Nomad: olanzapine, alprazolam withdrawal nightmare

[Nomad]

Also as a note to all who are suffering through their withdrawal. I could have never have gotten this far if it were not for breathing “exercises”. It has literally saved my life. I’m sure it’s been discussed here before many times. But it is worth another testimony. I have recently pulled out of the onset of major depressive, and also hypomanic episodes by very basic breathing techniques and meditation. I hope it can help others as well.

[Nomad]

@Altostrata Thank you again for your help and support. I also want to help others in their struggle. For many many years I have said that the only good that can come from my ill health is that I can empathize more effectively with others and possibly share some helpful knowledge or advice or support that will help them. Sadly I lost my younger sister on April 20 this year. She was suffering even more than I, and I could not help her enough. I am more determined than ever now to survive and thrive, hopefully helping others to do the same.

[bijay]

3 hours ago, Nomad said:

Also as a note to all who are suffering through their withdrawal. I could have never have gotten this far if it were not for breathing “exercises”. It has literally saved my life. I’m sure it’s been discussed here before many times. But it is worth another testimony. I have recently pulled out of the onset of major depressive, and also hypomanic episodes by very basic breathing techniques and meditation. I hope it can help others as well.

@Nomad  Thank you for talking about your experience with breathing and meditation.  They help me too, but it is easy to sometimes get overwhelmed and put these relatively simple tools aside.  To be reminded that others use these too, with much success, helps keep me motivated, and (hopefully) disciplined enough to keep at it  

[Altostrata]

I'm so sorry about your losing your sister, @Nomad

 

Thank you for your offer to help. Please visit the other Introductions topics and support people when you can.

[Nomad]

@Altostrata Ringing in ears getting louder. It significantly worsened after I reduced the diphenhydramine and subsequent nights of worse sleep. Now the level of ringing has gone up again. My problem has always been staying asleep not falling asleep. This is first night now that I could not fall asleep. My siblings are trying to insist that I get some kind of medical help. I’m sure there is nothing that can be done. But I’m in a pretty serious situation at this point. I’m struggling but maintaining my mental stability relatively well, but the lack of sleep and worsening tinnitus makes things look very unsustainable at this point.I’m not seeing any way out at this point. I don’t know how long I’ll be able to continue functioning like this. Memory concentration etc are declining. I have a feeling there is not much of a protocol for this situation but I have to at least ask...

I ishifted the Olanzapine .3mg, over the past few days to an evening dose 8:30pm. Xanax .75mg 10:30pm, 25mg diphenhydramine 10:30pm. Reinstatement of Olanzapine does not seem to be working yet. I have decided that this is my stopping point for the reinstatement. 

[Altostrata]

Perhaps you might add back in a half-dose of diphenhydramine.

 

Withdrawal insomnia is common, especially when people cold-turkey off drugs. We have many people here who have had terrible insomnia that slowly improved.

 

People tend to feel terrible from lack of sleep.

 

I know this is difficult, hang in there.

 

On 7/27/2020 at 12:09 PM, Nomad said:

9:00am .2mg Olanzapine 

10:30pm .75mg Xanax; 25mg diphenhydramine; .5mg melatonin

 

9 hours ago, Nomad said:

I ishifted the Olanzapine .3mg, over the past few days to an evening dose 8:30pm. Xanax .75mg 10:30pm, 25mg diphenhydramine 10:30pm. Reinstatement of Olanzapine does not seem to be working yet. I have decided that this is my stopping point for the reinstatement. 

 

You increased olanzapine as well as moved it around?

 

The only way we can tell what's going on is by looking at your daily symptom pattern. Please keep daily notes of times of day you take your drugs, their dosages, and your symptoms throughout the day. Post 24 hours of notes at a time in this topic, in a simple list format with time of day on the left and notation (symptom or drug and dosage) on the right.

 

I suspect your problems are related to benzo withdrawal and Xanax rebound, not olanzapine. Substituting diazepam for Xanax might help, but that can be rocky, too.

[Nomad]

   I checked myself into the ER on August 5, 2020 because of severe sleep deprivation. I felt as if a heart attack or stroke was imminent. The ER did absolutely nothing for me except give me 2 Ativan and show me the door. I was also experiencing dementia-like symptoms from the lack of sleep, memory loss confusion, inability to concentrate. I felt I was only a couple days away from a manic episode or heart attack. The elevated heart rate was probably from stress but I could feel something was going to break if I didn't get sleep ASAP. Contrary to what many people are saying sleep deprivation is not something that you can just "tough out". 

   I went from the ER to a walk-in mental health clinic. Long story short the doctor prescribed reinstating the Olanzapine at 5-10mg depending on how I was sleeping. Going back on the Olanzapine was one of the most difficult decisions that I have ever made. I worked so hard to taper off of it. But the doctor said "if you don't get sleep you're going to croak". I felt she was right so I reinstated the Olanzapine at 5mg, then increased to 7.5mg. 

  Over the last nearly seven months I have waged a hellacious battle against the insomnia. I addition to reinstating the Olanzapine I also had to increase the alprazolam to 1.5mg per night. I made two trips to Mexico to see a neuropsychiatrist because I couldn't afford one in the US. I also bought two different Cranial Electrotherapy Stimulation devices for treating insomnia, and went to several acupuncturists. Everything I tried improved my sleep for about a week and then it went back to being horrible. I felt suicidal numerous times. One day I even went as far as to set up an electrical cord noose in my hotel in Mexico. My cognitive impairment from lack of sleep was so bad that I didn't see how I was going to continue to take care of my finances and medical needs. It felt like it was the end of the road. But I kept fighting and got through one day at a time.  

    Now, nearly 7 months after the ER visit I feel like my sleep in improving. But now I am taking much more medication than before I started tapering a year ago. After giving myself some time to recuperate I will attempt to taper again. This time I will start with the alprazolam first and then the Olanzapine if I feel that I have the mental stability and proper sleep to justify another taper.

[Altostrata]

I don't believe anyone here told you to tough it out.

 

On 8/5/2020 at 10:27 AM, Altostrata said:

The only way we can tell what's going on is by looking at your daily symptom pattern. Please keep daily notes of times of day you take your drugs, their dosages, and your symptoms throughout the day. Post 24 hours of notes at a time in this topic, in a simple list format with time of day on the left and notation (symptom or drug and dosage) on the right.

 

I suspect your problems are related to benzo withdrawal and Xanax rebound, not olanzapine. Substituting diazepam for Xanax might help, but that can be rocky, too.

 

It is not unusual that reinstatement of the drug or drugs resolves withdrawal symptoms such as rebound insomnia, or that it might take time for your nervous system to settle down from going on and off drugs several times with intermittent alcohol ingestion last year.

[Nomad]

1 hour ago, Altostrata said:

I don't believe anyone here told you to tough it out.

 

 

It is not unusual that reinstatement of the drug or drugs resolves withdrawal symptoms such as rebound insomnia, or that it might take time for your nervous system to settle down from going on and off drugs several times with intermittent alcohol ingestion last year.

My purpose was not to imply blame but to impress on everyone that sleep deprivation can be more severe and dangerous for some than others, and that it is potentially very dangerous. 

[hayduke]

Yes, that's how I got drugged.  Stuff was coming up, no one understood it at the time, I seemed increasingly irrational the more days I couldn't sleep, and here we are.

 

I would tell my past self to get a week of benzos from a GP and find a clinical psychologist pronto, and look for something like Open Dialogue.  Noting that I had not been on any prescription at the time.

[Nomad]

7 hours ago, hayduke said:

Yes, that's how I got drugged.  Stuff was coming up, no one understood it at the time, I seemed increasingly irrational the more days I couldn't sleep, and here we are.

 

I would tell my past self to get a week of benzos from a GP and find a clinical psychologist pronto, and look for something like Open Dialogue.  Noting that I had not been on any prescription at the time.

Thanks for your post hayduke. What is Open Dialogue?

[hayduke]

Have a read https://willhall.net/opendialogue/

 

My view is that what got called psychosis in my case, was trauma that would not be ignored any more screaming to be heard and dealt with.  I've been recommended some reading on this, but haven't got to it yet...that huge tsundoku pile eh

 

Anyway the idea is that you can sit down with people and work through what is presenting in these non-everyday states and ideally resolve the 'crisis' without being put on these heavy drugs.  The outcomes seem better and you might also avoid a stigmatising diagnosis.

 

I've also come to the view that these phenomena are very natural and universal human responses to unbearable events, and it's our society that is unwell rather than any particular invidual.  Most human cultures make room for the shamanic, the modern West not really.

 

I actually asked for this style of therapy at the time but was fobbed off and drugged in the usual Dark Ages fashion.  My bratty teenage self would sum it up as "Oh, you got raped when you were small?  Here, let us trash the rest of your life for good measure".

 

I hear the outcomes with Open Dialogue are very good.  I would keep it in mind for anyone facing those issues.

[Wagen]

@Nomad,

 

What are you doing now to sleep? 

 

I struggle with insomnia for 9 months now. 

 

Im exhausted and scared. 

 

Thank you for your experience!! 

[Nomad]

I reinstated Zyprexa @ 7.5mg on August 5 2020. Since then I have gained over 30 lbs ( 14kg). I just attempted a taper off Zyprexa. 10% reduction using liquid suspension. Within 10 days of starting the taper my insomnia was returning. I now have reinstated back to 7.5mg. After 4 days of reinstatement insomnia has not improved.   Apparently I need to wait much longer to taper. I’m looking at a process of years rather than months.

[hayduke]

Sounds like resuming that large dose has sensitised your body to the drug a bit more, unfortunately.

 

Waiting longer may be sensible, or you can look at Brass Monkey's slide taper.  Gentler cuts and finer control of your tapering.

[Nomad]

@hayduke thanks for pointing me in the right direction for a slower taper. I didn’t realize that there are some others who are as sensitized as I am and need to go so incredibly slowly with their taper.

[hayduke]

@Nomad you're welcome.  No one goes slowly because they like being on the drug - it's just an acknowledgement that we have to respect the pace our body can manage in the process.

 

I know Brass Monkey mentioned the idea on the forums, but it's actually faster to go slower in the long run.  Risking a full dose again gives your body an even higher workload and you have to give it even more time.

 

Below 2.5mg I've really found the gentler 2.5%/wk cuts to be way more manageable in stressful situations like work, some family shite, etc.  Generally the stuff life sometimes throws at you like it or not 🙂

[Nomad]

What’s the general opinion here on this site about using marijuana products medicinally for sleep or other medical uses? I’ve never smoked before but considering edibles or tinctures for treatment of insomnia. But I’m wondering how it could affect things when I attempt to taper again soon.

[Nomansland]

Hello @Nomad,

 

here you can read peoples experience with using marijuana products in withdrawal:

 

Greetings

 

Nomansland

 

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2021 IMPORTANT WITHDRAWAL SURVEY, PLEASE PARTICIPATE: https://uelpsych.eu.qualtrics.com/jfe/form/SV_0AR9IsQ61jsiXBk

[hayduke]

Nomad - I can't do fish oil but wolfing down a shot or two of hemp protein powder with some yoghurt does me a lot of good every day or three.

 

Not crazy $$$ like cbd oil either, and probably less psychoactive/addictive.

[Nomad]

Healing Kindled brain

 

I have been severely kindled after multiple attempts to withdraw off of Zyprexa. I still have severe insomnia two years later. I was wondering if there is any info about how to heal or reverse the effects of a kindled brain? 
Thank you!

 

Edited September 13, 2022 by ChessieCat
added intro topic title before merging with intro topic

[ChessieCat]

post-withdrawal-nervous-system-hypersensitivity-hyper-reactivity-and-kindling

 

This is a recently published topic:

 

hypersensitivity-and-kindling

 

[Nomad]

16 hours ago, ChessieCat said:

post-withdrawal-nervous-system-hypersensitivity-hyper-reactivity-and-kindling

 

This is a recently published topic:

 

hypersensitivity-and-kindling

 

Thank you but I did not see anything in the information about how to heal a brain AFTER it has already been kindled. Is this because there is not information on that subject?

[Shep]

14 hours ago, Nomad said:

Thank you but I did not see anything in the information about how to heal a brain AFTER it has already been kindled. Is this because there is not information on that subject?

 

There is plenty of information on this subject. Our brains are very neuroplastic. See:

 

Neuroplasticity video (2 minutes)

 

Healing from antidepressants. How to speed up the recovery process video (5 minutes)

 

While it can take a long time for this type of damage to heal, there are many ways of calming the nervous system and healthy and healing activities that can help the process along. See: 

 

 

Non-drug techniques to cope with emotional symptoms

 

Art, music, gentle stretching or yoga, journaling, walks in the sun, a healthy diet with plenty of water, etc. can help heal the brain and nervous system from hypersensitivity and kindling. And these are the skills, activities, and lifestyle that will keep you from feeling the need to reach for a drug to handle life after you're off these drugs. 

 

Healing takes time, but it does happen. 

 

[Nomad]

Thanks Shep!

[ChessieCat]

Your new topic has been moved to the existing topic.  Please do a search before creating a new topic.

 

And no, the Alternative to Meds Center is NOT recommended.  Please read all the comments.