dove: my psychiatric journey

[dove]

Oh, sorry I can´t do that because it isn´t a tablet, it is a capsule.

I think Strattera isn´t sold in tablets.

I had an appointment with this doctor in Madrid and he cancelled it, he isn´t following how I am going on. I feel he doesn´t care because he isn´t very kind when I visit him.

[Skyler]

Oh, sorry I can´t do that because it isn´t a tablet, it is a capsule.

I think Strattera isn´t sold in tablets.

I had an appointment with this doctor in Madrid and he cancelled it, he isn´t following how I am going on. I feel he doesn´t care because he isn´t very kind when I visit him.

 

Hi Dove, sorry this is so stressful. There is probably a way to deal with the capsules. I think it's easier to get off stimulants than other classes of psychotropics, though you still do need to exercise care. We will be with you while this is sorted out. More to come...

[Altostrata]

dove, you can open the Strattera capsule. Put the powder on a piece of paper. Divide the powder in half.

 

Put half back in the capsule, close it, and take it as half a dose.

 

If you want to save the other half of the powder, you can put it in an empty capsule. Read this

 

http://survivingantidepressants.org/index.php?/topic/235-tapering-techniques

[dove]

I dont know if you could answer this question but, do you think a depression can be induced by psych meds?

 

I am asking this because I am not sure if I had depression before taking them, I used to feel depressed sometimes because I didn´t have many friends at school and that stuff, but... I think that wasn´t major depression. This scares me a lot because I didn´t have real depression and now I have chronic depression (I think I am never gonna heal completely).

Psichiatry won´t care at all of course.

When I realized all medicines I tried didn´t work (tolerance)is when I started to feel maybe it wasn´t the severe depression I had, maybe the medicines had induced it to me.

[Altostrata]

Yes, medicines can cause symptoms that look like depression.

 

You may feel better and more like yourself without medication.

 

You can live without psych meds. You will have to manage any symptoms of sadness you might have, with techniques such as meditation or cognitive behavioral therapy, or finding meaning in satisfying activities like making art.

 

Many people feel sad often. It is normal.

[dove]

Please I need help, I think I am having a relapse in depression.

 

My symtoms are: great difficulty to think and concentrate, anxiety, feeling really sad, anhedonia... Today I am not hungry anymore.

I feel really sad and I have difficulty in starting doing things...this is terrible because I spent three months in which these symtoms had gone away as I had told you.

This week I felt one day worse than the other, I continue taking Strattera every other day so...

I also have some physical symtoms: urinating frequently, shivering and lack of appetite as I said, are these normal? I need advise.

[Altostrata]

Did you decrease the Strattera? Is your sleep still disturbed on the days you take it?

 

It sounds like you are either ill or having some kind of reaction to drugs.

[annej]

Hi dove and welcome!

 

I was on "legal speed" (Brand: Adderral Generic: detroamphetamine salts) from 2009 until April 2011. It worked "too well" in my case and caused me to become hypomanic. I did not have any sleep problems because I was on several sedating drugs; Seroquel, Remeron, and Klonopin. It stopped "working" because one builds tolerance to stimulants.

 

My doctor cold turkeyed me off the Adderral (along with several other drugs). The only problem I had with coming off the Adderal was extreme fatigue (slept for a week) and HUNGER.

 

I like Alto's taper suggestion. Please keep us posted. Hugs, Annej

[dove]

No, I haven´t decreased strattera, I am still taking it every other day.

My sleep is always disturbed! This night I woke up at 5 in the morning and I had to take melatonine to get back to sleep.

I am so tired of taking Strattera, it didn´t work much at the beginning but now I am afraid it is doing nothing at all.

It seems like my brain has stuggled heal but it couln´t because Strattera isn´t making any effect, what do you think I should do?

[annej]

No, I haven´t decreased strattera, I am still taking it every other day.

My sleep is always disturbed! This night I woke up at 5 in the morning and I had to take melatonine to get back to sleep.

I am so tired of taking Strattera, it didn´t work much at the beginning but now I am afraid it is doing nothing at all.

It seems like my brain has struggled to heal but it couln´t because Strattera isn´t making any effect, what do you think I should do?

 

Hi dove,

 

It sounds like your brain has done a lot of healing.

 

Alto has given you very good suggestions as to how to taper off of the Strattera, if this is what you would like to do.

 

What are your thoughts as to Alto's suggestion on how to taper off of Strattera? Hugs, Annej

[Altostrata]

dove, I suggested cutting your Strattera dosage in half.

[dove]

But do you thing I should start another medication? The symtoms are so severe that sometimes I can´t stand them... I have severe anhedonia and emotional indifference.

My appetite has decreased a lot also and you know what is happening to my sleep... how much could this last?

[dove]

I think this has nothing to do with Strattera, it is Solian, I think I am addicted to it because sometimes I can´t get it out of my head...

[Skyler]

I think this has nothing to do with Strattera, it is Solian, I think I am addicted to it because sometimes I can´t get it out of my head...

 

Dove, could you put your drug history in your sig line? It's hard to give you a complete answer otherwise. link Thanks ~S

[dove]

Now I am experiencing something really weird, I am having one day almost fine and the next one horrible.

Could this be related to waves and windows? I am scared because I don´t know what to expect next day...

Today I am having a fine day but in the bad days symtoms can be so severe, for example yesterday I wasn´t able to eat until late in the night and there have been nights I didn´t sleep at all, I can spend the whole day lying on the sofa without doing nothing because I don´t have the energy to do so. Suicidal thoughts have hopefully gone away.

I think both Solian and Strattera have done a lot of harm to me.

My family tell me to take Strattera but I just don´t want to, have you heard cases like mine? This kind of symtoms are normal?

[Skyler]

But do you thing I should start another medication? The symtoms are so severe that sometimes I can´t stand them... I have severe anhedonia and emotional indifference.

My appetite has decreased a lot also and you know what is happening to my sleep... how much could this last?

 

Dove, I'm very sorry to hear you are feeling so distressed. Do you think you may be depressed other than withdrawal? The lack of appetite.. some of the symptoms you describe sound suspicious. Depression is surely miserable but does tend to subside.. problem is, the stress you describe would make any depression worse. What are the thoughts you have about taking Solian like, they sound obsessive, could these be related to feeling depressed. How do you think you would benefit from taking Solian?

 

ALSO Are you still taking Strattera every other day, do your symptoms tend to occur on that day, or the off day with any regularity. I would have had an adverse reaction to Ritalin had I taken it every other day. You mention keeping a journal.. what do the entries indicate? ~S

 

THANKS FOR THE SIG LINE!!

[Altostrata]

But do you thing I should start another medication? The symtoms are so severe that sometimes I can´t stand them... I have severe anhedonia and emotional indifference.

My appetite has decreased a lot also and you know what is happening to my sleep... how much could this last?

 

dove, are you still taking Solian?

 

The severe anhedonia and emotional indifference may be because of all the different drug withdrawals you've experienced. Is so, this will get better in time. You must be strong and patient.

 

I cannot see how taking Strattera or Solian would help with severe anhedonia and emotional indifference.

[dove]

No, I left Solian three years ago as prescribed by the doctor I went to. He made me cut the dose in two weeks, I went from 200, then 150-100-50.

When I reached the 50 mg I started to feel ill, specially nausea and stomachache. This symtoms lasted TWO MONTHS and then depression came back.

I think I have protracted withdrawal syndrome since beginning of 2009.

[Altostrata]

I think I have protracted withdrawal syndrome since beginning of 2009.

 

That is possible, or your nervous system might have been sensitized from all the different drugs. It needs to rest.

[dove]

Hi, I just wanted to keep you informed about my current situation.

I finally left Strattera as the doctor told me to do and he prescribed me 4mg of reboxetine, I have been taking it for more than a month and I have not clearly improved, I am still having what you here call "waves and windows" some days I feel quite normal and other ones I still feel really depressed, the windows are getting better but I still have this pattern with the new medication. Do you know something about this antidepressant? Why can I still have waves with it? Can it be related to tolerance?

[Altostrata]

You have waves and windows because your nervous system was injured by going on and off drugs.

 

The reboxetine is not helping.

[Jemima]

I'd never heard of your drug, so I looked it up. You might find these two articles enlightening:

 

http://blogs.scientificamerican.com/guest-blog/2010/11/30/the-antidepressant-reboxetine-a-headdesk-moment-in-science/

 

http://pipeline.corante.com/archives/2011/01/17/reboxetine_doesnt_work_but_thats_not_the_real_problem.php

 

I'm just guessing, but it struck me that you may be going through withdrawal because Reboxetine doesn't work.

[dove]

I just wanted to say hi as I am afraid I am dealing with withdrawal issues again.

I will try to explain, last year I decided (mainly persuaded by my family) that it Was time for a change in my life, so I started doing some activities, I went to English classes in an academy twice a week and also to singing lessons. When I had ben some time doing them I felt that suddenly medication stopped working again (tolerance) I went through a lot of suffering which I am still at but I managed to finish them, a thing that I hadn't been able to do until now. I went to the doctor a few days ago and he told me to increase the dose of reboxetine when I told him it wasn' t working enough for me. So this year I have started english lessons again, and I feel I have even more difficulties than last year in dealing with it, I find it hard to concentrate, I feel really depressed, I get crying spells etc.

In this situation I feel I can' t keep going on, what do you advise me to do? I am afraid that a bigger dose of reboxetine won't benefit me at all as I have read here. Does this mean that my nervous system isn' t prepared to deal with even this light activities?

[mammaP]

Hi Dove, it does sound like you are having side effects from reboxetine, it has a paradoxical

effect on you which means it is causing the very same symptoms it is meant to help. 

 

I think I would start to taper the reboxetine if you are wanting to get off the drugs altogether. 

Side effects are dose related and you could feel better as the dose gets lower. If you decide to

taper then we would recommend tapering 10% of the current  dose every 4 weeks.

Increasing  the dose may make you feel even worse. 

 

Well done for taking the lessons, you have done such a lot and you should be very proud of yourself.

Singing is especially good because it is very therapeutic. English is a very difficult language to learn,

one of the hardest in the world so you've done really well to carry on with it when you don't feel good.

[Petunia]

Hi Dove,

I'm sorry to hear that you are feeling unwell again.  Well done for staying with your studies even though you were not well.   I agree with the advice MammaP suggested.  You will probably start to feel better as you reduce your dose of reboxetine.

 

Studies have shown that reboxetine is ineffective as an antidepressant, that's why it isn't approved for use in the US.  But it does have a long list of potential side effects:

 

• Headache
• Lack or loss of appetite
• Agitation, anxiety
• Dizziness, paraesthesia (pins and needles), inability to sit or stand still, altered
taste sensation
• Lack of visual focus
• Increased heart rate, palpitation (heart pounding)
• Widened blood vessels, fall in blood pressure when standing up, increased blood
pressure
• Vomiting
• Rash
• Sensation of incomplete emptying or slowed emptying of the bladder, urinary
infection, painful urination, inability to completely empty the bladder
• Erectile dysfunction (impotence), ejaculatory pain, or ejaculatory delay
• Chills
• Spinning sensation
After marketing reboxetine, the following side effects have been reported:
• Hyponatremia (very low levels of sodium in the blood)
• Aggressive behaviour, hallucination
• Suicidal ideation, suicidal behaviour
Cases of suicidal ideation and suicidal behaviours have been reported during
reboxetine therapy or early after treatment discontinuation (see section 2 “Take
special care with Edronax”)
• Cold extremities, Raynaud’s phenomenon (poor blood circulation to the extremities
usually in the toes and fingers but could also affect nose and ears, the skin turns
pale and becomes cold and numb)
• Allergic skin inflammation
• Testicular pain
• Irritability

 

taken from the package insert here:

 

http://www.drugs.com/uk/edronax-4mg-tablets-spc-4205.html

 

Conclusions from this study  state:  Reboxetine is, overall, an ineffective and potentially harmful antidepressant. Published evidence is affected by publication bias, underlining the urgent need for mandatory publication of trial data.

 

Here is a link to our general tapering section, with important information if you do decide to come off it:

 

http://survivingantidepressants.org/index.php?/topic/300-important-topics-in-the-tapering-forum-and-faq/

 

If you have any questions or problems, please let us know.

 

Petu.

[dove]

I haven' t posted for a long time, but now that I am dealing with withdrawal issues again, I feel its time to do it again.

First of all I would life to say that Christmas is the time when I have felt worst for the past years and this one is not an exception.

This "relapse" has been different from many others as it has mainly started with physical symtoms and a kind of anguish as long as all the other depressive symtoms.

[tgirl]

Hello Dove,

Welcome back!

I'm sorry to hear your not feeling well.

Christmas is a rough time for all of us.

I hope one of the moderators will be along shortly to help you.

just wanted to say hello!

Tgirl

[dove]

What do you advise me to do, should I stop taking Reboxetine and switch to another antidepressant?

[cymbaltawithdrawal5600]

Hi dove,

 

I hunted up your original topic and merged your recent post into it. You may wish to bookmark it so you can find it again.

 

It is not clear from your signature that you had been taking Reboxetine. Would you tell us in more detail what dose you are taking and when you started on it? We do not, as a rule, ever advise people on 'switching to another antidepressant', but we can work with you on what you are currently prescribed.

[Petunia]

Hi Dove,

As CW noted, we need more of an update about your current history, in the meantime, you may find this link interesting:

 

Reboxetine: More side effects, but no antidepressant benefit at all.

 

If you decide to come off the Reboxetine, you still need to taper.

[dove]

I need your advise please, I am experiencing something weird.

I have some days in which I feel Almost normal ( not euphoric or maniac) and others I feel really depressed, I mean with moderate depression.

I am really worried because next year I Have to start English lessons again, and I feel I don't have the strength, what should I do? My family tries to force me to continue going to class.

[Petunia]

Hi Dove,

I moved your new post from the symptoms section to your own thread because the question is related to your situation in general rather than a specific symptom.  If we keep all updates and new information together in one place its easier to offer suggestions.

 

Please read the recent new replies and provide and update of your history. 

 

This thread may be helpful regarding your question:

 

The Windows and Waves Pattern of Recovery

[dove]

Looking at the question about switching to another antidepressant now sounds ridicule to me, because that means I could have fallen into a trap, the trap of needing a pill to feel better.

And now I have learned that the drugs have been in fact my problem, I just want to leave Reboxetine because I feel it is not working anymore (if it ever did) and what is worse, IT IS MAKING MORE HARM than good because the side effects I had at the beginning are increasing ( the worst are the lack of appetite and the weight loss).

Now it has been two years since I started taking reboxetine, I think it was on September 2012.

I suppose that the second question could be related to waves and windows which I had experienced before.

[Petunia]

Dove, please would you add Reboxetine to your signature, when you started it and the dose that you are on.

 

If you are going to stop taking it, you will need to taper carefully.  We don't have a topic for tapering Reboxetine, but I suggest you use the 10% method we recommend for similar drugs.  Please see:

 

Why taper by 10% of my dosage?
The general philosophy of gradual tapering

[dove]

I have decided to write a new post because I have read about withdrawal and I think I have reached What is called WDnormal.

I don’t need the drugs anymore, and I feel neither good nor bad. 

That I don’t need the drugs anymore doesn’t mean I don’t take them, as I am forced to do so, both by my parents and doctor.

[dove]

Does  WDnormal really exist?