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Erell

Erell: struggling with paroxetine

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Sassenach
14 minutes ago, Erell said:

I'm glad and also very anxious

Tonight is important then.

Start to wind down now, play the Monkees if you can find it.

Definitely a hot bath night, candles, incense, warm towels. Sorry getting carried away here:blush:

Where was I?

Phone off, yoga (if you can ), Sudoku, Lullaby.

Relax and sleep.

Tomorrow really is another day.rainbow3.jpg.05a57018bb504672229fa6cc0fd8c3b3.jpg

 

View from the window!

 

Sass

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Erell

Ohhh Sass! Thank you for this picture! Love it!

 

Yes now I'm cleaning a bit my flat, so they won't be scared as soon as they come in ;)

And after : relaxation evening!

 

Thank you for your support!!!!

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Sassenach

Will send you some more of Scotland soon as I have have chance.

Don't forget to ask your dad where you were on holiday.

Don't exhaust yourself cleaning.

Bossy aren't I👿

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Rhiannon

Hello Erell, just stopping by to say hi. I know you are having ups and downs, that is completely normal at this stage of things. You are healing and one day this will all be just a memory. Meanwhile you're doing great, even though it doesn't feel like that a lot of the time right now!

 

Hugs to you!

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Erell

@Sassenach : yes I Will try To not forgot!! ;)

I stop the cleaning ! ;)

You're not bossy : I Feel so lost, it is ok To have someone leading  in this mess ;)

 

@Rhiannon : yes it doesn't Feel like I'm doing great : on one hand I'm relieved for not having terrors, on the other hand I had never experienced such a level of despair.

But I know you're right : I'm gonna heal :)

 

Thanks To both of you for Being so supportive!

 

Now it's already time : Phone off and lullaby :)

 

Good evening Sass, great day Rhi !

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Sassenach

Sleep well

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Sassenach

Good morning.

Did you sleep well?

How are you feeling this morning?

Sass

 

 

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Erell

Good morning!

Diary : 4th October / day 10 on 10mg Paroxetine/ day 4 on magnesium citrate 

 

6.45 am : woke up anxious (6)

8am : 10mg Paroxetine 

9.30 am feeling sad

9.50am anxiety : 7 / Despair  : 8

This is going To last.

Can't cry.

2pm I m going To the beach. In my car,  and in front of the sea, can't stop crying.

3.30pm : back To my flat. Despair is at rate 9. Crying in my bed.

5pm go back To the sea. 

6pm : back To my flat : cleaning it.

Anxiety : 5 / despair  : 7

8.30pm in bed. Nervous about parents visiting. 

10pm woke up To see my neighbor : his music is very High, and it can Feel the basses in all my body. 

10.30 pm : he decreased a bit the music but I'm going crazy with the basses. I have a lot of angryness and tinnitus.

11pm I Feel like I'm going crazy. Can't deal with the basses even if they are low. A lot of agitation and tinnitus.

midnight music is OFF. Such a relief! I Feel better, but it is really hard To calm down the tense of the evening. I think I fell asleep around 12.30.

3.30 am woke up anxious. Go back To sleep.

5.30 am : woke up very anxious, go back To sleep.

7.30 am woke up anxious (7)

 

 

---》 what an evening my friends! I got overwhelmed by the situation. I really didn't need this. I felt like life was making a joke and telling "Well let see how far I can push you". 

I have a new neighbor under m'y flat: he seems Nice but I'm gonna have To explain him that this isn't possible. 

 

---》 I have now a weighted blanket, as Guilietta told me.

Didn't help with the neighbor ;)

 

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Erell

Hi @Sassenach !

We have posted together ;)

Well, as you can read, I did not sleep Well..

 

This morning  : I Feel highly anxious (7), dont know if it's because my parents are coming or just WD. 

 

Thanks for asking.

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Sassenach

Slow everything down try and look forward to enjoying the day ahead.

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Erell

Yes, I try my best!

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Giulietta

Hello Erell,

 

I don't how I missed your messages!  It looks like you are making progress even though you have had the despair and crying and perhaps some anxiety in the same day. They passed! I didn't know at the time that they were a sign of improvement - and if they had not happened - that meant I was stuck in WD. :) Things are on the up and up!

 

Never feel like an idiot. Always think you are doing an excellent job navigating uncharted waters with waves when you would like a calm sea upon which to sail.

 

'Hope for the best, but expect the worst' - sometmes this is comforting. I know to be pleasantly surprised in case something does not go my way (even if it means burning the pan when frying eggs as I did last night). Seems dumb - but there was a lot happening at once - so I did my best. The eggs were still good. :)

 

Do you cook? I love french cuisine. We have hardly any french restaurants here (I don't live in a cosmolitan area where we might find them). I wonder if you cook quail or creme brulee? Or chocolate mousse?

 

Well, hope you enjoy your visit with your parents.

 

Giuilietta

 

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Erell

Hi dear Guilietta!

 

Well, I love To eat,  and To eat great cook..but I must admit I don't like To cook 😄 and never cook desserts..

 

Rough day Today! After a rough night..

I woke up very anxious, and tried To relax. My parents arrived at 11am. They wanted To go To the market, so we went. It was really hard, I was highly anxious, and there were a lot of people, sounds..but I forced myself. 

Then we went To the restaurant. Also really hard, but I forced myself.

Then we went To the sea...And there I totally crashed : despair, crying, terror.

I begged them To take me back To my flat. We went back To my flat, and now they left.

 

I think I forced myself Too much all day, because I didn't want my parents To worry. And because they don't understand why I can't force me, or why it takes so long To Feel ok.

 

I think what makes me sad is also the fact that nobody understand the process, and most of all the slow part of it. I know we all struggle To explain it To others. My mum truly believe that next week all Will be ok...And I already know that she Will be disappointed. And my dad left me so sad,  I can't bear his sadness.

 

I really did believe I could go To work monday. Now I know I won't. 

 

So sorry, I really am struggling with acceptance right now. I'm scared and sad.  So much despair in me. 

 

I know this is a bad wave. I know the only thing To do is wait and hold. 

 

So sorry To not being able To say positive things here.

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Sassenach

Hey you.

 

How are you feeling now?

We have what we call Murphy's Law in the UK, this states:

" If anything can go wrong, it will "

The loud music was your Murphy's Law.

26 minutes ago, Erell said:

think what makes me sad is also the fact that nobody understand the process, and most of all the slow part of it. I know we all struggle To explain it To others. My mum truly believe that next week all Will be ok...And I already know that she Will be disappointed. And my dad left me so sad,  I can't bear his sadness.

This condition is very slowly becoming known but it will take a long time.

Over the last few weeks our founder AltoStrata has been attending conferences in America, Scandinavia and now in Europe on this subject.

She has had a gruelling schedule but if you read her thread you will see what she went through before forming this site.

She is strong, but not Superwoman, we can all get there too.

You have the spirit to help educate in the future.

I hope you are calming down as the evening approaches.

You will see your mum and dad happy again.

 

Sass

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Vegalia

Coucou Erell

 

I hope that is allowed to speak french hère. ;)

 

Quelle journée !

Peut-être que tes parents ont pensé que sortir te ferait du bien. C'est vrai ça fait du bien, mais là c'était beaucoup avec des lieux où il y a du bruit, du monde et ça sûrement ils ne peuvent s'en rendre compte.

 

Mon père n'est pas au courant pour moi, mais tu vois, mon conjoint il comprend pas que je m'isole régulièrement dans une autre pièce le week-end car quand il est là, la télé est allumée constamment et assez fort, ben tant pis.^^

 

Tu t'es mis beaucoup de pression. Peut être la prochaine fois avec tes parents, juste faire un repas chez toi simple, discuter et juste un petit tour. 

 

C'était bien de les voir tout de même non? Je pense que si les proches comprennent pas tout ( ils ne le vivent pas), s'ils comprennent même un tout petit peu et t'aiment c'est précieux. :)

 

Une petite astuce parfois : juste dire que tu es fatiguée, c'est un moyen plus simple pour que les autres puissent comprendre que tu as besoin d'y aller tout doux. 

 

Courage et ménage toi. 

 

Vegalia.

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Erell

@Sassenach : yes she is strong! I didn't know she was attending conferences! That is so great!

I hope one day i'll be strong enough To educate others! For now, people only tell me : you should take other meds, more. And it is really hard To convince them while feeling misérable! 

 

Now anxiety has decreased a bit, but not despair. Even knowing this is a bad wave, it is really hard To believe I'm gonna be ok and Feel better. I'm gonna have To reread again some information here to really understand the process and convince myself that I Will Feel better.

 

I'm not sure I understand Murphy's law, I'm gonna search ;)

 

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Erell

@SassenachOh and I asked my father  : when I was a child, we went to Fort William, Inverness...And many other place I've already forgotten! Should have wrote them ;)

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Sassenach

Sounds like the grand tour, I will send you the pics when I get a minute.

When I was 18 I spent 6 weeks working at a hotel in Port-Lesney, I think it was about 60kms from Dijon and near a little town, Salin les Bains.

My first experience of the Mistral.😎

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Erell

@Vegalia :

 

Oui je pense que mes parents avaient surtout envie de me sortir et me faire faire des choses! Ma mère pense que je vais mal parce que je reste trop chez moi seule, elle n'arrive pas à assimiler l'idée que mon état est lié au médicament. Je ne leur en veux pas, je sais qu'ils font de leur mieux et que leur impatience est due à leur besoin de me voir mieux.

 

Et oui, c'était bon de les voir :)

 

Merci pour ton soutien!! 

 

(Yes I think my parents wanted To make me go out and do things. My mum thinks I'm feeling bad because I stay too much in my flat, and alone. It is really hard for Her To accept the fact that m'y state is due To meds. I don't blame them, I know they do their best and that they are impatient because they wanna see me feeling better.

 

And yes, it was good to see them :)

 

Thank you for your support!!! )

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Erell
2 minutes ago, Sassenach said:

Sounds like the grand tour, I will send you the pics when I get a minute.

When I was 18 I spent 6 weeks working at a hotel in Port-Lesney, I think it was about 60kms from Dijon and near a little town, Salin les Bains.

My first experience of the Mistral.😎

 

 

Oh this is a part of France that I really don't know  🙃

Don't be sorry for the pictures, I already overuse your time here ;)

No mistral where I live, but a wind from the ocean...love It!!! I may be too metaphorycal, but strong wind helps me remember that everything move, even bad feelings ;) 

Another métaphore : this week there are what we call the "High tides " : the sea comes strongly very High (as waves) and then disappear very far..To let a quiet Window happen on the beach.

 

Oups, im getting convoluted  😄 sorry, trying To cope Despair!

 

Whouah,  what would I do without the sea! 😍

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Sassenach
1 minute ago, Erell said:

Don't be sorry for the pictures, I already overuse your time here

No you don't.

I like to talk to you, brings back happy memories of France.

When I worked at the hotel my french was good.

I had no work permit and gendarmes came in for coffee almost every day, got away with it, difficult to believe now.

Reminds me how old I am:rolleyes:

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Sassenach

Forgot, fell madly in love with a lady called Giselle, happy memories.

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Sassenach

Thank you Erell, I really did not want to stress you further tonight.

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Erell

Me too! Talking To you reminds me happy holydays in family! I remember Being in a lovely place with goats, my little brother and I have played a lot with them. My father told me Today that it was in Fort William.

Could have been everywhere, all I remember are the goats  😄

 

12 minutes ago, Sassenach said:

I had no work permit and gendarmes came in for coffee almost every day, got away with it, difficult to believe now.

 

Haha Yes! Maybe in countryside..even there I'm not sure : I have a friend who holds a cafe and he has a lot of administrative controls. 

 

11 minutes ago, Sassenach said:

Forgot, fell madly in love with a lady called Giselle, happy memories.

 

For how long ? 😄

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Erell
3 minutes ago, Sassenach said:

Thank you Erell, I really did not want to stress you further tonight.

 

Are you talking about translation? 

It is ok : I did not come earlier because I wasn't able To. Anxiety has decreased, so I thought it could be Nice To try to help a bit.

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Sassenach
2 minutes ago, Erell said:

Are you talking about translation? 

Yes

I really appreciate your help now because I need to get all this info correct and sorted.🤞

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Giulietta

Hello Erell,

 

I think there was a bit of anxiety around the visit with your parents - and you were ahead of time apprehensive about their emotions when they visited you. That alone would trigger me. The noise and confusion - and being around a lot of people - are also triggers - for me. It can cause so much anxiety. You don't want to be there - but when you go to a quieter place - you still may not feel right. I can feel restless. And it's all chemicals in our brain. Not us.

 

We have Murphy's Law in the US. It seems to to be present at the wrong times... ;) including when parents visit.

 

Your parents understand that you are getting through a difficult period! I think they have the wisdom to know that things in life wax and wane - come and go - so things will sort out with time. :)

 

I like the vision of you as a child with the little goats. We have some small farms near me - with sheep, goats, and even llama.  I have come to like llama. Their coats make the most wonderful yarn.  Happy memories help through bad times. 

 

I have never been to beautiful France - but maybe someday. There is so much interesting history - and what magnificent architecture and museums. I wonder if you have ever visited the Louvre?

 

Good for you for undestanding it is a bad wave and will be followed by a window - and that we just have to wait out. 

 

Giuilietta

 

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Sassenach

Its the time of night.

Phone off etc.

Thanks for your help.

 

Bon nuit et dormez bien

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Giulietta
3 hours ago, Erell said:

there were a lot of people, sounds..but I forced myself. 

Then we went To the restaurant. Also really hard, but I forced myself.

Then we went To the sea...And there I totally crashed : despair, crying, terror.

 

Hello Erell,

 

Maybe you will find some comfort with something I jsut remembered about a similar situation I had earlier this year. I was in a wave - about 2 weeks - and I didn't know what it was. Anxiety, terror, despair, a host of physical symptoms...but I was forcing myself to be with others so I would have less opportunity to ruminate, worry, etc.

 

So I had been invited to a gathering. I knew 3 people there. There were about 30 strangers. It was LOUD. It was CONFUSING. I had to leave - I said some brief hellos to the 2 people I new and had to leave.  Even though I felt better after I left - and I am glad I went so I didn't let the anxiety win - I had forgotton about this. Maybe you feel less alone.

 

well - have to run. 

 

 

 

 

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Erell

Good morning!

 

Diary :  Saturday 5th October / day 11 on 10mg Paroxetine  / (day 5 with magnésium)

 

7.30am woke up anxious (7)

8am 10mg Paroxetine 

9am Spike of despair (8) . Anxiety (6)

10am went To take a walk in the neighborhood

10.30am come back To my flat.  Anxiety : 5 / despair : 5.

11am parents arrived. We went To the market : too much people and sounds. High level of anxiety. Forced myself. 

12 went To the restaurant. High anxiety. Forced myself. 

1.30pm To 2.30 pm : we took a walk in my neighborhood. Anxious but tolérable because I'm not away of my flat. 

3pm we went to the sea. Totally crashed  (terror, despair crying).

We went back To my flat. 

5pm parents are gone. Despair: 8. Anxiety: 6.

8.30 pm took a warm bath. But have To go To see my neighbor because of very loud music...how long does this Murphy's law last ? ;)

High internal irritation. 

9pm went To bed. Anxiety : 7 / despair: 7. / Tinnitus : 6. / Restlessness: 5.

+ lot of intrusive thoughts, overanalysing my situation. 

10pm anxiety : 5 / despair: 6

10.30pm lights off

Think I fall asleep around 11.30pm.

Don't know if I woke up during the night.

 

This morning  : woke up anxious (7) at 6am. 

 

 

 

 

 

---》 I think my tinnitus is connected with my irritation. 

---》Today I'm gonna be anxious because tomorrow I'll have To tell my boss that I can't come back To work. This is my fault, should have done earlier. 

--》 i've read your post @Sassenach, and saw that you don't like To talk about your symptoms. I apologize, I won't ask you anymore. Actually, I admire you for this : don't know how you manage To deal with your symptoms on your own.  I'm trying to be more autonomous in this process, but it's really hard. 

 

--》 I analyzed a lot my situation yesterday evening. Things troubled me : for example, in 2010, 2 years after I coldturkeyed Paroxetine,  I made a reinstatement and in a week I was back To normal. And now, it's been a month with 10mg Paroxetine, and still not feeling good.

How can I know that the holding is working ? How can I know that the 10mg are the good dose ?

I don't wanna make any changes, too afraid of what could happen. But I find it hard To understand that, one month later, the battle is still so hard.

I Guess I really messed up by taking hypericum (st John wort) during 3 weeks. And other suppléments. 

 

Yesterday evening I couldn't stop thinking and spent too much time on the Phone, rereading my thread and others. Trying To understand the process. Trying To find proofs that I Will be ok soon, that in one month i'll be normal . But of course I didn't find these proofs. The unknown part is so big in the healing process. It's terrific. Still have To work on acceptance. 

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Sassenach

Good morning 

When you cold turkey in 2008 how long did the symptoms last and how severe were they?

Why did you reinstate?

Sass

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Erell

I did'nt remember having symptoms. Maybe 2 weeks feeling really tired, but then I was strongly believing I was healed so it was ok. Doctors told me to quit meds as I was now recovered. I was so happy, quitting meds was a happy time.

I reinstated a year and a half later because I had bad feelings during a couple of days : tremors, Despair,  anxiety. Doctors told me I needeed to take these meds all my life and I believed them.

 

I'm sorry, this happened a lot of years ago, and I was so Young,  its hard To remember how I was feeling.

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Erell

 

I assume I must be in a really bad wave. Just hope there Will be a Window soon. Need some relief To keep believing.

What scares me is the idea of the hold not working and the idea of getting worse. 

Need so much réassurance.

 

Well it seems that I'm doing pretty bad with this goal of autonomy :)

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Erell

@Guilietta : yes I agree, it is better to put my message here.

 

Here it is

 

"

Hi Guilietta 

 

Thank you very much, I really appreciate.

I admire so much your détermination!

1. Actually,  I don't have To convince them about tappering because I don't know if I Will ever have the confident To tapper again. I have to convince them that the best for me now is To hold my current dose,  even if I'm misérable. And they don't get the slow part.

I fear that if I would live with them they would try To convince me To take other drugs. My mum wants me To take benzos To Feel better. Or they would try To convince me To updose again. 

 

2. I sent some articles To my dad and told him about this forum, but he hasn't practiced English for years and he doesn't understand. + they trust doctors and all their théories.

 

3. I don't want To stay with them for a while, at least not until i get better. I couldn't bear their fears and sadness. 

 

 

I'm curious : do you work ?

 

Ps: I'm sorry I'm realizing this maybe shouldnt be on your thread but on mine"

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Sassenach

Hi Erell

 

9 hours ago, Erell said:

don't know how you manage To deal with your symptoms on your own.

We all do it differently there is no wrong or right way.

 

9 hours ago, Erell said:

To understand that, one month later, the battle is still so hard.

You started 10mgs on 25th Sept, that is 11 days ago, I understand it may feel like a month.

 

9 hours ago, Erell said:

How can I know that the holding is working ?

We never know for sure which is why we go so slowly.

However the fact that you have experienced changes suggests it is having an effect.

You are in withdrawal and it takes time for your CNS to settle around the dose.

You have already been on 20, 10,12 and 15mgs as well as a taper and none worked.

Have you increased the Magnesium dose?

If your symptoms are unbearable you could try an updose of 1 mg

However I think it is too early but it is your choice.

 

How are you feeling now?

 

Sass

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Erell
2 minutes ago, Sassenach said:

You started 10mgs on 25th Sept, that is 11 days ago, I understand it may feel like a month.

 

I said a month because I updosed to 10mg on 22nd August ;) But you're right, I should restart thinking from 11 days.

 

4 minutes ago, Sassenach said:

Have you increased the Magnesium dose?

No I haven't, still scared of any change...You've insisted several times on this, so I will try tomorrow.

 

That is also why I won't add 1mg : Im too scared about what changes could make to my brain !

 

I must say anxiety has decreased during the day (to a 5 rate).

What is really difficult to cope is the strong feeling of despair and depression. No relief in the day. Fells like I'll never feel joy again. Or confidence. Everything seems meaningless and hopeless.

 

I also experienced what might be derealization since this morning : I feel very disconnected with my environnment; I also have experienced what might be anhedonia : for almost an hour, I could only feel despair, nothing else, like if my brain had turned off. 

 

It is really disturbing to experience such variations and fluctuations in the combination of symptoms. healing really is an unlinear process !

 

However, you seem to think that changes are a good sign, so I want to believe it. I really want to feel in my body that the general direction is healing ! 

 

What I really need for now is hope, belief : I made several walks outside, tried to distract, went to the sea...it didn't work, but I keep trying ! I don't know if I'm doing enough : it is hard to know when to act and try, and when to accept.

 

Thank you for caring Sass !

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