bi-glycinate

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  • 8 months later...

Hi OMW

Thanks so much for the kind and validating words on my intro page. It really helped me to know that some kind stranger would spend that much time and thought on me. I've started that book you've recommended. If emotional flashbacks are what I think they are, then I have them almost constantly. It's occurred to me that spending years with unkind and uncaring people caused me to treat others kindly and with care. I wouldn't have this positive without that negative. I really wish that none of us had to deal with this. But we are bettering ourselves. One day we will thrive. ❤️

2004- Prescribed paxil, switched to effexor, gradually increased to a high dose over 10 years
2014- November began to taper off effexor
2015- March switched to Prozac
2016- May began taper down from 80mg Prozac
2017-Sept got to 40mg
2018- Aug- Got liquid prozac, beginning taper again

2018 dec- 26.24mg
2019 june- 19.13mg
2020 Jan- 10.17mg
2020 June- 6.67mg
2020 July- 7.41mg prozac
hold for covid
2021 June- 7.04mg prozac
 
Current supplements
fish oil 600mg
D3 75mcg
B12 7.5mg
Niacin 500mg
Magnesium
 

 

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  • 1 month later...
  • Administrator

Hello, @Onmyway, how are you doing?

This is not medical advice. Discuss any decisions about your medical care with a knowledgeable medical practitioner.

"It has become appallingly obvious that our technology has surpassed our humanity." -- Albert Einstein

All postings © copyrighted.

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  • Moderator
On 6/20/2020 at 8:30 AM, BlankGeneration said:

Hi OMW

Thanks so much for the kind and validating words on my intro page. It really helped me to know that some kind stranger would spend that much time and thought on me. I've started that book you've recommended. If emotional flashbacks are what I think they are, then I have them almost constantly. It's occurred to me that spending years with unkind and uncaring people caused me to treat others kindly and with care. I wouldn't have this positive without that negative. I really wish that none of us had to deal with this. But we are bettering ourselves. One day we will thrive. ❤️

 

Hi @BlankGeneration 

so sorry I did not see your post here. I think I replied to your other one but for some reason missed the notification for this and only saw it today after I got Alto's message notification. I am so glad the book helped. Recovery from trauma is life long and in my experience you reach 'new normal's which of course do not return you to a state of pre-trauma (whatever that was when we were children) but do allow the achievement of adjustment, happiness, satisfaction. I think of it as a branch that has been made to grow in a different way - the tree is still reaching to the sun but its torso or branches are perhaps twisted. I often find such trees the most interesting and beautiful in nature and have found in life that people who have been through hardship and trauma are the most genuine, kind and wonderful human beings. I feel kinship to people like that - our own grand extended family, if you will, of hurt and wonderfully different and amazing people. 

 

I am very partial to a poem by a  Naomi Shihab Nye

https://poets.org/poem/kindness

 

People who have not been through what I have been through will sometimes be offended by it because they feel like the poem is telling them they can't be kind. But that is not what I see in it - I see a softness, level of empathy that comes with hardship that is all encompassing of the human that's suffered. A pervasive, embodies kindness rather than simple acts of kindness. You can tell when you meet people like that. It's not to say that every person who has been through trauma has become soft and kind, sometimes the opposite occurs and we become hedgehogs in order to protect ourselves (I was one at times).  Anyway, here it is :) Let's count our blessings :) 

 

Hope you are doing better. I am really bad at checking the intro pages (incl mine) and mostly hang out on the Symptoms forum. Will go to see how you are doing now. 

Hugs, 

OMW

 

Kindness

Naomi Shihab Nye - 1952-

Before you know what kindness really is

you must lose things,
feel the future dissolve in a moment
like salt in a weakened broth.
What you held in your hand,
what you counted and carefully saved,
all this must go so you know
how desolate the landscape can be
between the regions of kindness.
How you ride and ride
thinking the bus will never stop,
the passengers eating maize and chicken
will stare out the window forever.

Before you learn the tender gravity of kindness
you must travel where the Indian in a white poncho
lies dead by the side of the road.
You must see how this could be you,
how he too was someone
who journeyed through the night with plans
and the simple breath that kept him alive.

Before you know kindness as the deepest thing inside,
you must know sorrow as the other deepest thing.
You must wake up with sorrow.
You must speak to it till your voice
catches the thread of all sorrows
and you see the size of the cloth.
Then it is only kindness that makes sense anymore,
only kindness that ties your shoes
and sends you out into the day to gaze at bread,
only kindness that raises its head
from the crowd of the world to say
It is I you have been looking for,
and then goes with you everywhere
like a shadow or a friend.

 

"Nothing so small as a moment is insurmountable, and moments are all that we have. You have survived every trial and tribulation that life has thrown at you up until this very instant. When future troubles come—and they will come—a version of you will be born into that moment that can conquer them, too." - Kevin Koenig 

 

I am not a doctor and this should not be considered medical advice. You can use the information and recommendations provided in whatever way you want and all decisions on your treatment are yours. 

 

In the next few weeks I do not have a lot of capacity to respond to questions. If you need a quick answer pls tag or ask other moderators who may want to be tagged. 

 

Aug  2000 - July 2003 (ct, 4-6 wk wd) , citalopram 20 mg,  xanax prn, wellbutrin for a few months, trazodone prn 

Dec 2004 - July 2018 citalopram 20 mg, xanax prn (rarely used)

Aug 2018 - citalopram 40 mg (self titrated up)

September 2018 - January 2019 tapered citalopram - 40/30/20/10/5 no issues until a week after reaching 0

Feb 2019 0.25 xanax - 0.5/day (3 weeks) over to klonopin 0.25 once a day to manage severe wd

March 6, reinstated citalopram 2.5 mg (liquid), klonopin 0.25 mg for sleep 2-3 times a week

Apr 1st citalopram 2.0 mg (liquid), klonopin 0.25 once a week (off by 4/14/19- no tapering)

citalopram (liquid) 4/14/19 -1.8 mg, 5/8/19 - 1.6 mg,  7/27/19 -1.5 mg,  8/15/19 - 1.35, 2/21/21 - 1.1 (smaller drops in between), 6/20/21 - 1.03 mg, 8/7/21- 1.025, 8/11/21 - 1.02, 8/15/21 - 1.015, 9/3/21 - 0.925 (fingers crossed!), 10/8/21 - 0.9, 10/18/21 - 0.875, 12/31/21 - 0.85, 1/7/22 - 0.825, 1/14/22 - 0.8, 1/22/22 - 0.785, 8/18/22 - 0.59, 12/15/2022 - 0.48, 2/15/22 - 0.43, 25/07/23 - 0.25 (mistake), 6/08/23 - 0.33mg

 

Supplements: magnesium citrate and bi-glycinate

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  • Moderator
On 8/10/2020 at 9:39 PM, Altostrata said:

Hello, @Onmyway, how are you doing?

Hi @Altostrata

Thank you for checking on me. 

I have been generally doing OK. I had some very severe personal setbacks in the last year.   Currently at @1.3 mg of citalopram which is 30% SERT occupancy from my calculations.  

 

Among this I have been doing surprisingly well, considering. I would be an 70% success story if it weren't for the fact that I am still on 1.3mg and dreading what is coming when I start cutting again. Able to sleep better now but still cortisol mornings despite blacked out windows. But much milder than the beginning, that's for sure. My evenings are better. I suspect I had Covid in the very beginning but tested Ab negative with 90% specific test 4 months out so it doesn't mean anything. Lockdown has been OK for me. Connected with neighbors in my apartment building and we hang out every day in the garden which provides a welcome relief from rumination. 

 

One big learning through WD for me has been the fact that I have taken my feelings seriously all my life when perhaps I should not have done that. What do I mean by that: basically that I have looked for help for things that now seem minor (in comparison to how awful WD is). So I am finding that stoics may have a point. 

 

I recently fired a therapist. She got uncomfortable when I told her about withdrawal and just sort of rolling her eyes every time I mentioned WD. She was very insightful but as soon as she suggested I go back on the SSRIs after telling her how awful WD has been I knew I was not having it. My sadness is normal and I don't want to numb it and WD and the support of this community and the learning from here gave me the confidence to show her the door (or the Zoom leave button, as it happens). The session itself was quite upsetting though and it took me a couple of days to figure out what about it was so upsetting. I sent her a short email explaining my reasons (a paragraph) and she never responded. Which confirms that my choice was right. That and her constantly checking her messages during the meeting. Bye Felicia. I know enough, thanks to you and this site to not take this any more. 

 

I have been recently taking CoQ10 and vitamin D for deficiency (I was severely deficient) and it is possible that they are making the current wave worse - I am quite restless and jittery until the evening but it is what it is.

 

After the treatments I will start cutting my meds back and am quite scared of how that will go. Last year was so brutal and I don't have the option of going extremely slowly. At 10% I will be done end of 2023. And with my recent setbacks I am waiting for something more horrible to happen any minute. 

 

Thank you for checking on me and for doing so much for all of us! 

Hugs, OMW

Edited by Onmyway

"Nothing so small as a moment is insurmountable, and moments are all that we have. You have survived every trial and tribulation that life has thrown at you up until this very instant. When future troubles come—and they will come—a version of you will be born into that moment that can conquer them, too." - Kevin Koenig 

 

I am not a doctor and this should not be considered medical advice. You can use the information and recommendations provided in whatever way you want and all decisions on your treatment are yours. 

 

In the next few weeks I do not have a lot of capacity to respond to questions. If you need a quick answer pls tag or ask other moderators who may want to be tagged. 

 

Aug  2000 - July 2003 (ct, 4-6 wk wd) , citalopram 20 mg,  xanax prn, wellbutrin for a few months, trazodone prn 

Dec 2004 - July 2018 citalopram 20 mg, xanax prn (rarely used)

Aug 2018 - citalopram 40 mg (self titrated up)

September 2018 - January 2019 tapered citalopram - 40/30/20/10/5 no issues until a week after reaching 0

Feb 2019 0.25 xanax - 0.5/day (3 weeks) over to klonopin 0.25 once a day to manage severe wd

March 6, reinstated citalopram 2.5 mg (liquid), klonopin 0.25 mg for sleep 2-3 times a week

Apr 1st citalopram 2.0 mg (liquid), klonopin 0.25 once a week (off by 4/14/19- no tapering)

citalopram (liquid) 4/14/19 -1.8 mg, 5/8/19 - 1.6 mg,  7/27/19 -1.5 mg,  8/15/19 - 1.35, 2/21/21 - 1.1 (smaller drops in between), 6/20/21 - 1.03 mg, 8/7/21- 1.025, 8/11/21 - 1.02, 8/15/21 - 1.015, 9/3/21 - 0.925 (fingers crossed!), 10/8/21 - 0.9, 10/18/21 - 0.875, 12/31/21 - 0.85, 1/7/22 - 0.825, 1/14/22 - 0.8, 1/22/22 - 0.785, 8/18/22 - 0.59, 12/15/2022 - 0.48, 2/15/22 - 0.43, 25/07/23 - 0.25 (mistake), 6/08/23 - 0.33mg

 

Supplements: magnesium citrate and bi-glycinate

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  • Administrator

Sorry to hear of the disappointment.

 

You may be taking too much vit D3, you might want to start low with the liquid form and slowly titrate up. Are you also taking hormones? They can cause mood swings.

 

Don't worry about finishing up your taper, it may go fine! Please let us know how you're doing.

Edited by Onmyway

This is not medical advice. Discuss any decisions about your medical care with a knowledgeable medical practitioner.

"It has become appallingly obvious that our technology has surpassed our humanity." -- Albert Einstein

All postings © copyrighted.

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  • 1 month later...
  • Moderator Emeritus

I've moved your new post to an existing topic:  asthenia-weakness-muscle-fatigue-in-legs-arms-or-body

 

* NO LONGER ACTIVE on SA *

MISSION ACCOMPLISHED:  (6 year taper)      0mg Pristiq  on 13th November 2021

ADs since ~1992:  25+ years - 1 unknown, Prozac (muscle weakness), Zoloft; citalopram (pooped out) CTed (very sick for 2.5 wks a few months after); Pristiq:  50mg 2012, 100mg beg 2013 (Serotonin Toxicity)  Tapering from Oct 2015 - 13 Nov 2021   LAST DOSE 0.0025mg

Post 0 updates start here    My tapering program     My Intro (goes to tapering graph)

 VIDEO:   Antidepressant Withdrawal Syndrome and its Management

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  • 8 months later...
  • Moderator

I have been having a really hard time recently. I started cutting again - 7.5% at first, then 2.5%. Initially it was going OK but in the meantime got Covid (I had been incredibly careful but someone I trusted lied to me about their safety behaviors). The Covid went for over 6 weeks and despite not having any underlying conditions, I had a pretty serious version of it. Lost 10 kg (about 22 lbs in about 6 weeks). Then realized that the GI symptoms that I initially thought were Covid were in fact H-Pylori for which I am now getting antibiotics and dreading it. Lots of emotional upheaval from outside sources but I also feel like I am perhaps a bit more sensitized from the recent cuts albeit tiny. I also read that H-Pylori can increase symptoms of depression/anxiety - they make a link with serotonin in the gut so it probably also exacerbates WD. But just as a general rule - nausea is not conducive to happiness. I am a bit mad with GP who delayed the diagnosis - instead of testing me for 10 weeks of symptoms he just prescribed a PPI (omeprazole) which I, of course, didn't take because I had no reflux. Finally did a home test and now speaking with him tomorrow. 

 

In the meantime, a lot of external emotional upheaval has also been ongoing and I barely made it through last week. I am holding off on cutting any more right now as I feel emotionally exhausted as if I were run by a car. I am worried though about the last 1.075mg of citalopram and how on earth I will be able to come off of that if I can't do even 2.5% at a time. This is rather discouraging. But at this point I am focusing on survival  though the desirability of that seems questionable at times.

"Nothing so small as a moment is insurmountable, and moments are all that we have. You have survived every trial and tribulation that life has thrown at you up until this very instant. When future troubles come—and they will come—a version of you will be born into that moment that can conquer them, too." - Kevin Koenig 

 

I am not a doctor and this should not be considered medical advice. You can use the information and recommendations provided in whatever way you want and all decisions on your treatment are yours. 

 

In the next few weeks I do not have a lot of capacity to respond to questions. If you need a quick answer pls tag or ask other moderators who may want to be tagged. 

 

Aug  2000 - July 2003 (ct, 4-6 wk wd) , citalopram 20 mg,  xanax prn, wellbutrin for a few months, trazodone prn 

Dec 2004 - July 2018 citalopram 20 mg, xanax prn (rarely used)

Aug 2018 - citalopram 40 mg (self titrated up)

September 2018 - January 2019 tapered citalopram - 40/30/20/10/5 no issues until a week after reaching 0

Feb 2019 0.25 xanax - 0.5/day (3 weeks) over to klonopin 0.25 once a day to manage severe wd

March 6, reinstated citalopram 2.5 mg (liquid), klonopin 0.25 mg for sleep 2-3 times a week

Apr 1st citalopram 2.0 mg (liquid), klonopin 0.25 once a week (off by 4/14/19- no tapering)

citalopram (liquid) 4/14/19 -1.8 mg, 5/8/19 - 1.6 mg,  7/27/19 -1.5 mg,  8/15/19 - 1.35, 2/21/21 - 1.1 (smaller drops in between), 6/20/21 - 1.03 mg, 8/7/21- 1.025, 8/11/21 - 1.02, 8/15/21 - 1.015, 9/3/21 - 0.925 (fingers crossed!), 10/8/21 - 0.9, 10/18/21 - 0.875, 12/31/21 - 0.85, 1/7/22 - 0.825, 1/14/22 - 0.8, 1/22/22 - 0.785, 8/18/22 - 0.59, 12/15/2022 - 0.48, 2/15/22 - 0.43, 25/07/23 - 0.25 (mistake), 6/08/23 - 0.33mg

 

Supplements: magnesium citrate and bi-glycinate

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  • Moderator Emeritus

Dear @Onmyway--Oh, I am so sorry you're having all of this at once.  My goodness, no wonder you feel as if you've been run by a car.  It is so fortunate that you have such an awareness of how these issues might conspire to cause overwhelming depression and anxiety.  Please allow me to send you confidence that you may not be able to feel right now that these terrible feelings and sensations will improve, will lift, will pass.  I have just come out of a darkness that I wasn't sure would ever end, but this morning I'm feeling somewhat better.  I know that you will get better.  However, in the depths of such a challenge, it is so very, very, very hard.  I send you hugs and best wishes, and will be holding you in my heart.    I look forward to hearing how you're doing.  Arbor

Zoloft: 1995 - 2015

Prozac: 2015 - 2018 (tapered from 40mg x day on July 31 to 30mg on August 31 to 20mg on September 31 to 10mg October 31 to 0mg on  December 15, 2018

Gabapentin: 2016 to 2019  (tapered from 300mg x day to 150mg on August 31, 2019 to 75mg on September 15 to 50mg on September 31 to 25ishmg on October 15 to 0mg on December 1, 2019

Enalapril: 2010 - 2019

Lipitor: 2017 -2017

Metformin: 2000 - 2020

Liothyronine: 2007 - 2019

Levothyroxine: 2000 - 2022

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Hello Onmyway,

 

So sorry to hear you've had to suffer all that at the same time... it's unbelievable bad luck coming on top of problems with tapering. Please try not to let it discourage you: give yourself plenty of time to recover from the two infections.

 

One thing I perhaps should mention just in case you're not aware of it - PPI's do have an effect on how you metabolise citalopram:

 

https://journals.lww.com/drug-monitoring/Fulltext/2015/02000/Effect_of_Proton_Pump_Inhibitors_on_the_Serum.13.aspx

 

I don't know what effect this would have on tapering, but I'm pretty sure the fact that PPI's slow your ability to metabolise citalopram played a role in the disasterous rapid switch from it to mirtazapine that my former GP put me through since I was on lansoprazole for stomach ulcers at the time. If you do decide to take the omeprazole then please watch out for any effects that could come from it changing the levels of the citalopram.

 

Sending you best wishes and hoping you're feeling better very soon.

1999 - 2001: Paroxetine 20mg, 2003: Venlafaxine 75mg, 2003 - 2014: Escitalopram 20mg

1999 - December 2017: Lansoprazole 15mg

2014 - December 2017: Citalopram 20mg

December 2017: Mirtazapine 30mg, stopped after 4 days due to immediate bad reaction, Zopiclone 3.75mg, stopped after 2 days due to immediate bad reaction

January 2018 - April 2018: Citalopram liquid, tapering, final dose 0.1mg

December 2018 onwards: Vitamin C 1000mg

October 2021: Loratadine 10mg for 6 days (23/10 to 28/10)

Long term (for asthma): Salbutamol and Salmeterol inhalers, Salmeterol stopped March 2021 due to migraine headaches

Occasional use for headaches: Paracetamol 40mg or Ibuprofen 40mg

4th December 2021: Eustachian tube infection: Amoxicillin 500mg 3 per day for 5 days, Dexamethasone & Neomycin ear spray 3 per day for 1 week, Beclometasone nasal spray 2 per day for 2 weeks.

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