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Erell: struggling with paroxetine


Erell

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Posted (edited)

Thank you dears  ❤

 

Things are pretty rough.

My parents took me back to their home.

I've lost my job and don't have the finance to pay my flat.

 

I'm lucky that I have a family that can take care of me. 

 

I'm having the hardest time of my life, trying to do my best to keep going.

 

@Altostrata :

- I think physical restlessness has improved : the need to move all day long and to jump out of skin is lower ❤

- Mental restlessness is still extremely high and sometimes unbearable (doom cloud/SI surges/intrusive thoughts/ mental "akathisia"/dread/surges to 'escape').

I hang on to the hope that the Fluoxetine decrease will also help the mental restlessness (which appeared with physical restlessness).

 

Take of you dear friends ☀️

Edited by Erell

2006 : 20mg Paroxetine + Bromazepam(no specific dose) 

2008 : cold turkey of both

2010 : 20mg Deroxat + Bromazepam

2013: Switch from Bromazepam To Prazepam (long half-life)

2014-June2017 : Prazepam taper, 3% drops. 

2018 to August 2019 : Paroxetine 20mg taper (3% every 15 days).

- 22nd August updosed To 10mg (was at 8.4mg) because of a big wave. 

25th Sept 2019 To April 2020 : found SA, holding at 10mg Paroxetine. 

 

April 2020-August 2020 : Paxil to Prozac bridge. Details https://www.survivingantidepressants.org/topic/21457-erell-struggling-with-paroxetine/?do=findComment&comment=499847

 

Current Supplements : magnesium citrate/ fish oil/ evening primrose oil 

 

Current medication :

7mg Fluoxetine + toothpick Paroxetine (since 20 Aug 2020)

1mg Diazepam (since 29 Aug 2020)

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  • Mentor
1 hour ago, Erell said:

'm lucky that I have a family that can take care of me. 

Hi Erell

 

Several years ago, when I was especially low, my therapist asked me to find some positive things in my life.  One was that I could depend on my family (wife) to be supportive while I dealt with WD and recovery.  It means so much to know you have a safe place despite all the other issues we're dealing with.  I hope you get into a window soon!

Tim C

Started Paxil for GAD in 1999

Unsuccessful taper attempt in 2006

Paxilprogress helped with a successful taper completed in 2009

Using therapy and CBT to manage my anxiety

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Erell, je suis tellement désolée que tu traverses ça... C'est terrible...

 

Je souhaite de tout coeur que ta mauvais vague se termine très rapidement et que tu entres très vite dans une nouvelle fenêtre de bien être...

 

Courage,courage ❤

 

Google translation:

 

Erell, I'm so sorry you're going through this ... it's terrible ...

 

I wholeheartedly wish that your bad wave ends very quickly and that you enter a new window of well-being very quickly ...

 

Edited by ChessieCat
added Google translation

June 25 - July 8, 2020 - 2 weeks on Brintellix, suffered an adverse reaction.

 

25 juin - 8 juillet 2020-2 semaines sur Brintellix, a subi un effet indésirable.

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🤗 ma chère Erell. Holding you in my heart. 

2008-2016 - Lexapro 10 mg, tapered to 2.5 mg over one year then CT without issues
Feb 2, 2019 to July 24, 2019 - restarted Lexapro 5 mg for insomnia; July 25, 2019 increase Lexapro 10 mg, which caused increased anxiety and depression.
Nov 20, 2019 to Dec 11, 2019 - 3-week FT from Lexapro 10 mg to 7.5 mg to 5 mg to 0
Dec 12, 2019 to Feb 4, 2020 - drug-free and feeling good until horrible WD hit
Feb 5, 2020 to Feb 16, 2020 - Paxil 10 mg, resulted in very bad reaction
Feb 18, 2020 - reinstate Lexapro 5 mg and stabilizing

Oct 24, 2020 - start brassmonkey taper with 2.5% reduction; current: 4.9 mgai/6.7 mgpw

 

daily meditation 10-40 minutes, yoga 30 minutes; CBT & ACT therapy

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  • Moderator Emeritus

Erell, I think of you every day and send you healing energy.

2016 - Zoloft 50 mg for klonopin w/d

Approx. Nov 2017 - successful taper of klonopin; Approx. Jan. 2018 - rapid taper Zoloft over 2 wks - no w/d symptoms; May 2018 - Reinstate 50 mg Zoloft per doctor; Aug 2018 - Rapid taper Zoloft over 3-4 weeks - no w/d symptoms for 1 mo.; Late Oct 2018 - pdoc rx'd 5mg lexapro -took for 1 wk; Early Nov 2018 - Reinstate 25 mg Zoloft; updose to 37.5 on Nov 28, 2018; Nov 30 2018 - returned to 25mg Zoloft upon mod. advice; Dec 9 - Dec10 2018 - 12.5mg zoloft liquid+12.5mg zoloft pill; Dec 11 2018 - 25mg zoloft all liquid; Feb 14 2019 - updosed to 26.25 mg liquid; Mar 6 2019 - updosed to 26.88 mg liquid - new symptoms; Mar 13 2019 - back down to 26.25 mg per mod suggestion

Dose Changes: Dec 2 2019 - 5% to 25mg; Jan 14 2020 - 10% to 22.5 (increase in sxs all month); Mar 10-15? 2020,  accidental updose to 25mg; Mar 22 2020 - back down to 22.5mg; Apr 12 2020 - 2.5% to 21.94mg; Apr 19 2020 - 2.5% to 21.375mg (symptom increase); May 17 2020 - 2.5% to 20.625mg; May 24 2020 - 2.5% to 20.1mg - Jun 14 2020 - noticed uptick in symptoms settled 2 days later - July 10 2020 - onset of wave

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  • Mentor

Erell,

 

You are in my thoughts.

 

Sending you lots of good vibes and hugs:)

PREVIOUS medications and discontinuations: Have been on medications since 1996. 

 Valium, Gabapentin, Lamictal and Prilosec from 2000 to 2015 with a fast taper by a psychiatrist.

 Liquid Lexapro Nov, 2016 to 31-March, 2019 Lexapro free!!! (total Lexapro taper was 4 years-started with pill form)

---CURRENT MEDICATIONS:Supplements:Milk Thistle, Metamucil, Magnesium Citrate, Vitamin D3, Levothyroxine

 Xanax 1mg three times a day June, 2000 to 19-September, 2020 Went from .150 grams (average weight of 1 Xanax) three times a day to .003 grams three times a day.

19-September, 2020 Xanax free!!! (total Xanax taper was 15-1/2 months-1-June, 2019-19-September, 2020)

 

 

I am not a medical professional. The suggestions I make are based on personal experience.

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Subzero42

Erell,

 

Does your family understands what you’re going through ? Mine does not and only thinks I’m a wreck.

 

It’s sad cause it can make a huge difference to have a supportive family not only financially speaking

2017 Feb : Lexapro 10mg.

2017 May : Lexapro 20mg.

2017 Nov : CT Lexapro

2017 Dec Reinstated Lexapro 20mg.

2018 Feb : Lexapro 20 + Effexor 75

May to December : Taper Lexapro 

2019 Apr : Effexor 56mg

2019 May : Effexor 37,5mg

2019 Jun : Effexor 18,75mg

2019 Aug : Reinstated Effexor 37,5mg.

2020 Oct : Slowly updose Effexor

 

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  • Moderator
Posted (edited)

Hello dear friends,

 

Thank you for you nice support, it helps me A LOT ❤

 

Wow, what a journey eh ?

I realize now how things are special with Fluoxetine because of its long half-life.

And how a small amount can make a big différence.

 

 

Well, one week at 7mg Fluoxetine,  here I am :

 

- physical restlessness  : a lot better !

I'm now able to sit still, able to sleep 5hours (❤).

Things are still difficult : I live all day with a strong restlessness feeling in arms and legs.

But the absolute necessity to shake/move/jump out of skin is much lower 😊

 

- mentally : I still feel highly restless.

Too much surges.

 

I struggle to cope, but put my efforts on focusing on the improvments, even if they are tiny ones.

 

I'm hoping that the decrease will help with mental restlessness and intrusive thoughts and surges. As these symptoms appeared with Fluoxetine increase.

 

I do consider Diazepam everyday, mostly when surges (harm and self harm) are too intense.

But my wish is not to add more drugs, and after 3 years without benzo I'm too afraid of a possible paradoxical réaction. 

It is hard to be afraid of yourself.

 

Again,  thank you : your healing vibes are great comfort ❤

 

Edited by Erell

2006 : 20mg Paroxetine + Bromazepam(no specific dose) 

2008 : cold turkey of both

2010 : 20mg Deroxat + Bromazepam

2013: Switch from Bromazepam To Prazepam (long half-life)

2014-June2017 : Prazepam taper, 3% drops. 

2018 to August 2019 : Paroxetine 20mg taper (3% every 15 days).

- 22nd August updosed To 10mg (was at 8.4mg) because of a big wave. 

25th Sept 2019 To April 2020 : found SA, holding at 10mg Paroxetine. 

 

April 2020-August 2020 : Paxil to Prozac bridge. Details https://www.survivingantidepressants.org/topic/21457-erell-struggling-with-paroxetine/?do=findComment&comment=499847

 

Current Supplements : magnesium citrate/ fish oil/ evening primrose oil 

 

Current medication :

7mg Fluoxetine + toothpick Paroxetine (since 20 Aug 2020)

1mg Diazepam (since 29 Aug 2020)

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  • Moderator
ChessieCat

Wow, that's great news that things are improving.  Thank you for letting us know.

NEW!!!              INTERVIEW with Altostrata, SA's founder               NEW!!! 

 

ADs since ~1992:  25+ years - 1 unknown, Prozac (muscle weakness), Zoloft; citalopram (pooped out) CTed (very sick for 2.5 wks a few months after)

Pristiq:  50mg 2012, 100mg beg 2013 (Serotonin Toxicity)  Tapering Oct 2015  Current from 14 Nov 2020:  Pristiq 0.50 mg

My tapering program                                      My Intro (goes to my tapering graph)

My website - includes my brief history + links to videos & information on the web

PLEASE NOTE:  I am not a medical professional.  I provide information and make suggestions.

 

REMINDER TO SELF:  I don't need the drug now, but my still brain does.

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  • Moderator
13 hours ago, Subzero42 said:

Erell,

 

Does your family understands what you’re going through ? Mine does not and only thinks I’m a wreck.

 

It’s sad cause it can make a huge difference to have a supportive family not only financially speaking

Hello 

 

No my family doesn't understand, but I don't think that people can understand the intensity of our symptoms.

And it's better like that : I'm glad they don't have to go through this !

 

As I'm now living with parents, I choose carefully my words  : I don't talk about harm and self harm impulses, it would just scare them.

And the risk would be to end with more drugs.

 

They do see that I'm very restless, and it seems that these new symptoms have a positive outcome : they now believe me that it is the drug that put me in this hard place.

But they still think that more drugs could help... ;)

 

I'm doing my best to cope, protect my family, my life.

 

Take care ☀️

2006 : 20mg Paroxetine + Bromazepam(no specific dose) 

2008 : cold turkey of both

2010 : 20mg Deroxat + Bromazepam

2013: Switch from Bromazepam To Prazepam (long half-life)

2014-June2017 : Prazepam taper, 3% drops. 

2018 to August 2019 : Paroxetine 20mg taper (3% every 15 days).

- 22nd August updosed To 10mg (was at 8.4mg) because of a big wave. 

25th Sept 2019 To April 2020 : found SA, holding at 10mg Paroxetine. 

 

April 2020-August 2020 : Paxil to Prozac bridge. Details https://www.survivingantidepressants.org/topic/21457-erell-struggling-with-paroxetine/?do=findComment&comment=499847

 

Current Supplements : magnesium citrate/ fish oil/ evening primrose oil 

 

Current medication :

7mg Fluoxetine + toothpick Paroxetine (since 20 Aug 2020)

1mg Diazepam (since 29 Aug 2020)

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  • Mentor

I've found that no matter how much my loved ones sympathize and support me, they can't really understand what we're experiencing.  Having your own mind become your worst tormentor is something that has to be experienced to be understood.  Still, having their support is often enough; like you, I try to be grateful for their patience.  Take care Erell!

Tim C

Started Paxil for GAD in 1999

Unsuccessful taper attempt in 2006

Paxilprogress helped with a successful taper completed in 2009

Using therapy and CBT to manage my anxiety

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  • Moderator
Posted (edited)

Hello @Altostrata,

 

I'm sorry to tag you, I'm looking for some words of wisdom and comfort. 

I am very tired.

 

Activation symptoms :

 

- physically : some things are lower (need to pace/shake all day long). Still restless. Physical urges to escape.

- mentally : hard to bear. Dread/intrusive thoughts/ doom/ surges/ loosing ground.

- sleep : I wake up every hour with "restless legs" in all my body. I think I get around 4-5 hours sleep.

- everything feels too much for my brain : light, sounds, interactions. Everything seems terrifying.

 

New symptoms :

- since yesterday evening my body rejects everything I eat (vomit). 

- inner vibrations + feeling like on a boat

 

When I look at daily notes, I think there are improvments (physical restlessness). But the mental restlessness is so hard and beyond everything I knew before August that I have issues to cope.

I know you can't do much, but I think I need some words of hope and support.

 

Take care ❤

Edited by Erell

2006 : 20mg Paroxetine + Bromazepam(no specific dose) 

2008 : cold turkey of both

2010 : 20mg Deroxat + Bromazepam

2013: Switch from Bromazepam To Prazepam (long half-life)

2014-June2017 : Prazepam taper, 3% drops. 

2018 to August 2019 : Paroxetine 20mg taper (3% every 15 days).

- 22nd August updosed To 10mg (was at 8.4mg) because of a big wave. 

25th Sept 2019 To April 2020 : found SA, holding at 10mg Paroxetine. 

 

April 2020-August 2020 : Paxil to Prozac bridge. Details https://www.survivingantidepressants.org/topic/21457-erell-struggling-with-paroxetine/?do=findComment&comment=499847

 

Current Supplements : magnesium citrate/ fish oil/ evening primrose oil 

 

Current medication :

7mg Fluoxetine + toothpick Paroxetine (since 20 Aug 2020)

1mg Diazepam (since 29 Aug 2020)

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 @Erell, iam very sorry u are feeling bad but I think I need to remind u with something; you could bear more than what u describe now and beared harder suffer. I know it is too hard but, let the hours go, u will feel better very soon.

Please let me know how it goes for u.

i wasn't on a certain drug all the period. i took many drugs many times and for no very long period but to simplify.

--fluvoxamine maleate100 mg + amisulpride 200mg------started july 2012 and total taper in february 2015 ( 9 months without drugs then)

--sertraline 100mg -------started november 2015 and total taper (withoud reduction slowly) in november 2016( 4 months withoud drugs then).

--sertraline 100mg + quetiabine 25mg ( started in mars 2016 and for 7 months) then fluvoxamine maleate 100mg again for another 7months and after that a something like to use every drug for 14 days and for about 1.5 years.

--my last drug was trintellix 10 mg ( used it in 12/2018and total taper in 4/2019).

symptomts i have now ( bad concentration and problems in short and long memory+ bad depersonalization).

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Longroadhome

Thinking of you @Erell

one day this will be over and you will be free of WD 

 

So sorry your going through this 

 

 

October 2004 -  October 2018 Paxil 20mg

October 2018 - November 2018 15mg Paxil 

Nov 2018 -  2x50 mg Pregabalin to help with Paxil WD

December 2018 - January 2019 10mg Paxil  

January 2019 - February 2019  7.5mg Paxil crashed 

February 2019 - 8.5mg Paxil

August 2019 - stopped both meds for 2.5 days meltdown 

August 2019 -  daily: 50mg Pregabalin April 2020 45mg May 40mg June 35mg, beg July 30mg, end July 25mg, Aug 24mg

Nov 2019 - 8mg Paxil, March 2020 7.2mg April 6.5mg May 5.9mg June 5.4mg July 4.8mg

 

these dates are approximate 

 

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  • Moderator Emeritus

@Erell, hi.

 

I'm sorry to hear you are struggling. I know it's a heavy burden to bear and you have my full compassion. You also have my admiration in your strength to endure it.

 

Those activation symptoms you describe are understandably disquieting. They wash in upon us with vigor during the waves. The restless feelings and urges to escape - "restless legs" all over - that inner agitation used to make me feel like I wanted to run down the street screaming. I felt I could not be still. The intrusive thoughts and surges are more pronounced as well as they walk hand-in-hand with the stresses that the symptoms put on our bodies and minds. There is too much for the brain to process. I remember that too. I couldn't ride in a car because things were passing by too fast, my brain couldn't take the stimulation that was coming in through my eyes. Sounds, even slight noises, startled me. If I went outside, I was blind until my eyes adjusted. And when I returned indoors, again the blindness until my eyes adjusted. And sometimes that adjustment took a long while. I was frightened of everything.

 

Your new symptoms were also experienced by me. I went through cyclical periods of not being able to eat anything. I did what I could, but some days I'd only get in 200 to 300 calories. And the inner vibrations; for me this was a feeling of instability, and also sometimes jarring, like the feeling of two rubber school erasers being rubbed together.

 

What you describe is... suffering. It's a suffering that is unfortunately part of the process of what we go through when we withdraw from medications that have asserted control over our biochemistry. The suffering however is to a greater end, as our minds and bodies have the capacity to restore and heal. This is the path you are on - the path towards restoration and healing. And you will get there. I didn't think I would get there - and when I was where you are, I struggled so mightily just to get through the minutes, hours, and days. The struggle was well worth it. I know that now in hindsight. You'll see.

 

Hang in there,

Dave

1996 - .5mg Ativan as needed, 7.5mg Remeron daily2008 - .5mg Xanax, Ativan discontinued, Remeron continued2012 - .5mg Xanax, .25mg Ativan 3x daily, Remeron continued2/2012 - Jumped from Remeron, continued .5mg Xanax .25mg Ativan 3x daily4/2012 - Began rapid taper of .5mg Xanax .25mg Ativan 3x daily6/2012 - Jumped from Xanax and Ativan, voluntary hospitalization followed7/2012 - 2nd voluntary hospitalization, reinstated Remeron, bumped to 30mg, also given risperidone.8/2012 - discontinued risperidone, tried gabapentin, dicontinued gabapentin, Remeron 30mg continued10/2012 to current - tapered Remeron 10% every 4 to 6 weeks (sometimes more time) using liquid compound12/2014 - 2mg Remeron 1/16/2015 - 1.9mg Remeron 8/1/2015 -1.6mg Remeron - 03/1/2016 - 1.5mg Remeron - 1/2/2017 1.3mg - 5/7/2017 1.2mg - 5/13/2017 - syringe size change - 6/8/2017 - 1.1mg - 7/10/2017 - 1mg - 9/1/2017 - 0.9mg - 10/22/2017 - 0.8mg - 11/22/2017 - 0.7mg - 2/2/2018 - 0.6mg - 3/13/2018 - new compound pharmacy - 5/20/2018 - 0.5mg - 8/31/2018 - 0.4mg - 11/16/2018 - 0.3mg - 12/24/2018 - 0.2mg - 4/1/2019 - 0.1mg - 5/1/2019 - .05mg - 0mg achieved 2019-06-15. 🤞

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@Erell - I am so sorry that you have to endure such challenges. Even with all you are going through, I swear I can feel your strength and hope in every word you write. I am holding you in my heart. 

2008-2016 - Lexapro 10 mg, tapered to 2.5 mg over one year then CT without issues
Feb 2, 2019 to July 24, 2019 - restarted Lexapro 5 mg for insomnia; July 25, 2019 increase Lexapro 10 mg, which caused increased anxiety and depression.
Nov 20, 2019 to Dec 11, 2019 - 3-week FT from Lexapro 10 mg to 7.5 mg to 5 mg to 0
Dec 12, 2019 to Feb 4, 2020 - drug-free and feeling good until horrible WD hit
Feb 5, 2020 to Feb 16, 2020 - Paxil 10 mg, resulted in very bad reaction
Feb 18, 2020 - reinstate Lexapro 5 mg and stabilizing

Oct 24, 2020 - start brassmonkey taper with 2.5% reduction; current: 4.9 mgai/6.7 mgpw

 

daily meditation 10-40 minutes, yoga 30 minutes; CBT & ACT therapy

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  • Administrator
Altostrata

Erell, how do you feel shortly after you take fluoxetine? Do you feel the effect of the drug?

This is not medical advice. Discuss any decisions about your medical care with a knowledgeable medical practitioner.

"It has become appallingly obvious that our technology has surpassed our humanity." -- Albert Einstein

All postings © copyrighted.

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  • Moderator
Posted (edited)
51 minutes ago, Altostrata said:

Erell, how do you feel shortly after you take fluoxetine? Do you feel the effect of the drug?

 

I don't feel different after taking Fluoxetine.

Symptoms don't seem to be impacted by the fact that I take my dose.

 

I take my dose at 8 am.

 

It seems that I have 2 slightly easier moments during the day : around 11am / around 6pm.

 

I have been wondering if I was having an adverse reaction to Fluoxetine, but it seems weird after 4 months.

Before August, I had my usual symptoms of a destabilised CNS (chemical anxiety/depression).

Restlessness state only appeared in August.

Edited by Erell

2006 : 20mg Paroxetine + Bromazepam(no specific dose) 

2008 : cold turkey of both

2010 : 20mg Deroxat + Bromazepam

2013: Switch from Bromazepam To Prazepam (long half-life)

2014-June2017 : Prazepam taper, 3% drops. 

2018 to August 2019 : Paroxetine 20mg taper (3% every 15 days).

- 22nd August updosed To 10mg (was at 8.4mg) because of a big wave. 

25th Sept 2019 To April 2020 : found SA, holding at 10mg Paroxetine. 

 

April 2020-August 2020 : Paxil to Prozac bridge. Details https://www.survivingantidepressants.org/topic/21457-erell-struggling-with-paroxetine/?do=findComment&comment=499847

 

Current Supplements : magnesium citrate/ fish oil/ evening primrose oil 

 

Current medication :

7mg Fluoxetine + toothpick Paroxetine (since 20 Aug 2020)

1mg Diazepam (since 29 Aug 2020)

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  • Moderator

@Altostrata :

 

As an example, here are my daily notes for Thursday 27 :

 

5.30am : woke up. Restlessness in legs in all body. Do some yoga.

 

7.30am : toothpick Paroxetine + 1 fish oil. + breakfast.

Mental restlessness/surges to escape/doom/ intrusive thoughts and physical need to move.

Strong nauseas. 

 

8am : 7mg Fluoxetine. 

Mental restlessness and physical need to move (same as earlier).

Try to distract with cleaning.

 

9.30am : same symptoms. Went for a walk outside. 

Walk seems to help with physical restlessness.

 

11am : slightly calmer for 30min. Trying to do a puzzle.

 

Noon : eat some vegetables with fresh meat.

 

1pm : lie down in bed with audio relaxation. Physical restlessness better.

Very hard mentally. 

 

2pm : EFT. Then clean my car in order to distract. Still very hard mentally.

 

3pm : some gardening. Still very hard mentally. 

 

4pm : went for a walk in woods Again. Seems to help with physical restlessness.  Feeling exausted.

 

6pm : Intrusive thoughts lower. Feeling dread. Body aches. Went to take a shower. 

Took 1000mg EPO.

 

7pm : eat a salad. Vomit after 5 minutes.

 

Evening : restlessness seems to be lower. Intense dread.

 

From midnight to 5am : fall asleep and wake up several times. Very hot and sweaty. Strong restlessness in legs.

 

 

2006 : 20mg Paroxetine + Bromazepam(no specific dose) 

2008 : cold turkey of both

2010 : 20mg Deroxat + Bromazepam

2013: Switch from Bromazepam To Prazepam (long half-life)

2014-June2017 : Prazepam taper, 3% drops. 

2018 to August 2019 : Paroxetine 20mg taper (3% every 15 days).

- 22nd August updosed To 10mg (was at 8.4mg) because of a big wave. 

25th Sept 2019 To April 2020 : found SA, holding at 10mg Paroxetine. 

 

April 2020-August 2020 : Paxil to Prozac bridge. Details https://www.survivingantidepressants.org/topic/21457-erell-struggling-with-paroxetine/?do=findComment&comment=499847

 

Current Supplements : magnesium citrate/ fish oil/ evening primrose oil 

 

Current medication :

7mg Fluoxetine + toothpick Paroxetine (since 20 Aug 2020)

1mg Diazepam (since 29 Aug 2020)

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  • Administrator
Altostrata

Since August 20, when you lowered fluoxetine to 7mg, you've had some fluctuations. It seemed symptoms got better, than worse. Can you list the 8 days since August 20 and indicate whether overall you had a lightening or intensification of symptoms?

This is not medical advice. Discuss any decisions about your medical care with a knowledgeable medical practitioner.

"It has become appallingly obvious that our technology has surpassed our humanity." -- Albert Einstein

All postings © copyrighted.

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  • Moderator
Posted (edited)
4 hours ago, Altostrata said:

 It seemed symptoms got better, than worse.

I think overall physical restlessness really improved, and then worsen again last two days.

Intrusive harm thoughts/dread/mental surges are still very hard to cope.

 

I'm sorry. 

 

I'm quite amazed that changes between 7 and 8mg have sent me in this situation.

 

20 August : same as previous days

 

21 August : better in the evening, less physical restlessness, slept 5 hours straight (!)

 

22 August : still physically better in the morning, then up again.

Mental restlessness same as previous days.

Slept 2-3 hours

 

23 August : same as days before August 20. Very hard. Slept around 4 hours.

 

24 August : Morning very hard.

Afternoon better : able to cry a bit and sit still. Yawn.

Slept 4 hours. 

 

25 August : physically better, less restlessness and need to move.

Mentally very hard, same as days before 20 August.

Slept 4-5 hours.

 

26 August : physically still better.

Mentally  : very hard, but some easier moments during the day. 

Slept 5 hours straight  (!)

 

27 August  : Mentally  : very hard day, no relief. Seems to worsen.

Vomit.

Intense intrusive thoughts and surges. 

Slept 3 hours. Need to pace during the night.

 

 

28 August : Mentally : very hard day,.no relief. Seems to worsen

Vomit.

Intense intrusive thoughts and surges.

Physical restlessness increases during night : need to pace and shake come back. Slept 2 hours. Feel like I'm gonna explode.

 

Edited by Erell

2006 : 20mg Paroxetine + Bromazepam(no specific dose) 

2008 : cold turkey of both

2010 : 20mg Deroxat + Bromazepam

2013: Switch from Bromazepam To Prazepam (long half-life)

2014-June2017 : Prazepam taper, 3% drops. 

2018 to August 2019 : Paroxetine 20mg taper (3% every 15 days).

- 22nd August updosed To 10mg (was at 8.4mg) because of a big wave. 

25th Sept 2019 To April 2020 : found SA, holding at 10mg Paroxetine. 

 

April 2020-August 2020 : Paxil to Prozac bridge. Details https://www.survivingantidepressants.org/topic/21457-erell-struggling-with-paroxetine/?do=findComment&comment=499847

 

Current Supplements : magnesium citrate/ fish oil/ evening primrose oil 

 

Current medication :

7mg Fluoxetine + toothpick Paroxetine (since 20 Aug 2020)

1mg Diazepam (since 29 Aug 2020)

Link to post
  • Administrator
Altostrata

My intuition is that your optimal Prozac dosage might be around 7.25mg. When you increased to 8mg, that was too much. It's taken the reductions following 8mg on August 5 3 weeks to bring the amount in your bloodstream down to 7mg. This is about right for the lower range of washout based on half-life. I might add 0.25mg.

This is not medical advice. Discuss any decisions about your medical care with a knowledgeable medical practitioner.

"It has become appallingly obvious that our technology has surpassed our humanity." -- Albert Einstein

All postings © copyrighted.

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  • Moderator
Posted (edited)
11 hours ago, Altostrata said:

My intuition is that your optimal Prozac dosage might be around 7.25mg. When you increased to 8mg, that was too much. It's taken the reductions following 8mg on August 5 3 weeks to bring the amount in your bloodstream down to 7mg. This is about right for the lower range of washout based on half-life. I might add 0.25mg.

 

Thank you for your input.

 

Alto, I just spent my most difficult night with constant extreme surges/ kind of akathisia.

I must confess that I took 1mg Diazepam 20 minutes ago.

 

I'm in a crisis state and don't really know how to protect my life the best I can. This inner restlessness feels unbearable.

 

I know that benzos are evil drugs and that my CNS needs rest.

I know about kindling.

I don't know how to go through this rough patch. 

I'm trying to self-soothe the best I can.

 

I'm sorry and ashamed. 

And scared. 

Edited by Erell

2006 : 20mg Paroxetine + Bromazepam(no specific dose) 

2008 : cold turkey of both

2010 : 20mg Deroxat + Bromazepam

2013: Switch from Bromazepam To Prazepam (long half-life)

2014-June2017 : Prazepam taper, 3% drops. 

2018 to August 2019 : Paroxetine 20mg taper (3% every 15 days).

- 22nd August updosed To 10mg (was at 8.4mg) because of a big wave. 

25th Sept 2019 To April 2020 : found SA, holding at 10mg Paroxetine. 

 

April 2020-August 2020 : Paxil to Prozac bridge. Details https://www.survivingantidepressants.org/topic/21457-erell-struggling-with-paroxetine/?do=findComment&comment=499847

 

Current Supplements : magnesium citrate/ fish oil/ evening primrose oil 

 

Current medication :

7mg Fluoxetine + toothpick Paroxetine (since 20 Aug 2020)

1mg Diazepam (since 29 Aug 2020)

Link to post

Oh je suis tellement désolée pour toi Erell... pour ce que tu traverses.... 

Toutes mes pensées vont vers toi...

Je t'envoies toutes mes bonnes ondes pour ton rétablissement 😘

 

 

 

June 25 - July 8, 2020 - 2 weeks on Brintellix, suffered an adverse reaction.

 

25 juin - 8 juillet 2020-2 semaines sur Brintellix, a subi un effet indésirable.

Link to post

Salut @Erell

 

Je pense à toi fort chaque jour. 

 

Je t'envoie toutes mes pensées. 

 

Bisous 😘

 

 

Hi @Erell


I think of you hard every day.

I send you all my thoughts.

Kisses

 

2018 : 29 July xanax 0,125x 2 12 Aug 0,25 x 2  28 Aug clotiazépam 5x2 4 Oct Prazepam : 5-5-7,5 to 3,5-3,5-6,5 25 oct 10x3 21 nov 9,5 x3/ Now Taper 2% / 21days = 19 may 2019 7,32x3/ Now 5%/8 days =10 july 5,145 x3 /Now 2% / 21 days = 27 sept 4,75x3/ Now 1%/21 days = nov 4,70 x3 dec 4,65x3 jan 2020 4,60x3 feb 4,50x3 march 4,45x3 april 4,385x3 may 4,32x3 

 

2018 : 29 Aug Venlafaxine 75mg XR 19 sept 37,5mg 4 oct 75mg18 oct bridge sertraline 1 nov Sertraline 50mg slow taper until mi April 2019= 25mg

15 July Escitalopram 5mg 20 Ju 4mg 22 Ju 3,25mg 23 ju 2,5mg  25 ju 2,25mg 8 Aug 2 mg 16 Aug 1,75mg 20 Aug 1,50mg 12 sept 1,25mg 24 sept 1,38mg 28 sept 1,50mg 8 Jan 1, 60mg

Link to post
sunnysideup69

Hey @Erell,

I'm so sorry it's this tough right now. Sending you lots of love and a big hug.

Do you have a safety plan? I just read that you're at home with your parents now. Are they able to sit with you without panicking themselves / referring you to a doctor? 

 

Am also wondering whether you have a support line like here in the UK we have the Samaritans, a 24hour service you can call when in crisis?

 

January 2008 to April 2015 Citalopram 20mg to 5mg, reducing in 50 per cent leaps. Jumped off at 5mg

March 2016 used MDMA triggered setback

April 2016 Citalopram 10mg October 2016 cut to 5mg, May 2017 cut to 2.5mg

May 2018 used MDMA triggered setback

June 2018 Citalopram 2.5mg up to 10mg, then back to 5mg

July/ August 2018 7.5mg, then 10mg

June 2019 updosed to 20mg Citalopram

August 2019 cold switch to Venlafaxine 75mg XR

Supplements; 1100mg fish oil daily; also currently reducing caffeine, aiming to get off.

 

 

Link to post
  • Moderator
5 hours ago, sunnysideup69 said:

Hey @Erell,

I'm so sorry it's this tough right now. Sending you lots of love and a big hug.

Do you have a safety plan? I just read that you're at home with your parents now. Are they able to sit with you without panicking themselves / referring you to a doctor? 

 

Am also wondering whether you have a support line like here in the UK we have the Samaritans, a 24hour service you can call when in crisis?

 

 

Hello

 

I'm really sorry to express my ordeal.

 

Yes I live with my parents : I hide my best what I'm going through in order to avoid their panic and the risk of more drugs.

However, they see how restless I am so I can't hide much.

 

I have to say that even if they don't understand they are currently pretty amazing : they used to be pro-drugs and didn't really believe me or listen when I tried to educate them.

But with my current restlessness state they are starting to believe me and willing to protect me from psychiatrists and drugs cocktails.

My mother even came with me today to see my psychiatrist (needed a new prescription) and she really has been my lawyer, she amazed me !

Her best sentence "my daughter needs your respect and integrity, she doesn't need more drugs" 😍

 

But yes I have to admit that they are panicking a bit, mostly because they see how much I struggle.

 

I've called a support line : I don't really know what to think, had the feeling that I was disturbing the guy. Might try again.

 

Thank you, all, for your priceless support.

 

2006 : 20mg Paroxetine + Bromazepam(no specific dose) 

2008 : cold turkey of both

2010 : 20mg Deroxat + Bromazepam

2013: Switch from Bromazepam To Prazepam (long half-life)

2014-June2017 : Prazepam taper, 3% drops. 

2018 to August 2019 : Paroxetine 20mg taper (3% every 15 days).

- 22nd August updosed To 10mg (was at 8.4mg) because of a big wave. 

25th Sept 2019 To April 2020 : found SA, holding at 10mg Paroxetine. 

 

April 2020-August 2020 : Paxil to Prozac bridge. Details https://www.survivingantidepressants.org/topic/21457-erell-struggling-with-paroxetine/?do=findComment&comment=499847

 

Current Supplements : magnesium citrate/ fish oil/ evening primrose oil 

 

Current medication :

7mg Fluoxetine + toothpick Paroxetine (since 20 Aug 2020)

1mg Diazepam (since 29 Aug 2020)

Link to post
  • Moderator
Posted (edited)
11 hours ago, Altostrata said:

My intuition is that your optimal Prozac dosage might be around 7.25mg. When you increased to 8mg, that was too much. It's taken the reductions following 8mg on August 5 3 weeks to bring the amount in your bloodstream down to 7mg. This is about right for the lower range of washout based on half-life. I might add 0.25mg.

 

Hello Altostrata 

 

And thank you for sharing your guess.

 

I'm not sure I interpret right : 

- activation might be lowered by decreasing a dosage

- an updose might help someone who suffers from WD symptoms

 

does the suggestion to increase mean that I don't suffer only from activation but maybe also WD ?

 

Must confess that I'm pretty scared to make inner restlessness worse with an updose. My mental state is very challenging with strong surges and I'm scared to risk being worse.

 

I'm sorry to ask you for your help.

I've informed my psychiatrist because I feel the need to educate him, but his advice is to add Olanzapine in order to "force the brain to accept Fluoxetine dosage".

So thank you for your patience. 

You really help me to hang on.

 

Edited by Erell

2006 : 20mg Paroxetine + Bromazepam(no specific dose) 

2008 : cold turkey of both

2010 : 20mg Deroxat + Bromazepam

2013: Switch from Bromazepam To Prazepam (long half-life)

2014-June2017 : Prazepam taper, 3% drops. 

2018 to August 2019 : Paroxetine 20mg taper (3% every 15 days).

- 22nd August updosed To 10mg (was at 8.4mg) because of a big wave. 

25th Sept 2019 To April 2020 : found SA, holding at 10mg Paroxetine. 

 

April 2020-August 2020 : Paxil to Prozac bridge. Details https://www.survivingantidepressants.org/topic/21457-erell-struggling-with-paroxetine/?do=findComment&comment=499847

 

Current Supplements : magnesium citrate/ fish oil/ evening primrose oil 

 

Current medication :

7mg Fluoxetine + toothpick Paroxetine (since 20 Aug 2020)

1mg Diazepam (since 29 Aug 2020)

Link to post
Longroadhome

@Erell

 

Glad your parents are with you for support and being so strong for you . 

Try the support line again Some are amazing and can be of great help. 
 

You seem to have a plan in place with parents , psychiatrist and help line and this site . That’s positive. 
hold tight take each day minute but minute hour by hour . 
 

you need to express how you feel and not suppress It. That is what this site is for. You are helping others that will be on the same journey through to recovery as you are now, in the future. 


don’t sit on your own away from others too much 

listen to comforting music 

have the tv on in the background 
distract yourself as much as you can 

October 2004 -  October 2018 Paxil 20mg

October 2018 - November 2018 15mg Paxil 

Nov 2018 -  2x50 mg Pregabalin to help with Paxil WD

December 2018 - January 2019 10mg Paxil  

January 2019 - February 2019  7.5mg Paxil crashed 

February 2019 - 8.5mg Paxil

August 2019 - stopped both meds for 2.5 days meltdown 

August 2019 -  daily: 50mg Pregabalin April 2020 45mg May 40mg June 35mg, beg July 30mg, end July 25mg, Aug 24mg

Nov 2019 - 8mg Paxil, March 2020 7.2mg April 6.5mg May 5.9mg June 5.4mg July 4.8mg

 

these dates are approximate 

 

Link to post
1 hour ago, Erell said:

Her best sentence "my daughter needs your respect and integrity, she doesn't need more drugs"

 

Sweet @Erell - It is great to hear you have your parents by your side, helping you. And you are doing everything in your power to help yourself. You are incredible! Sending you all my love and rest for your weary CNS. 🤗

2008-2016 - Lexapro 10 mg, tapered to 2.5 mg over one year then CT without issues
Feb 2, 2019 to July 24, 2019 - restarted Lexapro 5 mg for insomnia; July 25, 2019 increase Lexapro 10 mg, which caused increased anxiety and depression.
Nov 20, 2019 to Dec 11, 2019 - 3-week FT from Lexapro 10 mg to 7.5 mg to 5 mg to 0
Dec 12, 2019 to Feb 4, 2020 - drug-free and feeling good until horrible WD hit
Feb 5, 2020 to Feb 16, 2020 - Paxil 10 mg, resulted in very bad reaction
Feb 18, 2020 - reinstate Lexapro 5 mg and stabilizing

Oct 24, 2020 - start brassmonkey taper with 2.5% reduction; current: 4.9 mgai/6.7 mgpw

 

daily meditation 10-40 minutes, yoga 30 minutes; CBT & ACT therapy

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  • Administrator
Altostrata

I think you may be experiencing breakthrough Paxil withdrawal and may need a little more Prozac. Do you still have diazepam? A very little bit is preferable to olanzapine, in my opinion.

This is not medical advice. Discuss any decisions about your medical care with a knowledgeable medical practitioner.

"It has become appallingly obvious that our technology has surpassed our humanity." -- Albert Einstein

All postings © copyrighted.

Link to post

@Erell

 

I phoned SOS amitié. 

It was not bad ;)

 

Courage. 

 

2018 : 29 July xanax 0,125x 2 12 Aug 0,25 x 2  28 Aug clotiazépam 5x2 4 Oct Prazepam : 5-5-7,5 to 3,5-3,5-6,5 25 oct 10x3 21 nov 9,5 x3/ Now Taper 2% / 21days = 19 may 2019 7,32x3/ Now 5%/8 days =10 july 5,145 x3 /Now 2% / 21 days = 27 sept 4,75x3/ Now 1%/21 days = nov 4,70 x3 dec 4,65x3 jan 2020 4,60x3 feb 4,50x3 march 4,45x3 april 4,385x3 may 4,32x3 

 

2018 : 29 Aug Venlafaxine 75mg XR 19 sept 37,5mg 4 oct 75mg18 oct bridge sertraline 1 nov Sertraline 50mg slow taper until mi April 2019= 25mg

15 July Escitalopram 5mg 20 Ju 4mg 22 Ju 3,25mg 23 ju 2,5mg  25 ju 2,25mg 8 Aug 2 mg 16 Aug 1,75mg 20 Aug 1,50mg 12 sept 1,25mg 24 sept 1,38mg 28 sept 1,50mg 8 Jan 1, 60mg

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  • Moderator
27 minutes ago, Altostrata said:

I think you may be experiencing breakthrough Paxil withdrawal and may need a little more Prozac. Do you still have diazepam? A very little bit is preferable to olanzapine, in my opinion.

 

- I threw the Olanzapine prescription in the bin this afternoon : I don't wanna end on a drug cocktail. 

 

Diazepam : took 1mg this morning, it seemed to help during the day (less restlessness/way less harm intrusive thoughts).

I haven't decided yet if I will take it again tomorrow : I don't wanna play with my CNS and I'm aware of the risks. I also want to protect my life.

(Just expressing my thoughts, I know this has to be my decision).

 

- about updosing to 7.25mg Fluoxetine :

in my soul, there are two contrasting sentiments.

I trust your knowledge and experience/now that I've discovered what an extreme restlessness state is, I'm scared to fuel the fire with too much Fluoxetine or too much changes.

I know this also has to be my own decision. 

 

Sounds like I have some thinking to do.

 

Hope life is sweet on your side ❤

2006 : 20mg Paroxetine + Bromazepam(no specific dose) 

2008 : cold turkey of both

2010 : 20mg Deroxat + Bromazepam

2013: Switch from Bromazepam To Prazepam (long half-life)

2014-June2017 : Prazepam taper, 3% drops. 

2018 to August 2019 : Paroxetine 20mg taper (3% every 15 days).

- 22nd August updosed To 10mg (was at 8.4mg) because of a big wave. 

25th Sept 2019 To April 2020 : found SA, holding at 10mg Paroxetine. 

 

April 2020-August 2020 : Paxil to Prozac bridge. Details https://www.survivingantidepressants.org/topic/21457-erell-struggling-with-paroxetine/?do=findComment&comment=499847

 

Current Supplements : magnesium citrate/ fish oil/ evening primrose oil 

 

Current medication :

7mg Fluoxetine + toothpick Paroxetine (since 20 Aug 2020)

1mg Diazepam (since 29 Aug 2020)

Link to post
  • Administrator
Altostrata

You may be quite sensitive to blood level fluctuations of a drug. From your experiences, my guess is you are a fast metabolizer via liver enzyme CYP2D6. Both paroxetine and fluoxetine speed out of your system. As I said, 3-week washout for a change in fluoxetine dosage is at the lower end of the range.

 

This is not likely to cause a problem with diazepam.

 

Please do not take diazepam inconsistently, this will affect your symptom pattern for weeks. Don't worry about becoming dependent, we will help you taper it.

This is not medical advice. Discuss any decisions about your medical care with a knowledgeable medical practitioner.

"It has become appallingly obvious that our technology has surpassed our humanity." -- Albert Einstein

All postings © copyrighted.

Link to post
sunnysideup69

@Erell, I'm so glad your mum was so supportive! That's awesome.

No shame in needing to take a benzo right now, if that's what it takes. You're in the best place for tapering help. Sometimes we have to take sideways steps in order to eventually go forward again.

 

You are such a strong person, getting through this. It's going to be okay. 

January 2008 to April 2015 Citalopram 20mg to 5mg, reducing in 50 per cent leaps. Jumped off at 5mg

March 2016 used MDMA triggered setback

April 2016 Citalopram 10mg October 2016 cut to 5mg, May 2017 cut to 2.5mg

May 2018 used MDMA triggered setback

June 2018 Citalopram 2.5mg up to 10mg, then back to 5mg

July/ August 2018 7.5mg, then 10mg

June 2019 updosed to 20mg Citalopram

August 2019 cold switch to Venlafaxine 75mg XR

Supplements; 1100mg fish oil daily; also currently reducing caffeine, aiming to get off.

 

 

Link to post
  • Moderator
Posted (edited)
11 hours ago, Altostrata said:

You may be quite sensitive to blood level fluctuations of a drug. From your experiences, my guess is you are a fast metabolizer via liver enzyme CYP2D6. Both paroxetine and fluoxetine speed out of your system. As I said, 3-week washout for a change in fluoxetine dosage is at the lower end of the range.

 

This is not likely to cause a problem with diazepam.

 

Please do not take diazepam inconsistently, this will affect your symptom pattern for weeks. Don't worry about becoming dependent, we will help you taper it.

 

- About Diazepam : you're right, benzos have to be taken consistently.

My hesitation come from the fact that I did a very slow and long benzo taper, and I'm a bit angry at myself for going back there. I have to work on forgiveness and love.

BUT : I do think it helped being calmer yesterday, and I woke up this morning after 8 hours sleep ! Don't have enough words to express how good it feels to sleep without waking constantly with a need to jump out of my skin ❤

So yes, maybe a low dose of Diazepam will help me to go through this very rough patch : time to work on acceptance and consistent drug schedule 😉

 

- I thank you for sharing your guess about me being a fast metabolizer. 

Must confess that I don't understand right what it means, did some reading yesterday but English + brain in fire make things harder 😉

My biggest fear with an updose to 7.25mg is to make restlessness and harm impulses worse : I think I'm gonna take 7mg this morning and make reading to try to understand better and make an informed decision tomorrow (or at least semi-educated).

 

I'm also still taking Paroxetine with a toothpick every morning.

 

Alto, I'm really amazed when I read your guesses : you really have acquired a sophisticated knowledge of this complex process and of all the phenomenas involved. 

It makes all this difficult volunteer work even more priceless.

Thank you for your time ❤

 

Edited by Erell

2006 : 20mg Paroxetine + Bromazepam(no specific dose) 

2008 : cold turkey of both

2010 : 20mg Deroxat + Bromazepam

2013: Switch from Bromazepam To Prazepam (long half-life)

2014-June2017 : Prazepam taper, 3% drops. 

2018 to August 2019 : Paroxetine 20mg taper (3% every 15 days).

- 22nd August updosed To 10mg (was at 8.4mg) because of a big wave. 

25th Sept 2019 To April 2020 : found SA, holding at 10mg Paroxetine. 

 

April 2020-August 2020 : Paxil to Prozac bridge. Details https://www.survivingantidepressants.org/topic/21457-erell-struggling-with-paroxetine/?do=findComment&comment=499847

 

Current Supplements : magnesium citrate/ fish oil/ evening primrose oil 

 

Current medication :

7mg Fluoxetine + toothpick Paroxetine (since 20 Aug 2020)

1mg Diazepam (since 29 Aug 2020)

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