tripsteady: Lexapro 20mg for 8 years

[tripsteady]

Hi All

 

So I was prescribed 10mg lexapro for intense anxiety and depression about 8 years ago. My anxiety and depression got better, but then got worse after about 4 years, the doctor then upped my dose to 20mg for the last 4 years.

 

For the last 2 years or so I have felt emotionally numb. Through meditation and mindfulness I have been able to reduce my depression and I would like to get off Lexpro so I can enjoy the simple things in life again.

 

Nice to meet you all!
 

regards

 

tripsteady

[ChessieCat]

Hi tripsteady and welcome to SA,

 

You've come to the right place and it sounds like you have discovered SA before you even start tapering, which is great.

 

SA recommends tapering by no more than 10% of the current dose followed by a hold of about 4 weeks which allows the brain to adapt to not getting as much of the drug.  Why taper by 10% of my dosage?

 

If we remove the drug too quickly we can experience withdrawal symptoms.  Dr Joseph Glenmullen's Withdrawal Symptoms

 

Tips for tapering off Lexapro (escitalopram)

 

Please create your drug signature using the following format.   Keep it simple.  NO diagnoses or symptoms please - thank you.

• details for last 2 years - dates, ALL drugs, doses
• summary for older than 2 years - just years and drug/s

Account Settings – Create or Edit a signature

 

 

I will provide some more information in the next 2 posts.  This is your own introductions topic where your can ask questions about your own situation and journal your progress.

 

__________________________________________________________________________________

 

(My apologies, I forgot that the software merges 2 posts made in quick succession)

 

Here's some additional information:

 

Recovery isn't linear it happens in a Windows and Waves Pattern

 

Withdrawal Normal Description

When we take a psychiatric drug, we are adding chemical/s to the brain.  The brain then has to change to adapt to getting the chemical/s.  It might have to change something to do with A and then once that change has been made it affects B so another change has to be made and so on down the line.  It is a chain reaction, a domino effect.

 

The same thing happens when we take the drug away.  That's why it's possible to experience such a vast array of withdrawal symptoms, and they can change, and be of different intensity.

 

are-we-there-yet-how-long-is-withdrawal-going-to-take

 

These explain it really well:

 

Video:  Healing From Antidepressants - Patterns of Recovery

 

On 8/31/2011 at 5:28 AM, Rhiannon said:

When we stop taking the drug, we have a brain that has designed itself so that it works in the presence of the drug; now it can't work properly without the drug because it's designed itself so that the drug is part of its chemistry and structure. It's like a plant that has grown on a trellis; you can't just yank out the trellis and expect the plant to be okay. When the drug is removed, the remodeling process has to take place in reverse. SO--it's not a matter of just getting the drug out of your system and moving on. If it were that simple, none of us would be here. It's a matter of, as I describe it, having to grow a new brain. I believe this growing-a-new-brain happens throughout the taper process if the taper is slow enough. (If it's too fast, then there's not a lot of time for actually rebalancing things, and basically the brain is just pedaling fast trying to keep us alive.) It also continues to happen, probably for longer than the symptoms actually last, throughout the time of recovery after we are completely off the drug, which is why recovery takes so long.

 

AND

 

On 12/4/2015 at 2:41 AM, apace41 said:

Basically- you have a building where the MAJOR steel structures are trying to be rebuilt at different times - ALL while people are coming and going in the building and attempting to work.

It would be like if the World Trade Center Towers hadn't completely fallen - but had crumbled inside in different places.. Imagine if you were trying to rebuild the tower - WHILE people were coming and going and trying to work in the building!  You'd have to set up a temporary elevator - but when you needed to fix part of that area, you'd have to tear down that elevator and set up a temporary elevator somewhere else. And so on. You'd have to build, work around, then tear down, then build again, then work around, then build... ALL while people are coming and going, ALL while the furniture is being replaced, ALL while the walls are getting repainted... ALL while life is going on INSIDE the building. No doubt it would be chaotic. That is EXACTLY what is happening with windows and waves.  The windows are where the body has "got it right" for a day or so - but then the building shifts and the brain works on something else - and it's chaos again while another temporary pathway is set up to reroute function until repairs are made.  

 

Edited August 8, 2019 by ChessieCat

[ChessieCat]

We strongly encourage members to learn and use non drug coping techniques to help get through tough times.

 

Understanding what is happening helps us to not get caught up with the second fear, or fear of the fear.  This happens when we experience sensations in our body and because we don't understand them we are scared of them and then start to panic.

 

This document has a diagram of the body explaining what happens in the body when we become anxious:

 

https://www.getselfhelp.co.uk/docs/AnxietySelfHelp.pdf

 

Anxiety Stuff - all kinds of stuff about anxiety attacks and things that help ...

 

Audio FEMALE VOICE:  First Aid for Panic (4 minutes)

 

Audio MALE VOICE:  First Aid for Panic (4 minutes)

 

Non-drug techniques to cope

 

dealing-with-emotional-spirals

 

Dr Claire Weekes suffered from anxiety and learned and taught ways of coping.  There are videos available on YouTube.

 

Claire Weekes' Method of Recovering from a Sensitized Nervous System

 

Audio:  How to Recover from Anxiety - Dr Claire Weekes

 

CBT Course:  An Introductory Self-Help Course in Cognitive Behaviour Therapy

 

Resources:  Centre for Clinical Interventions (PDF modules that you can work through, eg:  Depression, Distress Intolerance, Health Anxiety, Low Self-Esteem, Panic Attacks, Perfectionism, Procrastination, Social Anxiety, Worrying)

 

On 4/28/2017 at 4:03 AM, brassmonkey said:

 

AAF: Acknowledge, Accept, Float.  It's what you have to do when nothing else works, and can be a very powerful tool in coping with anxiety.  The neuroemotional anxiety many of us feel during WD is directly caused by the drugs and their chemical reactions in the brain.  Making it so there is nothing we can do about them.  They won't respond to other drugs, relaxation techniques and the like.  They do, however, react very well to being ignored.  That's the concept behind AAF.  Acknowledge, get to know the feeling involved, explore them.  Accept, These feelings are a part of you and they aren't going anywhere fast. Float, let the feeling float off as you get on with your life as best as you can.  It's a well documented fact that the more you feed in to anxiety the worse it gets.  What starts as generalized neuroemotinal anxiety can be easily blown into a full fledged panic attack just by thinking about it.

 

I often liken it to an unwanted house guest.  At first you talk to them, have conversations, communicate with them.  After a while you figure out that they aren't leaving and there is nothing you can do to get rid of them.  So you go on about your day, working around them until they get bored and leave.

 

It can take some practice, but AAF really does work.  I hope you give it a try.

 

 

[tripsteady]

guys, you have no idea how much this means to me. This is exactly what I needed and I thought I was all alone in this. I will take my time and read the info above and follow it to the letter. thank you again for your help,  you get nothing from it, yet you help me and I sincerely appreciate that.

[ChessieCat]

I was very relieved to find SA after reducing my drug by 50% for 2 weeks and suffering bad withdrawal symptoms.  My intro topic is titled "so I'm not the only one".  It was both a relief and a shock to find other people going through similar and worse.

 

It's a good idea to throw out the calendar and listen to your body/symptoms and hold when needed.  It's generally better to hold for longer then to reduce too soon.  At times of additional stress, both good (eg holidays) and bad, it is better to hold until things settle down.  Acceptance

 

There are many existing topics on this site.  If anything concerns you I suggest you do a search to find what information there is here.  I suggest researching any drug  or supplement before taking it.  Only ever start one thing, or make one change, at a time and start with a small dose to see how you react to it.  Keep it Simple, Slow and Stable.  I like to use google and add survivingantidepressants.org to my search term.

 

The only supplements which SA recommends are (remember one at a time and a low dose):

 

Magnesium

Omega-3 Fish Oil

 

The easiest was to calculate your new dose is to multiply the current dose by 0.9.  If the result is an amount that is difficult to measure, always round up so that the reduction will be less than 10%.

 

And something that I will caution you about. Impatience.  It seems to be part and parcel of this tapering journey to go through times when you want to get it over and done with and go faster.  Being a member here and getting the support of other fellow "trippers" (ie companions on the journey) can help us to stay patient and keep on track.  It's a marathon, not a sprint.  We will get there one day, but it may not be as quickly as we would like.

 

Another thing that is good to know.  Some, perhaps many, members find that the lower their dose gets the slower they need to go, reducing by less and/or holding for longer.  And there may also be doses which are harder for you to get past than others. 

 

Why taper paper: dose-occupancy curves

 

When to end the taper and jump to zero?

[Siamese]

After two years tapering Lexapro 10 mg,  twenty months zero now. It was a long road, with small windows and big waves, but very much worth doing it. SA will help you through. 

Wish you all the best and please keep reading here, it will help you through the darkest hours!

 

Kind regards,

Siamese

[PatriciaVP]

Hi Tripsteady,

Welcome to SA from a fellow Lexapro taperer. This is not an easy drug to come off of,  but it can be done. Healing does happen. 

 

One thing I've learned over this journey is that you don't need to be all the way off the drug in order to feel significantly better. I'm still at 5mg, and tapering at a speed that makes a snail look fast. I'm a totally different person, however,  than I was when I started this process.  I am so much more patient and understanding. I can actually feel joy now. 

 

We all want to experience being drug free, but that can take a very long time.  Don't let that discourage you because wonderful improvements will be happening all along. 

 

Peace, love and healing. 

[tripsteady]

Guys. thank you for all the responses, Ive read everything in depth and Im ready to taper. Im glad I have this resource as support and I will endevour to help others as well.

 

Have got my pill cutter and scale and might get some liquid so it is easier to taper. im planning on starting this on Monday the 12th of August

[PH1]

Tripsteady,

There are lots of folks here who, unfortunately, are going through the same experience.   This is a solid, supportive community.  Just as others have said, Go slow in your taper (10% a month or slower) and listen to your body and you will make it.   I have had the ‘privilege’ of tapering off two meds, one being Lexapro.   Overall I’ve had a manageable time during my taper.  When I start to feel less than well, I slow down my taper and hold a bit longer.   

 

You’ll get there but it will take time.  We are here for you!

[jozeff]

10 hours ago, PatriciaVP said:

 

 

One thing I've learned over this journey is that you don't need to be all the way off the drug in order to feel significantly better. I'm still at 5mg, and tapering at a speed that makes a snail look fast. I'm a totally different person, however,  than I was when I started this process.  I am so much more patient and understanding. I can actually feel joy now. 

 

Wow patricia,

 

This is literally the first time I read this anywhere. This gives me hope! I was planning on waiting 7 years taper before I could feel happiness again.....

 

Tripsteady, I'm very glad you found this site! Take it slow and you'll thank yourself later. Believe me, fast changes can be devestating for your CNS. Your CNS controls literally everything in your body ( unfortunately I discovered this myself) so you saved yourself a lot of trouble by looking for advice here. Well done!

 

Good luck and let us know how your tapering is going.

 

Cheers guys 

 

Jozeff

 

 

 

 

[tripsteady]

Hi Guys, starting my taper today and will hold this for the next 4 weeks ( 12/08/2019 to 12/09/2019)

[PH1]

Keep us posted on how you are doing.   From your signature your first cut was a bit more than 10%.   The recommended is no faster than 10% every 4 weeks.

[ChessieCat]

9 hours ago, PH1 said:

From your signature your first cut was a bit more than 10%.

 

You've made a 12.5% reduction.

 

Your planned reduction from 17.5mg to 15mg will be a 14.3% reduction.  If you then reduce from 15mg to 12.5mg (I'm assuming that you are planning to drop each time by 2.5mg) that would be a 16.66% reduction.

 

SA recommends tapering by no more than 10% of the current dose followed by a hold of about 4 weeks to allow the brain to adapt to not getting as much of the drug.  The amount of each reduction becomes less.  Tips for tapering off Lexapro (escitalopram)

 

See also:  Why taper paper: dose-occupancy curves

 

The easiest way to calculate the next dose is to multiply the current dose by 0.9.

 

Because you have made a 12.5% reduction it might be best if you hold for at least 5 weeks.  If after that time you are at  WDnormal (withdrawal normal) you could then reduce by 10%, which would be 17.5mg x 0.9 =  15.75mg.  If the amount is difficult to measure it is best to round up to ensure that the reduction is not more than 10%.

 

Please be aware that withdrawal symptoms can be delayed, so if you continue to reduce by more than 10% you might find that you suddenly get hit with withdrawal symptoms from the accumulated large reductions.

Edited August 15, 2019 by Sassenach
misspell

[ChessieCat]

It takes about 4 days for a dose change to get to full level (aka steady state) in the blood and a bit longer for it to register in the brain.

 

If you find that you start getting unbearable withdrawal symptoms in the next few days you might want to consider updosing by a small amount.  You might find that increasing your dose by 0.5mg might be enough to bring the symptoms to a tolerable level.

 

Please do not jump back up to 20mg.

[tripsteady]

 

6 hours ago, ChessieCat said:

 

You've made a 12.5% reduction.

 

Your planned reduction from 17.5mg to 15mg will be a 14.3% reduction.  If you then reduce from 15mg to 12.5mg (I'm assuming that you are planning to drop each time by 2.5mg) that would be a 16.66% reduction.

 

SA recommends tapering by now more than 10% of the current dose followed by a hold of about 4 weeks to allow the brain to adapt to not getting as much of the drug.  The amount of each reduction becomes less.  Tips for tapering off Lexapro (escitalopram)

 

See also:  Why taper paper: dose-occupancy curves

 

The easiest way to calculate the next dose is to multiply the current dose by 0.9.

 

Because you have made a 12.5% reduction it might be best if you hold for at least 5 weeks.  If after that time you are at  WDnormal (withdrawal normal) you could then reduce by 10%, which would be 17.5mg x 0.9 =  15.75mg.  If the amount is difficult to measure it is best to round up to ensure that the reduction is not more than 10%.

 

Please be aware that withdrawal symptoms can be delayed, so if you continue to reduce by more than 10% you might find that you suddenly get hit with withdrawal symptoms from the accumulated large reductions.

 

You are right. I am going  to do this properly. after two days on that 12.5% reduction I have gone back up to 20mg and will do a proper 10% taper fromn Saturday the 17th onwards

 

So that would be 18mg now, not 17.5 

 

So I was dividing my pills and I weighed the 20mg and it is actually 26.mg. So I am calcuting 10% reduction of 26mg yeah? At 24.3mg per day? I'm assuming the extra 6mg is filler/binder in the tablet

6 hours ago, ChessieCat said:

It takes about 4 days for a dose change to get to full level (aka steady state) in the blood and a bit longer for it to register in the brain.

 

If you find that you start getting unbearable withdrawal symptoms in the next few days you might want to consider updosing by a small amount.  You might find that increasing your dose by 0.5mg might be enough to bring the symptoms to a tolerable level.

 

Please do not jump back up to 20mg.

Dammit, so I only saw this and had already jumped back up to 20mg after only two days on 17.5mg so I can start the taper again on Saturday the 17th and do a proper 10% reduction.

[ChessieCat]

I suggest that you stay on 20mg for a least 1 month or maybe a bit longer.  It is better to start from a nice stable foundation than to start tapering again too soon.
 

Stability

 

WDnormal (withdrawal normal)

 

In the scheme of getting off your drug, an extra month or 6 weeks isn't going to make much difference.  The aim is to get off with minimal discomfort.  It's a marathon, not a sprint.

[tripsteady]

Hi Guys

 

Just an update, after the last drop and mess around I went back up to 20mg and have now started a taper again from yesterday at exactly 10% less than my current dose.

 

The 20mg tablet weighed 26mg (due to filler)

 

The plan is as below (is in grams due to making it easier to compare to my scale)

 

18th sept - 17th Oct - 0.02187 g

18th Oct - 17th Nov - 0.01968 g

18th Nov - 17th Dec - 0.0177 g
18th Dec - 17th Jan 2020 - 0.0160 g

18th Jan 2020 - 17th Feb 2020 - 0.0143 g

18th Feb 2020 - 17th March 2020 - 0.0129 g

18th March 2020 - 17th April 2020 - 0.0116 g

18th April 2020 - 17th May 2020 - 0.0105 g

18th May 2020 - 17th June 2020 - 0.0094 g

18th June 2020 - 17th July 2020 - 0.0085 g

18th July 2020 - 17th Aug 2020 - 0.0076 g

18th Aug 2020 - 17th Sept 2020 - 0.0067 g

 

Continue or can i drop to 0 after the 17th of Sept 2020

 

18th Sept 2020 - 17 Oct 2020 - 0.0062 g

18th Oct 2020 - 17th Nov 2020- 0.0056 g

18th Nov 2020 - 17th Dec 2020  - 0.005 g

18th Dec 2020, 0?

 

[tripsteady]

reaching the 4th day of my taper, as advised, should start feeling symptoms (if any)..shortly

[tripsteady]

first week done!

 

No symptoms to speak off as yet

[tripsteady]

Extreme Irritability

 

Hi Guys

 

Started on Lexapro (escalitopram)

 

So I've managed to cut down from 0.2730mg to 0.076mg over the course of 12 months or so. Am proud of myself

 

I am experiencing fluctuating moods, but extreme irritability, I am angry/irritable at almost anything. It has been this way for almost 6 months, to the point where I'm getting used to being the person that is constantly angry at everything

I even get angry at inanimate objects. It is starting to effect my job.

 

I plan to taper down to 0.05 by January and then go completely off it January 2021.

 

Is this common?

 

Thanks in advance

 

Edited September 22, 2020 by ChessieCat
added topic title abd resized text

[ChessieCat]

Hi and welcome back

 

Good job on getting down so low on your dose.

 

There seems to be a discrepency with your doses.  I think you may have used "g" instead of "mg" and also the numbers don't correspond.  Please correct as necessary.  Thanks.

 

1 hour ago, tripsteady said:

down from 0.2730mg to 0.076mg

• started taper @ 18th sept 2019 - 17th Oct 2019 - 0.02187 g
• current dosage - 0.0700
• Next drop 18th Oct 2020 - 17th Nov 2020 - 0.0063 g

 

1 hour ago, tripsteady said:

I am experiencing fluctuating moods, but extreme irritability, I am angry/irritable at almost anything. It has been this way for almost 6 months, to the point where I'm getting used to being the person that is constantly angry at everything

 

Yes, irritability is a withdrawal symptom.  Dr Joseph Glenmullen's WD Symptoms Checklist

 

However, we sometimes automatically attribute how we are to withdrawal and don't think to look for what else might possibly be causing / contributing to this.

 

Since the beginning of this year we have members posting that they are experiencing unexpected and/or worse waves.  The timing of this does seem to coincide with the crazy covid situation we have all found ourselves in.

 

Things to consider:

 

How has your situation changed due to covid?  For example, changed working conditions, isolation, financial stress, relationship stress

Have you been taking any benzos or other drugs, even if occasionally?

Do you suffer from any other medical conditions for which you take drugs?

Have you been unwell?

Have you taken any antibiotics?

Added in or stopped any supplements?

Any major life changes?  For example, moving, relationship breakdown

Consuming caffeine beverages, eg lots of/strong coffee, cola drinks, energy drinks?

Consuming alcohol?

Consuming MSG which is a neurotoxin?  Chinese food, savoury snacks, frozen and tinned meals often contain MSG.

 

 

 

Edited September 22, 2020 by ChessieCat

[tripsteady]

thank you so much for the reply!

 

I have amended my signature to display correct dosages. No to anything changing , even with Covid. Im clearly just..angry and irritable..even at inanimate objects. Will read the link you posted. Seems like simply need to accept its a symptom and will lift eventually.

 

Edited September 22, 2020 by ChessieCat
removed quote