Moderator brassmonkey Posted March 26, 2020 Moderator Share Posted March 26, 2020 Hi Subzero-- Erell is trying a technique called a Prozac Bridge. Her original drug, Deroxat (paxil) has a reputation for being one of the hardest ADs to get off of, while prozac is one of the easier ones. Just by chance, for many people, the two can be interchanged if a careful cross taper is done. It tends to work more times then not, but is still an iffy proposition. Once the cross taper is complete the prozac masks the WD symptoms of the Paxil that has been CTed. Because of it's long half life prozac is much easier to taper once a person has stabilized from the crossover. 20 years on Paxil starting at 20mg and working up to 40mg. Sept 2011 started 10% every 6 weeks taper (2.5% every week for 4 weeks then hold for 2 additional weeks), currently at 7.9mg. Oct 2011 CTed 15oz vodka a night, to only drinking 2 beers most nights, totally sober Feb 2013. Since I wrote this I have continued to decrease my dose by 10% every 6 weeks (2.5% every week for 4 weeks and then hold for an additional 2 weeks). I added in an extra 6 week hold when I hit 10mg to let things settle out even more. When I hit 3mgpw it became hard to split the drop into 4 parts so I switched to dropping 1mgpw (pill weight) every week for 3 weeks and then holding for another 3 weeks. The 3 + 3 schedule turned out to be too harsh so I cut back to dropping 1mgpw every 4 weeks which is working better. Final Dose 0.016mg. Current dose 0.000mg 04-15-2017 "It's also important not to become angry, no matter how difficult life is, because you can loose all hope if you can't laugh at yourself and at life in general." Stephen Hawking Link to comment
Subzero42 Posted March 26, 2020 Share Posted March 26, 2020 15 hours ago, brassmonkey said: Hi Subzero-- Erell is trying a technique called a Prozac Bridge. Her original drug, Deroxat (paxil) has a reputation for being one of the hardest ADs to get off of, while prozac is one of the easier ones. Just by chance, for many people, the two can be interchanged if a careful cross taper is done. It tends to work more times then not, but is still an iffy proposition. Once the cross taper is complete the prozac masks the WD symptoms of the Paxil that has been CTed. Because of it's long half life prozac is much easier to taper once a person has stabilized from the crossover. I don't get why Prozac would be easier to taper just because of it's long half life, to me it just means that WD symptoms will take longer to appear 2017 Feb : Lexapro 10mg. 2017 May : Lexapro 20mg. 2017 Nov : CT Lexapro 2017 Dec : Reinstated Lexapro 20mg. 2018 Feb : Lexapro 20 + Effexor 75 May to December : Taper Lexapro 2019 Apr : Effexor 56mg 2019 May : Effexor 37,5mg 2019 Jun : Effexor 18,75mg 2019 Aug : Reinstated Effexor 37,5mg. 2020 Oct : Slowly updose Effexor Link to comment
Moderator brassmonkey Posted March 26, 2020 Moderator Share Posted March 26, 2020 Symptoms are triggered by fluctuations in the blood serum concentration of the drug. Because of the drugs, the body has been modified to require their presence at a certain level to function "correctly". If the concentration drops below that level the body reacts badly in the form of symptoms. Paxil is a very harsh drug with a relatively short half life so there are more opportunities for the drug concentration to drop below the required level. When it does the body reacts very strongly to the change. Prozac is a "gentler" drug so it's symptoms tend to be milder and because of the longer half life the blood serum concentration stays more consistent, which in turn keeps the symptoms from being triggered. While that longer time is passing the body is healing and can tolerate just a little less of the drug so there is a smoother decent in dose. 1 20 years on Paxil starting at 20mg and working up to 40mg. Sept 2011 started 10% every 6 weeks taper (2.5% every week for 4 weeks then hold for 2 additional weeks), currently at 7.9mg. Oct 2011 CTed 15oz vodka a night, to only drinking 2 beers most nights, totally sober Feb 2013. Since I wrote this I have continued to decrease my dose by 10% every 6 weeks (2.5% every week for 4 weeks and then hold for an additional 2 weeks). I added in an extra 6 week hold when I hit 10mg to let things settle out even more. When I hit 3mgpw it became hard to split the drop into 4 parts so I switched to dropping 1mgpw (pill weight) every week for 3 weeks and then holding for another 3 weeks. The 3 + 3 schedule turned out to be too harsh so I cut back to dropping 1mgpw every 4 weeks which is working better. Final Dose 0.016mg. Current dose 0.000mg 04-15-2017 "It's also important not to become angry, no matter how difficult life is, because you can loose all hope if you can't laugh at yourself and at life in general." Stephen Hawking Link to comment
Cathy4 Posted March 27, 2020 Share Posted March 27, 2020 On 3/16/2020 at 3:34 AM, Erell said: I'm only saying that we need to use the tools we learn in WD to apply them during this very particular and anxious time. Exactly. And goodness, some days recently this is easier said than done for me. We are warriors to be going through withdrawal in the midst of this. We will get through this. ❤️ 2 1999-2006 Luvox, xanax 2007-2009 Prozac, xanax, klonopin 2009-2018 Zoloft, xanax, klonopin 2019 January zoloft 150mg, February 100mg, April 75mg, mid-May 50mg, July 25mg, (xanax .5mg or .25mg as needed) August zoloft 25mg HOLD, CT xanax, reinstate 50mg zoloft, September reinstate 100mg zoloft w/.375 klonopin, mid-September lower to 75mg zoloft 2020 January: .125mg klonopin February 1st: .112mg klonopin February 24th: 60.3mgai zoloft 2020 December 1st: off klonopin completely currently on 15mgai zoloft Link to comment
Giulietta Posted March 27, 2020 Share Posted March 27, 2020 18 hours ago, brassmonkey said: Symptoms are triggered by fluctuations in the blood serum concentration of the drug. Because of the drugs, the body has been modified to require their presence at a certain level to function "correctly". If the concentration drops below that level the body reacts badly in the form of symptoms. Erell, Erell, I hope you are doing well. I look forward to hearing about your crossover and hope it goes smoothly (as can be). Nothing for us is easy is it. I read your thread over the past couple of days. I am experiencing the same issue but am on beads and short-half life so I am having a very hard time (too). I am on the last bead. I don't mean to hijack your thread, but I want to weigh in/ask BrassMonkey about this too. @brassmonkey thank kyou for posting this clear explanation. I am experiencing this same thing on my duloxetine beads (apparently). Since this is not specific to @Erell 's situation I will post on my thread and if you could chime in that would be nice. Big hugs to you Erell. Guilietta Link to comment
SolarPlexus Posted March 27, 2020 Share Posted March 27, 2020 On 3/24/2020 at 7:58 PM, Giulietta said: This is right on. Use adaptive thinking. And as all things in life, in print, on TV, etc. - you can't believe everything you are 'told'. This is no exception. The world has survived multiple catastrophes before we came along. And it will this as well. It seems bad now. Following best practices to stay well (and self-isolate) will get us through this. All the things we do in WD to help ourselves bode well for this. Me too. I have been thinking of you and hope you are staying healthy. Congrats on moving along in your taper. Enjoy your break from work next week. Hugs, G Yes indeed Giuletta, it feels like one is merely applying the same practices in self-quarantine that one uses to heal WD. Hopefully we get through both challenges soon. Wishing safety, healing and prosperity for everyone! Summer 2016 - summer 2018: put on Lexapro, going from 5 mg up to 20 mg over the span of the 2 years (had visited shrink for help with obsessive thinking, was not diagnosed with anything in particular, just prescribed Lexapro 15 mins into first session) Summer 2018: tapered down by 2.5 mg every few weeks Protracted withdrawal ever since. 0-14 months began with a massive panic attack that landed me in ER, followed by prolonged anxiety, mental fog and a skin rash on my back. Was regularly consuming alcohol as did not know I was in WD. From then onwards, hit with worse myriad symptoms. Currently at 22 months and have electromagnetic sensitivity, brain zaps, brain fog, memory problems (especially name recall), twitch in right eyebrow, daily waking up at 3 or 4 a.m. with fast heartbeats and "sticky" negative memories, suicidal thoughts, rage episodes, temperature dysregulation, physical numbness & weakness, libido loss. Link to comment
Moderator Emeritus Erell Posted March 27, 2020 Author Moderator Emeritus Share Posted March 27, 2020 Hello ! Dear @Giulietta : I've decided to postpone my crossover to Prozac. It has been a very stressfull week at work, and my symptoms have ramped up, so I decided to make changes later @brassmonkey : Third time will be the good one ! That's what we say in French I'm glad to know you're now safe at home. Take care ❤ 1 2006 : 20mg Paxil+Bromazepam. 2008 : cold turkey of both. 2010 : Reinstatement 20mg Paxil + Bromazepam. 2014-June2017 : Switch from Bromazepam to Prazepam, slow taper to 0mg. 2018 to August 2019 : Paxil 20mg taper (3% every 15 days). 22 Aug 2019 updose to 10mg (was at 8.4mg). 25th Sept 2019 To April 2020 : found SA, holding at 10mg Paxil. April 2020 : Paxil 10mg to Prozac 7mg bridge. Details : topic/21457 Current Supplements : magnesium citrate + fish oil Current medication : * 7pm Diazepam : 0.85mg (15 Aug 2022) / 0.95 mg (24 April 2022) / 1mg Diazepam (since 29 Aug 2020) * 8am Prozac : 6.16mg (25 oct 2022, feel awful, slight updose) / 6.08 mg (9 oct 2022) / 6.24mg (11 July 22) / 6.44mg (22 May 22) / 6.64mg (4 Nov 21) / 6.72mg (8 oct 21) / 6.8 mg (15 Sept 21)/ 6.88mg (14 Aug 21)/ 6.92mg (23 Jun 21) I am not a professional, I don't give medical advice. Discuss any decisions about your medical care with a knowledgeable medical practitioner. Link to comment
Giulietta Posted March 28, 2020 Share Posted March 28, 2020 23 hours ago, Erell said: I've decided to postpone my crossover to Prozac. It has been a very stressfull week at work, and my symptoms have ramped up, so I decided to make changes later Smart thinking. Changing meds during a difficult time is good to avoid when you can. You will have a smoother transition. I hope your symptoms settle and work as well. Big hug to you. Link to comment
sunnysideup69 Posted April 13, 2020 Share Posted April 13, 2020 Hey @Erell, catching up on your thread, haven't been about for a while because of bereavement etc. How are you doing? Hopefully, things are still tolerable and following a gradual upwards trajectory. London is VERY quiet, well, my little corner is ...even on Bank Holiday Easter Monday. It's so strange and a bit creepy, BUT essential. Are you still working? I guess you are, as a carer. Sending hugs and good wishes from a chilly London, xxx January 2008 to April 2015 Citalopram 20mg to 5mg, reducing in 50 per cent leaps. Jumped off at 5mg March 2016 used MDMA triggered setback April 2016 Citalopram 10mg October 2016 cut to 5mg, May 2017 cut to 2.5mg May 2018 used MDMA triggered setback June 2018 Citalopram 2.5mg up to 10mg, then back to 5mg July/ August 2018 7.5mg, then 10mg June 2019 updosed to 20mg Citalopram August 2019 cold switch to Venlafaxine 75mg XR Supplements; 1100mg fish oil daily; also 100mg Magnesium Glycinate. Tried Vagifem 10mcg from mid May 2021 to mid June 2021; caused depression, so stopped. Link to comment
Moderator Emeritus Erell Posted April 14, 2020 Author Moderator Emeritus Share Posted April 14, 2020 Hello Sunny, And thank you for asking. Well, I'm working from home now, so less pressure and stress. I have decided to take this time to start my Prozac Bridge, took my first 1mg yesterday ! Didn't notice any change 😎 Today is different : claustrophobia and chemical anxiety are back. But I stay confident : Prozac Bridge could be my best option to be drug free one day, and this is exactly my main goal ! Sending big hugs dear ❤ 2 2006 : 20mg Paxil+Bromazepam. 2008 : cold turkey of both. 2010 : Reinstatement 20mg Paxil + Bromazepam. 2014-June2017 : Switch from Bromazepam to Prazepam, slow taper to 0mg. 2018 to August 2019 : Paxil 20mg taper (3% every 15 days). 22 Aug 2019 updose to 10mg (was at 8.4mg). 25th Sept 2019 To April 2020 : found SA, holding at 10mg Paxil. April 2020 : Paxil 10mg to Prozac 7mg bridge. Details : topic/21457 Current Supplements : magnesium citrate + fish oil Current medication : * 7pm Diazepam : 0.85mg (15 Aug 2022) / 0.95 mg (24 April 2022) / 1mg Diazepam (since 29 Aug 2020) * 8am Prozac : 6.16mg (25 oct 2022, feel awful, slight updose) / 6.08 mg (9 oct 2022) / 6.24mg (11 July 22) / 6.44mg (22 May 22) / 6.64mg (4 Nov 21) / 6.72mg (8 oct 21) / 6.8 mg (15 Sept 21)/ 6.88mg (14 Aug 21)/ 6.92mg (23 Jun 21) I am not a professional, I don't give medical advice. Discuss any decisions about your medical care with a knowledgeable medical practitioner. Link to comment
Mentor Cocopuffz17 Posted April 14, 2020 Mentor Share Posted April 14, 2020 You got this! Glad you have less stress! I follow The Plant Paradox lifestyle by Dr.Gundry. This lifestyle has given me my life back and I feel better than I have ever felt in my life. It has enabled me to finally get off of this medication and truly live my life. Nutrition is the key to health!!!!! 2008 to 2019 - 20 mg Paroxetine Attempted 2 CT's around the 5-6 year mark. Were absolutely terrible and reinstated. Was never explained by the doctor the seriousness of the short half life of this drug. 2017 - Attempted a tapered discontinuation of this drug and reinstated after being unsuccessful. 2019 - Feb. 12 - After a three month taper I am off of paroxetine. The 3 months were terrible, awful withdrawal feelings. I followed the doctors guidelines for the reduction of this drug and now know it was way too fast. 2019 - Oct. 12 - 8 months off paroxetine. 75% improvement since coming off the drug. Definitely have had tons of challenges along the way. Let’s go!!!! 2021 - Feb. 12 - 24 months off paroxetine. I have minor challenges now. Tinnitus/Headaches are still around but are reduced by a massive amount. Link to comment
Mentor Hanna72 Posted April 14, 2020 Mentor Share Posted April 14, 2020 @Erell But I stay confident : Prozac Bridge could be my best option to be drug free one day, and this is exactly my main goal ! It helped me get off Paxil👍 You go girl 🙏 1999-2020 20 mg Paxil Bridged with Fluoxetine to help me get off Paxil. 2022 Fluoxetine 15 mg 12/12 14mg 27/12 13mg jan 12mg feb 11mg mars 10mg, 9 mg 8,5 mg 7.6mg 7.0 mg 6,3 mg 5,6 mg 5,0 mg 4,5 mg 4,0 mg 3.6mg 3,2 mg 2,9 mg 2,6 mg 2,3 mg 2,0 mg 1.8 mg I am not a medical professional nor is this a medical advice. I only talk from my own experience. Link to comment
Melissa03 Posted April 14, 2020 Share Posted April 14, 2020 When is the best to do the switch at what mg dosage ? How do you do it ? 20 mg seroxat from December 2012, several failed attempts to quit. Last attempt in 2019 resulted in terrible crush after being 3 months drug free (13. feb 2020) 1 March 2020 reinstated 10 mg seroxat July 2020 began slow taper. Link to comment
Mentor Hanna72 Posted April 14, 2020 Mentor Share Posted April 14, 2020 @Melissa03 this might be helpful for you https://www.survivingantidepressants.org/topic/19373-the-prozac-switch-or-bridging-with-prozac/ 1999-2020 20 mg Paxil Bridged with Fluoxetine to help me get off Paxil. 2022 Fluoxetine 15 mg 12/12 14mg 27/12 13mg jan 12mg feb 11mg mars 10mg, 9 mg 8,5 mg 7.6mg 7.0 mg 6,3 mg 5,6 mg 5,0 mg 4,5 mg 4,0 mg 3.6mg 3,2 mg 2,9 mg 2,6 mg 2,3 mg 2,0 mg 1.8 mg I am not a medical professional nor is this a medical advice. I only talk from my own experience. Link to comment
Moderator Emeritus Erell Posted April 17, 2020 Author Moderator Emeritus Share Posted April 17, 2020 (edited) Hello, As I've seen questions, I'm gonna update regularly my Prozac Bridge. * Advise you to read the topic : https://www.survivingantidepressants.org/topic/19373-the-prozac-switch-or-bridging-with-prozac/ ---》 Why my Prozac Bridge? I'm holding at 10mg Paroxetine since last 25th September. Liquid Paroxetine is out of stock in France since last November. The lab first told me every month that it would come back. Now they tell me it could not come back. I had been able to do some stock, but now i'm at the end of it. I made the decision to switch with Prozac. ---》 My plan was : - Introduce 1mg Fluoxétine. Then add 1mg every 5 days until I reach 5mg. - Then drop 1mg Paroxetine every 3 days until I reach 0mg. ---> My bridge : Day one/ 13th April : 1mg fluoxétine. Nothing to notice. Felt ok. Day two / 14th April : 1mg fluoxétine. Increased anxiety and agoraphobia back. Restlessness in legs and arms in the evening. Broken sleep. Day three/ 15th April : 1mg fluoxétine. Some chemical anxiety and agoraphobia. Restlessness in legs an arm in the evening. Sweet night. Day four / 16th April : 1mg fluoxétine Feeling good, almost normal in the morning. Low mood afternoon and evening, some SI. Anxiety increased during the day. Broken sleep. So, what have changed since I introduced Fluoxétine : More chemical anxiety/broken sleep/ agoraphobia back (had disappeared in January)/restlessness in legs and arms. ---》 Hard to tell if : my body don't like Fluoxétine/ or my body don't like the combination of the two drugs. Not easy right now to live and stay confident with these symptoms. On another hand, I know I have to expect symptoms while destabilising my CNS with a new molecule. Take care ❤ Ps : @Altostrata : does it sounds like an adverse reaction ? Edited April 17, 2020 by Erell 1 2006 : 20mg Paxil+Bromazepam. 2008 : cold turkey of both. 2010 : Reinstatement 20mg Paxil + Bromazepam. 2014-June2017 : Switch from Bromazepam to Prazepam, slow taper to 0mg. 2018 to August 2019 : Paxil 20mg taper (3% every 15 days). 22 Aug 2019 updose to 10mg (was at 8.4mg). 25th Sept 2019 To April 2020 : found SA, holding at 10mg Paxil. April 2020 : Paxil 10mg to Prozac 7mg bridge. Details : topic/21457 Current Supplements : magnesium citrate + fish oil Current medication : * 7pm Diazepam : 0.85mg (15 Aug 2022) / 0.95 mg (24 April 2022) / 1mg Diazepam (since 29 Aug 2020) * 8am Prozac : 6.16mg (25 oct 2022, feel awful, slight updose) / 6.08 mg (9 oct 2022) / 6.24mg (11 July 22) / 6.44mg (22 May 22) / 6.64mg (4 Nov 21) / 6.72mg (8 oct 21) / 6.8 mg (15 Sept 21)/ 6.88mg (14 Aug 21)/ 6.92mg (23 Jun 21) I am not a professional, I don't give medical advice. Discuss any decisions about your medical care with a knowledgeable medical practitioner. Link to comment
sunnysideup69 Posted April 17, 2020 Share Posted April 17, 2020 10 minutes ago, Erell said: --》 Hard to tell if : my body don't like Fluoxétine/ or my body don't like the combination of the two drugs. Not easy right now to live and stay confident with these symptoms. On another hand, I know I have to expect symptoms while destabilising my CNS with a new molecule. Take care ❤ I am sending you good vibes for this transition, @Erell. It's bound to be a bit rocky at first, and then will settle. It doesn't sound like an adverse reaction, though....nothing too severe or unremitting? I'm hoping you settle soon xxx 1 January 2008 to April 2015 Citalopram 20mg to 5mg, reducing in 50 per cent leaps. Jumped off at 5mg March 2016 used MDMA triggered setback April 2016 Citalopram 10mg October 2016 cut to 5mg, May 2017 cut to 2.5mg May 2018 used MDMA triggered setback June 2018 Citalopram 2.5mg up to 10mg, then back to 5mg July/ August 2018 7.5mg, then 10mg June 2019 updosed to 20mg Citalopram August 2019 cold switch to Venlafaxine 75mg XR Supplements; 1100mg fish oil daily; also 100mg Magnesium Glycinate. Tried Vagifem 10mcg from mid May 2021 to mid June 2021; caused depression, so stopped. Link to comment
Mentor Hanna72 Posted April 17, 2020 Mentor Share Posted April 17, 2020 @Erell I am rooting for you 💪 All the best to you🙏 1 1999-2020 20 mg Paxil Bridged with Fluoxetine to help me get off Paxil. 2022 Fluoxetine 15 mg 12/12 14mg 27/12 13mg jan 12mg feb 11mg mars 10mg, 9 mg 8,5 mg 7.6mg 7.0 mg 6,3 mg 5,6 mg 5,0 mg 4,5 mg 4,0 mg 3.6mg 3,2 mg 2,9 mg 2,6 mg 2,3 mg 2,0 mg 1.8 mg I am not a medical professional nor is this a medical advice. I only talk from my own experience. Link to comment
Administrator Altostrata Posted April 17, 2020 Administrator Share Posted April 17, 2020 9 hours ago, Erell said: --》 My plan was : - Introduce 1mg Fluoxétine. Then add 1mg every 5 days until I reach 5mg. - Then drop 1mg Paroxetine every 3 days until I reach 0mg. Since you added fluoxetine 4 days ago, I would decrease the paroxetine by 2mg. It's possible you won't need as much fluoxetine as paroxetine. You may end up on 5mg fluoxetine. It's a good sign that you had a good day while the fluoxetine was increasing. It sounds like the fluoxetine has already had some effect, that's what the additional stimulation is. 1 This is not medical advice. Discuss any decisions about your medical care with a knowledgeable medical practitioner. "It has become appallingly obvious that our technology has surpassed our humanity." -- Albert Einstein All postings © copyrighted. Link to comment
Moderator Emeritus Erell Posted April 17, 2020 Author Moderator Emeritus Share Posted April 17, 2020 Thank you for this quick answer ! So, your advice is to decrease Paroxetine before reaching 5mg fluoxétine, and I'm gonna follow it tomorrow morning. Let's stay confident ! 💪 Must admit I'm really excited about the idea of being Paroxetine-free, and drug-free one day in the future...😍 Take care ❤ 1 2006 : 20mg Paxil+Bromazepam. 2008 : cold turkey of both. 2010 : Reinstatement 20mg Paxil + Bromazepam. 2014-June2017 : Switch from Bromazepam to Prazepam, slow taper to 0mg. 2018 to August 2019 : Paxil 20mg taper (3% every 15 days). 22 Aug 2019 updose to 10mg (was at 8.4mg). 25th Sept 2019 To April 2020 : found SA, holding at 10mg Paxil. April 2020 : Paxil 10mg to Prozac 7mg bridge. Details : topic/21457 Current Supplements : magnesium citrate + fish oil Current medication : * 7pm Diazepam : 0.85mg (15 Aug 2022) / 0.95 mg (24 April 2022) / 1mg Diazepam (since 29 Aug 2020) * 8am Prozac : 6.16mg (25 oct 2022, feel awful, slight updose) / 6.08 mg (9 oct 2022) / 6.24mg (11 July 22) / 6.44mg (22 May 22) / 6.64mg (4 Nov 21) / 6.72mg (8 oct 21) / 6.8 mg (15 Sept 21)/ 6.88mg (14 Aug 21)/ 6.92mg (23 Jun 21) I am not a professional, I don't give medical advice. Discuss any decisions about your medical care with a knowledgeable medical practitioner. Link to comment
Administrator Altostrata Posted April 17, 2020 Administrator Share Posted April 17, 2020 It appears for you, the fluoxetine ramps up quickly. A decrease of 2mg paroxetine every few days while increasing fluoxetine probably will work. Your first dose of 1mg fluoxetine hasn't reached full effect yet. 1 This is not medical advice. Discuss any decisions about your medical care with a knowledgeable medical practitioner. "It has become appallingly obvious that our technology has surpassed our humanity." -- Albert Einstein All postings © copyrighted. Link to comment
Melissa03 Posted April 17, 2020 Share Posted April 17, 2020 So as far as I understood,10 mg of seroxat can be changed with 5 mg of Prozac ? 20 mg seroxat from December 2012, several failed attempts to quit. Last attempt in 2019 resulted in terrible crush after being 3 months drug free (13. feb 2020) 1 March 2020 reinstated 10 mg seroxat July 2020 began slow taper. Link to comment
Administrator Altostrata Posted April 17, 2020 Administrator Share Posted April 17, 2020 According to a knowledgeable doctor I consulted, 5mg Prozac is often sufficient substitute for 10mg paroxetine. Paroxetine is a very powerful SSRI. 1 This is not medical advice. Discuss any decisions about your medical care with a knowledgeable medical practitioner. "It has become appallingly obvious that our technology has surpassed our humanity." -- Albert Einstein All postings © copyrighted. Link to comment
sunnysideup69 Posted April 18, 2020 Share Posted April 18, 2020 Hey @Erell, wanna ask you this, because I think you're good at it! How do you cope with WD symptoms whilst living alone and in this current climate? I'm finding it a bit tough at the moment. xxx January 2008 to April 2015 Citalopram 20mg to 5mg, reducing in 50 per cent leaps. Jumped off at 5mg March 2016 used MDMA triggered setback April 2016 Citalopram 10mg October 2016 cut to 5mg, May 2017 cut to 2.5mg May 2018 used MDMA triggered setback June 2018 Citalopram 2.5mg up to 10mg, then back to 5mg July/ August 2018 7.5mg, then 10mg June 2019 updosed to 20mg Citalopram August 2019 cold switch to Venlafaxine 75mg XR Supplements; 1100mg fish oil daily; also 100mg Magnesium Glycinate. Tried Vagifem 10mcg from mid May 2021 to mid June 2021; caused depression, so stopped. Link to comment
mustafa Posted April 18, 2020 Share Posted April 18, 2020 Hello erell, Hope it goes smooth with your bridging. Good choice to be on fluoxetine instead of paroxetine and as u said, this should give u a push.. Take care of yourself ❤️.. @Erell i wasn't on a certain drug all the period. i took many drugs many times and for no very long period but to simplify. --fluvoxamine maleate100 mg + amisulpride 200mg------started july 2012 and total taper in february 2015 ( 9 months without drugs then) --sertraline 100mg -------started november 2015 and total taper (withoud reduction slowly) in november 2016( 4 months withoud drugs then). --sertraline 100mg + quetiabine 25mg ( started in mars 2016 and for 7 months) then fluvoxamine maleate 100mg again for another 7months and after that a something like to use every drug for 14 days and for about 1.5 years. --my last drug was trintellix 10 mg ( used it in 12/2018and total taper in 4/2019). symptomts i have now ( bad concentration and problems in short and long memory+ bad depersonalization). Link to comment
Moderator Emeritus Erell Posted April 18, 2020 Author Moderator Emeritus Share Posted April 18, 2020 Thank you @mustafa❤️ @sunnysideup69 : I understand, being so lonely can be tough sometimes. Here are some of my thoughts : - First, I've already been isolated and lonely when I went through hell last autumn/winter. Present isolation feels lot easier : I have symptoms, but nothing compared to the terror and despair I lived in, so right now, everything sounds much easier ! - One thought helping me : I can actually find positive aspects in this situation. I don't have any pressure to go outside, because we're supposed to stay home. I have all the time I need for selfcare. I feel more connected with my friends and family, taking the time on phone. ... - One thing that can help you : create a list of possible activities (puzzles, movies, gardening, take a walk, write letters, read books, cleaning, sewing, drawing, yoga, medtitation, ....) When I see my looooong list, I could almost say "oh, I'll never have enough time to do all I want" - Last but not least : no guilt; No guilt when I can't focus : since this pandemic started, I have troubles to focus on one activity. And it's ok, I change often ! Sometimes, I just feel like I can't do something : and it's ok. As you can see, I don't have specific tools, and my mood and anxiety oscillates during the day or the week. But my main tool is to find activities, and change everytime I need Hugs ❤️ 2 2006 : 20mg Paxil+Bromazepam. 2008 : cold turkey of both. 2010 : Reinstatement 20mg Paxil + Bromazepam. 2014-June2017 : Switch from Bromazepam to Prazepam, slow taper to 0mg. 2018 to August 2019 : Paxil 20mg taper (3% every 15 days). 22 Aug 2019 updose to 10mg (was at 8.4mg). 25th Sept 2019 To April 2020 : found SA, holding at 10mg Paxil. April 2020 : Paxil 10mg to Prozac 7mg bridge. Details : topic/21457 Current Supplements : magnesium citrate + fish oil Current medication : * 7pm Diazepam : 0.85mg (15 Aug 2022) / 0.95 mg (24 April 2022) / 1mg Diazepam (since 29 Aug 2020) * 8am Prozac : 6.16mg (25 oct 2022, feel awful, slight updose) / 6.08 mg (9 oct 2022) / 6.24mg (11 July 22) / 6.44mg (22 May 22) / 6.64mg (4 Nov 21) / 6.72mg (8 oct 21) / 6.8 mg (15 Sept 21)/ 6.88mg (14 Aug 21)/ 6.92mg (23 Jun 21) I am not a professional, I don't give medical advice. Discuss any decisions about your medical care with a knowledgeable medical practitioner. Link to comment
sunnysideup69 Posted April 18, 2020 Share Posted April 18, 2020 1 hour ago, Erell said: Thank you @mustafa❤️ @sunnysideup69 : I understand, being so lonely can be tough sometimes. Here are some of my thoughts : - First, I've already been isolated and lonely when I went through hell last autumn/winter. Present isolation feels lot easier : I have symptoms, but nothing compared to the terror and despair I lived in, so right now, everything sounds much easier ! - One thought helping me : I can actually find positive aspects in this situation. I don't have any pressure to go outside, because we're supposed to stay home. I have all the time I need for selfcare. I feel more connected with my friends and family, taking the time on phone. ... - One thing that can help you : create a list of possible activities (puzzles, movies, gardening, take a walk, write letters, read books, cleaning, sewing, drawing, yoga, medtitation, ....) When I see my looooong list, I could almost say "oh, I'll never have enough time to do all I want" - Last but not least : no guilt; No guilt when I can't focus : since this pandemic started, I have troubles to focus on one activity. And it's ok, I change often ! Sometimes, I just feel like I can't do something : and it's ok. As you can see, I don't have specific tools, and my mood and anxiety oscillates during the day or the week. But my main tool is to find activities, and change everytime I need Hugs ❤️ Thanks lovely, that's really helpful. I wrote a list of all the things I could do, as well as work (I've got reports to write.) Nice, creative things...similar ones to you, in fact. Last week, grief took over and I wasn't reaching out to people much...so have put lots of 'connecting ' things into this week, Whatsapp calls etc. Thank you. You've inspired me ❤️ When I look back on this time last year and wobbling around badly in May /June 2019, this isolation is very different. January 2008 to April 2015 Citalopram 20mg to 5mg, reducing in 50 per cent leaps. Jumped off at 5mg March 2016 used MDMA triggered setback April 2016 Citalopram 10mg October 2016 cut to 5mg, May 2017 cut to 2.5mg May 2018 used MDMA triggered setback June 2018 Citalopram 2.5mg up to 10mg, then back to 5mg July/ August 2018 7.5mg, then 10mg June 2019 updosed to 20mg Citalopram August 2019 cold switch to Venlafaxine 75mg XR Supplements; 1100mg fish oil daily; also 100mg Magnesium Glycinate. Tried Vagifem 10mcg from mid May 2021 to mid June 2021; caused depression, so stopped. Link to comment
cathnz Posted April 19, 2020 Share Posted April 19, 2020 On 3/25/2020 at 8:55 AM, MissyE said: Oh Cath I'm sorry to read that your struggling. Irene has loads of free stuff you can try. I love her heart meditation. I'll post it on my thread. Even if you just lie and listen. This is all part of WD, it's horrible and unfair, but you're doing the right thing reaching out on here. Love Missy x Hi @MissyE Are you able to point me in the direction of the heart meditation of Irene's you mentioned. I can't find it. How are you going with the course? Cath Aug 2004 - Dec 2006: Aropax ( 20mg - 30mg). Aug 2007: Fluoxetine (for 3 weeks). Sept 07 - July 12: Lexapro ( 10mg - 20mg). Pooped out July 12. Titrated down off Lexapro over 3 weeks and switched to Paroxetine (with Xanax to cover switch for 2 weeks). Aug 2012 - Aug 2019: Paroxetine (titrated up to 20mg in first few weeks,, dose reduced to 15mg . for 7 years until it 'pooped out'. 4th Aug 2019 - Reduced dose of paroxetine to 10mg (for 1 day) - under phychiatrists directions. Last dose of paroxetine. 5th Aug 2019 - Switch to 15mg Mirtazapine. 5th Aug - 15th Aug 2019 - 15mg Mirtazapine plus intermitent use of Lorazapm (0.25- 0.5 . Also used 12.5mg Quetiapine for 3 nights for sleep. 23rd Aug 2019 - Ended up in crisis team. Mirtazapine increased to 30mg. Diazapam 10mg twice daily. 30th Aug 2019 - Mirtazapine 30mg + Diazapam reduced to 7.5mg twice daily 6th Sept 2019 - Mirtazapine 30mg + Diazapam reduced to 5mg twice daily 13th Sept 2019 - Mirtazapine increased to 45mg. Diazapam increased back up to 10mg twice daily. 20th Sept - 29th Sept 2019: Mirtazapine 45mg. Diazapam being reduced from 10mg down to 0mg this week (in 2mg increments couple of days). 30th Sept - Thursday 3rd Oct 2019: Mirtazapine 45mg. WORST ANXIETY EVER. Akathisia. Couldn't stay still. Suicidal idealization. Friday 4th October - present: Reduced from 45mg to 30mg (straight drop to alleviate akathisia - reduction definitely helped alot but still not gone completely) , Vit B6, Curcumin, Magnesium (no adverse effects from adding these supplements - have helped akathisia somewhat). * Everything done from 23rd August under care of outpatient crisis team management. Untitled document.docx Link to comment
Moderator Emeritus Erell Posted April 20, 2020 Author Moderator Emeritus Share Posted April 20, 2020 (edited) Hello, quick update on my Prozac Bridge : as you can see on my signature, I've started to drop Paroxetine, while increasing Fluoxetine. My symptoms change with the days : some night I have a very broken sleep, feeling very hot, on other nights I have very sweet sleep (which always make me happy !). Yesterday I had a very low mood, feeling depressed and having catastrophizing intrusive thoughts. Today, mood is ok but I suffer from anxiety. However, these symptoms are not extreme and stay mild : considering that I'm destabilising my CNS with all these changes, I'm doing well. Suffer from some intrusive thoughts and fear about suffering from a Paroxetine WD : I do a lot of selfcoaching Well, to be continued... Take care ❤️ Edited April 20, 2020 by Erell 1 2006 : 20mg Paxil+Bromazepam. 2008 : cold turkey of both. 2010 : Reinstatement 20mg Paxil + Bromazepam. 2014-June2017 : Switch from Bromazepam to Prazepam, slow taper to 0mg. 2018 to August 2019 : Paxil 20mg taper (3% every 15 days). 22 Aug 2019 updose to 10mg (was at 8.4mg). 25th Sept 2019 To April 2020 : found SA, holding at 10mg Paxil. April 2020 : Paxil 10mg to Prozac 7mg bridge. Details : topic/21457 Current Supplements : magnesium citrate + fish oil Current medication : * 7pm Diazepam : 0.85mg (15 Aug 2022) / 0.95 mg (24 April 2022) / 1mg Diazepam (since 29 Aug 2020) * 8am Prozac : 6.16mg (25 oct 2022, feel awful, slight updose) / 6.08 mg (9 oct 2022) / 6.24mg (11 July 22) / 6.44mg (22 May 22) / 6.64mg (4 Nov 21) / 6.72mg (8 oct 21) / 6.8 mg (15 Sept 21)/ 6.88mg (14 Aug 21)/ 6.92mg (23 Jun 21) I am not a professional, I don't give medical advice. Discuss any decisions about your medical care with a knowledgeable medical practitioner. Link to comment
Administrator Altostrata Posted April 20, 2020 Administrator Share Posted April 20, 2020 When are you planning your next reduction of paroxetine, Erell? The fluoxetine should be ramping up now. This is not medical advice. Discuss any decisions about your medical care with a knowledgeable medical practitioner. "It has become appallingly obvious that our technology has surpassed our humanity." -- Albert Einstein All postings © copyrighted. Link to comment
Moderator Emeritus Erell Posted April 20, 2020 Author Moderator Emeritus Share Posted April 20, 2020 (edited) Hello Alto My new plan since your advice is to : - add 1mg fluoxetine every 4 days - drop 2mg Paroxetine every 4 days (not the same days) So next drop is tomorrow morning : I'll take 6mg Paroxetine. Some worries about a so fast taper of Paroxetine, but I know Fluoxetine is supposed to ramp up. By the way, felt relatively well today Afternoon : some anxiety but low or mild! And it was the only symptom ! 🤗 Thank you for keeping an eye on my bridge ❤ Edited April 20, 2020 by Erell 1 2006 : 20mg Paxil+Bromazepam. 2008 : cold turkey of both. 2010 : Reinstatement 20mg Paxil + Bromazepam. 2014-June2017 : Switch from Bromazepam to Prazepam, slow taper to 0mg. 2018 to August 2019 : Paxil 20mg taper (3% every 15 days). 22 Aug 2019 updose to 10mg (was at 8.4mg). 25th Sept 2019 To April 2020 : found SA, holding at 10mg Paxil. April 2020 : Paxil 10mg to Prozac 7mg bridge. Details : topic/21457 Current Supplements : magnesium citrate + fish oil Current medication : * 7pm Diazepam : 0.85mg (15 Aug 2022) / 0.95 mg (24 April 2022) / 1mg Diazepam (since 29 Aug 2020) * 8am Prozac : 6.16mg (25 oct 2022, feel awful, slight updose) / 6.08 mg (9 oct 2022) / 6.24mg (11 July 22) / 6.44mg (22 May 22) / 6.64mg (4 Nov 21) / 6.72mg (8 oct 21) / 6.8 mg (15 Sept 21)/ 6.88mg (14 Aug 21)/ 6.92mg (23 Jun 21) I am not a professional, I don't give medical advice. Discuss any decisions about your medical care with a knowledgeable medical practitioner. Link to comment
Administrator Altostrata Posted April 20, 2020 Administrator Share Posted April 20, 2020 Seems to be working. Well done, Erell. 1 This is not medical advice. Discuss any decisions about your medical care with a knowledgeable medical practitioner. "It has become appallingly obvious that our technology has surpassed our humanity." -- Albert Einstein All postings © copyrighted. Link to comment
Moderator Emeritus Erell Posted April 20, 2020 Author Moderator Emeritus Share Posted April 20, 2020 Fingers crossed ! 😊 2006 : 20mg Paxil+Bromazepam. 2008 : cold turkey of both. 2010 : Reinstatement 20mg Paxil + Bromazepam. 2014-June2017 : Switch from Bromazepam to Prazepam, slow taper to 0mg. 2018 to August 2019 : Paxil 20mg taper (3% every 15 days). 22 Aug 2019 updose to 10mg (was at 8.4mg). 25th Sept 2019 To April 2020 : found SA, holding at 10mg Paxil. April 2020 : Paxil 10mg to Prozac 7mg bridge. Details : topic/21457 Current Supplements : magnesium citrate + fish oil Current medication : * 7pm Diazepam : 0.85mg (15 Aug 2022) / 0.95 mg (24 April 2022) / 1mg Diazepam (since 29 Aug 2020) * 8am Prozac : 6.16mg (25 oct 2022, feel awful, slight updose) / 6.08 mg (9 oct 2022) / 6.24mg (11 July 22) / 6.44mg (22 May 22) / 6.64mg (4 Nov 21) / 6.72mg (8 oct 21) / 6.8 mg (15 Sept 21)/ 6.88mg (14 Aug 21)/ 6.92mg (23 Jun 21) I am not a professional, I don't give medical advice. Discuss any decisions about your medical care with a knowledgeable medical practitioner. Link to comment
Mentor mstimc Posted April 20, 2020 Mentor Share Posted April 20, 2020 Keep up the positive attitude, Erell--that is really so important to continued improvement! 2 Tim C Started Paxil for GAD in 1999 Unsuccessful taper attempt in 2006 Paxilprogress helped with a successful taper completed in 2009 Using therapy and CBT to manage my anxiety Link to comment
Mentor Cocopuffz17 Posted April 20, 2020 Mentor Share Posted April 20, 2020 You got this! Great attitude! I follow The Plant Paradox lifestyle by Dr.Gundry. This lifestyle has given me my life back and I feel better than I have ever felt in my life. It has enabled me to finally get off of this medication and truly live my life. Nutrition is the key to health!!!!! 2008 to 2019 - 20 mg Paroxetine Attempted 2 CT's around the 5-6 year mark. Were absolutely terrible and reinstated. Was never explained by the doctor the seriousness of the short half life of this drug. 2017 - Attempted a tapered discontinuation of this drug and reinstated after being unsuccessful. 2019 - Feb. 12 - After a three month taper I am off of paroxetine. The 3 months were terrible, awful withdrawal feelings. I followed the doctors guidelines for the reduction of this drug and now know it was way too fast. 2019 - Oct. 12 - 8 months off paroxetine. 75% improvement since coming off the drug. Definitely have had tons of challenges along the way. Let’s go!!!! 2021 - Feb. 12 - 24 months off paroxetine. I have minor challenges now. Tinnitus/Headaches are still around but are reduced by a massive amount. Link to comment
Moderator Emeritus Erell Posted April 24, 2020 Author Moderator Emeritus Share Posted April 24, 2020 (edited) Hello, and thanks for supporting me during this bridge ! ❤️ 💪 So, as you can see in my signature : still dropping Paroxetine while increasing Fluoxetine. Had a nice day on Tuesday 21st April : felt almost normal all day ! ❤️ Since Wednesday 22nd April, days are harder : increased anxiety, agoraphobia, dizziness, muscles pain, lot of nervosity... It worries me, but in the mean time : periods started on Wednesday ! And it's not unusual for me to have increased symptoms during periods. So I try to convince myself that symptoms are harder because of periods, and not because my brain is unhappy because of Paroxetine drops ! Not always easy to stay confident that this bridge will work, but as it is my best option right now, still doing a lot of self-coaching ! One thing that makes me very happy is : even if it takes more time to fall asleep, I'm having very sweet nights of sleep this week ! ❤️ Next steps will be : - 25th April : 4mg Paroxetine + 5mg Fluoxetine - 27th April : 2mg Paroxetine + 5mg Paroxetine - 30 April : 5mg Fluoxetine As I'm a bit worried about jumping to zero, I may add 1mg Fluoxetine in the mean time to get to 6mg. I'm ok with the idea to increase Fluoxetine to 10mg in the future if that's what my body needs. Most important for me is to give my CNS what he needs to avoid Paroxetine WD. Take care ❤️ Edited April 24, 2020 by Erell 2006 : 20mg Paxil+Bromazepam. 2008 : cold turkey of both. 2010 : Reinstatement 20mg Paxil + Bromazepam. 2014-June2017 : Switch from Bromazepam to Prazepam, slow taper to 0mg. 2018 to August 2019 : Paxil 20mg taper (3% every 15 days). 22 Aug 2019 updose to 10mg (was at 8.4mg). 25th Sept 2019 To April 2020 : found SA, holding at 10mg Paxil. April 2020 : Paxil 10mg to Prozac 7mg bridge. Details : topic/21457 Current Supplements : magnesium citrate + fish oil Current medication : * 7pm Diazepam : 0.85mg (15 Aug 2022) / 0.95 mg (24 April 2022) / 1mg Diazepam (since 29 Aug 2020) * 8am Prozac : 6.16mg (25 oct 2022, feel awful, slight updose) / 6.08 mg (9 oct 2022) / 6.24mg (11 July 22) / 6.44mg (22 May 22) / 6.64mg (4 Nov 21) / 6.72mg (8 oct 21) / 6.8 mg (15 Sept 21)/ 6.88mg (14 Aug 21)/ 6.92mg (23 Jun 21) I am not a professional, I don't give medical advice. Discuss any decisions about your medical care with a knowledgeable medical practitioner. Link to comment
Moderator Emeritus Sunnyday Posted April 24, 2020 Moderator Emeritus Share Posted April 24, 2020 @Erell very good to hear you've gotten some good sleep, that helps a lot! Wishing you luck and hoping it will work well for you. Take care Erell. 1 2011-2015: Escitalopram (Cipralex) 20 mg, Voxra 300 mg (quit Voxra in late 2015, no issues) 2016: Started tapering Escitalopram 5 mg at a time, every fourth week July 24th, 2016: Escitalopram 5 mg April 2nd, 2017: Quit last dosage (WD worsened a lot) Ca 6 last months of 2017: Taking Diazepam 15-25 mg irregularly, less than once a month Ca Dec 2017: Out of Diazepam, i.e free from all prescribed drugs Now: Still drug free Supplements: Irregular intake of Omega-3, magnesium, vitamin D. Link to comment
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