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Capuli: Just need a bit of support


Capuli

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After very careful tapering off, I have just completed 3 weeks without any Venlafaxine which I had been taking since 2005

In 2005, I had weaned myself off Seroxat but allowed myself to be bullied by my spouse (a sufferer from endogenous depression controlled by medication) and, at that time, work colleagues, into taking another anti-depressant.

Happily retired for over 10 years, my spouse's depression under control and a general feeling of being over-drugged, I decided in April, in the spring, with the days lengthening, after discussion with my GP, gently to wean myself off the pills.  I was hoping to do it all without having to own up to my spouse but my symptoms post stopping are quite severe and I cannot dissemble.

So, while not announcing it from the rooftops or posting it on Facebook, I am telling my friends and family what I am up to to explain occasionally disconcerting behaviour.  Unfortunately, both husband and sister have suggested what I am doing is not necessary though most friends I have told are most supportive. 

So here I am, weepy, upset stomach, off my food, aggressive being told by my nearest and dearest I'm depressed.  i found this website and decided to get it off my chest.

I know I am in for the long haul but I'm determined I'm not going to be dissuaded this time.  I need to know what the real me is like now.  Just need a pat on the head I suppose

  • 1995-2005 Seroxat
  • 2005 -2019 March 31 Venlafaxine latterly 112.5 mg
  • 2019 April 1 - April 12 Venlafaxine slow release 75mg and 37.5mg on alternate days
  • 2019 April 13 - April 22 Venlafaxine slow release 37.5mg daily
  • 2019 April 23 - May 4 Venlafaxine slow release 37.5mg on alternate days
  • 2019 May 5 - nil
  • taking multivitamin supplement
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  • ChessieCat changed the title to Capuli: Just need a bit of support
  • Moderator Emeritus

Welcome to SA, Capuli.  I'm glad you found your way here.  I'm sorry you're not getting support on the home front, but you'll find it here.  

 

To start, please add a signature.  Include drugs, doses, dates, and rate of taper and whether you venlafaxine was ER or regular release.  Also include supplements. This will help us give you the most accurate advice we can. 
  • Any drugs and supplements prior to 24 months ago can just be listed with start and stop years. 
  • Please use actual dates or approximate dates (mid-June, Late October) rather than relative time frames (last week, 3 months ago) 
  • Spell out months, e.g. "October" or "Oct."; 9/1/2016 can be interpreted as Jan. 9, 2016 or Sept. 1, 2016. 
  • Please leave out symptoms and diagnoses. 
  • A list is easier to understand than one or multiple paragraphs. 
  • This is a direct link to your signature:  Account Settings – Create or Edit a signature.

Here are some links from this website about dealing with lack of family support.  Please feel free to add your own comments.

 

No Friend/Family Support - Surviving Antidepressants

 

Regarding the symptoms you describe, they are typical withdrawal symptoms resulting from a too-fast taper of the Venlafaxine.  (We recommend tapering no faster than 10% of current dose every four weeks.)   

 

 
 
Sometime symptoms are delayed after a too-fast taper.
 

 

When we take medications, the CNS (central nervous system) responds by making changes over the months and years we take the drug(s). When the medication is discontinued, the CNS has to undo all the changes it made. Rebuilding the neurotransmitter production and reactivating the receptor and transporter cells takes time -- during that rebuilding process symptoms occur.  
 
 

The only known way to alleviate withdrawal symptoms is by reinstatement of a VERY small dose of the same drug, then waiting to stabilize, then tapering off that tiny dose at our recommended 10% rate.  The other alternative is to wait it out until your system regains homeostasis.

There is no way to predict how long it will take.  While some recover fairly quickly, others take quite a bit longer.  I understand that you will likely be reluctant to take even a tiny dose of the hated drug again, but I did want to let you know this option exists.  Please read:

 

About reinstating and stabilizing to reduce withdrawal symptoms. -- at least the first page of the topic

 

If reinstatement is something you might want to consider, please let me know and we can recommend a reinstatement dose.

 

We don't recommend a lot of supplements on SA, as many members report being sensitive to them due to our over-reactive nervous systems, but two supplements that we do recommend are magnesium and omega 3 (fish oil). Many people find these to be calming to the nervous system.  Magnesium glycinate is a good form of magnesium.

 

 

 

Please research all supplements first and only add in one at a time and at a low dose in case you do experience problems.
 
This is your Introductory topic, where you can ask questions, post updates and connect with other members.  Please let us know how you're doing.
 

 

 

 
Edited by Gridley

Gridley Introduction

 

Lexapro 20 mg since 2004.  Begin Brassmonkey Slide Taper Jan. 2017.   

End 2017 year 1 of taper at 9.25mg 

End 2018 year 2 of taper at 4.1mg

End 2019 year 3 of taper at 1.0mg  

Oct. 30, 2020  Jump to zero from 0.025mg.  Current dose: 0.000mg

3 year, 10 month taper is 100% complete.

 

Ativan 1 mg to 1.875mg 1986-2020, two CT's and reinstatements

Nov. 2020, 7-week Ativan-Valium crossover to 18.75mg Valium

Feb. 2021, begin 10%/4 week taper of 18.75mg Valium 

End 2021  year 1 of Valium taper at 6mg

End 2022 year 2 of Valium taper at 2.75mg 

End 2023 year 3 of Valium taper at 1mg

Jan. 24, 2024: Hold at 1mg and shift to Imipramine taper.

Taper is 95% complete.

 

Imipramine 75 mg daily since 1986.  Jan.-Sept. 2016 tapered to 14.4mg  

March 22, 2022: Begin 10%/4 week taper

Aug. 5, 2022: hold at 9.5mg and shift to Valium taper

Jan. 24, 2024: Resume Imipramine taper.  Current dose as of Feb. 22: 7.6mg

Taper is 90% complete.  

  

Supplements: multiple, quercetin, omega-3, vitamins C, E and D3, magnesium glycinate, probiotics, zinc, melatonin .3mg, anti-candida, iron, serrapeptase, nattokinase


I am not a medical professional and this is not medical advice but simply information based on my own experience, as well as other members who have survived these drugs.

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Dear Gridley

Thank you.

I don't understand.  What is my signature meant to be if i am clearly posting as Capuli?

Is that where I list my drugs/supplements etc?

  • 1995-2005 Seroxat
  • 2005 -2019 March 31 Venlafaxine latterly 112.5 mg
  • 2019 April 1 - April 12 Venlafaxine slow release 75mg and 37.5mg on alternate days
  • 2019 April 13 - April 22 Venlafaxine slow release 37.5mg daily
  • 2019 April 23 - May 4 Venlafaxine slow release 37.5mg on alternate days
  • 2019 May 5 - nil
  • taking multivitamin supplement
Link to comment
  • Moderator Emeritus
17 hours ago, Capuli said:

I don't understand.  What is my signature meant to be if i am clearly posting as Capuli?

Is that where I list my drugs/supplements etc?

 

We ask all members to create a signature containing a summary of med history, including all drugs, doses and dates (starting and stopping).  Your signature appears below every post you make, and allows us see your situation easily without having to read through your whole topic every time.   You could look at my signature for an example. 

 

Instructions for creating your signature are here: Please put your withdrawal history in your signature. 

 

You can edit your signature here: edit your signature in Account Settings

2001–2002 paroxetine

2003  citalopram

2004-2008  paroxetine (various failed tapers) 
2008  paroxetine slow taper down to

2016  Aug off paroxetine
2016  citalopram May 20mg  Oct 15mg … slow taper down
2018  citalopram 13 Feb 4.6mg 15 Mar 4.4mg 29 Apr 4.2mg 6 Jul 4.1mg 17 Aug 4.0mg  18 Nov 3.8mg
2019  15 Mar 3.6mg  21 May 3.4mg  26 Dec 3.2mg 

2020  19 Feb 3.0mg 19 Jul 2.9mg 16 Sep 2.8mg 25 Oct 2.7mg 23 Oct 2.6mg 24 Dec 2.5mg

2021   29 Aug 2.4mg   15 Nov 2.3mg

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thank you songbird too.

I have just added my anti-depressant medication history as my signature.

  • 1995-2005 Seroxat
  • 2005 -2019 March 31 Venlafaxine latterly 112.5 mg
  • 2019 April 1 - April 12 Venlafaxine slow release 75mg and 37.5mg on alternate days
  • 2019 April 13 - April 22 Venlafaxine slow release 37.5mg daily
  • 2019 April 23 - May 4 Venlafaxine slow release 37.5mg on alternate days
  • 2019 May 5 - nil
  • taking multivitamin supplement
Link to comment
  • Moderator Emeritus

Thanks for adding your signature.  You've tapered off very quickly and have been hit by withdrawal symptoms.  Here we recommend tapering much more slowly to allow the body to adapt to the dose reductions and avoid severe withdrawal problems.

 

See:  Why taper by 10% of my dosage?

 

You may be able to alleviate most of the symptoms (as well as preventing them getting worse) by reinstating a small dose of venlafaxine.  The idea is to get as stable as possible and then slowly taper off.  Reinstatement tends to work better when done sooner rather than later (when there is an increased risk of it not working or producing adverse reactions).  Please read the reinstatement topic thoroughly, especially the top section:

 

About reinstating and stabilizing to reduce withdrawal symptoms

 

Was your venlafaxine slow release a capsule or a tablet?

2001–2002 paroxetine

2003  citalopram

2004-2008  paroxetine (various failed tapers) 
2008  paroxetine slow taper down to

2016  Aug off paroxetine
2016  citalopram May 20mg  Oct 15mg … slow taper down
2018  citalopram 13 Feb 4.6mg 15 Mar 4.4mg 29 Apr 4.2mg 6 Jul 4.1mg 17 Aug 4.0mg  18 Nov 3.8mg
2019  15 Mar 3.6mg  21 May 3.4mg  26 Dec 3.2mg 

2020  19 Feb 3.0mg 19 Jul 2.9mg 16 Sep 2.8mg 25 Oct 2.7mg 23 Oct 2.6mg 24 Dec 2.5mg

2021   29 Aug 2.4mg   15 Nov 2.3mg

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Dear Songbird,

Thank you for your prompt reply. 

And there was me thinking I'd weaned myself off so slowly.  The medics were really impressed. 

Can't get a quick appointment.One is going to phone me tomorrow so I can request a low dosage to re-instate for a while.

I had been taking slow release capsules.  Is there a lower dose of Venlafaxine than 37.5mg?

  • 1995-2005 Seroxat
  • 2005 -2019 March 31 Venlafaxine latterly 112.5 mg
  • 2019 April 1 - April 12 Venlafaxine slow release 75mg and 37.5mg on alternate days
  • 2019 April 13 - April 22 Venlafaxine slow release 37.5mg daily
  • 2019 April 23 - May 4 Venlafaxine slow release 37.5mg on alternate days
  • 2019 May 5 - nil
  • taking multivitamin supplement
Link to comment
  • Moderator Emeritus

Hi Capuli and welcome from me too.

 

Please see Post #1 of Tips for tapering off Effexor (venlafaxine)

 

After the first 5 quotes there is information about how to get your dose under this heading (just under the biggest quote in the post):

 

Extended-release (Effexor XR) capsules: Open and count out beads

 

 

* NO LONGER ACTIVE on SA *

MISSION ACCOMPLISHED:  (6 year taper)      0mg Pristiq  on 13th November 2021

ADs since ~1992:  25+ years - 1 unknown, Prozac (muscle weakness), Zoloft; citalopram (pooped out) CTed (very sick for 2.5 wks a few months after); Pristiq:  50mg 2012, 100mg beg 2013 (Serotonin Toxicity)  Tapering from Oct 2015 - 13 Nov 2021   LAST DOSE 0.0025mg

Post 0 updates start here    My tapering program     My Intro (goes to tapering graph)

 VIDEO:   Antidepressant Withdrawal Syndrome and its Management

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Thank you again to Songbird and ChessieCat.

Fainted at lunchtime today. Spoke to doctor. 

Prescription for Venlafaxine 37.5mg awaits me at pharmacy tomorrow. 

Will take until I stabilise and then think about tapering off far more slowly.  I can see I'm in for the long haul.

What a pity I didn't find all this support before - really am grateful 

  • 1995-2005 Seroxat
  • 2005 -2019 March 31 Venlafaxine latterly 112.5 mg
  • 2019 April 1 - April 12 Venlafaxine slow release 75mg and 37.5mg on alternate days
  • 2019 April 13 - April 22 Venlafaxine slow release 37.5mg daily
  • 2019 April 23 - May 4 Venlafaxine slow release 37.5mg on alternate days
  • 2019 May 5 - nil
  • taking multivitamin supplement
Link to comment
  • Moderator Emeritus

Please note that skipping days is not recommended:  Skipping Days vs Every Day Dosing Graph

 

It is better to reinstate at the lowest dose which brings withdrawal symptoms to a tolerable level.  We generally suggest reinstating at a low dose and gradually increasing if needed.  These drugs are strong and once you have experienced withdrawal symptoms going back to a high dose (in your case 37.5mg every day) may be too much for your system and might make things worse.  Please read Post #1 of the reinstatement topic.

 

It's been over 1 month since you were taking a half dose of 37.5mg (ie alternate days) plus just over 3 weeks taking no drug.  That means that it's been at least 7 weeks since you were taking 37.5mg every day.

 

My suggestion would be to open a capsule and take 1/4 of the contents.  That would be ~9.375mg.  It takes about 4 days for a dose to get to full level in the blood and a bit longer for it to register in the brain.  The idea of reinstating isn't to get rid of withdrawal symptoms completely but to reduce them to a bearable level.

 

We suggest keeping daily symptom notes on paper so you can see how reinstating is affecting your symptoms, ie improvements/worsening.  If in 1 week after reinstating you find the your systems are still unbearable we can suggestion an amount to increase.  Providing the notes can help us with that.

 

After reinstating you would stay on the dose until you stabilise, which might take several months or longer.  It is better to hold for longer than to reduce too soon.  Please also note that stabilising is not linear, please see:

 

WDnormal (withdrawal normal)

 

Windows and Waves Pattern of Stabilization

* NO LONGER ACTIVE on SA *

MISSION ACCOMPLISHED:  (6 year taper)      0mg Pristiq  on 13th November 2021

ADs since ~1992:  25+ years - 1 unknown, Prozac (muscle weakness), Zoloft; citalopram (pooped out) CTed (very sick for 2.5 wks a few months after); Pristiq:  50mg 2012, 100mg beg 2013 (Serotonin Toxicity)  Tapering from Oct 2015 - 13 Nov 2021   LAST DOSE 0.0025mg

Post 0 updates start here    My tapering program     My Intro (goes to tapering graph)

 VIDEO:   Antidepressant Withdrawal Syndrome and its Management

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Thank you again.

I am now in possession of some 37.5mg slow release capsules.  I have not taken any of them or any part of them.

I am concerned that I may already be too late to re-instate even in the manner you suggest. 

I have decided not to re-instate at all but to accept  my daily symptoms and accommodate them in my life.  

I don't want to risk a relapse to something worse and then have to go through tapering off - albeit in a slower way.

I am going on holiday in a week, staying folk I know will be supportive 

I am determined to manage my symptoms after the wobble earlier this week.

I am grateful for all the help and advice I am getting.

  • 1995-2005 Seroxat
  • 2005 -2019 March 31 Venlafaxine latterly 112.5 mg
  • 2019 April 1 - April 12 Venlafaxine slow release 75mg and 37.5mg on alternate days
  • 2019 April 13 - April 22 Venlafaxine slow release 37.5mg daily
  • 2019 April 23 - May 4 Venlafaxine slow release 37.5mg on alternate days
  • 2019 May 5 - nil
  • taking multivitamin supplement
Link to comment
  • Moderator Emeritus

I can understand your reluctance to reinstate.  However, it is only about 4 weeks since you stopped the drug, and you tapered over a very short period of time (112.5mg to 0mg in about 8 weeks).  You are still within the time frame of when reinstatement is highly likely to be successful.

 

If you are concerned about taking ~9.375mg you can always start with less than that.

 

I will tell you of my own experience with trying to reduce my drug too quickly.

 

I was taking 100mg Pristiq and because it is only available in 50mg and 100mg doses I started taking 50mg.  Over a 2 week period my brain fog got worse and worse and even walking took my full concentration.  It was like my brain was full of mud and I was walking through molasses.  It was at this time that I researched and found SA.  They suggested that I increase my dose but I wanted to find out more about what they were suggesting and of course the brain fog made it difficult to take in the information I was reading.  However, a couple of days after joining SA I was unable to type.  I have been a professional typist for 40+ years so I knew something was wrong.  I decided to take extra Pristiq and after only about 4 hours I was able to type again and the brain fog was lifting.  I had a benchmark so I had proof that it was the lack of drug that caused the brain fog and inability to type.  The difference was like night and day.  I also knew that there was no way that this was wishful thinking etc.

 

After a few months I started tapering following SA's tapering recommendations and I'm now down to 3mg.  During my taper I have still experienced some withdrawal symptoms but they have been mild, except during times of stress and/or sickness when I have found that they do increase.

 

I will provide some additional information in the next post.

* NO LONGER ACTIVE on SA *

MISSION ACCOMPLISHED:  (6 year taper)      0mg Pristiq  on 13th November 2021

ADs since ~1992:  25+ years - 1 unknown, Prozac (muscle weakness), Zoloft; citalopram (pooped out) CTed (very sick for 2.5 wks a few months after); Pristiq:  50mg 2012, 100mg beg 2013 (Serotonin Toxicity)  Tapering from Oct 2015 - 13 Nov 2021   LAST DOSE 0.0025mg

Post 0 updates start here    My tapering program     My Intro (goes to tapering graph)

 VIDEO:   Antidepressant Withdrawal Syndrome and its Management

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  • Moderator Emeritus

Please note that antidepressant withdrawal symptoms have nothing to do with how strong and determined we are as a person.

 

When we take a psychiatric drug, we are adding chemical/s to the brain.  The brain then has to change to adapt to getting the chemical/s.  It might have to change something to do with A and then once that change has been made it affects B so another change has to be made and so on down the line.  It is a chain reaction, a domino effect.

 

The same thing happens when we take the drug away.  That's why it's possible to experience such a vast array of withdrawal symptoms, and they can change, and be of different intensity.

 

Please read these:

 

CT and Fast Tapers

 

Reinstatement

 

These are helpful:

 

Video:  Healing From Antidepressants - Patterns of Recovery

 

On 8/31/2011 at 5:28 AM, Rhiannon said:

When we stop taking the drug, we have a brain that has designed itself so that it works in the presence of the drug; now it can't work properly without the drug because it's designed itself so that the drug is part of its chemistry and structure. It's like a plant that has grown on a trellis; you can't just yank out the trellis and expect the plant to be okay. When the drug is removed, the remodeling process has to take place in reverse. SO--it's not a matter of just getting the drug out of your system and moving on. If it were that simple, none of us would be here. It's a matter of, as I describe it, having to grow a new brain. I believe this growing-a-new-brain happens throughout the taper process if the taper is slow enough. (If it's too fast, then there's not a lot of time for actually rebalancing things, and basically the brain is just pedaling fast trying to keep us alive.) It also continues to happen, probably for longer than the symptoms actually last, throughout the time of recovery after we are completely off the drug, which is why recovery takes so long.

 

AND

 

On 12/4/2015 at 2:41 AM, apace41 said:

Basically- you have a building where the MAJOR steel structures are trying to be rebuilt at different times - ALL while people are coming and going in the building and attempting to work.

It would be like if the World Trade Center Towers hadn't completely fallen - but had crumbled inside in different places.. Imagine if you were trying to rebuild the tower - WHILE people were coming and going and trying to work in the building!  You'd have to set up a temporary elevator - but when you needed to fix part of that area, you'd have to tear down that elevator and set up a temporary elevator somewhere else. And so on. You'd have to build, work around, then tear down, then build again, then work around, then build... ALL while people are coming and going, ALL while the furniture is being replaced, ALL while the walls are getting repainted... ALL while life is going on INSIDE the building. No doubt it would be chaotic. That is EXACTLY what is happening with windows and waves.  The windows are where the body has "got it right" for a day or so - but then the building shifts and the brain works on something else - and it's chaos again while another temporary pathway is set up to reroute function until repairs are made.  

 

* NO LONGER ACTIVE on SA *

MISSION ACCOMPLISHED:  (6 year taper)      0mg Pristiq  on 13th November 2021

ADs since ~1992:  25+ years - 1 unknown, Prozac (muscle weakness), Zoloft; citalopram (pooped out) CTed (very sick for 2.5 wks a few months after); Pristiq:  50mg 2012, 100mg beg 2013 (Serotonin Toxicity)  Tapering from Oct 2015 - 13 Nov 2021   LAST DOSE 0.0025mg

Post 0 updates start here    My tapering program     My Intro (goes to tapering graph)

 VIDEO:   Antidepressant Withdrawal Syndrome and its Management

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  • Moderator Emeritus
4 hours ago, Capuli said:

I am going on holiday in a week

 

If you decide not to reinstate before going away, please make sure that you take your drug with you so that you have it with you if you change your mind.

* NO LONGER ACTIVE on SA *

MISSION ACCOMPLISHED:  (6 year taper)      0mg Pristiq  on 13th November 2021

ADs since ~1992:  25+ years - 1 unknown, Prozac (muscle weakness), Zoloft; citalopram (pooped out) CTed (very sick for 2.5 wks a few months after); Pristiq:  50mg 2012, 100mg beg 2013 (Serotonin Toxicity)  Tapering from Oct 2015 - 13 Nov 2021   LAST DOSE 0.0025mg

Post 0 updates start here    My tapering program     My Intro (goes to tapering graph)

 VIDEO:   Antidepressant Withdrawal Syndrome and its Management

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Thank you once again for all your sane advice.  it is true I am in a brain fog and am finding it very difficult to take any rational decisions.

I have decided to re-instate and see what happens.

I have cut open a 37.5mg slow release capsule to find it contains 3  small individual tablets, presumably each is 12.5mg.  

I have taken one of these as I don't believe I can make them any smaller. 

I will definitely keep a diary of what happens to me. 

I have plenty of the drug to take with me on holiday.

  • 1995-2005 Seroxat
  • 2005 -2019 March 31 Venlafaxine latterly 112.5 mg
  • 2019 April 1 - April 12 Venlafaxine slow release 75mg and 37.5mg on alternate days
  • 2019 April 13 - April 22 Venlafaxine slow release 37.5mg daily
  • 2019 April 23 - May 4 Venlafaxine slow release 37.5mg on alternate days
  • 2019 May 5 - nil
  • taking multivitamin supplement
Link to comment
  • Moderator Emeritus

You're very welcome.  I hope you are starting to feel a bit better for your holiday.

 

It's important to take the same dose at about the same time every day.

 

Please let us know how the reinstatement goes.  It will probably take several months minimum to stabilise.  During that time I suggest you investigate ways to get the doses you will need when you start tapering.

* NO LONGER ACTIVE on SA *

MISSION ACCOMPLISHED:  (6 year taper)      0mg Pristiq  on 13th November 2021

ADs since ~1992:  25+ years - 1 unknown, Prozac (muscle weakness), Zoloft; citalopram (pooped out) CTed (very sick for 2.5 wks a few months after); Pristiq:  50mg 2012, 100mg beg 2013 (Serotonin Toxicity)  Tapering from Oct 2015 - 13 Nov 2021   LAST DOSE 0.0025mg

Post 0 updates start here    My tapering program     My Intro (goes to tapering graph)

 VIDEO:   Antidepressant Withdrawal Syndrome and its Management

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I will. 

Thank you again for all the good advice

Got my diary set up - ready to go

 

  • 1995-2005 Seroxat
  • 2005 -2019 March 31 Venlafaxine latterly 112.5 mg
  • 2019 April 1 - April 12 Venlafaxine slow release 75mg and 37.5mg on alternate days
  • 2019 April 13 - April 22 Venlafaxine slow release 37.5mg daily
  • 2019 April 23 - May 4 Venlafaxine slow release 37.5mg on alternate days
  • 2019 May 5 - nil
  • taking multivitamin supplement
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