Neuro loneliness - Is it iatrogenic or am I isolating?

[Barbarannamated]

Sorry if this has been covered elsewhere. I'm going down a dark hole.

 

I'm not sure if others feel this alone or isolated and if so, how do you handle it?

 

It's not unusual for me to go for weeks without human interaction aside from husband and those words are only what's absolutey necessary. Ive been fighting this isolation for many years prior to DCing. Lost my career in 2001 (injury/pain), have no kids and am estranged from family back east. I admit I have pushed friends away thru this.

Things went downhill dramatically when I returned to CA after a few months of aimless driving across the country. I can't explain it, but it somehow kept me going. When I returned to go to the ISEPP Conference and get some things taken care of, the only person who persisted and pushed to understand the 'craziness' of my life, (and did a very good job-better than any therapist) turned out to be stalking me online (I believe 'keeping watch over me under a pseudonym' or some similar wording was used).

(NOTE TO SELF: do not attempt to understand people w/180+ IQs. No offense meant to anyone here!)

 

I know I need different housing and to be where I have some interaction and support, but no idea where to go. I live in a rural area w/my horses. They're good for me; one seems to know when I'm bad and opens the sliding glass door and comes in house which got very ugly when he didn't get out in time once.

 

I've deteriorated in past few weeks and not sure I can be totally on own right now. Not doing well w/ADLs. Assisted Living? OMG--I'm 49! I used to be one of those super-achievers. Very independent and ok doing things on my own until recently. Why did I seem to lose my strength as soon as I wasn't totally alone?

I'm grasping onto the hope that I will again have ANYthing to look forward to. I realize many of you have far worse issues w/ WD/DC syndrome. DAMN! - I don't mean to whine. I know my lack of support system (and betrayal by closest) is making this much harder. Trying to get out and involved in helping w/charities or similar. I haven't had a sense of purpose or 'job' in so long. It does horrid things to self confidence, self perception.

 

The only med that 'helps' temporarily is a prescription stimulant (what was aptly compared to 'a legal meth habit'). I hate that I'm dependent on it. Will I ever get out of Psychiatryland? I need to find a doc who will prescribe until I can get past this. Not sure if Dr. Shipko will. Have had a hard time just making phone calls. Don't feel able to see my old psych yet and ~well~ there was that phone call when I accused him of malpractice and threatened legal action when I first realized what was going on and naively thought my case was 'unique'.

Doc at a WalkIn clinic in Nashville gave me script for the stimulant (Schedule II) when I ran out about a month ago (I had the bottle). No questions asked. Shocked the h**l outa me! VERY controlled prescribing in CA - special prescription forms, no phone-ins, refills, etc.

 

And it's a holiday week. Not good for the loneliness.

I AM thankful for all of YOU!

 

 

 

 

 

[InNeedOfHope]

Since I have been off sick from work in September, I too have had little interaction with human beings aside from my immediate family. Until I became unable to get about because of the pain, a trip to the shop was the highlight of my day. I feel as if I have slipped off the face of the earth and life carries on regardless. I can no longer use Facebook as it hurts too much to see people getting on with normal things and enjoying their lives.

 

I don't see or hear from people as much. Some friends I have not heard from in months. I suspect it is from a suspicion that all my protestations about what this medicine has done to me and how the doctors don't get it, is disbelieved deep down inside by many of them and they probably think I am denying I should be on these medicines and are uncomfortable talking to and supporting me when they don't really believe in it and that I should listen to doctors and double my dose...after all, doctors can't be wrong.

 

On a good day, my thought process goes something like this....will this drug shorten my life? what if I get sick in the future? What if it has done x, y, z to my system. Then I think, if it has shortened my life then there is nothing I can do about it...BUT, I most certainly am shortening and wasting my life worrying about it.It is robbing my life in the here and now. So, I will make the most of each day, live in that day, and try to get something out of it. I'll maybe do something good for someone else, to see them smile, I will plan things for the future to aim for. Help someone in need with a kind few words.

 

As I said, this is on a good day, which at the moment is a struggle. I don't think I have cried for 4 days, which is a major achievement for me. I am trying to stay calm (not always managing this) and learning to REST, REST AND REST AGAIN, and fight the urge to do, because I know at the moment this is what my body needs. I have found that the more I have rested, the better my sleep has got (not great, but better than 4 hours) Of course, deep down inside I am worried my body is incapable of doing this and that I have reduced far too fast and I will not be able to take the pain now or in the future. My head on the left right now, feels slightly paralysed and stiff again after a reaction to hair dye, but I am resting to try to correct (I pray this works) and breathing is none to great.

 

I suppose I am rambling and not being very helpful, but sometimes even reading this might be enough to distract you for a few moments from your pain and to know there are at least a few people in the world who get this, AND a handful who have come out of the other side. I hang on to the stories of these people; it is people like this who are saving lives, not doctors it is sad to say. Thinking of you all these miles away.

[Barbarannamated]

Hey, good to hear from you! How did things go w/pain doc? I'll read your Intro thread to see if you posted there.

 

You make great points. I find that some of my best ideas arise while babbling

An aside: A great line from The Big Bang Theory "I'm a Theoretical Physicist. I think all day." If only I could get paid!

My lack of purpose has waxed and waned for 10 years since I was put on disability. I've dealt with it better at different times, but it's all resurfaced since DCing Pristiq and 'waking up' to a very empty life and so many years gone by. I think loneliness is recognized in the elderly, but not so much in other age groups. Some therapist referred to as 'end of family line effect' several years ago, but I've never heard of it since. I hesitate to even write it for fear it will show up in the DSM. I have one friend in a similar position - no family at all after her mother dies - although she has a busy career. I've considered asking the groups w/o kids (DINKS, Childless by Choice) for input. I'm sure I'm not alone, but it is rare to have no kids, nieces, nephews, etc. ANother factor I've realized recently is the apathy and struggle to initiate and follow-thru that happens on ADs. We discussed that here awhile back.

 

I can no longer use Facebook as it hurts too much to see people getting on with normal things and enjoying their lives.

 

I relate VERY well.

 

I don't see or hear from people as much. Some friends I have not heard from in months. I suspect it is from a suspicion that all my protestations about what this medicine has done to me and how the doctors don't get it, is disbelieved deep down inside by many of them and they probably think I am denying I should be on these medicines and are uncomfortable talking to and supporting me when they don't really believe in it and that I should listen to doctors and double my dose...after all, doctors can't be wrong.

Absolutely. But we know better and you actually got an admission of wrong with an apology! I'm still marveling at that.

 

As I said, this is on a good day, which at the moment is a struggle. I don't think I have cried for 4 days, which is a major achievement for me. I am trying to stay calm (not always managing this) and learning to REST, REST AND REST AGAIN, and fight the urge to do, because I know at the moment this is what my body needs. I have found that the more I have rested, the better my sleep has got (not great, but better than 4 hours)

EXCELLENT insight. I had a glimmer of this idea last week -- that our bodies are screaming for rest but we (our society) are so accustomed to pushing through that it is viewed as strength and admired ("Susie has all that on her plate but keeps going. I don't know how she does it!") And resting/downtime and asking for help are avoided (aside from the power nap) and seen as weakness/negative/'intruding on others' in our fast-paced, overscheduled world. Causes me to wonder how much 'depression' is actually normal fatigue. I told someone that my parasympathetic nervous system had taken over although I'm not really sure what I meant now.

 

I suppose I am rambling and not being very helpful, but sometimes even reading this might be enough to distract you for a few moments

Good job - it worked!!

 

So glad to hear you've had a better few days!! It is helpful to hear the positives. Thanks.

[InNeedOfHope]

I saw the pain doctor and they gave me a TENS machine, which did nothing, if anything it gave me more tingling and burning in my leg and have been too scared to try it again. They have some 'cold laser therapy' planned for me, which is a laser that penetrates the tissue and muscle. I researched it and it apparently raises endorphins, encourages tissue to regenerate and also raises serotonin!! So that will be a no for me too, the charity have said to steer clear of anything that raises serotonin and I agree. All these things don't seem to work for people in WD.

 

I hope we all come through this. Regarding the isolation, is there no friend who understands, who gets it? Does your husband get any of it? My sister in law does but she lives far away, but she texts and she believes. Finding someone who believes has got to be half the battle with this.

 

The book I read the other day, talks about laughter as a powerful remedy. It has studies which show laughter reduces pain and releases good stuff. I suppose it is obvious if crying and bad thoughts bring negative chemical changes then laughter, forced smiling etc should do the same.Perhaps rent a couple of comedies and say at this time of day, I am going to forget withdrawal and immerse myself and try to laugh. This is something I am going to try. Don't feel like laughing, but you never know, I will try anything!

 

Are your symptoms more mood related or pain related if you don't mind me asking.....see, trying to distract you again lol

[InNeedOfHope]

Even distracted myself from my own pain for a couple of minutes there...

 

Sometimes I do think things happen for a reason. Perhaps I was meant to find this site, when I was at my most desperate. Perhaps all the people on it have been drawn to it for a reason, to give them strength and knowledge from people who truly do get it. Perhaps one day people will look back and realise that it was sites like this and the people who are kind and good hearted enough, to care enough to help others come through it, that were responsible for saving lives. It may sound quite dramatic to talk of saving lives, but anyone who has ever been in this kind of hell, knows that is exactly what we are talking about.

[Barbarannamated]

Even distracted myself from my own pain for a couple of minutes there...

 

Sometimes I do think things happen for a reason. Perhaps I was meant to find this site, when I was at my most desperate. Perhaps all the people on it have been drawn to it for a reason, to give them strength and knowledge from people who truly do get it. Perhaps one day people will look back and realise that it was sites like this and the people who are kind and good hearted enough, to care enough to help others come through it, that were responsible for saving lives. It may sound quite dramatic to talk of saving lives, but anyone who has ever been in this kind of hell, knows that is exactly what we are talking about.

 

That's what it's all about. If I think too hard about the depth of it, it's overwhelming. So, I have to come back to doing whatever I can within reason. I have alot of free time

 

My issues have been nearly all mood and perception related. Very unlike what I was originally treated for long ago.

My husband...that's a story in itself. He's an MD. He's been treated w same meds (plus) for 20 yrs. and has not yet acknowledged that he's become a shell of himself. He believes they are working. I heard him ok a script for citalopram the other day and went ballistic in my mind. He's finally looking at how the studies were done. Picked up Robert Whitaker's book from the coffee table the other day. Told me last nite that the study designs were not strong - something I've been trying to tell him for months, but sometimes they have to arrive at their own conclusions in their own time. (sarcasm intended) I'm sure that is alot of the reason I'm having a tough time. It's a very complex problem and I feel like I'm living right in the middle of it, seeing both sides.

[Shanti]

I feel pretty good about my isolation at this time. I'm totally accepting my aloneness without feeling lonely at all. I have just really set it in my mind that this is a time in my life that I have to withdraw, not just from drugs, but from society. I rarely go anywhere. Just to the store and to the docs and pharmacy. My social life is completely online and I like it that way. I don't have to talk when I'm not feeling well enough. I can end conversations when I want. My life is on hold and I accept it and choose to be indulgent in it, so to speak. Because I accept it's on hold, I refuse to think too much about my future and decide to have full faith that it will be good. I leave it at that. I can't let myself get into negative thinking.

[Shanti]

I feel like it is imperative to my sanity to take this attitude. It's just survival the best way I can right now.

[Altostrata]

It was very hard for me to accept the isolation and loneliness at first -- I'm pretty much estranged from my awful family, too -- but I've accepted it. Like everything else, I do what I can to connect with people.

 

This is the challenge, right? To accept yourself as you are and do what you can. Even if we were all 100%, this would be a healthy philosophy.

 

Bar, I really appreciate your participation here. You are learning and sharing more and more every day.

[Barbarannamated]

I've cut everyone off. Not intentionally, but over the last year. Not sure why.

[Shanti]

I've cut everyone off. Not intentionally, but over the last year. Not sure why.

 

It is kind of depressing this time of year especially. I'm not doing anything for Thanksgiving. My kids and I had pizza today for Thanksgiving. Tomorrow they're going to their dad's girlfriend's parents house. I'm not too depressed because I am relieved I'm not expected to do anything this year. But it is kind of a bummer.

 

I did have trouble with loneliness at first, but now I'm not feeling it anymore and I don't know why.

[compsports]

I've cut everyone off. Not intentionally, but over the last year. Not sure why.

 

Barb,

 

I so relate to the issues you have raised.

 

As I mentioned in a PM, I have family in the area but I feel very lonely and isolated. I can't totally blame them as due to my issues, I haven't been able to generally reach out. Also, due to my apartment being totally messed up from years of neglect due to my indifference from psych meds and then having problems with WD, I haven't been able to invite anyone over. So of course, that is a factor as I am not doing my share of entertaining.

 

But in the limited amount of times I have tried to reach out, I felt rejected so as a result, I had a "what is the use" attitude.

 

Many times for example, I will think of things to email people about. But my emails mostly have not been returned so I have stopped doing it.

 

At some point, when I don't feel as emotionally vulnerable, I might become more assertive and try to find out what is going on.

 

Shanti - I think when I am not sleeping and feeling non functional - I am more accepting of being alone. But when I feel better and realize what I have missed, I get depressed.

 

Inneed - The other day, a sports talk show host was so funny about how he was going to take a nap after eating his Thanksgiving Dinner. I guess because I related, I found it very funny. It was just a great feeling to laugh because I hadn't done too much of it.

 

Barb - I can't remember if I mentioned this but the situation with your husband reminds me of dealing with family members regarding regular medical issues. They just feel that mainstream medicine is always right and never question it. It is a very eerie feeling.

 

CS

[summer]

This time of the year is difficult for a lot of people, whether they are on ADs/WD or not.

 

It's been years since I enjoyed the holidays. Basically, from right after Halloween until January 2, I just tolerate all the "joy", and I try not to be down when I'm around family, especially my granddaughter. It's an expectation of things no longer to be (if that makes sense). I remember when the holidays were fun and I looked forward to them... no longer. I have family around, but it really doesn't help. It's a state of mind.

 

I wish all of you an easy time of the holidays... and some fun and joy for all that can allow it.

[Altostrata]

summer, what is it about the holidays you don't like?

 

The shopping frenzy gets me down. Except if I need some electronic gizmo -- Black Friday is the best time to buy one of those.

 

Otherwise, I lay low.

[summer]

Well, it's about holidays past I think. And, I believe most people are going through the motions, doing what they have to do because it's expected. I don't see happiness and joy on the faces of most people... I see a sort of... well... it's here again! Whether it's Christmas or Chanukah... same thing. If people were honest, most would be happy to do away with this time of the year. Oh yeah... and I HATE the time change!

 

Aren't you glad you asked?

[Barbarannamated]

Thanks for everyone's input.

 

Shanti, I didn't know that you had kids. Do they live w/you? I do understand the protection that being alone provides although I've only been able to relax w/that a few times. Then the 'shoulds' kick in: I 'should' get outside, 'should' get dressed, 'should' return phone calls, etc.

 

I've grappled with this since losing my career in 2001 and being stuck in a system where it's financially risky to even attempt to get back to work. I never planned to have kids - was career-oriented - but now have neither and no 'relationships of necessity' (kids, work, family, even exes) or 'mandatory interation'. It's a very un-grounded feeling. I have been involved w/horse groups and people over the years, volunteer work, attended various churches, trying to find my niche. I know I'm supposed to be learning something in all of this - that grounding must come from within. I suspect that our society will become progressively isolated and disconnected -with virtual relationships replacing real ones. I need EMF interaction! Like the one therapist said of my marriage - there wasn't anything to work with. Even anger is better than nothing.

 

I've had a recurring dream that I lived in a plantation-type farmhouse with a bunch of unrelated people. Not sure of timeframe, sometime in the past and in the south. I almost always had a book in hand.

 

When I say that I haven't talked to anyone in weeks (aside from spouse who can't hear), I mean that absolutely literally. The last time I spoke to another human being (in person or by phone) was Monday, 1.5 weeks ago (maybe 2.5 weeks ago) for about 15 minutes. Prior to that, it was at ISEPP at the end of October. It definitely got worse by returning to CA after traveling across the country for 3+ months which forced me to interact at least w/people at hotels and restaurants. I think my situation is unusual, but probably more common than we realize, esp in elderly who have no relatives remaining. My parents are the youngest of each of their families and friends (almost all deceased) and have no grandchildren. Given my genepool, that's a good thing.

 

I'm not complaining - much has been my own choice and result of my circumstances and independent nature. I can't say that I've been shunned by friends; they try to contact me, but I've pulled away and that's the part I'm not understanding.I've been aware of my lack of relationships of necessity for years and haven't met anyone w/a similar set of factors (at my age). It took my psych 15 years to 'get' the full picture last summer. He had an aha! moment and said "Wow. You really are alone." I saw a holistic psychiatrist 1 time last summer. I mentioned to him that I often go for days or weeks w/o voice-to-voice conversation with someone I know. Then I told him I go to baseball games. He said "but you said you don't go out." He assumed that 'not talking to people I know on a regualr basis' meant that I don't go out. I said "Hell no! If I wait for someone to do something or go somewhere, I'd never do anything." He was totally baffled that I, a single female, went to baseball games alone. That was my one and only time seeing him.

 

Most of my longtime friends are across the country. The ones near me geographically are busy w/their own families and jobs. I haven't told anyone about WD. I don't expect people who trust our system to believe something so preposterous. I'm not going to stress myself attempting to explain. I've always been able to share in friends' happiness and celebrations, but I'm so sensitive right now. I just don't want to hear about dance recitals, engagements, college graduations, new cars, and other random boastings on Facebook. My one dear friend's sister is in alcohol rehab again and the whole family is having a tough time. I feel horrible that my reaction (to myself) was a mix of jealousy and anger that she had a place to get help w/alcohol.

[Barbarannamated]

Well, it's about holidays past I think. And, I believe most people are going through the motions, doing what they have to do because it's expected. I don't see happiness and joy on the faces of most people... I see a sort of... well... it's here again! Whether it's Christmas or Chanukah... same thing. If people were honest, most would be happy to do away with this time of the year. Oh yeah... and I HATE the time change!

Aren't you glad you asked?

 

Ditto. I tried and tried for yeeears to buy presents for my parents and sister. Year after year, about an hour after opening gifts, each one came to me and asked for the receipts so they could return/exchange. The last time I attempted (many years ago), I had the receipts ready, tossed them in the air and, as they fluttered to the ground, I promised them and myself that I would never buy another gift for them.

I've allowed myself a few drama queen moments

 

I don't buy or expect anything now. If I could sleep through, that would be IDEAL.

[Rhiannon]

I just want you to know that my heart goes out to you. All of you. I know isolation and loneliness.

 

I push myself all the time to be involved and connected with people, but I have that option available to me now because the drugs are releasing their stranglehold on my ability to get out of the house and my ability to bond and connect with others. For many, many years I wasn't even able to really have friends. And when I'm in active withdrawal I sometimes can't leave the house, even now.

 

But I am able to work now, at a regular job, with other people around, which I was unable to do during all the years I was taking various psych meds. It's got downsides, but I'm not as isolated as when I worked at home.

 

And I have the gift of two daughters; they live far away, but I know they love me, and we will all be seeing each other soon for the holidays.

 

Barbara, if you do want to talk on the phone sometime, let me know. I get very lonely sometimes too. We are social creatures and we are not meant to be isolated. It's a basic need of the organism, like air and food and water and exercise.

[Nikki]

Wasn't sure where to post this....Maybe under Neuro-emotions?

 

I don't know if this is medication, stress, or just me.

 

Lately, on the weekends I go to my Saturday Morning Beach Meeting and then afterwards, brunch with a big group of friends. And for the remainder of the weekend I just spend it by myself. House projects, a nap, thrift shopping for entertainment.

 

During the week, I work (business is slow now and making me worried), go to Al-anon meetings, and have lunch afterwards with a large group of friends. I go to Mindful Meditation on Thursday evenings and sometimes TM on Monday evenings.

 

I do go to the movies with some of my friends.

 

In between all of this I take my mother for her errands quite a bit.

 

In the last 2 weeks, outside of these activities, I feel like I am isolating. I have a few friends that I am not interested in seeing and don't know if this is Neuro-emotion stuff, or I have just lost interest in them. I actually have lost interest, but don't know if this is

me wanting to be around healthier people or this neuro stuff.

 

I can have a tendency to isolate. Although I haven't done that in a few years.

 

I do get melancholy on Sundays, and today is Sunday.

 

I don't want my decisions to detach to be coming from medication. I want it to be from getting healthier and wanting to stick with winners.

 

Can anyone relate? Can we talk about Isolation vs just time alone???????

[amg2012]

To me, you sound "ACTIVE" as everything is relative.

 

I realize that I have not done one social thing for 3 weeks!

I keep myself very busy and spend far to much time "doing" rather than "being" or "enjoying."

 

When I think about what a hermit I have become it brings tears to my eyes. Not sure if this is drug related, as I just posted elsewhere, we tend to first place blame on withdrawal.

 

I am married so I am not really "alone" but, although my marriage is not an unhappy one, it is an empty one!

 

I have to think about this and could use some help here.

[GiaK]

I think this is a very important issue and maybe you've seen my post on it since you're very much using the same language I used (but it's also entirely possible you just came up with the same line of thinking)

 

I have found that alone time is TOTALLY important and while the isolation that the illness has brought me (I can't go out and people have mostly abandoned me) is an awful thing, the truth is I need a TON of time ALONE and in some ways am grateful for it...

 

the other thing that is funny is that I'm reposting this article tomorrow on the blog...(midnight tonight) because many people found it helpful and continue to find it helpful...so it will be on the homepage of Beyond Meds again tomorrow...

 

this is the first time it was posted: Are you “isolating” and “withdrawing” or do you just need to spend some time alone? http://beyondmeds.com/2011/10/10/alonetime/

 

Anyway, I don't fret over this anymore...sometimes I genuinely lonely as that is what chronic illness does, but the transformative process that this is allowing for needs a lot of alone time...and it's good for me...such is my life now...paradoxical perhaps...

 

and as amg2012 said, you sound really active to me as well...

[Barbarannamated]

This topic is so important! I think I posted something almost identical several months ago and then a few days later stumbled across Gia's previous writings on exactly what I was trying to express.

 

The evolutionary underpinnings to all of this are fascinating. It's extremely difficult to blot out society's "shoulds" about connecting / not isolating and withdrawing and listen to one's own body and intuition.

 

I agree that you sound EXTREMELY active, Nikki! You have done more socializing in one week than I've done in the past year. Not exaggerating. It seems you've been toying with this question for awhile. When I went to find the thread I began awhile ago, I found this one you started also:

 

http://survivingantidepressants.org/index.php?/topic/1939-isolating/page__fromsearch__1

[Nikki]

Barb when I posted that I was really sick. I had a UTI the Root canal that went awry along with the bacterial infection from the root canal. The Ibuprofen, Cipro, Amoxicillian fiasco.

 

I really did need to lay down.

 

amg: you said you needed some help in the being alone in the marriage, please feel free to PM me or send me an e-mail at any time. Been there.

 

Giak: I did read the blog and I did read it once before.

 

For some reason (probably because I isolated alot on Lexapro) I feel if I am not out socializing, I might be isolating.

 

These drugs can do this. I actually do like my "down time". But this weekend I had to ask myself if it is isolation.

 

There are some events coming up which I would rather not attend, because of not really wanting to spend money. When I was on Lexapro I did not want to go to any events.

I don't really do that now and I want to catch myself.

 

I would actually like to do more.

[Barbarannamated]

For some reason (probably because I isolated alot on Lexapro) I feel if I am not out socializing, I might be isolating.

 

Nikki,

 

Perhaps you could explain the above comment.

 

Also, how did "isolating" play out when you were on Lexapro?

 

B

[alexjuice]

I isolated on lexapro because I felt unmotivated to reach out to people. I had increased anxiety and miss perceived the risks of socializing. Also, I developed weird thoughts about my body and didn't like to be touched by other people...that my body was weird and people would judge me if they touched my person.

 

More than anything, I saw no purpose in having relationships. I rarely felt lonely. I'd get drunk a few times a week and usually interact in some way. In fact, if I didn't drink I could have gone a long time living as a hermit, attending classes silently thn returning home, not speaking with anyone.

 

It's a terrible sadness, looking back.

 

Nikki, what resonates with me is your few friends you don't want to see. I ave a couple of friends who have not been supportive of my ordeal except in that they are a good diversion. For a time, I enjoyed speaking with them even if we focused more and more on them. Eventually, it became all about them and their endless problems. While it used to help me, to escape a bit from my own issues by offering support, the one-sidedness has become unhealthy. As I have gotten worse, it's harder for me to cre bout their marital/money/financial/dailyBS.... And I sent an email the other day informing ive taken a hiatus and will not be answering calls or emails.

 

I felt angry with myself for allowing these relationships to become so one sided and unhelpful. I felt it wasn't fair to them either since I stopped talking about my health 2 years ago after a few failed attempts; they just didn't understand.

 

I am not sure which is better, having little social contact or having relationships which in large part are counterproductive. I have recently cut off contact with my friends, fired my CBT therapist and barely speak with my father. I know what you mean about finding a good balance between interaction and tranquility, which re both important to me.

[Shanti]

I'm an isolationist. I am finding peace with it in acceptance. I've pretty much been like this since my mid 20's, but even before that I only stuck to a few friends. And even the friends I chose to be close to were the type that don't put expectations on me. I don't like attachments and feeling obligations that I don't need. Aside from immediate family. It's just how I am. But I did notice it became much more prevelant in my personality after I started taking Cymbalta, the start of my psyche med experience. It's only gotten worse especially with the withdrawal. I notice that some other people going through this are saying they were pretty much loners even before meds. It might just be a personality thing, but amplified by the meds then withdrawal. In fact, I'd say that the personality type might lead many to choose antidepressants because they might be sensitive people. You can look online for "Highly Sensitive Person". It might be due to wanting to avoid drama that usually comes from having many close relationships. I realized that I had an inner conflict with my personality type vs. the societal norms. It's so ingrained in our culture to "need" others, that we might feel there is something wrong with us when there isn't. It's okay to be who we are. Of course I can't speak for others, but that is how I feel. When I accepted that it's okay for me to be a bit reclusive, then I felt the inner conflict leave me. Acceptance.

[Barbarannamated]

Well said, Shanti!

 

When I was an adolescent, I remember an older cousin describing me as a kid who had fewer but closer friends, in contrast to my sister who had several superficial acquaintances (very few now). That comment stuck with me and despite occasional jealousy of "the popular girls", I was ok with a small circle of friends and also spending time alone.

 

Ive become more aware of the difficulty that most people in our society have when faced with free time, especially alone. *not referring to anyone here!*

It's come to my attention recently with friends dealing with Empty Nest Syndrome. I never had a nest, so it's interesting to observe. Also, this weekend, a very social and outgoing friend posted on Facebook that she finds it challenging to know what to do with free time (a few hours) when the constant whirlwind of her life slows down. Her comment stopped me cold since ive spent the last 11 years trying to stay occupied since losing my job (forced medical retirement), no kids to care for and reclusive husband. I became very comfortable doing things on my own: movies, bookstores, libraries, eating out, going to stores to try clothes on that I would never buy, looking at model homes for ideas, driving to explore new places and listen to music.

 

I got involved in church for a few years, but that was not a good fit for me. TV is mind numbing. I like to be outdoors.

[Shanti]

I can totally relate. I observed this as well, how a lot of people aren't comfortable with being being alone or having silence and stillness in their life. I can't say for sure, but to me it seems that these people aren't comfortable with themselves if they can't stand to spend time alone with themselves. I love to contemplate and meditate on anything and everything. I'm a thinker. I like to be alone with my thoughts. Doesn't it seem these people must not feel comfortable with their own thoughts or something?

[Sparrow]

All of humanity's problems stem from man's inability to sit quietly in a room alone.

 

― Blaise Pascal, Pensées

[Nikki]

Well said Sparrow...

 

Barb...when I was on Lexapro I only wanted to come home, shower, sit if my favorite chair and watch TV. I just didn't do the things I had always done.

 

Outside all the time, seeing friends, etc.

 

While I was tapering Lexapro I started to get out again. My daughter and I would rollerblade for 7 miles a few times a week. I would go to the beach and pool, my Al-Anon meetings, and other activities. Being out during the taper kept me out of the anxiety part and even when it cropped up, it was better to be out then at home.

 

I am out most of the day even when I am not working. Yes, I am busy and active. Thank God

 

I do know now that the Neuro-emotion aspect of messing with these meds can bring on (for me), isolating because everyone annoys me and I am a Saint attitude

 

Yep I can go there, just like a Diva. Soooo I have to keep myself in check and I did just drop the dose of Celexa and I can get snooty.....

 

Just sayin'

[Barbarannamated]

I just posted this on the apathy thread thinking it was this thread.

 

" I don't know if I'm ok being alone or if SS/NRIs just made me feel ok with being alone. I feel the aloneness and loneliness and *stillness* inside my head now and it's AWFUL. Today was a day of feeling every second tick by. And, of course, *everyone else* is busy doing something interesting and purposeful or so my mind imagines. It's frightening that I cant remember what I've done for the last 11 years since I worked last. Aside from the nonsense i mentioned earlier, it's a blur."

 

Nikki, when I was tapering, I was out every day from noon until 9 or 10pm, fueled by akathisia and some anxiety. I would drive for hours, listening to music, cocooned in my car. Then one day in July, I got up and decided I was leaving, that day. I packed all I could into my car and started driving east. I ended up driving all the way across the country, spending time in Nashville, a small town in Texas, Scottsdale.. I drove and listened to music until I was tired and found a hotel. For 3 months. It was kinda crazy, but very interesting. I had NO IDEA that the weirdness I was feeling was due to brain issues. I had just found this group, so was aware of withdrawal. I returned to California last October and went downhill, crashed. My car is still in Nashville in a parking lot. Ive had a rental since late October but have only driven it a dozen times or so.

 

Bizarre.

[starlitegirlx]

This topic is so important! I think I posted something almost identical several months ago and then a few days later stumbled across Gia's previous writings on exactly what I was trying to express.

 

The evolutionary underpinnings to all of this are fascinating. It's extremely difficult to blot out society's "shoulds" about connecting / not isolating and withdrawing and listen to one's own body and intuition.

 

I agree that you sound EXTREMELY active, Nikki! You have done more socializing in one week than I've done in the past year. Not exaggerating. It seems you've been toying with this question for awhile. When I went to find the thread I began awhile ago, I found this one you started also:

 

http://survivingantidepressants.org/index.php?/topic/1939-isolating/page__fromsearch__1

 

I haven't done that level of socializing in years. Truly. Years. As far as dealing with withdrawal goes, I think a degree of isolation is probably in our best interest. And yes, i deliberately call it isolation because we need to isolate ourselves to some degree just to deal with what we are going through. People do not help during withdrawal and often our symptoms make it difficult to function or even exacerbate the issues we face.

 

Of course, I've been a fan of isolation for some years now having realized that solitude is actually therapeutic for me. People and a busy life are too much for me, or they were too much for me before withdrawal. Now that I am in withdrawal and functioning is limited, 'isolation' is my preferred state. People irritate me more often than not even on my best days. Not even so much of what they do but that they can do these things that I find myself struggling with on a good day.

 

Of course, I'm no longer prone to loneliness. I went through a strange and spiritual stage early on in my withdrawal that caused me to realize that people have done very little to help me during my life. I survived because of me and my strength. Few if any were ever actually there beyond one good friend and my father who has been dead for 16 years. And even my friend has limits as to what she can understand or do or what we can converse about since she can never comprehend on any level what it is I feel I have lost in my life due to my illness. She has options I never had. So I have found that I'm best off to 'isolate' though I prefer to think of it as a sort of solitary sanctuary that aids in my well being because that's exactly what it does. I live in my bedroom. Truly. In the past six months I've probably left it a total of 15 hours, if that. A major part of it is due to the withdrawal symptoms and issues, but if that were not there, the most I would add would be a trip or two to the cafe and perhaps meeting my best friend there for an hour or two on top of that. But my life is one of a 44 year old woman living on SSDI who has no boyfriend or husband and lives with her crazy mother. For me, I had to isolate to avoid my mother beginning many years ago. It was a coping skill.

 

I really don't see the harm in isolating one's self unless you are using that isolation time to get into all sorts of unhealthy thinking which I used to do. Now, my isolation consists of TV, video games, movies, sleep, reading, and whatever else interests me that keeps my mind off aspects of my reality that are not to my liking. Personally, I have found the days go by rather quickly and are generally rather good when i am distracted by TV and/or video games. My favorite video games that I played nearly non stop since may were the mass effect series on my xbox that I never used (bought in 2010) much until now. It's a scifi roleplaying game that removes me as far from reality as possible. I immerse myself in that world and become that character and play the different classes (on the easiest level possible so no stress) and even hack it so it's easier. Fun and me not thinking about anything I don't like and none of that neuro stuff turns into a well spent or wasted day. Kind of bored with it now but after some TV I'll go back to it. Suffice to say that for me, given my life circumstances, isolation serves me well, but partially because i don't have many other options and of those options few would help me maintain the best possible health and mental health I can, which I feel I am doing right now.

[Shanti]

I can totally relate. I never feel lonely and don't need other people to make me feel better. When I'm sick I don't want comfort from people. When I was in the hospital for a week, I didn't like people to visit. I get all of my strength from within, and other people that try to help me only get in the way of it. I totally agree that there's nothing wrong with being alone if you stay in a healthy mind. I rate pretty high in the Aperger's test, and one of the prominent traits that I share with other Aspies is not having a very high tolerance for the personas that other people wear. I get so annoyed about the phoniness of other people, how they aren't BEING. I don't feel that many people are genuine. I say what I want to say, directly, and I always mean what I say. I find no reason to put on airs. People manipulate and create drama that is totally necessary just in everyday conversation, like gossip. There are only two people in my life that I feel are genuine; my son and my daughter, and they never irritate me at all. I don't know why I never met others that don't feel like they're sincere in their being. But I just think it's from being molded by our society. Despite how I feel now, I used to get lonely until I had my spiritual experience and it changed my life. Thank God, because I used to be on a never ending, impossible quest to find someone sincere and true to themselves. No one can be true to me if they can't even live in their own truth with themselves.

[Barbarannamated]

A year has passed and this is worse than ever. Weekends are especially lonely.

 

I just can't seem to force myself to go out. I don't think it's agoraphobia because when we visited husband family in Vegas, I was out everyday and exploring on my own a few days.

 

It seems to be withdrawal-related. I recall this feeling after several CTs and switches in 2008.

 

I'm having trouble maintaining interest in books, TV, or movies. I have a few friends who invite me out occasionally, but I feel a wall, like I'm in a bubble and separated from them. I seem to be ok with strangers and husband's family when I do interact.

 

When I got out to doctor last week and then returned home, I immediately broke into tears when inside the house and had to go back out. I stayed the night and next day in our little motorhome.

 

Any insight appreciated.

[Shanti]

Barb, you are doing a work. You help a lot of people every day. This is a life purpose that is more needed than working in an office typing up letters or something. Never doubt that you can be more of a help to society, if even from your computer as you're doing.

 

But I totally understand the feeling of being directionless. I feel it too. It's just that it's so ingrained by society that we're only being productive and worthy of existence if we're working for someone at a workplace. Maybe affirmations will help, to re-program your mind to believe that all that you do here for people is more valuable than most 9 - 5 jobs. A path of self discovery and self transcendence can be the most high reasons for being, imo. You have an opportunity to have all the time you need to do that.

 

Isolation. I don't know how to advice you about that, in regards to needing help. But as far as isolation on the emotional level, to me it is fine. I'm introverted and value time alone. I can happily be a hermit. Have you ever taken a Myers Briggs personality test?

[Barbarannamated]

Thanks, Shanti. Very much. I know my situation is more than withdrawal though that is magnifying everything to a degree im not certain of. It became very unwell in the early 90s with the lupus reaction to Zoloft and I'm just so tired. Life has been very long. My endocrinologist is not a fan of SSRIs or neuroleptics, but he apparently feels ok about ECT as he mentioned it at my last appointment. No, I won't.

I need something good or even remotely interesting to look forward to. I used to have good internal motivation, but it's not there anymore. I suppose it's the Addison's Disease, too. I need help with day to day activities, but dont know where to find it. My doctor has no answers and doesn't understand that my husband is not really my partner in life even though I've told him. My dad wants me to go back to PA and I am considering, but my sister is still very into drugs and police at her house on a regular basis and then they call my 85 yo father who lives nearby. I just don't know if exposing myself to that drama again is a good exchange for being near other emotional support.

 

I'm sorry to drone on about this. I keep thinking there's must be some solution I'm not seeing. Or maybe my situation with husband is not as bad as I'm making it out to be and I need to make the best of it. When we're with his family, we both make more of an effort. Something about the extra interpersonal energy..?

 

I had another ordeal with pharmacy yesterday that sent me into a panic spiral (they shorted me 5 klonopin tabs and I didn't notice until I was out). They believed me and fixed it, but the hour of frantically searching for the missing K sent my adrenaline soaring and then a CRASH.

 

Thanks for listening.