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sunnysideup69: what can I do to stabilise on venlafaxine

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sunnysideup69
28 minutes ago, Cigale said:

This is simply beautiful news. Thank you for sharing!

 

@Cigale, you're most welcome. It's so important to share good news, to show other people that healing happens and we can feel positive emotions again. Have a good Sunday xxx

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mstimc
5 hours ago, sunnysideup69 said:

Both days, I have awoken with ZERO anxiety, ❤️ ,feeling calm. This morning, said a prayer of gratitude before getting out of bed. It's so good to wake without anxiety. That has eluded me since February, but it's back. Felt so happy yesterday that I had a little dance to a favourite track around the flat.

 

Over the last two weeks I have given my system a break and have temporarily stopped running and replaced it with long walks. I realised that running was just knackering my system further after the stress of two bereavements and that I need to go gently this month. I'll experiment again with jogging in June, if I feel better. 

 

Anyway, I feel calmer. Sending you all good wishes for a happy Sunday.

What a great post, Sunny!  I think many members need to hear more about the progress and successes we're achieving on the road to recovery.   And I'm so happy for you personally.  Hope you keep feeling positive. 

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sunnysideup69
38 minutes ago, mstimc said:

What a great post, Sunny!  I think many members need to hear more about the progress and successes we're achieving on the road to recovery.   And I'm so happy for you personally.  Hope you keep feeling positive. 

 

Thank you, hopefully will get a string of these days now. Even if I don't yet, it's still a really good sign of healing happening, for which I'm really grateful ❤️  Hope you are doing well xx

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Hanna72
8 hours ago, sunnysideup69 said:

Both days, I have awoken with ZERO anxiety, ❤️ ,feeling calm.

Love love, so happy for you🥰

Yes we will get more of those days, I have no doubt.

Thank you for sharing, I needed this🙏

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sunnysideup69
1 hour ago, Hanna72 said:

Love love, so happy for you🥰

Yes we will get more of those days, I have no doubt.

Thank you for sharing, I needed this🙏

 

You're most welcome and yes, more of these days are coming...❤️

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Lynnardgirl
11 hours ago, sunnysideup69 said:

Some good news. Am gonna post good news, too, as otherwise this log just becomes 'tales of misery.' Want to keep it balanced and as the saying goes 'recognise when you are feeling good.' Yesterday was one such day, it was a window. I think today will be, too. I've been having occasional magnesium salts baths now and again and I think that's helping to calm me as well as these other steps.

 

Both days, I have awoken with ZERO anxiety, ❤️ ,feeling calm. This morning, said a prayer of gratitude before getting out of bed. It's so good to wake without anxiety. That has eluded me since February, but it's back. Felt so happy yesterday that I had a little dance to a favourite track around the flat.

 

Over the last two weeks I have given my system a break and have temporarily stopped running and replaced it with long walks. I realised that running was just knackering my system further after the stress of two bereavements and that I need to go gently this month. I'll experiment again with jogging in June, if I feel better. 

 

Also, have cut out the refined sugar and am eating better. Also, sunshine. When the sun is out, am sitting in it for an hour or so and getting some vitamin D.

 

Anyway, I feel calmer. Sending you all good wishes for a happy Sunday.

So Happy form you ! Waking with no anxiety what a wonderful feeling! Keep

up the good work! Prayers 

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sunnysideup69

Thanks, @Lynnardgirl.

 

Well, it's the THIRD morning of waking with no anxiety. ❤️❤️❤️ Savouring these moments in recovery, they are really precious. It's so nice to wake with a quiet head.

Even after a bit of a disturbed sleep. Since Friday afternoon, have been feeling pretty 'normal', or as 'normal' as you can be on a psych drug 😂

However long this lasts, it is a welcome reprieve from the last two months of extra angst / anhedonia and I'm really hopeful that I'm getting back to my previous baseline.

My appetite is also back, which is a good sign.

Wishing for a good stretch of this and less noticeable waves until end of August and then maybe I can consider a taper.....

 

Sending sunny vibes to you all. Weather looks good this week in London and I'm going to plant out my tomato plants and sun myself....in line with my name.

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mstimc

Great to hear, Sunnyside!  Positive thoughts that your window lasts!

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sunnysideup69

I'd love some ideas, everyone, so please help me out if you can ❤️ ❤️❤️ 

 

Well, I woke at 4 am, and this morning my mood is a bit more flat, a bit more WD normal....owing to a bit of a dodgy sleep, I think. 

 

All of this time off is giving me time to really look at my routines and the main routine which is really bad, in my case, is my bedtime routine. It's really haphazard. It always has been. Mornings, I'm up and into a routine straight away. Evenings are a bit more random.

 

My AIM is to have screens off by 830 pm and to go to bed at 10 00pm. Any earlier and I wake too early. When I get to bed at 10pm, I usually sleep until 5 / 5 30 ish, which is not bad.

 

What tends to happen in reality is that I start watching youtube in the early evening, around 7pm, and then I get to 830pm and I just want to watch ONE MORE THING.....sometimes I then fall asleep on sofa whilst watching, wake up and have to take myself off to bed. So I've fallen asleep too early, thus waking too early. Sometimes, I just keep watching my screen right up until 930pm and then take myself to bed....so I don't get that screen-free, wind-down time in either case. I'm pretty sure this is disruptive to my sleep.

 

Tell me, those of you who have good sleep hygiene, what do you do in your screen free hour (plus) before bed? Puzzles? Reading? Take a bath? Sit out under the moonlight for a bit?? Just don't really have the end of the day licked, I think it's the missing piece of the puzzle.

 

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mstimc

Hi Sunny

 

I'm big into a consistent bedtime ritual, but I must confess I'm a Youtube junkie as well.  I'm taking classes from the Great Courses, so after dinner and a shower, I usually tuck in and watch a class session.  I find it requires focus and takes my mind from recurring negative thoughts.  AFter that, i check Facebook to catch up with friends in the States, and then its onto Youtube.  I do try to avoid negative or heavy; I did woodworking when we had a house in the States, so I often watch carpentry videos or subjects about history.  I try to keep them positive because I watch right up to bedtime.   Since we're on lock down, I check Youtube every now and then during the day to see if there are videos I may enjoy at night.   One thing I avoid is writing emails or anything else that requires active or creative thinking at least an hour before lights out so I don't excite my brain.  If I'm feeling unusually tense, I'll have a cup of chamomile tea while I'm watching videos; I don't know if its really an effective sleep aid, but the ritual helps chill me out. 

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Longroadhome
4 hours ago, sunnysideup69 said:

I'd love some ideas, everyone, so please help me out if you can ❤️ ❤️❤️ 

 

Well, I woke at 4 am, and this morning my mood is a bit more flat, a bit more WD normal....owing to a bit of a dodgy sleep, I think. 

 

All of this time off is giving me time to really look at my routines and the main routine which is really bad, in my case, is my bedtime routine. It's really haphazard. It always has been. Mornings, I'm up and into a routine straight away. Evenings are a bit more random.

 

My AIM is to have screens off by 830 pm and to go to bed at 10 00pm. Any earlier and I wake too early. When I get to bed at 10pm, I usually sleep until 5 / 5 30 ish, which is not bad.

 

What tends to happen in reality is that I start watching youtube in the early evening, around 7pm, and then I get to 830pm and I just want to watch ONE MORE THING.....sometimes I then fall asleep on sofa whilst watching, wake up and have to take myself off to bed. So I've fallen asleep too early, thus waking too early. Sometimes, I just keep watching my screen right up until 930pm and then take myself to bed....so I don't get that screen-free, wind-down time in either case. I'm pretty sure this is disruptive to my sleep.

 

Tell me, those of you who have good sleep hygiene, what do you do in your screen free hour (plus) before bed? Puzzles? Reading? Take a bath? Sit out under the moonlight for a bit?? Just don't really have the end of the day licked, I think it's the missing piece of the puzzle.

 

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Longroadhome
Just now, Longroadhome said:
4 hours ago, sunnysideup69 said:

I'd love some ideas, everyone, so please help me out if you can ❤️ ❤️❤️ 

 

Well, I woke at 4 am, and this morning my mood is a bit more flat, a bit more WD normal....owing to a bit of a dodgy sleep, I think. 

 

All of this time off is giving me time to really look at my routines and the main routine which is really bad, in my case, is my bedtime routine. It's really haphazard. It always has been. Mornings, I'm up and into a routine straight away. Evenings are a bit more random.

 

My AIM is to have screens off by 830 pm and to go to bed at 10 00pm. Any earlier and I wake too early. When I get to bed at 10pm, I usually sleep until 5 / 5 30 ish, which is not bad.

 

What tends to happen in reality is that I start watching youtube in the early evening, around 7pm, and then I get to 830pm and I just want to watch ONE MORE THING.....sometimes I then fall asleep on sofa whilst watching, wake up and have to take myself off to bed. So I've fallen asleep too early, thus waking too early. Sometimes, I just keep watching my screen right up until 930pm and then take myself to bed....so I don't get that screen-free, wind-down time in either case. I'm pretty sure this is disruptive to my sleep.

 

Tell me, those of you who have good sleep hygiene, what do you do in your screen free hour (plus) before bed? Puzzles? Reading? Take a bath? Sit out under the moonlight for a bit?? Just don't really have the end of the day licked, I think it's the missing piece of the puzzle.

 

Firstly make sure you’re  not having power naps too late in the day Also make sure your doing enough in the day to feel tired and more ready  to relax 
Get a bedtime routine going; 

pjs or comfies on Face scrubbed :) of makeup and ready to chill

no caffeinated drinks 

no internet after 6pm 

no action  movies thrillers etc just nice easy watching 
Or maybe A little light reading 

meditating  To take mind off ruminating thoughts that go round and round in our head especially when tired 💤 
no eating after 8pm 
You can just start to add some of the above here and there 

for instance I know that if I fall asleep on the sofa early without getting changed into my comfies I’m already on to a loser because I’ll wake up be hungry go and eat something that’s going to keep me awake  and then Be awake  with an overactive brain when I do go to bed 
 

just “food” for thought 💭 

hope it helps 

 

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sunnysideup69

Really helps, thank you @Longroadhome xxx

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Cigale
8 hours ago, sunnysideup69 said:

I'd love some ideas, everyone, so please help me out if you can ❤️ ❤️❤️ 

I would love to help you with ideas. Sleep has been one of my biggest challenges as I try to stabilize, so this is a work in progress.

 

First, I agree with @Longroadhome about avoid late/long power naps and also getting up and about during the day. For me it is especially important to get out and get some vitamin D sunshine.

 

For my evening routine, here's what I TRY to do:

  • Wrap up dinner about 3 hours before bedtime. I have cut out desserts because sugar - especially chocolate - is a WD no-no for me.
  • At 9pm, a sweet little alarm sounds to remind me to set all electronics aside.
  • Then I either dig into a book or see if my partner is up for a round of backgammon - a game I just learned and really love.
  • Take a 10-15 minute epsom salt bath.
  • About 45 minutes before bedtime, I do very light, slow yoga. Here's a link to a nice mindfulness and movement routine. I also do the 'legs-up-the-wall' stretch Gridley has shared...must find that link...
  • Read a bit more of my book until my eyes get heavy.
  • With lights out, I like to fade into sleep by visualizing 10 positive things from the day. These are simple things, like an encouraging comment from YOU for example!

I hope this helps you some. Hugs!

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Cigale

And here's the legs-up info and link:

 

For anxiety I have found the best tool to be the restorative yoga pose in the following link.  If you can't get your legs all the way up on the wall, you can just hook them over a chair as you lie on the floor.  Make yourself comfortable and cozy with a pillow or two and a duvet to cover you and let yourself just sink into the pose.  Here's the link:

 

10 minute Restorative Yoga for Relaxation | Up the wall

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sunnysideup69

@mstimc, @Longroadhome, @Cigale,

Thanks so much for your suggestions ❤️❤️❤️ Yesterday was okay, despite poor sleep, I'd say my WD normal baseline is slowly creeping back up. 

 

Had to have an afternoon nap for an hour yesterday, but was careful not to do it too late. Slept from about 14 30 to 15 30 and I did feel more refreshed afterwards. Patchy sleep is definitely linked to more jagged mood in the morning, for me.

 

I'm going to remember all your tips. Yesterday evening, I stopped you tube and all screens at 20 30. I ran a bath, which is a bit of a palaver in this flat, for reasons I won't go into it's been easier to get a full bath in the mornings ....but I did so anyway. Relaxed in the bath for a good soak. Dried off, no more screens, then went and sat outside in the cool air for a while getting acquainted with the darkening sky. Came in and read for a while, then went to bed. 

 

It took me a little while to drift off at 2200 bedtime and I think that's most likely because I've developed the bad habit of falling asleep early on the sofa, waking, taking self to bed late and dropping back into sleep again. Woke in the night once to use the bathroom....sometimes go through a habit of that for a while, think it's just hormones.

Woke this morning about 450, which is better than the 400 of yesterday! Sometimes I sleep until nearly 530. I've gradually turned into an early riser over the last 3 years, ever since tapering Citalopram too fast in 2017/going through menopause. Thinking about it, my sleep has really been a bit 'off' since then. Plus, I was working as a supply teacher and needed to get up early.

 

I'm trying to give myself an '8 hour window' for sleep, from 2200 to 600. At the moment, would really love to be getting a consistent seven hour sleep.

Mood this morning is ok, kind of WD normal, as was yesterday.

There seems to be contradictory info out in the world about napping. Especially at the moment, when grieving. Sometimes, my body just wants to shut down and sleep and it's not always at bedtime. I think I'm going to follow the rule that early afternoon napping is okay ie waking by 1530.

 

@Cigale, I like the tip about stretching before bed/ yoga. I'm gonna try some restorative poses in the evening. Really enjoyed sitting out under the stars, too, last night......accompanied by the sound of many passing Deliveroo drivers, underground trains rattling by 😂 And occasional moments of absolute peace.

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Cigale

You are doing all the right things @sunnysideup69 and being so mindful of your surroundings. My heart goes out to you as you work through your loss and WD. Please know that you are strong and so inspiring. I appreciate you sharing your journey. Hugs!

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sunnysideup69
14 minutes ago, Cigale said:

You are doing all the right things @sunnysideup69 and being so mindful of your surroundings. My heart goes out to you as you work through your loss and WD. Please know that you are strong and so inspiring. I appreciate you sharing your journey. Hugs!

Thank you Cigale xxx

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Erell

quickly stopping by...to give you big hugs ❤️ 

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sunnysideup69
26 minutes ago, Erell said:

quickly stopping by...to give you big hugs ❤️ 

Aaw, that's so lovely....thank you @Erell xxx Hugs to you, too xxx

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sunnysideup69

Another really calm start to the day ❤️❤️ 

Will do a proper week's update tomorrow, but this week has really seen a shift, for me. I haven't felt this stable since the beginning of January and long may it continue! :D

 

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mstimc

Wonderful news, Sunny!  Positive thoughts going out to you from Portugal!

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Lynnardgirl

Great news! So so happy for you. 

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sunnysideup69

Thank you @mstimc and @Lynnardgirl xxx

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Malbec37

@sunnysideup69great news that you’re in another window! We are all rooting for you as you are for us x 

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sunnysideup69

Thanks you @Malbec37 :)

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sunnysideup69

Weekly progress report ❤️ 

 

So, since Friday 15th May, I seem to have had the most stable week in a long time. In fact, looking at my notes, I've been improving again since 8th, but over the last week have seen a significant reduction in anxiety. I've had a few anxiety - free days where I've felt happy like my 'normal' self, so a good few windows.

 

Mostly I've been at a much improved WD normal with some 'windows' thrown in. Feeling like my WD normal is much more like it was during January this year.

 

WD normal for me is a general feeling of being okay but with some tiredness/apathy, not feeling good but not feeling really bad, either, just a bit 'meh', and it actually tends to improve a bit if I can get myself engaged in something, usually.

 

Of course, there's grief, but that is manageable and not random like the chemical symptoms from antidepressants.

 

I'm sticking now to a bedtime routine as it's giving me a clearer idea of how well I'm sleeping. Youtube/computer off at 2030, run a nice warm bath, sometimes add some Epsom salts, then dry off. Legs up wall yoga and either sit in the garden for a bit or just potter around my flat and read until about 21 45, by then my eyelids are heavy. I'm finding it easy to fall asleep. Generally wake once in the night needing the bathroom, not always the case, sometimes just wake. Get myself up quickly, use bathroom and straight back to bed, back to sleep no problem. I'd say I'm getting a solid sleep between 2200 and 300. Then, I tend to dream and it sometimes briefly wakes me, but I get back to sleep, it's a momentary waking. Then I wake naturally around 500. Try for a bit more sleep but if no luck/ not asleep within 20 mins, I get up. I'm enjoying the early morning quiet at the moment.

 

So am getting about seven hours sleep. I'd like optimally to be getting about eight hours and more solid, but so far this is fair.

So....a good week, all in all. Really glad and grateful for this.

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mstimc

Wonderful post, Sunny!  It sounds like you're taking the right approach--not stressing if you're not getting the perfect sleep you want.  Just like recovery itself, sleep improves gradually.  What's really great about these long windows is that they prove you can recover, and the longer they last the more confident you become.  I still have anxious episodes, but I know they'll pass.  Practicing gratitude for these moments is tremendously beneficial to your long-term state of mind and keeps you in a positive frame of mind.  Congratulations!

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sunnysideup69
22 hours ago, mstimc said:

Wonderful post, Sunny!  It sounds like you're taking the right approach--not stressing if you're not getting the perfect sleep you want.  Just like recovery itself, sleep improves gradually.  What's really great about these long windows is that they prove you can recover, and the longer they last the more confident you become.  I still have anxious episodes, but I know they'll pass.  Practicing gratitude for these moments is tremendously beneficial to your long-term state of mind and keeps you in a positive frame of mind.  Congratulations!

 

Thanks @mstimc xxx

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sunnysideup69

Morning all. Morning @Gridley, just wanted to check out that I've understood something correctly, here.

 

In order to begin tapering, I understand that it's wise to be as stable as possible. But that doesn't necessarily mean free of windows and waves, right? Is it correct to say that the waves can still be there but as minimal as possible in their effect? 'WD normal' doesn't mean wave-free?

 

Asking because I think I've been misunderstanding and expecting to feel pretty 'normal' before beginning a taper....but that would mean being in a window all the time, which is unlikely. It's more a case of being in 'WD normal', which is still having some ups and downs but as minor as possible?

 

Thank you, hoe you have a great day :) 

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Cigale
On 5/23/2020 at 11:21 AM, sunnysideup69 said:

So, since Friday 15th May, I seem to have had the most stable week in a long time. In fact, looking at my notes, I've been improving again since 8th, but over the last week have seen a significant reduction in anxiety. I've had a few anxiety - free days where I've felt happy like my 'normal' self, so a good few windows.

Yes! This is such good news and so encouraging to hear. It sounds like you might soon be able to move to the next phase. Thinking of you and sending hugs!

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sunnysideup69
1 hour ago, Cigale said:

Yes! This is such good news and so encouraging to hear. It sounds like you might soon be able to move to the next phase. Thinking of you and sending hugs!

 

Thank you, @Cigale. I hope so, too! This week has been so-so, much more fatigue, but still relatively okay. Oh the ups and downs...we have to be so patient with this process, don't we?

 

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Longroadhome
10 hours ago, sunnysideup69 said:

Morning all. Morning @Gridley, just wanted to check out that I've understood something correctly, here.

 

In order to begin tapering, I understand that it's wise to be as stable as possible. But that doesn't necessarily mean free of windows and waves, right? Is it correct to say that the waves can still be there but as minimal as possible in their effect? 'WD normal' doesn't mean wave-free?

 

Asking because I think I've been misunderstanding and expecting to feel pretty 'normal' before beginning a taper....but that would mean being in a window all the time, which is unlikely. It's more a case of being in 'WD normal', which is still having some ups and downs but as minor as possible?

 

Thank you, hoe you have a great day :) 

Hi sunny I think I can answer this too 

wd normal for me is having mainly the same symptoms but different intensity at times mainly on reductions  

as you know I am tapering Brass monkey style 

hope this helps 

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Gridley
10 hours ago, sunnysideup69 said:

But that doesn't necessarily mean free of windows and waves, right? Is it correct to say that the waves can still be there but as minimal as possible in their effect? 'WD normal' doesn't mean wave-free?

That is exactly correct.  

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sunnysideup69
52 minutes ago, Gridley said:

That is exactly correct.  

 

Thanks @Gridley :) That's good news, will reassess how I am at the end of August. 

53 minutes ago, Longroadhome said:

Hi sunny I think I can answer this too 

wd normal for me is having mainly the same symptoms but different intensity at times mainly on reductions  

as you know I am tapering Brass monkey style 

Thanks @Longroadhome, I think I'm kind of at this point. I'm not really getting any new symptoms at this point, just the same old and, as you say, differing intensity. E.g. this week for me is slightly less buoyant than last week. But as a 'wave', it is pretty mild. Mostly, I'm being hit with fatigue and anhedonia. Don't seem to be too anxious these days. Also grief, which is another thing.

 

One thing I'm gonna have to do is switch from Venlafaxine to Effexor, at some point. I want to be able to do bead reduction and Venlafaxine doesn't seem to come in 'bead' format.

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Longroadhome
21 minutes ago, sunnysideup69 said:

 

Thanks Gridley :) That's good news, will reassess how I am at the end of August. 

Thanks @Longroadhome, I think I'm kind of at this point. I'm not really getting any new symptoms at this point, just the same old and, as you say, differing intensity. E.g. this week for me is slightly less buoyant than last week. But as a 'wave', it is pretty mild. Mostly, I'm being hit with fatigue and anhedonia. Don't seem to be too anxious these days. Also grief, which is another thing.

 

One thing I'm gonna have to do is switch from Venlafaxine to Effexor, at some point. I want to be able to do bead reduction and Venlafaxine doesn't seem to come in 'bead' format.

Can you not get liquid form ? 

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