Snorky: Reinstatement of amitriptyline

[mstimc]

2 minutes ago, Snorky said:

Hi

 

Many thanks for your interest and response. It's a weird feeling, have it now, typing this. Like my brain is resisting any attempt to think or do anything positive . Tried to watch an old movie on YouTube last night. (Anthony Hopkins playing Hitler in "the Bunker"'). Thought it would distract me, but kept checking every five minutes how long was left. Guess that's a sort of restlessness reaction?

 

Thank you again

Yes, I experienced that as well.  Before we moved to Portugal, I was a  hobbyist woodworker at home in California.  I had an office job so woodworking allowed me to be creative with my hands instead of just my head.  But when I was struggling, I couldn't muster the will to set up my equipment nor focus on designing and creating projects. I just didn't want to invest the time and effort.  I felt the same way about reading, watching TV, etc.  As I recovered from withdrawal, my interest started coming back, and the more I did positive activities, the better it got. 

[Snorky]

11 minutes ago, mstimc said:

Yes, I experienced that as well.  Before we moved to Portugal, I was a  hobbyist woodworker at home in California.  I had an office job so woodworking allowed me to be creative with my hands instead of just my head.  But when I was struggling, I couldn't muster the will to set up my equipment nor focus on designing and creating projects. I just didn't want to invest the time and effort.  I felt the same way about reading, watching TV, etc.  As I recovered from withdrawal, my interest started coming back, and the more I did positive activities, the better it got. 

Thanks again. Anhedonia and restlessness combo not great. My worry is I’m in 4th month of CT, but the mist palpable and distressing symptoms (psychological) only kicked in last month. It’s like my graph is going downwards and I’m going to feel a hell of a lot worse b4 improvement. (Don’t think that’s possible)

[mstimc]

Oddly enough, one thing I was able to do to work off my nervous energy was clean the house.  I'd put on the TV or radio as a diversion and just start cleaning.  Even if I did a little bit it helped.  I still do that when I feel anxious, especially about upcoming events.

[mstimc]

1 minute ago, Snorky said:

Thanks again. Anhedonia and restlessness combo not great. My worry is I’m in 4th month of CT, but the mist palpable and distressing symptoms (psychological) only kicked in last month. It’s like my graph is going downwards and I’m going to feel a hell of a lot worse b4 improvement. (Don’t think that’s possible)

I think recovery can be wavy--mine certainly was.  Once I got past one symptom something else popped up.  My personal theory is that until we can start diminishing the "ball" of anxiety, we need to put ti somewhere, whether its ahedonia, hypochondria,  obsessive thinking or any other anxious behavior.  For me, the wave pattern actually helped, because it made me realize I was engaging in certain thought patterns independent of reality.  Once I accepted that my mind was searching for issues, it was much easier to deal with them.  OCD and anxiety will always be with me because they're part of who I am, but I can recognize and manage the thoughts and channel them more positively. 

 

[Snorky]

8 minutes ago, mstimc said:

I think recovery can be wavy--mine certainly was.  Once I got past one symptom something else popped up.  My personal theory is that until we can start diminishing the "ball" of anxiety, we need to put ti somewhere, whether its ahedonia, hypochondria,  obsessive thinking or any other anxious behavior.  For me, the wave pattern actually helped, because it made me realize I was engaging in certain thought patterns independent of reality.  Once I accepted that my mind was searching for issues, it was much easier to deal with them.  OCD and anxiety will always be with me because they're part of who I am, but I can recognize and manage the thoughts and channel them more positively. 

 

Thanks again. V constructive and clear. In my case I can differentiate between ruminating and simply describing the nasty symptoms to family and others as they arise. (Ie anhedonia stuff-don’t think I’m doing anything to precipitate this) However, one thing I have noticed is my constant desire to cling on to the past. This could be going past my son’s old school, park where he used to play. I don’t build them up into negative spirals, more harking back for an era when I was relatively well.

[mstimc]

25 minutes ago, Snorky said:

Thanks again. V constructive and clear. In my case I can differentiate between ruminating and simply describing the nasty symptoms to family and others as they arise. (Ie anhedonia stuff-don’t think I’m doing anything to precipitate this) However, one thing I have noticed is my constant desire to cling on to the past. This could be going past my son’s old school, park where he used to play. I don’t build them up into negative spirals, more harking back for an era when I was relatively well.

Oh yes, same here.  I'm doing a bit of that now.  We moved to Portugal in September and the holidays were especially hard for me.  I really enjoyed setting up and decorating a 9-foot tree in our living room.  We had a four-bedroom house and now live in a small two-bedroom apartment (first time since 1988 we lived in an apartment).  No tree or other decorations.  Not to mention missing our son and other family.  Some of it was normal homesickness but I sensed a taste of idealization of the past; driven by anxiety "If I could go home now I could share the holidays like I used to."  But my wife reminded me the holidays could be stressful, too--running around to relatives' houses, getting gifts, etc. 

 

Herodotus said "Not even God can change the past".   I miss many things in my past life pre-anxiety and WD.  But I can't get them back nor change the time between.  I can honor my experiences by helping others, by being more empathetic, and by committing to enjoy what the future may bring. 

[Snorky]

12 minutes ago, mstimc said:

Oh yes, same here.  I'm doing a bit of that now.  We moved to Portugal in September and the holidays were especially hard for me.  I really enjoyed setting up and decorating a 9-foot tree in our living room.  We had a four-bedroom house and now live in a small two-bedroom apartment (first time since 1988 we lived in an apartment).  No tree or other decorations.  Not to mention missing our son and other family.  Some of it was normal homesickness but I sensed a taste of idealization of the past; driven by anxiety "If I could go home now I could share the holidays like I used to."  But my wife reminded me the holidays could be stressful, too--running around to relatives' houses, getting gifts, etc. 

 

Herodotus said "Not even God can change the past".   I miss many things in my past life pre-anxiety and WD.  But I can't get them back nor change the time between.  I can honor my experiences by helping others, by being more empathetic, and by committing to enjoy what the future may bring. 

The Father of Modern History- I wonder how he coped with windows and waves and anhedonia?

[Snorky]

3 minutes ago, Snorky said:

The Father of Modern History- I wonder how he coped with windows and waves and anhedonia?

Father of History, not modern history.

[mstimc]

13 minutes ago, Snorky said:

Father of History, not modern history.

Close enough--its early!  😄

[Snorky]

Massive wave of anxiety, anger and agitation now. Snapping at everyone, overreacting to trivial stuff like Sport result. Anger and agitation were adverse effect of amitriptyline, but now carrying on with WD. 

[Snorky]

Seems to be worse than anhedonia. Not just unable to enjoy, more anger, aggression and agitation. WTF is happening to me????

[Snorky]

Morning

 

Came back to work this week, as sick certificate ran out. Nice to briefly take mind off situation, but don’t think sustainable as feel truly awful. (Anxiety and physical stuff) 

 

A few people have commented on how much weight I’ve lost. (I knew I had, as wearing belts all time) 

 

Im going to check later, but us this associated with CT?

 

Thanks

[Snorky]

Hi again

Im still 12st, but think I’ve lost about 9lbs. Is this normal after four months CT?

 

Thanks

[sunnysideup69]

How did you cope with work, Snorky? 

 

I know when I initially stopped Citalopram in 2015, and also when I lurched down to 2.5mg in 2017, the pounds dropped off. 

I lost  8 pounds from that drop in 2017. So your weight loss doesn't surprise me.

[Snorky]

18 minutes ago, sunnysideup69 said:

How did you cope with work, Snorky? 

 

I know when I initially stopped Citalopram in 2015, and also when I lurched down to 2.5mg in 2017, the pounds dropped off. 

I lost  8 pounds from that drop in 2017. So your weight loss doesn't surprise me.

 Hi S

 

Hope you’re managing. Mixed experience re work. Forced myself to go, as worried about psychological impact of staying home. V quiet, so a bit artificial. Seemed to help with psychological symptoms a tad , as taking mind off for a while. Paradoxically, much more of a strain with physical symptoms, shakes and pains etc.

Don’t know if it will be sustainable going forward.

 

Thanks for reassurance re weight loss. I checked the site and most of the posts were about weight gain during AD use and after taper.

[Gridley]

13 minutes ago, Snorky said:

weight loss

Weight loss is WD is common.  I've lost a lot of weight that I really didn't need to lose.

[Snorky]

16 minutes ago, Gridley said:

Weight loss is WD is common.  I've lost a lot of weight that I really didn't need to lose.

Hi G 

 

Long time no speak. I guess that’s associated with heightened anxiety as much as anything else?

 

Thanks

[Altostrata]

Snorky, if you can handle going to work, keep at it. Challenging yourself a little can move recovery along, plus you have distractions all day long, which is good.

 

How is your sleep, now that you're working? You must make sure to keep regular hours.

[Gridley]

17 minutes ago, Snorky said:

heightened anxiety as much as anything else?

That and lack of appetite.

[Katy398]

I lost 20kgs in 4 months. I actually needed to, so for me it’s my silver lining. Folk say I look good but I feel terrible, the worse I’ve ever felt in my life. No one understands so I just keep quiet now. I think it was the reason work reduced my responsibilities. They realise some thing is not right. Anxiety,, doom and dread, insomnia and hair loss are my biggest challenges after 1 year med free from a cold turkey fast taper. 

Best wishes Storky, and everyone else on this excruciating journey. 

Kx 

[Snorky]

7 minutes ago, Gridley said:

That and lack of appetite.

I can certainly relate to that. Appetite comes and goes.

 

[Snorky]

18 hours ago, Altostrata said:

Snorky, if you can handle going to work, keep at it. Challenging yourself a little can move recovery along, plus you have distractions all day long, which is good.

 

How is your sleep, now that you're working? You must make sure to keep regular hours.

Hi A

 

Thanks. Yes, I can see virtue in work distraction. However, will be back to “normal” next week, so will have to see how I cope. Sleep-Doc only gave me one month sedative, so will run out soon. Intention was to get me into routine, without long term medication. I just hope a) I can sleep when sedative ends, and, b) no adverse reaction to stopping...

 

[Snorky]

Update 17.11

 

Had the mother and father of all depression/anhedonia type sensations and feelings all afternoon. (If they can be combined?)

 

I’m no expert, but not sure AAF type approach is able to help with the more palpable depression type symptoms? Ie had more angst yesterday, working, even went our. Kept telling myself to forget how I felt and was partially successful. Adopted the same approach today, and no help whatsoever?

 

Just an observation.

 

Thanks

[Altostrata]

7 hours ago, Snorky said:

Sleep-Doc only gave me one month sedative, so will run out soon.

 

What does this mean? I don't see it in your signature.

[Snorky]

43 minutes ago, Altostrata said:

 

What does this mean? I don't see it in your signature.

Sorry, should have added to signature. It’s covered in Dec 16 post re Doc prescription for promethazine for one month.

[Gridley]

1 hour ago, Snorky said:

promethazine

 

You might want to do a fast taper off the promethazine toward the end.  Alto recommends reducing by 25% every few days.

Tips for tapering promethazine / Phenergan - Tapering ...

[Snorky]

6 minutes ago, Gridley said:

 

You might want to do a fast taper off the promethazine toward the end.  Alto recommends reducing by 25% every few days.

Tips for tapering promethazine / Phenergan - Tapering ...

I’m not sure how to do that on 25mg tabs.

[Gridley]

12 minutes ago, Snorky said:

I’m not sure how to do that on 25mg tabs.

I'd just cut approximately 1/4 of the tablet off for a few days just by eyeballing it. Then take 1/2 tab for a few days. Then take 1/4 tab for a few days.  It doesn't have to be perfect, just so you gradually ease off.

[Snorky]

20 minutes ago, Gridley said:

I'd just cut approximately 1/4 of the tablet off for a few days just by eyeballing it. Then take 1/2 tab for a few days. Then take 1/4 tab for a few days.  It doesn't have to be perfect, just so you gradually ease off.

Thank you G

 

Did you read my other post today about AAF approach when dealing with awful depressive and anhedonia type symptoms?

[Gridley]

1 hour ago, Snorky said:

other post today about AAF

Yes, you may be right.  It's more for anxiety than the depressive/anhedonia spectrum of the symptoms.  On the other hand, acceptance is always helpful regardless so I wouldn't write it off.  

[Snorky]

21 minutes ago, Gridley said:

Yes, you may be right.  It's more for anxiety than the depressive/anhedonia spectrum of the symptoms.  On the other hand, acceptance is always helpful regardless so I wouldn't write it off.  

Noted. I’ve become increasingly convinced that my intensifying depression and anhedonia will be difficult to shift without reinstatement of ADs. Ie depletion of serotonin and dopamine receptors.

 

Almost the elephant in the room of you will. Will be intrigued to see what other Mods think on this. 

If you will.

[Snorky]

10.00

 

Woke at 5. Mind then bombarded with same recurrent and uncontrollable thoughts. Ie

• I'm in a doom cloud
• I've got recurrent and uncontrollable thoughts

Repeeated every few seconds until I got up at 10.00. Also accompanied by a permanent physical tightness, knot in skull.

 

Hope this is not rumination. Don't think so, just describing what's occurring.

 

Thanks

[Katy398]

So sorry you’re going through this as well Snorky. I’m going through the same. When I see folk going through the same, it makes me realise this has to be withdrawal. I just get so frightened. I wonder what we are supposed to do. I’ve been trying to work out how to use Claire Weekes and which book to buy but I’m in too much of a fog to search and work it out.

we will get through this Snorky they say everyone heals eventually it’s the unknown of  how long it will take that we have to live with. 

Hang on in there Snorky take care Kx

[Snorky]

31 minutes ago, Katy398 said:

So sorry you’re going through this as well Snorky. I’m going through the same. When I see folk going through the same, it makes me realise this has to be withdrawal. I just get so frightened. I wonder what we are supposed to do. I’ve been trying to work out how to use Claire Weekes and which book to buy but I’m in too much of a fog to search and work it out.

we will get through this Snorky they say everyone heals eventually it’s the unknown of  how long it will take that we have to live with. 

Hang on in there Snorky take care Kx

Hi Katy

 

Thanks for your thought. How weird to get recurring thoughts about having recurring thought. Would be funny if wasn’t so tragic.

[Snorky]

Update

 

Only slept about two hours despite sedative, Then depression, anhedonia, edge and insomnia. To give an indication of eruptions of anhedonia if that’s what it is. One minute watching YouTube on phone, then awful sensation, which stops you in your tracks and makes it almost painful to watch stuff you used to enjoy (natural history etc)

 

Quite terrifying.

[sunnysideup69]

Sorry to read this Snorky. What are you planning re work? Any chance you could do reduced hours for a while?

I also get days when I can't tolerate watching things/ somehow it presses the dread button.Other days are totally normal. WD is indeed very strange.