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AlanC: one year on from stopping Celexa / citalopram too quickly


AlanC

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  • Moderator Emeritus
27 minutes ago, AlanC said:

I did try omega-3 fish oil early on but didn't notice any particular effect, plus I didn't like taking it: it gave me unpleasant stale fishy burps, and I just couldn't lose that taste.

 

In the past I've taken deodorised fish oil to avoid the fishy burps, but more recently I've been using krill oil.  I found if I take it with a big glass of water it seems to avoid a fishy aftertaste.  I was having brain fog and the krill oil helped but it took a while, I didn't notice improvements immediately.

2001–2002 paroxetine

2003  citalopram

2004-2008  paroxetine (various failed tapers) 
2008  paroxetine slow taper down to

2016  Aug off paroxetine
2016  citalopram May 20mg  Oct 15mg … slow taper down
2018  citalopram 13 Feb 4.6mg 15 Mar 4.4mg 29 Apr 4.2mg 6 Jul 4.1mg 17 Aug 4.0mg  18 Nov 3.8mg
2019  15 Mar 3.6mg  21 May 3.4mg  26 Dec 3.2mg 

2020  19 Feb 3.0mg 19 Jul 2.9mg 16 Sep 2.8mg 25 Oct 2.7mg 23 Oct 2.6mg 24 Dec 2.5mg

2021   29 Aug 2.4mg   15 Nov 2.3mg

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I've seen the doctor, and it went exactly as I thought it would.

 

Complete denial that what's happening could be withdrawal. The section in the Citalopram leaflet listing the symptoms of a too-fast withdrawal was barely glanced at and immediately dismissed. Suggested that I needed to be put on another antidepressant and go through a round of tests to find out what's causing the brain zaps, dizziness, headaches, etc.

 

I declined, and I won't be going back. And, obviously, I won't be trying to reinstate. 😐

 

Songbird, thanks for the suggestion of the deodorised fish oil or krill oil. It sounds as though it should be far more bearable so I'll have a search and see what I can find here in the UK. I'm definitely willing to try it, and I'll give it plenty of time to see if it does work.

1999 - 2001: Paroxetine 20mg, 2003: Venlafaxine 75mg, 2003 - 2014: Escitalopram 20mg

1999 - December 2017: Lansoprazole 15mg

2014 - December 2017: Citalopram 20mg

December 2017: Mirtazapine 30mg, stopped after 4 days due to immediate bad reaction, Zopiclone 3.75mg, stopped after 2 days due to immediate bad reaction

January 2018 - April 2018: Citalopram liquid, tapering, final dose 0.1mg

December 2018 onwards: Vitamin C 1000mg

October 2021: Loratadine 10mg for 6 days (23/10 to 28/10)

Long term (for asthma): Salbutamol and Salmeterol inhalers, Salmeterol stopped March 2021 due to migraine headaches

Occasional use for headaches: Paracetamol 40mg or Ibuprofen 40mg

4th December 2021: Eustachian tube infection: Amoxicillin 500mg 3 per day for 5 days, Dexamethasone & Neomycin ear spray 3 per day for 1 week, Beclometasone nasal spray 2 per day for 2 weeks.

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12 hours ago, AlanC said:

it went exactly as I thought it would.

 

 

Sorry it went so predictably bad.  Unforgivable obtuseness.

 

Responding to your earlier post about magnesium, I've had good results with magnesium glycinate and have been able to increase my dose slowly up to 100mg four times daily.  I had to start lower (50mg) due to the laxative effect, I was able over time to work up a bit and I do find it calming and helpful.  As always, start low and work up.

Gridley Introduction

 

Lexapro 20 mg since 2004.  Begin Brassmonkey Slide Taper Jan. 2017.   

End 2017 year 1 of taper at 9.25mg 

End 2018 year 2 of taper at 4.1mg

End 2019 year 3 of taper at 1.0mg  

Oct. 30, 2020  Jump to zero from 0.025mg.  Current dose: 0.000mg

3 year, 10 month taper is 100% complete.

 

Ativan 1 mg to 1.875mg 1986-2020, two CT's and reinstatements

Nov. 2020, 7-week Ativan-Valium crossover to 18.75mg Valium

Feb. 2021, begin 10%/4 week taper of 18.75mg Valium 

End 2021  year 1 of Valium taper at 6mg

End 2022 year 2 of Valium taper at 2.75mg 

End 2023 year 3 of Valium taper at 1mg

Jan. 24, 2024: Hold at 1mg and shift to Imipramine taper.

Taper is 95% complete.

 

Imipramine 75 mg daily since 1986.  Jan.-Sept. 2016 tapered to 14.4mg  

March 22, 2022: Begin 10%/4 week taper

Aug. 5, 2022: hold at 9.5mg and shift to Valium taper

Jan. 24, 2024: Resume Imipramine taper.  Current dose as of Feb. 22: 7.6mg

Taper is 90% complete.  

  

Supplements: multiple, quercetin, omega-3, vitamins C, E and D3, magnesium glycinate, probiotics, zinc, melatonin .3mg, anti-candida, iron, serrapeptase, nattokinase


I am not a medical professional and this is not medical advice but simply information based on my own experience, as well as other members who have survived these drugs.

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Sorry it went like that. I honestly do not understand the GPs' deal with ADs. I understand why psychiatrists might deny wd effects - it threatens their identity but the GPs? Also do not understand the desire to switch ADs - why not give you your previous one? If you did want to go back to the medicine, do you have old tablets that you can dissolve so you can get your 0.5 mg? Not suggesting that you should or should not reinstate but if you decided either way, would you be able to reinstate? In Spain you can get the pills without prescription. If you did reinstate and dissolved one 20 mg tablet, that'd last you for 40 days. 

 

I am reading the book "An anatomy of an epidemic" and it's making me angry. Not so much about what was done to me but what is still being done!

"Nothing so small as a moment is insurmountable, and moments are all that we have. You have survived every trial and tribulation that life has thrown at you up until this very instant. When future troubles come—and they will come—a version of you will be born into that moment that can conquer them, too." - Kevin Koenig 

 

I am not a doctor and this should not be considered medical advice. You can use the information and recommendations provided in whatever way you want and all decisions on your treatment are yours. 

 

In the next few weeks I do not have a lot of capacity to respond to questions. If you need a quick answer pls tag or ask other moderators who may want to be tagged. 

 

Aug  2000 - July 2003 (ct, 4-6 wk wd) , citalopram 20 mg,  xanax prn, wellbutrin for a few months, trazodone prn 

Dec 2004 - July 2018 citalopram 20 mg, xanax prn (rarely used)

Aug 2018 - citalopram 40 mg (self titrated up)

September 2018 - January 2019 tapered citalopram - 40/30/20/10/5 no issues until a week after reaching 0

Feb 2019 0.25 xanax - 0.5/day (3 weeks) over to klonopin 0.25 once a day to manage severe wd

March 6, reinstated citalopram 2.5 mg (liquid), klonopin 0.25 mg for sleep 2-3 times a week

Apr 1st citalopram 2.0 mg (liquid), klonopin 0.25 once a week (off by 4/14/19- no tapering)

citalopram (liquid) 4/14/19 -1.8 mg, 5/8/19 - 1.6 mg,  7/27/19 -1.5 mg,  8/15/19 - 1.35, 2/21/21 - 1.1 (smaller drops in between), 6/20/21 - 1.03 mg, 8/7/21- 1.025, 8/11/21 - 1.02, 8/15/21 - 1.015, 9/3/21 - 0.925 (fingers crossed!), 10/8/21 - 0.9, 10/18/21 - 0.875, 12/31/21 - 0.85, 1/7/22 - 0.825, 1/14/22 - 0.8, 1/22/22 - 0.785, 8/18/22 - 0.59, 12/15/2022 - 0.48, 2/15/22 - 0.43, 25/07/23 - 0.25 (mistake), 6/08/23 - 0.33mg

 

Supplements: magnesium citrate and bi-glycinate

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Gridley, thanks for the advice about the Magnesium. The morning anxiety is pretty much gone at the moment after I started taking 1000mg Vitamin C on an evening. I was really sceptical that it was helping at first, so when I ran out I didn't bother to get more. But within a couple of days I was waking up in terror again. So I re-started the Vitamin C, and the anxiety went away again. I'll give the Magnesium a try provided it doesn't upset my digestion: I'm a bit uncomfortable in that department as things are and I don't want to make it worse.

 

Onmyway, the whole thing was ridiculous. The doctor was in complete denial that the effect of the antidepressant withdrawal could last this long and, basically, wanted to do everything the Royal College of Psychiatrists have identified as the risks when withdrawal is misdiagnosed. She ended up accusing me of having an agenda and trying to manipulate her decision get what I wanted. She was genuinely angry about that, and it baffled me - is there a black market for Citalopram or something? Or maybe it's just that I'm not allowed to be involved in decisions about my care. 🙄

 

At any rate, this has cleared up the decision about what I'm going to do: I'm not reinstating.

 

Firstly because the moderators regard reinstatement this far out to have a very high risk of adverse reactions. I was willing to chance it because I'd been having an awful couple of days and would have done anything to make the anguish stop, but that's fading now and I'm realising the whole thing has been a string of bad decisions because I was so desperate. Plus the possibility of making things even worse isn't worth the risk. I keep thinking about what happened when I took the Mirtazapine; another reaction like that could see me on antipsychotics....

 

Secondly because I can't. At the end of the taper I took the remaining Citalopram back to the pharmacy for disposal.

 

I really wish I hadn't gone to see the doctor, but I can't turn the clock back now. So I put it down as another bad decision and try to move on.

1999 - 2001: Paroxetine 20mg, 2003: Venlafaxine 75mg, 2003 - 2014: Escitalopram 20mg

1999 - December 2017: Lansoprazole 15mg

2014 - December 2017: Citalopram 20mg

December 2017: Mirtazapine 30mg, stopped after 4 days due to immediate bad reaction, Zopiclone 3.75mg, stopped after 2 days due to immediate bad reaction

January 2018 - April 2018: Citalopram liquid, tapering, final dose 0.1mg

December 2018 onwards: Vitamin C 1000mg

October 2021: Loratadine 10mg for 6 days (23/10 to 28/10)

Long term (for asthma): Salbutamol and Salmeterol inhalers, Salmeterol stopped March 2021 due to migraine headaches

Occasional use for headaches: Paracetamol 40mg or Ibuprofen 40mg

4th December 2021: Eustachian tube infection: Amoxicillin 500mg 3 per day for 5 days, Dexamethasone & Neomycin ear spray 3 per day for 1 week, Beclometasone nasal spray 2 per day for 2 weeks.

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I read once that making a decision about a problem one faces relieves anxiety/depression partly. Making a decision about not reinstating might have helped too, though your symptoms are more physical it seems.

 

It boggles my mind how sensitized we are. When I reinstated at 2.5 even within a month my whole nausea ordeal started, though the reinstatement relieved the akathisia which I consider a beneficial trade but 7 months out the risks are probably much higher that you will get something worse. Regarding supplements, magnesium glycinate is supposed to be more tummy friendly. I have been taking quite a lot of it 550 mg a day and have had no significant issues but I don't have pre-existing issues in that dept so not sure how you'd react. Magnesium citrate did cause some issues if I can remember correctly. 

 

I am starting to have so much less respect for doctors. Mine also was angry that I was saying I had withdrawal effects this far out. It's as if I somehow wanted to injure him personally by having these symptoms. Why would I possibly want to do that? It is also distrurbing that they don't read literature and get offended when you point it out to  them. Sure, I understand you can't read everything but when I say it's in the Lancet, maybe show some interest in the findings. Or in your case the leaflet itself. I hope the memory of the encounter goes away soon. It was traumatic for me and I ruminated over it for a few days. 

 

Hope you have a long clear window soon.

"Nothing so small as a moment is insurmountable, and moments are all that we have. You have survived every trial and tribulation that life has thrown at you up until this very instant. When future troubles come—and they will come—a version of you will be born into that moment that can conquer them, too." - Kevin Koenig 

 

I am not a doctor and this should not be considered medical advice. You can use the information and recommendations provided in whatever way you want and all decisions on your treatment are yours. 

 

In the next few weeks I do not have a lot of capacity to respond to questions. If you need a quick answer pls tag or ask other moderators who may want to be tagged. 

 

Aug  2000 - July 2003 (ct, 4-6 wk wd) , citalopram 20 mg,  xanax prn, wellbutrin for a few months, trazodone prn 

Dec 2004 - July 2018 citalopram 20 mg, xanax prn (rarely used)

Aug 2018 - citalopram 40 mg (self titrated up)

September 2018 - January 2019 tapered citalopram - 40/30/20/10/5 no issues until a week after reaching 0

Feb 2019 0.25 xanax - 0.5/day (3 weeks) over to klonopin 0.25 once a day to manage severe wd

March 6, reinstated citalopram 2.5 mg (liquid), klonopin 0.25 mg for sleep 2-3 times a week

Apr 1st citalopram 2.0 mg (liquid), klonopin 0.25 once a week (off by 4/14/19- no tapering)

citalopram (liquid) 4/14/19 -1.8 mg, 5/8/19 - 1.6 mg,  7/27/19 -1.5 mg,  8/15/19 - 1.35, 2/21/21 - 1.1 (smaller drops in between), 6/20/21 - 1.03 mg, 8/7/21- 1.025, 8/11/21 - 1.02, 8/15/21 - 1.015, 9/3/21 - 0.925 (fingers crossed!), 10/8/21 - 0.9, 10/18/21 - 0.875, 12/31/21 - 0.85, 1/7/22 - 0.825, 1/14/22 - 0.8, 1/22/22 - 0.785, 8/18/22 - 0.59, 12/15/2022 - 0.48, 2/15/22 - 0.43, 25/07/23 - 0.25 (mistake), 6/08/23 - 0.33mg

 

Supplements: magnesium citrate and bi-glycinate

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  • 3 weeks later...

So today has brought an "interesting" new symptom: kaleidoscope vision.

 

It started second time I woke up this morning. Zigzag rainbow distortions around the outside of my vision. At first I thought it was because I’d been sleeping with my left eye pressed against the pillow, but it went on far too long for the sort of after-images pressure against your eye causes.

 

Then it came back late morning while I was sitting in the lounge: a circular area in the centre of my vision with a bright, zigzag rainbow border that slowly changed to a crescent on the left side. It wasn’t specific to one eye - I could see it exactly the same with my left or right eye closed. It distorted everything so badly I couldn’t read. After half an hour or so it faded away leaving me with a painful headache.

 

Since there are no other symptoms to suggest anything serious like a TIA I guess my brain has decided it’s time to do a little re-wiring of my visual cortex. Or maybe it’s a return of the migraine headaches I suffered 15-20 years ago. Either way I hope this isn’t going to become a regular thing because it’s very disconcerting.

1999 - 2001: Paroxetine 20mg, 2003: Venlafaxine 75mg, 2003 - 2014: Escitalopram 20mg

1999 - December 2017: Lansoprazole 15mg

2014 - December 2017: Citalopram 20mg

December 2017: Mirtazapine 30mg, stopped after 4 days due to immediate bad reaction, Zopiclone 3.75mg, stopped after 2 days due to immediate bad reaction

January 2018 - April 2018: Citalopram liquid, tapering, final dose 0.1mg

December 2018 onwards: Vitamin C 1000mg

October 2021: Loratadine 10mg for 6 days (23/10 to 28/10)

Long term (for asthma): Salbutamol and Salmeterol inhalers, Salmeterol stopped March 2021 due to migraine headaches

Occasional use for headaches: Paracetamol 40mg or Ibuprofen 40mg

4th December 2021: Eustachian tube infection: Amoxicillin 500mg 3 per day for 5 days, Dexamethasone & Neomycin ear spray 3 per day for 1 week, Beclometasone nasal spray 2 per day for 2 weeks.

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It's called a visual migraine. I get them every once in a while.  I haven't been able to tie them directly to ADWD.  They are a spontaneous over stimulation of the visual cortex of the brain. Doctors have even been able to image them with MRIs.  From everything I've read they are not dangerous, except if you try to drive or the like. They are just a pain for a while.  Sorry to hear that it ended up in a full blown migraine, they usually don't do that, but it does happen.  The first few I had did and then it stopped and all I got was the light show.  I have been able to tie mine to being a stress reaction but haven't worked out any triggers or presymptoms.

 

They frequently start as a bright spot in the middle of your vision and slowly grow until they pass out the sides.  In general they take 20 to 30 minutes to complete. They can cause a lot of stress and leave you with a "hangover" for several hours, and in some cases a really bad headache.  There isn't much that can be done about them.  Mainly relax, let them happen and then get back to what you were doing. Tylenol for the headache might help.

20 years on Paxil starting at 20mg and working up to 40mg. Sept 2011 started 10% every 6 weeks taper (2.5% every week for 4 weeks then hold for 2 additional weeks), currently at 7.9mg. Oct 2011 CTed 15oz vodka a night, to only drinking 2 beers most nights, totally sober Feb 2013.

Since I wrote this I have continued to decrease my dose by 10% every 6 weeks (2.5% every week for 4 weeks and then hold for an additional 2 weeks). I added in an extra 6 week hold when I hit 10mg to let things settle out even more. When I hit 3mgpw it became hard to split the drop into 4 parts so I switched to dropping 1mgpw (pill weight) every week for 3 weeks and then holding for another 3 weeks.  The 3 + 3 schedule turned out to be too harsh so I cut back to dropping 1mgpw every 4 weeks which is working better.

Final Dose 0.016mg.     Current dose 0.000mg 04-15-2017

 

"It's also important not to become angry, no matter how difficult life is, because you can loose all hope if you can't laugh at yourself and at life in general."  Stephen Hawking

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24 minutes ago, brassmonkey said:

They frequently start as a bright spot in the middle of your vision and slowly grow until they pass out the sides.  In general they take 20 to 30 minutes to complete.

 

That's it exactly. Very, very weird, like there's something invisible floating in front of your eyes that's refracting the light into jagged rainbows. Straight out of some bizarre sci-fi story.

 

Sorry to hear you get them as well, but it's reassuring to know what they are and that, generally, they don't continue into a full on migraine headache like the second one did. But the thought of having one while driving is scary; the only thing you could do would be to stop as soon as possible and wait for it to end.

1999 - 2001: Paroxetine 20mg, 2003: Venlafaxine 75mg, 2003 - 2014: Escitalopram 20mg

1999 - December 2017: Lansoprazole 15mg

2014 - December 2017: Citalopram 20mg

December 2017: Mirtazapine 30mg, stopped after 4 days due to immediate bad reaction, Zopiclone 3.75mg, stopped after 2 days due to immediate bad reaction

January 2018 - April 2018: Citalopram liquid, tapering, final dose 0.1mg

December 2018 onwards: Vitamin C 1000mg

October 2021: Loratadine 10mg for 6 days (23/10 to 28/10)

Long term (for asthma): Salbutamol and Salmeterol inhalers, Salmeterol stopped March 2021 due to migraine headaches

Occasional use for headaches: Paracetamol 40mg or Ibuprofen 40mg

4th December 2021: Eustachian tube infection: Amoxicillin 500mg 3 per day for 5 days, Dexamethasone & Neomycin ear spray 3 per day for 1 week, Beclometasone nasal spray 2 per day for 2 weeks.

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  • Moderator

Have the migraines gotten better, Alan? How about the dizziness? Hope you are doing well. 

"Nothing so small as a moment is insurmountable, and moments are all that we have. You have survived every trial and tribulation that life has thrown at you up until this very instant. When future troubles come—and they will come—a version of you will be born into that moment that can conquer them, too." - Kevin Koenig 

 

I am not a doctor and this should not be considered medical advice. You can use the information and recommendations provided in whatever way you want and all decisions on your treatment are yours. 

 

In the next few weeks I do not have a lot of capacity to respond to questions. If you need a quick answer pls tag or ask other moderators who may want to be tagged. 

 

Aug  2000 - July 2003 (ct, 4-6 wk wd) , citalopram 20 mg,  xanax prn, wellbutrin for a few months, trazodone prn 

Dec 2004 - July 2018 citalopram 20 mg, xanax prn (rarely used)

Aug 2018 - citalopram 40 mg (self titrated up)

September 2018 - January 2019 tapered citalopram - 40/30/20/10/5 no issues until a week after reaching 0

Feb 2019 0.25 xanax - 0.5/day (3 weeks) over to klonopin 0.25 once a day to manage severe wd

March 6, reinstated citalopram 2.5 mg (liquid), klonopin 0.25 mg for sleep 2-3 times a week

Apr 1st citalopram 2.0 mg (liquid), klonopin 0.25 once a week (off by 4/14/19- no tapering)

citalopram (liquid) 4/14/19 -1.8 mg, 5/8/19 - 1.6 mg,  7/27/19 -1.5 mg,  8/15/19 - 1.35, 2/21/21 - 1.1 (smaller drops in between), 6/20/21 - 1.03 mg, 8/7/21- 1.025, 8/11/21 - 1.02, 8/15/21 - 1.015, 9/3/21 - 0.925 (fingers crossed!), 10/8/21 - 0.9, 10/18/21 - 0.875, 12/31/21 - 0.85, 1/7/22 - 0.825, 1/14/22 - 0.8, 1/22/22 - 0.785, 8/18/22 - 0.59, 12/15/2022 - 0.48, 2/15/22 - 0.43, 25/07/23 - 0.25 (mistake), 6/08/23 - 0.33mg

 

Supplements: magnesium citrate and bi-glycinate

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On 7/14/2019 at 12:16 AM, brassmonkey said:

It's called a visual migraine. I get them every once in a while.  I haven't been able to tie them directly to ADWD.  They are a spontaneous over stimulation of the visual cortex of the brain. Doctors have even been able to image them with MRIs.  From everything I've read they are not dangerous, except if you try to drive or the like. They are just a pain for a while.  Sorry to hear that it ended up in a full blown migraine, they usually don't do that, but it does happen.  The first few I had did and then it stopped and all I got was the light show.  I have been able to tie mine to being a stress reaction but haven't worked out any triggers or presymptoms.

 

They frequently start as a bright spot in the middle of your vision and slowly grow until they pass out the sides.  In general they take 20 to 30 minutes to complete. They can cause a lot of stress and leave you with a "hangover" for several hours, and in some cases a really bad headache.  There isn't much that can be done about them.  Mainly relax, let them happen and then get back to what you were doing. Tylenol for the headache might help.

Can you please share other details of Visual problems with depressants or WD.

Recently I've noticed a serious blurring of vision, which has even impeded my reading, whether in print or on paper. 

 

I attributed that to glaucoma, which I suffer from. I do have an appointment with the ophthalmologist next week, but the post above got me wondering.

2012- Citalopram 40- Axal 0.5mg  2017- Stopped Axal CT. No WD.

2017 - Effexor XR 75 mg.

For Epilepsy:1983 - Tegral 400 mg/day  2009 - Lumark 1000 mg/day- Biotim eyedrops for glaucoma.

27 April 2019 - Effexor XR taper started. 40 beads removed - 16% - 63mg20 May - 10% - 20 beads. 57mg / 3 June - 10% - 20 beads - 51mg / 18 July - 6% -10 beads - 48mg / 20 July - 7% -10 beads- 44.5mg/ 1 Sept - 75 mg alternate days = 37.5 mg/ 14 Sept - 75 mg every 3rd day = 25mg/  22 Sept - Effexor XR stopped.

27 Oct - Tegral = 300mg. Citalopram = 30 mg. Lumark = 500mg Busron = 10 mg. Somna = 2.5 mg

1-Jan 2020 Tegral 200mg BD- Citalopram 20mg OD- Lumark 500BD

25 Apr 2020 Tegral 200 mg BD- Citalopram alternate days 20 mg and 10 mg OD - Lumark 500BD

May June 2020 Dropped to 10 mg citalopram due to drug shortages.

Early July 2020: CT'ed citalopram - nonavailability of medicine. Tegral + Lumark remains same as before.

 

 

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  • Moderator

Blurry vision is a very common problem when tapering ADs.  The best way to get more information would be to type "vision" into the search box at the top right of the screen, you will get many pages of posts that talk about it.

20 years on Paxil starting at 20mg and working up to 40mg. Sept 2011 started 10% every 6 weeks taper (2.5% every week for 4 weeks then hold for 2 additional weeks), currently at 7.9mg. Oct 2011 CTed 15oz vodka a night, to only drinking 2 beers most nights, totally sober Feb 2013.

Since I wrote this I have continued to decrease my dose by 10% every 6 weeks (2.5% every week for 4 weeks and then hold for an additional 2 weeks). I added in an extra 6 week hold when I hit 10mg to let things settle out even more. When I hit 3mgpw it became hard to split the drop into 4 parts so I switched to dropping 1mgpw (pill weight) every week for 3 weeks and then holding for another 3 weeks.  The 3 + 3 schedule turned out to be too harsh so I cut back to dropping 1mgpw every 4 weeks which is working better.

Final Dose 0.016mg.     Current dose 0.000mg 04-15-2017

 

"It's also important not to become angry, no matter how difficult life is, because you can loose all hope if you can't laugh at yourself and at life in general."  Stephen Hawking

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17 hours ago, Onmyway said:

Have the migraines gotten better, Alan? How about the dizziness? Hope you are doing well. 

 

I haven't had another visual migraine, thank goodness, but a stressful situation on Friday definitely acted as a trigger for a normal one. It also sent my emotions out of control and I had to walk away from the cause. Unfortunately I'm going to have to deal with the people concerned on Monday and I'm not looking forward to it.

 

Anything that provokes any sort of negative emotion (like anger, fear or despair) in me triggers a massively out of proportion response, and I end up feeling horrible self-loathing over the fact I react so badly. It's very hard to deal with.

 

As to the rest, it just drags on and on. Since early February I've had one four-day window where I felt perhaps two-thirds of normal. The rest of the time the symptoms vary to a degree (I'm not suffering too badly with the dizziness at the moment, for example) but overall they remain at the sort of level where I'm just about able to look after myself but nothing more.

 

Sorry about the moan, and thanks for your kind words; I really hope everything is improving for you.

1999 - 2001: Paroxetine 20mg, 2003: Venlafaxine 75mg, 2003 - 2014: Escitalopram 20mg

1999 - December 2017: Lansoprazole 15mg

2014 - December 2017: Citalopram 20mg

December 2017: Mirtazapine 30mg, stopped after 4 days due to immediate bad reaction, Zopiclone 3.75mg, stopped after 2 days due to immediate bad reaction

January 2018 - April 2018: Citalopram liquid, tapering, final dose 0.1mg

December 2018 onwards: Vitamin C 1000mg

October 2021: Loratadine 10mg for 6 days (23/10 to 28/10)

Long term (for asthma): Salbutamol and Salmeterol inhalers, Salmeterol stopped March 2021 due to migraine headaches

Occasional use for headaches: Paracetamol 40mg or Ibuprofen 40mg

4th December 2021: Eustachian tube infection: Amoxicillin 500mg 3 per day for 5 days, Dexamethasone & Neomycin ear spray 3 per day for 1 week, Beclometasone nasal spray 2 per day for 2 weeks.

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Completely understand about the spirals. I have been dealing with them too. Last week was awful - I was wound up in a right spiral of anxiety/anger/exhaustion/agitation and self-loathing all at the same time. By the evening I was so exhausted I felt like I had carried a ton of bricks. I am very slightly better now as I basically had to let go but I feel like I am vigilant to avoid triggers all the time and that takes a lot of energy and results in exhaustion. Same here about the window - I had a short one, similar to yours and then things got bad again. They are not worse than Feb for sure but they are different so hard to compare. 

 

How are you handling the heat wave? What things do you do that give you joy? 

 

By the way, not sure if it is available in your area but if you can do CBT, that might be helpful. After a 4 month waiting period I finally am getting some and it's helpful to get me from some of the spirals though it can be triggering as well. Maybe inquiring might help? 

"Nothing so small as a moment is insurmountable, and moments are all that we have. You have survived every trial and tribulation that life has thrown at you up until this very instant. When future troubles come—and they will come—a version of you will be born into that moment that can conquer them, too." - Kevin Koenig 

 

I am not a doctor and this should not be considered medical advice. You can use the information and recommendations provided in whatever way you want and all decisions on your treatment are yours. 

 

In the next few weeks I do not have a lot of capacity to respond to questions. If you need a quick answer pls tag or ask other moderators who may want to be tagged. 

 

Aug  2000 - July 2003 (ct, 4-6 wk wd) , citalopram 20 mg,  xanax prn, wellbutrin for a few months, trazodone prn 

Dec 2004 - July 2018 citalopram 20 mg, xanax prn (rarely used)

Aug 2018 - citalopram 40 mg (self titrated up)

September 2018 - January 2019 tapered citalopram - 40/30/20/10/5 no issues until a week after reaching 0

Feb 2019 0.25 xanax - 0.5/day (3 weeks) over to klonopin 0.25 once a day to manage severe wd

March 6, reinstated citalopram 2.5 mg (liquid), klonopin 0.25 mg for sleep 2-3 times a week

Apr 1st citalopram 2.0 mg (liquid), klonopin 0.25 once a week (off by 4/14/19- no tapering)

citalopram (liquid) 4/14/19 -1.8 mg, 5/8/19 - 1.6 mg,  7/27/19 -1.5 mg,  8/15/19 - 1.35, 2/21/21 - 1.1 (smaller drops in between), 6/20/21 - 1.03 mg, 8/7/21- 1.025, 8/11/21 - 1.02, 8/15/21 - 1.015, 9/3/21 - 0.925 (fingers crossed!), 10/8/21 - 0.9, 10/18/21 - 0.875, 12/31/21 - 0.85, 1/7/22 - 0.825, 1/14/22 - 0.8, 1/22/22 - 0.785, 8/18/22 - 0.59, 12/15/2022 - 0.48, 2/15/22 - 0.43, 25/07/23 - 0.25 (mistake), 6/08/23 - 0.33mg

 

Supplements: magnesium citrate and bi-glycinate

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On 7/21/2019 at 1:26 PM, AlanC said:

 

I haven't had another visual migraine, thank goodness, but a stressful situation on Friday definitely acted as a trigger for a normal one. It also sent my emotions out of control and I had to walk away from the cause. Unfortunately I'm going to have to deal with the people concerned on Monday and I'm not looking forward to it.

 

Anything that provokes any sort of negative emotion (like anger, fear or despair) in me triggers a massively out of proportion response, and I end up feeling horrible self-loathing over the fact I react so badly. It's very hard to deal with.

 

As to the rest, it just drags on and on. Since early February I've had one four-day window where I felt perhaps two-thirds of normal. The rest of the time the symptoms vary to a degree (I'm not suffering too badly with the dizziness at the moment, for example) but overall they remain at the sort of level where I'm just about able to look after myself but nothing more.

 

Sorry about the moan, and thanks for your kind words; I really hope everything is improving for you.

Hi there we have really similar stories. Same drug, timeline and symptoms and tapering length of time. PM me if you need to I am currently in a severe wave and about to lose everything 

April 2011 - citalopram 20 mg

April 2018 - tapered in 4 weeks

Nov 2018 - reinstated 20 mg

Stopped 8 days later bad reaction

November 5 2020 - reinstated citalopram 0.5mg. Increase to 1mg

November 10 2020 - stopped citalopram.  

December 8 2020 - reinstate 2.5mg citalopram. Stayed on until December 17

December 20 2020 - discontinue citalopram again 

Dec 2020 - start ativan for akathisia 

Nov 2020 to Jan 2021 - tried low dose Seroquel, Risperidone, Luvox, Zoloft and Prozac. just added symptoms no benefit

Feb 2021 - ativan went paradoxical. landed in hospital. cold turkeyed.

Totally drug free since Feb 21, 2021

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  • 3 weeks later...
  • Moderator

Hi Alan, haven't seen any posts and just wanted to chek how you are doing. Hope you are getting better! 

 

"Nothing so small as a moment is insurmountable, and moments are all that we have. You have survived every trial and tribulation that life has thrown at you up until this very instant. When future troubles come—and they will come—a version of you will be born into that moment that can conquer them, too." - Kevin Koenig 

 

I am not a doctor and this should not be considered medical advice. You can use the information and recommendations provided in whatever way you want and all decisions on your treatment are yours. 

 

In the next few weeks I do not have a lot of capacity to respond to questions. If you need a quick answer pls tag or ask other moderators who may want to be tagged. 

 

Aug  2000 - July 2003 (ct, 4-6 wk wd) , citalopram 20 mg,  xanax prn, wellbutrin for a few months, trazodone prn 

Dec 2004 - July 2018 citalopram 20 mg, xanax prn (rarely used)

Aug 2018 - citalopram 40 mg (self titrated up)

September 2018 - January 2019 tapered citalopram - 40/30/20/10/5 no issues until a week after reaching 0

Feb 2019 0.25 xanax - 0.5/day (3 weeks) over to klonopin 0.25 once a day to manage severe wd

March 6, reinstated citalopram 2.5 mg (liquid), klonopin 0.25 mg for sleep 2-3 times a week

Apr 1st citalopram 2.0 mg (liquid), klonopin 0.25 once a week (off by 4/14/19- no tapering)

citalopram (liquid) 4/14/19 -1.8 mg, 5/8/19 - 1.6 mg,  7/27/19 -1.5 mg,  8/15/19 - 1.35, 2/21/21 - 1.1 (smaller drops in between), 6/20/21 - 1.03 mg, 8/7/21- 1.025, 8/11/21 - 1.02, 8/15/21 - 1.015, 9/3/21 - 0.925 (fingers crossed!), 10/8/21 - 0.9, 10/18/21 - 0.875, 12/31/21 - 0.85, 1/7/22 - 0.825, 1/14/22 - 0.8, 1/22/22 - 0.785, 8/18/22 - 0.59, 12/15/2022 - 0.48, 2/15/22 - 0.43, 25/07/23 - 0.25 (mistake), 6/08/23 - 0.33mg

 

Supplements: magnesium citrate and bi-glycinate

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  • ChessieCat changed the title to AlanC: one year on from stopping Celexa / citalopram too quickly
  • 11 months later...
  • Moderator Emeritus

It's difficult to see from your drug signature whether you are currently taking any psychiatric drug/s or whether you stopped.

 

It is easier for the mods to see your drug history at a glance in your drug signature.

 

December 2017: Mirtazapine 30mg

December 2017: Zopiclone 3.75mg

January 2018 - April 2018: Citalopram liquid, tapering

 

If you are still taking Mirtazapine and Zopiclone please put December 2017 - current

 

If you have stopped Citalopram please add the last dose you took before going to 0mg.

 

If you are still on Citalopram please provide details of your taper, ie. dates & doses, for 2020.

 

Thank you.

* NO LONGER ACTIVE on SA *

MISSION ACCOMPLISHED:  (6 year taper)      0mg Pristiq  on 13th November 2021

ADs since ~1992:  25+ years - 1 unknown, Prozac (muscle weakness), Zoloft; citalopram (pooped out) CTed (very sick for 2.5 wks a few months after); Pristiq:  50mg 2012, 100mg beg 2013 (Serotonin Toxicity)  Tapering from Oct 2015 - 13 Nov 2021   LAST DOSE 0.0025mg

Post 0 updates start here    My tapering program     My Intro (goes to tapering graph)

 VIDEO:   Antidepressant Withdrawal Syndrome and its Management

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  • Moderator Emeritus

This topic was recently updated.  I suggest that you read all the relevant sub topics.  There are links to them in Post #1.

 

are-we-there-yet-how-long-is-withdrawal-going-to-take

 

Edited by ChessieCat

* NO LONGER ACTIVE on SA *

MISSION ACCOMPLISHED:  (6 year taper)      0mg Pristiq  on 13th November 2021

ADs since ~1992:  25+ years - 1 unknown, Prozac (muscle weakness), Zoloft; citalopram (pooped out) CTed (very sick for 2.5 wks a few months after); Pristiq:  50mg 2012, 100mg beg 2013 (Serotonin Toxicity)  Tapering from Oct 2015 - 13 Nov 2021   LAST DOSE 0.0025mg

Post 0 updates start here    My tapering program     My Intro (goes to tapering graph)

 VIDEO:   Antidepressant Withdrawal Syndrome and its Management

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  • Moderator Emeritus

Member posted this elsewhere:

 

  

2 hours ago, AlanC said:

So it seems I may have had COVID-19.

 

My brother’s eldest daughter is a pharmacist at one of the UK’s largest hospitals. The hospital have been giving all their staff antibody tests; she had hers last week and it came back positive.

 

We’re pretty sure we know when it happened. Just before the UK went into lockdown (late March) her younger daughter had a bad cough / sore throat / mild temperature that progressed to swollen lymph nodes. As a result my niece was told by the hospital to self-isolate for two weeks; during that time she got it, as did her other daughter. None of them got particularly ill.

 

My brother and his wife usually take their two granddaughters to/from school and look after them until their mum finishes work. As a result they, and their other daughter, all got it: my brother had a slight sore throat, but his wife got it far more badly: it left her bed-bound for three days.

 

And I got it from my brother when he came to visit while his wife was ill. We had no idea what it was: at the time the UK government were saying the symptoms were a continuous cough / high fever / breathing difficulties. I coughed a fair amount for 3 days, had a temperature of about 99.5F and then got what felt like a mild asthma attack that went on for another 5 days and that wouldn’t respond to my reliever inhaler. If it hadn’t been for that last and the fact my niece has antibodies for COVID-19 I’d have dismissed the whole thing.

 

By mid April I’d recovered and was actually feeling better than I had in a long time but then, at the start of June, what felt like the worst wave ever started and has continued ever since. I’m tired all the time. I go out to do food shopping and it wipes me out for days. Even something as simple as changing the bedding leaves me tired - I have to stop for a rest half-way through.

 

I really don’t know what’s going on. Was the odd illness that went through my brother’s family COVID-19, or did my niece get the supposedly common symptomless version at some other time? Working at a hospital that deals with COVID-19 patients would certainly put her at risk. Is what’s happening to me now some sort of chronic fatigue triggered by the infection? If it is, why the odd delay before it started?

 

* NO LONGER ACTIVE on SA *

MISSION ACCOMPLISHED:  (6 year taper)      0mg Pristiq  on 13th November 2021

ADs since ~1992:  25+ years - 1 unknown, Prozac (muscle weakness), Zoloft; citalopram (pooped out) CTed (very sick for 2.5 wks a few months after); Pristiq:  50mg 2012, 100mg beg 2013 (Serotonin Toxicity)  Tapering from Oct 2015 - 13 Nov 2021   LAST DOSE 0.0025mg

Post 0 updates start here    My tapering program     My Intro (goes to tapering graph)

 VIDEO:   Antidepressant Withdrawal Syndrome and its Management

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On 8/7/2020 at 12:33 AM, ChessieCat said:

It's difficult to see from your drug signature whether you are currently taking any psychiatric drug/s or whether you stopped.

 

It is easier for the mods to see your drug history at a glance in your drug signature.

 

December 2017: Mirtazapine 30mg

December 2017: Zopiclone 3.75mg

January 2018 - April 2018: Citalopram liquid, tapering

 

If you are still taking Mirtazapine and Zopiclone please put December 2017 - current

 

If you have stopped Citalopram please add the last dose you took before going to 0mg.

 

If you are still on Citalopram please provide details of your taper, ie. dates & doses, for 2020.

 

Thank you.

 

Hello Chessie,

 

Nothing has changed. The various treatments stopped on the dates specified in my signature and I haven't taken any form of psychiatric drugs since. My GP's, unfortunately, flat out refuse to acknowledge any possibility that I could be suffering from withdrawal and want to put me back on a larger dose of an even stronger antidepressant.

 

Over the last year the symptoms have shifted somewhat: the early morning anxiety has faded and I no longer need to black out my bedroom, but the problems with negative emotions have become significantly worse. The dizziness comes and goes over a period of weeks or months: it can be quite severe at times.

 

There was a period starting late April through to the end of May this year (2020) where I had a long window and was feeling considerably better than I've done at any point since stopping the Citalopram in April 2018. Past experience made me very cautious of taking advantage of this, though, since previous experience has shown that becoming more active during a window results in a harder crash when the next wave starts. It may be that the gradual build up that I was attempting has been the cause of the fatigue I've suffered since the latest wave started.

 

I haven't been posting here over the last year because nothing significant has been happening. Since I'm no longer taking any form of psychiatric drugs and have been able to manage the emotional problems to a degree where I can present a reasonable "face" to the outside world it seemed best to step away.

 

But the possible COVID-19 infection together with the uncertainty that has brought has proved very difficult to deal with; being able to discuss it with others who are also going through antidepressant withdrawal has helped.

1999 - 2001: Paroxetine 20mg, 2003: Venlafaxine 75mg, 2003 - 2014: Escitalopram 20mg

1999 - December 2017: Lansoprazole 15mg

2014 - December 2017: Citalopram 20mg

December 2017: Mirtazapine 30mg, stopped after 4 days due to immediate bad reaction, Zopiclone 3.75mg, stopped after 2 days due to immediate bad reaction

January 2018 - April 2018: Citalopram liquid, tapering, final dose 0.1mg

December 2018 onwards: Vitamin C 1000mg

October 2021: Loratadine 10mg for 6 days (23/10 to 28/10)

Long term (for asthma): Salbutamol and Salmeterol inhalers, Salmeterol stopped March 2021 due to migraine headaches

Occasional use for headaches: Paracetamol 40mg or Ibuprofen 40mg

4th December 2021: Eustachian tube infection: Amoxicillin 500mg 3 per day for 5 days, Dexamethasone & Neomycin ear spray 3 per day for 1 week, Beclometasone nasal spray 2 per day for 2 weeks.

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  • 4 months later...

It’s been a while since I last posted, so here’s an update:

 

There have been no changes to my medication history. I remain off all psychiatric drugs and am only using my asthma inhalers and occasionally (once or twice a month at most) paracetamol or ibuprofen for headaches. @ChessieCat I’m afraid that after 2.75 years I can’t remember the last dose of Citalopram liquid; it was very low, though, probably 0.1mg. I've updated my signature to, hopefully, make my current status clearer.

 

Nothing much changed during the period between my last post in August and late November. The migraine headaches occurred once or twice a month. They were very rarely preceded by a visual migraine: I had perhaps two over this period. The early morning anxiety has never returned and I remain able to sleep without the need to black out my bedroom window. One new symptom that developed was my nose and mouth going very dry while I sleep, presumably because I’m sleeping with my mouth open for some reason. The dry nose can be quite unpleasant since it tends to bleed. I was able to walk a considerable amount with no return of the dizziness although I would get tired rather more easily. Another new symptom was that any form of exertion makes me sweat far more than I used to.

 

Late November saw the return of the brain zaps, dizziness, a constant headache and brain fog, and these have continued to date. The zaps are present at a low level all the time but can be triggered by moving my eyes or turning my head quickly. The dizziness is also always present but varies in intensity on a daily basis: at its worst it's bad enough to make me clumsy, but not bad enough to demand use of a walking stick when I'm outside as it did previously. If the zaps occur during a more serious bout of dizziness the result will make me stagger, although I’ve had no falls. The brain fog is a serious problem: it’s extremely difficult to concentrate and I’m barely able to work.

 

Life at the moment sees me able to do little more than looking after myself and trying to keep going with my work as a software developer, something that can be very frustrating because the brain fog often sees me making no progress or even messing up parts of an application I’ve previously written so I have to discard the day’s work and return to a previous version.

 

I know this is just another wave and that it’ll pass in due course but, rather like a bout of depression, it feels like I’ve been stuck in it forever and it’s never going to go away.

1999 - 2001: Paroxetine 20mg, 2003: Venlafaxine 75mg, 2003 - 2014: Escitalopram 20mg

1999 - December 2017: Lansoprazole 15mg

2014 - December 2017: Citalopram 20mg

December 2017: Mirtazapine 30mg, stopped after 4 days due to immediate bad reaction, Zopiclone 3.75mg, stopped after 2 days due to immediate bad reaction

January 2018 - April 2018: Citalopram liquid, tapering, final dose 0.1mg

December 2018 onwards: Vitamin C 1000mg

October 2021: Loratadine 10mg for 6 days (23/10 to 28/10)

Long term (for asthma): Salbutamol and Salmeterol inhalers, Salmeterol stopped March 2021 due to migraine headaches

Occasional use for headaches: Paracetamol 40mg or Ibuprofen 40mg

4th December 2021: Eustachian tube infection: Amoxicillin 500mg 3 per day for 5 days, Dexamethasone & Neomycin ear spray 3 per day for 1 week, Beclometasone nasal spray 2 per day for 2 weeks.

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Hi Alan,

 

Sorry to hear you're still getting hit with it. Blows me away what these drugs are capable of doing to people. Keep at it, sounds like you've got a good mindset given the situation.

Started Lexapro 5mg Mid March 2020

Came off Completely September 2020

Hospitalised september 2021

Slowly worked up to 50mg lamictal and 60mg Prozac

reduced to 20mg Prozac September 2021

Holding 20mg Prozac and 50mg Lamictal for a good while to stabilise. November 2021

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Coming back after around four months I see my thread has been tagged with PAWS, or Post Acute Withdrawal Syndrome, also known as PWS, or Protracted Withdrawal Syndrome.

 

There’s a post on the “From journals and scientific sources” forum, “Hengartner, 2020: Protracted withdrawal syndrome after stopping antidepressants: a descriptive quantitative analysis of consumer narratives from a large internet forum” that represents the largest survey of established cases of PWS to date, based on the experiences of members of this forum.

 

It’s striking to see this information gathered together, to see the experiences of others so closely match what’s been happening to me and, as I commented on that thread, it confirms that Altostrata and the moderators have been doing a remarkable job of identifying the various ways withdrawal from antidepressants can progress.

 

Regarding the paper itself I found the contents to be more than a little alarming, especially the sections relating to reinstatement and the possible outcomes of taking drugs that affect the serotonin receptors. On the other hand it’s a major step forward that this information is now out there with a significant researcher in the field, Dr Michael Hengartner, saying that yes, this is real, it is a problem, and that doctors need to be aware of the possibility and recognise it.

 

A big thank you to Altostrata and the moderators for this one.

1999 - 2001: Paroxetine 20mg, 2003: Venlafaxine 75mg, 2003 - 2014: Escitalopram 20mg

1999 - December 2017: Lansoprazole 15mg

2014 - December 2017: Citalopram 20mg

December 2017: Mirtazapine 30mg, stopped after 4 days due to immediate bad reaction, Zopiclone 3.75mg, stopped after 2 days due to immediate bad reaction

January 2018 - April 2018: Citalopram liquid, tapering, final dose 0.1mg

December 2018 onwards: Vitamin C 1000mg

October 2021: Loratadine 10mg for 6 days (23/10 to 28/10)

Long term (for asthma): Salbutamol and Salmeterol inhalers, Salmeterol stopped March 2021 due to migraine headaches

Occasional use for headaches: Paracetamol 40mg or Ibuprofen 40mg

4th December 2021: Eustachian tube infection: Amoxicillin 500mg 3 per day for 5 days, Dexamethasone & Neomycin ear spray 3 per day for 1 week, Beclometasone nasal spray 2 per day for 2 weeks.

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  • 1 month later...
  • Mentor
On 13/7/2019 at 15:18, AlanC said:

Così oggi ha portato un nuovo sintomo "interessante": la visione caleidoscopica.

 

È iniziata la seconda volta che mi sono svegliato questa mattina. Distorsioni arcobaleno a zigzag intorno alla parte esterna della mia vista. All'inizio ho pensato che fosse perché avevo dormito con l'occhio sinistro premuto contro il cuscino, ma è durato troppo a lungo per il tipo di pressione delle immagini residue contro i tuoi occhi.

 

Poi è tornato in tarda mattinata mentre ero seduto nel salone: un'area circolare al centro della mia visione con un bordo arcobaleno luminoso a zigzag che lentamente si è trasformato in una mezzaluna sul lato sinistro. Non era specifico per un occhio: potevo vederlo esattamente allo stesso modo con l'occhio sinistro o destro chiuso. Ha distorto tutto così gravemente che non riuscivo a leggere. Dopo mezz'ora o giù di lì svanì lasciandomi con un doloroso mal di testa

Hey @AlanC, I don't know how to thank you for this description... It happened to me yesterday evening... I supposed it was WD but I was quite scared... It seems transitory phenomena... I hope so... Now, how do you feel? 

Citalopram sucks!

July 2015: the 20mg citalopram for great stress begins

After two years I start tapering (slow but without medical advice) and I guess wrongly. First up to 10 mg, then 5 mg and 2 mg (liquid solution) and skips

January 2020 (I don't remember exactly the day): off citalopram (last dose 2mg).

June 2020: adrenal crash. The beginning of Hell on Earth

 

Current supplement:

- saffron pill (20 mg) + vit. E, omega 3 (EPA + DHA) 2g, magnesium bisglycinate 300 mg, iron , vitamin D3 (2500ui) +K7 (50 ui), vitamin C (1g) + quercitin (25 mg), theanine (as necessary).

 

Try meditating / mindfulness, walking every day, CBT/ACT, massage.

 

"E quindi uscimmo a riveder le stelle" ("And so we went out to see the stars again")

(Dante Alighieri, Divine Comedy , Inferno, XXXIV, 139)

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This is not going well.

 

There have been no changes to my medication. I remain off all psychiatric drugs and am only using my asthma inhalers and, occasionally, paracetamol to deal with headaches.

 

On 29th October 2020 I had what felt like a bad wave with a major increase in the symptoms that have troubled me from the start: brain zaps, dizziness and headaches. It reached a peak over the next ten days then faded, but from that point on my normal state was somewhat worse than before.

 

On 30th January 2021 I developed a bad cough and sore throat. Over the course of the day it got worse until I was coughing non-stop: an awful, dry, barking cough that tore my throat raw and kept me awake all night. The following day I decided to get tested for coronavirus; this was a do-it-yourself test at a mobile drive-through unit and, having never used one of the test kits before, I’m almost certain I messed it up. The result was negative.

 

Whatever it was seems to have triggered another wave, and it’s even worse than the preceding one. The withdrawal symptoms have been building up in a way that’s rather frightening. The brain zaps are back at a distressing level: they make it hard to do anything. I’m severely dizzy; I need to hold on to the walls and furniture when I move. I’ve had a continuous, intense headache that never goes away. I try to work, but the frustration with it all is unbearable because I can’t concentrate. I get upset, I get angry. I can’t even play the piano because my coordination is significantly off and the brain fog is affecting my memory of pieces I’ve known most of my life. This scares me more than anything else: making a hash of Scott Joplin’s Maple Leaf Rag that I learned and memorised as a teenager, have been playing ever since, and suddenly can’t play properly any more.

 

I’m getting very tired of never ending withdrawal with almost no relief.

1999 - 2001: Paroxetine 20mg, 2003: Venlafaxine 75mg, 2003 - 2014: Escitalopram 20mg

1999 - December 2017: Lansoprazole 15mg

2014 - December 2017: Citalopram 20mg

December 2017: Mirtazapine 30mg, stopped after 4 days due to immediate bad reaction, Zopiclone 3.75mg, stopped after 2 days due to immediate bad reaction

January 2018 - April 2018: Citalopram liquid, tapering, final dose 0.1mg

December 2018 onwards: Vitamin C 1000mg

October 2021: Loratadine 10mg for 6 days (23/10 to 28/10)

Long term (for asthma): Salbutamol and Salmeterol inhalers, Salmeterol stopped March 2021 due to migraine headaches

Occasional use for headaches: Paracetamol 40mg or Ibuprofen 40mg

4th December 2021: Eustachian tube infection: Amoxicillin 500mg 3 per day for 5 days, Dexamethasone & Neomycin ear spray 3 per day for 1 week, Beclometasone nasal spray 2 per day for 2 weeks.

Link to comment

Hello @AlanC

 

I'm truly sorry to hear of your latest 'sequence' of waves. I can't begin to imagine how frustrating it must be after such a long time and intensity. I can empathise however with the brutal and all consuming nature of waves, Even for me after a short 6 months on the drug, bad waves essentially render me incapacitated with severe brain fog, nausea, anxiety, sweats, black depression, insomnia etc. 

 

Waves are a clear sign that your brain is making adjustments, its just unfortunate that they have to be so debilitating, and the process so slow.

 

None of my words will make it any easier, but I'm always here to give support, and have faith in you and your recovery. 

 

Feel free to shoot me a pm anytime your struggling, i follow your post and will continue to check in.

 

MVA

 

 

 

 

 

Started Lexapro 5mg Mid March 2020

Came off Completely September 2020

Hospitalised september 2021

Slowly worked up to 50mg lamictal and 60mg Prozac

reduced to 20mg Prozac September 2021

Holding 20mg Prozac and 50mg Lamictal for a good while to stabilise. November 2021

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  • Mentor

Dear @AlanC, thank you for your kind post on my thread! I found the exact name of that strage visual issue: sparkling scotomas. Very strange issue... I hope that it will fade away like it was fort you.

I read your last post and I'm so sorry you are struggling in another wave so far in your WD. I hope it is only a kind of virus or flu and you will see again and soon better days! I keep you in my thoughts!

🙏

July 2015: the 20mg citalopram for great stress begins

After two years I start tapering (slow but without medical advice) and I guess wrongly. First up to 10 mg, then 5 mg and 2 mg (liquid solution) and skips

January 2020 (I don't remember exactly the day): off citalopram (last dose 2mg).

June 2020: adrenal crash. The beginning of Hell on Earth

 

Current supplement:

- saffron pill (20 mg) + vit. E, omega 3 (EPA + DHA) 2g, magnesium bisglycinate 300 mg, iron , vitamin D3 (2500ui) +K7 (50 ui), vitamin C (1g) + quercitin (25 mg), theanine (as necessary).

 

Try meditating / mindfulness, walking every day, CBT/ACT, massage.

 

"E quindi uscimmo a riveder le stelle" ("And so we went out to see the stars again")

(Dante Alighieri, Divine Comedy , Inferno, XXXIV, 139)

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MVA96 and Leila, thank you, and I'm really hoping everything is going well for you.

 

Unfortunately, I seem to have suffered a significant setback.

 

Wednesday 17th February I went to collect my prescription and, since it was a nice day, I decided to go for a walk, probably no more than a mile and a half. I was tired when I got home, but I put that down to the fact I’d not been out of the house for about eighteen days.

 

The next day I woke up in hell.

 

It feels like what happened when I got hit by the sudden onset of the withdrawal back in August 2018: my head aches savagely and continuously, the brain zaps are back with a vengance every time I move, turn my head or move my eyes quickly, the dizziness has increased, I have digestive problems and there’s a horrible mental turmoil going on that just won’t stop: anger, hatred, terrible violent thoughts, anxiety, grief. I go to bed hoping I won’t wake up again. And I continuously feel exhausted because I don’t sleep more than two or three hours a night. It’s hard to find the energy or the will to look after myself.

 

I really hope this is just a bad wave, caused by being run-down as a result of whatever caused the cough two weeks before. It’s scary, though, because I never came out of the previous wave that started in late October, so the overall trend appears to be downwards with no discernible relief.

 

On another note, for those who remember my run-ins with my existing doctors, I’m being moved to another practice at the end of March. The principal of my current practice has decided she’s had enough, is retiring early, and is shutting the practice down rather than allowing another doctor to take it over. The cynical part of me thinks this is down to the fact she will doubtless make an extremely good profit from the sale of the property where the practice is based: a large house in one of the nicer areas of the city. This leaves the only other practice in the area - which is already overloaded, doesn’t exactly have the best of reputations, and which I would far rather have avoided for personal reasons - having to take on some 4,500 additional patients. So it’s probably not going to be an improvement.

 

For the moderators: at this point my posts here are more to keep a record of how I progress rather than as appeals for help. I’m holding everything steady and not making any changes to medication (asthma inhalers and occasional use of paracetamol for headaches) or diet. Stress is a problem because I now have significant financial worries thanks to the situation here in the UK, but there’s not really anything that can be done about that unless I recover sufficiently to be able to hold down a normal job. In the meanwhile I will continue working as an independent software developer, something that allows me to work around the bad days and which should, hopefully, help to keep the wolf from the door.

1999 - 2001: Paroxetine 20mg, 2003: Venlafaxine 75mg, 2003 - 2014: Escitalopram 20mg

1999 - December 2017: Lansoprazole 15mg

2014 - December 2017: Citalopram 20mg

December 2017: Mirtazapine 30mg, stopped after 4 days due to immediate bad reaction, Zopiclone 3.75mg, stopped after 2 days due to immediate bad reaction

January 2018 - April 2018: Citalopram liquid, tapering, final dose 0.1mg

December 2018 onwards: Vitamin C 1000mg

October 2021: Loratadine 10mg for 6 days (23/10 to 28/10)

Long term (for asthma): Salbutamol and Salmeterol inhalers, Salmeterol stopped March 2021 due to migraine headaches

Occasional use for headaches: Paracetamol 40mg or Ibuprofen 40mg

4th December 2021: Eustachian tube infection: Amoxicillin 500mg 3 per day for 5 days, Dexamethasone & Neomycin ear spray 3 per day for 1 week, Beclometasone nasal spray 2 per day for 2 weeks.

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  • 4 weeks later...

Over the last week things have, finally, started to get better.

 

The dizziness has lessened considerably: it's still there, but it's not much of a problem. I've been out walking a lot without it bothering me. The brain zaps are still there, but have reduced both in frequency and intensity.

 

The headaches seem to have a specific cause: the Salmeterol inhaler. Salmeterol is a vasodilator and a common side effect of using it is, apparently, migraine headaches. During the course of lockdown in the UK I've started cooking a lot of my own food from scratch and have been paying a lot of attention to the contents of what I buy since my asthma is caused by an allergic reaction to certain fats: peanut, coconut, palm nut, palm oil, soya. I eliminated anything that has any traces of these from my diet then, cautiously, stopped using the inhaler to see if the asthma would return: it hasn't, although it's too soon to be certain that I can go without the inhaler completely. And while I do still get headaches, the continuous, painful ones have virtually stopped. This has helped my mood immensely.

 

There have been some rather stressful events over the last week and, unfortunately, I reacted badly to one of them; I hope I've been able to patch up the damage I did.

 

Maybe I'm having my first window in a long time. Maybe, if I can safely stop using the Salmeterol, I can eliminate the headaches. I'm just glad to finally be feeling some relief.

1999 - 2001: Paroxetine 20mg, 2003: Venlafaxine 75mg, 2003 - 2014: Escitalopram 20mg

1999 - December 2017: Lansoprazole 15mg

2014 - December 2017: Citalopram 20mg

December 2017: Mirtazapine 30mg, stopped after 4 days due to immediate bad reaction, Zopiclone 3.75mg, stopped after 2 days due to immediate bad reaction

January 2018 - April 2018: Citalopram liquid, tapering, final dose 0.1mg

December 2018 onwards: Vitamin C 1000mg

October 2021: Loratadine 10mg for 6 days (23/10 to 28/10)

Long term (for asthma): Salbutamol and Salmeterol inhalers, Salmeterol stopped March 2021 due to migraine headaches

Occasional use for headaches: Paracetamol 40mg or Ibuprofen 40mg

4th December 2021: Eustachian tube infection: Amoxicillin 500mg 3 per day for 5 days, Dexamethasone & Neomycin ear spray 3 per day for 1 week, Beclometasone nasal spray 2 per day for 2 weeks.

Link to comment
  • 2 months later...

I’ve been back in another wave for a while now.

 

The individual windows and waves that I go though seem to be far longer than those of most other people here. The recent window lasted around four weeks, but the preceding wave lasted more than four months. There’s also a clear cause to the end of the windows: they go on long enough that I start to get confident that I’m actually improving; I slowly try to become more active and, when everything seems to be OK, I get tempted to try a bit more. Then, quite consistently, the day after I’ve done something like walking three or four miles or spending a morning or afternoon out of the house, the new wave will hit while I sleep and I’ll wake up in hell the next day.

 

This one has brought back all the usual symptoms that I seem to be prone to, but the dizziness and brain zaps are worse than usual and are a nasty combination: when I’m particularly dizzy the zaps can make me lose my balance. I’ve also seen the return of the insomnia and waking as soon as it starts to get light, but thankfully there’s no anxiety - I just wake up around 3:30 to 4:00am and can’t go back to sleep again. My mood is terrible: horrible thoughts running out of control in a dreadful mental turmoil. I’m full of fear, anger and hatred and, unfortunately, have been experiencing suicidal ideation. Is this akathisia? There’s no physical restlessness, just a horrible mental state that I can’t seem to escape from. During my first bout of depression I learned ways to deal with problematic thoughts but it’s proving hard to put into practice since there isn’t really any specific issue behind them, plus the physical withdrawal symptoms make it all so much worse.

 

This really isn’t helping my work. I have a kids cartoon strip creator app that’s now complete and ready to go on sale, but trying to put together some funny and appealing cartoons that I can use in the App Store artwork and writing the promotional text is hard when my mood is so negative...

1999 - 2001: Paroxetine 20mg, 2003: Venlafaxine 75mg, 2003 - 2014: Escitalopram 20mg

1999 - December 2017: Lansoprazole 15mg

2014 - December 2017: Citalopram 20mg

December 2017: Mirtazapine 30mg, stopped after 4 days due to immediate bad reaction, Zopiclone 3.75mg, stopped after 2 days due to immediate bad reaction

January 2018 - April 2018: Citalopram liquid, tapering, final dose 0.1mg

December 2018 onwards: Vitamin C 1000mg

October 2021: Loratadine 10mg for 6 days (23/10 to 28/10)

Long term (for asthma): Salbutamol and Salmeterol inhalers, Salmeterol stopped March 2021 due to migraine headaches

Occasional use for headaches: Paracetamol 40mg or Ibuprofen 40mg

4th December 2021: Eustachian tube infection: Amoxicillin 500mg 3 per day for 5 days, Dexamethasone & Neomycin ear spray 3 per day for 1 week, Beclometasone nasal spray 2 per day for 2 weeks.

Link to comment

Hi, Alan,
 

I hope you feel better soon.  Have you had SI before?  Aka can occur without the need to move.  Yet, you might not have aka just because you have SI.  Are the SI, fear and anger related in any way?  Does the SI occur directly after the fear and anger or are they unrelated?

It’s interesting that you wake up early with no anxiety.   That’s really nice.  I found it to be a turning point when that started to happen.  If the anxious wake ups come back, don’t get discouraged.  This current development is still very good news.
 

Sorry to hear you are back in a wave. A lot of people say that doing too much seems to bring on a wave.  I’m not sure that’s accurate, but I can’t disprove it either.  It seemed that way for me, and it was related to an inability to tolerate stress.  Even having a good day out is somewhat taxing.  However, I believe the wave would arrive at some point even if we stayed at home.  
 

Hang in there, Rosetts

https://www.survivingantidepressants.org/topic/16629-rosetta-ct-may-2011-too-fast-taper-feb-2017/?page=25

2001-2011 Celexa 10 mg raised to 40 mg then 60 mg over this time period

May 2011 OB Doctor's Cold switch Celexa 60 mg to 10 mg Zoloft sertraline (baby born)

2012-2016 - Doctors raised dose of Zoloft up to 150 mg

2016 - Xanax prescribed - as needed - 0.5 mg about every 3 days (bad reaction)

2016 - Stopped Xanax

Late 2016- Began (too fast) taper of Zoloft

Early 2017 - Trazodone prescribed for bedtime (doseage unknown)

Feb 2017 - Completed taper/stopped Trazodone

Drug free since Feb 2017

2017 - Unisom otc very rarely for sleep

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Hello Rosetta,

 

Thank you for the encouraging words about waking without anxiety being a turning point for you.

 

The early morning waking with anxiety was something that gradually faded away some time ago so I was rather upset when the early waking part came back, even if it was without the anxiety. At the moment it's probably three days out of four; I get increasingly tired because of the lack of sleep then either sleep through to 7am or wake early and go back to sleep after a couple of hours.

 

The fear and anger are down to what's been done to me, my complete distrust of the medical profession as a result, and the fact that three and a half years on I've seen the symptoms change, some get better, some get worse, but I don't really seem to be improving. There are other serious worries as well: my business (I'm self employed) was hit very hard by the pandemic and associated recession and needs a lot of effort to rebuild, something I'm struggling to do.

 

The SI is something new and does seem to be related to bad bouts of the aka/fear/anger and the feeling that the discontinuation will continue to drag on for the rest of my life. I very much doubt I'd actually act on the thoughts but they're something I've never experienced before, are hard to control, and are extremely disturbing.

1999 - 2001: Paroxetine 20mg, 2003: Venlafaxine 75mg, 2003 - 2014: Escitalopram 20mg

1999 - December 2017: Lansoprazole 15mg

2014 - December 2017: Citalopram 20mg

December 2017: Mirtazapine 30mg, stopped after 4 days due to immediate bad reaction, Zopiclone 3.75mg, stopped after 2 days due to immediate bad reaction

January 2018 - April 2018: Citalopram liquid, tapering, final dose 0.1mg

December 2018 onwards: Vitamin C 1000mg

October 2021: Loratadine 10mg for 6 days (23/10 to 28/10)

Long term (for asthma): Salbutamol and Salmeterol inhalers, Salmeterol stopped March 2021 due to migraine headaches

Occasional use for headaches: Paracetamol 40mg or Ibuprofen 40mg

4th December 2021: Eustachian tube infection: Amoxicillin 500mg 3 per day for 5 days, Dexamethasone & Neomycin ear spray 3 per day for 1 week, Beclometasone nasal spray 2 per day for 2 weeks.

Link to comment

Alan,

 

For what it’s worth, I’m not surprised that at 3 1/2 years you are feeling very, very discouraged.  That is such a long time to struggle with the back and forth of withdrawal, aka and all the other symptoms.  I was extremely discouraged at that point, and I doubted that I would heal numerous times.  The evidence to the contrary was abundant, but I couldn’t see it because of anhedonia, depression and sheer exhaustion.  However, I couldn’t deny the windows were better and better over time.  So, my doubt never took over and never lasted beyond a bad wave.


Having your business struggling is, of course, a stressor, and stress is particularly hard for people in WD.  I do want to say that you will see vast improvements in the next year despite the stress.  There has been so much stress in my life this past year, but I have made steady progress on PWS.  Stress has an effect on how we feel, and it may have an effect on how quickly we heal, but we heal nonetheless. 

I don’t believe you are going to have PWS for life.  That fear seems like a very logical conclusion based on the length of time you have spent in WD, but this healing process doesn’t follow the same path that other healing processes follow.  For any physical disability that lasted this long, the extended time period would portend a much less positive prognosis.  Brain transformation is not the same, fortunately.  We weren’t “damaged;” we were changed - in a way that caused severe disability and our lives were changed, but most, if not all, of the changes are reversible.  

It is hard to be convinced that my dystonia is going to completely resolve, but I believe it could.  What else would explain the vast improvement?  At times, I do wonder if there was some actual damage at some point that resulted in permanent dystonia, but if so, why does it continue to improve in a windows and waves pattern?  None of this changes the fact that I believe continued assault on the brain by adverse reactions prolong dystonia and increase it’s severity.

 

I’m still very hopeful for your complete recovery.

 

Rosetta

 

https://www.survivingantidepressants.org/topic/16629-rosetta-ct-may-2011-too-fast-taper-feb-2017/?page=25

2001-2011 Celexa 10 mg raised to 40 mg then 60 mg over this time period

May 2011 OB Doctor's Cold switch Celexa 60 mg to 10 mg Zoloft sertraline (baby born)

2012-2016 - Doctors raised dose of Zoloft up to 150 mg

2016 - Xanax prescribed - as needed - 0.5 mg about every 3 days (bad reaction)

2016 - Stopped Xanax

Late 2016- Began (too fast) taper of Zoloft

Early 2017 - Trazodone prescribed for bedtime (doseage unknown)

Feb 2017 - Completed taper/stopped Trazodone

Drug free since Feb 2017

2017 - Unisom otc very rarely for sleep

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  • 1 month later...
  • Moderator
On 5/24/2021 at 11:08 PM, AlanC said:

I’ve been back in another wave for a while now.

 

The individual windows and waves that I go though seem to be far longer than those of most other people here. The recent window lasted around four weeks, but the preceding wave lasted more than four months. There’s also a clear cause to the end of the windows: they go on long enough that I start to get confident that I’m actually improving; I slowly try to become more active and, when everything seems to be OK, I get tempted to try a bit more. Then, quite consistently, the day after I’ve done something like walking three or four miles or spending a morning or afternoon out of the house, the new wave will hit while I sleep and I’ll wake up in hell the next day.

 

This one has brought back all the usual symptoms that I seem to be prone to, but the dizziness and brain zaps are worse than usual and are a nasty combination: when I’m particularly dizzy the zaps can make me lose my balance. I’ve also seen the return of the insomnia and waking as soon as it starts to get light, but thankfully there’s no anxiety - I just wake up around 3:30 to 4:00am and can’t go back to sleep again. My mood is terrible: horrible thoughts running out of control in a dreadful mental turmoil. I’m full of fear, anger and hatred and, unfortunately, have been experiencing suicidal ideation. Is this akathisia? There’s no physical restlessness, just a horrible mental state that I can’t seem to escape from. During my first bout of depression I learned ways to deal with problematic thoughts but it’s proving hard to put into practice since there isn’t really any specific issue behind them, plus the physical withdrawal symptoms make it all so much worse.

 

This really isn’t helping my work. I have a kids cartoon strip creator app that’s now complete and ready to go on sale, but trying to put together some funny and appealing cartoons that I can use in the App Store artwork and writing the promotional text is hard when my mood is so negative...

Hi AlanC, 

I was in such a bad way at that time that I didn't check what was happening with you. So sorry you are going through a difficult wave. Has it gotten better? Financial worries can't be helping this of course. I didn't know you were an app developer!

 

I have been recently waking up early as well sometimes with and sometimes without insomnia. I think it has to do with the early sunrise. I have had to put foil on my window (yes, I know!), top it with a felt fabric tightly around the glass and then two layered window. It doesn't always solve the issue but it does help as I have east facing windows. 

 

Hope this gets better soon. Do you end up practicing the CBT even if it doesn't work initially? I am not very good at it but it helped when I  did. There was a chapter in one of the books that helped with identifying the thoughts when that was hard - specific techniques - but I can't seem to find them now. Sometimes things are a complete jumble in my head esp with the WD anxiety and it is more agitation than anxiety that I am feeling so it is hard to figure what is what. 

 

Please let us know how you are doing now. OMW

 

 

"Nothing so small as a moment is insurmountable, and moments are all that we have. You have survived every trial and tribulation that life has thrown at you up until this very instant. When future troubles come—and they will come—a version of you will be born into that moment that can conquer them, too." - Kevin Koenig 

 

I am not a doctor and this should not be considered medical advice. You can use the information and recommendations provided in whatever way you want and all decisions on your treatment are yours. 

 

In the next few weeks I do not have a lot of capacity to respond to questions. If you need a quick answer pls tag or ask other moderators who may want to be tagged. 

 

Aug  2000 - July 2003 (ct, 4-6 wk wd) , citalopram 20 mg,  xanax prn, wellbutrin for a few months, trazodone prn 

Dec 2004 - July 2018 citalopram 20 mg, xanax prn (rarely used)

Aug 2018 - citalopram 40 mg (self titrated up)

September 2018 - January 2019 tapered citalopram - 40/30/20/10/5 no issues until a week after reaching 0

Feb 2019 0.25 xanax - 0.5/day (3 weeks) over to klonopin 0.25 once a day to manage severe wd

March 6, reinstated citalopram 2.5 mg (liquid), klonopin 0.25 mg for sleep 2-3 times a week

Apr 1st citalopram 2.0 mg (liquid), klonopin 0.25 once a week (off by 4/14/19- no tapering)

citalopram (liquid) 4/14/19 -1.8 mg, 5/8/19 - 1.6 mg,  7/27/19 -1.5 mg,  8/15/19 - 1.35, 2/21/21 - 1.1 (smaller drops in between), 6/20/21 - 1.03 mg, 8/7/21- 1.025, 8/11/21 - 1.02, 8/15/21 - 1.015, 9/3/21 - 0.925 (fingers crossed!), 10/8/21 - 0.9, 10/18/21 - 0.875, 12/31/21 - 0.85, 1/7/22 - 0.825, 1/14/22 - 0.8, 1/22/22 - 0.785, 8/18/22 - 0.59, 12/15/2022 - 0.48, 2/15/22 - 0.43, 25/07/23 - 0.25 (mistake), 6/08/23 - 0.33mg

 

Supplements: magnesium citrate and bi-glycinate

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Hi, Alan.  An eye pillow mask might help if blocking the light from the windows is not something you feel up to doing.  I still need mine.  Get one that is light snd has a strap to put around your head so that you can sleep on your side.  
 

I’m sorry you are feeling so bad.  It’s great that you are waking without anxiety.  I think the eye pillow will work because you aren’t having cortisol wake ups.  As for the other anxiety, I don’t know if that is aka, but probably not.  In any event, it is something experienced.  It’s awful, I know.  Any possibility you can distract from it with a book or a show, perhaps?  Even if you get some relief for a little while by listening to another storyline, that would help.  Don’t worry if you can’t focus on it.  Maybe a comedic series?  
 

Hang in there, Rosetta

https://www.survivingantidepressants.org/topic/16629-rosetta-ct-may-2011-too-fast-taper-feb-2017/?page=25

2001-2011 Celexa 10 mg raised to 40 mg then 60 mg over this time period

May 2011 OB Doctor's Cold switch Celexa 60 mg to 10 mg Zoloft sertraline (baby born)

2012-2016 - Doctors raised dose of Zoloft up to 150 mg

2016 - Xanax prescribed - as needed - 0.5 mg about every 3 days (bad reaction)

2016 - Stopped Xanax

Late 2016- Began (too fast) taper of Zoloft

Early 2017 - Trazodone prescribed for bedtime (doseage unknown)

Feb 2017 - Completed taper/stopped Trazodone

Drug free since Feb 2017

2017 - Unisom otc very rarely for sleep

Link to comment

Hello OnMyWay, really glad to see you posting again and to hear that you’re recovering; I was concerned that you were in such a bad way.

 

Rosetta, thank you for the encouraging words.

 

I’ll try to reply properly in a while. I had a bad fall last week and have lost a lot of sleep because of the pain; I can’t think straight at the moment.

1999 - 2001: Paroxetine 20mg, 2003: Venlafaxine 75mg, 2003 - 2014: Escitalopram 20mg

1999 - December 2017: Lansoprazole 15mg

2014 - December 2017: Citalopram 20mg

December 2017: Mirtazapine 30mg, stopped after 4 days due to immediate bad reaction, Zopiclone 3.75mg, stopped after 2 days due to immediate bad reaction

January 2018 - April 2018: Citalopram liquid, tapering, final dose 0.1mg

December 2018 onwards: Vitamin C 1000mg

October 2021: Loratadine 10mg for 6 days (23/10 to 28/10)

Long term (for asthma): Salbutamol and Salmeterol inhalers, Salmeterol stopped March 2021 due to migraine headaches

Occasional use for headaches: Paracetamol 40mg or Ibuprofen 40mg

4th December 2021: Eustachian tube infection: Amoxicillin 500mg 3 per day for 5 days, Dexamethasone & Neomycin ear spray 3 per day for 1 week, Beclometasone nasal spray 2 per day for 2 weeks.

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