Dmitry: hello

[Dmitry]

Topic title:  Antidepressants withdrawal

 

Hey guys, I really need your help. I been on escitalopram for about 8 months. I ween myself off 10mg in about 2 and a half months, gradually reducing the dosage from 10 to 7.5 then 5 then 2.5. For the first two weeks I had brain zaps but nothing too severe. After the two weeks for about two weeks now I am very depressed, not able to work, having suicidal thoughts, feeling hopeless. Did I ween off too quickly? What would you suggest? This feel almost impossible to bear. Please any suggestions will be greatly appreciated.  Thank you.

 

 

Edited April 25, 2019 by ChessieCat
added topic title

[Dmitry]

Hello guys, my name is Dmitry. I had a type of a nervous break down in May 2018. I was in a very poor shape so doctors put me on Clonazepam and Escitalopram. This is my first experience with medical drugs. I found that it is almost impossible to get the right support and guidance from mental health care practitioners that I came across during this time. I am here because I need help and would like to also help anyone if I can, in any way. Thank you.

 

[Carmie]

Hi Dmitry, 

 

Welcome to SA. I’m sorry you’re struggling so much. Yes, you reduced too quickly. It’s recommended to taper by no more than 10% a month. 

 

What date did you start the Escitalopram? Did you start it at 10mg?

 

How long have you been on 2.5mg now?

 

Could you please go to the Read This First forum and to the thread entitled “ Please Put Your Withdrawal History In Your Signature.” Please put the dates of when you tapered in there as well, as that thread explains. Thank you.

 

Sending hugs 🤗

[Dmitry]

Hey Carmie, thank you so much for responding )

I started on Escitalopram on 5mg beginning of June 2018. After a week I went up to 10mg. I started to ween myself off January 21 2019.

 

I was on 2.5 mg for two weeks, starting March 10 until March 23, then I stopped.

 

First two weeks were fine but now its hell.

 

I am thinking of reinstating a small dosage as I was reading through the forum. Do you think its a good idea? Please let me know.

 

Thank you kindly.

 

I attempted to create the signature, please let me know if I did it correctly. 

 

Thank you.

[Carmie]

Hi Dmitry, 

 

Thanks for doing your signature. Could you add the  tapering dates and the doses of the Escitalopram to your signature as well. Thank you.

 

Reinstating has helped a lot of people. It doesn’t help everyone though, and in a few cases it’s made things worse, but a lot of people have found it beneficial. I’ve actually updosed myself when I tapered too quickly in the past and it really helped me. I didn’t know about this site then, but I just thought if I go back up a bit it might help, and it did. I had such severe akathisia that I felt like I was being electrocuted. After a week of that I did an updose, and within a few days the symptoms subsided. 

 

You’ve been off the meds for a little while now so it may not be wise to back on the last dose you were on. You might want to reinstate a smaller dose. I’ll see what dosage the other mods advise. 

 

Please keep up updated as to how you’re doing. 💚

[Dmitry]

Hey Carmie, 

 

I have included the history about my taper and I see it was definitely rushed. Ironically I wrote the reply already but it didn't seem to publish. I hope I am doing this right, still learning. I think I need to reinstate and see if I can bring my symptoms under control. The last two weeks I was on about 2.5 and was off the pills for almost a month now. Do you think I should try reinstating a very small dosage, 1.25 and see if that helps to stabilize the nervous system?

 

Thank you for all you help guys.

[jozeff]

Hi Dmitry,

 

Sorry for your struggling.

I have the feeling that you might get on the right track in the near future. You have been tapering fast but you haven't been on zero for that long so there is certainly hope for some relief, no guarantees unfortunately.

 

I updosed myself to counteract wd symptoms and felt relief after 3 days.

 

The last three weeks I have been taking saffron and that helped tremendously with my suicidal feelings and hopelessness. I shouldn't take that right away now but it might be something for the future.

 

I wish you all the best and great job that you found this website!

 

Cheers

 

Jozeff

[Dmitry]

Hey Jozeff,

 

Thank you so much for your reply. I been off for about 30 days or so. Symptoms started about two weeks ago. How long were you off before the up dosing? And it terms off dosage, how did you decide on how much to take?

 

 

[Dmitry]

Guys, I also have a question. In the moment of really bad anxiety or a panic attack ( I trying my best not to do it ), has anyone had experience taking an anti anxiety ( clonazepam ) just to get over the very difficult patch? I do my best not to take them only if I feel like I can't cope any other way.

 

Please let me know your thoughts 

[Carmie]

12 hours ago, Dmitry said:

Hey Carmie, 

 

I have included the history about my taper and I see it was definitely rushed. Ironically I wrote the reply already but it didn't seem to publish. I hope I am doing this right, still learning. I think I need to reinstate and see if I can bring my symptoms under control. The last two weeks I was on about 2.5 and was off the pills for almost a month now. Do you think I should try reinstating a very small dosage, 1.25 and see if that helps to stabilize the nervous system?

 

Thank you for all you help guys.

 

Hi Dmitry, 

 

I’ve left a report with the other mods to see what dosage they recommend. 1.25mg may actually be a bit high seeing you’ve been off the meds for a month. 

 

Take care.💚

 

[Dmitry]

Hi Carmie,

 

Ok, I will wait until the response. I truly hope that it helps me.

 

Thank you for looking into it for me.

[Songbird]

21 hours ago, Dmitry said:

HThe last two weeks I was on about 2.5 and was off the pills for almost a month now. Do you think I should try reinstating a very small dosage, 1.25 and see if that helps to stabilize the nervous system?

 

Choosing a reinstatement dose can be tricky, as some people find it doesn't work the same as before, or have adverse reactions.  Starting with a smaller dose can help to reduce the risk of adverse reactions.  Your idea of reinstating 1.25mg sounds reasonable to me - I wouldn't go higher at this stage.  If you find it is not enough to alleviate severe withdrawal symptoms you have the option of increasing the dose later.  It's a good idea to keep a record of your symptoms, so you can note if you have any adverse reaction, or if you see improvement over time.  Please have a good read of our reinstatement topic, especially the top post: About reinstating and stabilizing to reduce withdrawal symptoms.  

[Dmitry]

Thank you very much. Will start with this dosage and see how it progresses. 

 

Why is this so hard? (

[Carmie]

Hi Dmitry, 

 

Just wanted to wish you all the best with your reinstatement. You’re certainly right, everything to do with withdrawals is hard. These medications certainly are really potent. There are no certainties, but a lot of people have been helped by reinstating. I myself have benefited from an updose, as I’ve mentioned before. 

 

Just know that it may take months to work, or even longer. You could be fortunate though, and it may help pretty soon. We just don’t know. There’s no rhyme or reason when it comes to these meds. They affect everyone differently. 

 

Please keep us updated, sending hugs🤗

[Songbird]

On 4/28/2019 at 6:10 AM, Dmitry said:

Thank you very much. Will start with this dosage and see how it progresses. 

 

 

Hi Dmitry, just wondering if you started the dose and how things are going?

[Dmitry]

Hey guys. Going through a very tough time. Attempted to stabilize on a low dosage but unfortunately it didn't work. I increased Escitalopram up to 10 mg and been taking it for the last few days. Seems like I will have to do the process all over again. The bad part is that my anxiety was so severe that I had to take clonazepam, again. I am on 0.75mg of clonazepam. Could you please make some suggestions please on what to do next? Also, did anyone introduce cbd oil to help come off the medication? Please let me know. Thank you.

[jozeff]

Hi Dmitry,

 

Good to hear from you! Too bad you are still struggling so hard. For how long did you take the low dose?

 

You increased to 10 mg a few days ago. This might take some time before you start to feel effect. It might be pretty high but since you tried a much lower reinstatement this is what you decided to go for.

 

I take oxazepam sometimes for anxiety. That stuff is very addictive so people will not encourage you hete to take that often. Do you take I on a daily basis? 

 

When is your anxiety peaking? 

 

What I do to prevent anxiety and panic attacks is:

 

-eat small meals often, no large portions.

-massage my belly with a stick (or hard thin object) .....search for adrenal gland massage.

-feet in cold water or head under cold shower.

-walk, walk, walk.....

-breathing exercises

-no coffee after meals

-no diet Coke

 

I tried CBD oil 10% a few times but I didn't really feel the difference.

 

 

I really hope that you will see improvements soon. Stay tough, time is the healer here.

 

Jozeff

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Dmitry]

Hey Jozeff. Thank you so much for reply.

 

I really didnt want to go to 10 mg but felt like things were not getting better. I am hoping to stabilize and then start to reduce slowly. 10 percent with 1 month hold. When do you guys think it would be ok to start the taper? Also, has anyone tried cbd oil to help with coming off?

 

Thank you.

[Gridley]

On 5/19/2019 at 10:43 AM, Dmitry said:

I increased Escitalopram up to 10 mg and been taking it for the last few days. Seems like I will have to do the process all over again. The bad part is that my anxiety was so severe that I had to take clonazepam, again. I am on 0.75mg of clonazepam.

 

Dmitry, please update your signature to reflect the changes in Escitalopram and Clonazapam, including dates.    Here's the link where you can do that.

 

 Account Settings – Create or Edit a signature.

 

How are you feeling on 10mg?  What are your symptoms?  Are they better or worse?  You are going to need to stabilize before thinking about a taper.  This could take several months.  

 

Here is an SA link on CBD oil.

 

Cannabis, marijuana, THC, and CBD or Hemp oil - Page 4 ...

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Dmitry]

I do feel a bit better then when the hell started. Still have depression symptoms and some anxiety. Would you suggest I start clonazepam taper and how slowly should I do it? I been taking it daily for about a month now. Also been taking CBD oil 2ml per day for the last 3 weeks.

 

Thank you.

[Gridley]

Just now, Dmitry said:

Would you suggest I start clonazepam taper and how slowly should I do it? I been taking it daily for about a month now. Also been taking CBD oil 2ml per day for the last 3 weeks.

 

I would not make ANY changes now.  Your system is still working to stabilize from the increase in Escitalopram.   I know that making changes seems like you're DOING something, but holding is also doing something and is often --and certainly in your case -- the best way to progress toward healing.  Hold steady where you are, Dmitry, and let your brain catch up. 

[Dmitry]

Thank you kindly for the reply. Do you have any suggestions on CBD oil? I am not sure if I should continue to take it during this time.

[Altostrata]

Have you felt any benefit from the CBD oil? Why do you want to change it now?

[Dmitry]

So far I am not sure, will continue for now. Will keep you posted on the results.

In terms of getting off benzos and antidepressants, will I have to taper off benzo first before starting antidepressants? I am holding for now to stabilize as advised. Are there are many successful cases of people getting off antidepressants under 2 years of use?

[ChessieCat]

Taking multiple psych drugs? Which drug to taper first?
If you're not having an adverse reaction from the other medications, taper the most activating drug first. This is usually an antidepressant or stimulant (ADHD drug).

[Dmitry]

Hello guys,

 

About 3 weeks now at 10mg of escitalopram after reinstatement but still feel really down. Do you know what I can do? Does it get better?

 

Please let me know.

 

Thank you.

[TriD]

 

 

I was on similar treatment to you.

 

i think you should try tapering very slowly at lower doses. My experience alone 10,7.5,5,2.5 lexapro in 6weeks, felt no difference at all. All came to ahead at 0mg. So the tapering I was doing was not effective at all, program was wrong.

In retrospect I would have stayed at 2.5 for 1month, then do about 4-5 drops per month till zero.gradual staircase at the <2.5mg. But too late I’m already six weeks at 0mg will keep going.

 

i did a lot of supplements they had paradoxical effect and set me back a month and messed with my nervous system. CBD I tried and works but caused some anxiety after the calming wore off. But I would try again at small doses to test limit.

 

i used to get bad coffee reaction also but since I’m a coffee addict my body eventually accepted the caffeine so I can at least drink that. I think if you push on with cbd it might have good and bad effects but the body eventually adapts.

 

when I reinstated my 10mg from 0mg hell, I had redo the whole onboarding lexapro effect again, hot sweats, anxiety spikes, insomnia, really bad morning depression and very sad thoughts... it lasted a few weeks also. Felt like crap, but then it goes away... morning cortisol buzz was a big one when I restarted on 10mg also but went away when stabilised 

 

reason I went to 10mg .. not sure was ignorant I guess. I took 2.5mg felt better, 5mg improved , 7.5 then 10mg, I felt big difference WD symptoms dropped a lot, but unfortunately going back to a high dose. Stayed on that till the bad effects went away, then dropped at 2.5mg increments... I didn’t try to low dose taper, but now I regret it a bit heh as I got some symptoms I need to deal with. Guess I was impatient as usual

[Songbird]

12 hours ago, Dmitry said:

About 3 weeks now at 10mg of escitalopram after reinstatement but still feel really down. Do you know what I can do? Does it get better?

 

 

What symptoms are you having now?  Have your symptoms or their severity changed since you reinstated?  

[Dmitry]

Definitely got better then in the beggining of the " crash ". Still feel depressed, lack of interest in things I used to enjoy. Kinda nervous, not sure if the balance can be achieved. Do you recommend stabilizing before I can think of starting the taper? I will definitely go super slow when the time is right. Oh ya, struggling with thoughts of suicide from time to time.

[Dmitry]

On 6/7/2019 at 3:17 AM, TriD said:

 

 

I was on similar treatment to you.

 

i think you should try tapering very slowly at lower doses. My experience alone 10,7.5,5,2.5 lexapro in 6weeks, felt no difference at all. All came to ahead at 0mg. So the tapering I was doing was not effective at all, program was wrong.

In retrospect I would have stayed at 2.5 for 1month, then do about 4-5 drops per month till zero.gradual staircase at the <2.5mg. But too late I’m already six weeks at 0mg will keep going.

 

i did a lot of supplements they had paradoxical effect and set me back a month and messed with my nervous system. CBD I tried and works but caused some anxiety after the calming wore off. But I would try again at small doses to test limit.

 

i used to get bad coffee reaction also but since I’m a coffee addict my body eventually accepted the caffeine so I can at least drink that. I think if you push on with cbd it might have good and bad effects but the body eventually adapts.

 

when I reinstated my 10mg from 0mg hell, I had redo the whole onboarding lexapro effect again, hot sweats, anxiety spikes, insomnia, really bad morning depression and very sad thoughts... it lasted a few weeks also. Felt like crap, but then it goes away... morning cortisol buzz was a big one when I restarted on 10mg also but went away when stabilised 

 

reason I went to 10mg .. not sure was ignorant I guess. I took 2.5mg felt better, 5mg improved , 7.5 then 10mg, I felt big difference WD symptoms dropped a lot, but unfortunately going back to a high dose. Stayed on that till the bad effects went away, then dropped at 2.5mg increments... I didn’t try to low dose taper, but now I regret it a bit heh as I got some symptoms I need to deal with. Guess I was impatient as usual

Thank you so much for your feedback. So going back up caused some morning depression for you also? I find it very hard getting out of the bed in the morning. How long did you wait after you stabilized to taper again?

 

On 6/7/2019 at 3:17 AM, TriD said:

 

 

I was on similar treatment to you.

 

i think you should try tapering very slowly at lower doses. My experience alone 10,7.5,5,2.5 lexapro in 6weeks, felt no difference at all. All came to ahead at 0mg. So the tapering I was doing was not effective at all, program was wrong.

In retrospect I would have stayed at 2.5 for 1month, then do about 4-5 drops per month till zero.gradual staircase at the <2.5mg. But too late I’m already six weeks at 0mg will keep going.

 

i did a lot of supplements they had paradoxical effect and set me back a month and messed with my nervous system. CBD I tried and works but caused some anxiety after the calming wore off. But I would try again at small doses to test limit.

 

i used to get bad coffee reaction also but since I’m a coffee addict my body eventually accepted the caffeine so I can at least drink that. I think if you push on with cbd it might have good and bad effects but the body eventually adapts.

 

when I reinstated my 10mg from 0mg hell, I had redo the whole onboarding lexapro effect again, hot sweats, anxiety spikes, insomnia, really bad morning depression and very sad thoughts... it lasted a few weeks also. Felt like crap, but then it goes away... morning cortisol buzz was a big one when I restarted on 10mg also but went away when stabilised 

 

reason I went to 10mg .. not sure was ignorant I guess. I took 2.5mg felt better, 5mg improved , 7.5 then 10mg, I felt big difference WD symptoms dropped a lot, but unfortunately going back to a high dose. Stayed on that till the bad effects went away, then dropped at 2.5mg increments... I didn’t try to low dose taper, but now I regret it a bit heh as I got some symptoms I need to deal with. Guess I was impatient as usual

Thank you so much for response. The experience at 0 is quiet literally hell on earth. I am at 10 mg again, unfortunately ( but felt it was the right thing to do. I hope I stabilize. How long after you felt stable did you start the taper again? Thank you for responding.

[TriD]

 

 

When I went back on 5mg I felt relief almost immediately. Then I went back to 10mg and felt good. I expected the onboard process to start again and I was expecting the effects for 1-2 weeks before it stablise

 

morning cortisol and bad thoughts about 1 week

then some hot sweating and waking up 2-4hrs at night

 About 2 weeks I felt okay and stayed at 10mg for another 2 weeks then started to taper again .. 6 weeks 10 to 0mg then I got WD again but not as bad as before. It was probably too fast, in retrospect I should have went slower over 3-6months, but I was impatient.

 

im 7 weeks now on 0mg and still suffering symptoms mainly morning depression, and now newly cortisol spikes when I wake... but over this time it has improved slowly, I think I’m going through a “wave”. My nervous system now is highly sensitive 

[Dmitry]

19 minutes ago, TriD said:

 

 

When I went back on 5mg I felt relief almost immediately. Then I went back to 10mg and felt good. I expected the onboard process to start again and I was expecting the effects for 1-2 weeks before it stablise

 

morning cortisol and bad thoughts about 1 week

then some hot sweating and waking up 2-4hrs at night

 About 2 weeks I felt okay and stayed at 10mg for another 2 weeks then started to taper again .. 6 weeks 10 to 0mg then I got WD again but not as bad as before. It was probably too fast, in retrospect I should have went slower over 3-6months, but I was impatient.

 

im 7 weeks now on 0mg and still suffering symptoms mainly morning depression, and now newly cortisol spikes when I wake... but over this time it has improved slowly, I think I’m going through a “wave”. My nervous system now is highly sensitive 

I was off the drug for almost a month when the crash happened. Its been over a month from reinstatement and I still have bad thoughts and still feeling a bit down. I am hoping I will stabilize soon. I will taper after but will do it very slow. Too scared to feel this way again. How long were you on medication?

[Songbird]

10 hours ago, Dmitry said:

Definitely got better then in the beggining of the " crash ". 

 

That's a very good sign.

 

10 hours ago, Dmitry said:

Do you recommend stabilizing before I can think of starting the taper?

 

Yes, it's very important to hold until you stabilise before beginning a taper again.

 

10 hours ago, Dmitry said:

Oh ya, struggling with thoughts of suicide from time to time.

 

This is a symptom - you might find mindfulness techniques helpful.  With mindfulness, you are the observer in your mind and just watch what is going on - kind of like you're a scientist studying some phenomenon.  Your goal is not to try to stop the thoughts from happening, but just let them happen without giving them any importance.  Watch the thoughts as if they are clouds floating by, or cars driving past.  Accept that the thoughts are there, but don’t attach any importance to them.

 

I’ve found it can also help to give your internal negative voice a name (e.g. “doomcloud", “chatterbox", "monkey mind" or whatever name you want) so that you can separate this voice from your real self.  When you are able to perceive that this voice is not “you”, it becomes easier to step back from it, to be less involved in the thoughts, and they become less frightening.  I hope this makes some sense.

[TriD]

10 hours ago, Dmitry said:

I was off the drug for almost a month when the crash happened. Its been over a month from reinstatement and I still have bad thoughts and still feeling a bit down. I am hoping I will stabilize soon. I will taper after but will do it very slow. Too scared to feel this way again. How long were you on medication?

Same first time i was on lexapro for 2months on high dose 20mg. 

 

I stopped nearly cold turkey.. thought i could cheat it as it was only a short time. I got major symptoms like you 1month after 0mg. I got a holiday period for 1month after i stopped and thought i was in the clear.

 

Then one day i started getting flu i thought but funny it cleared in 3 days. After that i got bad stomach pain for 1 week.. didnt make the connection until after that i got some real agitation and anger... then when the zap started i realised something was wrong. Haha..

 

I tried to push through but lasted about 3 weeks the pain was too much. Then i decided to reinstate.

 

A question i would ask you is have you ever been diagnosed with anxiety disorder or GAD? reason i ask is i realised while the symptoms are bad and i can see them improving my anxiety and overthinking cause me much more problems and that thinking is obsessive around the WD. 

[TriD]

Just to add... i dont have a chronic metal illness per se.. i took lexapro because i went through a bad patch in life which ended up with panic attacks...

 

While most people it takes 4 weeks to work, for me it worked almost on day1, panic gone in a few days... my view is my serotonin levels just went very low and also my brain was fatigued and so too the neuroplasticity of being under stress for a long time.. i fell into a depression. 

 

Since then my situation has mostly improved. So there is no chronic condition for me to be on lexapro. However the difficulties in getting off the drug has now caused me a new stressor... and retriggered my anxiety and depression. I try to separate my anxiety over this with the actual symptoms itself. I found that if you stress over the symptoms they are magnified. I found when i realised this i began to only see symptoms are physical and not put too much thought behind it as my anxiety disorder tends to excessive thinking. When i did this i notice the symptoms became much less severe.

[Dmitry]

Hey guys, I am in Canada. I believe we only have 10mg pills here for escitalopram.  When I am ready to taper, how to break the pill at 10% drops? Is there another more successful way then cutting the pill?

I have calculated that with 10% reduction and 1 month hold it will take close to two years to come off. Does that sound about right?

 

The symptoms are starting to get better. How long would you recommend to wait before the idea of tapering? Please let me know.

 

Thank you.