Sexoxat: Seroxat/Paxil withdrawal while switching to Lexapro (escitalopram)

[Seroxat]

Hi everyone, I am new here and I would greatly appreciate your help!

I am sorry for my long story (with possible errors) but I just can't find anyone who can answer my questions and I desperately seek recognition and advice. If you do not want to read this long story please scroll to my questions and fears?

I'm Renske, 46 years old, and I'm from the Netherlands.
I have been taking 20 mg of Seroxat aka Paxil for a very long time (since I was 19) because I was diagnosed with a compulsive disorder. Seroxat worked very well for me for a long time. Mainly because I gradually gained weight (more than 25 kilos),  and kept gaining (with no obvious reason, such as eating a lot or something like that) and everything was checked; bloodwork, thyroid etc ,  I decided a few years ago to try to phase out Seroxat. Because I already knew how difficult that would be, I did it VERY slowly, with a suspension.
I was busy with this for a year.
 

 Throughout the year I was particularly affected by huge irritations and hostility. It seemed as if I had absolutely no patience and I was constantly angry. I have been very sad about this, because I was particularly unkind and impatient towards my children (8 and 11). Not physically thank God, but extreme irritation and impatience is of course also very bad. This made me feel very guilty.
 

The phasing out eventually failed, the moment I took almost nothing anymore, because I became extremely anxious and because the obsessive thoughts came back. Because I didn't have a back-up plan, after all the effort 😞 I quickly rebuilt to the full dose. It didn't work properly anymore; so i went up to 30 mg. Still didn't work properly. What I found remarkable, though, was that the aggressive / irritated feelings greatly decreased.
 

In consultation with a psychologist and psychiatrist I recently decided to switch to Lexapro (escitapram) although I realize that it is a matter of trying, because many SSRIs work the same (with the risk that it would not work properly again) and that they often have the same side effects (weight gain). I noticed that I had developed some sort of aversion to Seroxat, because it is apparently the most difficult drug to phase out and because it is the biggest culprit among the SSRis when it comes to weight gain.
 

The current situation: week 1: Seroxat (paxil) I went from 30 mg to 20 mg, week 2; 20 mg of Seroxat, week 3; 10 mg Seroxat and 5 mg Escitalopram (lexapro), week 4; stop Seroxat and 10 mg escitalopram. Afterwards; continue with 10 mg escitalopram. I understand that 10 mg of Lexapro (escitalopram) is approximately equal to 20 mg of Seroxat.
I am now at the beginning of week 5.
 

During these past weeks I have had the so-called and famous brain zapps, and huge sweat attacks. But the worst thing is that I am AGAIN so terribly irritated and hostile. I recognize this as a withdrawal from Seroxat, I am almost certain that this is not a side effect of building the escitalopram.
Ironically, I don't have a lot of trouble with my compulsion, but all the more with my very short temper.
 

Discussed it with the psychiatrist; she indicates that if this is a withdrawal phenomenon, it should be over in a few weeks, according to the pharmacist who makes the product. Of course I said that that is the biggest bullsh*t and that there are so many people who suffer from these symptoms for a longer period of time. She didn't really have an answer for that. She indicated that maybe it was my personality that came back. But that is nonsense; I was always gentle and kind to others. this is also not ordinary irritation due to stress or something, but it really seems like something physical that really engulfs me, just like that
She suggested perhaps adding some Seroxat again?
The reason why I do not believe in this is because in the past I have phased out the Seroxat very slowly and then I also had such symptoms. Why would that be different now?

My questions and fears:

Does anyone recognize the symptoms of irritation, impatience and hostility of phasing out the Seroxat / Paxil?
How long can this take? Was this passing on?
Is there anyone with whom this went away as a new drug started to work properly?
I am afraid that this withdrawal phenomenon will continue to exist for a long time due to the withdrawal of Seroxat, while the Lexapro may work, can this coexist? Or is that far-fetched?
I know that all anti-depressants must be phased out gradually. Would it make sense to take a little more Seroxat next to the Lexapro, so that I would phase out slower, despite using Lexapro at the same time (within safe margins of course)because the (very) slow reduction has not diminished the feelings of irritation in the past, and I am now inclined to finally stop completely with Seroxat and switch completely to Lexapro.

I would be so grateful if I get some responses from people who recognize things.

Again, sorry for my long story.

Thanks so much in advance.
 

Renske

[Altostrata]

Welcome, Seroxat.

 

I moved your post to start your Introductions topic. You can add questions and status updates in this topic, to track your individual progress.

 

Obviously, you have paroxetine withdrawal symptoms -- brain zaps are not associated with personality. It is indeed possible to have withdrawal symptoms from the first drug while taking the second.

 

How often are the brain zaps? How have these and other symptoms changed in the last 2 weeks? How's your sleep?

 

What time of day do you take Lexapro? How do you feel in the hours before and after you take it?

 

18 hours ago, Seroxat said:

it should be over in a few weeks, according to the pharmacist who makes the product.

 

A pharmacist makes the product? Please explain.
 

[Seroxat]

Hi, thanks for responding. 
i understand the brain zaps have nothing to do with my personality. I was referring to my irritation en hostility: the psych suggested that  that was possible my personality before I started taking the meds. But’s that not the case. The brain zaps I’m not experiencing all the time, but mostly in the mornings before I take my Lexapro and sometimes in the evenings. I take lexapro between 7:30 and 7:45 before I leave for work. 
until now I sleep ok, although I feel much more energetic since one week on 10 mg lexapro 

I feel less tired and numb. At the moment I only worry about being so very angry and about being  so easily irritated. This seems to be worst in the evrning and  around my kids, i can’ T stand  the noises they make en I’m not patient at all during the daily routines. I would especially like to know if this is a common effect of withdrawal and if people recognize this? 

[Seroxat]

As for your questions about the pharmacist: I meen according to the instruction leaflet from the producer of the meds. Or how is it called?  Like Glaxo Smith Kline The psych also claims the withdraw shouldn’t take so long.  

[Altostrata]

That is common misinformation from doctors and pharmacists, originating from pharmaceutical manufacturers such GlaxoSmithKline. NICE itself just revised its guidelines https://www.pharmaceutical-journal.com/news-and-analysis/news/nice-amends-depression-guideline-highlighting-severe-and-long-lasting-withdrawal-symptoms/20207226.article

 

You might print this out for your doctors and pharmacist.

 

When a withdrawal syndrome hallmark such as "brain zaps" is present, all unusual symptoms should be presumed to be associated with withdrawal syndrome. Increased irritability and sensitivity to sound, light, or other stimuli are known withdrawal symptoms. 

 

It sounds like the substitution of escilatopram for paroxetine is starting to work. Please try to be patient while your nervous system settles down over the next months. Symptoms may change and should fade and not be as frequent as your system stabilizes on the new drug regimen. When you are stable, you can consider tapering the escilatopram dosage.

 

Please continue to let us know how you're doing. To help us out, follow these instructions Please put your drug and withdrawal history in your signature You may need to use a computer to do this.

[Seroxat]

Hi, I wrote a big introduction, maybe that’s why I did not get many responses. I’ll try again. I’m Renske (46) from the Netherlands. I suffer from ocd. therefore  i can hardly do without medication. Currently I’m switching from Seroxat to Lexapro. Seroxat didn’t  work properly any more en in gained an enormous amount of weight. 
I tried tapering off Seroxat  before, very slowly. It took me a year and I experienced I became very irritable and angry during the entire  time.   It failed, Now i’m trying again: this time i’m crosstapering to Lexapro. I’m experiencing the same withdrawal symptoms: I’m very irritable, angry and impatient. This troubles me a lot, especially because I hurt my children with my behavior. I take lorazepam daily, just to try to be Less aggressive. 

I’m afraid this won’t pass. Had anyone had the same experience? And did this pass? I’m worried. 

Thanks in advance. 

 

[Seroxat]

On 10/27/2019 at 1:47 AM, Seroxat said:

Hi everyone, I am new here and I would greatly appreciate your help!

I am sorry for my long story (with possible errors) but I just can't find anyone who can answer my questions and I desperately seek recognition and advice. If you do not want to read this long story please scroll to my questions and fears?

I'm Renske, 46 years old, and I'm from the Netherlands.
I have been taking 20 mg of Seroxat aka Paxil for a very long time (since I was 19) because I was diagnosed with a compulsive disorder. Seroxat worked very well for me for a long time. Mainly because I gradually gained weight (more than 25 kilos),  and kept gaining (with no obvious reason, such as eating a lot or something like that) and everything was checked; bloodwork, thyroid etc ,  I decided a few years ago to try to phase out Seroxat. Because I already knew how difficult that would be, I did it VERY slowly, with a suspension.
I was busy with this for a year.
 

 Throughout the year I was particularly affected by huge irritations and hostility. It seemed as if I had absolutely no patience and I was constantly angry. I have been very sad about this, because I was particularly unkind and impatient towards my children (8 and 11). Not physically thank God, but extreme irritation and impatience is of course also very bad. This made me feel very guilty.
 

The phasing out eventually failed, the moment I took almost nothing anymore, because I became extremely anxious and because the obsessive thoughts came back. Because I didn't have a back-up plan, after all the effort 😞 I quickly rebuilt to the full dose. It didn't work properly anymore; so i went up to 30 mg. Still didn't work properly. What I found remarkable, though, was that the aggressive / irritated feelings greatly decreased.
 

In consultation with a psychologist and psychiatrist I recently decided to switch to Lexapro (escitapram) although I realize that it is a matter of trying, because many SSRIs work the same (with the risk that it would not work properly again) and that they often have the same side effects (weight gain). I noticed that I had developed some sort of aversion to Seroxat, because it is apparently the most difficult drug to phase out and because it is the biggest culprit among the SSRis when it comes to weight gain.
 

The current situation: week 1: Seroxat (paxil) I went from 30 mg to 20 mg, week 2; 20 mg of Seroxat, week 3; 10 mg Seroxat and 5 mg Escitalopram (lexapro), week 4; stop Seroxat and 10 mg escitalopram. Afterwards; continue with 10 mg escitalopram. I understand that 10 mg of Lexapro (escitalopram) is approximately equal to 20 mg of Seroxat.
I am now at the beginning of week 5.
 

During these past weeks I have had the so-called and famous brain zapps, and huge sweat attacks. But the worst thing is that I am AGAIN so terribly irritated and hostile. I recognize this as a withdrawal from Seroxat, I am almost certain that this is not a side effect of building the escitalopram.
Ironically, I don't have a lot of trouble with my compulsion, but all the more with my very short temper.
 

Discussed it with the psychiatrist; she indicates that if this is a withdrawal phenomenon, it should be over in a few weeks, according to the pharmacist who makes the product. Of course I said that that is the biggest bullsh*t and that there are so many people who suffer from these symptoms for a longer period of time. She didn't really have an answer for that. She indicated that maybe it was my personality that came back. But that is nonsense; I was always gentle and kind to others. this is also not ordinary irritation due to stress or something, but it really seems like something physical that really engulfs me, just like that
She suggested perhaps adding some Seroxat again?
The reason why I do not believe in this is because in the past I have phased out the Seroxat very slowly and then I also had such symptoms. Why would that be different now?

My questions and fears:

Does anyone recognize the symptoms of irritation, impatience and hostility of phasing out the Seroxat / Paxil?
How long can this take? Was this passing on?
Is there anyone with whom this went away as a new drug started to work properly?
I am afraid that this withdrawal phenomenon will continue to exist for a long time due to the withdrawal of Seroxat, while the Lexapro may work, can this coexist? Or is that far-fetched?
I know that all anti-depressants must be phased out gradually. Would it make sense to take a little more Seroxat next to the Lexapro, so that I would phase out slower, despite using Lexapro at the same time (within safe margins of course)because the (very) slow reduction has not diminished the feelings of irritation in the past, and I am now inclined to finally stop completely with Seroxat and switch completely to Lexapro.

I would be so grateful if I get some responses from people who recognize things.

Again, sorry for my long story.

Thanks so much in advance.
 

Renske

thank you for your answer. I’ll try to be patient. I feel so quilty towards my kids. 

[Altostrata]

Renske, only one Introductions topic to a member. You might visit other Intro topics for people in similar situations and ask about their experiences.

[Seroxat]

Hi, I wrote a very long introduction, maybe that’s why I did not get many responses. I’ll try again. I’m Renske (46) from the Netherlands. I suffer from ocd. therefore  i can hardly do without medication. Currently I’ve switched from Seroxat to Lexapro. Seroxat didn’t  work properly any more en in gained an enormous amount of weight. I used it for over 20 years.
I tried tapering off Seroxat (20 mg)  before in the past, with no cross tapering, i did it very slowly, with a suspension . It took me a year and I experienced I became very irritable and angry during the entire  time.  It failed, anxiety and ocd came back hard time. Now i’m trying again: this time i’ve crosstapered from 30 mg Seroxat to 10 mg Lexapro. I’m experiencing the same withdrawal symptoms as before from Seroxat: 

I find it the most disturbing that  I’m very irritable, angry and impatient. This troubles me a lot, especially because I regularly (verbally) hurt my children with my behavior. I take lorazepam daily, just to try to be less aggressive and unkind. This feeling can suddenly flood me, for no reason, or for a small reason. For example if my child has to go to the toilet in the middle of Ikea, or if my child lingers too much or whatever. I am so angry that I cannot even commit myself to comforting my child, that is upset because of me! A little later I say sorry, of course, but the process starts all over again. I feel so guilty and on the other hand I can't stop it!

It breaks my heart. I don't want my children to get scared of me or to end up in my emotional roller coaster.

I understand that these symptoms may be associated with withdrawal from Seroxat, but I do not read many experiences about this specific phenomenon.

Who recognizes this. Does anyone have advice?

Sharing experiences is very very welcome.

 

a sad mother

 

Thanks in advance. 

[Altostrata]

Before starting a topic in other forums, please look around for existing discussions. You may wish to participate in these topics

 

Neuro-emotions

 

Non-drug techniques to cope with emotional symptoms

 

Easing your way into meditation for a stressed-out nervous system

 

Shame, guilt, regret, and self-criticism

 

Health anxiety, hypochondria, and obsession with symptoms

 

Ways to cope with daily anxiety

 

Coping with irritation, anger and rage

[Altostrata]

You are taking lorazepam every day? How long have you been doing this? What times of day do you take your drugs, and their dosages?

[Seroxat]

I take 0,5 mg lorazepam every day for about two weeks now, times are different: whenever I feel to irritated ..

lexapro I take once a day, in the morning, at about 7:30

[Altostrata]

You will need to keep daily notes of times of day you take ALL your drugs, their dosages, and your symptoms throughout the day. We need this to see if the lorazepam is adding to symptoms.

 

You can post 24 hours of notes at a time in this topic, with a simple list format with time of day on the left and notation (symptom or drug and dosage) on the right.