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RM123: In need of help

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RM123
11 minutes ago, Altostrata said:

 

Please clarify.

 

Do you use the computer at night?

 

I need to see TIMES OF DAY (o'clock) attached to your symptom pattern, in daily notes.

 

 

^This appears to be a recent small improvement.

 

It appears you're not getting enough sleep -- I very much sympathize -- but it's not absolute and appears to be repairing. We expect very gradual improvement in withdrawal syndrome, over weeks or months.

 

I need to see those daily notes, including sleep pattern and when you take melatonin. Please post them in this topic, at least 24 hours at a time.

 

 

How's the bloating? If irregular heartbeats have gone away, that's an improvement, correct? How did this symptom resolve?

I’m thinking of smoking CBD. 

 

I forgot to say I’m also taking lysine, NAC, immanence, echinacea all for my immune system. 
 

I take melatonin as stated but thinking of adding in Niacimanide (vit b3) as per the link someone posted above. 
 

I answered about computer in other post. 
 

The only symptoms I have are bloating which is constant and lack of sleep which is at night. I forgot to say I’m extremely anxious and the morning and that carried on until I try and sleep. So don’t know how to give you times of day for those. To keep track would be a nightmare for me if i had other symptoms. For instance 1:34 anxious, 2.29 palpitations, 3:12 bloating. It’s just too overwhelming. 

 

I also take all supplement 30mins before bed which is usually 11pm including melatonin. 
 


Please do know I appreciate you trying to help. But as stated above the symptoms never leave they stay throughout. 

 

I can’t seem to find “this topic” is is a form I use to fill out? 

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Altostrata

I need to see those daily notes with drug and supplement schedule with symptoms before and after you take each drug or supplement plus throughout the day or night.

 

Here are instructions for the simple list format we expect for daily notes:

 

NAC can cause stomach upset, if I were you, I'd stop taking it. If they're not clearly helping, I would stop taking the other supplements.

 

4 minutes ago, RM123 said:

I forgot to say I’m extremely anxious and the morning and that carried on until I try and sleep.

 

Do you have a peak of anxiety in the morning? What time of day does this occur? See Waking with panic or anxiety -- managing cortisol spikes

 

Also see

 

Tips to help sleep -- so many of us have that awful withdrawal insomnia

 

Path to Better Sleep FREE online for everyone from the US Veterans Administration

 

Music for self-care: Calms hyperalertness, anxiety, aids relaxation and sleep

 

What is the sleep cycle?

 

Melatonin for sleep: Many people find it helpful

 

TV or computer use in evening can disrupt sleep: Bright light signals the brain that it's daytime

 

These links will give you plenty of tips to improve your sleep. If you don't wish to supply daily notes, our ability to answer questions about what you should do is very limited.

 

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RM123
14 minutes ago, Altostrata said:

 

Since daily notes are our main way of getting information for an educated guess, if you can't supply them, our ability to help is limited. You have to help us to help you.

 

You appear to be slowly recovering in the usual frustrating pattern that's normal for withdrawal syndrome recovery. If you're unable to supply daily notes, you'll have to be patient and let nature take its course.

 

Many people find fish oil and magnesium supplements helpful, see
https://survivingantidepressants.org/index.php?/topic/36-king-of-supplements-omega-3-fatty-acids-fish-oil/
https://survivingantidepressants.org/topic/15483-magnesium-natures-calcium-channel-blocker/

 

You might try a little bit of one at a time to see how it affects you.

How do I do daily notes. Like I don’t even know when symptoms arise as they are always there. 
 

I appreciate everyone’s help on here, I really do. 
 

I am taking 400mg mag gly which I worked up to and worked up to 20000mg fish oil 

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RM123
9 minutes ago, Altostrata said:

I need to see those daily notes with drug and supplement schedule with symptoms before and after you take each drug or supplement plus throughout the day or night.

 

Here are instructions for the simple list format we expect for daily notes:

 

NAC can cause stomach upset, if I were you, I'd stop taking it. If they're not clearly helping, I would stop taking the other supplements.

 

 

Do you have a peak of anxiety in the morning? What time of day does this occur? See Waking with panic or anxiety -- managing cortisol spikes

 

Also see

 

Tips to help sleep -- so many of us have that awful withdrawal insomnia

 

Path to Better Sleep FREE online for everyone from the US Veterans Administration

 

Music for self-care: Calms hyperalertness, anxiety, aids relaxation and sleep

 

What is the sleep cycle?

 

Melatonin for sleep: Many people find it helpful

 

TV or computer use in evening can disrupt sleep: Bright light signals the brain that it's daytime

 

These links will give you plenty of tips to improve your sleep. If you don't wish to supply daily notes, our ability to answer questions about what you should do is very limited.

 

I will see with what I can do with a diary. But from what I noticed. I don’t notice any symptoms as they are persistent throughout the day.  I will try my best. 

 

Anxiety is strong in the morning but tbh that strength last throughout the day. Sometime it eases off in the day. I’m not sure.

 

I haven’t I have been takin NAC for a long time even after withdrawl and it didn’t cause me bloating. The bloating just happened months after withdrawl. 
 

So you recommend to stop all those supplements? I’m worried about my immune system.

 

If I’m not sleeping I need all the nutrients I can get? my diet has been the best either lately. 
 

 

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RM123

Should I try Niacinamide (vit b3) with melatonin?

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RM123

Im thinking of takin Temezepam tonight and zopiclone tmrw to see if that stops my insomnia and brings back my sleep pattern 

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Altostrata
4 hours ago, RM123 said:

Im thinking of takin Temezepam tonight and zopiclone tmrw to see if that stops my insomnia and brings back my sleep pattern 

 

As this is a site for going off drugs, we generally don't recommend adding drugs. These may or may not work for you. They may upset the apple cart. We can't advise you or predict what will happen.

 

What is it you'd like to get from this site? You seem to be gradually improving. We don't have any instant fixes, anything we'd suggest would be incremental improvement.

 

Still need to see those daily notes!

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Ripley

Hi RM123

 

Please try to write up your daily notes so Alto can get the information she needs to advise you. It's probably the most helpful thing you can do for yourself right now. I've seen examples go something like this:

 

6.am Wake up

7.30am Take Lexapro 2.5mg

8.30am Stomach upset

10am Felt anxious

Etc.

 

Try to write a few words every couple of hours throughout the day.

 

Also, it's good news that your ectopic heart beats have settled. And that you can go back to sleep after waking - I could not do that for ages. Good signs.

 

You say you stop working on your computer an hour before bed. I have found that I can get a night of insomnia when I've been on the computer over 2 hours before bed! Seriously. I now just don't go on in the evenings or stop 3 or 4 hours before bed. Perhaps you could move your work to earlier in the day and have a total break in the evenings. Worth a try. (I have no problem watching tv though, perhaps because it's more passive.)

 

Also, Mirtazapine liquid is available in the UK although I know it's much more expensive than the tablets so my doctor was less keen to prescribe it - but you could explain it's for tapering off. You can also get dispersable tablets which can be dissolved in water (they're cheap so you'd have no problems getting those I'm sure). 

 

Did you take a zopiclone or temazapam last night? 

 

Best wishes,

Ripley

 

 

 

 

 

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Ripley

Ps  Cross tapering is when you gradually move from pills to liquid (or whatever) rather than an abrupt change. There's advice on this site about it. 

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Shebon

RM:  you will get to sleep with temazepam and zopiclone but know that temazepam is a benzo and addictive as well as zopiclone.  

 

It will take a length of time to restabilize on the mirt at 7.5 mg. and you don't want to add in other addictive meds.  

 

Hold your course....things will improve.

Shebon

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RM123

The thought of giving up and not having to go through this insomnia makes me feel happy and at peace

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Rozon1

hey @RM123 I'm in the same mind set as you are right now. I'm tired of doing this. Not going through my symptoms makes me feel happy and at peace but it scares me too. I don't want to leave yet. I want to keep fighting to see if I get any better. Let's keep going for each other, okay?

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RM123

@Rozon1 thanks for your reply. It’s appreciated. I don’t how much longer I can keep going. It’s been 6months if 1-2hrs broken sleep. This insomnia has made me so upset and depressed. I absolutely hate this. This is not quality of life. At all. I’m suffering everyday. This is killing me. Life is not even enjoyable. 
 

how long have you been not sleeping for? I just feel like this will go on for a long time 

 

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RM123

I don’t know how much longer I can live with this misery 

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senseless

Hi RM,

Just wanted to drop by say that i understand your pain. Chronic insomnia has got to be the most horrible experience a human can endure. 

 

I completely understand why you would want to end your life, i myself contemplate it too daily just so i can have relief.

But there is a couple facts that keep me going, which i think you too should consider.

First of all once you are dead you wont be able to experience anything, including relief from you suffering. 

Secondly being dead rids you of your situation ever improving, which it always could!
 

You truly do not know what lies ahead in the future, whether that includes your sleep eventually returning naturally.

Or the invention of medication that cures insomnia with no adverse side effects. 

A promising medication Lemborexant, has been approved by the FDA for long term treatment of insomnia. Does not show any adverse effects or tolerance build up and more efficient than ambien. 


Im not saying this is the cure, but more my point is that science is tirelessly working on a treatment/cure for insomnia.

 

There is always hope my friend dont give up.

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Shebon

Hi RM:

A 1/2 tablet of Unisom at bedtime might help you get to sleep.  This is my "go to" for insomnia right now as I taper.  

 

You are at 7.5 mg. Remeron right now?  Restabilizing takes awhile and how long is anyone's guess.  Are you able to get some nitely sleep?  How about naps during the day?  

 

Please don't give up.....things will get better.....

Best to you,

Shebon

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Melissa03

CT of Prozac might be the reason of insomnia too,have you tried reinstating tiny amount of Prozac too to see if it helps,if moderators think thats good idea?

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nipsu

Melissa I dont believe thats good idea to reinstate with Prozac. It has been 7 months since he last time took Prozac.  I also believe that CT:ing prozac is cause of his current insomnia. CT:ing wellbutrin caused me similar kind of insomnia as RM123 has now. Insomnia didnt start the day i cted wellbutrin. After 2-3 months i noticed my sleep started to gradually get worser. I slept 0-4 hours every night. My insomnia lasted 1.5 years and now i am sleeping 7-8 hours every night. I still feel that i have brainfog, anxiety and depression so i am not fully recovered. I cant say how long it takes to recover from insomnia but i t takes time and most likely it will get progressively better not suddenly.

 

Have you noticed any improvement in your sleep quality or quantity during your insomnia? Do you see progress? Have you had days when you have slept better? What did you do in those days you slept better? Maybe you should keep some kind of diary where you write about your day, nutrition and medication. Also write there about your thoughts and how did you feel during day. Try to keep it simple so you can easily check your diary and notice if you have had progress. At the end of each day rate your day from 1 - 10.

 

Take one day at a time. You will overcome this.

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RM123
On 4/23/2020 at 3:00 PM, senseless said:

Hi RM,

Just wanted to drop by say that i understand your pain. Chronic insomnia has got to be the most horrible experience a human can endure. 

 

I completely understand why you would want to end your life, i myself contemplate it too daily just so i can have relief.

But there is a couple facts that keep me going, which i think you too should consider.

First of all once you are dead you wont be able to experience anything, including relief from you suffering. 

Secondly being dead rids you of your situation ever improving, which it always could!
 

You truly do not know what lies ahead in the future, whether that includes your sleep eventually returning naturally.

Or the invention of medication that cures insomnia with no adverse side effects. 

A promising medication Lemborexant, has been approved by the FDA for long term treatment of insomnia. Does not show any adverse effects or tolerance build up and more efficient than ambien. 


Im not saying this is the cure, but more my point is that science is tirelessly working on a treatment/cure for insomnia.

 

There is always hope my friend dont give up.

Thanks for your reply. It means a lot. It’s absolutely torture. It’s the worse thing ever. It has literally made every aspect of my life crap. 
 

I want to do anything to get back to sleep again and I’m so tempted to take sleeping pills. The on you mentioned sounds promising but what will it to do me. Will it make me “lifeless” etc. And to have to taper it. 
 

I’m sorry to hear you contemplate it too. You’re right about all those things about being dead. 
 

I really don’t want to give up. And I’m scared of every ending it. But I just don’t know to live like this anymore. 

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RM123
On 4/23/2020 at 9:50 PM, Shebon said:

Hi RM:

A 1/2 tablet of Unisom at bedtime might help you get to sleep.  This is my "go to" for insomnia right now as I taper.  

 

You are at 7.5 mg. Remeron right now?  Restabilizing takes awhile and how long is anyone's guess.  Are you able to get some nitely sleep?  How about naps during the day?  

 

Please don't give up.....things will get better.....

Best to you,

Shebon

Unisom or any OTC sleep med does not even touch me. I need 80mg of temezepam just to knock me out. But when I use those I can’t sleep for a week at all. 
 

I’m holding at 7.5mg but I’m breaking the tabs in half and not sure each half is the correct dose. 

 

I sleep about 1-2hrs. It horrendous. It’s affected me so much. Weight, anxiety, depression, cognitive ability. I can’t even nap in the day. My mind won’t allow me. 
 

I don’t want to give up but this is hell. 

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RM123
On 4/24/2020 at 7:57 AM, nipsu said:

Melissa I dont believe thats good idea to reinstate with Prozac. It has been 7 months since he last time took Prozac.  I also believe that CT:ing prozac is cause of his current insomnia. CT:ing wellbutrin caused me similar kind of insomnia as RM123 has now. Insomnia didnt start the day i cted wellbutrin. After 2-3 months i noticed my sleep started to gradually get worser. I slept 0-4 hours every night. My insomnia lasted 1.5 years and now i am sleeping 7-8 hours every night. I still feel that i have brainfog, anxiety and depression so i am not fully recovered. I cant say how long it takes to recover from insomnia but i t takes time and most likely it will get progressively better not suddenly.

 

Have you noticed any improvement in your sleep quality or quantity during your insomnia? Do you see progress? Have you had days when you have slept better? What did you do in those days you slept better? Maybe you should keep some kind of diary where you write about your day, nutrition and medication. Also write there about your thoughts and how did you feel during day. Try to keep it simple so you can easily check your diary and notice if you have had progress. At the end of each day rate your day from 1 - 10.

 

Take one day at a time. You will overcome this.

Nipsu I happy to hear you are sleeping 8hrs now. How did you get to that? I’m really not sure if I have noticed improvements. I think one day out of a month I may get more than 1-2hrs sleep. 
 

Im just tired of this. I can’t live a normal life. If I just had my sleep. I could handle anything better. 
 

Thanks for the suggestions. 

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Shebon

RM:

 

Are you taking any night time supplements?  These can also cause insomnia while in withdrawal.  I take my calcium and magnesium in the a.m. as it does not work to take it with dinner.  I think the Remeron needs to be fully absorbed into the system without any supplement blocking it.  I discovered this many times.  

 

Also, caffeine and high carbs foods at dinner time will also rev up your symptoms.  I have to have some protein with dinner and stay far, far away from anything with MSG.  

 

You will start sleeping again.....The reason you didn't have insomnia after you stopped the Prozac is due to the very long half life of the drug.  It can take a few months to wash out of your system.  You might want to ask a moderator about reinstating a small dose of Prozac; maybe 5 mg. or less?  The important thing is to make this manageable for you as soon as possible.  

 

I would say that 80 mg. of Temezepam is a most high, high dose.  Please do not take that much again.  And please do not add any alcohol into the mix.  

 

Please stay in touch....we want to help you as much as possible with support and care.

Best regards,

Shebon

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nipsu

I noticed most improvement in my sleep when i had taken vitamin D 100 mikrograms for about month. I reduced the dose to 50 mikrograms at the start of this month. I also have noticed that my skin is getting alot better and i look younger and better. I thought i will get permanent wrinkles and dark circles because of insomnia but when my sleep has improved my skin had also became better.

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RM123
2 hours ago, nipsu said:

I noticed most improvement in my sleep when i had taken vitamin D 100 mikrograms for about month. I reduced the dose to 50 mikrograms at the start of this month. I also have noticed that my skin is getting alot better and i look younger and better. I thought i will get permanent wrinkles and dark circles because of insomnia but when my sleep has improved my skin had also became better.

Thanks. When do you take it?

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nipsu

I take it everyday in the morning. It takes time to raise vitamin D levels in your body. Taking 100 micrograms every day will raise it quicker than taking 50 micrograms. Maximium recommended dose is 100 micrograms everyday so this dosage is completely safe for most of people. Vitamin D also promotes good immunity, bone health, skin health and reduces cancer risk. If you dont see any improvement in your sleep after a month when you started vitamin D supplementation keep pause from it or lower dosage to 50 mikrograms/day. I currently take 50 mikrograms every day.

 

If you can check your vitamin D levels in lab, do it so you can see if you have defiency from it.

 

I also recommend to take some vacation from school. 

 

Being deficient in vitamin D can lead to a host of sleep issues, including sleep disruption, insomnia, and overall poor sleep quality. "A deficiency in Vitamin D has been associated with many changes in sleep such as fewer sleeping hours, and sleep that is less restful and restorative," 

 

Source: https://www.insider.com/how-vitamin-d-affects-sleep-2019-2

 

https://www.express.co.uk/life-style/health/1062825/vitamin-D-deficiency-low-UK-adults-lack-essential-vitamin

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RM123

I have so much anxiety everyday. I gained so much weight. 
 

I really just want to drop off the 7.5mg mirtzapine and be down with it. 

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nipsu

Did you start vitamin D supplementation? Maybe it would be time to reduce your mirtazapine dosage. I recommend that you wean off slowly from it. I have reduced dose 10% every month and i am currently taking 1.65 mg of it everyday. I hope you get better soon.

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RM123
On 6/4/2020 at 10:13 AM, nipsu said:

Did you start vitamin D supplementation? Maybe it would be time to reduce your mirtazapine dosage. I recommend that you wean off slowly from it. I have reduced dose 10% every month and i am currently taking 1.65 mg of it everyday. I hope you get better soon.

No not yet because it can disrupt my sleep. How have you reduced? What method? 

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RM123

Can anyone help with anxiety? I’m waking up everyday with extreme anxiety and last throughout the day. 
 

Do I need to go back on medication? I really don’t want to but this anxiety affects me. I’m procrastinating on important things :( 

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ChessieCat
Posted (edited)

Please note that I have not read through your topic.

 

I find that magnesium helps my anxiety.  It is best taken throughout the day.  On several occasions I have run out of magnesium and my anxiety increased.  When I resumed taking it my anxiety lessened.

 

When introducing anything new try a small amount and only try one thing at a time: 

 

the-rule-of-3kis-keep-it-simple-keep-it-slow-keep-it-stable

 

The only supplements that SA recommends are:

 

Magnesium

 

Omega-3 Fish Oil

 

SA also strongly encourages members to learn and use Non-drug techniques to cope

 

See also:  the-dr-claire-weekes-method-of-recovering-from-a-sensitized-nervous-system

 

 

Edited by ChessieCat

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mstimc
52 minutes ago, RM123 said:

Can anyone help with anxiety? I’m waking up everyday with extreme anxiety and last throughout the day. 
 

Do I need to go back on medication? I really don’t want to but this anxiety affects me. I’m procrastinating on important things :( 

Good Morning, RM

 

Morning anxiety is a common and aggravating problem with many of us, including me.  Once it hits you, its very difficult to deal with it for the rest of the day.  Many of us think its due to a spike in cortisol as you wake up.  

 

I've learned to read the signs when it begins to hit me in the morning.  I can feel my heart begin to race and my thoughts speed up till they're almost overwhelming.  When I get that feeling, I try to focus my thoughts on calming thoughts, such as memories of a favorite vacation, or even scenes and dialogues from a favorite movie--anything to switch my racing thoughts off and get my heart rate down.  I focus on my breathing to make sure I'm not hyperventilating and increasing my heart rate.  Sometimes I say calming words to myself, "peace" and "rest" to help quiet the thoughts. I also tell myself this is just my body experiencing a hormonal spike that will pass fairly quickly if I let it.  

 

Morning anxiety is awful but its transitory...

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senseless

Hows your sleep RM?

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RM123
4 hours ago, ChessieCat said:

Please note that I have not read through your topic.

 

I find that magnesium helps my anxiety.  It is best taken throughout the day.  On several occasions I have run out of magnesium and my anxiety increased.  When I resumed taking it my anxiety lessened.

 

When introducing anything new try a small amount and only try one thing at a time: 

 

the-rule-of-3kis-keep-it-simple-keep-it-slow-keep-it-stable

 

The only supplements that SA recommends are:

 

Magnesium

 

Omega-3 Fish Oil

 

SA also strongly encourages members to learn and use Non-drug techniques to cope

 

See also:  the-dr-claire-weekes-method-of-recovering-from-a-sensitized-nervous-system

 

 

Hi thanks for your reply. Yes I have been on magnesium 4 x a day and I find it helps. I’m also taking fish oil as well. 

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RM123
4 hours ago, mstimc said:

Good Morning, RM

 

Morning anxiety is a common and aggravating problem with many of us, including me.  Once it hits you, its very difficult to deal with it for the rest of the day.  Many of us think its due to a spike in cortisol as you wake up.  

 

I've learned to read the signs when it begins to hit me in the morning.  I can feel my heart begin to race and my thoughts speed up till they're almost overwhelming.  When I get that feeling, I try to focus my thoughts on calming thoughts, such as memories of a favorite vacation, or even scenes and dialogues from a favorite movie--anything to switch my racing thoughts off and get my heart rate down.  I focus on my breathing to make sure I'm not hyperventilating and increasing my heart rate.  Sometimes I say calming words to myself, "peace" and "rest" to help quiet the thoughts. I also tell myself this is just my body experiencing a hormonal spike that will pass fairly quickly if I let it.  

 

Morning anxiety is awful but its transitory...

Thanks for your reply. Yes morning anxiety is horrible. It stays with me sometimes throughout the whole day. Some days I might a get a few hrs break from it. 
 

I’m just anxious right now about getting and job and doing well for interview. I feel so unprepared and lost with it, it causes me anxiety. I really want to work for what I trained for. 
 

Thanks for sharing those tips with me. I will try them out myself. Like I said just really anxious about landing the job. 

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RM123
10 minutes ago, senseless said:

Hows your sleep RM?

Hey @senseless

 

Actually I think my sleep has improved! It’s still not the best but has gotten better. 
 

Over the last three weeks:


Most nights I’m getting at least 4hrs now before I wake up but I am able to sleep again after. 
 

Some nights I think, I get 6hrs of sleep and able to sleep again after. 
 

However a few nights last weeks only managed 2hrs sleep and clunky get back to sleep after. 
 

I really just want to drop off 7.5mg and be done with it. I should of never went back on. I don’t know what to do 

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senseless
10 minutes ago, RM123 said:

Hey @senseless

 

Actually I think my sleep has improved! It’s still not the best but has gotten better. 
 

Over the last three weeks:


Most nights I’m getting at least 4hrs now before I wake up but I am able to sleep again after. 
 

Some nights I think, I get 6hrs of sleep and able to sleep again after. 
 

However a few nights last weeks only managed 2hrs sleep and clunky get back to sleep after. 
 

I really just want to drop off 7.5mg and be done with it. I should of never went back on. I don’t know what to do 

 

Wow i'm so happy for you! That must make such a huge difference!

 

I know how you feel, i just want to be of seroquel too because it makes me so lethargic and lazy.

 

But we cant rush these things, that's what got us here in the first place.

 

Keep your head up :)

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