Arti: paroxetine 17 years intolerably

[Altostrata]

Arti, you have had many drug changes since 2018 that may have upset your nervous system.

 

12 hours ago, Arti said:

12.April.2020 0mg paroxetin

 

Paroxetine is a very difficult drug to go off. Your many attempts to reduce dosage have resulted in your nervous system being irritated by withdrawal.

 

I might try substituting 0.25mg fluoxetine (1/4 milligram), take in the morning. Fluoxetine comes in a liquid form, or you can make your own liquid, instructions here Tips for tapering off Prozac (fluoxetine)

 

Are you still taking Dominal? If so, please ask your pharmacist what the half-life of this drug might be, and if it conflicts with fluoxetine.

 

What effect does Dominal have on you? Does it help?

[Arti]

@Altostrata i know i am stupid until now i dont wand to Make anymore mistakes 

 

What should i do with the paroxetine I reinstate yesterday 0,35mg and today i took it for the second Time?

Fluoxetin addional or instead of paroxetine ?

Dominal has a half Life of 2 to 3 hours very short yes i take it since April or May 2019 now with 45mg

I take at10pm in die evening i feel nothing From it no Benefit no really bad Reaktion,

 

I checked on German pharmacy side there are exactly same conflicts with Dominal and paroxetine or fluoxetin

(When combining the medicinal products, undesirable effects such as fever, tremors, muscle or movement stiffness, slowed movement, gait insecurity or risk of falling, as well as palpitations, shortness of breath, dizziness or fainting fits may occur.)

[Altostrata]

How do you feel, having taken 0.35mg paroxetine?

[Arti]

@Altostrata feel more or less same then before Bad, maybe today in die evening after the second Time a little better more stable but cannot really say because of the paroxetin i feel very Bad, difficult to detect feelings im very weak it feels every small thing physic psychollogy brings me to a nervous breakdown

[Altostrata]

Just now, Arti said:

a little better more stable

 

A little better is what we'd expect. Please continue to take 0.35mg paroxetine at the same time each day. You will need to be patient as your nervous system slowly settles down. Let us know how you're doing.

[Arti]

@Altostrata the last two days i took paroxetin at 15pm normally 8am in the morning 

I thougt i take it every day one hour earlier to com back to 8 is this ok ?

So no fluoxetin at the Moment?

And keep the Domal how it is?

 

[Altostrata]

It is essential you take your drugs at the same times each day. At this point, you might as well keep paroxetine at 15:00.

 

I would start to explore getting fluoxetine liquid for substitution.

[Arti]

@Altostrata ok thanks a Lot!!

Next week i ask doctor for fluoxetin liquid to be prepared 

Dominal i still take at 22pm

I give you Message in a few days how it is 

 

[Altostrata]

We will need to see how you do on 0.35mg paroxetine at the same time each day before making a change to fluoxetine. Please let us know how you're doing.

[Arti]

@Altostrata yes bevor i do any Change i let you know 

[Arti]

@Altostrata

hello altostrata

if I write too much and I disturb you please let me know

yesterday evening it was more or less okay I took the dominal at 10pm and went to bed at 10:30pm I was unable to sleep. One reason for that was not a joke, I had to go to the toilet every 5 to 10 minutes, I think it went until around 5:00 am then I have to fall asleep by 7:00 am and now after stand up confused with terrible fear and lighter physical things, burning skin, dizziness, facial sensations problems to coordinate movement etc(chortisol). when I lie in bed, the thoughts eventually become a mush and often even though i don't know what went through my head at all, i get scared of it. since the beginning in 16 months I have never sleept like before. when i sleep i often don't notice it like tonight it felt like i'm awake and still sleep. I also have no feeling of tiredness as before and when it feels different. I slept without problems for 40 years. I know the nervous system is irritated and hurt and i made so many mistakes im in hell since the first too fast reduction 

but do you think I can one day sleep again in a normal rhythm?

 

[Altostrata]

I am sorry, Arti, that is part of the paroxetine withdrawal. I don't know what to do about it. Please hang in, see if the low dose of paroxetine helps.

[Arti]

@Altostrata thanks its enough for me if you say this is really withdrawal  !!

 

the day today was just to endure the fear and restlessness. after taking it at 3pm I thought it would get better then after about 1 hour it got extremely worse I can hardly explain the fear even more brutal it looks very strange feeling as if the mind is flying away. problems with moving the arms later then freeze and burn. it's hard for me to say it's a bad reaction to paroxetine or a wave now. I have had these symptoms before. the bad thing is i can hardly explain the conditions a feeling as if you explode. now it seems to degrade a little I just can not rest as soon as my body relaxes or I get tired then a flashes through my body so that I'm afraid to somehow come to rest even in the evening it happens with the shaking or flashes when your eyes close in front of tv 

[Altostrata]

Arti, that sounds like a bad reaction to paroxetine.

 

Please check with your pharmacist about reactions between Dominal and citalopram. Citalopram might be a better substitute for you than fluoxetine.

[Arti]

@Altostrata

I checked it its always the same conflict with Dominal 

No matter if fluoxetin,paroxetin or citalopram 

 

I dont understand why yesterday it becomes little Bit better after paroxetin and today Bad reaction 

[Arti]

@Altostrata do you think the Dominal is also a big Problem in this Situation. Because of the short half Life  and the conflict 

Do you think rebound effect and daily withdrawl From that drug ?

 

So its a really misguided Situation 

[Arti]

@Altostrata

one last question. i know that i messed up and i'm in the paws. It will take time before I healed I hope it can happen at all. I stopped the 0.35mg again after it went so badly after taking the 3rd one. but I had the months and weeks before such conditions, the last few days it got worse. Is it possible that I generally no longer tolerate paroxetine  since the first reinstate in February 2019? I have never been well since the reinstate. yes I have again overdosed up to 10mg and then waited 4.5 months better it never got better I was afraid and restless akhathisie and insomnia which was immeasurable otherwise I could function somehow I could often not move afraid of all day but the body worked more or less. one thing that does not let go of me is something that I have never read neither in the german forum or on sa, this started around january2019 after i set off too quick

since then i can't lie anymore during the day and close my eyes because i get scared. I sit comfortably and look too long without bothering the brain my mind drifts away then I see daydreams sometimes the eyes close without me noticing then my body or my stomach contracts and I get scared and clear my eyes again. it is as if my system does not fit to rest. That happens often in the evening when I can watch TV. i know that all sri sri are in conflict with the dominal, so i have no other choice either i leave paroxetine out and go into the cold train so actually 2 questions

 

should i try again to dose 0.25mg ssri or is it possible that my body just doesn't want anything anymore?

where do you think this condition comes from with the mind it is because of the irritated nervous system. a bad reaction to paroxetine or withdrawal?

 

 

 

 

[Altostrata]

17 minutes ago, Arti said:

I stopped the 0.35mg again after it went so badly after taking the 3rd one.

 

What exactly happened after you took the third dose?

 

Please update your signature. Very clearly, you tapered too fast between January 2020 and April 2020. We always tell people to stop tapering if they get withdrawal symptoms.

 

 

[Arti]

@Altostrata

 

See the Post on may10 what happend 

I do Not know how to change Signature

 

I know there is  a conflict with dominal and every ssri but is this the only Chance? 

 

[Altostrata]

What effect did 60mg Dominal have on you?

 

 

[Arti]

NO Benefit 

And now i also detect nothing if i take Dominal 

[Arti]

Hallo @Altostrata

 

Today i tried 0,28mg paroxetin before that i feel really bad meanwhile i think every Thing in me ist destroyed 

 

2 hours after taking the paroxetin akhathisie went to the roof and anxiety also i could not rest at any Place. I was punshing things and was screaming for hours

Every Thing of this was happend in the Weeks before but not so itense. Not immediately after taking paroxetin but most in de first half of the day and i was alllways taking paroxetin at 8pm

 

Please forgiving me i am very confused no it is more Bad then ever every few days i take tavor 0,5mg but this is no Solutions.

 

Meanwhile im Not sure if paroxetin triggered a psychic desease because this ist not longer me i cannot stand the preasure in me no Chance to Relax 24/7

If i read other Storys i See Not me there it is different i have physical sympthoms but Not much but the madness in my head i cannot stand.

 

Again altostrata Sorry that i am crying like a Baby and i think you hear manny Bad things and its my own fault

Updosing, reducing, Updosing, reducing over two year so my nervous System ist at the end i think.

In the other Hand i cannot believe that i am the only Idiot with this fault. I will survive nothing Else 

A fast Solutions is not avaiable but i need hope you also survived this 

 

I think my System no longer tollerate ssri but I am Not sure, today it was the worst what happend the last Month an the last Month are terrible 

But im Not sure what to do keep trying paroxetin for Weeks or other ssri or stopp a Go throu the hell.

Und also Dominal i get this at the beginnen of this nochmals i Think in April 2019 at the beginnen i detect some small effect but meanwhile not really.

I am really at the end and if you also have no idea Please tell me.

 

 

 

 

[Altostrata]

It appears you have paroxetine withdrawal syndrome. It does not seem that reinstating any amount of paroxetine is going to be of any help.

 

How's your sleep? Are your symptoms better or worse at any times of day?

 

Have you talked with your doctor about having paroxetine withdrawal syndrome? Did you tell your doctor Dominal is not helping?

 

You will need to taper off Dominal.

[Arti]

@Altostrata

My sleep is very Bad it was Bad since this Starts in January2019 but changes since that sometimes i woke often, sometimes i could not sleep at all,

At the Moment the last nights since weeks i Go to bed at 10:30 I try to sleep but I have to Go several times to toillet between i cannot detect if i sleep or Not.

After this several times maybe i get sleep next i look to the clock in 4 or 5 am but it feels terrible i cannot say if was sleeping and i feel no wakeup point. 

 

Few days ago i feelt the deepest sleep since Month dont know why, since that the same i have fear of the night and of the mornig after i look to the clock

Scary thoughts coming in my mind and fear increase think kortisol. When i stand up after i while i am confused. Then fear increase more for the whole day.

It feels in the night like my body maybe sleep but Not my Braun.

 

At the  moment i have no doctor only my house doctor for the drugs but yes they all dont 

Believe me.

During the day it is a terrible feeling as i told no chance to rest brain always full power and i think allways my mind is seperate from the body.

 

Dominal tapper despite of paroxetin withdrawl?

 

 

[Arti]

 

@Altostrata forgot normally sympthoms in the evening becoming better Not every day but most

Still feel very Bad brain 100% but better

[Altostrata]

16 minutes ago, Arti said:

Few days ago i feelt the deepest sleep since Month

 

What were you taking then?

 

Your doctor doesn't know anything about paroxetine withdrawal syndrome?

 

Many people find fish oil and magnesium supplements helpful, see
https://survivingantidepressants.org/index.php?/topic/36-king-of-supplements-omega-3-fatty-acids-fish-oil/
https://survivingantidepressants.org/topic/15483-magnesium-natures-calcium-channel-blocker/

 

You might try a little bit of one at a time to see how it affects you.

[Arti]

@Altostrata It was the second day i reinstate 0,35mg paroxetine but also two days before i took 0,5mg tavor 

Also on that day i had very Bad feeling who i thougt it makes me tired. Also a felling what i normally cannot feel since many Month.

The day after that i feel after the 3rd Time paroxetine very Bad and the following Night was also very Bad.

 

My doctor know withdrawl but he think  it goes after few weeks like all doctors i was talking

 

I take Magnesium an fish oil since Month 

 

[Altostrata]

Quote

 It was the second day i reinstate 0,35mg paroxetine

 

Arti, why didn't you continue to take 0.35mg paroxetine?

 

I don't know what to suggest. Usually, reinstatement of a low dose works to reduce withdrawal symptoms.

 

But you have been very inconsistent in reinstatement and I can't follow whether any dose had a good effect, or if you have a distinct bad reaction from taking it.

 

Sometimes substitution of another SSRI helps, but if you had a distinct bad reaction to a very low dose of Paxil, you may have a bad reaction to the others. So I don't feel I can suggest that.

 

We don't prescribe drugs here, we more or less work with what you have already been prescribed. Many doctors will treat antidepressant withdrawal syndrome with benzodiazepines over some months. This can work, but needs to be tapered as it's possible to develop physiological dependency within 2 weeks.

[Arti]

@Altostrata i didnt Continue 0,35mg because of this reaction after taking the third Time.

Yes i had also this reaction the Weeks before also Not every after taking paroxetin but allways in die first half of the day.

I,m so confused i cannot say if al this comes From the dosis i know konstant Dosis at the same Time of the day ja essentiell.

 

Gut my feeling is i cannot tollerate paroxetin this was the recent why reducing so fast die second Time.

 

Meanwhile it become more Bad every day i have to stand up now on 5.15am look on die clock on 4.15.am

Meanwhile it is Horror cannot controll my thougt  i have scary of the thougts  my stomach contracts because of the thougts. The hearts Beats then and my breathe Speed up. I have to stand up. It is still Not better. No i took a tavor 0,5mg i cannot withstand i got Crazy because of my thougts.

 

Will this all gone or becoming better from to Time to time, nobody can Life with that i think 

I have to Go to the benzo depency. I can stand a Lot pain but madness i cannot stand.

It feels like i am in a different World more Bad more every day. 

I Ruined my Life sure. I cannot forgive this myselfe i have i Girlfriend they also cannot longer endure this.

 

Sometimes if die body try to Relax the stomach contracts or some small zap in the head and fear increase 

This happend wenn i try to Relax. In die evening afer 8pm die only Time of the day whenn i can lay a little Bit on die Coach.

As i told it is like the mind dont allows to rest.

 

Altostrata im Know this is a very Personal question. So its you Choice to aswer 

Did you had such or similar things during your withdrawl ?

 

Tanks a Lot for yor help i know i Ruined my Life with all my mistakes and you cannot heal me only my body can this.

Stay healthy!!

 

 

 

 

 

[Arti]

@Altostrata

 

Maybe if i really have Bad reaction to paroxetin and it is Not possible to Continue and it look like that 

Is it possible to tapper Dominal an stopp this

And in die otherside maybe took tavor or diazepam 0,5 morning und evening. To settle down the nervous System.

Und other question if this works und i take this for Month and den tapper slowly 

Is it possible that the damage of the paroxetin withdrawl heal in die bachgrount a little maybe in Time of the acute withdrawl? 

I expect Not that i will feel good but only to can exist at home, and paroxetin withdrawl take years so From a point after Month im have to endure it without benzo so next tapper.

 

I know you are not a doctor but do you think could this Work ?

To be honest doctors know nothing really nothing about this they tell me die Serotonin lies of the Pharma Industrie

This is last century.

 

Greatfull Greetings 

 

 

[Altostrata]

You have withdrawal syndrome from paroxetine. It can take a long time to recover. Please tell your doctor you have severe Paxil withdrawal syndrome.

[Arti]

@Altostrata i know that it can take a long Time and that scares me terrible i read a Lot of the storrys and i am schocked yes 

  

 I try to tell my doctor this.

Why i reduced so fast is i thougt i cannot tollerant paroxetin longer i thougt this fear and akhathisie was because of the paroxetin it incresed immense

In the years before 2019 also had some effects i had so big stomach problems i lost 18kg my blood was bad, i had dizzines etc.

So i think i had many years with paroxetin problems before.

Sure that was a joke compared with now and if i start this horror trip i was not good informed about it like manny,  now  i am in hell.

 

Tanks altostrata for the help !! i think Now i have to survive this however. Its a big Mountain.

I will Search a doctor who believe me it is difficult.

Maybe you can say something what you Think about die Dominal i think Now i cannot Change this. 

But maybe if it Not helps is there a Chance to reduce this still in paroxetin withdrawl 

I think its also a Problematik drugs because of the short half Life 

 

     

[Altostrata]

I would not go into detail about tapering and withdrawal with a doctor, it confuses them. I'd tell a doctor I went off paroxetine too fast, taking it again didn't work, you have severe withdrawal syndrome.

[Arti]

@Altostrata ok but what can they do for me i am at Home since 16 Month if this Odyssee Starts in Germany there is an Option that the doctor can give illnes notificatiin for another year the money then comes From different Office of the state within this time die job Rest an they cannot Kick me out. After that it is in my case Juli 2021 i will lose my Job. And yes at the Moment i think this will happen but till juli2021 i get money.  And i think ja actual doctor will give me the illnes Document.

 

 

[Arti]

@Altostrata i forgett and  i think my doctor give me every drug i tell him

[Altostrata]

Arti, I don't know the rules in Germany. I cannot follow your symptom pattern, I can't help you. I have no suggestions other than to hang in there for months and hope it goes away or ask a doctor for a low-dose benzodiazepine prescription, preferably clonazepam or diazepam.