Iman: weaning off nortriptyline, withdrawal battlefield

[ADWarrior]

Hi @Iman

thank you for the update. I am sorry to hear that you had a tough luck with your health and couldn't continue with the deduction of your medication. I have been holding since my last cut since October 2021 hoping to stabilize but I have a feeling I went too fast and now my body needs longer to heal. 

All I can say please take it slowly and listen to your body. There is no faster or better way just go slowly. 

I am looking forward to hearing from you about your progress  

 

[Iman]

@Altostratathanks for asking dear Alto. i'm doing way better now,  thankfully I managed to sail through all the ailments and the key thing i believe was that I held my dose for 6 months. i'm now feeling ready to ride the tapering boat once again. 

 

@ChessieCata perfectly wise piece of advice. i'll go ahead with a 1 percent reduction try tonight. good thing is i'm now perfectly used to liquid Nortriptyline in distilled water. thanks for the heads up. 👍🏻

 

@ADWarriorADWarrior

good to hear u're making a sane choice of holding your dose to let your body catch up.  holding when necessary is the key thing to avoid unnecessary suffering although i know quite well that the side effects of taking the drug is bothersome enough but still way better than hellish withdrawal from fast and untimely tapering. u're a wise man and will make to the finish line safe and sound. 

[Iman]

@Altostrata @ChessieCat @ADWarrior

 

Hello everyone

 

It's been almost 4 months since my last post here. Thought it'd be wise to leave an update on how i've been doing. The liquid taper has become smooth and quite manageable for me as I've been able to anticipate the pattern of symptoms as well as their frequency and length. I also have the necessary tools (especially the nondrug ones) at hand to handle the symptoms with minimum of fuss. I'm now on 7 mg sharp and plan to go for another 10 percent reduction in a few days. Sadly though i've come across a wholly new symptom during the past 2 months. I had a chirrping tinnitus in my left ear from the very moment i took Nori poison almost 4.5 years ago. It was a misery for the first few months but i managed to get habituated to it and even developed a liking for it (i even sleep to it sometimes) after a while. However, 3 months ago i felt there's a loud irregular thumping tinnitus in my left ear next to the chirrping ones but much louder as if there's something moving in my ear producing popping sounds. It stopped the day after. After a few days it reappeared and lasted for 5 hours and then stopped again. Several days after it happened again and abated a day after. Cut a long story short, the popping tinnitus got extended in its length and is now showing no sign of abating and is present most hours of the day and night. It gave me a few sleep deprived nights but once again i managed to get myself used to it. It's really bothersome however and worrying at the same time as i'm really scared things might even get worse. I'd really appreciate some wisdom and insight on this. Apart from the newly-developed tinnitus, I'm doing fine and keeping things under control.

Thanks for your attention and kindness. Wish you sweet moments and beautiful days. 🥀🌷🙏

[Altostrata]

I am sorry to hear about the tinnitus getting worse during your taper. How much nortriptyline were you taking when this new symptom started?

[Iman]

@Altostrata

 

Thanks for the response dear Alto. I was on 9.5 when it first showed up. I wasn't tapering at the time it happened first and was holding on 9.5 for almost six months. It went away for a few weeks and i thought it was from a cold i had a few months ago. But it's now constant and present everyday like my chirrping tinnitus which i've had with me since the first Nortriptyline pill I swallowed in 2017. This one however is pretty loud and hardly gets masked by the white noise stuff i have around me. All I can do is to pray for my left ear not to add more sounds to the melody. 😄

[Altostrata]

13 hours ago, Iman said:

Thanks for the response dear Alto. I was on 9.5 when it first showed up. I wasn't tapering at the time it happened first and was holding on 9.5 for almost six months. It went away for a few weeks and i thought it was from a cold i had a few months ago.

 

Sometimes tinnitus is caused by an infection. Have you seen an ear specialist?

 

Many people find fish oil and magnesium supplements helpful, see

 

https://survivingantidepressants.org/index.php?/topic/36-king-of-supplements-omega-3-fatty-acids-fish-oil/

 

https://survivingantidepressants.org/topic/15483-magnesium-natures-calcium-channel-blocker/

 

You might try a little bit of one at a time to see how it affects you. Please let us know how you’re doing.

[Iman]

@Altostrata

 

Thanks a billion for the helpful tips dear Alto. I did go to an ENT specialist and once there they ran all possible tests. There was not even the slightest trace of earwax in my ears and the hearing tests came back with 100% auditory acuity. The doc said this is most likely an ear muscle tic more like the one we get at times of nervousness on our eyelids with the muscles involuntarily moving and jerking. It was then that I began to suspect the Nori and withdrawal as the prime cause of this whole thing. As for magnesium and fish oil, I'm a big fan of both and have been taking each with SA's recommended dose every single day religiously and am fully satisfied with the results. They keep most if not all my WD symptoms at bay. I can't thank you enough for introducing these 2 jewel supplements. I've also tried topical CBD and drinking very controlled amount of rose water with some degree of success. The noisy popping tinnitus is an unwelcome guest i should put up with till this whole WD thing is over. Still, i thank God and can't complain as i've made much progress and learnt quite a lot in dealing with the horrible WD monster on this breath-taking battlefield. I'll appreciate any further input and insight on this bizarre type of tinnitus. Thanks again. 🙏🌷🥀

[Altostrata]

How much fish oil and magnesium do you take?

 

I'm sorry we don't have any easy remedies for tinnitus.

[Iman]

@Altostrata

 

I take 1000 mg fish oil with EPA and DHA twice a day right after lunch and dinner. I keep my fish oil capsules in the refrigerator. Aslo, i take 300 mg magnesium in 3 divided doses of 100 mg, morning noon and before bed. These 2 have been my favorite supplements all throughout these 5 years. They've been so helpful.

[Altostrata]

You may wish to take 2 1000mg fish oil capsules 3 times a day, with meals, a total of 6 capsules per day.

[Iman]

@Altostrata

 

Thanks for the pretty helpful tip dear Alto. I took 4 capsules the day before yesterday, took 5 yesterday and 4 today so far(it's 5.30 pm here local time). Apart from some gastrointestinal and digestive issues(most notably mild diarrhea and bloating) i've done well and felt a difference in my symptoms. The thumping and popping tinnitus is still there but seems to have become less frequent in its episodes during 24 hours. I visited another ENT specialist in the mean time and he suggested middle ear myoclonus(erratic and jerky movements of the Eustachian tube in the middle ear) as the prime cause of such a tinnitus which i have my doubts about. Apparently there's no definite cure or effective treatment for this disorder(either subjective or objective). But my hope is that the high dose omega 3 will help settle the issue. 

[Altostrata]

I hope more omega-3 helps, too, @Iman Please be sure to take the fish oil capsules with meals, it will make them more digestible.

[Iman]

@Altostrata

 

Will do dear Alto. Your guidelines have always been most insightful and beneficial. I can't thank you enough for your kindness and care. Will report back what i experience as a result of several days of taking 6 omega 3 capsules. 🌷🥀🙏

[Iman]

@Altostrata @brassmonkey @ChessieCat @ADWarrior

 

Hello all

 

Just thought it'd be good to drop a few lines concerning how I'm doing these days WD-wise and especially tinnitus-wise. Thanks to Alto's pretty helpful and golden guideline of taking 6 omega 3 capsules per day, i'm now gradually feeling the barely stopping and extremely noisy popping tinnitus losing its potency and extreme volume. Truth be told, my system couln't handle 6 omega capsules (had bad diarrhea as a result) so i made do with 4 capsules but they did do the trick after almost 2 weeks of regular consumption. The poppoing tinnitus is now absent the majority of the day and gets activated only a short few hours and when it does it s not even half as bad. The chirpping tinnitus is still there 24/7 but i can hardly complain about it as it's been with me since day 1 of WD. This encouraged me to go further ahead with the taper of Nori so i went head with the move. i'm now on 6.7 mg with some bothersome symptoms most of which are predictable with each taper I make. All in all nothing to complain about. Hope you're all doing fine and experiencing awesome days. Take good care. 👍🙏🌹🌷🥀

[Altostrata]

Good to hear, @Iman

[Iman]

@Altostrata @Gridley @MoveIt @ADWarrior @brassmonkey

 

Hey there everyone

 

Hope everyone's doing great and having a fun life. 

 

It's been a long time since I last put an update on how I've been dealing with the monstrosity of Nortriptyline and my tapering status. I thought it'd be wise to come up with one after such a long while.

 

In simple terms, I have to admit that I'm doing far better than I did exactly a year ago at this time. I've recently hit 1.8 mg of Nortriptyline homemade water solution. I began my taper from 10mg which was my constant dose for almost 15 months( I had to hold and stop tapering due to the severe reactions and side effects I experienced after my Covid shots) from June 2nd 2022 and came all the way down to 1.8 today after almost 10 months.

 

The first few months of my taper were terrible with God-awful waves and shorter windows in between. However, things have altered noticeably these past 3 months with the waves lasting merely one to 3 days max after each drop and the windows are the predominant theme here.

 

I'm gradually beginning to experience my old energetic self with so much love for life and a great deal of zeal and enthusiasm in my professional career. I can say I'm now almost fully functional and can achieve most, if not all, of my professional objectives and ambitions quite easily. When waves hit I usually go through them with much patience and fortitude, observing myself and how I deal with the symptoms from above, have no complaints in this department.

 

The symptoms which are constantly present both during waves and windows are: Tinnitus in both ears with the left one being much louder and noisy, vision problems mostly colors losing vivacity and sharpness and bloating in the stomach. During waves, I experience almost every single symptom I've experienced during withdrawal and the ones I get directly from taking the pill(side effects). Surprisingly enough, I've been taking all B vitamins every day with no adverse effect(this has been the case for more than 4 months now).

 

I feel I have better control over my emotions and feelings and generally feel in control. My sleep has been fine with 6 to 8 hours each night(when in waves, sleep time decreases and it's quite typical and run-of-the-mill for me). I still have a lot to accomplish here but I believe I'm more than 60 percent healed and beginning to look better and more like my old self (pre-Nortriptyline self).

 

The supplements I take regularly everyday are: Omega 3(fish oil), pre and probiotics, lycopene, L lysine, Ganoderma powder, rose water, milk thistle, B vitamins, Zinc with Vitamin C, magnesium citrate, taurine powder, olive leaf oil, turmeric and chamomile tea.

 

I feel obliged to offer my especial thanks to the creator of this website dear Altostrata for her wonderful and unique guidelines in helping us getting our hands on light when walking through our darkest most gloomy alleys of our life. Also, I'm infinitely grateful to the moderators of the website whose care and responsiveness gave me the much-needed hope to push through. I'm still a long way away from fully healed but the fact that I'm moving on slowly and steadily is a clear indication that I'm on the right track. I'll provide new updates once I hit 1 mg hopefully. I wish you the best of everything in life. Shine on. 🌷✌️👍🙏🤗

[Altostrata]

You're welcome! Thanks for giving back to the community by letting us know that you're doing well.

 

Congratulations at reducing so far. Please update your signature.

[Iman]

@Altostrata

 

Thanks a billion dear Alto. I owe you a tremendous amount. I hope I can make it up to you and your esteemed team once I'm fully recovered. I'll update my signature asap as instructed. Thanks again for everything. 🌷🙏🌹

[Iman]

@Altostrata @brassmonkey @ADWarrior @Gridley

 

Hello all

 

Hope you're doing great and are experiencing WD-free days. Been a while since I last provided an update from my tapering and wd status.

 

Good news is I took my last dose of Nortriptyline on August 1st, almost 3 months ago. My exit dose was 0.05(half a drop from a 10 cc syringe) which I took for 20 days and then stopped altogether. Since then I've had mostly clear and window-like days although some of my symptoms like incessant tinnitus and sleep jerks hardly disappeared and merely became less intense. A few days after my last dose, I grew more energetic and functional, was able to take power naps whenever I intended and desired, my nighttime sleep became longer more restful(7 to 9 hours each night). Appetite-wise, things got way better and I suddenly was able to drink coffee without spiraling down to jitters and heightened wd symptoms(I never got fooled by this and steered clear from coffee much as I could) and my intolerance to various foods and fruits vanished completely as if I'd done a stomach transplant and received a teenager's digestive system. My eyesight was back to normal and I could once again see everything vividly and clearly without the grey fog which had dominated my past 6 years of taking the Nori poison. I was upbeat and in cloud nine for almost 2 successive months despite experiencing very light WD symptoms which were nothing but negligible. Intrusive thoughts were gone altogether and I suddenly became immune to fears from height and death and the like. This was too good to be true, I was a superhuman capable of doing anything I desired to.

 

However the bad news is that after almost 3 months, I've recently begun experiencing nightmares and the foggy brain and eyesight once again. Things got even worse in the past 2 days with my brain and me going through almost all the horrible wd symptoms at full throttle yet again. I just can't believe this is all happening all over again with such intensity.

 

I was wondering whether I'd be back to where I was a week ago when I was experiencing almost the best version of my true self. I hope my brain showing me the power to turn me into a superhuman is demonstrative of better more brilliant days in the future. The setback from top to bottom is hardly bearable for me especially having experienced being on tiptop form and shape less than a week ago. I'd truly appreciate any insight and advice on my current situation. Thanks a billion  up front. 🌹🌷🙏

[Altostrata]

Hello, @Iman Did anything happen that might have precipitated this setback?

[Iman]

@Altostrata

 

Thanks for the reply dear Alto. The only thing I did differently in these past few weeks was my decision to taper down the 20 mg propranolol I take daily to 15 mg. I'm not quite sure whether this has been the culprit in me going through all the nasty sypmtoms of Nortriptyline WD all over again. As I mentioned in my earlier update, once I was done with tapering Nortriptyline and reaching 0 mg, I grew marvelously energetic, upbeat and motivated which enabled me to engage in numerous challenging managerial tasks and undertakings in the 7-branch language college that I run as the CEO(something I couldn't even imagine in my wildest dreams). Right now, I'm almost back to the "barely functional" status I was when in WD-NORMAL. Today however things have changed from worst to bad and I could sleep almost 5 hours nonstop last night. 

[Altostrata]

Good to hear you'd been feeling so well -- but you have to be careful not to overdo it. You might still be susceptible to The Windows and Waves Pattern of Stabilization  -- you still may have spells of withdrawal syndrome.

 

On 10/24/2023 at 5:19 AM, Iman said:

Today however things have changed from worst to bad and I could sleep almost 5 hours nonstop last night. 

 

This is a good sign that whatever bump you hit is evening out. Be patient and treat your nervous system gently.

 

[Iman]

@Altostrata

 

Thanks dear Alto for the profound wisdom and insight. As you rightly pointed out, I'm still quite vulnerable to the windows and waves pattern of stabilization. There're times I feel invulnerable and invincible and this results in me saying "yes" to almost all the challenges presented to me on a daily basis. I feel so empowered that I can work zealously and handle numerous tasks for 10 hours a day nonstop. However, I get hit hard by a an all-inclusive wave once I push it too hard. I have to take things more slowly as I believe my brain is still in the middle of a serious recovery process. All in all, I'm nowhere near as miserable and depressed as I was when I was on the Nori poison. Your wisdom dear Alto has been the real life savior and game changer all along the way. I yet have a mountain to climb to reach the ultimate recovery but the bearable status I'm in now owes a tremendous amount to your aid and assistance and the wonderful website you're running saving plenty of trapped souls.

 

I'm still in the middle of a wave which began a few days ago but it's nothing I can handle using the many nondrug coping strategies I learned from this website.

 

[ADWarrior]

@Iman

 

My Dear friend,

 

My apologies for being late for your new milestone! I know this might sound weird  but let me CONGRATULATE you for making it this far. I am not an expert on the recovery process, but from what I have heard and experienced ( discontinuing 1 x antipsychotic and 1 x Benzo), the real fight started after the discontinuation. 

However, I believe you have all the tools and techniques to make it through in your bag already. The symptoms could return in an unpredictable timeframe, but I am sure you will be ready.

 

The only thing that I have noticed is that my body was super sensitive to any other drugs, medicine and caffeine etc.Be careful and note all that goes into your body. It is still common to wipe your hands with alcohol spray before you enter a shop here in Japan. I have noticed that alcohol, even small dose applied through my skin, affected my state.

 

I applaud you that you can keep your job through all this hell. Please stay strong! You can do it. Listen to your body and don't argue it is doing all it can to get you back into the old YOU!

 

I am reading all your posts as they come to my mail  

 

[Iman]

My dearest @ADWarrior

 

I can't thank you enough for your wonderfully helpful and soothing comments. I'm more than excited to know that you're off the poisons altogether and have made it this far. Your progress is quite impressive and a true mood and morale booster for me. As you mentioned quite rightly, the true challenge begins once the system reaches 0 mg. Many of my food sensitivities have gone and my stomach seems to be in a better state digestion-wise. I can tolerate controlled amounts of coffee but when it comes to alcohol, my brain sounds alarm bells and goes into a chaotic state so I've decided to avoid alcohol altogether. My nondrug coping strategies help me get me through the horrible and hellish wave days. I now seem to be at the final stages of a wave which took form mid-October. My main complaints(most persistent symptoms) right now are blurred vision and eyesight problems, left ear tinnitus, involuntary muscle twitches, hypnic jerks, sudden whole body and brain zaps right at the moment of falling asleep, nightmares(sometimes false awakenings), on and off urinary retention and stuffy nose. There are times when most of the above-mentioned symptoms disappear all at once(except for the left-ear tinnitus which has been incessant from the get-go) which signals I've entered a much-needed window. I hope things are going well at your end as well. I wish you the best of all this world could offer. I'm sending you positive vibes. I'm more than certain you're way stronger than the WD monster and will pretty soon make withdrawal hell bite the dust. Stay strong and rock on. Throw us an update on how you're doing at your earliest if possible. Take great care.👍👏🌷🌹❤️