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sunnysideup69: what can I do to stabilise on venlafaxine

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sunnysideup69
16 hours ago, Altostrata said:

That latest report is an improvement, isn't it?

Yes, it really is, about to post yesterday's also, was a good day, and also so far today. Thank goodness. Still a bit prone to odd days of anxiety but I do think things are heading in the right direction :)

 

October 9th- first day of phased return to work (mornings only, 3 days per week)

2 am woke, straight back to sleep

4 am woke, straight back to sleep

5 am woke and got up, have a headache (but I ran yesterday and my fluid intake was really too low, think it's just dehydration from that) Anxiety around 2

6am breakfast

6 20 2200mg fish oil, 150mg magnesium citrate

7 am 75mg XR Venlafaxine then leave for work, anxiety is about 2

7 45 am arrive at work, feel calmer, not bothered by anxiety all morning :D at work

12 45 leave work

1 30 begin to prepare lunch Drank caffeinated tea

1500 ate lunch slight anxiety, 1, I think it may have been due to the caffeine in the tea. Tak 150mg magnesium

17 30 10 mins meditation, then 10 mins 'legs up the wall yoga', no anxiety at all, just feel sleepy and relaxed

1800 supper

2030 screens off, feeling relaxed and reading peacefully

2130 fell asleep reading

2230 wake and take myself to bed

 

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Erell

Hi Sunnysideup!

 

Whouah! I'm so glad To see you're doing great!!! Everytime I read your thread it gives me hope !

 

Enjoy your day ! ;)

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sunnysideup69

Thanks @Erell, I'm definitely getting there, and if I can, after such a rough year, than rest assured you will, too.

 

October 10th notes

3 am woke, back to sleep

4 am same

4 55 fully awake

5 30am warm epsom salts bath

6 am breakfast

6 30 2200mg fish oil, 150mg magnesium, noticing some slight body twitches, jerks starting, mostly in arms

7 am Venlafaxine 75mg XR, then leave for work

anxiety free morning!

 

1400 return home from work

14 30 eat a HUGE lunch, still relaxed

1800 brief strength workout at home

anxiety free evening!

21 30 tired, go to bed, sleep straight away

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Erell

Whouah!!!! Anxiety free! What a sweet day, Im so glad for you 🤗🤗🤗🤗🤗

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sunnysideup69

Friday 11th October notes

Awoke in early hours, didnt see time, straight back to sleep.

4 30 am beginning to wake up

5am fully awake and feeling calm but really knackered

530 am warm epsom salts bath

6 am breakfast, including three caffeinated teas*, really need to cut back on this/ get decaf because I think it spikes me a bit

630 am 2200mg fish oil, 150mg magnesium citrate, *anxiety is about a 2, bit of ringing in ears and slightly jittery. Did 10 mins meditation

7am 75mgXR Venlafaxine, right now anxiety still around a 2

7am leave for work, pretty good morning, anxiety subsides to 0

1400 arrive home, really tired, feel a bit flat, slight depression for 30 mins at 1 or 2 ie feeling 'oh , i have nothing to look forward to.....but it goes

1430 eat

1500 feeling better

1630 really tired, flatness of affect about 1 or 2, so I snuggle under a blanket on sofa and watch tv, unintentionally fall asleep

2130 suddenly wake, can't believe I slept for 5 hours. Woah, must have been really tired. Not gonna attempt bed straight away, won't be able to sleep. Watch Gardener's World.

2300 go to bed 

 

 

 

 

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sunnysideup69

Saturday 12th October                60 days into taking Venlafaxine/since switching directly from Citalopram

 

2am woke up, used bathroom, went back to sleep

4am snapped awake, doubt I'm gonna get more sleep as I fell asleep at 4 30 pm yesterday

4 30 am up, made tea, went back to bed with it

5 30am warm epsom salts bath

6am felt really wobbly after bath, shaky, today I need to rest really well anxiety this morning, about 2

7am take Venlafaxine 75mgXR, eat breakfast, feeling spaced out

9am went food shopping as friends coming for lunch anxiety still around 2/1

1pm friends arrived feeling a tiny bit withdrawn initially

130-5pm really relaxed, good to actually laugh with friends, enjoyed their company  anxiety subsided to 0 

6pm went for 5k run

2130pm bed anxiety has been 0 since 130pm

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sunnysideup69

Sunday 13th October notes

 

2am, 4am woke, restless, back to sleep

5am got up Feeling calm despite restless sleep

630 am Breakfast beginning to feel some irritation, realise it's part of 'fight or flight' about a 3, imaginary arguments w family in my head

7am Venlafaxine 75mg XR

730 warm epsom salts bath

845 out for 5k walk through park, irritation subsiding

10am home again irritation 2 or 1, when I stopped citalopram in 2015 I recall being very angry often, this is mild

11am go food shopping, irritation now 0

1240 lunch, then spent afternoon making sauerkraut and kefir

Anxiety/depression free afternoon :D

1700 did strength exercises

1800 supper

1830- legs up wall yoga/meditation, then peacefully watching you tube snuggled up on sofa, at some point fell asleep (too early) and took myself to bed around - didnt see the time

 

NB I need to change a few things eg want to take my bath in the evening, also, need to go to bed no earlier than 10pm because my body doesn't seem to sleep longer than 7 hours max and am waking up too early

 

@Gridley, hello, is this disturbed sleep through the night likely also to be withdrawal from Cit? I'm guessing it is.....I don't actually feel tired but it would be good to sleep through.....

 

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Erell
9 minutes ago, sunnysideup69 said:

Anxiety/depression free afternoon :D

Still loving your updates 😄😉

 

About sleep  : I understand what you mean. In my case, I don't put lights off to sleep before 11pm : if I do it earlier, I wake up too early.

However, I keep going to bed early (around 8pm !) : it gives me the time To relax with slight light.

 

So happy To see that you expérience times without anxiety or dépression! Enjoy it! 

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Guilietta
5 hours ago, sunnysideup69 said:

is this disturbed sleep through the night likely also to be withdrawal from Cit?

 

Hello sunnysideup

Disturbed sleep is a WD effect of ADs. Have you noticed that some nights are better than others? Speaking from personal experience - and what I have  seen of nearly else - the stark reality of poor sleep is a consequence of ADs and withdrawal fromt them.  From the time I started taking cymbalta - I almosts never had a full night where I didn't wake up 2 or 3 times. I am now down most nights to waking up once a night - and occasionally sleep through the night.

 

I did start wearing a black out mask which helps very much. A weighted blanket and low lights from 7 pm helps as well.

 

Welcome to AD

 

Giuilietta

 

 

 

 

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Gridley
5 hours ago, sunnysideup69 said:

 

@Gridley, hello, is this disturbed sleep through the night likely also to be withdrawal from Cit?

 

Very likely yes.

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sunnysideup69
3 hours ago, Guilietta said:

 

Hello sunnysideup

Disturbed sleep is a WD effect of ADs. Have you noticed that some nights are better than others? Speaking from personal experience - and what I have  seen of nearly else - the stark reality of poor sleep is a consequence of ADs and withdrawal fromt them.  From the time I started taking cymbalta - I almosts never had a full night where I didn't wake up 2 or 3 times. I am now down most nights to waking up once a night - and occasionally sleep through the night.

 

I did start wearing a black out mask which helps very much. A weighted blanket and low lights from 7 pm helps as well.

 

Welcome to AD

 

Giuilietta

 

 

 

 

Hello Giuilietta,

Thanks for this info. I almost never had a problem sleeping until the second time round on Citalopram, after beginning to taper in October 2016. From about Feb 2017, I started to have problems sleeping. I just put it down to being post menopause at that point, which I'm sure didn't help....but in the whole peri menopausal period running up to then, my sleep had been okay. I think it was probably down to a too fast taper.

Also, @Erell, I have seen you refer to having a 'toxic nap.' Do you mean when you fall asleep and then wake, and feel suddenly anxious/horrible? That just happened to me, and it feels really random. ( I also think I'm getting a cold though, my throat is very scratchy and a bit sore.) I'm wondering if it's low blood sugar or something, but I feel a sense of doom all of a sudden after waking......

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Guilietta
43 minutes ago, sunnysideup69 said:

I started to have problems sleeping. I just put it down to being post menopause at that point, which I'm sure didn't help....but in the whole peri menopausal period running up to then, my sleep had been okay. I think it was probably down to a too fast after.

 

Me too!  I started experiencing hot flushes, perspiring and terrible insomnia - 3 years after 50 (menopause)!!! The MD really didn't undestand and referred to me to a gyn who didn't help. I would not take estradiol. I read in the cymbalta prescribers information and other details (look on the mayo website) that cymbalta causes these symptoms so I am more inclined to associate my symptoms with cymbalta.

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sunnysideup69
11 hours ago, Guilietta said:

 

Me too!  I started experiencing hot flushes, perspiring and terrible insomnia - 3 years after 50 (menopause)!!! The MD really didn't undestand and referred to me to a gyn who didn't help. I would not take estradiol. I read in the cymbalta prescribers information and other details (look on the mayo website) that cymbalta causes these symptoms so I am more inclined to associate my symptoms with cymbalta.

 

I meant 'too fast taper', but you got what I meant.

Yes, I can understand why you chalked it up to the Cymbalta.

Fell asleep on the sofa at 8 30last night....gah! Need to keep myself awake until at least 10pm as am awake at 430 am again this morning.

Funnily enough, after chatting to you about this yesterday, I had a really good sleep. Fell asleep 830pm, suddenly awoke at 2230 and thought bugger, I've done it again. Went to bed, slept through til 430 am. Also fell asleep for an hour during the day. It's been really dark in London all day, cloudy and rainy, and that weather just makes me feel so tired. In answer to your question, my sleep is definitely better some days than others. Going to try to keep better sleep hygiene, no napping, 10pm bedtime.

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Erell

Hi you !

 

I talk about 'toxic naps' when I fall asleep during the day. Everytime I did, I would woke up highly anxious and it takes a long time To settle down.

I don't have an explaination, but I know I can't take naps because things are worse after.

 

 

Hope you had a good day  :)

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sunnysideup69
38 minutes ago, Erell said:

Hi you !

 

I talk about 'toxic naps' when I fall asleep during the day. Everytime I did, I would woke up highly anxious and it takes a long time To settle down.

I don't have an explaination, but I know I can't take naps because things are worse after.

 

 

Hope you had a good day  :)

That was my experience yesterday, I woke suddenly, feeling anxious....but it did pass within an hour. I think it might be something to do with low blood sugar....maybe.

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sunnysideup69

Daily notes for Monday 14th October 2019

 

Awake at 2, then 3, back to sleep

Fully awake 430am, make tea

5am some anxiety about a 3

615 breakfast, feeling shaky this morning, as in physically anxiety 3

7am Venlafaxine 75mgXR

715 epsom salts bath, still feeling shaky

8am meditation 30mins, helps alleviate the shakes a little

9am quick snack, took 2200mg fish oil and 150mg magnesium  citrate, went shopping to Homebase now anxiety is 0

1130am back home and prepping/cooking lunch- making a chilli con carne, then busy doing various chores around the house

1330, chilli ready, ate lunch 

 

Now quietly watch youtube channels, this is fatal as I fall asleep...been feeling sniffly and a bit like I have a cold coming anxiety still 0

 

1624 suddenly wake from a nap, dont know how long I've been unconscious, I feel weird, a sense of impending doom, but I remember not to freak out, it's 'just' anxiety playing a trick. My arms feel tense and my heart races a bit. I'm wondering if this is a 'cortisol spike' after sleeping?anxiety 3/4

1700 I ignored the feeling as best as I could and it dissipated, now I feel fine.anx 0

1800 prepare supper and eat

1900 again, watching youtube channels, looking for relaxations and meditations, I find a really good one

 

Suddenly realised today that my sense of taste has been really off since starting Venlafaxine, I'm not getting the nuances of flavour that I used to

2000 find a really relaxing one, listen with headphones....fall asleep😩accidentally

2235 suddenly awake, put myself to bed

 

 

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sunnysideup69

Okay @Gridley, have a confession to make here. I have another thread. I am also here as Ruthmcg. Is it possible to delete or integrate that thread?..delete would be preferable, here's why...After I switched to Venlafaxine, was gonna continue to update my old profile. Got into a conversation with a parent of one of my kids at school (I'm a teacher part time) about mental health and she mentioned this website. I then got totally paranoid and wanted to remain anonymous, so came back as my new name. Shouldn't really have used my actual name to begin with. Anyway, integrate if you like or remove old thread.

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Guilietta
5 hours ago, sunnysideup69 said:

That was my experience yesterday, I woke suddenly, feeling anxious....but it did pass within an hour. I think it might be something to do with low blood sugar....maybe.

 

When awakening from a nap I am looking for sugar/carbs - without fail. I am not anxious. I know others who are the same way and they are not in WD. Could be blood glucose related.

 

8 hours ago, sunnysideup69 said:

It's been really dark in London all day, cloudy and rainy, and that weather just makes me feel so tired. In answer to your question, my sleep is definitely better some days than others. Going to try to keep better sleep hygiene, no napping, 10pm bedtime.

 

Dark, clouds, damp weather make me feel depressed and tired as well. In the fall and winter things are much worse for me in general and in the afternoons as the sun sets earlier. We call it SAD - season affective disorder. I haven't found a way to work around this.  In the winter - we have days at a time like this.

 

I do better if I can stay up until 10 for sleeping. As you say - it varies from night to night. And of course some days I am just so tired I fall asleep at 8. 😕

 

 

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Gridley
5 hours ago, sunnysideup69 said:

Is it possible to delete or integrate that thread?..delete would be preferable,

sunny, I don't have the ability but I will bring this to the attention of admins who can do it.  I'll pass on that you'd like to delete ruthmcg

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sunnysideup69
5 minutes ago, Gridley said:

sunny, I don't have the ability but I will bring this to the attention of admins who can do it.  I'll pass on that you'd like to delete ruthmcg

Thanks Gridley, sorry for any hassle.

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sunnysideup69

Tuesday 15th October

 

Bit of a crappy day, is the bad news, but not as crappy as other bad days, is the good news.

3am wake, sleep again

4am wide awake

5am drinking tea, feeling like a cold is coming, sore throat sniffly nose, dizzy, feeling down depression about 3

6am breakfast

710 Venlafaxine 75mgXR

830 out for a walk instead of a run, as I'm not feeling well

945 return from walk, mood is lifting a bit dep 3/2

1230 feeling drained, overdid the walk, it was 7km in total

1230 ate a nice stodgy lunch 

Burst of energy mid pm, did hoovering, repotted two plants, cleared tomato plants from back garden and dug the soil

1600 meditation grouchy mood lifting, but not going to yoga because of cold depression 1

1800 bit of supper, very light salady stuff

From here on it's a blur, went to bed around 2230, but between 1800 and then I was drifting in and out of sleep on the sofa. Cold has knackered me out.

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Erell

Hi you !

Thank you so much for your hugs 😍

Yes patience patience patience....grrr! ;)

 

From what I read on your thread, you seem To be close To stabilisation! I'm so happy for you! 

 

Take good care of yourself  !

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sunnysideup69

Thank you @Erell, oh gosh I hope so.

 

I was thinking yesterday that I haven't felt 'normal' since March/April 2018, whatever normal is. It's because of the too fast taper of the Cit, and all of the subsequent changes. Still! No point dwelling, I keep telling myself. Had a bit of a tricky, low depression/irritable morning at school, but one thing this withdrawal is teaching me is not to get carried away with thoughts/feelings. Take a breath, take a hundred if necessary, and remember it's all just passing through. 

 

It's interesting; my symptoms have changed a bit. Last week, I had an anxiety peak that lasted a day and a half. This week, the anxiety is much better really, but I've had some low grade depression dips.

 

Hopefully it's all just ironing itself out. I ALWAYS feel better by late afternoon/early evening, so I look forward to that part of the day and relish it. Now I just need to get my bedtime regular....

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Erell
On 10/14/2019 at 7:59 AM, sunnysideup69 said:

Anxiety/depression free afternoon :D

 

Last monday ! This is huge ! Really ! It says that it is possible  :) And it Will happen again :)

 

I totally understand: from one day To another, I don't know if I Will suffer from anxiety or dépression. Both are rough !

 

Enjoy your evening :)

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sunnysideup69
21 minutes ago, Erell said:

 

Last monday ! This is huge ! Really ! It says that it is possible  :) And it Will happen again :)

 

I totally understand: from one day To another, I don't know if I Will suffer from anxiety or dépression. Both are rough !

 

Enjoy your evening :)

Thank you :) I will,  I have to remind myself that I have a string of days at a time where I feel pretty good and then.....plop. But it always passes. xxx

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sunnysideup69

Bloody cold. Feeling grouchy this morning. Here's yesterday's notes....

 

Wednesday 16th October 2019

Awake at 4, back to sleep

Up at 5, anxiety about 3

530am warm epsom salts bath

545 breakfast

6am 2200mg fish oil, 150mg mag cit

7am Venlafaxine XR 75mg, leave for work

745 arrive at work, anxiety begins to diminish

1130am burst of irritability (cold is annoying me)

12-1.30 pm feel a bit flat/depressed  3 Thoughts of 'I have no dreams to aspire to'....(which is untrue)

1400 prepping lunch, beginning to feel better

1500 eat lunch, then 150mg mag cit

1800 small snack, feeling much better dep 1 then goes

Did some meditation here for about 20mins

From here I forgot to take notes as I was feeling better and also, I was listening to podcasts

2000 around this time fell asleep on sofa

2130, awoke, took myself to bed

 

@Altostrata dear Altostrata, wondering if you still think there's potentially an adverse reaction /too high of a dose of Ven? Or am I just experiencing the normal ups and downs of stabilisation during the day? Thank you very much.

 

 

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Altostrata

That looks like a promising pattern to me. Appears venlafaxine begins to take effect in about 45 minutes. Please continue to post daily notes.

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sunnysideup69
19 minutes ago, Altostrata said:

That looks like a promising pattern to me. Appears venlafaxine begins to take effect in about 45 minutes. Please continue to post daily notes.

Thanks so much Alto, will keep posting :)

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sunnysideup69

Notes for 17th October

 

Horrible nightmare about drowning, awoke around 3 back to sleep

450 woke up, got up

530 warm epsom salts bath...really have full cold symptoms today, feeling ill, 

6am eat breakfast, irritability 3

615 2200mg fish oil plus 150mg mag cit, some depressive thoughts 3

7am Venlafaxine 75mg XR leave for work

745 arrive at work, depression lifts within half hour 0, have a happy and productive morning

1300 leave work, almost on leaving some slight depressing thoughts againaround 2/3 but realise I havent eaten since 6am, probably also a blood sugar crash

1330 arrive home order lunch, takeaway

1400 eat lunch, feel much better, sadness 0

1600 out for 6k walk, really enjoy it, looking at beauty of autumn in park

1800 eat ice cream and take 150mg mag cit, content and happy

Rest of evening I feel peaceful and happy

2130 bed

 

 

 

 

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Erell
7 hours ago, sunnysideup69 said:

content and happy

 

Whouah! This is wonderful! Just reading this makes me Feel happy  😄

 

Wish you a delightful evening :)

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sunnysideup69
13 hours ago, Erell said:

 

Whouah! This is wonderful! Just reading this makes me Feel happy  😄

 

Wish you a delightful evening :)

Thank you @Erell, wishing you a great day xxx

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sunnysideup69

Friday 18th October

 

Forgot to take notes today because I feel totally 'normal' and happy. So, I just went out and enjoyed the day. Will resume notes today.

Was reading @brassmonkey and the definition of 'withdrawal normal', I think I'm getting my head around it now.....eg, 'withdrawal normal' ISN'T a day like today ( even though today was fantastic.)

 

Withdrawal normal for me, at the moment, is that during the seven days of the week, I have a couple of days where anxiety/depression is worse. The rest of the days are basically okay, usually with a brief mood blip somewhere in the day, usually at the very beginning after waking, or around midday if I need to eat. I think this is the definition of looking at 'withdrawal normal.' Over time, this pattern will improve to maybe one day of feeling dodgy, less days of waking with angst etc. Until the contrasts between good/bad days are less. 

 

I feel like it's coming. But am still gonna hold for quite a few months when I get there.

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brassmonkey

I'm so glad you were able to have such a wonderful day that you didn't want to take notes. It shows that what you're doing is working. Hopefully today goes as well.

 

That's a pretty good grasp of WDnormal. It's not the day to day fluctuations but rather the day in day out consistencies.

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sunnysideup69

@brassmonkey, thank you, and got you. So my withdrawal normal at the moment is morning anxiety and some sleep issues with waking a few times. Also, sleep cycle in general needs sorting- falling asleep too early.Am getting the hang of this.

 

Yesterday was also good but am still going to keep notes, also going home tomorrow for a couple days, which is nice but sometimes triggering also.

Saturday 19th October 2019

4am woke up

5am up, feeling ok, very minor anxiety 1

630 breakfast...feeling slightly nauseous, cold seems to have resurfaced a bit more since yesterday

Think I overdid it yesterday cos I was feeling better, walked around 6k both yesterday and day before. Was happy to have energy and be motivated. Now I'm just headachey.

7am Venlafaxine 75mg XR

730 Warm bubble bath with magnesium bath salts, also

Spend the morning 'Marie Kondo-ing' my wardrobe. Now got a pile of things to give away.

Yesterday, got rid of any out of date spices/tins/packages from kitchen. Feels a bit like making a fresh start. Anxiety now 0.

12pm lunch, didn't really enjoy, sense of taste has been killed by Venlafaxine and cold.

This afternoon I'm tired and headachey and coldy, but my mood is still good. Relax on sofa watching back episodes of Gardener's World, planning what I might grow in my allotment (if I ever get one) or in pots around the front of the building.

1800 supper. I've eaten three huge meals today. Supposed to go out but rest at home with cold, instead.

 

2030 Think I fell asleep round about now, same as usual, woke around 2230 and took myself off to bed. 

 

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sunnysideup69

Notes for Sunday 20th October

 

430 woke up, stayed in bed

530 got up, minor anxiety 2 still have cold so decide to rest at home/no running for me today, learning to listen to body

720am Venlafaxine 75mgXR

800 breakfast no anxiety, it's 0

900 2200mg fish oil, 150mg mag cit

930 warm bubble bath with epsom salts

Calmly resting this morning, planning future garden/seed planting

1230 roast dinner prepped and cooked by me

1245 small spike of feeling wobbly, minor 'dread', not sure there's a trigger or if just a random blip, around 2

1400 okay again, anxiety 0, spend a pleasant afternoon at home pottering around meditation with headspace

1800 supper then mostly just watching tv, forcing myself to stay awake until 2200 because I've been sleeping too early/waking too early

2200 Evening was calm and yaaaaay! did it, went to bed, almost straight away asleep

 

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sunnysideup69

Just for the record, and will elaborate in my notes for today, have had a horrible start today. Am feeling ill with cold and on way home to Chippenham to see parents. Paddington was so busy I felt really panicky, but I just kept going. On the train now. Note to self; travelling with cold and wonky nervous system is brutal. Plus nervous about seeing parents as I always feel a bit 'observed' if I am unwell, they mean well, but it ramps up the anxiety. I'm really having to practice non attachment to mood/thoughts right now. Trying not to feel discouraged, but this is the worst I have felt in a couple of weeks, and it has wobbled me a bit. Any encouragement gratefully received.

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